Hudson keen to boost Dogs' big-man stocks

[The Coon Dog]

Hudson keen to boost Dogs' big-man stocks (http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/footy/common/story_page/0,8033,22442850%255E20322,00.html)

The Herald Sun - 19 September

ADELAIDE ruckman Ben Hudson seems bound for the Western Bulldogs.

It is believed Hudson wants to go to Whitten Oval.

The Bulldogs, keen to bolster their ruck division, only need to satisfy the Crows with a player or draft picks.

Hudson was originally snatched from under the Bulldogs' noses by the Crows.

The 28-year-old played with the Dogs' VFL affiliate, Werribee in 2003, but was taken with pick No. 58 in that year's national draft. He made a solid return from a knee injury this year, playing 22 games.

The Bulldogs have refused to talk about likely trades, but Hudson is said to be a lock-in and contract terms have already been discussed.

Adelaide, with Rhett Biglands ready to return from a knee injury, also has young ruck back-ups in Jonathon Griffin, Ivan Maric and John Meesen.

Adelaide football operations manager John Reid confirmed the contract stand-off.

"Negotiations with Ben on a new contract have broken down," Reid said last night.

"As a result, his management has advised us that the Western Bulldogs are keen.

"We regard Ben as a required player. We are waiting to hear where the Bulldogs stand."

Hudson, who has played 55 games, made headlines last month when suspended for a week by the Crows for breaking off-field rules. He broke an 11pm Sunday curfew and teammates made it clear it would take time to win back respect.

"Huddo is very disappointed in himself for letting the playing group down," teammate Nathan Bock said at the time.

Securing a ruckman is the Dogs' No. 1 trade priority -- ahead of a key forward.

If Hudson lands at Whitten Oval, it will put increasing pressure on Peter Street. Will Minson, who will return from a back injury, is expected to be given development time following Luke Darcy's retirement.

St Kilda, Carlton and Richmond are also in the market for a ruckman.

Despite speculation, it is believed Brendan Fevola is not on the Dogs' radar.

[The Coon Dog]

So what would we be prepared to offer for him?

[The Underdog]

So what would we be prepared to offer for him?

A late pick. He's old after all, and not the only one on the market.

I'm intrigued about this radar though, it's doing an excellent job if this article is any indication and it's Fevola free, which is nice.

[Mantis]

So what would we be prepared to offer for him?

I am prepared to offer a second rd pick (maybe trade for a latish one) or a player equivalent to Giansiracusa/ McMahon.

[W W Biscuit]

I am prepared to offer a second rd pick (maybe trade for a latish one) or a player equivalent to Giansiracusa/ McMahon.

If we trade either of those two for a 28-year-old, serviceable ruckman with a reconstructed knee, then we are being mightily ripped off.

[Mantis]

If we trade either of those two for a 28-year-old, serviceable ruckman with a reconstructed knee, then we are being mightily ripped off.

We need a ruckman. The 2 players mentioned had less than satisfactory years and are in a group of players that we have an excess of, outside players.

Please offer an alternative.

[Bulldog Revolution]

We need a ruckman. The 2 players mentioned had less than satisfactory years and are in a group of players that we have an excess of, outside players.

Please offer an alternative.

Im inclined to agree with WW Biscuit - Hudsons value in the trade stakes is about a 4th round pick given the age and previous knee reconstruction, and the guy is out of contract and not heading back to Adelaide.

If we give them McMahon then we should expect to receive a pick from them as well as Hudson, maybe there 2nd pick for our 3rd or 4th. So McMahon and our 3rd for Hudson and there 2nd.

Hudson is a terrific workhorse at the stoppages and is exactly the type of player Minson should be striving to become

[Bulldog Revolution]

Hudson quits Crows (http://www.news.com.au/adelaidenow/story/0,22606,22443607-12428,00.html)


September 19, 2007 02:15am
RUCKMAN Ben Hudson has quit the Crows after his contract talks broke down last week as Adelaide labelled his demands as excessive.

Hudson, 29 next year, has asked to be traded to the Western Bulldogs.

Hudson, who was plucked from VFL obscurity by Adelaide in the 2003 draft, demanded a three-year contract worth more than $1 million.

