Game Day 2012 - R3 Western Bulldogs vs St Kilda

[BulldogBelle]

This is the discussion thread for our Saturday evening game against St Kilda at ES.

My predictions are:

The Dogs by 22 points
BOG : Matthew Boyd
Luke Dahlhaus to kick the first goal

[Eastdog]

Doggies by 8 points
BOG: Matthew Boyd
First Goal: Libba

[Greystache]

Dogs by 10 points
BOG- Griffen
First goal- Dahlhaus

[Bumper Bulldogs]

Dogs by 3 points
BOG - Boyd
1st Goal - Gia

[AndrewP6]

Aints by 11 points
BOG for us Griff
First goal Coons.

[bornadog]

Dogs by 33 points

BOG Griffen

First goal - Jones

[G-Mo77]

Saints by 28 Points

BOG for us Griff

First goal for us DollHouse

[SlimPickens]

Dogs 15pts
BOG Griffen
First Goal- Jones

[DragzLS1]

either side to win by 7 points (But am hoping its us!)

BOG will be Boyd

First Goal Gia

[Ozza]

I think the Saints might have too many good experienced players for us and they'll get over the line by less that 20.

BOG for us - Bob Murphy

First Goal - Will Minson.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Dogs by 22pts
BOG Cross
First Goal: Higgins

[LostDoggy]

Dogs by 7pts
BOG Jones (Liam Variety)
First Goal: Higgins
Sub: Smith

[Daughter of the West]

Aints by 13
Dogs BOG: Boyd
Dogs first goal: Gia

[LostDoggy]

Dogs by 24
BOG: Minson
First Goal: Minson

[bornadog]

I can't believe this is officially my 10,000th post, so I am going to use it to say:

Go Doggies!!!!!!

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Saints by 11
BOG: Dahlhaus
First Goal: Cooney

[Bulldog4life]

Doggies by 5 points...I had a dream last night!!!
BOG: Griffen
First Goal: Gia

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Dogs by 3 points.
BOG Griffen
1st goal. Gia

[Go_Dogs]

Dogs by 7.
First goal - Griffen
BOG - Boyd

[Rocco Jones]

Tory Dickson left the Willy game at HT heading for Etihad. A late out looks likely.

[Eastdog]

Tory Dickson left the Willy game at HT heading for Etihad. A late out looks likely.

Who do you think it might be thats gets omitted?

[Rocco Jones]

Who do you think it might be thats gets omitted?

Shaggy was a slight concern early in the week and Smith was sore after Round 1. You would think it has to be a how they have woken up type injury due to Dickson playing a half of footy. Could be anything.

[Eastdog]

Shaggy was a slight concern early in the week and Smith was sore after Round 1. You would think it has to be a how they have woken up type injury due to Dickson playing a half of footy. Could be anything.

Will have to wait and see closer to the match.

[Doggy]

Saints by 29
First goal - Gia
BOG for us - Boyd

[LostDoggy]

Shaggy was a slight concern early in the week and Smith was sore after Round 1. You would think it has to be a how they have woken up type injury due to Dickson playing a half of footy. Could be anything.

Panos didn't play either game as well and as far as i know isn't injured. Maybe held out just in case someone wasn't ready?

[LostDoggy]

We really need to do to St Kilda what we did against Adelaide , push their midfield as wide as possible to try to compress their forward line with the forced angle of delivery

I believe our midfield can dominate the contested possessions but its our second and third efforts to pressure their clearances where we have to lift , the ruckmen have to make a solid contribution

We can,t afford a quiet quarter on the scoreboard we just have to keep it ticking over

http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/1479/r32012poster.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/822/r32012poster.jpg/)


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[GVGjr]

It should be a big crowd tonight. Plenty of Saints supporters coming through the gate.

[Eastdog]

I'll guess around 35,000 tonight.

[DOG GOD]

Saints by 19 pts.

Riewoldt to be the difference.

Bog- Boyd
1st goal - Gia.

[bornadog]

DJ is the sub

[AndrewP6]

It should be a big crowd tonight. Plenty of Saints supporters coming through the gate.

Just over 25k at the moment, game on!

[Mantis]

Playing with fire by letting Joey & Goddard run free.

[MrMahatma]

Disposal again an issue, at least early.

Grant wasteful.

[LostDoggy]

Butchering disposal at the moment

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[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Super frustrating.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Minson's ruckwork has been nothing short of pathetic. When he does get the tap, he is displaying absolutely no awareness of the Saints mid's movement around the stoppage, and more often than not is stuffing it right down a Saint's players throat.

[FrediKanoute]

Need a goal. Saints dominating the clearances.......

[MrMahatma]

Had our chances.

Grant misses one. Dahl misses one. Grant turns over going inside 50. Jones not quite nible enough to get it from the goal square.

Frustrating as we should be closer even thought we've been smashed all over the park.

Could get ugly if we don't take our chances.

[Eastdog]

Poor 1st quarter. Once again need to take all our chances eg: Liam Jones right in front of goal.

[LostDoggy]

We just have to stop the hack kick from a contest , it just feeds a Saints rebound

At the moment Murphy is on Milne , probably better to have Addison there

Our kick ins are horrible , no real penetration

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[The Pie Man]

You'd think they'd be copping a fair bake at quarter time - surprised to see we only lost clearances by 5, as it didn't look up to scratch

[Eastdog]

We need to keep within a few goals otherwise it could blowout.

[AndrewP6]

Could be another long night. Getting smashed in clearances, not desperate enough, not converting opportunities. We need half a dozen Dahlhauses. :(

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Saints killing us in clearances, 14-9
Our disposal efficiency 59% to Saints 71%

Cooney 2 possies,
Gia 2 possies,
Libba 3 possies
C Smith 2 possies.
Cross 3 possies

Need more output from our mids. Not only are we not getting the ball, but we're butchering it when we do. That's a a recipe for a pounding if we don't rectify it now.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

That kick from Minson into our forward 50 is exactly the sort of thing that has to change. Complete waste of a great opportunity to create a shot on goal. Absolutely wasted the opportunity by kicking to a two on one in the goal square, instead of to the vacant space 20 out.

[Mantis]

Our skills are disgusting.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Every week now Clay Smith has had at least 1 of his kicks smothered, and because he's in tight under pressure either.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Our skills are disgusting.

It's embarrassing.

[MrMahatma]

When we get it in tight, we panic and turn it over. When we get it in space, we fail to execute and turnover.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Clay Smith is not a first rounder.. I really don't care how hard he is. the bloke is going at 33% efficiency, and at least two of his disposals have either cost us a goal, or led directly to a goal for the Saints.

[AndrewP6]

Gamer over, IMO. We are just terrible.

[LostDoggy]

Death by a thousand cuts , turnovers , clangers , disposal efficiency

Just not sticking with what we are supposed to be doing , having the midfield push up past the 50m arc and either kicking the goal or passing to a leading target

Cordy just not able to get into the game , whos going to get the ball to him ?

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[Mantis]

Clay Smith is not a first rounder.. I really don't care how hard he is. the bloke is going at 33% efficiency, and at least two of his disposals have either cost us a goal, or led directly to a goal for the Saints.

Yep... We must have been drunk at the draft.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

I am gobsmacked at how terrible we are with our disposal and decision making.
We were bad last year, but we have gone backwards again.

Have we spent so much time trying to learn how to play McCartney's 'manly football' during the pre-season that we've forgotten that it's also kinda important to be able to dispose of the ball effectively?

[DOG GOD]

Anyone have a sense of another rhode era?

How could we go from pre-lim to this in 2 years.....this is bad to watch.

We are gonna struggle to beat gold coast, Melbourne and gws if we can't kick more than 1 goal to half time. Can't wait to see the odds fo that gws game in 2weeks time :)

[Eastdog]

We have been bad. 1 goal in a half of football is not acceptable. Minson has been woeful Dahlhaus has been very good and once again has that excitement when he has the footy. Must get the first few in the 3rd quarter to have any chance.

[Scraggers]

Our skills are disgusting.

Totally agree; but I think it's also our poor decision making that is leading to players having less time to use it effectively.

[LostDoggy]

Why did we spend so much time trying to learn how to play McCartney's 'manly football' during the pre-season ? Surely it would have been better to learn how to use the ball effectively

Well , if we are playing " manly " football at the same time we are rebuilding then its no wonder we can,t get hold of the ball when in one hand we have a handbag and in the other hand the list of excuses

Need to have Cooney and Jones at HF , Cordy can stay at FF , Griffen needs to spend more time in the corridor

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[Scraggers]

And the umpiring is woeful (but no excuses for this display)

[GVGjr]

Skills, pace and decision making has been the notable problems tonight. It's all well and good being hard at it but we just aren't effective when we get the ball.

