Our list changes for 2013

[bornadog]

Confirmed Outs:

Tom Hill (delisted)
Brodie Moles (delisted)
Matt Panos (delisted)
Andrew Hooper (delisted)
James Mulligan (delisted)
Justin Sherman (pre-season draft)
Lindsay Gilbee (retired)
Ryan Hargrave (retired)
Nathan Djerrkura (retired)
Brian Lake (traded)

Confirmed Ins:

Campbell
Hunter
Johannisen
Stevens
Young

Draft Picks:

Need five players

5, 6, 22, 50(Hunter), 51, 89, 107 and 125 - Presuming last two will be for the rookie upgrades.

Rookie List:
Reduced to four this year, so final list is:

Austin
Greenwood
Jong
Redpath

[chef]

Don't expect us to use pick 89, we will sign a FA over the next 2 weeks.

[Maddog37]

Don't expect us to use pick 89, we will sign a FA over the next 2 weeks.

Any mail Chef?

[SlimPickens]

Happy with those upgrades and equally happy to maintain Jong, Austin and Greenwood. Don't see what Redpath can offer but coaches obviously see something I don't.

[chef]

Any mail Chef?

No, just a hunch.

[Bulldog Revolution]

I think we've pretty much nailed our changes this year,

I've got to say I'm impressed with how decisive the McCartneys have been cutting dead wood and - ruling a line through those that could have been persisted with.

We give Skinner and Vez another year to show they are part of the future plans

Upgraded two rookies who deserved it (JJ and Campbell), and given another couple (Austin and Jong) another year to develop

I think we've cut as deep as we would want to in one year, and feel confident that in another year or two our list will be looking a lot better

[Cyberdoggie]

Don't expect us to use pick 89, we will sign a FA over the next 2 weeks.

Wouldn't it then be pick 125 we don't use?

Correct me if i'm wrong but i thought as soon as you pass that's it.
So if we don't use a pick for a FA, then the two rookie upgrades would be pushed up the draft order. :confused:


It wouldnt' surprise for us to pick up a FA or use pick 89 for a recycled or mid aged player.

We will probably stick to 4 kids plus hunter maximum.

[BulldogBelle]

I think we've pretty much nailed our changes this year,

I've got to say I'm impressed with how decisive the McCartneys have been cutting dead wood and - ruling a line through those that could have been persisted with.

We give Skinner and Vez another year to show they are part of the future plans

Upgraded two rookies who deserved it (JJ and Campbell), and given another couple (Austin and Jong) another year to develop

I think we've cut as deep as we would want to in one year, and feel confident that in another year or two our list will be looking a lot better

I agree with this. Shouldn't cut any more this year.

I think Vez, Addison and Cross should have been gone, lucky survivors because of The Eade administration's poor list management over the last several years.

[whythelongface]

I agree with this. Shouldn't cut any more this year.

I think Vez, Addison and Cross should have been gone, lucky survivors because of The Eade administration's poor list management over the last several years.

Why would think that Cross is lucky to be still on the list? Whilst he is not as prolific as he once was he still has an important role to play within the team, particularly in the development of the younger guys in the midfield. From all reports he is one of the hardest trainers at the club and sets a glowing example for the younger guys to follow.

[chef]

Wouldn't it then be pick 125 we don't use?

Correct me if i'm wrong but i thought as soon as you pass that's it.
So if we don't use a pick for a FA, then the two rookie upgrades would be pushed up the draft order. :confused:


It wouldnt' surprise for us to pick up a FA or use pick 89 for a recycled or mid aged player.

We will probably stick to 4 kids plus hunter maximum.

Picks 107 and 125 have been used on JJ and Campbell.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

I agree with this. Shouldn't cut any more this year.

I think Vez, Addison and Cross should have been gone, lucky survivors because of The Eade administration's poor list management over the last several years.

Addison and Cross? Wow i would have thought Crossy still has plenty to offer in terms of leadership and setting an example. Agree that our reliance on him will be reduced with the likes of Smith and Stevens but i believe he is still vital to show these young kids the way.

Addison had arguably his best season providing some spark up forward.

Who will be on thier 'last chance' next season other than Vez and Skinner? Is it Grant's last opportunity to show improvement? Other than that i think only Howard needs to step it up a gear. He has been in the system a while now and needs to show something

[LostDoggy]

I would think that Skinner, Howard, Vez and Grant are the players under the pump this year.

[Eastdog]

I would think that Skinner, Howard, Vez and Grant are the players under the pump this year.

