Dark horses for 2013

[Dry Rot]

There's been a lot of attention on forums on players such as Jones, Vez, Grant, and perhaps even Wood and their prospects for 2013. Fair enough, they've been in system a while now.

But what about these guys? Could there be some pleasant surprises for us in 2013 among them?

- Roberts

- Tutt

- Howard

- Pearce

- JJ

- Young

EDIT: Let's include these two too

- Stevens

- Lower

2nd EDIT: Due to popular demand

- Talia

3rd EDIT: good suggestion by Pedro Sanchez

- Goodes

[GVGjr]

I have a hunch that Stevens will impress us along with the continual development of Johannisen
I'm not sure if Steven is the definition of the dark horse but he's a player that fell a bit short at West Coast but might have found a good home with us.

Good thread DR, I'll be interested to read everyone's views.

[Dry Rot]

I have a hunch that Stevens will impress us along with the continual development of Johannisen
I'm not sure if Steven is the definition of the dark horse but he's a player that fell a bit short at West Coast but might have found a good home with us.

Good thread DR, I'll be interested to read everyone's views.

Yes, I thought of including both Stevens and Lower and I probably should have, as neither had a stellar season last year and both have both a point to prove and arguably a question mark over them at AFL level.

[The Underdog]

I think we'll be surprised how much football Pearce plays this year. While the addition of Lower probably adds competition in the back half I think Pearce will get some solid games in defence.
I also think JJ could be something special. His couple of senior games last year added something to the team that was sorely missing, pace and skill coming from the back half.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

JJ is my predicted bolter to really emerge as an exciting player in 2013. He covers the ground really well, has great speed and agility but more importantly knows when to use these attributes to his advantage, and uses the footy well.

Might be a bit early for the likes of Pearce and Roberts, who do have plenty to work with and showed some good glimpses last season, but will still be pretty raw. Both could be important in 2 years time though.

I expect that Stevens and Lower will add quite a bit, without being players who significantly impact the result of matches (if that makes sense).

I am still concerned about Howard and even more so in regards to Tutt.

[The Underdog]

Anyone else with a JJ man crush?:)

[GVGjr]

Anyone else with a JJ man crush?:)

Hey, I sponsored him first ;)

[always right]

I can see Talia coming on quicker than many may have thought. Strikes me as a real competitor.

[bulldogtragic]

Personally I'm looking forward to Stevens and especially Lower. Can't wait to see what they can add to the team.

[Go_Dogs]

Great post DR, quite a bit to look forward to with a lot of the names mentioned. Lower, Stevens and JJ should all be looking forward to big years. I'm not sold on Young yet but don't really know enough about him and like most, have a few concerns for Howard and Tutt, massive year for both of those guys who really need to start becoming consistent senior performers or else they are at risk of being moved on at years end.

I'm quite excited about Roberts too based on what he did in his brief showing last year. He's going to take another year or two to really develop his body, but I think we can expect him to get a few more games this year and hopefully just have a full year of development with no injuries.

Clay Smith must be the guy I'm most excited about right at this moment. (Not really a dark horse though)

[Dry Rot]

Personally I'm looking forward to Stevens and especially Lower. Can't wait to see what they can add to the team.

From what I've seen, Lower might add some biff. :)

[Dry Rot]

Great post DR, quite a bit to look forward to with a lot of the names mentioned. Lower, Stevens and JJ should all be looking forward to big years. I'm not sold on Young yet but don't really know enough about him and like most, have a few concerns for Howard and Tutt, massive year for both of those guys who really need to start becoming consistent senior performers or else they are at risk of being moved on at years end.

I'm quite excited about Roberts too based on what he did in his brief showing last year. He's going to take another year or two to really develop his body, but I think we can expect him to get a few more games this year and hopefully just have a full year of development with no injuries.

Clay Smith must be the guy I'm most excited about right at this moment. (Not really a dark horse though)

Thanks.

For me, Roberts is the really interesting one from the first bracket. I'm far from sold on Cordy and Jones, so I'd like to see what he can do up forward. IIRC, I read somewhere that he really stood up in the VFL finals as a forward?

[bulldogtragic]

Yep :) . Wouldn't it be great to have a feared midfield pack like we used to. Here's hoping!

[Ghost Dog]

Nice thread. Impressed by Roberts' poise. I think he'll do well, along with JJ, who has a bit of Harbow about him.
Lower has nothing to lose. Stevens is a quality player. No surprises if either does well.

[Go_Dogs]

Thanks.

For me, Roberts is the really interesting one from the first bracket. I'm far from sold on Cordy and Jones, so I'd like to see what he can do up forward. IIRC, I read somewhere that he really stood up in the VFL finals as a forward?

That's right, and also as a forward in the TAC Cup too.

