Menzel/Stringer types

[wimberga]

With the Menzel v Stringer choice seemingly looming large at the Doggies I thought it might be interesting to talk about some previous draft choices where players have been highly rated but injured going into the draft.

Joel Selwood is the classic example where injury concerns seemingly had him drop a few spots however he has since shown just how classy he is. My understanding is he was rated as a top 3 talent before the injury concerns were around?

What other examples (both failed and successful) of injured juniors going into the Draft?

[chef]

Ayce Cordy.

[azabob]

Did Chris Judd have injury concerns?

[GVGjr]

Rory Hilton springs to mind.
Terrific junior footballer but carried an injury into the draft. In the end I don't think he was committed to his football as he needed to be.

[dog town]

Beau Muston.

[Go_Dogs]

Jackson Trengove at Port - still undecided if he's a boom or bust yet, but certainly slid a lot.

[Remi Moses]

Jack Darling:eek:

[Maddog37]

Cotchin from memory had injuries.

[bulldogsman]

^ I think Cotchin broke his ankle.

Tom Swift had knee issues (2 knee reco's?). Was a very highly rated 16 year old.

[Sedat]

Beau Muston.
Beau Dowler as well from memory. Didn't he have serious injuries from a car crash prior to draft day?

[FrediKanoute]

Selwood aside, the list is fairly heavily weighted against taking a Menzel/Stringer in that more fail than succeed.

[MrMahatma]

Did Chris Judd have injury concerns?
Yep. Shoulders.

[dog town]

Beau Dowler as well from memory. Didn't he have serious injuries from a car crash prior to draft day? Yep. Good pick up. Was also a period where many of the young players were getting OP but that seems to have dropped right off. I think Jordan McMahon had some injury concerns when we drafted him.

[FrediKanoute]

Danny Southern - you can add him to the list and Scott Wynd

[Mofra]

Xavier Ellis had hip issues pre-draft day from memory

[Sedat]

Yep. Good pick up. Was also a period where many of the young players were getting OP but that seems to have dropped right off. I think Jordan McMahon had some injury concerns when we drafted him.
While we're on a Hawthorn roll, Max Bailey was recovering from his 23rd knee reco when the Hawks drafted him. He's since had another 14 knee recos.

[KT31]

Weren't there concercerns on Buddy ?

[LostDoggy]

Brian Harris / Lake had some issues in his final year of junior footy. Can't recall exactly but something that affected his sleep. Meant he was discounted entirely by most teams.

[G-Mo77]

Weren't there concercerns on Buddy ?

I think that was more attitude and off field shenanigans. They were right, would have still picked him though in hindsight.

[w3design]

From memory didn't Christian Howard come with a hip issue?

[jeemak]

From memory didn't Christian Howard come with a hip issue?

Identified as an issue by the club prior to the 2009 draft (if you believe it), and meant Howard had surgery when he arrived at the club keeping him out for the majority of 2010.

[Ghost Dog]

Why was Simon Black a pick in the early 30s?

[Ghost Dog]

Jake Carlisle?

[chef]

Any chance we'll take both?

[The Underdog]

Any chance we'll take both?

Some I'd imagine. It's been fairly strong most of the way that we're into Stringer and now there's some seemingly strong rumours that we're into Menzel. They might be just rumours and it'd be a risk but seemingly both are talented enough to be considered around our picks.

[jazzadogs]

Some I'd imagine. It's been fairly strong most of the way that we're into Stringer and now there's some seemingly strong rumours that we're into Menzel. They might be just rumours and it'd be a risk but seemingly both are talented enough to be considered around our picks.
I'd heard that the Giants were leaning towards Stringer, as they can afford the high risk/high reward policy with the current state of their list. Which would, assuming Melbourne don't take him, leave Menzel for us.

[w3design]

Don't see that we can risk both top 10 picks on kids with injury doubts. One perhaps, but not both. If that went wrong it would make a lot of our previous 1st round fiascos look tame given the potential quality available to us in this draft.

[The Underdog]

Don't see that we can risk both top 10 picks on kids with injury doubts. One perhaps, but not both. If that went wrong it would make a lot of our previous 1st round fiascos look tame given the potential quality available to us in this draft.

It'd be ballsy but to be honest, if they think they are the 2 most talented I've got no problem with them doing it. It'd be far easier to go the safe route and pick someone you think has less upside but hasn't got the injury history but I'm happy if they go against the conventional thought in this case if they think the upside is worth it. There's nothing to say that whoever they pick doesn't get injured anyway down the track and let's face it nearly all players miss some relatively significant time during their careers.

[chef]

It'd be ballsy but to be honest, if they think they are the 2 most talented I've got no problem with them doing it. It'd be far easier to go the safe route and pick someone you think has less upside but hasn't got the injury history but I'm happy if they go against the conventional thought in this case if they think the upside is worth it. There's nothing to say that whoever they pick doesn't get injured anyway down the track and let's face it nearly all players miss some relatively significant time during their careers.

Agree. If Dalrymple thinks they are the 5th and 6th best players available then we should draft them both.

[W W Biscuit]

Billy Morrison was supposed to be the next big thing in the KPF stakes about ten years ago but slid to pick 17, from memory, because of dodgy knees. Collingwood picked him up and he never played a senior game.

[w3design]

I do not claim to b an expert on the kids coming through in this draft, but all I have seen and read suggests that beyond Whitfield and Toumpas there does not seem to be a huge quality gap from one player to the next in the top 10 or so.
If there is any truth in that, what is the advantage/risk reasoning in taking both the injury suspect players? If the potential risk of doing so is more than marginal, what is the advantage to taking that risk?
The potential for gain is far too small to justify the risk in my opinion.

[jeemak]

I think Menzel and Stringer are ahead of a lot of the others from a talent perspective, as far as I can tell, though due to their respective injuries and potential ongoing issues they've not been rated as highly as they might have been. As a result, they've not been talked up as much.

I'd be happy for us to take one or the other, but not both.

[KT31]

I think Menzel and Stringer are ahead of a lot of the others from a talent perspective, as far as I can tell, though due to their respective injuries and potential ongoing issues they've not been rated as highly as they might have been. As a result, they've not been talked up as much.

I'd be happy for us to take one or the other, but not both.

Agree, in a draft that it is so imperative to get right I just think it is to big a risk to take both.

[Ghost Dog]

Do you think Emma Quayle reads these boards?

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/draft-dodgers-20121110-29577.html

Get this -- >
During his second season, Cordy had surgery in which pieces of his collarbone were placed in both shoulders, limiting their range of movement but making it impossible for them to be broken or pushed out of place. After a two-game start in 2011 he played another dozen this year and started to show what his 202 centimetres might be capable of.

Wow - this I did not know.

[wimberga]

It seems entirely plausible that EQ does get on Woof - good article and a great idea :)

Also that is really interesting on Cordy, never knew that either.

[Dry Rot]

I think Menzel and Stringer are ahead of a lot of the others from a talent perspective, as far as I can tell, though due to their respective injuries and potential ongoing issues they've not been rated as highly as they might have been. As a result, they've not been talked up as much.

I'd be happy for us to take one or the other, but not both.

Agreed. Even one is a bit problematic given our current list.


When did we last have such an injured or injury prone list?

Morris will be a miracle to come back, ditto Cooney's knee, Gia is cooked, and Williams and Higgins seem to always get injured.

Given this, IMO Menzel would be a dodgy choice.