For sure. If there is not much improvement then there spots on the list are in trouble. We have cut quite a few from the list and next year I'd expect a bit more if certain players don't step up.

[Maddog37]

I would not lump Howard in with Vez and Grant personally.

[LostDoggy]

I would not lump Howard in with Vez and Grant personally.

You think he deserves more time?

[Maddog37]

Yes I do. Came from a little way back and has had hip troubles along the way. He has had some quite bad games but has showed plenty in others which is a trait of youth.

[chef]

You think he deserves more time?

I think he would be under the same pressure, same with Tutt and Jones too.

[westdog54]

I agree with this. Shouldn't cut any more this year.

I think Vez, Addison and Cross should have been gone, lucky survivors because of The Eade administration's poor list management over the last several years.

Did you watch any football this year?

Cross was our most consistent midfielder all year up until his injury and made a positive contribution throughout the season.

Plus he's the most professional footballer at the club and is an ideal role model to our inexperienced list.

You're impossible to please.

[Eastdog]

Cross is a workhorse in the midfield like Boyd and puts all his effort in. Cross get a lot of the ball but the one criticism of Cross is that he handballs it a lot rather than kick it. Otherwise his important as westdog54 says for experience for the young players coming through in the midfield.

[always right]

Cross is a workhorse in the midfield like Boyd and puts all his effort in. Cross get a lot of the ball but the one criticism of Cross is that he handballs it a lot rather than kick it. Otherwise his important as westdog54 says for experience for the young players coming through in the midfield.

Cross is someone who continues to work on his weaknesses. I would like to see his stats for the last couple of years. I think you'll find he kicks the ball far more than he did previously. He has improved markedly in that he hits targets the majority of the time....he just has to play within his limitations and hit blokes 35 metres away rather than going for distance. As someone who declared very early in the piece that he would not make it, he has turned out to be one of my very favourite players.

[1eyedog]

I would think that Skinner, Howard, Vez and Grant are the players under the pump this year.

Yep that's obvious enough.


I would not lump Howard in with Vez and Grant personally.

I would not lump Grant in with the other two personally. I'm yet to see Howard break away from backs and bend goals from the boundary.


I think he would be under the same pressure, same with Tutt and Jones too.

Jones isn't under pressure next year, maybe the year after. Anyone who takes a grab like that is worth persisting with.

[westdog54]

Cross is someone who continues to work on his weaknesses. I would like to see his stats for the last couple of years. I think you'll find he kicks the ball far more than he did previously. He has improved markedly in that he hits targets the majority of the time....he just has to play within his limitations and hit blokes 35 metres away rather than going for distance. As someone who declared very early in the piece that he would not make it, he has turned out to be one of my very favourite players.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/pc-western-bulldogs--daniel-cross

His kicks per game average is reasonably steady but his handball average has dropped off, so his kick to handball ratio has improved slightly.

[jeemak]

I'm pretty happy with how the list changes are looking right now.

Howard as MD has said started from a long way back. He played some excellent football this year, among patches of really poor football. He needs to narrow the gap between the two to find consistency.

Grant is probably the best forward talent we have. He was always going to need time, and he will improve as the support around him improves. By support, I mean a backline and midfield that can move the ball quickly and effectively and some other forwards to share the load evenly. When he had such support he played very well. He's capable, though his attitude needs to support the faith paid in him.

Cross was very much maligned by me early in the season, and I'm really happy to say he made me eat roast words Sunday evening on more than one occasion. He had a very consistent year, and once again demonstrated how a player should follow instructions and work within their talent parameters. He's not got long to make an impact on our club, as the game will pass him by this year, but it's good to have him around to set an example.

Tutt is the player I want to see ensure he puts a solid preseason together and get as fit and strong as he possibly can be. We talk about drafting good outside runners and kickers of the football, and in glimpses Tutt has shown he can provide these qualities. From his first game there was one kick that stuck in my mind. Going to the right of screen against Port he was on the near side wing running towards the same flank. At the last second he modified his kick to hit someone at CHF with precision and fooled everyone in the process. We don't have many players that can do that.

[Dry Rot]

My take on the changes is that after a season, Macca has first made a stand on complete duds (no brainer) eg Moles and DJ and then made on a stand on players that appear to not buy in to his story eg Sherman. Good.

We didn't do any silly trades. Good.

He appears to be giving some players, that many of us here would delist, a chance to buy in and improve themselves eg Vez and Skinner. Ditto he is showing faith in our current rookies.

