Bankers and Anchors - Round 5 vs GWS

[westdog54]

In memory of 'The Banker', who recently passed away, The weekly Slaps and Sledges/Saints and Sinners thread will now permanently be renamed the 'Bankers and Anchors" thread

This is the round 5 edition. Once the game against Greater Western Sydney is concluded post your nominations for:

The Bankers = 3 guys that you we banked on to do the right thing during the game
The Anchors = 3 guys that weighed us down by their errors or poor play

Please limit it to no more than three of each, but feel free to make honourable/dishonourable mentions. As usual try to make it constructive criticism.

[Maddog37]

Love it. Great name.

[LostDoggy]

I agree. Nice tribute to The Banker. :)

[LostDoggy]

Yeh nice change, any chance of a fulltime change of names?

[hujsh]

Thought it was a sledge at Ward at first.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Seriously cool name

[GVGjr]

Yeh nice change, any chance of a fulltime change of names?

As far as we are concerned it's a permanent change

[EasternWest]

Yep love it. It's a small gesture to The Banker, but spot on for this community.

[Eastdog]

Great tribute to The Banker for his memory.

[LostDoggy]

Awewome name and a very nice touch.

[LostDoggy]

As far as we are concerned it's a permanent change


Fantastic news. Well done.:)

[F'scary]

In memory of 'The Banker', who recently passed away, The weekly Slaps and Sledges/Saints and Sinners thread will now permanently be renamed the 'Bankers and Anchors" thread

This is the round 5 edition. Once the game against Greater Western Sydney is concluded post your nominations for:

The Bankers = 3 guys that you we banked on to do the right thing during the game
The Anchors = 3 guys that weighed us down by their errors or poor play

Please limit it to no more than three of each, but feel free to make honourable/dishonourable mentions. As usual try to make it constructive criticism.

top name for this thread. Good stuff

[Go_Dogs]

Bankers:

Griffen - huge first half, slowed down a little but worked hard all day.

Murphy - just about everything he did was good, just need him kicking the ball 20 times a game.

Wallis - showed some good poise at times today, and improved again on last week.


Anchors:

Wood - thought he did a few better things as the game went on, but I think he either needs a few weeks at VFL level, or a move out of the backline.

Jones - another who had a better second half, I know he isn't getting much help but he's struggling at the moment and his confidence must be dropping off.

Run and spread - it was the right decision to take Roughy off as we needed more run. We just seem very stagnate and struggle to move the ball cleanly once we've won it. A number of times today we had no run from behind the ball and were reduced to short chip kicks to work the ball forwards which wasn't an effective tactic.

[Ghost Dog]

Bankers:

Liberatore. In, under, winning it out with a long kick. Did his job well

Griff: 37 touches say no more

Vezpa: Good to see someone with enough pep not to be pushed around by a bunch of pubescent orange jaffas.

Dahlhaus: Liam Jones. Some excellent contested marks. Pity they weren't always converted.

Murphy: As reliable as a 1988 Corolla

Anchors: Higgins - Missed the gettable, and can often be seen giving others a bit of a spray. Don't like it.

Pace: We looked like a bunch of plodders and anytime they were able to get a player forward and turn it into a chase, we were bound to be beaten.

Last Quarter: Chipping it around like a bunch of noobs with 2 minutes left on the clock. My pet hate in moments.

[Rocco Jones]

Bankers-
Picken- great work on Ward in the first half.
Wallis- great work in close
Minson- looking a lot better now he has the 1st ruck role

Anchors-
Our foot skills. Jones has the toughest job in footy.

Wood- I remember actually being worried that GWS would sign him...

Spread/pace

Special bonus 'Wanker'

Callan Ward

[always right]

Bankers
Minson....the most influential player on the ground
Picken for his job on Ward
Libba who showed others up with the quality of his posessions

Anchors
Austen who was shown up by an 18 year old
Our foot skills
Cordy.....who actually played a pretty good first half but is there any chance he can hold a mark?