Adelaide offered a two-year deal with a lower annual pay scale.

Despite 55-game Hudson drawing controversy to himself late this season - when he was suspended from the August 12 clash with Geelong for breaking a team curfew - the exit from the Crows is based purely on the terms and value of his new contract at West Lakes.

However, there is also speculation Hudson lost interest in Adelaide after coach Neil Craig gave him a scathing assessment of his form at the start of August after a poor performance against Essendon at the Telstra Dome. This was shortly before he broke the curfew.

Adelaide football operations manager John Reid last night confirmed Hudson and the Crows were left at odds on Friday.

"Negotiations with Ben on a new contract have broken down," said Reid.

"As a result, his management has advised us that the Western Bulldogs are keen on Ben.

"We regard Ben as a required player. We are waiting to hear just where the Bulldogs stand on this."

It is uncertain if the Bulldogs are planning a package of players - such as South Australians Jordan McMahon and Stephen Tiller - or draft picks for Adelaide.

Hudson's exit has left a sour taste at Adelaide. The Crows are questioning Hudson's appreciation for their taking him from VFL club Werribee as a 25-year-old as the No. 58 pick in the 2003 national draft after an AFL opportunity seemed to have passed him.

Also, Adelaide stood by Hudson as he recuperated from major knee surgery in 2006.

Hudson played 22 of a possible 23 matches this season, carrying Adelaide's rucks as Rhett Biglands was sidelined by a major knee injury from last year's preliminary final against West Coast.

Hudson's departure dramatically leaves Adelaide vulnerable in the ruck division. It has the recuperating 30-year-old Biglands and 21-year-old rookie ruckman John Meesen, drafted from Victoria two years ago, out of contract and set for a raid from Carlton.

Adelaide's other ruck options are novices Ivan Maric and Jonathon Griffin, both aged 21.

Hudson's exit will increase Adelaide's need to accept a deal with Brisbane for West Adelaide-drafted ruckman Cameron Wood.

Hudson is the second Adelaide player to ask to be traded out of West Lakes. He follows key forward Ken McGregor who is seeking to find greater opportunities with the prospect of being signed by any of Fremantle, Richmond and the Bulldogs.

Hudson's VFL club, Werribee, is aligned to the Bulldogs.

Western Bulldogs coach Rodney Eade also needs a ruckman - more so than a key forward such as McGregor - to cover the absence by retirement of Luke Darcy.

[W W Biscuit]

We need a ruckman. The 2 players mentioned had less than satisfactory years and are in a group of players that we have an excess of, outside players.

Please offer an alternative.

My preference would be to not court Ben Hudson at all. I'd be far happier to pursue a young player such as Cameron Wood - the first ruckman taken at the 2005 draft.

Jordy and Gia are 24 and 25 years old respectively. Sure, they had fairly poor seasons, but I think that they have greater currency due to their age, experience and some top level performances on their CV. I agree, we do have an excess of these players, and I would be willing to include either of them in trade negotiations - as long as we are shrewd. Particularly if McMahon was part of the Hudson deal, I'd expect some type of sweetener - perhaps an exchange of our 3rd round and Adelaide's 2nd round pick.

EDIT: Just read your post BR. Must have been ESP.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Hudson would be a good stop gap while we get the protein shakes into Ayce Cordy

[Mantis]

My preference would be to not court Ben Hudson at all. I'd be far happier to pursue a young player such as Cameron Wood - the first ruckman taken at the 2005 draft.

Jordy and Gia are 24 and 25 years old respectively. Sure, they had fairly poor seasons, but I think that they have greater currency due to their age, experience and some top level performances on their CV. I agree, we do have an excess of these players, and I would be willing to include either of them in trade negotiations - as long as we are shrewd. Particularly if McMahon was part of the Hudson deal, I'd expect some type of sweetener - perhaps an exchange of our 3rd round and Adelaide's 2nd round pick.



The McMahon deal seems reasonable.

Personally I think McMahon holds a bit more value than Gia.

To get Wood I think we would have to offer up one of these players and our 2nd rd draft pick, is this too much? Personally I have high hopes for Minson and think that with the help that Hudson will provide over the next 3 or 4 years it will allow Will to develop over this time. If we do get Hudson I think Street has to be offloaded.

