End of Season - Trade Targets

[bulldogtragic]

What is the glaring gap (or gaps) in our list? Who would you target first to fill the void/s?


I think Jones needs another target, Austin, Marko and Grant aren't up to it. Ayce isn't there yet, Stringer needs time. So for me, a tall forward target is a must.

I'd love Robbie Tarant or Jack Darling, maybe Nathan Vardy, but would cost way too much. Perhaps Lachie Hansen, Jesse White might be a possibility? Or a 'roughy' like Mitch Brown from Geelong or Fraser MacInness from WCE, although they might want too much.

Any others suitors or other positions which need urgent attention??

[LostDoggy]

We need back up for Minson if gets injured....Hudson

Unless a good youngster turns up I would be content to build from the draft this year.

Interested in seeing if Frawley and Blease are available. In saying Frawley, I'd draft via PSD and do a deal with GWS to avoid them drafting them. I wouldn't give up our high first round pick for Frawley and he is worth that. In saying Blease he offers speed. In saying Melbourne, I am assuming players will want to get out as some have already demonstrated.

Don't know enough of GWS and GC list but would have a look there. Speed, ball use and marking power are the needs

[DOG GOD]

Would love Trent Mckenzie from GCOAST.
Jack darling from weagles
Nathan vardy from cats

Can I wake up now.

[bulldogtragic]

Pick 20 or near could be worth some currency. What could that get us realistically??

[Scorlibo]

What is the glaring gap (or gaps) in our list? Who would you target first to fill the void/s?


I think Jones needs another target, Austin, Marko and Grant aren't up to it. Ayce isn't there yet, Stringer needs time. So for me, a tall forward target is a must.

I'd love Robbie Tarant or Jack Darling, maybe Nathan Vardy, but would cost way too much. Perhaps Lachie Hansen, Jesse White might be a possibility? Or a 'roughy' like Mitch Brown from Geelong or Fraser MacInness from WCE, although they might want too much.

Any others suitors or other positions which need urgent attention??

I'm not sure whether we desperately need a key forward as much as you think we do.

Jones is starting to improve, Stringer isn't as far away from a regular game as we might think, Grant has more to offer, Williams will play forward once he's back, Ayce is lingering, Roberts is on the list.

None of them are very good quality players right now but there's 6 of them! If we can't sort our problems out with these guys already there then why are they on the list? And why in such abundance?

It seems pretty clear that we need a bit more class up forward because Gia and Murph won't be there forever and we look hopeless without those two guys there. Higgins is always injured also.

[Dry Rot]

Jones is starting to improve, Stringer isn't as far away from a regular game as we might think, Grant has more to offer, Williams will play forward once he's back, Ayce is lingering, Roberts is on the list.


Grant will be delisted, and I have no faith in Cordy (ability) or Williams (always injured). Hope to see more of Roberts (who can play back) soon.

Recruiting a good tall forward wouldn't hurt us. Ditto a CHB.

[bulldogtragic]

Grant will be delisted, and I have no faith in Cordy (ability) or Williams (always injured). Hope to see more of Roberts (who can play back) soon.

Recruiting a good tall forward wouldn't hurt us. Ditto a CHB.
Forward who can play back... Mitch Brown from Geelong, Lachie Hansen from North. ARe they worth pick 20??

[Dry Rot]

Forward who can play back... Mitch Brown from Geelong, Lachie Hansen from North. ARe they worth pick 20??

I'm in two minds about trading this year or even next.

We're well on our way to a bottom 3 finish this year and logic suggests we'll get the spoon next year. Dunno if it's worth trading good picks now.

[Scorlibo]

Grant will be delisted, and I have no faith in Cordy (ability) or Williams (always injured). Hope to see more of Roberts (who can play back) soon.

Recruiting a good tall forward wouldn't hurt us. Ditto a CHB.

How do you think we will recruit a good tall forward? How many good tall forwards do you think are running around at the moment?

You can't be sure on Grant, neither can anyone, until he's given game time. Even if he isn't given a fair run this year, when we go to get rid of him he'll probably be picked up by another club for cheap and kill it (besides the point I know, but I can't help but express my views on this one).

The minute you recruit a 'good' tall forward you have to question why Cordy is on the list, Williams and Roberts too. Is having Stringer and Jones not enough?


Forward who can play back... Mitch Brown from Geelong, Lachie Hansen from North. ARe they worth pick 20??

If we paid pick 50 for Mitch Brown I would lose my sh*t. He will be delisted before too long.

What has Lachie Hansen shown? This thread is reminding me of the Ash Hansen push a few years ago.

The reality is if we want quality, we have to give up quality picks, and in 99% of cases we'll be paying overs because A) no decent forward wants to come and play for a bottom 4 side and B) if that's the case then we'll have to deal solely with the player's club = rip off o'clock.

[Dry Rot]

How do you think we will recruit a good tall forward? How many good tall forwards do you think are running around at the moment?





Recruit ie draft



You can't be sure on Grant, neither can anyone, until he's given game time. Even if he isn't given a fair run this year, when we go to get rid of him he'll probably be picked up by another club for cheap and kill it (besides the point I know, but I can't help but express my views on this one).



The MC seems certain, so that's that for him with us.




The minute you recruit a 'good' tall forward you have to question why Cordy is on the list, Williams and Roberts too.



Agreed. We should question that. One seems a dud, one is always injured and one is unknown and mostly played as a defender at Willi.


Is having Stringer and Jones not enough?





Stringer looks like he'll be a good forward. Jones is unknown beyond being a good contested mark.

[chef]

Robbie Tarrant would be handy and wouldn't cost the earth.

[bulldogtragic]

Robbie Tarrant would be handy and wouldn't cost the earth.
I like Robbie too. I wonder what market value would be?

[azabob]

Robbie Tarrant would be handy and wouldn't cost the earth.

Is he over his injuries though?

[lemmon]

You'd have to go think one of Essendons talls, probably Gumby would be squeezed out. Wouldn't mind him

[Pickenitup]

I would take Gumby would add so much to us.
Don't think we will get Frawley maybe a defender Like Pears would be Good!
We should def look at mature state players for our rookie list like the Pies
Did with Frost Dwyer and Martin who probably would all get games easily with us.

[LostDoggy]

Regarding trading, I think it's all solid body potential key backs.

Markovic and Austin aren't up to AFL standard
, Morris may not have long and Roberts\Talia are speculatives.

Roughy and Young look the types to build around.
I'd be happy to go into the trade period looking to find more surplus types like Tom Young.

Use the draft for best available, geared towards key forward.

[LostDoggy]

I don't think forwards are the problem. The problem is with defenders and mids who can't kick 60 metres and kick pinpoint passes to advantage. We've got to get one top liner in the mould of Suckling, and a pacy mid player in the mould of Atley (who has, from memory, taken 3 or 4 years to develop).

[Twodogs]

One seems a dud, one is always injured and one is unknown and mostly played as a defender at Willi.


Talls always take time to mature. It's far too early to make a definitive call on Cordy yet. In fact I'd say he's shown more signs that he will make it than he won't.


Regarding trading, I think it's all solid body potential key backs.

Markovic and Austin aren't up to AFL standard
, Morris may not have long and Roberts\Talia are speculatives.

Roughy and Young look the types to build around.
I'd be happy to go into the trade period looking to find more surplus types like Tom Young.

Use the draft for best available, geared towards key forward.

Yep. Good assessment. Especially re Markovic.


I don't think forwards are the problem. The problem is with defenders and mids who can't kick 60 metres and kick pinpoint passes to advantage. We've got to get one top liner in the mould of Suckling, and a pacy mid player in the mould of Atley (who has, from memory, taken 3 or 4 years to develop).

Again good assessment.

[w3design]

We already have more than enough "handy"players on our list.
Spend up big only on silk or cream, and I don't much care if that is in the draft or trade.
Pace, and 'natural footballers' who can kick with precision only need apply.

Watching some of our kids, there is heaps of potential coming through, but a bit more class around them will both bring them on quicker, and make them and the team a lot stronger.

As for it being a risk that should Grant be traded, he might come good some where else. Well so be it, and good luck to him, and whoever might have taken the gamble to pick him up. But I don't see how we can continue to clog up a place on the list in the forlorn hope that he will somehow miraculously start performing to his potential after so many years of not doing so.

I don't see how we need to promote him to the seniors in order for him to prove his worth or otherwise, as he has not exactly been banging the door down at the lower level to force his way in. And if we give him weeks in the seniors just for the sake of it, that only keeps a kid from getting a senior go.

[Ghost Dog]

Anyone who can play and who wants to come to us.
ANYONE. Holes all over the ground.
Except for in and under midfielders.

[Throughandthrough]

Jarryd Lyons, crows.

[Remi Moses]

You'd have to go think one of Essendons talls, probably Gumby would be squeezed out. Wouldn't mind him

Noticed the other Night Gumby got his hands on a lot and dropped them.
Went to ground often as well.

[Ghost Dog]

Carlton will lose a few. Melbourne too.

[bulldogtragic]

Carlton will lose a few. Melbourne too.
Would we look at Luke Mitchell from Carlton. 198cm, 100kg former teammate of Libba and Wallace. Has had a lot of shoulder issues, but looked a likely junior up forward.

[bornadog]

Would we look at Luke Mitchell from Carlton. 198cm, 100kg former teammate of Libba and Wallace. Has had a lot of shoulder issues, but looked a likely junior up forward.

Gee he must be getting on in years :D

[anfo27]

Matthew Watson from the blues or Tayte Pears. I know Watson is a little slow & that probably wouldn't work well with Roughie being slow but he has a hell of kick on him.

[The Cowshed]

Anyone who has two legs, two arms and can kick, mark and handball...seriously!