[Mofra]

Bankers:
Wallis & Libba - will play lots of footy for us in coming years, both have super quick hands and Wallis seems to have imporved his kicking

Minson - gave us some serious presence at the ruck contests

Cordy - his defensive efforts were excellent for much of today, managed his first goal too.

Well done to DJ & Addison too - both are ahead of where I thought they'd be this year

Anchors:
Wood - needs a spell, his handballing is terrible at the moment

Roughy - just couldn't get into it today

[Ghost Dog]

In some ways, I was more disappointed in that win than I was with our loss to Adelaide. Generally, poor and patchy football.
Higgins was a real lowlight for mine. Our senior players need to get those shots from in front.

[Raw Toast]

Fantastic name change, thanks to the mods responsible.

In terms of actually contributing, I'll see if I have enough time and courage to watch the replay, and then have my say :o

[bornadog]

Bankers

*Griffen - Genuiune A grader

* Cordy, Wallis, Libba - Father Sons and players of the future

* Picken - Ward kept to 18 disposals. The guy harrasses all day. How good was that tackle on Million dollar man Folau

Anchors

*Missed shots at goal and there were plenty, should have won by 60 plus points

* Whole Team - First quarter a shocker

* Umpiring - The AFL needs to get back to basics.

[always right]

Fantastic name change, thanks to the mods responsible.

In terms of actually contributing, I'll see if I have enough time and courage to watch the replay, and then have my say :o

Don't put yourself through it...or if you do, certainly don't watch the first quarter. One of our darkest moments in years not to have scored a goal against that mob.

[jazzadogs]

Don't put yourself through it...or if you do, certainly don't watch the first quarter. One of our darkest moments in years not to have scored a goal against that mob.
I just got home from footy and have started watching from quarter time. No way I'm putting myself through the first quarter!

[azabob]

Bankers-


Anchors-
Our foot skills. Jones has the toughest job in footy.




RJ, Jones is his own worst enemy also. When he does get a chance he doesn't make the best of his opportunities.

[Rocco Jones]

RJ, Jones is his own worst enemy also. When he does get a chance he doesn't make the best of his opportunities.

With enemies like his own kicking and our delivery to him it's pretty cruel that the opposition try and be his enemy as well.

[Eastdog]

I just got home from footy and have started watching from quarter time. No way I'm putting myself through the first quarter!

We were awful in that first quarter and to not score a goal against the new kids on the block GWS is simply not good enough. The rest of the match was ok but there is a lot of work to do.

[Ghost Dog]

With enemies like his own kicking and our delivery to him it's pretty cruel that the opposition try and be his enemy as well.

I'd rather he have the marking bit as good as he does than the kicking bit, as bad as he does. Seems the easier of the two to rectify.
Get Barry in to help him with it please?

[jeemak]

Bankers:

Cordy - Excellent first half. He will be a player, though needs to build his fitness to ensure a 4 quater performance

Picken - Kept Ward quiet (disgraceful decision to play on after receiving from Lake, needs to be smarter with limited opportunities) and made himself dangerous up forward.

Griffen - Needs to break out with run and carry, though his ability to win and use the ball is top notch

Anchors:

Wood - Needs a spell to get some confidence beating up smaller opponents. Unacceptable skill level even for a developing player.

Cross - Not his fault, though I find his lack of pace, indecisiveness and poor foot skills becoming more frustrating and more of an issue each week.

Dahlhaus - Didn't work hard enough in the first half. Showed some willingness to turn it around in the second, though he needs to show intensity at all times to be effective.


Special mention for the terrible umpiring, the Fox footy team's one sided comentary when GWS were competitive and our foot skills.

Extra special mention to our players unwillingness to give Ward grief when he deliberately tunnelled Dahlhaus. If the AFL is serious they'll give him a week or so, though that's not likely to happen any time soon.

[LostDoggy]

Cross - Not his fault, though I find his lack of pace, indecisiveness and poor foot skills becoming more frustrating and more of an issue each week.