[Go_Dogs]

Perhaps a direct swap for Tiller? I don't think we'll be giving up too much. Given our early PSD selection, we could just pick him up that way if the Crows are being unreasonable, no?

[Mantis]

Perhaps a direct swap for Tiller? I don't think we'll be giving up too much. Given our early PSD selection, we could just pick him up that way if the Crows are being unreasonable, no?


No thanks, Tiller is a promising Key Forward. Last time I checked there wasn't to many of these types on our list.

PSD - Will Hudson make it to our pick seeing as though Richmond and Carlton who both have picks before us are also in the need of a ruckman.

[dog town]

Hudson is a fairly decent sort of player. Not going to come over and win an AA spot or anything but he will get in and get his hands dirty at stoppages and is rarely dominated. Actually leads the crows for contested possessions and first possessions so he has a presence at ground level around the centre bounces and throw ins. Would be staggered if we let Mcmahon go for a 29 year old with a dodgy knee but wouldn't be against trying to lure him over. The touted 1 million for 3 years is a bit of a worry as well.

[Twodogs]

No thanks, Tiller is a promising Key Forward. Last time I checked there wasn't to many of these types on our list.

PSD - Will Hudson make it to our pick seeing as though Richmond and Carlton who both have picks before us are also in the need of a ruckman.



I'm pretty relaxed about taking that chance. If he's there at our pick, then great, if he's not it's not a huge hassle.



I dont Tiller involved in this trade-he's got to much upside.

[Go_Dogs]

In regards to the PSD I guess a lot of that depends on how keen Richmond and Carlton are to sign a 29 year old ruck whose done a knee and is intent on coming to the Dogs on a 3 year deal. Obviously, it wouldn't be a sure thing, but a risk that I'd be prepared to take if the Crows try to do something ridiculous (such as a McMahon + Tiller package for example that was suggested in todays Advertiser, BAH!).

As far as trading Tiller, I agree that I'd be reluctant to do it too - I have genuinely liked what I have seen of him so far, and I think he has an excellent platform as far as his shape to certainly develop into a key forward. I guess a lot of it depends on if we get another forward somewhere else during trade week or whatever.

I certainly wouldn't want to be trading McMahon, Gia or a 2nd Rounder for Hudson, as has been suggested in this thread.

[dog town]

I wonder who would be the most concerned right now out of Minson and Street?

[LostDoggy]

I wonder who would be the most concerned right now out of Minson and Street?
Doubt it would be Minson even though he needs to pick up his game.
Street is older and at his second club and just as badly performed.

[Raw Toast]

Hudson sounds like a good fit for us because he would improve both our ruck-stocks and our contested work once the ball hits the ground - I think it's been said before that he's like a poor man's version of the pre-injured Darcy.

Very important that we don't pay over the odds for him though. Been rumoured for a little while now that he wants to come to the dogs and that he doesn't like Craig, so we should be able to use this to our advantage. I suspect (and hope) that the three-year million dollar asking price was a way of showing the Crows that they couldn't afford to keep him. It might also scare of the other VIC clubs and make the Crows give him for less than they want rather than let him go for nothing in the PSD.

Hudson's age and prior injuries mean he's definitely not worth our second pick or McMahon or Gia. I'd be happy to hand over Street for him though and a very late pick or a downgrade of late picks :) I know this is unlikely but Street's clearly shown the ability to tap the ball exactly where Adelaide like it, the only question is to whether he could do this intentionally...

[LostDoggy]

prefer to give away more and get wood. 3 yrs time u have a good ruckman, with hudson , in 3 yrs time u have nothing.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Hudson's age and prior injuries mean he's definitely not worth our second pick or McMahon or Gia. I'd be happy to hand over Street for him though and a very late pick or a downgrade of late picks :) I know this is unlikely but Street's clearly shown the ability to tap the ball exactly where Adelaide like it, the only question is to whether he could do this intentionally...

Excellent post - makes sense and provides laughs

[LostDog]

Streety can do the job
Do you forget that he near won us the game kicking a big goal on the run

he played a massive role in our win over geelong in round 4 last year.

stop putting the big fella down, gee he kicked TV lukes butt this year

I would take Hudson for sure, Minson has not really had a mentor especially a tough 1

without Scotty Wynd i dont think darc would have met the level

Minson, Street and Skipper are no Paul Dooley thank christ!!!!

