Would we be better or worse off if Eade was still coach?

[angelopetraglia]

Obviously it's still early days and he needs more than a pre-season and six games to put his stamp on the club. However, we now have had some time to see Brendan McCartney's style, approach and game plan.

There are always advantages (e.g. new voice, new style, see things differently, freshen the place up) and disadvantages of changing the coach (e.g. starting over again, instability, learning a new game plan, building relationships).

My question, do you believe we would currently be in a better, worse or no different position if Eade was still coaching the Bulldogs?

[whythelongface]

Think your opening paragraph best sums this question up. Way too early to tell.

However in saying that we were going backwards last year so I am more than happy to give mccartney a couple of years to ply his trade to develop this squad. I like what I saw last night and it will take a fair bit longer to get the team playing this way consistently. No need at this stage to reflect and ask where would we be under eade. Let's move fwd and focus on and enjoy the development of this team under macca.

[always right]

I was a fan of Eade but I don't think that Eade woud have the cattle to play his style.....and I'm not sure he had shown the willingness to change his philosophies. It was the right time to change coaches but still too early to judge whether Macca was the correct choice.

[SonofScray]

Can't see much being different other than we may have recruited and traded differently and had higher hopes or fewer hopes heading into the season depending on where he thought we were at.

Mac is saying the right stuff about mentality and competitiveness and hardness which we've seen glimpses of, it was diminishing rapidly under Eade.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

We had been on a downward spiral for two years under Eade.

He simply had no plan B, and thus, his game plan was outdated after 2009. We didn't have the cattle to play the '09 game plan which had failed on the big stage numerous times, but we continued with it.

If Eade was such a brilliant coach, he would be the senior coach of another club. He isn't. He is a good coach who got stale -- let's leave it at that and stop reverting back to the past.

[chef]

We had been on a downward spiral for two years under Eade.

He simply had no plan B, and thus, his game plan was outdated after 2009. We didn't have the cattle to play the '09 game plan which had failed on the big stage numerous times, but we continued with it.

If Eade was such a brilliant coach, he would be the senior coach of another club. He isn't. He is a good coach who got stale -- let's leave it at that and stop reverting back to the past.

This.

[Remi Moses]

We had been on a downward spiral for two years under Eade.

He simply had no plan B, and thus, his game plan was outdated after 2009. We didn't have the cattle to play the '09 game plan which had failed on the big stage numerous times, but we continued with it.

If Eade was such a brilliant coach, he would be the senior coach of another club. He isn't. He is a good coach who got stale -- let's leave it at that and stop reverting back to the past.

Ditto for me. Like Rocket, but we needed a change

[Greystache]

We had been on a downward spiral for two years under Eade.

He simply had no plan B, and thus, his game plan was outdated after 2009. We didn't have the cattle to play the '09 game plan which had failed on the big stage numerous times, but we continued with it.

If Eade was such a brilliant coach, he would be the senior coach of another club. He isn't. He is a good coach who got stale -- let's leave it at that and stop reverting back to the past.

Pretty much sums it up for me too.

[BulldogBelle]

All coaches have a use-by date and Rockets had come. He was fantastic for the club when he was there, but I remember clearly Dogs vs Swans at Canberra 2011, Rocket giving a spray at qtr time, and the players whom i was so used to looking Rocket in the eye, were looking at the ground. I could imagine them thinking "Here we go again" and praying for qtr time to finish so they could get back to business. Rocket had a style that brought out a teams potential, but would only ever produce one premiership window. Once the window started closing, Rockets style became a burden. All coaches have a particular style and Rockets was suited for a team on the up, not on the down.

[Scraggers]

First off ... 24 people have voted and only a handful of comments ... Why is that ??

I think the OP is correct, it's too early to say ... I voted that there would be no difference ... I think if Rocket had a 90% fit Cooney and Lake (like we do right now) we would have had the same results this season that we have had under McCartney. This year if we were still under Rocket we would have lost to Eagles, Adelaide, St. Kilda, and Collingwood ... We would have won against Melbourne and GWS. Too early to call ...

[boydogs]

Voted Eade, only because I think we would be a step closer to a refresh than a rebuild if he was still around. We're heading in the right direction.

[Eastdog]

I'm also in the camp of its too early to say. We need to give Macca more time as it is only 6 rounds in.