9 kicks 25 handballs 5 marks 4 tackles. 4 frees for 1 against.
I wish others played as bad as he did.

[Rocco Jones]

9 kicks 25 handballs 5 marks 4 tackles. 4 frees for 1 against.
I wish others played as bad as he did.

Yep, I thought Cross was alright today. IMO he gets way too much criticism on here.

Fans say he is too slow and he is but at least he tries to spread and offer us a free option. Sure it isn't a great option but it well and truly smacks our benchmark. I am not a believer in the more kids you play, the more they develop kind of thinking and I see Crossy as a positive influence on our kids.

He is nothing more than a good ordinary player but as a team, we are a couple of rungs below ordinary.

[westdog54]

9 kicks 25 handballs 5 marks 4 tackles. 4 frees for 1 against.
I wish others played as bad as he did.

With all due respect Chops, those stats are completely irrelevant to the lack of pace, indecisiveness and poor foot skills that Jeemak identified.

[LostDoggy]

With all due respect Chops, those stats are completely irrelevant to the lack of pace, indecisiveness and poor foot skills that Jeemak identified.

Well we knew he had no pace prior this game.
I saw very little indecisiveness or poor foot skills by him today especially compared to other players.
What the stats show he was he one of the better players.

Some players can do no wrong and even when they do some of us turn a blind eye. Eg Picken, Cordy, Dahlhaus, etc
Others are the opposite.

[jeemak]

9 kicks 25 handballs 5 marks 4 tackles. 4 frees for 1 against.
I wish others played as bad as he did.

Not concerned with his numbers. He's never been a player to return poor numbers anyway, even though those high stats don't always equate to high impact.

There were a heap of poor efforts from all of our players today, and Cross was by no means the poorest performer.

For mine, he's desperately slow, his decision making is becoming a liability and he isn't at all creative with his ball use. I really don't know how he could have been given a two year deal post 2011 and I think his position in the side is eventually going to stifle the development of one of Wallis, Liberatore and Smith.

I understand he has a hand in many score opportunitess however, I don't think we'd score less without him in the side and I think that as Wallis, Liberatore, Smith and Tutt gain more experience they'll prove to be more effective in this area.

If he was highly skilled or likely to kick goals or shut down an opponent I'd be more lenient on his lack of athletic or decision making attributes, though he doesn't do that. Right now he's a midfielder that gets a lot of the ball, and doesn't hurt the opposition when he has it.

He's an honest player and has been a loyal, committed and hard working soldier of the club. The coaching staff rate him, so I'm out of line I suppose.

[Sedat]

9 kicks 25 handballs 5 marks 4 tackles. 4 frees for 1 against.
I wish others played as bad as he did.
Agreed, he was excellent today. Sure he is as slow as a wet week when he gets into space, but his workrate to actually get into space should be commended - shame that many of his more skilled teammates don't work as hard to find space as Crossy does.

[LostDoggy]

Why are you highlighting Cross getting 2 years when you have players that shouldn't be getting games at Williamstown on the list.
At the moment his form isn't bad and I dont see anyone ready take his spot.

Cross may be a poor kick but nothing I've seen of Smith makes me think he is a better kick or decision maker.

[bornadog]

9 kicks 25 handballs 5 marks 4 tackles. 4 frees for 1 against.
I wish others played as bad as he did.

We can't go a week without having a crack at Cross now can we.

[jeemak]

Why are you highlighting Cross getting 2 years when you have players that shouldn't be getting games at Williamstown on the list.
At the moment his form isn't bad and I dont see anyone ready take his spot.

Cross may be a poor kick but nothing I've seen of Smith makes me think he is a better kick or decision maker.

Smith isn't a better decision maker than Cross, yet, and he will only become one over time through gaining experience. He needs to get his fitness base up of course. Although he has defficiencies in his kicking I think he's likely to be a more penetrating one as time goes by.