[LostDoggy]

prefer to give away more and get wood. 3 yrs time u have a good ruckman, with hudson , in 3 yrs time u have nothing.
I suppose it depends on how good they think Cordy and any other developing ruck will be.
I'm happy to go Hudson for 3 years, hoping by then Minson is good and 1 or 2 others coming through.

[Mantis]

Streety can do the job
Do you forget that he near won us the game kicking a big goal on the run

he played a massive role in our win over geelong in round 4 last year.

stop putting the big fella down, gee he kicked TV lukes butt this year

I would take Hudson for sure, Minson has not really had a mentor especially a tough 1

without Scotty Wynd i dont think darc would have met the level

Minson, Street and Skipper are no Paul Dooley thank christ!!!!

This is a BF quality post.

WOOF is for Bulldogs supporters with some grip on reality. BF is for talking crap.

Peter Street is a hack, end of story..

[LostDog]

yeah fair enough

Street is a Hack, cant help but laugh at the big fella

guess you could send his photo in to the Footy Show for a Garry Lyon Look Alike

[DOG GOD]

im iffy on husdon...he would be good for the club, not afraid to get his hands dirty and is decent around the ground. IF we got him then surely street would be gone.

I think a fair trade would be mcmahon and pick 38 for hudson and mcgregor.

thought?

HOWEVER i would prefer to go after wood.

[LostDoggy]

I would be happy to take Hudson, but only for 2 years and for marginally less than what he apparently wants (1 million over 3 years). Although i would rather go after Cameron Wood.

[The Underdog]

Happy to take Hudson on the proviso that he comes cheap.
Still think Street would be retained for depth. Nobody would want to trade for him.
Bloody big Seagull alert around Point Gellibrand next year

[LostDoggy]

What is to stop us for going for both Hudson and Wood? We have delisted 6 players - freeing up some room in the salary cap. Three young players we should pick up in the draft, two ruckman and possibly Robertson or McGregor as a makeshift full forward while Tiller develops - that makes six?
I don't think we need to reruit anyone for the backline, especially as doogs seems to be doing well playing there as well.

[LostDoggy]

What is to stop us for going for both Hudson and Wood? We have delisted 6 players - freeing up some room in the salary cap. Three young players we should pick up in the draft, two ruckman and possibly Robertson or McGregor as a makeshift full forward while Tiller develops - that makes six?
I don't think we need to reruit anyone for the backline, especially as doogs seems to be doing well playing there as well.

The only things that would stop us is having too many ruckman on the list, the cost and the belief we have gone for too many trades and not young draftees.

[Sedat]

The great irony in Hudson is that he was right under our noses at Werribee in 2003, when we could have gotten him for a pick in the 50's. Iszac Thompson was our late selection that year - sometimes the Clayton ethos of drafting for upside doesn't always pay off. I'm sure that Hudson would have been looked at but considered one-dimensional and not going to improve. Now he is going to cost us a lot more than a lowly 4th round pick in a weak draft year.

Having said that, he really does fit our immediate needs very well. He is both an inside clearance winner (something we lack in spades) and a very good tap ruckman (something we also lack in spades). I certainly back us going for him but at a reasonable price and not the rubbish sprouted across the border.

[LostDoggy]

The great irony in Hudson is that he was right under our noses at Werribee in 2003, when we could have gotten him for a pick in the 50's. Iszac Thompson was our late selection that year - sometimes the Clayton ethos of drafting for upside doesn't always pay off. I'm sure that Hudson would have been looked at but considered one-dimensional and not going to improve. Now he is going to cost us a lot more than a lowly 4th round pick in a weak draft year.

Not sure if its Clayton's fault, we might have been full on ruckman.
We traded for Street at pick 19 or 20 when he was about to be delisted.

[Sedat]

Not sure if its Clayton's fault, we might have been full on ruckman.
We traded for Street at pick 19 or 20 when he was about to be delisted.
Fair call. We had Darce in his prime, we just picked up Street and we drafted Will the year before. However, we have not drafted or traded for a ruckman since; 4 years is a long time to rely on 3 ruckmen in your entire squad, especially as your #1 ruckman has had 2 knee recos in that time. I think we have been derelict in our duty by not drafting or trading for at least 2 ruckmen in the last 4 years, and at long last it seems that our match committee agrees.