[FrediKanoute]

I don't think it would be any different in terms of results.....maybe we would have beaten one of Adelaide or WCE, but probably not.

I think the big difference though would have been that where a 2-3 start for Macca is seen as a pass in a rebuild phase a 2-3 start for Rocket would have had the butchers sharpening their knives......

[Pedro Sanchez]

There's a definite change in our game style which was evident against the Pies for almost 4 qtrs and has been there in patches in other games.

The trick is to get the group repeating Friday night's performance and playing this hard, lets rip in, contested footy game in game out.

I've got to say I like the new style.

I also liked Eade but his time was up. He's a great taction and an impact coach who was losing his impact.

You can only berate players for so long before they start going numb. The players were shot last year.

B Mac's biggest job is to get the self belief back. From the outside it looked as if Eade's style of giving a spray sucked the fun and life out the players. Given he was there for so long it'll take some time for the guys to heal and re-find there x-factor.

Anyway if we can repeat our effort against the Pies then maybe the healing has well and truly started...

[Bulldog Joe]

It is not a question that can be realistically answered.

.....and the answer is also irrelevant.

The club made a decision. The club needs to do everything to show it was a positive move.

Even if we are really successful, we will not know if we could have been just as successful with Rocket and conversely if it fails we still will not know if the same result would have occurred with Rocket.

The Collingwood game gives me a lot of hope that we can get back to being a top side.

[GVGjr]

I don't believe we would be any better or any worse but while I'm fully behind McCartney it won't be until late into the season where we can really start to ask this question and have some decent facts to debate the topic.

To me, McCartney's first season is all about the progress in the development he can make with the likes of Cordy, Roughead, Jones, Howard, Tutt, Wallis, Liberatore, Tom Hill, Skinner, Dahlhaus and Johannisen. If he can get a good level of improvement in those guys then he is doing a good portion of his job well.

[LostDoggy]

Maybe this question should have waited till round 8 or 10.
Personnally I'm very happy with Macca, I was an Eade fan, but it was time for him to go. One could see that from about round 8 last year.

[LostDoggy]

BTW I voted "Better" with Macca, only from the feedback i get from the team.
They seem to be in a "Better Place" with him than they were with Eade last year

[LostDoggy]

I voted Better with Bmac aswell, Very different approach to coaching then Eade and i think the players would resond better to the way he goes about his Job. Sometimes yelling at players to play better is not the way to go, Bmac seems to be more of calm presence which can help the young players coming through. I think the answer to the question will come next year though.

[Maddog37]

This thread is a bit like asking would I prefer Jen Hawkins or Megan gale. Neither is going to happen so what's the point?

Rocket is gone and he ain't coming back.

[Sedat]

It is not a question that can be realistically answered.

.....and the answer is also irrelevant.
This. It is such a pointless discussion because whoever was appointed to coach us was taking over a team in decline. It's what happens in the next 2-3 seasons that will dictate the McCartney legacy, not a few weeks with a developing team.

Rocket's coaching record for us has been written and is secure. Now it's McCartney's turn to write his own chapter.

[1eyedog]

Define better.

One could only take a philosophical standpoint on arguing between the two. A comparative study between the two may go some way to answering specific questions but without really having any inside knowledge the answer would have to be 42 I'm afraid.

[ReLoad]

It is a flawed poll.

What does "Better off" mean? Won more games this year? better in 5 years from now? Better in 2013?

If rocket was still with us we would have won one more game this year, but would we be a better team in 5 years with him stil on board? nope.

Flawed poll, but the answer is No, no in the long term.

[LostDoggy]

This. It is such a pointless discussion because whoever was appointed to coach us was taking over a team in decline. It's what happens in the next 2-3 seasons that will dictate the McCartney legacy, not a few weeks with a developing team.

Rocket's coaching record for us has been written and is secure. Now it's McCartney's turn to write his own chapter.

Yes but Sedat a team in decline with Rocket at the helm...for some reason that doesn't sound
like the ideal situation to me. He would have his career considerations weighing heavily on his mind.
You either have to back him in and give him a few years of security to go again (so he can
play the kids, experiment, fully rebuild) ... or make the change.