Definitely agree with your assessment that if Jones and Cordy don't come on I think the focus will move to Roberts to become that key forward for us. Think he'll play forward in the VFL this year because we have a number of back men who look capable, with Markovic, Talia and Austin all likely to play down there. Hope it happens, but I'm not putting too much expectation on him as far as senior performance this year as he continue to grow into his body.

[Greystache]

Like most I think JJ will really come on, I've watched him develop over the past 2 years and his improvement curve has continued up. I think Talia will play a lot of senior footy this year, he's physically mature and is a competitor. Campbell might also make a bit of an impact too.

I think Roberts is another year away but I also think he has the most potential of our young KP players. I'm hoping Tutt can get a free run and make an impact but I'm starting to lose faith, I don't think both of him and Howard will survive our next cull and he needs make the most of his opportunities.

[bornadog]

This is the year Howard must really show something. We are all still doubters and can't predict what he will do, but for me its make or break for Howard. He has shown some glimpses of what he can do, but not consistently enough.

[Cyberdoggie]

I can see Talia coming on quicker than many may have thought. Strikes me as a real competitor.

Physically he looks like he's not far off.
Once he gets his confidence up he'll come along quite quickly. He'll follow his brothers footsteps.

[Mofra]

My take, feel free to bump at the end of the year to show how far off I am on any of them:

- Roberts
I love this kid, I really wish we'd try him as a forward at senior AFL level. He was pulling up sore from Willy games by all accounts, so he'll probably be managed through the year as a young tall that has put alot of weight on in the last 12 months. Not expecting more than a handful of games because of his physical development.
His body positioning forward and back is excellent and he uses the ball well.

- Tutt
He can play, but can he play the way B-Mac wants? At his best, he provides exactly what the team needs. A real throw of the dice.

- Howard
I'm worried that he can't find a position at AFL level. He has excellent endurance but is not particularly quick and doesn't put enough body pressure on his opponent when played as a backman. Needs to work out where he will play and make that position his own.

- Pearce
I have doubts about his pace for his height, he seems to be able to do everything else. Good leap as well. I think quicker opponents will trouble him.

- JJ
Best 22 by the end of the year. Harbrow mk 2. Yes, my expectations are that high, I'm an unashamed JJ fan.

- Young
Absolutely no expectations whatsoever. Sorry to sound harsh, but he is a ranga Lin Jong and I'm not sure he is the type of player we needed to add to our list. I hope he proves me wrong.

- Stevens
I expect he will become a best 22 player, probably this year but if not it will be in 2014. I'm very happy with this trade and think we have snagged ourselves a bargain.

- Lower
Probable best 22 player, not sure of his outside game so will fight for midfield spots with the inside mid brigade we have but he is a mature body which is an advantage.

- Talia
Will continue to imporave and show his worth as a lock-down defender. His brother as a ~21 year old held dwon CHB in a top four side and our Talia looks like he will track a similar path at a similar age.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Anyone else with a JJ man crush?:)

Looks the goods to me as does Roberts form the limited vision I've seen. Talia looks like he'll get there if not this season and only Howard is yet to show he belongs.

[whythelongface]

I can see Talia coming on quicker than many may have thought. Strikes me as a real competitor.


I think Talia will develop into a quality player over the course of the next few years. Really looking forward to his development this year.

Whilst our success on the field will be limited this year it is the development of our younger brigade, with the prospect of developing into a very good team, that I am most looking forward to. Potentially we have a very good list of young players that should see the club have a rosy future.

[Pickenitup]

Went and had a Look at training and Gee I am Impressed with Talia i really think
he will have A Big season this year really looks to have added a bit of size to his already impressive frame.

Really Like the look of Lower think he is going to be a very important run with player for us.

One of the most pleasing signs i saw today was how good Dale Morris moved i have got no doubts he can get back to his best!

[Pedro Sanchez]

What about Goodes... Lets add him to the list. Could be a perfect addition to our half back line - skilful, quick and hard. I'm tipping him to make an immediate impact - more so then Lower.

Others I'm looking forward to seeing are:

Stevens
C Smith
JJ
Stringer

[mjp]

I am going to be interested in how roles are defined for players such as Stevens and Lower.

I remain confident that Stevens can be a player, however I think (as the WCE experience showed) it really is going to come down to what role he is playing. If he is given a share of ball winning resposibility, then I think he has the chance to be a strong contributor. If - on the other hand - we need him to be primarily a role player around stoppages (as the Eagles asked him to be) whilst the likes of (a rejuvenated) Cooney, Griffen, and Boyd - with Smith, Liberatore and Wallis filling the second line and Dalhaus adding the 'X' then he might find himself stranded at Willi.

Lower I think needs to be settled into a position. He was good enough to be in the 22 at Freo but not good enough to lock down a single role - hence he was a bit in, bit out as the season wore on and his value (versatility, hardness) became less important than the best person for a single role.