I'm highlighting Cross getting two years because it was topical, on the back of you questioning me over stating how frustrated I am by his deficiencies in the Anchors section of this thread. I'll happily discuss the other issues we have with our list with you, but this isn't the thread for that.

I don't normally take hard lines with players and I am not happy about drawing a line through Cross because of how hard he works each week. Slow midfield players that can't kick, don't make good deicsions or don't shut down the opposition don't really have a place in the game anymore. He'll keep getting the ball, he'll keep trying his guts out and he will always have solid character as a player however, I struggle to see his ongoing value to the side through his inability to use it.

[bornadog]

Smith isn't a better decision maker than Cross, yet, and he will only become one over time through gaining experience. He needs to get his fitness base up of course. Although he has defficiencies in his kicking I think he's likely to be a more penetrating one as time goes by.

I'm highlighting Cross getting two years because it was topical, on the back of you questioning me over stating how frustrated I am by his deficiencies in the Anchors section of this thread. I'll happily discuss the other issues we have with our list with you, but this isn't the thread for that.

I don't normally take hard lines with players and I am not happy about drawing a line through Cross because of how hard he works each week. Slow midfield players that can't kick, don't make good deicsions or don't shut down the opposition don't really have a place in the game anymore. He'll keep getting the ball, he'll keep trying his guts out and he will always have solid character as a player however, I struggle to see his ongoing value to the side through his inability to use it.

Really you are becoming like a broken record every week having a go at Cross. Yes he is slow, and really that is the reason you don't like him, yet the guy gets a lot of the ball and he hits his targets. He had 88% disposal efficiency today and only 2 clangers

[jeemak]

Really you are becoming like a broken record every week having a go at Cross. Yes he is slow, and really that is the reason you don't like him, yet the guy gets a lot of the ball and he hits his targets. He had 88% disposal efficiency today and only 2 clangers

Fair enough, I'll give it a rest.

I guess I look at our side on the basis of how we're going to improve going forwards, as well as how we perform week to week. I do have a prejudice against him because of his pace, though to suggest that's the only reason why I don't think he adds value versus the amount of football he gathers is pretty simplistic. He's going to be a part of the team this year, and maybe next year as well so I'll have to just deal with it.

Let's move on.

[jeemak]

In some ways, I was more disappointed in that win than I was with our loss to Adelaide. Generally, poor and patchy football.
Higgins was a real lowlight for mine. Our senior players need to get those shots from in front.

His finish on the left boot was very silky, though he let himself down through blocking the ball across the face a couple of times.

I thought he tried today throughput terrible services, and at least tried to play defensively as well.

[Ghost Dog]

His finish on the left boot was very silky, though he let himself down through blocking the ball across the face a couple of times.

I thought he tried today throughput terrible services, and at least tried to play defensively as well.

Yes I thought he tried as well. However I hate seeing him throw a tanty at others ( Liam Jones ) for what he sees as poor delivery and then miss very very gettable goals from inside 50. He must kick those. The ones he missed were not extreme angles, or beyond his distance. According to the web His kicking is becoming less accurate for goal as time goes on.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Not concerned with his numbers. He's never been a player to return poor numbers anyway, even though those high stats don't always equate to high impact.

There were a heap of poor efforts from all of our players today, and Cross was by no means the poorest performer.

For mine, he's desperately slow, his decision making is becoming a liability and he isn't at all creative with his ball use. I really don't know how he could have been given a two year deal post 2011 and I think his position in the side is eventually going to stifle the development of one of Wallis, Liberatore and Smith.

I understand he has a hand in many score opportunitess however, I don't think we'd score less without him in the side and I think that as Wallis, Liberatore, Smith and Tutt gain more experience they'll prove to be more effective in this area.

If he was highly skilled or likely to kick goals or shut down an opponent I'd be more lenient on his lack of athletic or decision making attributes, though he doesn't do that. Right now he's a midfielder that gets a lot of the ball, and doesn't hurt the opposition when he has it.