[AndrewP6]

I am gobsmacked at how terrible we are with our disposal and decision making.
We were bad last year, but we have gone backwards again.

Have we spent so much time trying to learn how to play McCartney's 'manly football' during the pre-season that we've forgotten that it's also kinda important to be able to dispose of the ball effectively?

Couldn't agree more. Contested ball is well and good, but pointless if you are inept when you get the ball. I think they've overemphasised one thing and completely neglected another. :mad:

[Eastdog]

How have you guys rated Murphy's game.

[Mantis]

We have been bad. 1 goal in a half of football is not acceptable. Minson has been woeful Dahlhaus has been very good and once again has that excitement when he has the footy. Must get the first few in the 3rd quarter to have any chance.

Winning the ball ok, but like the rest he isn't using it that well... That 1st qtr miss was a shocker.

[whythelongface]

Absolutely woeful. The most insipid display in a half of football that I can remember .

[AndrewP6]

Mark Seymour the highlight of the night so far (and the young lady who just walked past me ;)). Couple of ripping songs at half time. Kudos to the club for setting this up. Now if only they had a handle on this football caper...

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

How have you guys rated Murphy's game.

confusing. Because he's been given a job on Milne, he's not been able to get off the chain and help us set up. Yes he's kept Milne quiet, but at the expense of our one strength in the backline, Murph's breaking through the lines with his run and disposal.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

I really hate getting toweled up by the Saints. My boss and my best mate are both Saints fans, and will be gunning for me on Monday unless we can turn this around.

[LostDoggy]

Boyd has seriously regressed from last year. What the hell was that handball?

this is horrible, time to start rebuilding in full

Edit: another goal against Easton Wood. Another one who's taken a big step back

[LostDoggy]

First time we have a much better kick to the top of the square with Cordy contesting , Gia some quality roving , goal

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[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

We have so many players tonight who are not even playing to VFL level standard.
I'm quite embarrassed by how poor we are.

[Dry Rot]

Getting ugly now.

A seal has better foot skills than us. And vision.

[Mantis]

Rabbit in the headlights stuff.

Their best 5 torch us every time.

[The Pie Man]

This should be an interesting post game presser from BMac..sad that I'm casting my mind to that early in the 3rd

[MrMahatma]

We're actually not good at anything. Not a single aspect of the game.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Hargrave is cooked. Unfortunately he will play most of the year because we don't have any other options .

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Our play at the moment is almost reminiscent of our massive head drop against the Eagles last year. Everyone is playing an individual's game, absolutely no team work. Everytime we get the ball the bloke play's no heed to whether the guy he's kicking to has two or 3 St's players on him.

[whythelongface]

We are in serious trouble . We will be lucky to win any games this year.

[LostDoggy]

The only kicks Jones can even contest are 3v1. Anything else has been uncontested marks to opposition players.
Grant is the only player on the field playing better than last year, mainly because he was horrid last year

edit: bit harsh, Other than 2 quarters against Kennedy, Marko has ben pretty good.
And why is Cross still on Goddard

[whythelongface]

What has happened to the new game plan? Still handballing way too much.

[BulldogBelle]

Wow. We are seriously shit. I'm sorry but I can't sit through this crap any longer.. It just hurts too much.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

I've changed the channel, watching Gold Coast giving the Bombers a good crack, 1 goal up after 3 Qtrs. At least their guys are showing some spirit, fight and skill.

[whythelongface]

I am dumbfounded by this display. Last week the team showed some fight , this week nothing. What the hell is going on?

[Mantis]

Contested ball count is 58-40 at 3/4 time... At least we are 'getting in', pity you need to use it efficiently as well.

[AndrewP6]

Going into forward fifty hasn't changed, put one bloke in the middle and kick everything to him. Embarrassing, gutless, insipid display.

[FrediKanoute]

Pressure. The Saints just harder and better cat applying pressure. There is also the fact that our forward line is in complete disarray. Too much left to too few

[LostDoggy]

Anyone else would think we are tanking for draft picks

Griffen has been on Goddard before and done really well , burnt him for pace and could match him in the air , have no idea why we didn,t do it again

It would be horribly unfair to drop Cordy after this game , the ball was put in a secure box labelled " Property of St Kilda FC "


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[LostDog]

Embarrassing, couldn't imagine what's worse supporting the demons or dogs, decade of the dogs pfft. Switched the channel to the Suns even if they lose at least it's exciting football

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Contested ball count is 58-40 at 3/4 time... At least we are 'getting in', pity you need to use it efficiently as well.

Absolutely. We have laid more tackles, have broke even in clearances, and are thereabouts in the contested ball. According to our coach this is what he wants. Unfortunately we have assembled a team of blokes who cannot use the ball to anywhere near the standard required at AFL level.

[MrMahatma]

This could end up 100 point drubbing.

Team defence. Manly footy.

Great work boys.

[LostDoggy]

Lake you *!*!*!*!ing idiot, Melbourne are a serious chance to beat us

[Rance Fan]

Came into todays game thinking .. this should tell us where we sit.
Win - we in the mix for the 8
Lose - bottom 4

Bottom 4 it is!

Seems a worse loss than WCE last year, At least WCE was a top side last year and it was in WA.
This lose is against an average side at a home game.

Its just sad, but sadly as a bulldog im kinda use to it

[LostDog]

All bulldogs games will be moved to the adult channel for the rest of the season , 22 men getting bent over by other men should not be on mainstream tv

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

But according to the club, we just needed to change coach and have a little refresh?

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

All bulldogs games will be moved to the adult channel for the rest of the season , 22 men getting bent over by other men should not be on mainstream tv

:DThat's the first thing that has brought a smile to my face tonight!!

[LostDoggy]

We definitely beat Adelaide in a quarter, by a large amount

[Ghost Dog]

Was busy, just tuned in and saw the score. Not sure I'm game to watch the replay.
Just when you think things are looking up. Always makes for a great weekend doesn't it? getting towelled up by the team you hate the most.

[firstdogonthemoon]

oh dear me - we are even worse than i thought

[LostDoggy]

Brian Lake - two to three weeks for striking

More pressure for the backline , we will have to elevate Austin to go to CHB so Markovic can go to FB

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[whythelongface]

Was busy, just tuned in and saw the score. Not sure I'm game to watch the replay.

Do yourself a favour and don't waste your time

[FrediKanoute]

Next week starts now. Put it aside, move on and start planning how to beat Melbourne

[Eastdog]

Next week starts now. Put it aside, move on and start planning how to beat Melbourne

Agree. We need to put tonight behind us and focus now on next week.

[LostDoggy]

Agree. We need to put tonight behind us and focus now on next week.

With the added pressure of no Lake at FB

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[Djwilly]

Hmm, It can only get better - can't it !!

[MrMahatma]

Agree. We need to put tonight behind us and focus now on next week.
Cue quotes from Boyd "we disgraced the jumper, that'll never happen again"

Gia: "We pride ourself on the contest and we won't let that happen again"

blahl blah.

Very disappointing effort.

[Dry Rot]

With the added pressure of no Lake at FB

.

What did he do? Will he be rubbed out? Not clear from the radio call.

[bornadog]

One of the worst performances I have ever seen.
Time for some big changes

[Eastdog]

What happened with Lake?

[Mantis]

Time for some big changes

Like what?

[Hotdog60]

What happened with Lake?

Smacked a st kilda player in the face.

[LostDoggy]

What did he do? Will he be rubbed out? Not clear from the radio call.

Straight punch to Simkin,s jaw , probably two to three weeks out , will have to elevate Austin to CHB and Markovic to FB

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[Remi Moses]

Just abysmal
No other way of describing it
Disposal efficiency was suburban football standard.
Need to recruit footballers WHO CAN KICK!!

[bornadog]

Like what?

Like the whole structure. Time to start playing more kids, elevate Campbell, bring in Tutt Sherman, drop Gia, Hargrave, Wood, Higgins and more

[Eastdog]

It can't get any worse being 0-3 now. Next week now will be an important game in terms of teams near the bottom.

[Remi Moses]

We got murdered at the run and spread by a team not renowned for it
I've never seen a team so poor kicking into their own half of the ground

[Remi Moses]

It can't get any worse being 0-3 now. Next week now will be an important game in terms of teams near the bottom.

Why? So we finish above Melbourne and get picks after theirs?
In the medocrity stakes the lower the better.

[Dry Rot]

It can't get any worse being 0-3 now.

Really?


Next week now will be an important game in terms of teams near the bottom.

Should I send the club my prized Guide to WW2 tanks?

Should we go the Soviet T-34 or the German Tiger Panzer?