We had to make the change. And Macca has been extremely impressive so far. His faith in players like wood and addison have impressed me. They have this year to prove themselves.
Rocket would be more reactive and we would be seeing more changes from week to week
because he would have his w/l ratio on his mind.

2014 we will be really pushing hard again..the club did the right thing.

[Rocco Jones]

Agree that it is too early. As much as I rated Eade, I thought it was time for a change and nothing so far has changed my mind. I understand the same must be said for those opposing getting rid of Rocket.

Just throwing this out there, I wonder how Lake would be going if Rocket was still around. The word out of the club was that it was a mental rather than physical issue last year. Not too hard to tell Eade and Lake didn't have a great relationship at the end. Brian now seems in a much better head space and getting back to his old self. I know Rocket had great success with Lake for the vast majority of time but getting Lake back on track is surely an early tick for BMac.

[Raw Toast]

Agree that it is too early. As much as I rated Eade, I thought it was time for a change and nothing so far has changed my mind. I understand the same must be said for those opposing getting rid of Rocket.

Just throwing this out there, I wonder how Lake would be going if Rocket was still around. The word out of the club was that it was a mental rather than physical issue last year. Not too hard to tell Eade and Lake didn't have a great relationship at the end. Brian now seems in a much better head space and getting back to his old self. I know Rocket had great success with Lake for the vast majority of time but getting Lake back on track is surely an early tick for BMac.

Agreed. I think we can tick McCartney on Lake, Addison, Wallis, Minson and maybe Wood (that hamstring injury came at such a bad time). But the forward line has been failing so far, and ball movement has been an issue. Maybe Eade have been better at these, maybe not, maybe he would have also got significant improvement out of certain players (he had before).

While it is ridiculously early, at the moment I guess I hope we're better off under BMac, although I was against Eade being (effectively) sacked. Two reasons for me. Firstly, it seems like the players needed a new voice and style. Secondly, I can't think of teams that have won flags recently without a more structured game-plan, and I think BMac is more likely to give us that.

[Ghost Dog]

Agreed. I think we can tick McCartney on Lake, Addison, Wallis, Minson and maybe Wood (that hamstring injury came at such a bad time). But the forward line has been failing so far, and ball movement has been an issue. Maybe Eade have been better at these, maybe not, maybe he would have also got significant improvement out of certain players (he had before).

While it is ridiculously early, at the moment I guess I hope we're better off under BMac, although I was against Eade being (effectively) sacked. Two reasons for me. Firstly, it seems like the players needed a new voice and style. Secondly, I can't think of teams that have won flags recently without a more structured game-plan, and I think BMac is more likely to give us that.

Agreed with above. I'm not sure if Rodney would have had the emotional investment in 2012 that a new coach, given such a special opportunity to coach an AFL side, seems to have. It is hard to say.

[AndrewP6]

Agreed with above. I'm not sure if Rodney would have had the emotional investment in 2012 that a new coach, given such a special opportunity to coach an AFL side, seems to have. It is hard to say.

Watching the press conference where they announced his departure, I'd say he most certainly had the emotional investment.

[Raw Toast]

Agreed with above. I'm not sure if Rodney would have had the emotional investment in 2012 that a new coach, given such a special opportunity to coach an AFL side, seems to have. It is hard to say.

It is hard to say. Lots of coaches have reinvented themselves, and Eade had shown the ability to do that between different clubs. And he gave all of himself to the Dogs during his time with us.

[LostDoggy]

If Rocket was still at the helm I don,t believe our draft picks and rookies would have been the same

Addison would probably not be a rock in defense , Dahlhaus probably would not be in the midfield , Lake would still be stressed about his recovery and Jones would be a frustrated HF at Williamstown

And I don,t believe that the Club would be feeling as positive after 5 rounds

.

[Ghost Dog]

Watching the press conference where they announced his departure, I'd say he most certainly had the emotional investment.

Mine certainly wasn't a pot at Rodney. Like all roles, being fresh can be an advantage. It is very hard to say however. I was gutted when he left the club and it is still hard to see him in black and white.

[AndrewP6]

Mine certainly wasn't a pot at Rodney. Like all roles, being fresh can be an advantage. It is very hard to say however. I was gutted when he left the club and it is still hard to see him in black and white.

Fair enough. Me too.