He's an honest player and has been a loyal, committed and hard working soldier of the club. The coaching staff rate him, so I'm out of line I suppose.

That's actually the only bit I agree with

[LostDoggy]

Banker :
Austin - 12 disposals, 5 contested, 8 1% , 92% disposal efficiency , 90% game time - Mark may have looked a little out of place at times but he wasn,t alone , it was good for him to get some more game time , we need him against Collingwood

Cross - 34 disposals , 12 contested , 7 clearances , 88% disposal efficiency , 91% game time - tough day at the office for Mr Reliable , not his usual game where he is closer to the contest , he may be too patient with the ball at times but he just keeps working and working

Griffen - 37 disposals , 13 contested , 6 clearances , 8 inside 50,s , 4 rebound 50,s , 2 goal assists, 86% disposal efficiency , 83% game time - Ryan may be a cruiser and not a bruiser and he was patchy at times but worked hard to find space , probably BOG yesterday

Anchor :
Minson - The Unit needs to be cleaner with the ball , 59% disposal efficiency for a player we need to dominate the contest and work it to advantage its just not the standard we need

The pressure on Jones - The young bloke is going to burn out if anymore pressure is put on his shoulders , he did have a bad day and made some mistakes but with some structure there to support him and some clean delivery he will improve

I,m no going to bake anyone or anything else we were down across the board


.

[LostDoggy]

Anchor :
Minson - The Unit needs to be cleaner with the ball , 59% disposal efficiency for a player we need to dominate the contest and work it to advantage its just not the standard we need
.

Gesz I thought he was the best big man on the ground. Not sure looking 1 stat sums up his day. Does this 59% include tap to advantage stats?
17 disposals vs 13 Giles
6 tackles vs 5
1 crit error vs 3
30 taps at 30% vs 31 at 19%

[Ghost Dog]

It's really funny how stats can often tell a different tale to what you see at the game. Minson looked good to me.

[bornadog]

Yes I thought he tried as well. However I hate seeing him throw a tanty at others ( Liam Jones ) for what he sees as poor delivery and then miss very very gettable goals from inside 50. He must kick those. The ones he missed were not extreme angles, or beyond his distance. According to the web His kicking is becoming less accurate for goal as time goes on.

The wind was blowing across the face of goal and even in the commentary they mentioned they were difficult shots. He had to start the ball left to get it to swing right.

[Rocco Jones]

It's really funny how stats can often tell a different tale to what you see at the game. Minson looked good to me.

Stats can be very deceptive.

Austin had 92% efficiency but how many were short disposals going either sidewards or backwards to free team mates in our defenisve 50?

I think efficiency can be a particularly misleading stat.

[Ghost Dog]

The wind was blowing across the face of goal and even in the commentary they mentioned they were difficult shots. He had to start the ball left to get it to swing right.

Others were able to score from the same distance out.

[LostDoggy]

It's really funny how stats can often tell a different tale to what you see at the game. Minson looked good to me.

If you just look at 1 stat in isolation it is.
He did have a good game

[bornadog]

Well, that's his trade. It's all he does. If it's not his job to understand the effect of wind on a ball, who's is it?

Ok he missed a couple of shots not the end of the world.

Higgins actually played a very good game yesterday and if he was directing traffic, well he is showing leadership in the forward line and helping the younger guys. Can't see a problem with that.

[LostDoggy]

9 kicks 25 handballs 5 marks 4 tackles. 4 frees for 1 against.
I wish others played as bad as he did.

You have to be joking Chops ................ the time has come where more people are becoming aware that Cross' stats are nowhere near a reflection on the impact he has on a game. I could only listen to the game on radio and I heard the ABC commentary team criticise his poor disposal on several occasions.

One glaring moment occurred in the first half and Mark McClure expressed disappointment that a senior player could turn the ball over so often.

Another time was in the second half when he kicked into our forward 50 straight to a GWS defender.