[w3design]

Wood is not a E.D.F.L standard yet alone AFL standard has to go so does Higgins trade him for what ever we can get. That was worse than the west coast lost WTF.

[LostDoggy]

Like the whole structure. Time to start playing more kids, elevate Campbell, bring in Tutt Sherman, drop Gia, Hargrave, Wood, Higgins and more

Tutt I think did his hammy today , Austin will probably be elevated as Lake will probably have a holiday , Sherman may replace Hargrave but his disposal efficiency in not the wonderful either

I think Macca will only make one or two changes

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[bulldogsman]

Williamstown looked just as good as us today.

[Eastdog]

Be good to see if Macca gives Panos a game. How has he been going for Willy.

[Sedat]

Contested ball count is 58-40 at 3/4 time... At least we are 'getting in', pity you need to use it efficiently as well.Teams will structure up to let us almost fight each other to win the contested ball knowing full well that we'll cough it up through abysmal skill errors, abysmal decision making or a combination of both. We will get killed on the spread every week against half-decent teams with semi-decent skills and pace.

We've known our skills were heading south for a couple of seasons, and yet we pick a one-paced contested ball winner with abysmal disposal at our 1st pick in the ND. Staggwring.

[Eastdog]

2-3 years ago we were in the hunt for the premiership and now languishing near the bottom. How things can change.

[LostDoggy]

Be good to see if Macca gives Panos a game. How has he been going for Willy.

Panos has,nt played as a pure FF for a while , mainly being used as a defender , he's a long way from where he needs to be if we want him to step up to AFL level as a key position forward

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[LostDoggy]

I talked about this in other threads. Winning the ball has never been this team's problem, to focus on it was facetious at best by macca. He has been given an easy pass because it looks okay even when you're losing, and he's not expected to win games. Eade actually had to try to score goals the other way as well.

The stupidest part about focusing on winning the ball is that in team field sport, tactically speaking, the most important player isn't actually the guy who wins the ball but the second guy in the play ie the receiver (as their positioning makes the ballwinner's job clear), then the third player in the chain. However, our guys only ever think about getting their hands on the ball, so we have 5 guys attacking the ball, with absolute dumbness about creating the second ball. Of course, because we have no idea about creating the second and third ball, we don't know how to defend against it either so smart midfields just carve us up around the stoppages where we're not covering.

[Scraggers]

I think a lot of people are avoiding the big white elephant sitting in the corner ...

I have heard nothing about McCartney ... Last year virtually every loss was Eade's fault ... Eade wasn't doing this or Eade wasn't doing that or what was Eade thinking ????

IMO McCartney got a free ride today ... We got rid of Rocket for ???????

[Eastdog]

Panos has,nt played as a pure FF for a while , mainly being used as a defender , he's a long way from where he needs to be if we want him to step up to AFL level as a key position forward

.

Who would be good to try at FF?

[Mantis]

Teams will structure up to let us almost fight each other to win the contested ball knowing full well that we'll cough it up through abysmal skill errors, abysmal decision making or a combination of both. We will get killed on the spread every week against half-decent teams with semi-decent skills and pace.

We were extremely flat-footed around the contest tonight. We played handball games with each and as soon as we made a skill error, which was inevietable, the Saints were off to the races.


We've known our skills were heading south for a couple of seasons, and yet we pick a one-paced contested ball winner with abysmal disposal at our 1st pick in the ND. Staggwring.

First time I had saw Smith in the flesh and I really hoped he just had a bad one, but with that kicking action I doubt it.

[firstdogonthemoon]

I miss Rodney

[w3design]

I have sat through a lot of bad performances. This was right up there. It's not like we were dismantled by a premiership challenger. I feel embarrassed. Totally embarrassed.

[LostDoggy]

I miss Rodney

FDOTM , there was for a time there a team who could run and carry and easily score a 100 or more points week to week , I don,t think you miss Rodney I think you have misplaced the clock you could wind backwards , where is it and what did you do with it ?

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[Bumper Bulldogs]

I think a lot of people are avoiding the big white elephant sitting in the corner ...

I have heard nothing about McCartney ... Last year virtually every loss was Eade's fault ... Eade wasn't doing this or Eade wasn't doing that or what was Eade thinking ????

IMO McCartney got a free ride today ... We got rid of Rocket for ???????

Yes I must admit I was asking the something, the coach made the call on the side and the call on the day, we got smashed in the middle and the alls didn't work out as planned..... Let sub a small off,

Murphy our best ball user left on Milne in the back pocket....don't move him up in the play

Shaggy playing on Fisher. Yes he did Ok but why not swap him and Murp over

Just ask everyone to get a man, the under 12's can do it why guys hat are AFL footballers, clearly the zone thing you want to play wasn't working so stick at it a bit longer as we can score a few goals in junk time when the saint put the que in the rack.

I suppose the coach and his is in the box were happy o noy ask our guys to man up and at least make the saint accountable....well done I can't wait to come back next week and see this exciting brand of football that you are teaching our kids to play.

Well maybe we could watch a few more Geelong games and feel better about our aspirations

[Mofra]

First time I had saw Smith in the flesh and I really hoped he just had a bad one, but with that kicking action I doubt it.
It's an awkward ball drop, very close to his quad. I'd hope if his drop can be fixed his kicking would improve rapidly, but how many players who are poor kicks become good ones?
Jobe Watson is one who springs to mind, although Dalhaus was a poor kick as a junior apparently.

[LostDoggy]

Disgraceful.........The list looks very slow. What I learnt over the weekend is that Carlton cheated, received 3 #1 draft picks and now look a good for the flag. Clubs like Carlton, WCE, Pies, Cats dont except anything less than success, They will put everything in place to make it happen. Who does that! The administration, they employ the best, until we do that we will always be in the middle, or this year case, at the bottom of the pack!

[LostDoggy]

I think a lot of people are avoiding the big white elephant sitting in the corner ...

I have heard nothing about McCartney ... Last year virtually every loss was Eade's fault ... Eade wasn't doing this or Eade wasn't doing that or what was Eade thinking ????

IMO McCartney got a free ride today ... We got rid of Rocket for ???????

I've been saying it all summer but i was a lone voice. Also see my previous post re macca's facetious focus on ballwinning. I also spoke strongly against smith's selection... some have been saying that he had an okay kick but they must be watching a different player to me. As ive said many many times about that selection, what the hell did we need another bull at the gate, crap decision making, rubbish kicking, hardarse dumb ballwinner for? Like we needed our midfield IQ to go down any more?

[Mofra]

Yes I must admit I was asking the something, the coach made the call on the side and the call on the day, we got smashed in the middle and the alls didn't work out as planned..... Let sub a small off
I do worry about our decision to play a spare man in defence - our forwardline is just not good enough to play a man short.
Against West Coast we played a spare man in defence in the 3rd quarter and it started their run on.

[LostDoggy]

Who would be good to try at FF?

If we could manage it Austin has the build and defensive smarts but with Lake probably having a holiday , if he's elevated he will have to go to CHB and Markovic to FB

Skinner also makes a case as a FF but that would only work properly if he had Dalhaus riding shotgun to rove spilled marks

.

[Mantis]

It's an awkward ball drop, very close to his quad. I'd hope if his drop can be fixed his kicking would improve rapidly, but how many players who are poor kicks become good ones?
Jobe Watson is one who springs to mind, although Dalhaus was a poor kick as a junior apparently.


My brother-in-law did a coaching course just recently and a section focused on the mechanics of kicking, the instructor said that Clay Smith has the worst action he has seen in his time.

[Mofra]

Skinner also makes a case as a FF but that would only work properly if he had Dalhaus riding shotgun to rove spilled marks
Skinner looked a mile off it in the VFL today.
Hill looked good but is very raw.

[Mofra]

My brother-in-law did a coaching course just recently and a section focused on the mechanics of kicking, the instructor said that Clay Smith has the worst action he has seen in his time.
It's hard to disagree on tonight's performance.

Makes you wonder how it has not been fixed given he was an elite junior and presumably had some very astute coaches in the last two years.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

I think a lot of people are avoiding the big white elephant sitting in the corner ...

I have heard nothing about McCartney ... Last year virtually every loss was Eade's fault ... Eade wasn't doing this or Eade wasn't doing that or what was Eade thinking ????

IMO McCartney got a free ride today ... We got rid of Rocket for ???????

I think the board themselves need to take a fair portion of the blame.
I think it was clear to many last year, not least our coach at the time, that we were in for some tough times ahead, and that we needed to prepare for pain, and focus on getting through this period with a plan to rebuild.

