No Subsititute

[bornadog]

http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa198/mmsalih/svSP_NOBENCH-620x0.jpg


Good article today in the The Age on consulting players re rule changes and in particular the substitute rule being trialled in the Sham Cup. Read here (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/bench-warfare-20120305-1uecm.html). Believe me, this is a deliberate ploy by the AFL to introduce 2 + 2 next year, no doubt they planned this over a year ago.

The changes last year to the bench ie 3 on the bench and 1 substitute was a another knee jerk reaction by the AFL. The AFL was concerned that there were too many rotations off the bench with Collingwood and the Bulldogs recording over 150 in a game.

Firstly - so what if there are so many rotations off the bench? What harm is there?. The 4 on the bench was introduced about 20 years ago and its only been in the last 5 or so years that rotations started to increase. Why are are there so many rotations? The game is fast now, the players are full time athletes and the human race is getting bigger and faster. Ball movement, skills are practised at training. The AFL have tried to make the game faster (again through rule changes) but there are limits and demands on players during the game are enormous and therefore players need to rest and avoid injuries etc.

So why change the game? The AFL proclaim it was to slow the game down and create a better contest when all the players are tired in the last quarter. This is utter rubbish and creates no advancement to the game.

The introduction of the 3 +1 to me has proven nothing and there are no stats to stay it has.

I don't know about you but I am sick to death of changing this game constantly. I say no substitutes and lets just go back to 4 on the bench and leave the game alone. We could go way back to just having two reserves who could not be interchanged at all, but its too late for that, the game has evolved way past that, but its not too late to scrap the subsitute.

[LostDoggy]

I don't know about you but I am sick to death of changing this game constantly. I say no substitutes and lets just go back to 4 on the bench and leave the game alone.

Agree! Stop changing our beloved game into a load of s--t! Getting closer and closer to the game of Soccer (WHICH I FOR ONE HAVE NO INTEREST IN) Bring the season forward and get rid of the NAB Cup which trials all these ludicrious (and useless) rules!

[DragzLS1]

I can see the 1 sub as a challenge and making it harder for team and I dont mind it but 2 subs is just rubbish! wether its 4 on the bench or 3 and 1 sub I dont mind but 2 subs, seriously, now they want to ruin the game!

[LostDoggy]

I like the sub rule as it is.

[Ghost Dog]

Guess the player in the photo....

Can see a few grey hairs there....might be Gia?? ^_^ joke

[Scraggers]

Listening to Rocket and Mark Thompson on AFL 360 last night; the coaches are already strategising on how to beat the fatigue. They said the 'keepings-off' that we saw both Carlton and Bulldogs employ in the 4th quarter on the weekend is in direct correlation with the 2 + 2 interchange. Rocket said he knows both fitness coaches and knows that both teams are fit.

He also said that coaches will employ all different strategies to counter-act fatigue; most to the detriment of the game. Throwing 3 players behind the play to minimise scoring is just one of the ways coaches will manage the fatigue.

[G-Mo77]

I don't know about you but I am sick to death of changing this game constantly. I say no substitutes and lets just go back to 4 on the bench and leave the game alone.

Rarely I do this but I agree with you 100%.

The current sub rule is a complete farce and if it goes 2 - 2 then not only are you making a bad part of the game even worse you are then putting more players at risk through injury.

[Remi Moses]

The game is going to get ugly.
More defensive games and players stuffed by the end!
I see old man Bartlett had a crack at Minson for offering his opinion.

[bornadog]

The game is going to get ugly.
More defensive games and players stuffed by the end!
I see old man Bartlett had a crack at Minson for offering his opinion.

Barlett is the biggest old fart of all time and ought to retire.

[jeemak]

Listening to Rocket and Mark Thompson on AFL 360 last night; the coaches are already strategising on how to beat the fatigue. They said the 'keepings-off' that we saw both Carlton and Bulldogs employ in the 4th quarter on the weekend is in direct correlation with the 2 + 2 interchange. Rocket said he knows both fitness coaches and knows that both teams are fit.

He also said that coaches will employ all different strategies to counter-act fatigue; most to the detriment of the game. Throwing 3 players behind the play to minimise scoring is just one of the ways coaches will manage the fatigue.

I always thought coaches would prefer to keep tired players behind the ball and back a slow forward moving strategy with a lot of keep things off through going to lateral targets once possession has been gained, rather than just go all out attack and try to blow the opponent out of the water. Doing the latter burns a lot of energy.