I am afraid he has a long history of form for getting bucket loads of possession but simply doesn't hurt the opposition with his disposal. I am pleased that the media and many supporters are becoming aware of his inefficiency because it may begin to make the coaching staff realise too.

[hujsh]

You have to be joking Chops ................ the time has come where more people are becoming aware that Cross' stats are nowhere near a reflection on the impact he has on a game. I could only listen to the game on radio and I heard the ABC commentary team criticise his poor disposal on several occasions.

One glaring moment occurred in the first half and Mark McClure expressed disappointment that a senior player could turn the ball over so often.

Another time was in the second half when he kicked into our forward 50 straight to a GWS defender.

I am afraid he has a long history of form for getting bucket loads of possession but simply doesn't hurt the opposition with his disposal. I am pleased that the media and many supporters are becoming aware of his inefficiency because it may begin to make the coaching staff realise too.

That time came years ago on WOOF. In fact Cross has been discussed as possible trade bate numerous times. However in this case Cross had 2 clangers, high disposal efficiency and I didn't think Cross had a bad day.

Sometimes people attack Cross' weaknesses regardless of his performance on the day when assessing Cross and I think this has been the case the last 2 weeks on this forum.

[LostDoggy]

That time came years ago on WOOF. In fact Cross has been discussed as possible trade but numerous times. However in this case Cross had 2 clangers, high disposal efficiency and I didn't think Cross had a bad day.

Sometimes people attack Cross' weaknesses regardless of his performance on the day when assessing Cross and I think this has been the case the last 2 weeks on this forum.

Well said

[Rocco Jones]

The extreme critics of Cross have two issues IMO:
1/ They seem to think they are the only ones that see his defencies
2/ They have a warped view on what the benchmark is to get into our 22

Yes, he is slow. Yes, he can't kick but at the moment we are struggling to get anyone to spread and offer us an option. Cross does that as well as winning his own ball.

Get heaps of it + wasteful > Don't get it

[LostDoggy]

The extreme critics of Cross have two issues IMO:
1/ They seem to think they are the only ones that see his defencies
2/ They have a warped view on what the benchmark is to get into our 22

Yes, he is slow. Yes, he can't kick but at the moment we are struggling to get anyone to spread and offer us an option. Cross does that as well as winning his own ball.

Get heaps of it + wasteful > Don't get it

I rest my case your honour!

[Rocco Jones]

I rest my case your honour!


What would you prefer...

- a player who works hard and has a great tank that allows him to get 30 touches with 60-65% efficiency

- a player who gets 16 touches at 75-80% efficiency.

That's not to mention how Cross can win his own ball.

I find this discussion really odd, seems like his critics thinks the benchmark to get into our 22 is amazing or that the best way to develop kids is to play as many as you can, which I believe is a massive mistake.

[LostDoggy]

I rest my case your honour!

This a game thread who played well and who didn't. Cross may be slow and sometime his kicking lets us down. None of that is new or was evident in this game to warrant criticism. Bring up stuff we didn't know.

[Sockeye Salmon]

What would you prefer...

- a player who works hard and has a great tank that allows him to get 30 touches with 60-65% efficiency

- a player who gets 16 touches at 75-80% efficiency.

That's not to mention how Cross can win his own ball.

I find this discussion really odd, seems like his critics thinks the benchmark to get into our 22 is amazing or that the best way to develop kids is to play as many as you can, which I believe is a massive mistake.

It's clearly better to never get it, then you can never make a mistake.

[always right]

First let me say that people rely too much on stats. I don't care what the stats say in regard to Minson's DE. I know what I see and he clealy had a big influence on the game. Is there a stat for physical presence in a contested situation? I didn't think so.

As for Crossy....I love him. I do concede however that the game becomes very predictable for the opposition when he has the ball in his hands...and that's a problem.

[Eastdog]

First let me say that people rely too much on stats. I don't care what the stats say in regard to Minson's DE. I know what I see and he clealy had a big influence on the game. Is there a stat for physical presence in a contested situation? I didn't think so.