[Sedat]

Yes but Sedat a team in decline with Rocket at the helm...for some reason that doesn't sound
like the ideal situation to me. He would have his career considerations weighing heavily on his mind.
You either have to back him in and give him a few years of security to go again (so he can
play the kids, experiment, fully rebuild) ... or make the change.

We had to make the change. And Macca has been extremely impressive so far. His faith in players like wood and addison have impressed me. They have this year to prove themselves.
Rocket would be more reactive and we would be seeing more changes from week to week
because he would have his w/l ratio on his mind.

2014 we will be really pushing hard again..the club did the right thing.
Rocket had already started the rebuild in full swing last year, which is a credit to the integrity of the man, as he implemented a policy in the last year of his contract that was going to have long-term benefits to the Bulldogs even though it might have the potential to curtail his future as coach (which is exactly what transpired). The big knock on Rocket has been his inability to adapt to the press game plans of Hawthorn/St Kilda/Collingwood and to develop something similar with the Bulldogs, but I haven't yet seen much evidence of the 2012 Bulldogs being able to lock the ball into our forward 50 for minutes on end either - that says to me that our issues are personnel based and not coaching/game plan based. Rocket and McCartney are both clearly astute thinkers and excellent teachers, but they can't make slow players quick, or unskilled players skilful, or turn dumb players into smart decision-makers.

McCartney has implemented some positive initiatives to the game plan but there are still so many list/personnel holes that are simply impossible to fill in the short term and that will not do justice to any game plan that we implement in the short term. Rocket suffered from two things IMO - placing too much faith in personnel that delivered for him in 2008-9 and trying to wring out another year of contention in 2010 (understandable in hindsight but ultimately flawed logic to rely on senior players past their best and reduced in athletic capacity), and he also suffered from having a list that was unsuited to the changing tactical landscape of the game (previous people in charge of list management are almost fully culpable here, yet strangely are still employed at the club). I've liked McCartney's measured, methodical approach to the rebuild, and I've been very impressed with his ability to handle media and press conferences with a steady hand and always an eye to education and emphasising the issue that all the players are learning from every experience, but arguably he will live and die by whatever Simon Dalrymple can deliver for him in the next couple of drafts to fill the numerous holes on our list, and by the list management decisions of Jason McCartney to weeding out personnel that won't contribute to future success and righting the numerous wrongs of the past list management disasters. He has got a massive job on his hands but he is as well equipped and experienced as anybody to be able to make a positive contribution to our club.

[boydogs]

The word out of the club was that it was a mental rather than physical issue last year.

What? I thought he was in so much pain he was shoving painkillers up his arse to train?

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Rocket had already started the rebuild in full swing last year, which is a credit to the integrity of the man, as he implemented a policy in the last year of his contract that was going to have long-term benefits to the Bulldogs even though it might have the potential to curtail his future as coach (which is exactly what transpired). The big knock on Rocket has been his inability to adapt to the press game plans of Hawthorn/St Kilda/Collingwood and to develop something similar with the Bulldogs, but I haven't yet seen much evidence of the 2012 Bulldogs being able to lock the ball into our forward 50 for minutes on end either - that says to me that our issues are personnel based and not coaching/game plan based. Rocket and McCartney are both clearly astute thinkers and excellent teachers, but they can't make slow players quick, or unskilled players skilful, or turn dumb players into smart decision-makers.

McCartney has implemented some positive initiatives to the game plan but there are still so many list/personnel holes that are simply impossible to fill in the short term and that will not do justice to any game plan that we implement in the short term. Rocket suffered from two things IMO - placing too much faith in personnel that delivered for him in 2008-9 and trying to wring out another year of contention in 2010 (understandable in hindsight but ultimately
flawed logic to rely on senior players past their best and reduced in athletic capacity), and he also suffered from having a list that was unsuited to the changing tactical landscape of the game (previous people in charge of list management are almost fully culpable here, yet strangely are still employed at the club). I've liked McCartney's measured, methodical
approach to the rebuild, and I've been very impressed with his ability to handle media and press conferences with a steady hand and always an eye to education and emphasising the
issue that all the players are learning from every experience, but arguably he will live and die
by whatever Simon Dalrymple can deliver for him in the next couple of drafts to fill the
numerous holes on our list, and by the list management decisions of Jason McCartney to
weeding out personnel that won't contribute to future success and righting the numerous
wrongs of the past list management disasters. He has got a massive job on his hands but he
is as well equipped and experienced as anybody to be able to make a positive contribution to
our club.
This is a good summation Sedat. We shouldn't lose sight of the talent that we had under Rocket when we were playing in pre- lim finals. A defence for example that boasted Harbrow, Lake, Gilbee, Hargrave and Morris all at their top. I believe the appointment of BMcC was the right choice for times such as these. Given the talent at his disposable the effort against Collingwood was most commendable save for three costly turnovers in the final term, with the first of these coming from Murphy one of our better performers.Our biggest challenge is without question in recruitment as you rightly identified, starting with the need to find a couple of key forwards, which we have sadly lacked for a long time and a significant factor in our inability to go all the way.