I'd trade to get Tom Boyd (U18 CHF). Trade our first pick & Higgins...we must make sure we bring in quality and here you have a future premiership key forward. The club needs to go all out...

[stefoid]

We should rookie a mature gorilla forward form the secondary comps. A pack marker, not a leading forward like Redpath. I think Redpath is gone.

Oh, thats not a trade target.

[The Cowshed]

They should groom Redpath as a key defender (CHB) he has agility and height and a ripping build- just needs to get some games consistently under his belt, Stringer as FF

[Remi Moses]

Matthew Watson from the blues or Tayte Pears. I know Watson is a little slow & that probably wouldn't work well with Roughie being slow but he has a hell of kick on him.

Great kick, but a bit undersized for a key back.
Not overly nimble either.
What on earth happened to Laidlaw of Carlton?
Looked a good pick up under Ratten.

[Throughandthrough]

Whatever happened to James Magner?

[Twodogs]

Anyone who has two legs, two arms and can kick, mark and handball...seriously!

I'd trade to get Tom Boyd (U18 CHF). Trade our first pick & Higgins...we must make sure we bring in quality and here you have a future premiership key forward. The club needs to go all out...

Why would any other club want Higgins?

[Mofra]

We should rookie a mature gorilla forward form the secondary comps. A pack marker, not a leading forward like Redpath. I think Redpath is gone.

Oh, thats not a trade target.
Justin Hardy?
Some talent watchers say he's the best mature KPF not on an AFL list.

[LostDoggy]

Whatever happened to James Magner?

Rookie and i don't know if they had any available spots. Tom Gillies may be on the LTI list now.

Disposal lacks a little but surely they could use his run, in and under work and hardness, considering they lack much of that currently.

[Axe Man]

Great kick, but a bit undersized for a key back.
Not overly nimble either.
What on earth happened to Laidlaw of Carlton?
Looked a good pick up under Ratten.

Do you mean Jeremy Laidler? Did his knee last year but seems to have fallen out of favour with Malthouse after a good season in 2011.

[Mofra]

Perhaps we wont trade at all this year? Clear out a few to clear up list space and draft our way out of trouble.

I was pretty happy with our trading last year, giving up little save for Stevens who is 21 anyway.
We have tended to get more value out of later pick trades (eg. Hudson) over higher pick trades (Rawlings) anyway.

[Dancin' Douggy]

Perhaps we wont trade at all this year? Clear out a few to clear up list space and draft our way out of trouble.

I was pretty happy with our trading last year, giving up little save for Stevens who is 21 anyway.
We have tended to get more value out of later pick trades (eg. Hudson) over higher pick trades (Rawlings) anyway.

Yes I thought we played it well last year.

[soupman]

Rookie and i don't know if they had any available spots. Tom Gillies may be on the LTI list now.

Disposal lacks a little but surely they could use his run, in and under work and hardness, considering they lack much of that currently.


I'm pretty sure they have had a spot but won't promote him, which seems baffling unless there is some off field issues not yet public.

I'm quite happy if we can identify players like Tom Young who are surplus to requirements at other clubs and cheap.

[Remi Moses]

Do you mean Jeremy Laidler? Did his knee last year but seems to have fallen out of favour with Malthouse after a good season in 2011.

Yes, it seems to always happen with Mick.

[Doc26]

Lets get one back from the system.
Dale Thomas as a an unsigned restricted agent. Doesn't appear to be a fan of Bucks. At 25 he's in an ideal age bracket for us and where we are lacking, offers us much needed outside run and spread, uses the ball well and offers all over ground flexibility. Would complement our developing inside mid group well, offers a much needed foil for Griff and has the added benefit of being a highly marketable commodity. Would be a huge get for the Club even if the odds might be against us.

[wimberga]

Lets get one back from the system.
Dale Thomas as a an unsigned restricted agent. Doesn't appear to be a fan of Bucks. At 25 he's in an ideal age bracket for us and where we are lacking, offers us much needed outside run and spread, uses the ball well and offers all over ground flexibility. Would complement our developing inside mid group well, offers a much needed foil for Griff and has the added benefit of being a highly marketable commodity. Would be a huge get for the Club even if the odds might be against us.

Hadn't really thought about this until you wrote it Doc but agree it would be pretty awesome. Does provide us with what we are seriously lacking and brings star power to Whitten Oval. The question is, what would it cost to get him and could we actually get him to want to come to us?

[Remi Moses]

Lets get one back from the system.
Dale Thomas as a an unsigned restricted agent. Doesn't appear to be a fan of Bucks. At 25 he's in an ideal age bracket for us and where we are lacking, offers us much needed outside run and spread, uses the ball well and offers all over ground flexibility. Would complement our developing inside mid group well, offers a much needed foil for Griff and has the added benefit of being a highly marketable commodity. Would be a huge get for the Club even if the odds might be against us.

Be a great pick up. Why not?

[lemmon]

Lets get one back from the system.
Dale Thomas as a an unsigned restricted agent. Doesn't appear to be a fan of Bucks. At 25 he's in an ideal age bracket for us and where we are lacking, offers us much needed outside run and spread, uses the ball well and offers all over ground flexibility. Would complement our developing inside mid group well, offers a much needed foil for Griff and has the added benefit of being a highly marketable commodity. Would be a huge get for the Club even if the odds might be against us.

Great point Doc, we have the cap space, he fills a need and we get him for nothing. I echo the words of others but...why not?

[hujsh]

Then while we're at it we can build a time machine and pick up young versions of Granty, Westy, Johnson, Templeton and Whitten and win 12 flags in a row. Yay.:)

[lemmon]

If we're talking Daisy, does Buddy come into the conversation? Even if all it does is muddy the waters a bit I can't see that as being a bad thing?

We have to pay this money to someone and we are only going to have more room in the cap with the guys who will go out...why not throw a decent offer to Franklin or Thomas? The reality is they wont come but it forces up market value and throws a spanner in the works for other clubs...this is a competition after all.

[Doc26]

If we're talking Daisy, does Buddy come into the conversation? Even if all it does is muddy the waters a bit I can't see that as being a bad thing?

We have to pay this money to someone and we are only going to have more room in the cap with the guys who will go out...why not throw a decent offer to Franklin or Thomas? The reality is they wont come but it forces up market value and throws a spanner in the works for other clubs...this is a competition after all.

Money can talk... Ablett from the Cats to the Suns, Mitch Clark's last minute change of heart to head to the Demons rather than the supposed reason he gave to the Lions to head back home to be close to family, to take up a lucrative offer with the Dockers.

I'm not suggesting that it wouldn't be a difficult get but it is hard to imagine the Pies having any room left in their cap to match any sizeable restricted agent offer put to Daisy after all their quality signings last season. Just as our Club must continue to sell its vision and provide hope to its players and members we must as a Club look to thinking and acting bigger, to stay in touch with the competition..

[The Bulldogs Bite]

It would be a very handy get.

Along with a few early picks that we'll get from this year's coming draft, it would put us in a much better position heading forward. As has been said, he'd be a great foil for Griffen and co.

His asking price would be pretty high though, much more than his worth.

[Doc26]

It would be a very handy get.

Along with a few early picks that we'll get from this year's coming draft, it would put us in a much better position heading forward. As has been said, he'd be a great foil for Griffen and co.

His asking price would be pretty high though, much more than his worth.

It no doubt would require a big offer to lure such a player.

Aside from what he should be able to offer us substantially on field, which I might add is my primary concern, as a Club we must be currently haemorrhaging in gate receipts, memberships and merchandising. Simplistically, and without access to data to model, if a Thomas was to contribute to the generation of say 5k new members at $200 pa, that's 1m pa in gross revenue alone. We must look at what the total value of his offer would bring to us from where we're at, to where we need to reach.

Unlike a few of the high end Club's who have virtually saturated their membership growth potential we have a lot of potential to increase our return from increasing our supporter base, we just need prospects or those holding back to buy into the vision and a highly marketable commodity in Thomas would help in part to get us there. This point on our Club's potential was a key essence of Peter Gordon and co.'s equalisation related submission to the league earlier in the season.

[Mofra]

Why on Earth would Thomas come to a struggling bottom 4 club when he could get almost the same money playing for Carlton who are still (arguably) in their finals window and he has a close relationship with Mick Malthouse?

The only scenario I could consider would be if we pay him significant overs, Cooney goes to allow us to pay that much, and Thomas refuses to go to a GWS who have 9.8% COLA + a $1m bonus over other clubs. It seems a fair stretch.

[Dancin' Douggy]

Lets get one back from the system.
Dale Thomas as a an unsigned restricted agent. Doesn't appear to be a fan of Bucks. At 25 he's in an ideal age bracket for us and where we are lacking, offers us much needed outside run and spread, uses the ball well and offers all over ground flexibility. Would complement our developing inside mid group well, offers a much needed foil for Griff and has the added benefit of being a highly marketable commodity. Would be a huge get for the Club even if the odds might be against us.

This is the correct way to be thinking about free agency.
Maybe it won't happen but we would still get a headline out of it.
And maybe he WOULD come.
Surely we've got salary cap room to 'buy' a star player.

We should at least be making the right noises.

[whythelongface]

Why on Earth would Thomas come to a struggling bottom 4 club when he could get almost the same money playing for Carlton who are still (arguably) in their finals window and he has a close relationship with Mick Malthouse?

The only scenario I could consider would be if we pay him significant overs, Cooney goes to allow us to pay that much, and Thomas refuses to go to a GWS who have 9.8% COLA + a $1m bonus over other clubs. It seems a fair stretch.

Nothing wrong with dreaming Mofra. :)

But you are right. Whilst it would be wonderful to snare someone like Daisy, realistically a team fighting for the flag or the GWS will be the ones to pick up the big ticket free agents. GWS are in the market for two or three big name players at the end of this year - Daisy is one of the most marketable players in the AFL and will attract a fair bit of attention from them.