I think all of the above is pretty good. His next big test is whether he influences who we chose for our first 3 draft picks, and if so, who we chose.

[chef]

Jones isn't under pressure next year, maybe the year after. Anyone who takes a grab like that is worth persisting with.

Another year like he just had he would be under a bit of pressure IMO. He needs more tricks than just taking the occasional grab.

[Bulldog Revolution]

My take on the changes is that after a season, Macca has first made a stand on complete duds (no brainer) eg Moles and DJ and then made on a stand on players that appear to not buy in to his story eg Sherman. Good.

We didn't do any silly trades. Good.

He appears to be giving some players, that many of us here would delist, a chance to buy in and improve themselves eg Vez and Skinner. Ditto he is showing faith in our current rookies.

I think all of the above is pretty good. His next big test is whether he influences who we chose for our first 3 draft picks, and if so, who we chose.

Thats pretty similar to my take DR, but I think it was particularly impressive he was so decisive on DJ who is seemingly a very impressive person, and probably everything that Macca appreciates as a teammate/clubman etc.

With Vez and Skinner and others, it may be a case of what they do behind the scenes, and wanting to manage when players come out of contract.

My understanding was that National Draft picks had to receive 2 year deals - I wonder if that is still the case?

[Mantis]

My take on the changes is that after a season, Macca has first made a stand on complete duds (no brainer) eg Moles and DJ and then made on a stand on players that appear to not buy in to his story eg Sherman. Good.



Didn't DJ retire?

Moles wasn't even given a game last year so how can the coach make this call?

[LongWait]

Didn't DJ retire?

Moles wasn't even given a game last year so how can the coach make this call?

Would you have kept DJ and Moles on our list?

[Mantis]

Would you have kept DJ and Moles on our list?

If DJ wanted to stay on I would have been happy for him to continue for one more year.

I would have liked Moles to be given a few games during 2012 to see how he performed under B-Mac's game plan, but seeing as though he didn't it was pretty clear that he was a goner.... I thought he showed signs in the past that he was capable of playing at AFL level, obviously B-Mac didn't.

[Hotdog60]

Moles most likely thought his card was marked the day we got Macca.

[bornadog]

Moles most likely thought his card was marked the day we got Macca.

Doesn't crack in:D

[w3design]

Maybe there is some bad blood between B-Mac and Moles from their time at Geelong...

[bornadog]

Maybe there is some bad blood between B-Mac and Moles from their time at Geelong...

I don't know about that, but Moles didn't even play a game last year and his form in the VFL this year was ordinary.

[Ghost Dog]

Sorry, but I would have Moles over Vezpremi any day of the 365 in the year. Including leap years.
The only interesting thing I have seen about Patrick's sporting abilitiy is his fly fishing trophy collection in his garage.
DJ wanted to go home. He's probably kicking a footy barefoot with some future stars right now on some island.

[Hotdog60]

I don't know about that, but Moles didn't even play a game last year and his form in the VFL this year was ordinary.

He was good in patches and this is probably what is most annoying, he can show some potential but can't deliver it on a consistent basis. I liked Moles and we could have used him if he could have played well for more than a quarter and a half and for more than one game in four.

[LostDoggy]

I don't know about that, but Moles didn't even play a game last year and his form in the VFL this year was ordinary.

There's a coouple of fair reasons to dump him, I would have thought. Anybody who didn't get a game in last season's free-for-all was obviously shot.

[Happy Days]

I don't know about that, but Moles didn't even play a game last year and his form in the VFL this year was ordinary.

From what I've read on here and heard McCartney seems to be highly judgmental; not playing Moles due to past perceptions wouldn't be a surprise.

[LongWait]

From what I've read on here and heard McCartney seems to be highly judgmental; not playing Moles due to past perceptions wouldn't be a surprise.

Well McCartney would be very much at home on here wouldn't he!

[Eastdog]

Why hasn't Moles been playing more often in the seniors. Is he just not good enough or is he more of a VFL type player.

[AndrewP6]

Why hasn't Moles been playing more often in the seniors. Is he just not good enough or is he more of a VFL type player.

That's the same thing. Not good enough for AFL= VFL type player.

[mighty_west]

Why hasn't Moles been playing more often in the seniors. Is he just not good enough or is he more of a VFL type player.

Both in my opinion, has the tools to be a decent enough player but just nowhere near consistent enough, Cam Faulkner, Brennan Stack etc etc.

[Eastdog]

Both in my opinion, has the tools to be a decent enough player but just nowhere near consistent enough, Cam Faulkner, Brennan Stack etc etc.