[FrediKanoute]

Fair call. We had Darce in his prime, we just picked up Street and we drafted Will the year before. However, we have not drafted or traded for a ruckman since; 4 years is a long time to rely on 3 ruckmen in your entire squad, especially as your #1 ruckman has had 2 knee recos in that time. I think we have been derelict in our duty by not drafting or trading for at least 2 ruckmen in the last 4 years, and at long last it seems that our match committee agrees.

I disagree with that part of your post. In 2005 when Darcy first went down we had, Darcy, Street and Minson as our rucks. Darcy the veteran, Street the ready to peak and Minson as the developing. I would say the only thing we lacked was a young totally raw ruck on the rookie or freshly drafted.

In 2006, after the draft and trading period for 2005, we lost Darcy and hence were forced to rely on Street and Minson who between them did a pretty good job in 2006. Throw in Skipper a pinch hitter and whilst we weren't great we held our own.

In 2007. after the 2006 draft and trading period we expected to have Darcy back, Street improve and Minson challenge for the No.1 spot - it simply didn't happen. Darcy never got back to his best (or even close to it), Street was patchy and without an able back up in Minson as was the case in 2006 began to be exposed. Minson went backwards and then got injured. Probably our biggest mistake in 2007 was that we didn't try Skipper earlier in the season.

[Rocco Jones]

Hudson was second in both total and average contested possesions this season. Pretty good achievement for a ruckman coming off a knee injury. If we can get him for pick 21 in a weak draft, I'll be happy. People who know a lot more about draftees have told me that a 2nd round draft pick this year is worth less than a 3rd rounder from last year. Hudson fills a massive need.

[LostDoggy]

I disagree with that part of your post. In 2005 when Darcy first went down we had, Darcy, Street and Minson as our rucks. Darcy the veteran, Street the ready to peak and Minson as the developing. I would say the only thing we lacked was a young totally raw ruck on the rookie or freshly drafted.

In 2006, after the draft and trading period for 2005, we lost Darcy and hence were forced to rely on Street and Minson who between them did a pretty good job in 2006. Throw in Skipper a pinch hitter and whilst we weren't great we held our own.

In 2007. after the 2006 draft and trading period we expected to have Darcy back, Street improve and Minson challenge for the No.1 spot - it simply didn't happen. Darcy never got back to his best (or even close to it), Street was patchy and without an able back up in Minson as was the case in 2006 began to be exposed. Minson went backwards and then got injured. Probably our biggest mistake in 2007 was that we didn't try Skipper earlier in the season.

Agree with this. 2 years ago we had nothing to worry about with ruckman. Darcy still had 3-4 years left in him:o Minson was young, Street was solid and you could count on him to fill in, skipper was on the list and we had hope for him and Wight was raw, but still there. Lots of potential in those guys BAR Darcy. 2 years later, we got nothing....funny how things change.

Seriously, we were looking sweet. How wonderful hindsight is.

[The Underdog]

According to todays Hun, we've got ourselves a ruckman, trade to be determined of course, but Hudson has quit the Crows and wants a trade to us.
Meesen also asked for a trade to the Dees

[GVGjr]

This is in the paper today



MICHELANGELO RUCCI

September 29, 2007 02:15am

ADELAIDE formally lost two ruckmen - Ben Hudson and John Meesen - and put experienced forward Scott Welsh on notice yesterday.

Meesen, the club's first-round draft pick in 2004, has told the Crows he wants to be traded to Melbourne which has offered the 21-year-old a contract.

Hudson, the Crows' lead ruckman this season, has ended all negotiations with Adelaide and confirmed he will join the Western Bulldogs on a three-year deal. The Crows would not budge on offering the 28-year-old more than two seasons.

Welsh, who is out of contract, yesterday was identified by Adelaide as the player at the centre of a police report by an 18-year-old woman outside a Hindley Street nightclub last Saturday morning.