[mjp]

Why on Earth would Thomas come to a struggling bottom 4 club when he could get almost the same money playing for Carlton who are still (arguably) in their finals window and he has a close relationship with Mick Malthouse?

The only scenario I could consider would be if we pay him significant overs, Cooney goes to allow us to pay that much, and Thomas refuses to go to a GWS who have 9.8% COLA + a $1m bonus over other clubs. It seems a fair stretch.

1/.We don't know if he could get the same money at Carlton or not...so why not have a go.
2/.Maybe he doesn't want to live in Blacktown. Unlike a lot of people I don't hate it there but it would not be my preferred location.
3/.Who *REALLY* knows about the Thomas/Malthouse relationship...they seemed close I guess, but Lake and Eade seemed to be at loggerheads (externally) and Lake actually re-upped whilst he was there. In short, I suspect the pull of his mates at Collingwood would be > than the pull of Malthouse.
4/.Cooney would (and should) be on a good wicket...but there are not too many others. To my way of thinking we should have $ to spend and if it means losing a couple of fringe players and double dipping at draft time, well...it isn't like we are winning any games anyway!

I said all this about Goddard 12-months ago...we simply must swing the bat. Sooking about players who have left is a waste of time - use the system.

[KT31]

I said all this about Goddard 12-months ago...we simply must swing the bat. Sooking about players who have left is a waste of time - use the system.

Agree, you will never know if you don't have a crack.
Not just pertaining to Thomas but on any player the staff think will improve our list.
I don't understand, or agree, with statements from our club stating we will not partake in trying to lure players from other clubs.
It has happened to us in spades and with money to spend it is now time to turn the tables.

[mjp]

I don't understand, or agree, with statements from our club stating we will not partake in trying to lure players from other clubs.
It has happened to us in spades and with money to spend it is now time to turn the tables.

It is great to take the moral high ground, but we haven't even played in a GF since 1961. Where is the mhg getting us?

[BulldogBelle]

Who was the last 'required' played at Collingwood that crossed over to us?

In the last 25 years?

[bornadog]

Who was the last 'required' played at Collingwood that crossed over to us?

In the last 25 years?

who cares. It doesn't matter, you will never know if you don't have a go.

[Greystache]

Lets get one back from the system.
Dale Thomas as a an unsigned restricted agent. Doesn't appear to be a fan of Bucks. At 25 he's in an ideal age bracket for us and where we are lacking, offers us much needed outside run and spread, uses the ball well and offers all over ground flexibility. Would complement our developing inside mid group well, offers a much needed foil for Griff and has the added benefit of being a highly marketable commodity. Would be a huge get for the Club even if the odds might be against us.

I agree with you Doc.

I was discussing this situation, and in fact, this very scenario at last week's game. We at this time should be making a play at all and every restricted free agent that suit our needs, especially if they're at a team near the top of the ladder who will invariably have salary cap pressure.

The benefits are two fold for us;

1) We get a gun player who has 5 years+ left to offer when we have a lot of salary cap room.

2) We force the other club to pay overs to keep him AND declare it openly in their salary cap.

Using Collingwood as an example- If we made a play for Pendlebury, Swan, Cloke, Beams, and Thomas and made an offer for $700K+ for each of them, we would either get one or Collingwood would have to openly declare they're paying $3.5 million of their salary cap to those 5 players alone. Good luck trying to creatively account for the rest of their list under the salary cap, or when a player becomes available on the market and they want to make a play for.

We should be into Thomas' manager trying to manipulate a deal- Basically "we'll put in an open offer for $750K for him, best case Collingwood matches it and he stays on a good wicket, worst case he comes to us on a massive salary and is the face of the club".

[lemmon]

who cares. It doesn't matter, you will never know if you don't have a go.

This, best case scenario we get a good player for nothing, worst case we squeeze the pies. Win win

[FrediKanoute]

Thomas would be ideal as a target (as would Buddy).

I never thought of it previously, but Free Agency with a properly policed salary cap is an effective redistribution tool, because the only clubs with space in the salary caps are likely to be clubs down the bottom of the ladder with a multitude of young players on "low value" contracts. By purchasing Free Agents well a low level club can and should accellerate its climb up the ladder.

As a club we should be doing everything we can to arrest this decline. Playing and losing for development purposes as we are doing at the moment just isn't right. Whilst I support Macca's approach and accept it will take time I still want to see some results to give us a degree of hope.

[Remi Moses]

Personally don't care on the squeezing Collingwood concept.
Doesn't aid our cause? So why care?
Let's look at players that will help us climb the ladder, and Thomas fits the bill.

[LostDoggy]

Fantastic thinking and it's that kind of use of the system that will take the club forward.

Have we ever signed a genuine star player in the age bracket that'd give us 5-6+ years from another club. I can't think of one in the last 20 years.

[bulldogtragic]

Fantastic thinking and it's that kind of use of the system that will take the club forward.

Have we ever signed a genuine star player in the age bracket that'd give us 5-6+ years from another club. I can't think of one in the last 20 years.
Jade Rawlings :)


Or he was meant to be anyway...

[Mofra]

Have we ever signed a genuine star player in the age bracket that'd give us 5-6+ years from another club. I can't think of one in the last 20 years.
Ben Hudson would be the closest - not a star but definately one of the most effective ruckmen of his time. He did have a pull towards the Western Suburbs as well as the Bulldogs being seen as a team on the rise at the time.

[w3design]

It is great to take the moral high ground, but we haven't even played in a GF since 1961. Where is the mhg getting us?

Perhaps trying to keep to the "moral high ground" has not helped us in the premiership stakes. But we can still look at ourselves in the mirror... more than a few teams who should remain nameless.

That being said though, while I may not want to see us lower our standards to those of some other teams, we are in a competition with 17 other teams, and subject to sets of rules and conditions that govern how our environment operates.

Daisy would potentially [ as long as he is physically sound] be a good get for us, and surely it is worth at least testing the water... though I will admit, had he not re-signed with the Collywobbles, Sidebottom would have been my first preference from their lot.

Now re the suggestion that FA should advantage the lower clubs? Sounds nice in theory, but I would not hold my breath waiting for that to occur. 2012 produced one big name FA moving, and look where he went.

[bornadog]

Fantastic thinking and it's that kind of use of the system that will take the club forward.

Have we ever signed a genuine star player in the age bracket that'd give us 5-6+ years from another club. I can't think of one in the last 20 years.

Paul Hudson went pretty well.

[bulldogtragic]

I'm not sure we can claim the moral high ground after manipulating the system and rail roading Jade Rawlings against his will. If Rawlings was a better player, the 'doing whatever it takes' approach would still be employed by the club. Doing the opposite doesn't wipe away our sins, it just imposes a self imposed punishment and puts us behind every other club. And when you're already behind most other clubs in most areas, it's just another area where we are behind. Maybe it's just the club being defeatist?

[Axe Man]

Any interest in Polec, Docherty, Longer or Karnezis from the Lions?

Rival clubs circle uncontracted Lion cubs (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-05-17/rival-clubs-circle-uncontracted-lion-cubs)

[lemmon]

Their list management must be awful to have all that young talent coming out of contract all at once

[bulldogtragic]

Any interest in Polec, Docherty, Longer or Karnezis from the Lions?

Rival clubs circle uncontracted Lion cubs (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-05-17/rival-clubs-circle-uncontracted-lion-cubs)
Why the hell not!

[bulldogsman]

Big Docherty fan. Line breaking speed, good skills, clean hands and has good intensity.

Not a big Karnezis or Polec fan. Can see us being interested though, both have X factor.

[Remi Moses]

Aaron Black at Norf is out of contract also.
Looks an impressive type.

[Remi Moses]

Big Docherty fan. Line breaking speed, good skills, clean hands and has good intensity.

Not a big Karnezis or Polec fan. Can see us being interested though, both have X factor.

I was surprised The Lions picked Longer considering they had Luenberger.

[azabob]

Aaron Black at Norf is out of contract also.
Looks an impressive type.

If memory serves me correctly, mjp was keen for us to get him in the draft originally.

[ledge]

You do realise the players retiring are ones on the veterans list so our salary cap might not be as much free as you think .

[LostDoggy]

You do realise the players retiring are ones on the veterans list so our salary cap might not be as much free as you think .

I'd love to know how we are paying close to the same money for
our list as say Hawthorn or Essendon are for theirs. Hope some of the kids are getting a motsa front loading as I can only see Murph, Griffin and Coons as being worth the very high end dollars. Surely we have a million somewhere tucked away for the right player???? I'd happily pay Gumbleton overs for a 2-year deal (a $600-$650 sort of number) so we can pick up a quality mid in the draft and start climbing.

[ledge]

The first two years in the system I think it's a set amount, but it's the third year the player will push for a bigger pay , we have a lot of kids and because of having to spend a certain amount in sakarya I imagine some of our players are over Paid

[Remi Moses]

If memory serves me correctly, mjp was keen for us to get him in the draft originally.

He is drafted in 09, so it's taken awhile. You'd think with Tarrant waiting in the wings someone isn't going to get much game time.

[bulldogtragic]

He is drafted in 09, so it's taken awhile. You'd think with Tarrant waiting in the wings someone isn't going to get much game time.
I wouldn't be opposed to seeing if we could pry Black, Hansen or especially Tarrant. Hopefully one or all gets left out consistently and look for more game time elsewhere.

[hujsh]

If memory serves me correctly, mjp was keen for us to get him in the draft originally.

I remember being very excited that we might get him and then we picked Howard I couldn't believe it.

[Mitcha]

I'd happily pay Gumbleton overs for a 2-year deal (a $600-$650 sort of number)
WTF!!!!! Some on here are calling for the culling of Tom Williams because he is injury prone yet you want to fork out an outrageous amount of money for this injury prone no talent spud, your'e entitled to your opinion but surely not serious with this one are you?