As for Crossy....I love him. I do concede however that the game becomes very predictable for the opposition when he has the ball in his hands...and that's a problem.

Who do you see always right that will in the future take over Crossy position?

[always right]

Who do you see always right that will in the future take over Crossy position?

Depends what we think Cross brings to our side. I see desperation, courage, a fantastic work rate, strong overhead and very good hands.

I don't see anyone bringing all of those things but I guess Smith is the closest in terms of grunt...perhaps Wallis in terms on accumulating possessions. Personally I would rather see us replace Cross with a different type of player. Someone like Tutt would be good to see come through.

[Eastdog]

Depends what we think Cross brings to our side. I see desperation, courage, a fantastic work rate, strong overhead and very good hands.

I don't see anyone bringing all of those things but I guess Smith is the closest in terms of grunt...perhaps Wallis in terms on accumulating possessions. Personally I would rather see us replace Cross with a different type of player. Someone like Tutt would be good to see come through.

Smith in the first game against West Coast was exciting kicking 4 goals of debut. Wallis some poster say that he might not be that good but I say that he is still at the start of his career and you can't say too much on how he will go. Boyd early in his career wasn't that great but then eventually became good also like Dane Swan from the Pies.

[Dazza]

Depends what we think Cross brings to our side. I see desperation, courage, a fantastic work rate, strong overhead and very good hands.

I don't see anyone bringing all of those things but I guess Smith is the closest in terms of grunt...perhaps Wallis in terms on accumulating possessions. Personally I would rather see us replace Cross with a different type of player. Someone like Tutt would be good to see come through.

Tutt would be handy. IMO given how our year is going to go. We need to get games into him as soon as he's ready.

cross is a bit of a blunt axe at the moment.

[1eyedog]

Banker: Cross becasue he worked so hard and led by example. Seriously if the talented players in the team worked as hard as Cross we'd be playing in the Grand Final this year.

Anchor: Higgins, he is a sook and Cross' anti-matter, he has more talent in his little finger than Cross has in his whole body but he refuses to up the ante to 10% of Cross' workrate.

Higgins should be gone before Cross.

[immortalmike]

What would you prefer...

- a player who works hard and has a great tank that allows him to get 30 touches with 60-65% efficiency

- a player who gets 16 touches at 75-80% efficiency.

That's not to mention how Cross can win his own ball.

I find this discussion really odd, seems like his critics thinks the benchmark to get into our 22 is amazing or that the best way to develop kids is to play as many as you can, which I believe is a massive mistake.

How about a player who gets 30 touches at 80% efficiency like Cross has for the last five weeks running. Check his stats he only dipped below 80 % once.

On topic:

Bankers:
Wallis: his hands in congestion are so good I thought I was watching Scottie West.

Coons: Lacks fitness but is all class.

Griff: After quarter time he was the best I've seen him all year.

Anchors:
First quarter: Embarassing and sad.

Vez: Love his skill. But how do you go a whole game without laying one tackle?

Fox Commentary team: Biased as you'll ever hear.

[jeemak]

Banker: Cross becasue he worked so hard and led by example. Seriously if the talented players in the team worked as hard as Cross we'd be playing in the Grand Final this year.

Anchor: Higgins, he is a sook and Cross' anti-matter, he has more talent in his little finger than Cross has in his whole body but he refuses to up the ante to 10% of Cross' workrate.

Higgins should be gone before Cross.

What did you find so offensive about Higgins' game?

It would have been nice if he converted at least one of the two set shots he had, though I thought he was relatively effective and showed a fair level of competitiveness.

He had six tackes (two more tackles than Cross, and the second highest for the team), this might point to his intent on the day.

[comrade]

Why are we bleating about disposal efficiency? It's one of the most overrated stats.

I love Cross and will defend him when he's unfairly maligned, but the way he uses the ball means he should always have high DE%.