[bornadog]

If Rocket was still at the helm I don,t believe our draft picks and rookies would have been the same

Addison would probably not be a rock in defense , Dahlhaus probably would not be in the midfield , Lake would still be stressed about his recovery and Jones would be a frustrated HF at Williamstown

And I don,t believe that the Club would be feeling as positive after 5 rounds

.

Sorry but I think this is an uninformed post.

* Addison - Rocket loved his hardness but knew his limitations. Last year Addison didn't hit form at all.

* Dahl - don't agree, he is destined to be tried in the midfield.

* Lake - that is just speculation from what you have read in the Herald Sun.

* Jones - Never dropped him once last year even though some games he barely touched the ball.


For what its worth, I think the club wanted a change and Macca has brought that refreshing change and the club will be better for it. I loved Rocket at the club during his time, but it was time to move on.

[hujsh]

If Rocket was still at the helm I don,t believe our draft picks and rookies would have been the same

Addison would probably not be a rock in defense , Dahlhaus probably would not be in the midfield , Lake would still be stressed about his recovery and Jones would be a frustrated HF at Williamstown

And I don,t believe that the Club would be feeling as positive after 5 rounds

.

There is some positivity at this exact point, but look back 3 weeks ago against the Saints and it definitely wasn't there. Another game like that and the 'positivity' will again descend into 'negativity' until we show our next good effort performance. To me this perception is just that, perception, and it is almost entirely decided on a week to week basis as it was with Eade.

Maybe it was time for a change but as for if we're better off I have no idea, there's too many variables and assumptions for it to be anything but a pure guess.

[LostDoggy]

There is some positivity at this exact point, but look back 3 weeks ago against the Saints and it definitely wasn't there. Another game like that and the 'positivity' will again descend into 'negativity' until we show our next good effort performance. To me this perception is just that, perception, and it is almost entirely decided on a week to week basis as it was with Eade.

Maybe it was time for a change but as for if we're better off I have no idea, there's too many variables and assumptions for it to be anything but a pure guess.

Sorry but i have to disagree. If we have 2 or 3 honest , intense performances followed
by the odd down week i don't believe the positivity will turn into negativity. Most dogs fans
imo have a fairly good grip on where we are at. What will make a difference is our run home.
Its unfortunate but just human nature...if we come home with a head full of steam this
year over the last 4 - 6 rounds our membership numbers will be fine next year....and hopefully it's onwards and upwards from there.

I loved Rocket and didn't want him to go but i firmly believe we have done the right thing.

in reply to a couple of other posters - bornadog - re:addison -i remember rocket being roundly criticised around here for failing to give players more than one or two weeks then dropping them. towards the end he did become reactive in his selections. why did ves barely get a sniff last year? he should have played a bunch of games.

raw toast - how much time were we supposed to give rocket to reinvent himself again?
to this day he still doesn't get the credit he deserves for the play on at all costs game style
that geelong adapted and ultimately took them to a flag. but people here were screaming out
for years about his lack of answers to the zone / forward press. going into 2009 i remember saying nothing else matters if we don't come up with a strategic answer to this problem, we can kiss our year goodbye.

sedat - we are looking pretty good with our inside 50's so maybe it is a personnel issue..
ie: if we are not taking marks inside the fwd 50 the ball will come strait out again.
but overall we have structure...when the opposition kick the ball in from a point
WE CAN LOCK THE BALL IN! WOO! mate this simply wasn't happening last year ..everyone
has a use by date and Rocket had no answers to a lot of these problems.