[G-Mo77]

WTF!!!!! Some on here are calling for the culling of Tom Williams because he is injury prone yet you want to fork out an outrageous amount of money for this injury prone no talent spud, your'e entitled to your opinion but surely not serious with this one are you?

It's actually a pretty standard figure and one he would get in the open market. I think we offered around $200 - $250K last year. A healthy year from Gumby he'd easily push well past that.

[Mitcha]

A healthy year from Gumby? Hasn't happened in the past 6 years he has been in the system. $200-$250k is a long way from $600k which was the figure suggested.

[Go_Dogs]

I'm 100% behind having a crack at Dale Thomas. He's a great fit for us and would add a lot on field and off. Good suggestion Doc.

[SlimPickens]

I'm 100% behind having a crack at Dale Thomas. He's a great fit for us and would add a lot on field and off. Good suggestion Doc.

Agree 100%. We would be negligent in our duty if we didnt ask the question.

[G-Mo77]

A healthy year from Gumby? Hasn't happened in the past 6 years he has been in the system. $200-$250k is a long way from $600k which was the figure suggested.

It was $600K over 2 years if you re-read the original post from Superdog. It's not that far off and seems about market value. No way anyone would pay $600K per season.

[Mofra]

It was $600K over 2 years if you re-read the original post from Superdog. It's not that far off and seems about market value. No way anyone would pay $600K per season.
$300k is around average AFL salary IIRC

Of course, the mean salary is likely to be lower due to rookie/1st & 2nd year contracts but $300k for an established player isn't outrageous.

I'm wary of trading for established talent, simply because when we do (with the exception of 2012) we generally pay too much for too little return.
We all look at trades in hindsight and say "look what we could have drafted instead" yet this is what we're effectively doing when trading

3rd rounders and beyond I'm happy to part with (I think the Stevens & Young trades will be seen as wins in future years) but 1st & 2nd rounders are something we need to be very careful in parting with. Libba, Wallis, Jones, Roughy, Smith, McCrae, Stronger, Hrovat... outside of two rookie picks (Dahl & JJ) these guys are the core we rebuild with.

To use an example from last year, would anyone give up Koby Stevens plus one of those named players for Chris Dawes? That's the realistic market value for traded players we have to consider. It's time to suck it up, accept some time at the foot of the ladder and draft our way out of trouble.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Fyfe, Black, Carlisle -- take your pick.

Let's try to forget Howard's selection..

[SlimPickens]

Rory Sloane should be another on our radar. Very good user and a gut runner. Vic boy out of contract.

[bulldogtragic]

Before we identify targets, what picks or decent players are we willing to part with??

[The Adelaide Connection]

Rory Sloane should be another on our radar. Very good user and a gut runner. Vic boy out of contract.

Was about to write the same thing. Exactly what we need, but while it has been reported he is coming out of contract I remember him apparently signing on for three last year. Even found a few articles. Confused.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/sloane-signs-new-deal-with-crows-20120604-1zr08.html

[Remi Moses]

I'd say he'd stay to be honest.Would be a nice fit for anyone

[Mantis]

Considering the position we are in are we likely to be to attract any player who is not a 'fringe' type?

Money is nice.. Playing in a poor side isn't.

[Ghost Dog]

Is it a poor side? Cooney, Murphy, Griffen, Gia, Boyd, Jones, Stringer, Dahlhaus, MaCrae, Morris, - any side in the AFL would love these players.
It's playing poorly or being set up poorly. We were crap V the suns.That's the set up and the on field skill level on the day. Everyone knows we are more capable than that effort. A lot of very experienced tipsters and former AFL coaches picked us to win that game.

[bornadog]

Is it a poor side? Cooney, Murphy, Griffen, Gia, Boyd, Jones, Stringer, Dahlhaus, MaCrae, Morris, - any side in the AFL would love these players.
It's playing poorly or being set up poorly. We were crap V the suns.That's the set up and the on field skill level on the day. Everyone knows we are more capable than that effort. A lot of very experienced tipsters and former AFL coaches picked us to win that game.

6 wins in two years says we are a poor side.

[LostDoggy]

WTF!!!!! Some on here are calling for the culling of Tom Williams because he is injury prone yet you want to fork out an outrageous amount of money for this injury prone no talent spud, your'e entitled to your opinion but surely not serious with this one are you?

Totally utterly 100 percent straight faced in my opinion sir. We desperately, desperately, need a key forward. Lachie Hanson is almost mentally challenged and is the only other obviously likely available with any modicum of talent. Even if we get Boyd in the draft we still need at least one other viable option and Gumby (when on the park) can definately play. He's also still on the fringe at the bombers and may have another think at the end of this year. If you believe he's a spud you haven't been looking closely enough in my opinion. Jones will hopefully continue to develop but we need more. If you are looking for spuds, try looking at a few of our own before you start pointing at Gumby. We have some talent too but we need to go after viable forward options and whilst I'd prefer it if he wasn't injury prone, he wouldn't be as likely available if he wasn't. Same with Stringer and his broken leg - never would have dropped to 5. At 1 and 6 I'm ready take a short term (2 year) risk and build around and beneath it.

[LostDoggy]

Had to laugh. Mitcha ref page 69 of todays Hun. Not that I read much into those muppets but timing was ironic

[SlimPickens]

6 wins in two years says we are a poor side.

1 and a half years;)

[Topdog]

Is it a poor side? Cooney, Murphy, Griffen, Gia, Boyd, Jones, Stringer, Dahlhaus, MaCrae, Morris, - any side in the AFL would love these players.
It's playing poorly or being set up poorly. We were crap V the suns.That's the set up and the on field skill level on the day. Everyone knows we are more capable than that effort. A lot of very experienced tipsters and former AFL coaches picked us to win that game.

Yes, yes, yes, no, yes, no, no, no, no, yes

4 are players other teams would have. 4 are young and promising and 1 is old and probably in his last season even though he is still performing.

[Bulldog4life]

Considering the position we are in are we likely to be to attract any player who is not a 'fringe' type?

Money is nice.. Playing in a poor side isn't.

Ward & Scully didn't think so.

[bornadog]

1 and a half years;)

You got me on a technicality.:D I can't see us winning any more games this year.:mad:

[Mofra]

Before we identify targets, what picks or decent players are we willing to part with??
We have a winner.

I'm of the opinion, given where we are at as a side, we have to draft our way out of trouble. Therefore I'm hesitant to give up too much which means we won't attract too much.

[Mantis]

Ward & Scully didn't think so.

Yep... but I don't think we will be in a position to offer a ridiculous amount of money as was the case with those 2.

[G-Mo77]

You got me on a technicality.:D I can't see us winning any more games this year.:mad:

Right now I'm thinking that but surely we'd put the sword to GWS? We've got Melbourne and them back to back. 2 wins maybe our season is back on track. :D

[Bulldog4life]

Yep... but I don't think we will be in a position to offer a ridiculous amount of money as was the case with those 2.

Possibly but as has been suggested you just never know if you don't try. I can't see Thomas getting a huge amount from Collingwood. Could be a target.

[whythelongface]

We have a winner.

I'm of the opinion, given where we are at as a side, we have to draft our way out of trouble. Therefore I'm hesitant to give up too much which means we won't attract too much.

Pretty much agree. Whilst it would be great to pick up a player the ilk of Franklin or Thomas they alone would not make a huge difference to our structural deficiencies. We would need to trade three top level players to see signficant improvement in the short to medium term. Say we recruited Franklin on his own we would still need to deliver the ball to him for him to be effective, unfortunately our foot skills would probably render him useless and we would be pissed off we wasted our top 2 draft picks on him plus a squillion dollars.

I think the approach is to continue to draft our way out of trouble and teach those that we draft how to play the game. Whether McCartney is the coach to develop the list into a top team is another question that needs considering, at year's end.

[Mantis]

Possibly but as has been suggested you just never know if you don't try. I can't see Thomas getting a huge amount from Collingwood. Could be a target.

... for Carlton.

[Scorlibo]

Yes, yes, yes, no, yes, no, no, no, no, yes

4 are players other teams would have. 4 are young and promising and 1 is old and probably in his last season even though he is still performing.

Dahlhaus is already a very good player and would get a game in any other side in the competition. Otherwise I'd agree with you.

[soupman]

At this point we only trade what we don't see developing for us.

Therefore hold onto our draft picks unless we identify another Young/Lower/Stevens available at the right price ie. pick 45 for Stevens was good.

Players we don't think will kick on with us can be offered around but obviously they will not attract much in compesnation.

The only player that might attract anything pre-pick 50 atm is Higgins.

Wood and Williams might join him but firstly we should see how they play out the season and whether they are required players with us.

[Topdog]

Dahlhaus is already a very good player and would get a game in any other side in the competition. Otherwise I'd agree with you.

I think he is the most over rated Bulldog player I have ever seen in my life.

[Greystache]

I think he is the most over rated Bulldog player I have ever seen in my life.

By supporters or the club?

He finished 4th in the B&F last year despite missing the last 4 games.

[SlimPickens]

I think he is the most over rated Bulldog player I have ever seen in my life.

Pretty tough call on a kid that has played 35 games, I would have thought.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I think he is the most over rated Bulldog player I have ever seen in my life.

Tough call given he's still inexperienced, but my dad agrees with you that he's had a pretty poor season so far.

[The Doctor]

Dalhaus is a good player as we all know. But he is over rated. He is rated that way because of his looks but mainly because so much of our list is crap.

If we are to be a force, Dal would be in the bottom 6 of our 22.

[Remi Moses]

Yes he's useless, trade him. Gets a game because of his hair.