The club instead opted to spin the fans the line that all we needed was a change of coach and a 'resfresh'. No doubt concerned about the impact a statement like this would have on memberships.
This has contributed to many fans being led to believe that our hopes for the season were better than they really were.

No doubt this will impact our membership figures for the rest of the season, I just hope the false hope doesn't have an even more detrimental impact on next season's too.

[LostDoggy]

We need to start afresh. Build a side around Roughy, Cordy, Williams and the Dollhouse.
Cooney, Gia, Higgins, Hargrave, Lake, Wood,.............As I say to my Dogs, get out of the House!!!!

[Sedat]

I do worry about our decision to play a spare man in defence - our forwardline is just not good enough to play a man short.Right here and now, Liam Jones has the worst job in the AFL. On his lonesome, getting sat on by 3 defenders, subjected to crap delivery into forward 50.

[LostDoggy]

Skinner looked a mile off it in the VFL today.
Hill looked good but is very raw.

Yes , our options are a little thin , we need to keep the pressure off Jones or the poor bloke will burn out and we just don,t have some available in form firepower

.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

My brother-in-law did a coaching course just recently and a section focused on the mechanics of kicking, the instructor said that Clay Smith has the worst action he has seen in his time.

I hate focusing on it, and I really wish the boy success, as it's not his fault we picked him so high. I am however very annoyed with our selection of him with our first pick. Surely hard at it types who can't kick are the realm of a rookie pick not your prime selection in the draft.
It just adds to our underwhelming early round drafting over the past decade in general.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Right here and now, Liam Jones has the worst job in the AFL. On his lonesome, getting sat on by 3 defenders, subjected to crap delivery into forward 50.

I think we've given the lad a difficult task. It doesn't help that he doesn't run anywhere near enough to the right spots though either. And that's not a criticism of him, I accept it takes several seasons for this to come naturally. But it makes it all the more bewildering why we would put him at even more of a disadvantage by playing a spare man behind the ball, thus allowing the opposition to double team him all night.

[LostDoggy]

I know posters have mentioned this earlier but it's just so obvious i'll mention it again..

5 blokes hunting the ball like maniacs, either giving away a stupid free kick or gathering possessions and turning it over.

Getting killed on the spread time and time again because we have 5 players surrounding where the ball WAS.

We are in trouble.

[angelopetraglia]

Deplorable.

Absolutely no resolve when under pressure. Our skills under pressure were non-existent. How many times did we handball it straight to them for a goal?

As bad as I have seen. Two goals half way through the last quarter. Tonight's performance reminded me of the dark, dark days of the Peter Rhode era.

Gutted.

[bulldogsman]

I've been saying it all summer but i was a lone voice. Also see my previous post re macca's facetious focus on ballwinning. I also spoke strongly against smith's selection... some have been saying that he had an okay kick but they must be watching a different player to me. As ive said many many times about that selection, what the hell did we need another bull at the gate, crap decision making, rubbish kicking, hardarse dumb ballwinner for? Like we needed our midfield IQ to go down any more?

You were never alone. There were a few others saying it including myself. I was really disappointed come draft day when we recruited Smith and I'm even more disappointed now. It's hard to see the logic in it.

[Dry Rot]

You were never alone. There were a few others saying it including myself. I was really disappointed come draft day when we recruited Smith and I'm even more disappointed now. It's hard to see the logic in it.

Well, aren't we lucky we did so well with Howard then?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Rohde era -- but possibly worse -- all over again.

Agree with everything that has been said. We look clueless, slow and just plain dumb. Who cares if you win the key indicators but turn it over like that?

What's more worrying is how disgruntled our fan base already is. A LOT of people left early into the third, and long before the final siren.

As a club, on the whole, I fear we're in deep water.

[Rocco Jones]

What's more worrying is how disgruntled our fan base already is. A LOT of people left early into the third, and long before the final siren.


I left at HT to go to the bar and watch the GC game.Really think I could have used that time more effectively...

[bulldogsman]

Well, aren't we lucky we did so well with Howard then?

Our recruiters can be just as dumb as our footballers.

[Dry Rot]

Rohde era -- but possibly worse -- all over again.

Agree with everything that has been said. We look clueless, slow and just plain dumb. Who cares if you win the key indicators but turn it over like that?

What's more worrying is how disgruntled our fan base already is. A LOT of people left early into the third, and long before the final siren.

As a club, on the whole, I fear we're in deep water.

IIRC you questioned a pre-season post of mine that Saints were a better team than us?

We are a bottom 4 or 6 team. But I don't know if it's fair to just bag the new coach - he only has the cattle he's given, even if most have foot and mouth disease and should be put down.

[SonofScray]

It felt like we just stepped back into the Rohde era. That was a real worry for me. I don't want to make a call likening what we have on front of us to those days but it was a bit of a gut wrenching game from that POV.

We were just so poor in every aspect of the game. Very few players were able to win the individual contests, very few were able to execute skills at an acceptable level. The effort wasn't shameful but the application and execution was beyond shameful. Thats even worse in a way.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I left at HT to go to the bar and watch the GC game.Really think I could have used that time more effectively...

No doubt, but I think it's a worrying sign for the club when its supporters have had enough after three rounds.

I get the feeling that a lot of supporters have 'let go' somewhat. It's as though our latest 'premiership tease' of '08-'10 has taken the sting out of the fanbase. I know that personally, I haven't felt passionate about it since 2009.

The ineivtable feeling of knowing you're going back down to the bottom for another 3-5 years is a tough pill to swallow. Especially considering our lack of success.


IIRC you questioned a pre-season post of mine that Saints were a better team than us?

We are a bottom 4 or 6 team. But I don't know if it's fair to just bag the new coach - he only has the cattle he's given, even if most have foot and mouth disease and should be put down.

Maybe -- but I never said we were a good side either. I predicted us to finish 14th or 15th IIRC. My point was that St. Kilda were crap -- and I still believe this. From memory, you were hyping them up.

We were beyond a disgrace and they only beat us by 60 points. They are lucky they've only played us and Gold Coast.

[always right]

I've been saying it all summer but i was a lone voice. Also see my previous post re macca's facetious focus on ballwinning. I also spoke strongly against smith's selection... some have been saying that he had an okay kick but they must be watching a different player to me. As ive said many many times about that selection, what the hell did we need another bull at the gate, crap decision making, rubbish kicking, hardarse dumb ballwinner for? Like we needed our midfield IQ to go down any more?

Congratulations

[The Bulldogs Bite]

On another note, Hayes should never retire so long as St. Kilda get to play the Western Bulldogs.

[Scraggers]

I think the board themselves need to take a fair portion of the blame.

Agree whole heartedly

[Eastdog]

They did not play for the jumper tonight - our traditional jumper.

[Rocco Jones]

They did not play for the jumper tonight - our traditional jumper.

I am going to start a new group. Bring back the Robodog jumper until we are less shitty.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Agree whole heartedly

And I really hope that they allow McCartney the tools and time that he will need to get us going again, and not make him the fall-guy in two years time. Because I think that this year and next are going to be very painful.
I

[LostDoggy]

They did not play for the jumper tonight - our traditional jumper.

"I want you to INSPIRE me"

Teddy Whitten (in his dressing gown) addressing players at 3/4 time in his last game

.

[Eastdog]

Do you think there could be board changes come seasons end?

[Eastdog]

"I want you to INSPIRE me"

Teddy Whitten (in his dressing gown) addressing players at 3/4 time in his last game

.

Maybe they should play that famous speech sometime to our players to give them some inspiration.

[angelopetraglia]

When was the last time a team won the inside 50s and the clearances yet lost by 10+ goals?

Tipping it would be a very rare thing, very rare. Just highlights how bad we were tonight with the ball in hand and how deficient our attacking options are.

I have no idea where this footy team is heading ... but more importantly, I don't think the coaching staff know either.

[Evel]

IIRC you questioned a pre-season post of mine that Saints were a better team than us?

We are a bottom 4 or 6 team. But I don't know if it's fair to just bag the new coach - he only has the cattle he's given, even if most have foot and mouth disease and should be put down.

Agree with this. Think it's too early to call for the coaches head, he can only work with what he has inherited. I will be interested to see his response in terms of team selection and gameplan over the next few weeks. No argument from me that tonight was deplorable. 2 goals to half time was unacceptable, in fact gws like. There's something about st.kilda going back now 6 years that seems to bring out the worst in the way we play. My entire family barrack for st.kilda and they all say to me they love playing us because they think their stars have our players psyched out and look forward to an easy win. S@$ts me that more often than not lately they're right.

In regards to Clay Smith, so far I like him. Sure his skills are lacking but for now I'm going to back the coaches to work with him to improve his deficiencies. In contrast to previous drafts I'm enjoying that I'm not screaming at a player to get in there and put your body on the line.