[Ghost Dog]

but overall we have structure...when the opposition kick the ball in from a point
WE CAN LOCK THE BALL IN! WOO! mate this simply wasn't happening last year ..everyone
has a use by date and Rocket had no answers to a lot of these problems.

Eade was kind of stuck in a hard situation and was stuck between trying to keep his job and rebuild.
Feeling the need to give older players long lines of credit. Topping up the team with short term prospects to keep us afloat.
Living with the unrealized expectations of 2009, 2010 and trying to build on top of something that was past its used by date anyway.

[LostDoggy]

We had been on a downward spiral for two years under Eade.

He simply had no plan B, and thus, his game plan was outdated after 2009. We didn't have the cattle to play the '09 game plan which had failed on the big stage numerous times, but we continued with it.

If Eade was such a brilliant coach, he would be the senior coach of another club. He isn't. He is a good coach who got stale -- let's leave it at that and stop reverting back to the past.

Worse off. Our win/loss would probably be the same at this stage, but the future would be bleak. There is a lot of talk about 'game plan'. What was Eade's game plan apart from motivating good players to play well? To win flags you need cattle, and Eade had a fine herd for a few seasons there. What he didn't have was a game plan ... yelling at players during breaks isn't a plan. Bmac seems to have an actual plan that is built around the way he wants the boys to play, and we've seen glimpses of it already; the first edition seems to be about being hard at the contest, lots of doggies around the ball and a heavy emphasis on defence. When he speaks in the media he talks a lot about teaching the boys what he wants them to do, and when thing go wrong he speaks about what the coaching staff have to address with the group to fix the problem. He speaks in glowing terms about the willingness of the established group to take on his changes and the exciting potential he sees in the younger players coming through. I'm looking forward to the next instalment of the plan being rolled out when the boys are ready to execute it. Dalrymple and co have already provided some cattle and there are, hopefully, more on the way. I'm excited about the prospect of us having a coach who can motivate, instead of a motivator who coached. Harsh on Rocket, but realistic. Debate me if you like, but start with Rocket's game plan, what was it?

[bornadog]

What was Eade's game plan apart from motivating good players to play well?

Debate me if you like, but start with Rocket's game plan, what was it?

Is this a joke? Do you think coaches go into a game without a plan? :confused::confused:

Rocket changed the way football is played. With the Swans he was responsible for the super flood. With us he developed the running game and moving the ball at all costs. Geelong took it to another level. Eventually football changed again, teams had to counter the play on at all costs by applying pressure on the ball carriers and Malthouse took it to another level with forward pressure.

Rocket is now a game Strategist at Collingwood, so I think he knows a bit about game plans and football.

I can accept it if you said it was time for a change, a new voice, blah blah, but " no game plan" ...please.

[LostDoggy]

Is this a joke? Do you think coaches go into a game without a plan? :confused::confused:

Rocket changed the way football is played. With the Swans he was responsible for the super flood. With us he developed the running game and moving the ball at all costs. Geelong took it to another level. Eventually football changed again, teams had to counter the play on at all costs by applying pressure on the ball carriers and Malthouse took it to another level with forward pressure.

Rocket is now a game Strategist at Collingwood, so I think he knows a bit about game plans and football.

I can accept it if you said it was time for a change, a new voice, blah blah, but " no game plan" ...please.

When Barassi famously said, "Handball at all costs", was that a game plan? No, it was a tactic. Flooding is not a game plan, it is a tactic. Getting your good players to take the game on is not a game plan, it is a tactic. Screaming at your players to play better is not a strategy, it is a tactic. Rocket might be a tactician at Collingwood, but he is not is not a strategist, never has been, anywhere. Today, to make it as a coach, you have to be able to develop a game plan and teach it your players so that they can execute it. From what i have seen so far, I believe Bmac is capable of doing it. The fact that Rocket has a seat in the second row at Collingwood these days says that they (the Magpies) and the Bulldogs agree with me that he isn't. No joke.