[boydogs]

Before we identify targets, what picks or decent players are we willing to part with??


We have a winner.

I'm of the opinion, given where we are at as a side, we have to draft our way out of trouble. Therefore I'm hesitant to give up too much which means we won't attract too much.

You don't need to trade players or picks in free agency. They do however have to have been with their club for a while and will be 26+, maybe we could pick up one or two players but they won't be in their prime when we're next pushing for a flag.

Given our abundance of inside mids, I would do something like Clay Smith for Rory Sloane though.

[The Doctor]

Yes he's useless, trade him. Gets a game because of his hair.

stupid comment.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Dalhaus is a good player as we all know. But he is over rated. He is rated that way because of his looks but mainly because so much of our list is crap.

If we are to be a force, Dal would be in the bottom 6 of our 22.

Agree with the sentiment, but I think he's better (and will be better) than a bottom 6 player at a good club.

I have doubts whether he can even pinch hit in the midfield, more of a natural crumbing forward. I understand versatility is the buzz word in AFL circles right now, but he's one I'd leave up forward unless he's really struggling.

[AndrewP6]

Dalhaus is a good player as we all know. But he is over rated. He is rated that way because of his looks but mainly because so much of our list is crap.

If we are to be a force, Dal would be in the bottom 6 of our 22.

If he's going to be bottom 6 in our 22, we're not going to be a force.

[Remi Moses]

stupid comment.

He's rated that way because of his looks is a stupid comment.
The guy's 21 played bugger all games and yet you're condemning him to the bottom 6, when we're going okay! Gee I hope that's the case because that will signal we're a bloody good side.:confused:

[Greystache]

Dalhaus is a good player as we all know. But he is over rated. He is rated that way because of his looks but mainly because so much of our list is crap.

If we are to be a force, Dal would be in the bottom 6 of our 22.

He's highly rated because of his hair? That's a new one.

Any team that he's rated in the bottom 6 would be a premiership team not just a force.

[Mofra]

Dalhaus is a good player as we all know. But he is over rated. He is rated that way because of his looks but mainly because so much of our list is crap.
... and because he is one of the leaders in the AFL for pressure acts as a kid who is only in his 3rd year of senior AFL football.

[The Doctor]

The guy's 21 played bugger all games and yet you're condemning him to the bottom 6, when we're going okay! Gee I hope that's the case because that will signal we're a bloody good side.:confused:

thats the whole point.

I'm not condemning him at all. Have rated him highly since his junior days.

[The Doctor]

Any team that he's rated in the bottom 6 would be a premiership team not just a force.

You got it!

[Greystache]

Dale Thomas had just been filled out for the season with an ankle injury. Does that change whether we should go after him or does it mean he's more attainable now?

[G-Mo77]

Dale Thomas had just been filled out for the season with an ankle injury. Does that change whether we should go after him or does it mean he's more attainable now?

He won't be any more attainable with the cash the expansion clubs have. They'll throw silly money at him regardless.

[Maddog37]

The thing about Dal is that he has had a couple of quiet games but he is one of only a couple of creative players we have and he is getting smashed about and sat on heavily by tagging defenders.

That is normally not an issue and you would cop it on the chin but he is not a 25 year player with 100 games under his belt and struggles to cope at times. The fact we seem to think he is a CHF and kick it on his head alot is not a massive positive for him or the team either.

I must admit I have been critical of him myself at times but the kid genuinely has a go. The goal he missed on the weekend is the type of thing that makes supporters turn a little bitter in their views too.

[Happy Days]

... and because he is one of the leaders in the AFL for pressure acts as a kid who is only in his 3rd year of senior AFL football.

Dahlhaus is being unfairly maligned because he's actually shown some output before at AFL level and is having a down patch, which *might* have something to do with the entire side being terrible.

If he had shown glimpses of his ability instead of actual consistent output we would all be going on about how he should have games pumped into him.

[The Doctor]

Dahlhaus is being unfairly maligned because he's actually shown some output before at AFL level and is having a down patch, which *might* have something to do with the entire side being terrible.

If he had shown glimpses of his ability instead of actual consistent output we would all be going on about how he should have games pumped into him.

I don't think he is being maligned. The discussion was about whether he is over rated or not. I think everyone here admires the way he plays.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Dale Thomas had just been filled out for the season with an ankle injury. Does that change whether we should go after him or does it mean he's more attainable now?

I think it definitely makes him more attainable.

The odds of him staying at Collingwood would have to be lower than they were prior to this news. Collingwood aren't going to have a heap of room to move in the cap, and after 1 poor season and 1 injury ruined season, it's hard to see them offering him anywhere near what other clubs will.

Whether we can attain him ourselves, I don't know, but there's cause for optimism and we should be right into him.

[LostDoggy]

Anyone know of Sam Blease's contract status?

I've liked him since his junior days and feel he's not getting a fair go at Melbourne.

Has speed, good skills, courage. We should put the feelers out

[Topdog]

I don't think he is being maligned. The discussion was about whether he is over rated or not. I think everyone here admires the way he plays.

Yeah I wrote my initial statement in a rush but I think he has had a very poor season. Absolutely love the way he goes about his footy and teams need someone like him.

I feel he is over rated because despite IMO being so poor this season I keep hearing that he has been fantastic. He is an exciting and creative young talent who hopefully continues to improve.

[AndrewP6]

Anyone know of Sam Blease's contract status?

I've liked him since his junior days and feel he's not getting a fair go at Melbourne.

Has speed, good skills, courage. We should put the feelers out

Signed a two year deal last year.

[LostDoggy]

cheers

[immortalmike]

Dalhaus is a good player as we all know. But he is over rated. He is rated that way because of his looks but mainly because so much of our list is crap.

If we are to be a force, Dal would be in the bottom 6 of our 22.

I do think that some supporters have selective amnesia. He had numbers comparable to All Australian Cyril 'delicious' Rioli last year in a much worse side. He's having a poor year and certainly seems to be struggling with the extra attention, I hear that there's usually a phenomenon called "second year blues" that might fit here despite this being his third year.
Also don't forget that Gary Ablett Jr was an underperforming forward pocket in his early twenties, never write off a kid with potential.

[Mofra]

I feel he is over rated because despite IMO being so poor this season I keep hearing that he has been fantastic. He is an exciting and creative young talent who hopefully continues to improve.
Who else in season 3 is being tagged in our side?

Teams put alot of work into him because he is so good at what he does. There's a reason opposition stoppers don't run to Howard at the opening bounce.

[SlimPickens]

Wonder if Jack Watts would be on our radar. 21 years old, elite junior talent and out of contract.

Not sure where I sit on recruiting him but wonder if we would consider him?

[Maddog37]

Melbourne would want too much for him and his trajectory is too similar to J Grant for mine.

[The Underdog]

Wonder if Jack Watts would be on our radar. 21 years old, elite junior talent and out of contract.

Not sure where I sit on recruiting him but wonder if we would consider him?


Melbourne would want too much for him and his trajectory is too similar to J Grant for mine.

I was actually wondering recently, who says no in a Grant for Watts trade?
Watts still has a little more currency but Grant has arguably shown more at senior level.

[soupman]

Melbourne says no every time

[Greystache]

I was actually wondering recently, who says no in a Grant for Watts trade?
Watts still has a little more currency but Grant has arguably shown more at senior level.

Watts is playing seniors (mostly anyway), Grant is playing Williamstown reserves at the moment. There's question marks over whether Watts will ever kick on and become a gun AFL player, but there's question marks over whether Grant will even make it as an AFL player at all. Grant hasn't shown any improvement in 3 years.

A more comparable swap would be Grant for Cale Morton (picks 4 & 5) in the 2007 draft, they're at about the same point in their careers. Morton was traded to West Coast last year for pick 88.

[BRG1993]

James Frawley, Dale Thomas, Aaron Black, Daniel Rich, Matthew Leuenberger

[Mofra]

James Frawley, Dale Thomas, Aaron Black, Daniel Rich, Matthew Leuenberger
Would love any of them - isn't Frawley contracted for one more year though?

[BRG1993]

Would love any of them - isn't Frawley contracted for one more year though?

Contracts don't mean a thing in the AFL anymore mate I mean look at Brian Lake

[Bulldog Revolution]

Personally I dont have a great interest in Thomas

Id be all for targeting:

Dion Prestia, Trent McKenzie, Sam Docherty and Pat Karnezis

[Throughandthrough]

Johncock from the Crows wont be at the Crows next year #justsaying #nope

[BulldogBelle]

Media reports that clubs are hunting Jack Watts

Depending on how much he wants, I wouldnt be opposed to looking at him - given Morris' days are numered - Talia and Roberts arent proven at AFL level, Markovic and Austin are only backups, Young is better suited to a 3rd tall and Roughead is better suited to playing deeper

[bornadog]

Johncock from the Crows wont be at the Crows next year #justsaying #nope

Isn't he passed his best?

[Mofra]

Contracts don't mean a thing in the AFL anymore mate I mean look at Brian Lake
Lake is at the tail end of his career and went chasing a premiership.
Completely different scenario to trying to get a 24 year old Frawley across to another bottom four side.

[Mofra]

Isn't he passed his best?
He's finished.

[OLD SCRAGGer]

[QUOTE=Greystache;322468]Watts is playing seniors (mostly anyway), Grant is playing Williamstown reserves at the moment. There's question marks over whether Watts will ever kick on and become a gun AFL player, but there's question marks over whether Grant will even make it as an AFL player at all. Grant hasn't shown any improvement in 3 years.

Last night at the Inside the Kennel dinner, Chris Maple said Jarrod has had Hamstring issues and because we can ONLY have 11 Bulldog listed players in Williamstown seniors is why Jarrod has been in the Development team. Personally, I WOULDN'T get rid of Grant just yet!! I still believe he has a bit to offer us.