It is not that I am doubting their selections in any way - I am just really interested in how the coaches plan on using these players as I believe their ability to succeed will be strongly based on the roles they are given.

My take? Throw Stevens straight into the centre square with a bit of a license and see what happens - first bounce, round 1. Dalhaus goes back to the forward line and plays high, Wallis does a similar thing.

Lower starts on the half back line and plays on the 'best' opposition half forward - we find out if he is up to it and if he is, he stays...if not, back to Willy and try the kids in that spot.

Whatever happens I want to see them both playing in Round 1. We have traded for them...PLAY THEM - and let the kids bide their time.

[bulldogtragic]

I am going to be interested in how roles are defined for players such as Stevens and Lower.

I remain confident that Stevens can be a player, however I think (as the WCE experience showed) it really is going to come down to what role he is playing. If he is given a share of ball winning resposibility, then I think he has the chance to be a strong contributor. If - on the other hand - we need him to be primarily a role player around stoppages (as the Eagles asked him to be) whilst the likes of (a rejuvenated) Cooney, Griffen, and Boyd - with Smith, Liberatore and Wallis filling the second line and Dalhaus adding the 'X' then he might find himself stranded at Willi.

Lower I think needs to be settled into a position. He was good enough to be in the 22 at Freo but not good enough to lock down a single role - hence he was a bit in, bit out as the season wore on and his value (versatility, hardness) became less important than the best person for a single role.

It is not that I am doubting their selections in any way - I am just really interested in how the coaches plan on using these players as I believe their ability to succeed will be strongly based on the roles they are given.

My take? Throw Stevens straight into the centre square with a bit of a license and see what happens - first bounce, round 1. Dalhaus goes back to the forward line and plays high, Wallis does a similar thing.

Lower starts on the half back line and plays on the 'best' opposition half forward - we find out if he is up to it and if he is, he stays...if not, back to Willy and try the kids in that spot.

Whatever happens I want to see them both playing in Round 1. We have traded for them...PLAY THEM - and let the kids bide their time.
I'm assuming you would have seen a bit of Lower MJP, how good do you think he could be and what positions/roles can he play his best football?

[jeemak]

I'm on Howard to take significant steps forward.

Perhaps I'm being a little lenient on him, though he practically wrote off 2010 due to his hip and having come from a more obscure background rather than the truly elite background like most first round draft picks he was always coming from a long way back.

Mofra makes an excellent point that he really needs to find a position for himself, and put consistent performances together. GVGjr sums Howard up well, when stating that his best and worst are too far apart. He desperately needs to tighten up his deficiencies, and expose his opponents with his strengths which for me are attack on the ball, strength with it in hand and kicking.


JJ reminds me of Raph Clark when he's playing good football (the ten or so games that he did - hopefully JJ can keep it together mentally!). Excellent mover, deceptively quick and creative. There were a couple of times where he side stepped an opponent with much more composure and time than a first year player shows.

Once he gets some confidence from consistent performances I think he'll become an extremely clever and creative player.

[w3design]

I would love to see Goodes take his opportunity and forge himself a belated career as a general on the HBF. He has the experience/maturity, and if he takes the opportunity he is being given and really runs with it, giving it 100% effort, he could be very useful over the next few years.

I hope with all the potential mids we have coming through, that we develop some kind of structure in there were we have in/under providers, and receiver/distributors, and not just a great heap of 'at the bottom of the pack' bodies lying over a stagnant and stationary ball. Dig it out, get it out, and run like hell !!!

It will be interesting to see just how B Mac intends to use all these tough mids now he has them. Surely he must convert some of them into something different all together, or else come up with a revolutionary new game plan to play with a 10 man running midfield.

Interested also to see if Dal and Hrovat can form some kind of mosquito squadron together.
Hoping to see obvious development from Talia, Roberts, and Roughy in his new guise.

[Ghost Dog]

I'd like to suggest Campbell as a 4th addition to the dark horse thread.

http://resources1.news.com.au/images/2012/03/11/1226296/434313-tom-campbell.jpg

That's a very hard grab to defend against right there. There are probably only a couple of blokes in any opposition side who can spoil him in full flight. I'm really excited to see how he will go in 2013.

Kicks straight, took some commanding marks in the backline last season. Started lean, but has been hitting the weights and looks a lot stronger. With only seven games last season, and in a year when it was played a lot in our defensive half, we haven't really seen a consistent strategy to use him in the forward line yet, similar to how he played in the NAB ( where he kicked some good goals and took a couple of outstanding grabs ).

[LostDoggy]

I'm with you, GD. Mac introduced Campbell at last year's East West day and said something like, 'we think we might have a dark horse'. If he starts taking contested grabs in the forward line he will kick goals. He is an excellent kick. I've seen him taking shots from outside 50 at training that sail through post high. Anything inside 50 is a gimme.