[bornadog]

When Barassi famously said, "Handball at all costs", was that a game plan? No, it was a tactic. Flooding is not a game plan, it is a tactic. Getting your good players to take the game on is not a game plan, it is a tactic. Screaming at your players to play better is not a strategy, it is a tactic. Rocket might be a tactician at Collingwood, but he is not is not a strategist, never has been, anywhere. Today, to make it as a coach, you have to be able to develop a game plan and teach it your players so that they can execute it. From what i have seen so far, I believe Bmac is capable of doing it. The fact that Rocket has a seat in the second row at Collingwood these days says that they (the Magpies) and the Bulldogs agree with me that he isn't. No joke.

Believe what you will.

[comrade]

When Barassi famously said, "Handball at all costs", was that a game plan? No, it was a tactic. Flooding is not a game plan, it is a tactic. Getting your good players to take the game on is not a game plan, it is a tactic. Screaming at your players to play better is not a strategy, it is a tactic. Rocket might be a tactician at Collingwood, but he is not is not a strategist, never has been, anywhere. Today, to make it as a coach, you have to be able to develop a game plan and teach it your players so that they can execute it. From what i have seen so far, I believe Bmac is capable of doing it. The fact that Rocket has a seat in the second row at Collingwood these days says that they (the Magpies) and the Bulldogs agree with me that he isn't. No joke.

What is B-Mac's game plan?

[AndrewP6]

Worse off. Our win/loss would probably be the same at this stage, but the future would be bleak. There is a lot of talk about 'game plan'. What was Eade's game plan apart from motivating good players to play well? To win flags you need cattle, and Eade had a fine herd for a few seasons there. What he didn't have was a game plan ... yelling at players during breaks isn't a plan. Bmac seems to have an actual plan that is built around the way he wants the boys to play, and we've seen glimpses of it already; the first edition seems to be about being hard at the contest, lots of doggies around the ball and a heavy emphasis on defence. When he speaks in the media he talks a lot about teaching the boys what he wants them to do, and when thing go wrong he speaks about what the coaching staff have to address with the group to fix the problem. He speaks in glowing terms about the willingness of the established group to take on his changes and the exciting potential he sees in the younger players coming through. I'm looking forward to the next instalment of the plan being rolled out when the boys are ready to execute it. Dalrymple and co have already provided some cattle and there are, hopefully, more on the way. I'm excited about the prospect of us having a coach who can motivate, instead of a motivator who coached. Harsh on Rocket, but realistic. Debate me if you like, but start with Rocket's game plan, what was it?


I struggled to get through the rest of the post after reading this. I like absurdist humour, but this is taking it to the extreme.

[LostDoggy]

What is B-Mac's game plan?

Good question. From what I've seen so far, I'd say it owes a lot to the Geelong style of play (surprise, surprise!) You could also watch Essendon now and see elements of it in their approach (again, not a big surprise). 'Bomber' is now a Bomber again and he and Bmac were there together after building the Cats up from nothing. Yes, Bmac was at Geelong from the start of the dynasty and was part of the development of their game plan. It wasn't based on free-running attacking football, not at the start anyway, but on a hard-nosed defensive effort all over the ground, forward as well as back. When everyone is a defender, it's easier for everyone to also be an attacker - Matthew Scarlett is the perfect example. I think you will find that Bmac's game plan will take shape in much the same way as Geelong's did - from a defensive mindset. He will demand that players go and get their own ball, or burrow in and help while their team mates get it. There will be plenty of red, white and blue around the contest. From there, you will see the focus move to delivery, but you have to get it before you can deliver it. Ask the Willi Watchers about the VFL side. They had 8 18 year olds up against Port on Saturday, and those kids had a real crack - didn't disgrace themselves at all. They are a bunch of hard nuts and the future of our club - playing footy McCartney-style and not taking any backward steps. The skills and outside pay will come. I believe the new game plan is just that, a plan, and it is being built from the inside out and from the back to the front. It will take a while, but if it's done properly, and the early signs are good, then it will be worth the short term pain. We're not playing finals this year, but we will be blooding some hard-arsed youngsters and laying the foundation for a dynasty. It's exciting. Looking back, misty-eyed, at the golden years of preliminary final glory is plain stupid. Let's consign the Rocket years to history where they belong and look forward to future flags instead.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

What is B-Mac's game plan?