[LostDoggy]

I think it's time to start looking at players Gold Coast and GWS have been developing for 2-3 years. They won't be able to keep them all.

Dion Prestia, Brendan Matera, Devon Smith - Would happily take any of these

[bornadog]

I think it's time to start looking at players Gold Coast and GWS have been developing for 2-3 years. They won't be able to keep them all.

Dion Prestia, Brendan Matera, Devon Smith - Would happily take any of these

Yes look at the Victorians and entice them back

[KT31]

Yes look at the Victorians and entice them back

May be harder than thought to entice the GWS kids, Sheedy and his team have seemed to have been quite smart by recruiting kids who played together and are familiar with each other.

[Mantis]

From the Herald Sun:

Taylor Adams (GWS)

The Giants can afford to trade-off a gun midfielder and Adams is looming as the one. Has been the Giants' best onballer over the past fortnight. Richmond, Essendon and Western Bulldogs all big fans in his draft year.

[bulldogtragic]

AFL360 last night made the call that we shold trade Cooney. If we did, what could we realistically get in return?

[neddie]

Isn't he passed his best?

Yes,and we have enough like him on our team at present.

[Mantis]

AFL360 last night made the call that we shold trade Cooney. If we did, what could we realistically get in return?

If he can keep up his form in the 2nd half of the year and has no knee issues I would think he is worth a pick b/w 10 -15... We need to keep some experience & quality on the list come season's end so I would hope he would stay, but if the carrot is dangled he might jump ship.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

From the Herald Sun:

Taylor Adams (GWS)

The Giants can afford to trade-off a gun midfielder and Adams is looming as the one. Has been the Giants' best onballer over the past fortnight. Richmond, Essendon and Western Bulldogs all big fans in his draft year.

He'd be a great pick up, but not sure I agree GWS would trade him off. Not only is he an ever improving player with a fairly well rounded game, he's very close to a number of the players up there, including Smith.

[LostDoggy]

AFL360 last night made the call that we shold trade Cooney. If we did, what could we realistically get in return?

I think this is a realistic call and a realistic pick would be somewhere between 20-30, depening on whether he was a target of a GWS/GC at one end or a preimership contender. The knee and the trade for a lucrative contract would be major sticking point for any team in dealing with us.

He's a restricted free agent as far as i'm aware. We can match his offer from another club, but he can still walk. Regarding Adams, possibly a swap of second round draft picks for Cooney. Being a Brownlow medalist and in his prime (regardless of his knee problem which i don't believe the AFL would take into compensation, we may shoot ourselves in the foot as Mantis says, we'd get a very high DP if there was no player exchange.

[bulldogtragic]

I think this is a realistic call and a realistic pick would be somewhere between 20-30, depening on whether he was a target of a GWS/GC at one end or a preimership contender. The knee and the trade for a lucrative contract would be major sticking point for any team in dealing with us.

He's a restricted free agent as far as i'm aware. We can match his offer from another club, but he can still walk. Regarding Adams, possibly a swap of second round draft picks for Cooney. Being a Brownlow medalist and in his prime (regardless of his knee problem which i don't believe the AFL would take into compensation, we may shoot ourselves in the foot as Mantis says, we'd get a very high DP if there was no player exchange.
Would you take a punt on 20-30 in the ND? Would we prefer to upgrade our pick like we Did with Lake.

Say CArlton upgrading from pick 20 to pick 10
Say Sydney upgrading from pick 20 to pick 14
Say North upgrading from pick 20 to pick 11

Would any of this be realistic in your estimation? Would you then consider an on trade to poach a GWS or GC gun who wants back to Vic??

[Bulldog Joe]

AFL360 last night made the call that we shold trade Cooney. If we did, what could we realistically get in return?

Another uninformed suggestion from a media outlet.

Cooney is out of contract and a free agent. We resign and keep him or he goes where he wants. Trade is NOT an option as we have no hold on him.

[bulldogtragic]

Another uninformed suggestion from a media outlet.

Cooney is out of contract and a free agent. We resign and keep him or he goes where he wants. Trade is NOT an option as we have no hold on him.
Forgive my ignorance BJ. But what's to stop Cooney from selecting a new club and demanding that he new club organise a trade. He may want elsewhere, but if he wanted to make sure the WB got compo what would prohibit it.

[lemmon]

Forgive my ignorance BJ. But what's to stop Cooney from selecting a new club and demanding that he new club organise a trade. He may want elsewhere, but if he wanted to make sure the WB got compo what would prohibit it.

We could just dump him into the draft. If we match an offer he doesn't get a choice of where he plays, he either stays or goes into the draft

[LostDoggy]

BT, i believe BJ is correct. Lakey was still contracted. Looking them up, none of the RF Agents involved any form of trade.

We'd have to get a late/end of first round pick for Cooney if we don't pick up any other RSA's (based on the Goddard deal)

[Greystache]

Another uninformed suggestion from a media outlet.

Cooney is out of contract and a free agent. We resign and keep him or he goes where he wants. Trade is NOT an option as we have no hold on him.

Trade is certainly an option. If he nominates a club he wants to go to we can facilitate a trade with them on agreeable terms, if they don't offer those terms they can offer him a salary as a restricted free agent and we have the option to match that offer and retain him. If he's not happy with either of those options he can go into the draft and try his luck

Trade is the most likely option if he wants to leave, it's either that or another clubs offers him significant overs and we chose not to match it which is probably unlikely.

[bulldogtragic]

BT, i believe BJ is correct. Lakey was still contracted. Looking them up, none of the RF Agents involved any form of trade.

We'd have to get a late/end of first round pick for Cooney if we don't pick up any other RSA's (based on the Goddard deal)
Fair enough, it's a bit sad if a player wants to make sure his old club gets decent compo that doesn't happen. That being the case, I'm not sure Cooney would fetch a first rounder, sadly, unless he has a great back end of the season.

[wimberga]

From memory i think F/S nomination is before trade week but....

If it isnt, what would be the odds of something like the following.

North trade us; their first rounder and 3rd rounder
We trade North; Cooney and our 3rd rounder

They gain Cooney, and an upgrade on their 3rd rounder
We gain an additional first rounder but a slight downgrade on our 3rd rounder, plus we also lose Cooney.

North could then simply utilise there first pick in the draft (in the second round after trading us there first) on there F/S recruit McDonald, but gain an extra pick in the middle of the Draft.

[bulldogtragic]

From memory i think F/S nomination is before trade week but....

If it isnt, what would be the odds of something like the following.

North trade us; their first rounder and 3rd rounder
We trade North; Cooney and our 3rd rounder

They gain Cooney, and an upgrade on their 3rd rounder
We gain an additional first rounder but a slight downgrade on our 3rd rounder, plus we also lose Cooney.

North could then simply utilise there first pick in the draft (in the second round after trading us there first) on there F/S recruit McDonald, but gain an extra pick in the middle of the Draft.
I like the effort Wimberga, but you were right at the beginning, it's before trade week.

[Maddog37]

I don't want to lose Cooney. He is my kids favorite player.

[LostDoggy]

I don't want to lose Cooney. He is my kids favorite player.

Prefer not to lose him either, but reality is the club and it's vision come first, otherwise your kids, and mine may go through the same heartache.

Lake was traded when he still had value and the initial evidence is that we got reasonable compensation. Whether Coons fits into the same mindset of being open to leave I don't know, but he's not going to win a GF with us, and highly unlikely to play another final.

The remainder of this season aside, if other clubs are willing, then I think he offers more value in the long term away from us.

[Bulldog Joe]

Trade is certainly an option. If he nominates a club he wants to go to we can facilitate a trade with them on agreeable terms, if they don't offer those terms they can offer him a salary as a restricted free agent and we have the option to match that offer and retain him. If he's not happy with either of those options he can go into the draft and try his luck

Trade is the most likely option if he wants to leave, it's either that or another clubs offers him significant overs and we chose not to match it which is probably unlikely.

My understanding is that Cooney is able to field offers and if he chooses an offer. we are able to match that offer to retain him. I guess that means that we could effectively trade with his chosen side.

I would think that extremely unlikely. The power in this scenario is not with us.

[Greystache]

My understanding is that Cooney is able to field offers and if he chooses an offer. we are able to match that offer to retain him. I guess that means that we could effectively trade with his chosen side.

I would think that extremely unlikely. The power in this scenario is not with us.

I guess it comes down to how you interpret the situation, but I view it that we have more power than any potential other club. We have the ability to match any other club's offer and render their offer redundant. We make it clear to any club wanting to pursue Cooney that if they don't want us to block any offer made to him then they will trade with us under terms which are mutually agreeable. Other wise he can reject our contract and try his luck in the draft.

[JohnGentStand]

I dont care if we are better of trading him. I want him to stay. I want him to want to stay. I want everyone who wears our jumper to love this club. i may be out of touch with reality, but IMHO we are a better club if he stays.

[bornadog]

I dont care if we are better of trading him. I want him to stay. I want him to want to stay. I want everyone who wears our jumper to love this club. i may be out of touch with reality, but IMHO we are a better club if he stays.

Yes I agree, he is a club champion and should be a one club player.

[Throughandthrough]

Hypothetical. What if Bob Murphy professed his life lasting love for the dogs, promised to barrack for us for ever after, but said he only has two years at best left and desperately wants a chance to win a flag

He assures us that the dogs are in great hands, the young ones are great and he cant wait to watch us in 4 years time. He also said that he's holding back the development of a similar player at the dogs.


And then requests a transfer to collingwood

[AndrewP6]

Hypothetical. What if Bob Murphy professed his life lasting love for the dogs, promised to barrack for us for ever after, but said he only has two years at best left and desperately wants a chance to win a flag

He assures us that the dogs are in great hands, the young ones are great and he cant wait to watch us in 4 years time. He also said that he's holding back the development of a similar player at the dogs.