[DOG GOD]

I'd say lower. He has the body and the discipline to be one of our up comers this year. The fact that he can play defensively will be a major help, to allow Pickens not to be that defensive player 100% of the time. Looking fwd to seeing how he goes.

[LostDoggy]

I'm with you, GD. Mac introduced Campbell at last year's East West day and said something like, 'we think we might have a dark horse'. If he starts taking contested grabs in the forward line he will kick goals. He is an excellent kick. I've seen him taking shots from outside 50 at training that sail through post high. Anything inside 50 is a gimme.

He's an animal and i was glad that we upgraded him ASAP. I see him as the long term replacement for Minson :)

[GVGjr]

He's an animal and i was glad that we upgraded him ASAP. I see him as the long term replacement for Minson :)


I see it a bit differently. I don't believe we have recruited a long term replacement for Minson yet. Right at this moment I see Campbell very much as a short term back-up.

He might develop into something more he hasn't shown enough to suggest he is ready to be a long term number one ruckman.

[Ghost Dog]

When we are screaming out for a forward who can take a mark, not sure why we haven't thrown him up there to give him a go.

[bornadog]

When we are screaming out for a forward who can take a mark, not sure why we haven't thrown him up there to give him a go.

Pretty sure we did in the games he played in last year.

[LostDoggy]

Im on the JJ and Talia horse also, but I seriously think that Goodes will have a role to play for us off half back. I dont have much to base this on as i have never seen him play, just a gut feel that the coaches picked Goodes for a very specific reason and that he will end up playing some pretty important roles for us this year if he can stay fit.

[Ghost Dog]

Pretty sure we did in the games he played in last year.

He played ruck most of the time IIRC

[w3design]

Im on the JJ and Talia horse also, but I seriously think that Goodes will have a role to play for us off half back. I dont have much to base this on as i have never seen him play, just a gut feel that the coaches picked Goodes for a very specific reason and that he will end up playing some pretty important roles for us this year if he can stay fit.

I have seen a fair bit of Goodes over recent years Teddy, and your right on the money. Think he is destined for the HBF for sure. Good to have a mature head back there given Murph is supposed to be going forward, coupled with losing all the back 6 experience we have.

[Mofra]

He played ruck most of the time IIRC
He spent time playing the no 2 ruck role which involved stints forward - he's about as effective forward as Minson, which mean he and Will shouldn't play in the same side IMO.

Unless he's radically transformed over the pre-season, I see him as a no 1 ruckman vying for the same spot as Minson.

[always right]

I have seen a fair bit of Goodes over recent years Teddy, and your right on the money. Think he is destined for the HBF for sure. Good to have a mature head back there given Murph is supposed to be going forward, coupled with losing all the back 6 experience we have.

Doesn't he have to be elevated off the rookie list first?

[Mantis]

Doesn't he have to be elevated off the rookie list first?

He does, but don't we have one spare spot on the main list which may allow for a good performer in the NAB Cup games to be elevated prior to rd 1.

[The Pie Man]

He spent time playing the no 2 ruck role which involved stints forward - he's about as effective forward as Minson, which mean he and Will shouldn't play in the same side IMO.

Unless he's radically transformed over the pre-season, I see him as a no 1 ruckman vying for the same spot as Minson.

Agree 100% - am very interested to see how he moves in the pre-season games.

[F'scary]

When we are screaming out for a forward who can take a mark, not sure why we haven't thrown him up there to give him a go.

Stringer. The next Tony Lockett.

[always right]

He does, but don't we have one spare spot on the main list which may allow for a good performer in the NAB Cup games to be elevated prior to rd 1.

I didn't realise that. Does this effectively mean we are one short on our total list? If Goodes is elevated then we are one short on the rookies....or am I missing something?

[Axe Man]

I didn't realise that. Does this effectively mean we are one short on our total list? If Goodes is elevated then we are one short on the rookies....or am I missing something?

No we have 1 less on our primary list, 1 more on our rookie list (5 rookies total), overall list number is unaffected.

[always right]

No we have 1 less on our primary list, 1 more on our rookie list (5 rookies total), overall list number is unaffected.

Okay...thanks.

[Maddog37]

Stringer. The next Tony Lockett.


No pressure or anything though..........:D

[LongWait]

He may not be eligible for the club award given his age, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Brett Goodes as our best first year player.

[F'scary]

No pressure or anything though..........:D

check out his highlights package. 17yo out marking, out muscling grown men.:cool:

[LostDoggy]

I'm a fan of Stringer but next year? Still very young. Big improver for mine will be Wallis. He's a leader in waiting who is constantly learning all that he can. Expect him to be in our top 3. Of the newbies, I think Lower can become a regular if he can get his body right. Goodes may make it a contest though.