Kevin Bartlett is a bloody lunatic, and a really good example of why the decision making process for adopting potential rule changes needs to be spread over a larger group of diverse people from within the game (club representatives - both players, coaches etc, past players, league officials) than a committee appointed by the AFL. There's too much scope for agenda pushing currently, although that's exactly how the AFL wants it.

[stefoid]

Could extend Cross's career by another two years!

[Ghost Dog]

Could extend Cross's career by another two years!

Seriously - the guy is a freak. I reckon I could do .005 of the work he puts in.

[w3design]

Have to agree with a lot of what has been said here. However I would like to see a few serious changes made to the league and it's structures for the sake of the game.

1. Let the League administration concentrate on running the business of the game, and leave the playing of it to those actively involved day to day. In other words Demetriou/Anderson and company just butt out.

2. The Rules of the Game Committee. Anything created to do nothing but this, has to make changes simply to justify it's own existence. So lets just dump it! After each season is complete, if problems with the game/rules are apparent, representatives from the players, coaches and umpires bodies could get together and decide if anything actually needed to be changed, or if any perceived problems could be managed without rule changes.

3. Dump the Match Review Panel. There are more than enough umpires and their officials at each game to cover this function. You have all the umpires on the field, reserves in the stands, and in my experience officials reviewing each umpires performances on the field at each game. With video available on every game from multiple cameras that should cover all contingencies.
After the game if any of the officials have seen something, or they feel there was anything field umpires missed at the time, they could get those who were on the field to review the footage and they alone should decide if further action is required. Surely the umps. who were there at the time have a greater understanding of the circumstances than some nong who probably wasn't [ e.g. the notorious mr Collins].

By all means let the game evolve, but let it do so naturally rather than mutating it artificially.

[DragzLS1]

Have to agree with a lot of what has been said here. However I would like to see a few serious changes made to the league and it's structures for the sake of the game.

1. Let the League administration concentrate on running the business of the game, and leave the playing of it to those actively involved day to day. In other words Demetriou/Anderson and company just butt out.

2. The Rules of the Game Committee. Anything created to do nothing but this, has to make changes simply to justify it's own existence. So lets just dump it! After each season is complete, if problems with the game/rules are apparent, representatives from the players, coaches and umpires bodies could get together and decide if anything actually needed to be changed, or if any perceived problems could be managed without rule changes.

3. Dump the Match Review Panel. There are more than enough umpires and their officials at each game to cover this function. You have all the umpires on the field, reserves in the stands, and in my experience officials reviewing each umpires performances on the field at each game. With video available on every game from multiple cameras that should cover all contingencies.
After the game if any of the officials have seen something, or they feel there was anything field umpires missed at the time, they could get those who were on the field to review the footage and they alone should decide if further action is required. Surely the umps. who were there at the time have a greater understanding of the circumstances than some nong who probably wasn't [ e.g. the notorious mr Collins].

By all means let the game evolve, but let it do so naturally rather than mutating it artificially.

Top post hit the nail on the head imo

[bornadog]

Have to agree with a lot of what has been said here. However I would like to see a few serious changes made to the league and it's structures for the sake of the game.

1. Let the League administration concentrate on running the business of the game, and leave the playing of it to those actively involved day to day. In other words Demetriou/Anderson and company just butt out.

2. The Rules of the Game Committee. Anything created to do nothing but this, has to make changes simply to justify it's own existence. So lets just dump it! After each season is complete, if problems with the game/rules are apparent, representatives from the players, coaches and umpires bodies could get together and decide if anything actually needed to be changed, or if any perceived problems could be managed without rule changes.

3. Dump the Match Review Panel. There are more than enough umpires and their officials at each game to cover this function. You have all the umpires on the field, reserves in the stands, and in my experience officials reviewing each umpires performances on the field at each game. With video available on every game from multiple cameras that should cover all contingencies.
After the game if any of the officials have seen something, or they feel there was anything field umpires missed at the time, they could get those who were on the field to review the footage and they alone should decide if further action is required. Surely the umps. who were there at the time have a greater understanding of the circumstances than some nong who probably wasn't [ e.g. the notorious mr Collins].

By all means let the game evolve, but let it do so naturally rather than mutating it artificially.

Well said.