And then requests a transfer to collingwood

I'd think the sky had fallen.

[AndrewP6]

I dont care if we are better of trading him. I want him to stay. I want him to want to stay. I want everyone who wears our jumper to love this club. i may be out of touch with reality, but IMHO we are a better club if he stays.

Ditto.

[Remi Moses]

You're going to see more players leave in F/A to chase a flag.
The sports changed whether we like it or not.
As they said on 360 if Adam says he wants to play in a flag the club should make the logical decision and grant him his wish.

[LongWait]

You're going to see more players leave in F/A to chase a flag.
The sports changed whether we like it or not.
As they said on 360 if Adam says he wants to play in a flag the club should make the logical decision and grant him his wish.

As long as we receive compensation I would agree, however, if the player agent calls to abandon free agency compensation are heeded by the AFL, then clubs will not be so magnanimous.

[w3design]

Haven't both Coons and Bob stated earlier this year that being 'one team players' is their preferred option?

[bulldogtragic]

Haven't both Coons and Bob stated earlier this year that being 'one team players' is their preferred option?
So has Buddy F. :)

[GVGjr]

We need to target a key position player like the Swans Sam Reid.

[bulldogtragic]

We need to target a key position player like the Swans Sam Reid.
20 more games and the Swans Sam Reid would have been our Sam Reid. Damn.

[bornadog]

We need to target a key position player like the Swans Sam Reid.

Later on this season, with Tippett at the Swans, Sam may feel he is not getting a go, or given the key forward role, so he may think about returning to Victoria. I think he would fit in beautifully at the dogs.

[Rocco Jones]

Jack Watts?

[LostDoggy]

Jack Watts?

Can't see Jack choosing to move from miseryville to its neighbour strugglingtown. Would be a good get though and macca might be the right coach to reinstill his confidence.

Would take Sam Reid for sure but only at the right price. Wouldn't give an early first rounder for him (under 10) and it would probably need that to convince the swans to give him up. Good player.

[always right]

Don't rate Sam Reid highly....seems to be a cameo player doing the odd spectacular thing. He also looks to have serious flaws in his kicking. He's not unlike Liam Jones in some respects actually.

[GVGjr]

Don't rate Sam Reid highly....seems to be a cameo player doing the odd spectacular thing. He also looks to have serious flaws in his kicking. He's not unlike Liam Jones in some respects actually.

We won't get him but he could be used as a defender.

[ledge]

Jack Watts interesting, he is the right age has talent to burn but i get the feeling he is soft. In saying that the culture he is at isn't good and going by how Macca interviews players if we get him he isn't soft at all.

[ratsmac]

Don't rate Sam Reid highly....seems to be a cameo player doing the odd spectacular thing. He also looks to have serious flaws in his kicking. He's not unlike Liam Jones in some respects actually.

My thoughts exactly. So much potential that could amount to nothing.

[bulldogtragic]

Jack Watts interesting, he is the right age has talent to burn but i get the feeling he is soft. In saying that the culture he is at isn't good and going by how Macca interviews players if we get him he isn't soft at all.
What would you do with Watts. His success as a junior was as a marking forward, but now seems a spare parts player down back. Have we got enough players like him down back? Could we move him forward perhaps??

[Greystache]

What would you do with Watts. His success as a junior was as a marking forward, but now seems a spare parts player down back. Have we got enough players like him down back? Could we move him forward perhaps??

Even if he never becomes that key position competitive beast he was drafted to be he could still be a very good rebounding third tall defender. I wouldn't however want to sell the farm to acquire that skill set.

[bulldogtragic]

Even if he never becomes that key position competitive beast he was drafted to be he could still be a very good rebounding third tall defender. I wouldn't however want to sell the farm to acquire that skill set.
Taken at pick one and five years development. They might want the farm to let him go.

[Greystache]

Taken at pick one and five years development. They might want the farm to let him go.

I suspect they would and I can somewhat understand that, so I can't see us getting him. As I said I'm happy to get him but not at huge cost.

[bulldogtragic]

I suspect they would and I can somewhat understand that, so I can't see us getting him. As I said I'm happy to get him but not at huge cost.
Would Melbourne entertain Higgins for Watts. Or would we????

Missy has experience, creativity and strong leadership and he is in his prime. Sure his injured a bit, but he has something Something Melbourne are craving.

Or this me overestimating our talent as we are proned to do fom time to time.

[Greystache]

Would Melbourne entertain Higgins for Watts. Or would we????

Missy has experience, creativity and strong leadership and he is in his prime. Sure his injured a bit, but he has something Something Melbourne are craving.

Or this me overestimating our talent as we are proned to do fom time to time.

I actually doubt either team would do that deal funnily enough. Higgins is probably higher rated internally than on the open market and Watts still has some currency.

[bulldogtragic]

I actually doubt either team would do that deal funnily enough. Higgins is probably higher rated internally than on the open market and Watts still has some currency.
I tend to agree. Consider last years draft as similar to this year. And then make some parallels...

So based on last year and this years similar selections, Would you trade an unproven talent in Hrovat for the known quantity in Watts. That's essentially where I see it lying. I'd need convincing to part with the potential talent of a Hrovat type selection for Watts.

[wimberga]

Really not a fan of Watts. As some other posters have alluded to, his game oozes softness and that is something Bmac has as a non-negotiable.

If its going to be anyone, it should be a young gun from GC or GWS like Prestia or Adams, or it should be a marquee player like D.Thomas.

[stefoid]

Prestia? good fit

[azabob]

20 more games and the Swans Sam Reid would have been our Sam Reid. Damn.

I think we lost out bigger with Dan Hanebery.

[chef]

I think we lost out bigger with Dan Hanebery.

Not when you include Sam's brother as well.

[azabob]

Not when you include Sam's brother as well.

Yeah, good point.

[The Underdog]

20 more games and the Swans Sam Reid would have been our Sam Reid. Damn.

Or we could have used one of the 2 picks we used on Howard or Tutt (15 & 31) to select him in the draft before the Swans picked him at 38. We had the chance to select him, we just didn't.

[GVGjr]

I think we could target West Coasts Mitch Brown.

He's big, strong and versatile and importantly he wants to come back to Victoria.
The Saints tried last year and will try again this year but our selling point should be that we will improve quicker than the Saints.

While we would probably prefer a gun midfielder maybe we could target two players.

[bornadog]

I think we could target West Coasts Mitch Brown.

He's big, strong and versatile and importantly he wants to come back to Victoria.
The Saints tried last year and will try again this year but our selling point should be that we will improve quicker than the Saints.

While we would probably prefer a gun midfielder maybe we could target two players.

Did we try to get him last year? I think he could be a good fit for us.

[bulldogtragic]

I think we could target West Coasts Mitch Brown.

He's big, strong and versatile and importantly he wants to come back to Victoria.
The Saints tried last year and will try again this year but our selling point should be that we will improve quicker than the Saints.

While we would probably prefer a gun midfielder maybe we could target two players.
I'd take him in a heartbeat. But the going rate would be high with competition to get him. What would we offer to get the deal done?

[w3design]

Prestia? good fit

Didn't Prestia go through TAC with Wal and Libba Jnr.? Perhaps that might sway him towards considering the Doggies as an option. If so, those three would already have a good understanding for playing together.

[wimberga]

This would certainly hurt our chances:

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-05-26/prestia-set-to-resign

[bulldogtragic]

This would certainly hurt our chances:

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-05-26/prestia-set-to-resign
Ok, I'll have Aaron Hall. Heaps of posies and five goals VS the hawks.

[Bulldog Revolution]

I think we could target West Coasts Mitch Brown.

He's big, strong and versatile and importantly he wants to come back to Victoria.
The Saints tried last year and will try again this year but our selling point should be that we will improve quicker than the Saints.

While we would probably prefer a gun midfielder maybe we could target two players.

Wouldn't Geelongs Mitch Brown be a better option? with Hawkins, Taylor, Pods, Lonergan they dont have room for him.

Can play either end, develop as a key defender who can go forward - thoughts?

[bulldogtragic]

Wouldn't Geelongs Mitch Brown be a better option? with Hawkins, Taylor, Pods, Lonergan they dont have room for him.

Can play either end, develop as a key defender who can go forward - thoughts?
Don't forget Vardy too. I'd have him too.

[GVGjr]

Wouldn't Geelongs Mitch Brown be a better option? with Hawkins, Taylor, Pods, Lonergan they dont have room for him.

Can play either end, develop as a key defender who can go forward - thoughts?

He looks OK but can't stay on the park. He might be worth a look at but I think we want a more established player.

[always right]

I think we could target West Coasts Mitch Brown.

He's big, strong and versatile and ......crap. Importantly he wants to come back to Victoria.
The Saints tried last year and will try again this year but our selling point should be that we will improve quicker than the Saints.

While we would probably prefer a gun midfielder maybe we could target two players.

Edited for accuracy.

[LostDoggy]

Edited for accuracy.

That made me giggle....

[LostDoggy]

Anyone for young Daniel Talia? Dogs connection, might be convinced with his brother here. I'd happily give a 15-25 pick for him and that would creat solid options down back.

[bornadog]

Anyone for young Daniel Talia? Dogs connection, might be convinced with his brother here. I'd happily give a 15-25 pick for him and that would creat solid options down back.

yes please

[Sedat]

Anyone for young Daniel Talia? Dogs connection, might be convinced with his brother here. I'd happily give a 15-25 pick for him and that would creat solid options down back.
He is the best full back in the competition and will be marshalling the Adelaide defensive 50 for the next 10 years. Not going anywhere, and certainly not for a late 1st round/early 2nd round pick. I do agree that he would be absolutely perfect for us - hopefully Michael continues to progress well.