Adelaide has described Welsh's behaviour towards the teenager as "totally unacceptable". The Crows have written to Welsh and his management declaring a new contract will include a clause putting the 28-year-old forward at risk of being sacked if there is another off-field drama.

Adelaide did not fine Welsh, but ordered he seek behavioural counselling and a behavioural clause in his new contract.

Adelaide football operations manager John Reid said the Crows would now negotiate trades for Meesen and Hudson with both the Western Bulldogs and Melbourne. Trade week opens on Monday week.

"There is nothing further to be done with Ben Hudson other than to do a deal with the Western Bulldogs," Reid said.

"John Meesen gave genuine thought to his future at Adelaide - which did change with Ben leaving the club - but has decided to join Melbourne."

Adelaide's difficulty in trade week is that neither the Bulldogs nor Melbourne are compelled to work a deal with the Crows.

The Bulldogs can claim Hudson - without compensation - with the fourth pick in the pre-season draft. Melbourne can do the same with Meesen with the No. 3 call in the pre-season draft.

Carlton, at No. 1, and Richmond, at No. 2, have declared they would pass up on Meesen and Hudson if they enter the draft as uncontracted players.

[The Coon Dog]

Almost seems like common sense for them to both nominate for the PSD if, as the report suggest they will be bypassed by Carlton & Richmond.

Obviously that would be a worse case result for Adelaide & they would be filthy. If I was in their position & that happened I'd feel aggrieved. Also, it would get Adelaide's back up, making further trades down the track difficult.

Common sense to prevail & we'll do a deal, just hope it's a 3rd rounder.

[southerncross]

I think the fact that Eade is happy to offer Hudson a three deal is a strong reflection that he really doesn't rate the ruck position that highly.
If we were to get Hudson via the PSD then I would prefer that we don't trade for anyone else.
There is only one other player on the Adelaide list appeals to me and that is Richard Douglas. For a midfielder/forward he takes a strong grab and is very good with his tackles and contested ball work.

[Twodogs]

Almost seems like common sense for them to both nominate for the PSD if, as the report suggest they will be bypassed by Carlton & Richmond.

Obviously that would be a worse case result for Adelaide & they would be filthy. If I was in their position & that happened I'd feel aggrieved. Also, it would get Adelaide's back up, making further trades down the track difficult.

Common sense to prevail & we'll do a deal, just hope it's a 3rd rounder.



Bugger 'em.


Remember Kym Koster and Simon Tregenza? By my reckoning they still owe us one.

[The Coon Dog]

Bugger 'em.


Remember Kym Koster and Simon Tregenza? By my reckoning they still owe us one.
Fair enough, particularly when you throw in Tony McGiunness!

[Twodogs]

Fair enough, particularly when you throw in Tony McGiunness!



Forgot about him. It's two they owe us then.

[hargs37]

doesn't anyone remember Shane Ellen either.

[Rocco Jones]

Meesen and Hudson have quit the Crows and signalled their intentions to join Melbourne and the Bulldogs respectively.

Their local media believes the Blues and Tigers would pass up on the pair if they enetered the PSD. The Tigers seem really keen on Mitch Morton. It looks like we can use the PSD for bargaining power at the very least.

[GVGjr]

Well I think we have the stronger hand at the moment with Hudson heading our way but ideally the PSD should be used for someone else.

I suspect that a swap of 2nd and 3rd round selections or just the 3rd round selection might get the job done with the Crows.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Well I think we have the stronger hand at the moment with Hudson heading our way but ideally the PSD should be used for someone else.

I suspect that a swap of 2nd and 3rd round selections or just the 3rd round selection might get the job done with the Crows.

I think thats a reasonable take on the situation

[Dry Rot]

Bugger 'em.


Remember Kym Koster and Simon Tregenza? By my reckoning they still owe us one.

In the long term, dunno whether we should get a bad trading reputation like say Port.

Especially with so many SA players in the side who may want to go home at some point.

[Dogs 24/7]

Is this something that could be virtually announced by the media or the clubs before the trade period starts ?I think the Aker trade was all stitched beforehand except for some of the minor points.
I wouldnt think Hudson would be keen to try his luck in the pre season draft because unless Carlton nominate him or someone else he really cant train with anyone.He looks to me like a player that would need plenty of work and a late start might not work.