I see Buckley came out and said, Yeah I agree there should be a sub, but there should be 4 on the bench.

[jeemak]

Have to agree with a lot of what has been said here. However I would like to see a few serious changes made to the league and it's structures for the sake of the game.

1. Let the League administration concentrate on running the business of the game, and leave the playing of it to those actively involved day to day. In other words Demetriou/Anderson and company just butt out.

2. The Rules of the Game Committee. Anything created to do nothing but this, has to make changes simply to justify it's own existence. So lets just dump it! After each season is complete, if problems with the game/rules are apparent, representatives from the players, coaches and umpires bodies could get together and decide if anything actually needed to be changed, or if any perceived problems could be managed without rule changes.

3. Dump the Match Review Panel. There are more than enough umpires and their officials at each game to cover this function. You have all the umpires on the field, reserves in the stands, and in my experience officials reviewing each umpires performances on the field at each game. With video available on every game from multiple cameras that should cover all contingencies.
After the game if any of the officials have seen something, or they feel there was anything field umpires missed at the time, they could get those who were on the field to review the footage and they alone should decide if further action is required. Surely the umps. who were there at the time have a greater understanding of the circumstances than some nong who probably wasn't [ e.g. the notorious mr Collins].

By all means let the game evolve, but let it do so naturally rather than mutating it artificially.

All of the above make sense, though unfortunately you're preaching to the converted whilst the AFL isn't.

The AFL's admitted to their mantra of spreading the game as far and wide as possible, and maximising revenue to ensure the long term sustainability of the game (funny how these sorts of endeavours could so easily be linked to the performance of key executives within the organisation and their financial incentive structure!).

They don't try and hide the fact that they're all about finding new markets and attracting supporters that don't traditionally follow the game. What they do hide though is their willingness to marginalise already existing followers of the sport because they see the few who do drop off as being at the very worst interchangeable with the new supporters that pick the game up.

Until those that run the game realise that expansion doesn't necessarily equate to success, such things as the rules committee and match review panel will exist.

[w3design]

Yeah Jeemac, your dead right, but then People Power has produced some amazing results around the globe in recent decades. Perhaps it is time for a Peoples revolution within our game as well.
The new media does present possibilities that simply did not exist when I was a kid.

I raise a glass to the [AFL] Revolution!!! May the peoples voices be raised heard and heeded!

[jeemak]

Hmmm, I think you're up against it mate! Even us down trodden folk are far too passive to rally the collective, let alone ourselves!

Though, I admire your willingness to passionate.

[Murphy'sLore]

Oh, I dunno, Rocco managed to get the Bulldogs jumper changed.

Restructuring the AFL should be a piece of cake :D

[jazzadogs]

Guess the player in the photo....

Can see a few grey hairs there....might be Gia?? ^_^ joke
Fasolo.

It doesn't matter what anyone says, they will change the rule. There was reasonable opposition to the 3-1 sub rule, and they did it anyway.

I doubt there will be a dramatic increase in number of injuries, because clubs will monitor players and change their gameplan to prevent this, but it does mean that endurance based athletes are going to be much more common in the game than explosive players without a tank. And surely the explosive types are the ones that the AFL want to be involved?

I'm sure that somewhere in HQ, there would be a grand plan with all the rule changes and plans they have for the next 10 years to 'improve the game' and make it more 'viewer-friendly' with 'greater contests'. Would love to see it, so I can decide which year I'll give up and stop watching.

[w3design]

Funny isn't it. All this changing of rules and interpretations there of, is a bit like lying. That is once you start, you just have to keep on going.

Even if the first change goes somewhere toward achieving it's intention, it invariably has unintended, unforseen and or unexpected consequences. So they need to introduce yet another change to offset those consequences. And so on and on it will go, in a continuing domino effect, and most likely a downward spiral in the view of many fans.

Clubs, coaches etc. then have to constantly re-jig their game plans and lists just to adjust to, or cope with those changes, rather than them simply concentrating on improving their team and own game. In other words they have to put a lot of energy and resources into competing with the AFL and the rules of the game committee rather than their opposition.

As for the Leagues argument based on one set of selected statistics from last season to justify and support their 3&1 fiasco. What a load of Cods!
Have they ever heard the phrase.... Not Statistically Valid!!! They would need to wait another 3-4 seasons with similar results before they can justify any of that crowing we have been subjected to this week.