[F'scary]

I am not in favour of going after big name, big cheque players a la romantic night club singer, Buddy Franklin. It is just not Western Bulldogs. Leave it for the Collingwoods & the Demetriou love children. We'll breed our own, take in strays, rely on loyalty over money and still beat them all one day.

[chef]

Anyone for young Daniel Talia? Dogs connection, might be convinced with his brother here. I'd happily give a 15-25 pick for him and that would creat solid options down back.

I doubt they would accept our first pick(likely to be 3) for him.

[LostDoggy]

Edited for accuracy.

Must say i agree with the edit.

If we can get him for cheap then sure, but what has he actually done in he's career to date? Apart from getting injured.

[bulldogtragic]

I am not in favour of going after big name, big cheque players a la romantic night club singer, Buddy Franklin. It is just not Western Bulldogs. Leave it for the Collingwoods & the Demetriou love children. We'll breed our own, take in strays, rely on loyalty over money and still beat them all one day.
I'm with you, but it seems Gordon isn't.

[bornadog]

One for Greystache :D

Shunned young gun Dayle Garlett says he is a changed man and ready for AFL football (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/shunned-young-gun-dayle-garlett-says-he-is-a-changed-man-and-ready-for-afl-football/story-e6frf9jf-1226652508331)

Will he get his chance at the end of this year.

[stefoid]

Skill wise a perfect fit. But then again, so is Jarryd Grant. 3rd round or latter, you could take a punt?

[bulldogtragic]

One for Greystache :D

Shunned young gun Dayle Garlett says he is a changed man and ready for AFL football (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/shunned-young-gun-dayle-garlett-says-he-is-a-changed-man-and-ready-for-afl-football/story-e6frf9jf-1226652508331)

Will he get his chance at the end of this year.
Lets see how his season progresses and what MJP has to say. It's a long year.

[lemmon]

I am not in favour of going after big name, big cheque players a la romantic night club singer, Buddy Franklin. It is just not Western Bulldogs. Leave it for the Collingwoods & the Demetriou love children. We'll breed our own, take in strays, rely on loyalty over money and still beat them all one day.

This is a competition, romanticism doesn't win premiership's, good players do. We are in the rare position of having space in the bank and holes to fill, I would be highly disappointed if we weren't heavily involved come player exchange time

[Remi Moses]

If this kids right( the reports are true)
He'll go earlier than a third round.

[Remi Moses]

This is a competition, romanticism doesn't win premiership's, good players do. We are in the rare position of having space in the bank and holes to fill, I would be highly disappointed if we weren't heavily involved come player exchange time

Yep, agree. We've had a future capt and a key running defender get knocked off.
Time for pay back

[jeemak]

Skill wise a perfect fit. But then again, so is Jarryd Grant. 3rd round or latter, you could take a punt?


If this kids right( the reports are true)
He'll go earlier than a third round.

If he matures off the field and keeps progressing on it, he'll be worth well more than a 3rd round pick.

One of the most talented players in last years draft isn't going to get less talented this time around, particularly after settling for a year amongst a senior environment.

[Sedat]

Adelaide are stock-piling a very strong and deep midfield - perhaps someone like a Bernie Vince might get squeezed out and be considered expendable by them? He'll be 28yo at the start of next season - possibly too old - but he's a beautiful long kick, can run all day and can carry the ball through the corridor, so his skills set would compliment what we already have in our midfield. Hasn't been the world's greatest or most dedicated trainer in the past so might count against him. Wouldn't be too expensive to secure and has real talent.

[Twodogs]

I havent seen a lot of Adelaide so I dont know much about Vince. From your description he sonds like an Eagleton type-would that be a fair comparison Sedat?

[Mofra]

I am not in favour of going after big name, big cheque players a la romantic night club singer, Buddy Franklin. It is just not Western Bulldogs. Leave it for the Collingwoods & the Demetriou love children. We'll breed our own, take in strays, rely on loyalty over money and still beat them all one day.
If we can by some miracle bring someone in by FA, then I say yes.

I'd rather keep our picks - our core side will be drafted, not traded.

[F'scary]

Yep, agree. We've had a future capt and a key running defender get knocked off.
Time for pay back

Fair comment.

[Bumper Bulldogs]

What about a new coach?

I think the midfield will come good and the forwards....well I have more hope than others. I think a really hardnut back pocket type with a super classy 1/2 back flanker (Gilbee at his peak)

[Remi Moses]

Gotta say the caning McCartney's getting on Social Media annoys me .
It dies down when we win, but bobs up when we get rolled.
Hard to give a definitive opinion, but really calls for a new coach is ridiculous.

[chef]

Gumbleton for me.

[bulldogtragic]

Gumbleton for me.
What do we trade?
Then what do we pay?

[Remi Moses]

Gumbleton for me.

Me to. The only problem is dealing with them.
Easier to negotiate with the Taliban.

[chef]

What do we trade?
Then what do we pay?

He's out of contract again at the end of this year, so he shouldn't be that hard to get if he really wants to join the dogs. If Essendon want the earth then we can look at the PSD.

The big question is is he eligible for FA yet?

[chef]

Me to. The only problem is dealing with them.
Easier to negotiate with the Taliban.

Hopefully McCartney can make it smoother.

[Twodogs]

Me to. The only problem is dealing with them.
Easier to negotiate with the Taliban.


At least the Talibn have nicer uniforms than those awful grey and red things Essendon wear.

[Go_Dogs]

Could Luke Thompson at the Crows be another option for a key defender? Seems a bit out of favour at the moment, but can definitely play and is still young.

[bulldogtragic]

Could Luke Thompson at the Crows be another option for a key defender? Seems a bit out of favour at the moment, but can definitely play and is still young.
Where would you see him in our pecking order. Best 18, 22, 30 or depth like Marko or Austin. I don't know much about him.

[Go_Dogs]

Where would you see him in our pecking order. Best 18, 22, 30 or depth like Marko or Austin. I don't know much about him.

He could play as our second key defender at the moment. He's behind Rutten and Talia at the Crows, which is pretty stiff competition.

A lot depends on how we see certain players developing, but Roughead and Talia are the only two who seem locked in for defensive roles. Young isn't really a key defender, Fletcher may play defence but may not, Williams seems likely to play more minutes forward. Morris will be finished in the next couple of years.

To me Thompson is the sort of guy that could be acquired at a reasonable price and add a lot immediately and longer term.

[bulldogtragic]

He could play as our second key defender at the moment. He's behind Rutten and Talia at the Crows, which is pretty stiff competition.

A lot depends on how we see certain players developing, but Roughead and Talia are the only two who seem locked in for defensive roles. Young isn't really a key defender, Fletcher may play defence but may not, Williams seems likely to play more minutes forward. Morris will be finished in the next couple of years.

To me Thompson is the sort of guy that could be acquired at a reasonable price and add a lot immediately and longer term.
Sounds ok, but what's a reasonable price?

[Go_Dogs]

Sounds ok, but what's a reasonable price?

Possibly similar to what we paid for Young. I'm not really sure though. Wouldn't command anything higher than a 3rd round selection for mine.

[bulldogtragic]

Possibly similar to what we paid for Young. I'm not really sure though. Wouldn't command anything higher than a 3rd round selection for mine.
Just reading the Adelaide website. 194cm, 88kg. Tall enough for KP, but plays 3rd tall. Taken as a rookie and 14 games in two and a half years. Probably 5th in line at Adelaide.

If he's third tall type, we have Roughie, Dale, Talia, Young, Roberts, Williams, Markovic, Austin.

Where does he fit in?

[bulldogtragic]

Just reading the Adelaide website. 194cm, 88kg. Tall enough for KP, but plays 3rd tall. Taken as a rookie and 14 games in two and a half years. Probably 5th in line at Adelaide.

If he's third tall type, we have Roughie, Dale, Talia, Young, Roberts, Williams, Markovic, Austin.

Where does he fit in?
When watching Libba and Wallis at Calder, I loved Luke Mitchell as a forward who can really kick goals. Went to Carlton, at pick 42 in the 2010 draft.

Now he's 198cm, 100kg. Had shoulder problems and only managed one game. So he's back in the pack at Carlton, maybe 5th in line.

Could bolster our forward stocks and allow for Roberts to concentrate down back?? Wouldn't cost the earth.

Anyone else rate him when you were watching Calder a few years ago.

[lemmon]

When watching Libba and Wallis at Calder, I loved Luke Mitchell as a forward who can really kick goals. Went to Carlton, at pick 42 in the 2010 draft.

Now he's 198cm, 100kg. Had shoulder problems and only managed one game. So he's back in the pack at Carlton, maybe 5th in line.

Could bolster our forward stocks and allow for Roberts to concentrate down back?? Wouldn't cost the earth.

Anyone else rate him when you were watching Calder a few years ago.

How does he move?

[Happy Days]

When watching Libba and Wallis at Calder, I loved Luke Mitchell as a forward who can really kick goals. Went to Carlton, at pick 42 in the 2010 draft.

Now he's 198cm, 100kg. Had shoulder problems and only managed one game. So he's back in the pack at Carlton, maybe 5th in line.

Could bolster our forward stocks and allow for Roberts to concentrate down back?? Wouldn't cost the earth.

Anyone else rate him when you were watching Calder a few years ago.

Oh yeah.

People on here (and elsewhere I guess) had him locked into a top 10 pick but got ruined by injuries in his draft year, looked sensational the year before.

Have to put a serious question mark over him if he can't get a game at the team with maybe the biggest need for a KPF in the league though.

[Go_Dogs]

Just reading the Adelaide website. 194cm, 88kg.
Where does he fit in?

I certainly see him as being able to develop as a key defender. Played some key roles when they had injuries late last year. Andy Otten is more of a third tall on their list for mine.