I think you will find Macca's game plan will evolve over time. There is little doubt that he is endeavoring to adopt a far more team orientated approach to our game and to make each player more competitive in man on man tussles. There is also a greater emphasis on defence. The performance against Collingwood in spite of the defeat was our best for the year with the pressure applied by the Bulldogs a feature.I sense that veterans like Lake, Murphy, Cross , Boyd, Cooney and Griffen are responding in a positive frame of mind and that early improvement from youngsters in Liberatore, Wallis, Roughead and Cordy is obvious. Wins may not come as frequent as we would like in the short term but could I suggest that by the end of the year we will witness the fruits of the coach's labour in a positive way.

[Ghost Dog]

I think you will find Macca's game plan will evolve over time. There is little doubt that he is endeavoring to adopt a far more team orientated approach to our game and to make each player more competitive in man on man tussles. There is also a greater emphasis on defence. The performance against Collingwood in spite of the defeat was our best for the year with the pressure applied by the Bulldogs a feature.I sense that veterans like Lake, Murphy, Cross , Boyd, Cooney and Griffen are responding in a positive frame of mind and that early improvement from youngsters in Liberatore, Wallis, Roughead and Cordy is obvious. Wins may not come as frequent as we would like in the short term but could I suggest that by the end of the year we will witness the fruits of the coach's labour in a positive way.


One of the most obvious things I've noticed is our blokes don't seem afraid to step up and go the wrestle. Vezpa, Brian, Addison, Jones and others have all had a bit of a dance on the field with an opponent of annoying disposition. More so than last season I reckon. Take it as a healthy sign of a competitive nature.

[Sedat]

There is little doubt that he is endeavoring to adopt a far more team orientated approach to our game and to make each player more competitive in man on man tussles. There is also a greater emphasis on defence.
One of Rocket's greatest legacies was to teach our defenders to defend one-on-one. Everybody thought that he would adopt a flood game plan to protect the defenders but he did the opposite - it cost us some blowouts in 2005 but it meant we had a terrific back 6 who all improved significantly as actual defenders under Rocket's watch. Our recruiting from 2000-2002 was arguably the single biggest determinant in preventing us from winning a flag in 2008-2010. While Geelong and Hawthorn were loading up on serious quality during this period that ultimately formed the backbone of their premiership teams, we recruited bust after bust.

I'm all for giving McCartney credit for putting together a game plan that will (hopefully) bear fruit over time, but I'm annoyed by the re-writing of history when it comes to Rocket's coaching tenure at the kennel. He was a great teacher (witness how many of our list improved significantly the moment he came to the club), he was an astute tactician and he did radically overhaul our game plan from the wreckage of 2001-2004, where we really didn't have any discernible game plan or methodology. Fast ball movement through the corridor was introduced by Rocket and then improved upon by Geelong.

I said it before and I'll say it again....the overall quality of our playing personnel will ultimately determine the success of Macca's game plan, just as it ultimately did Rocket's. If Dalrymple drafts some duds in the next 2 years, Macca simply won't have the tools to bring his vision to life. It can't be emphasised enough how critical it is to nail the next 2 drafts - if we do, we are every chance to seriously contend again in 3 year's time.

[LostDoggy]

One of the most obvious things I've noticed is our blokes don't seem afraid to step up and go the wrestle. Vezpa, Brian, Addison, Jones and others have all had a bit of a dance on the field with an opponent of annoying disposition. More so than last season I reckon. Take it as a healthy sign of a competitive nature.

Funny you should mention this. Cooney has been much more assertive this year also.
And his upper body is BIG. I think B Mac has been excellent in helping him find new ways
to be effective despite his knee. He still can win a hard ball and has great hands / vision in traffic....He has got into a wrestle nearly every week so far sticking up for, or making room
for one of our youngsters. Great stuff. Good coaching.

[KT31]

Funny you should mention this. Cooney has been much more assertive this year also.
And his upper body is BIG. I think B Mac has been excellent in helping him find new ways
to be effective despite his knee. He still can win a hard ball and has great hands / vision in traffic....He has got into a wrestle nearly every week so far sticking up for, or making room
for one of our youngsters. Great stuff. Good coaching.

B Mac definitly has made us more agressive and accountable but not sure if this part has been instigated by the coach or by the senior players realising our side comprises of a lot of younger players that need a bit of protection and looking out for ?

[Maddog37]

They have done plenty of wrestling at training so it is probably second nature for them.