[LostDoggy]

I am going to start a new group. Bring back the Robodog jumper until we are less shitty.

Funniest post ever.:D

[AndrewP6]

I think a lot of people are avoiding the big white elephant sitting in the corner ...
IMO McCartney got a free ride today ... We got rid of Rocket for ???????

I was always against the change. I am yet to see anything that tells me it was the right move. Talk is cheap, and we have gone backwards, IMO.

[AndrewP6]

I've run the whole gamut tonight, now I'm just plain sad that we have regressed so far in such a relatively short time. What an embarrassing, humiliating performance from a team, that almost made the big dance a few years back. I'm simply gutted. And I'm up really late too ;)

[Scraggers]

And I really hope that they allow McCartney the tools and time that he will need to get us going again, and not make him the fall-guy in two years time.

Again ... Agreed !! I was a huge advocate for keeping Rocket ... I was so disappointed when the board (in its infinite wisdom) decided not to renew Rocket's contract ... I believed then, as I do now the best way to ensure success is continuity of leadership (I'm thinking Sheedy and Essendon ... Not to say Rocket should have been given 25 years, but I thought another extension was in order ... ANYWAY ... I'm rambling ... Back to your point, we can't go backwards; we have to move forward and therefore I hope McCartney is given every opportunity and every resource possible.



Agree with this. Think it's too early to call for the coaches head

I'm not calling for his head; I just believe he should be accountable for tonight's performance (as much as the players anyway ... The way they are being berated here)

[angelopetraglia]

The loss of Ward and Harbrow really hurts. The power clubs (i.e. Essendon, Carlton, Collingwood etc.) have been untouched by the expansion teams while we lose two players in an age bracket we could not afford to lose.

Boyd played a lone hand in the midfield last night. He had 133 SuperCoach points. Our next best midfielder was Cooney with 85. StKilda had six mids higher than 115. Another hard head in their to help Boyd would be priceless.

If we still had Harbrow, he could be playing the Robert Murphy creative role down back and Murphy could be providing some options across half-forward.

The expansion has benefited many, but has hurt us very bad.

[ReLoad]

There is quite a bit of “we shouldn’t post immediately after a game” Syndrome happening in here.

Let’s set a few things straight:

Clay Smith; It is his 3rd day at work, that’s right 3rd day and some of you are all over him like ants on dropped paddle pop. Enough of that nonsense. The kid has more guts and intestinal fortitude than the majority of our players, being so young I have some faith that he can be taught to address the deficiencies in his game, his kicking may not be perfect but let’s get stuck into him after his 75th game. To those that said “I told you so we shouldn’t have selected him” – Great feel better? Want a noddy badge?, you sound like a Richmond supporter. The kid is an extraction machine, i could not ask for more of a first year player than what he has done already.

Brendan McCartney; The guy knows what it’s like to be in a winning situation, he knows the formula, he knows the hard work that needed for a team to be as good as the cats. Does he have the cattle o do it? Hell No! Has he had the time to do it? Hell no! Saying it’s his fault and we were better off staying with rocket is another ludicrous statement which is probably worthy of a smack in the chops. Is he perfect? also Hell no. He made an obvious mistake with Bobby Murphy, BUT he does have a long term plan, and teaching the boys to put their body on the line is clearly part of it. And its step 1 in the process which was followed by the cats in a defined sequence.

There were many players who played last night that are clearly not up to it and have had years to prove themselves, Addison, Grant, Higgins etc even perhaps Wood in that bucket too (and throw in the Cooney conundrum) (and the loss of the two players to the expansion teams when they were in their primes). They are the ones who are under the pressure; they have had the game time and have shown the best part of bugger all in their development.

So let’s not eat out own, Yes we are in for a crap few years, but with a draft and its mechanisms that’s part of the cycle, we had our shot at it, it’s now our turn to rebuild. How do you think the Cheaters did it? By bottoming out, they had 5 of the crappest years under the sun. We too will have to have pain.

The real question is can the club survive it? Can we get through that period whilst the schanpperheads who will leak to the media, and cause all sorts of internal turmoil have their minutes of fame. Can we financially survive as the members drop off?

Here is where we can help, yes we can be upset we lost etc, but let’s stick fat, let’s show the club how much we love them by not ripping them to shreds, lets spread some enthusiasm about the place and pump up the tyres of our kids, like smith, libba and jonesy.

[Bumper Bulldogs]

Maybe they should play that famous speech sometime to our players to give them some inspiration.

How about just put these overpaid duds on performance contracts. Yes if you don't play you not get paid. I am not hearing that he team didn't follow instructions so maybe the coach has got it wrong.

Our senior guys will more than likely bounce back next week but is this going to help us long term. As much as it will hurt they may need to trim the senior guys now and blood kids. I would rather get spanked by only having kids than face the fact our starts are not starts and get well and truly over paid and holding ur Club back.

[w3design]

There is quite a bit of “we shouldn’t post immediately after a game” Syndrome happening in here.

Let’s set a few things straight:

Clay Smith; It is his 3rd day at work, that’s right 3rd day and some of you are all over him like ants on dropped paddle pop. Enough of that nonsense. The kid has more guts and intestinal fortitude than the majority of our players, being so young I have some faith that he can be taught to address the deficiencies in his game, his kicking may not be perfect but let’s get stuck into him after his 75th game. To those that said “I told you so we shouldn’t have selected him” – Great feel better? Want a noddy badge?, you sound like a Richmond supporter. The kid is an extraction machine, i could not ask for more of a first year player than what he has done already.

Brendan McCartney; The guy knows what it’s like to be in a winning situation, he knows the formula, he knows the hard work that needed for a team to be as good as the cats. Does he have the cattle o do it? Hell No! Has he had the time to do it? Hell no! Saying it’s his fault and we were better off staying with rocket is another ludicrous statement which is probably worthy of a smack in the chops. Is he perfect? also Hell no. He made an obvious mistake with Bobby Murphy, BUT he does have a long term plan, and teaching the boys to put their body on the line is clearly part of it. And its step 1 in the process which was followed by the cats in a defined sequence.

There were many players who played last night that are clearly not up to it and have had years to prove themselves, Addison, Grant, Higgins etc even perhaps Wood in that bucket too (and throw in the Cooney conundrum) (and the loss of the two players to the expansion teams when they were in their primes). They are the ones who are under the pressure; they have had the game time and have shown the best part of bugger all in their development.

So let’s not eat out own, Yes we are in for a crap few years, but with a draft and its mechanisms that’s part of the cycle, we had our shot at it, it’s now our turn to rebuild. How do you think the Cheaters did it? By bottoming out, they had 5 of the crappest years under the sun. We too will have to have pain.

The real question is can the club survive it? Can we get through that period whilst the schanpperheads who will leak to the media, and cause all sorts of internal turmoil have their minutes of fame. Can we financially survive as the members drop off?

Here is where we can help, yes we can be upset we lost etc, but let’s stick fat, let’s show the club how much we love them by not ripping them to shreds, lets spread some enthusiasm about the place and pump up the tyres of our kids, like smith, libba and jonesy.
This is a great post. Thanks.

Last night was pretty awful, but you've given me much needed perspective. And yes I'm too amazed that smith is being written off. He has an undefinable something and I like what I see.

[PedroArvy]

Brendan McCartney; The guy knows what it’s like to be in a winning situation, he knows the formula, he knows the hard work that needed for a team to be as good as the cats.

Not quite, he has watched these things happen, he has not made these things happen. It's a pretty different situation.

[Sedat]

Last night was pretty awful, but you've given me much needed perspective. And yes I'm too amazed that smith is being written off. He has an undefinable something and I like what I see.Nobody is writing Smith off, but we are entitled to ask the question of why we would use a 1st round ND selection on a contested ball winning animal with questionable disposal skills. We won clearances, inside 50's, and we broke even in CP's, yet we kick 2 goals in 100 mins.. We have other urgent priorities to address to the list.

[ReLoad]

Not quite, he has watched these things happen, he has not made these things happen. It's a pretty different situation.

So you are saying he did nothing at Geelong but watch? Are you serious?

[ReLoad]

Nobody is writing Smith off, but we are entitled to ask the question of why we would use a 1st round ND selection on a contested ball winning animal with questionable disposal skills. We won clearances, inside 50's, and we broke even in CP's, yet we kick 2 goals in 100 mins.. We have other urgent priorities to address to the list.

He kicked 4 goals In his first game, you seriously can criticize the selection after 3 games. Last year our contested footy sucked. We didn't draft him this week we drafted him last year.

How about you pump up his tyres before you go headhunting scapegoats

[LostDoggy]

Not quite, Brendan McCartney has watched these things happen, he has not made these things happen. It's a pretty different situation.