Cross at 80% efficiency doesn't mean he's slicing up the opposition and driving us forward time and again, like Griffen is capable of. It means he's playing to his strengths, slowing the play down, kicking within 30m most of the time. He knows his limitations and stays within them - many of his teammates would do well to follow his example.

BUT...you know every opposition coach is pretty happy to have Cross take possession in open play in stead of Griffen or Murphy or Dahl etc.

[Ghost Dog]

What did you find so offensive about Higgins' game?

It would have been nice if he converted at least one of the two set shots he had, though I thought he was relatively effective and showed a fair level of competitiveness.

He had six tackes (two more tackles than Cross, and the second highest for the team), this might point to his intent on the day.

Had two set shots from memory.

[Ghost Dog]

Smith in the first game against West Coast was exciting kicking 4 goals of debut. Wallis some poster say that he might not be that good but I say that he is still at the start of his career and you can't say too much on how he will go. Boyd early in his career wasn't that great but then eventually became good also like Dane Swan from the Pies.

Wally seems to have great vision. I was always thinking he was going to be caught at various moments in the game, but his decision making speed is definitely up to AFL standard. The boy can play.

[bornadog]

Why are we bleating about disposal efficiency? It's one of the most overrated stats.

Better than clangers;)

[Maddog37]

Cross is under fire because he is more prominent in a poor team. When he is the grunt worker with better players around him then he is playing his role and gets much kudos.

When he is one of our main ball winners and the others around him are not firing his outs are more limited.

He is playing the way he always has. Put him in Collingwoods team to replace Ball and he is a superstar. Feeding Thomas, Swan etc he would look a much better player than he does with us at the moment.

[Mofra]

What did you find so offensive about Higgins' game?

It would have been nice if he converted at least one of the two set shots he had, though I thought he was relatively effective and showed a fair level of competitiveness.

He had six tackes (two more tackles than Cross, and the second highest for the team), this might point to his intent on the day.
Higgins is the new Eagleton. He could get 40 touches at 100% DE and lay 20 tackles and there'd still be criticism.

[bornadog]

Higgins is the new Eagleton. He could get 40 touches at 100% DE and lay 20 tackles and there'd still be criticism.

I thought Higgins played well and did his job. Shame he missed those two shots. The Age Football writer gave him votes.:eek:

[Mofra]

I thought Higgins played well and did his job. Shame he missed those two shots. The Age Football writer gave him votes.:eek:
That's because there is no expectation or baggage - impartial observers tend to just base their votes on performance, not what a player should do because of draft number or expectation.

[Mantis]

I thought Higgins played well and did his job. Shame he missed those two shots. The Age Football writer gave him votes.:eek:

I noticed this morning 'the age' also gave votes to Cordy which was even more surprising.

[always right]

Malcolm Conn (who?) in the Herald Sun couldn't even squeeze Big Will into our side's best players.:confused:

[Raw Toast]

Smith in the first game against West Coast was exciting kicking 4 goals of debut. Wallis some poster say that he might not be that good but I say that he is still at the start of his career and you can't say too much on how he will go. Boyd early in his career wasn't that great but then eventually became good also like Dane Swan from the Pies.

Interesting points Eastdog.

Smith's first game reminded me of Scott West's fourth game ever when he kicked six against Essendon (more than he kicked in lots of the great seasons that followed). In other words, I want to see evidence that he is going to continue to be a goal-kicking mid.

It's exciting that Wallis is starting to adapt to the pace of the game and to how he needs to play it. He was a first round pick for a reason, and he's starting to show why.

I'd like Boyd to model his game a bit more on Swan's. Swan has mastered the art of not trying to do too much with the ball, especially by foot, and I think Boyd lets himself down when he tries to do too much with it.

[azabob]

I thought Higgins played well and did his job. Shame he missed those two shots. The Age Football writer gave him votes.:eek:

Before the game gave him best on ground! I did wonder though was it because he was due to do media?