Consistency is so important. Justin Sherman is a player that had potential but just was not consistent enough. Brennan was another player who had potential but just didn't show enough of it.

[jeemak]

Sorry, but I would have Moles over Vezpremi any day of the 365 in the year. Including leap years.
The only interesting thing I have seen about Patrick's sporting abilitiy is his fly fishing trophy collection in his garage.
DJ wanted to go home. He's probably kicking a footy barefoot with some future stars right now on some island.


There's a few years differnce between the two. Pat has had his chances at two clubs, and is probably lucky to be retained, though you'd think with that being the case the coaching staff see potential in him. He can kick the ball, and he can put himself in good positions to get it. He just needs to put effort in to be fit enough to do it consistently.

I've always thought that Moles was too obviously one sided, and inconsistent. He could run fast, and he could surprise from time to time with the way he won the ball, though as an opponent I think he'd be pretty easy to work out at the highest level and as a result be easily kept quiet.

[always right]

What a refreshing article on Sherman. No histrionics, no blaming others for his predicament......just an honest admission that he didn't perform to expectations. Many have bagged Sherman the player but I give him enormous credit for his mature outlook on his delisting.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/sherman-frank-20121103-28r5m.html

[The Bulldogs Bite]

What a refreshing article on Sherman. No histrionics, no blaming others for his predicament......just an honest admission that he didn't perform to expectations. Many have bagged Sherman the player but I give him enormous credit for his mature outlook on his delisting.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/sherman-frank-20121103-28r5m.html

Very good read. Really refreshing, well done to Sherman for that.

Hopefuly he gets picked up by another club - always liked him and wanted him to do well.

[AndrewP6]

What a refreshing article on Sherman. No histrionics, no blaming others for his predicament......just an honest admission that he didn't perform to expectations. Many have bagged Sherman the player but I give him enormous credit for his mature outlook on his delisting.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/sherman-frank-20121103-28r5m.html

Great article, I wish Shermo all the best.

[azabob]

What a refreshing article on Sherman. No histrionics, no blaming others for his predicament......just an honest admission that he didn't perform to expectations. Many have bagged Sherman the player but I give him enormous credit for his mature outlook on his delisting.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/sherman-frank-20121103-28r5m.html

Agree in part. But did he have any choice but to say what he said especially considering no club is interested in him?

I'm sure we saw a very similar article at the start of this year by the same jurno, claiming he will work hard etc, etc due to his indescretion in 2011. But alas it was pretty much what he does best - talk.

[always right]

Agree in part. But did he have any choice but to say what he said especially considering no club is interested in him?

I'm sure we saw a very similar article at the start of this year by the same jurno, claiming he will work hard etc, etc due to his indescretion in 2011. But alas it was pretty much what he does best - talk.

Did he have a choice? I gues he could have gone down the line that he wasn't given opportunities, the coach and he didn't see eye to eye, he wasn't given great support, etc.
He didn't so I'm happy to give him some credit. Not sure what it has to do with his previous statements about completely different topics.

[azabob]

Did he have a choice? I gues he could have gone down the line that he wasn't given opportunities, the coach and he didn't see eye to eye, he wasn't given great support, etc.
He didn't so I'm happy to give him some credit. Not sure what it has to do with his previous statements about completely different topics.

And if he had've gone down the track of blaming others his chances of being picked up would go from 50% to 10%.

Topics are different of course, but the statements are very similar. In both articles he talks about how he needs to be more consistent at a day to day level etc to get the most out of himself.

Hopefully it finally sinks in and he can re-continue his career somewhere down the track.

[GVGjr]

Agree in part. But did he have any choice but to say what he said especially considering no club is interested in him?

I'm sure we saw a very similar article at the start of this year by the same jurno, claiming he will work hard etc, etc due to his indescretion in 2011. But alas it was pretty much what he does best - talk.

He had the chance to play the role of the victim and to say that he wasn't able to produce his best because of the coach etc but instead he gave an honest appraisal that he didn't live up to his potential.

Aker never acknowledged his role in his dismissal from the club.

Hope he finds a good spot.

[Ghost Dog]

At least he said thanks to us for giving him his break. More than Aker ever did.

[Eastdog]

At least he said thanks to us for giving him his break. More than Aker ever did.

Aker sure I can understand he was disappointed when he was sacked by us but he should have been more grateful that we took him in. There were other reasons apart from what he said on the radio as to why he was sacked.

[lemmon]

That look like Altona Pier to anyone else?