He was an integral part of the process at Geelong , he is our senior coach whether people like it or not , as has been posted our list is slightly out of balance but at the moment we have to pull apart the game against St Kilda and just review the structure , the game plan Macca has put in place will stay , its just a case of building on the positives from the first two games and getting the players to refocus on efficient use of the ball and decision making , I don,t see us making more than two or three changes for the next game

.

[PedroArvy]

Leading a group is different to watching a group be lead. There are different pressures, a different pschology you have to adopt. I don't think it's a great argument that simply because you have seen it happen you can make it happen. It's probably a prerequiste for getting the job in the first place, but it does not guarantee success.

[LostDoggy]

Leading a group is different to watching a group be lead. There are different pressures, a different pschology you have to adopt. I don't think it's a great argument that simply because you have seen it happen you can make it happen. It's probably a prerequiste for getting the job in the first place, but it does not guarantee success.

So are you saying that Brendan McCartney as the Coach of Ocean Grove just got lucky winning four consecutive Premierships 1994, 1995, 1996 and 1997 ?

.

[Sedat]

He kicked 4 goals In his first game, you seriously can criticize the selection after 3 games. Last year our contested footy sucked. We didn't draft him this week we drafted him last year.

How about you pump up his tyres before you go headhunting scapegoatsThe object of my ire isn't Smith - it is our recruiting dept. Our spread from contests and our decision making with ball in hand are almost the worst in comp. First round picks should not be used in 'reach' players.

FWIW I reckon Smith will have a solid AFL career,

[LostDoggy]

Bang , two to three weeks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MPH3wCrxyg

.

[bornadog]

Bang , two to three weeks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MPH3wCrxyg

.

If that's two weeks, I will bare my bum at the Pound. That was a softcock punch that brush his cheek.

[chef]

If that's two weeks, I will bare my bum at the Pound. That was a softcock punch that brush his cheek.

It was, but you just can't do it nowadays.

[LostDoggy]

If that's two weeks, I will bare my bum at the Pound. That was a softcock punch that brush his cheek.


10,000 posts and a strip show , legend

After the Tribunal decision let me know when the show is on and I,ll bring a camera ;)


.

[bornadog]

10,000 posts and a strip show , legend

After the Tribunal decision let me know when the show is on and I,ll bring a camera ;)


.

haha very funny.

[ledge]

I see the same problem every week, not enough goals for the entries into forward fifty.
Is it the delivery or is it our forwards arent good enough?
Macca has bought contest and hardness into the boys, thats great but our structure into the forward line is atrocious, he needs to address this.

[ledge]

10,000 posts and a strip show , legend

After the Tribunal decision let me know when the show is on and I,ll bring a camera ;)


.

One thing that might help Lake out is.. the player he hit didnt really flinch, his head didnt go back, all he did was put his hand on his jaw as if to say umpire did you see that, then he carried on like nothing happened, the tribunal does take into account the damage recieved to the player in this case it was none.

Intent maybe all they have to go on, it was definitely low impact.

[AndrewP6]

It was, but you just can't do it nowadays.

The way the game has been changed, you can't do anything.

[AndrewP6]

So are you saying that Brendan McCartney as the Coach of Ocean Grove just got lucky winning four consecutive Premierships 1994, 1995, 1996 and 1997 ?

.

You can't compare the AFL to the minor leagues.

[LostDoggy]

One thing that might help Lake out is.. the player he hit didnt really flinch, his head didnt go back, all he did was put his hand on his jaw as if to say umpire did you see that, then he carried on like nothing happened, the tribunal does take into account the damage recieved to the player in this case it was none.

Intent maybe all they have to go on, it was definitely low impact.

He may have only got a week if they used the 2011 guidelines

Striking and Behind Play Incidents 2012
- Change to Tribunal guidelines around impact to ensure that any reckless or intentional strikes which are inherently dangerous and / or have the potential to cause serious injury will not be classified as ‘low’ impact and will be given a higher impact rating than other offences;
- Change to Tribunal guidelines around intent to ensure that any striking action with a raised forearm or elbow will be classified as intentional, unless there is clear evidence the strike was not intentional;
- Changes to Tribunal guidelines around intent to ensure that any striking action that occurs behind play, off the ball or during a break in play will be classified as intentional, unless there is clear evidence the strike was not intentional.

.

[AndrewP6]

.
:Clay Smith; It is his 3rd day at work, that’s right 3rd day and some of you are all over him like ants on dropped paddle pop. Enough of that nonsense. The kid has more guts and intestinal fortitude than the majority of our players, being so young I have some faith that he can be taught to address the deficiencies in his game, his kicking may not be perfect but let’s get stuck into him after his 75th game. To those that said “I told you so we shouldn’t have selected him” – Great feel better? Want a noddy badge?, you sound like a Richmond supporter. The kid is an extraction machine, i could not ask for more of a first year player than what he has done already.
.

Well, if you only consider game day his "work". Reality is he's there every day. FWIW, I agree that he shouldn't be the target of scorn.


. Saying it’s his fault and we were better off staying with rocket is another ludicrous statement which is probably worthy of a smack in the chops.
.
It's simply an opinion., that's what a forum is for.

[Maddog37]

Reading some of this I had to check and make sure I wasn't on big footy.

Lots of I told you so and our club is doomed bullshit.

All I really felt about last night was a group of individuals not yet adapted to a different game style and getting caught second guessing themselves. The team work was non existent.

Long road in front of us but if You did not already know that then you were delusional.

No doubt it will be painful at times but the sun will keep coming up. Enjoy the journey.

[Hotdog60]

We all knew we were in for some short term pain for long term gain, we just need to sit tight for a while. There is going to be a lot of venting on this forum which is totally understandable. It's a good thing it's only the TV that hears me at the game.:D

[MrMahatma]

I am going to start a new group. Bring back the Robodog jumper until we are less shitty.
Boom.

I laughed!

[MrMahatma]

The question is: WTF happened?

Did players not follow instructions? If so, they should be made accountable.
Did we get out coached? If so, that's a shame given the bloke in the other box is also in his 3rd game in the top job.
Are the blokes on the ground just not capable? If so, drop them.

Found it interesting that Macca said "going bananas" at young kids and dropping them won't help. Wallis seemed to only get one crack at it before getting the ass.

Why is Jones being triple teamed? Bad coaching? Players not following instructions?

Also - who's our skills coach?

[LostDoggy]

There is quite a bit of “we shouldn’t post immediately after a game” Syndrome happening in here.

Let’s set a few things straight:

Clay Smith; It is his 3rd day at work, that’s right 3rd day and some of you are all over him like ants on dropped paddle pop. Enough of that nonsense. The kid has more guts and intestinal fortitude than the majority of our players, being so young I have some faith that he can be taught to address the deficiencies in his game, his kicking may not be perfect but let’s get stuck into him after his 75th game. To those that said “I told you so we shouldn’t have selected him” – Great feel better? Want a noddy badge?, you sound like a Richmond supporter. The kid is an extraction machine, i could not ask for more of a first year player than what he has done already.

Brendan McCartney; The guy knows what it’s like to be in a winning situation, he knows the formula, he knows the hard work that needed for a team to be as good as the cats. Does he have the cattle o do it? Hell No! Has he had the time to do it? Hell no! Saying it’s his fault and we were better off staying with rocket is another ludicrous statement which is probably worthy of a smack in the chops. Is he perfect? also Hell no. He made an obvious mistake with Bobby Murphy, BUT he does have a long term plan, and teaching the boys to put their body on the line is clearly part of it. And its step 1 in the process which was followed by the cats in a defined sequence.

There were many players who played last night that are clearly not up to it and have had years to prove themselves, Addison, Grant, Higgins etc even perhaps Wood in that bucket too (and throw in the Cooney conundrum) (and the loss of the two players to the expansion teams when they were in their primes). They are the ones who are under the pressure; they have had the game time and have shown the best part of bugger all in their development.

So let’s not eat out own, Yes we are in for a crap few years, but with a draft and its mechanisms that’s part of the cycle, we had our shot at it, it’s now our turn to rebuild. How do you think the Cheaters did it? By bottoming out, they had 5 of the crappest years under the sun. We too will have to have pain.

The real question is can the club survive it? Can we get through that period whilst the schanpperheads who will leak to the media, and cause all sorts of internal turmoil have their minutes of fame. Can we financially survive as the members drop off?

Here is where we can help, yes we can be upset we lost etc, but let’s stick fat, let’s show the club how much we love them by not ripping them to shreds, lets spread some enthusiasm about the place and pump up the tyres of our kids, like smith, libba and jonesy.



Great post, I say relax we knew we would be preety average this year plus last weeks game in Adelaide was a bruiser and we were just very flat and on the other side the Saints had a cruisy game. We need some luck with the back six and have them out there fit at once for a change, two more blokes in the middle who can finish and a lead up FF and things will change preety quickly sounds simple enough?

More importantly is how Cooney pulled up after running around on the carpark.

[AndrewP6]

The question is: WTF happened?

Did players not follow instructions? If so, they should be made accountable.
Did we get out coached? If so, that's a shame given the bloke in the other box is also in his 3rd game in the top job.
Are the blokes on the ground just not capable? If so, drop them.

Found it interesting that Macca said "going bananas" at young kids and dropping them won't help. Wallis seemed to only get one crack at it before getting the ass.

Why is Jones being triple teamed? Bad coaching? Players not following instructions?

Also - who's our skills coach?

Rohan Smith

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

There is quite a bit of “we shouldn’t post immediately after a game” Syndrome happening in here.

Let’s set a few things straight:

Clay Smith; It is his 3rd day at work, that’s right 3rd day and some of you are all over him like ants on dropped paddle pop. Enough of that nonsense. The kid has more guts and intestinal fortitude than the majority of our players, being so young I have some faith that he can be taught to address the deficiencies in his game, his kicking may not be perfect but let’s get stuck into him after his 75th game. To those that said “I told you so we shouldn’t have selected him” – Great feel better? Want a noddy badge?, you sound like a Richmond supporter. The kid is an extraction machine, i could not ask for more of a first year player than what he has done already.



You really think his kicking can improve drastically? Do you not think that as an aspiring AFL footballer he would've already had alot of coaches in his ear attempting to change the way he kicks? His issue has nothing to do with whether he has played 3 games or 30 games for us. It's not like he needs someone to just help him with his run-up. Clay has profound issues with his whole kicking action and the fact is without significant change it will have a major impact on whether or not he becomes a valuable midfielder for us.


It won't make a lick of difference that he may be an 'extraction machine' if he's handing it over to the opposition more times than not because of an inherent and major flaw in his kicking action.

If when required he cannot perform a basic skill of the game such as kick the ball to a team mate on a regular and predictable basis, he will be a liability. And on that basis I think it's a valid query to ask why the club spent a 1st round pick on someone who has such a serious flaw in one of the basics required to play the game.

Asking such a question or discussing it here, does not deserve to incur your's or anyone's wrath. It does not make us any less passionate or supportive of the club.

Usually such guys who are rated as -'hard at it, has a great desire and ability to win ball, but requires major remedial work on his kicking if he is going to make it'- usually get taken in the late rounds or via the rookie draft.

We have chosen to spend a 1st round pick on one such player. To apparently fill a need that that apart last year, we have otherwise been quite good at.
We have already drafted inside types in recent years with high draft picks in Libba, Wallis, and possibly next year as well with Lachlan Hunter. For mine it seems as if we went into the draft hell bent on trying to replace Callan Ward. Was that to address a team need, or was it to get supporters minds off of the loss of yet another quality young player to an expansion team?
I want the boy to suceed as I've already said previously, but this is not mutually exlcusive from my concern that it was not a pick we should've made in the first place.

[MrMahatma]

RE: Clay Smith. A boss once told me "don't confuse the fact that someone's nice person with whether or not they're good at their job". No one wishes bad of Smith, and we all want him to succeed and improve. But given the time spent analysing kids pre-draft, and the critical importance of foot skills, it's only logical that when we use our best pick for years on a bloke who can't hit targets by foot, supporters ask the question.

Of course, having said all that, we could've used our pick on a skilled player like Howard (how's he going?) or a talented mid like Higgins...

[G-Mo77]

Glad I wasn't there last night, was at a wedding and the bottom of many beer glasses was a much better site.

It was still hard to stomach watching the replay this morning. :(

[comrade]

Glad I wasn't there last night, was at a wedding and the bottom of many beer glasses was a much better site.

It was still hard to stomach watching the replay this morning. :(

I was also at a wedding last night and missed the carnage.

Not sure I'm going to bother with the replay. Is there anyway I can just download the passages of play when Dahlhaus is involved? :)

[bornadog]

I was also at a wedding last night and missed the carnage.

Not sure I'm going to bother with the replay. Is there anyway I can just download the passages of play when Dahlhaus is involved? :)

I wouldn't bother watching the replay either, basically Zero highlights.

[Mantis]

Not sure I'm going to bother with the replay. Is there anyway I can just download the passages of play when Dahlhaus is involved? :)

So you want to watch 1 minute of play?

Seriously Dahlhaus was only made to look ok by the rest being deplorable... His miss late in the 1st qtr to keep us in touch was a shocker.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

So you want to watch 1 minute of play?

Seriously Dahlhaus was only made to look ok by the rest being deplorable... His miss late in the 1st qtr to keep us in touch was a shocker.

Yep -- not one of his good games, but the fact that he features in votes is largely due to the performance of the majority of the side.

St. Kilda's pressure was pretty immense on Dahl.

[Hotdog60]

On a bright note our first goal to Jones looked good. It's a pity there wasn't more of it.

[ReLoad]

You really think his kicking can improve drastically? Do you not think that as an aspiring AFL footballer he would've already had alot of coaches in his ear attempting to change the way he kicks? His issue has nothing to do with whether he has played 3 games or 30 games for us. It's not like he needs someone to just help him with his run-up. Clay has profound issues with his whole kicking action and the fact is without significant change it will have a major impact on whether or not he becomes a valuable midfielder for us.


It won't make a lick of difference that he may be an 'extraction machine' if he's handing it over to the opposition more times than not because of an inherent and major flaw in his kicking action.

If when required he cannot perform a basic skill of the game such as kick the ball to a team mate on a regular and predictable basis, he will be a liability. And on that basis I think it's a valid query to ask why the club spent a 1st round pick on someone who has such a serious flaw in one of the basics required to play the game.

Asking such a question or discussing it here, does not deserve to incur your's or anyone's wrath. It does not make us any less passionate or supportive of the club.

Usually such guys who are rated as -'hard at it, has a great desire and ability to win ball, but requires major remedial work on his kicking if he is going to make it'- usually get taken in the late rounds or via the rookie draft.

We have chosen to spend a 1st round pick on one such player. To apparently fill a need that that apart last year, we have otherwise been quite good at.
We have already drafted inside types in recent years with high draft picks in Libba, Wallis, and possibly next year as well with Lachlan Hunter. For mine it seems as if we went into the draft hell bent on trying to replace Callan Ward. Was that to address a team need, or was it to get supporters minds off of the loss of yet another quality young player to an expansion team?
I want the boy to suceed as I've already said previously, but this is not mutually exlcusive from my concern that it was not a pick we should've made in the first place.

Yes I think he can improve his skills, will they be Elite? No I doubt it. Can they get to a serviceable level such as Daniel Cross? Yes i think he can. He's just a kid he's had half a pre season. Several posters here have lambasted our recruiting team for selecting him, and i think it is simply too early to even think about that

There are a plethora of great players who have kicking issues, sadly for us 93% of our team couldnt kick a rock in a quarry.

Just as you suggest discussions dont deserve any wrath, Im simply offering an opposing point of view to those suggestions previous to mine about the obvious mistake made by our recruiting team.

I too am just as passionate about our predicament, just because my passion is in a different opinion direction :)

[Sedat]

Yes I think he can improve his skills, will they be Elite? No I doubt it. Can they get to a serviceable level such as Daniel Cross? Yes i think he can. He's just a kid he's had half a pre season.I guess the point we are trying to make is that Cross was a pick 56 and Boyd was a rookie selection. These guys weren't anywhere near 1st round selections.

[LostDoggy]

There is quite a bit of “we shouldn’t post immediately after a game” Syndrome happening in here.

Let’s set a few things straight:

Clay Smith; It is his 3rd day at work, that’s right 3rd day and some of you are all over him like ants on dropped paddle pop. Enough of that nonsense. The kid has more guts and intestinal fortitude than the majority of our players, being so young I have some faith that he can be taught to address the deficiencies in his game, his kicking may not be perfect but let’s get stuck into him after his 75th game. To those that said “I told you so we shouldn’t have selected him” – Great feel better? Want a noddy badge?, you sound like a Richmond supporter. The kid is an extraction machine, i could not ask for more of a first year player than what he has done already.

Brendan McCartney; The guy knows what it’s like to be in a winning situation, he knows the formula, he knows the hard work that needed for a team to be as good as the cats. Does he have the cattle o do it? Hell No! Has he had the time to do it? Hell no! Saying it’s his fault and we were better off staying with rocket is another ludicrous statement which is probably worthy of a smack in the chops. Is he perfect? also Hell no. He made an obvious mistake with Bobby Murphy, BUT he does have a long term plan, and teaching the boys to put their body on the line is clearly part of it. And its step 1 in the process which was followed by the cats in a defined sequence.

There were many players who played last night that are clearly not up to it and have had years to prove themselves, Addison, Grant, Higgins etc even perhaps Wood in that bucket too (and throw in the Cooney conundrum) (and the loss of the two players to the expansion teams when they were in their primes). They are the ones who are under the pressure; they have had the game time and have shown the best part of bugger all in their development.

So let’s not eat out own, Yes we are in for a crap few years, but with a draft and its mechanisms that’s part of the cycle, we had our shot at it, it’s now our turn to rebuild. How do you think the Cheaters did it? By bottoming out, they had 5 of the crappest years under the sun. We too will have to have pain.

The real question is can the club survive it? Can we get through that period whilst the schanpperheads who will leak to the media, and cause all sorts of internal turmoil have their minutes of fame. Can we financially survive as the members drop off?

Here is where we can help, yes we can be upset we lost etc, but let’s stick fat, let’s show the club how much we love them by not ripping them to shreds, lets spread some enthusiasm about the place and pump up the tyres of our kids, like smith, libba and jonesy.

Great post, saved me the time putting it together.
:D

Young Clay managed to slot 4 goals in his first game, I'm sure there is plenty to work with.

[Ghost Dog]

There is quite a bit of “we shouldn’t post immediately after a game” Syndrome happening in here.

So let’s not eat out own, Yes we are in for a crap few years, but with a draft and its mechanisms that’s part of the cycle, we had our shot at it, it’s now our turn to rebuild. How do you think the Cheaters did it? By bottoming out, they had 5 of the crappest years under the sun. We too will have to have pain.

T

Some good points there but not everyone agrees. The current coach of Geelong says there is no need to bottom out in order to remain competitive. It was our senior players who let us down against St Kilda ( so people say, I can't bring myself to watch the game to tell the truth as I have a severe dislike of that particular team) just as much as our junior players.

[LostDoggy]

It's the gameday thread. We played like arse -- as bad as we've ever played, and these posts are banged out in the heat of the game. You're going to get venting, and we who plonk down our hard-earned decade after decade probably feel entitled to expect a bit better than we are getting. I think the gameday thread is a valid place to vent as much as one likes (within reason).

Also, I haven't seen the negativity carry over into other threads, which tend to be far more measured.

No need to get too precious.

[chef]

Some good points there but not everyone agrees. The current coach of Geelong says there is no need to bottom out in order to remain competitive. It was our senior players who let us down against St Kilda ( so people say, I can't bring myself to watch the game to tell the truth as I have a severe dislike of that particular team) just as much as our junior players.

TBH what would he really know with the job he walked into.

[bornadog]

Bang , two to three weeks

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MPH3wCrxyg

.


If that's two weeks, I will bare my bum at the Pound. That was a softcock punch that brush his cheek.

Hehhe, lucky it was only one.

[LostDoggy]

Hehhe, lucky it was only one.

He did get two weeks but with a guilty plea one week , I,ll let you off on a technicality , also I,m a nice bloke and I,m pretty sure no one wanted photos of you exposing yourself :D

.

[AndrewP6]

We played like arse -- as bad as we've ever played, and these posts are banged out in the heat of the game.

This is my new favourite expression. :D So precise and eloquent.


No need to get too precious.

Amen to that.

[Redemption97]

A lot has been said about our foot skills in our midfield against the saints... What bothers me and we've had this in our game long before this season is the over possession of the ball when we run and carry... The extra handball usually to a running player who is under pressure and in a worse position than the original ball carrier... I find this is usually after a break on the spread and rather to go by foot to a target across the half forward line or even for the boundary line we try to run it that bit extra through a zone. I realise this might be a result of a lack of confidence in our half forwards or that our forwards maybe aren't actually making the position so the ball has to held up but that for me is something I see time and time again with our midfield. I'd be interested in what others think... I think decision making of that midfield group is often more the issue perhaps than their kicking... Sure the kicking is bad but when you receive the ball under pressure it's hard to execute those kicks no matter how good your skills are.

[HOSE B ROMERO]

There is quite a bit of “we shouldn’t post immediately after a game” Syndrome happening in here.

Let’s set a few things straight:

Clay Smith; It is his 3rd day at work, that’s right 3rd day and some of you are all over him like ants on dropped paddle pop. Enough of that nonsense. The kid has more guts and intestinal fortitude than the majority of our players, being so young I have some faith that he can be taught to address the deficiencies in his game, his kicking may not be perfect but let’s get stuck into him after his 75th game. To those that said “I told you so we shouldn’t have selected him” – Great feel better? Want a noddy badge?, you sound like a Richmond supporter. The kid is an extraction machine, i could not ask for more of a first year player than what he has done already.

Brendan McCartney; The guy knows what it’s like to be in a winning situation, he knows the formula, he knows the hard work that needed for a team to be as good as the cats. Does he have the cattle o do it? Hell No! Has he had the time to do it? Hell no! Saying it’s his fault and we were better off staying with rocket is another ludicrous statement which is probably worthy of a smack in the chops. Is he perfect? also Hell no. He made an obvious mistake with Bobby Murphy, BUT he does have a long term plan, and teaching the boys to put their body on the line is clearly part of it. And its step 1 in the process which was followed by the cats in a defined sequence.

There were many players who played last night that are clearly not up to it and have had years to prove themselves, Addison, Grant, Higgins etc even perhaps Wood in that bucket too (and throw in the Cooney conundrum) (and the loss of the two players to the expansion teams when they were in their primes). They are the ones who are under the pressure; they have had the game time and have shown the best part of bugger all in their development.

So let’s not eat out own, Yes we are in for a crap few years, but with a draft and its mechanisms that’s part of the cycle, we had our shot at it, it’s now our turn to rebuild. How do you think the Cheaters did it? By bottoming out, they had 5 of the crappest years under the sun. We too will have to have pain.

The real question is can the club survive it? Can we get through that period whilst the schanpperheads who will leak to the media, and cause all sorts of internal turmoil have their minutes of fame. Can we financially survive as the members drop off?

Here is where we can help, yes we can be upset we lost etc, but let’s stick fat, let’s show the club how much we love them by not ripping them to shreds, lets spread some enthusiasm about the place and pump up the tyres of our kids, like smith, libba and jonesy.


Good work Reload! As i begun reading through these posts, i thought ' i have to respond to some of these' but then realized i haven't got that many years left.

To all the 'Eeyores', if you can't stand the pain/haven't got the patience that comes with the territory, don't come to the games and put yourself through it. Honestly the Melbourne Theatre Company has some smashing productions through the winter months.

And please, P-L-E-A-S-E, if you are going to turn on the coach and the boys at games (like the Tiger ferals do), make sure you're not sitting near bay 17 at the Doglands.

See you at MCG Sunday afternoon.

[bornadog]

A lot has been said about our foot skills in our midfield against the saints... What bothers me and we've had this in our game long before this season is the over possession of the ball when we run and carry... The extra handball usually to a running player who is under pressure and in a worse position than the original ball carrier... I find this is usually after a break on the spread and rather to go by foot to a target across the half forward line or even for the boundary line we try to run it that bit extra through a zone. I realise this might be a result of a lack of confidence in our half forwards or that our forwards maybe aren't actually making the position so the ball has to held up but that for me is something I see time and time again with our midfield. I'd be interested in what others think... I think decision making of that midfield group is often more the issue perhaps than their kicking... Sure the kicking is bad but when you receive the ball under pressure it's hard to execute those kicks no matter how good your skills are.

I agree you make some very good points. The Saints on Saturday really pressured us every time we had the ball and our decision making was not good. We are currently sitting on fifth for total disposals, but are third with total handballs, which means we are trying to handball our way through zones ......unfortunately not doing a good job.

[LostDoggy]

To all the 'Eeyores', if you can't stand the pain/haven't got the patience that comes with the territory, don't come to the games and put yourself through it. Honestly the Melbourne Theatre Company has some smashing productions through the winter months.


That's exactly what we need: less people through the gate.

Don't worry, you're getting your wish; on current trend we'll end up with the lowest membership of any Victorian club, and our gates are not going to get any better on the back of the performances so far. If some of us are p.o.ed it's because we've seen what happens when a club with a small supporter base start turning in the shit performances: see 1989, Fitzroy, North Melbourne's GC dramas, Port and Melbourne currently.

The last thing we need is for die-hards to drop off too. Say what you will about the Richmond ferals, at least they keep fronting up.