McCartneys 2nd season

[GVGjr]

How does everyone see the development of the Bulldogs in McCartney's 2nd season?

The positives I see are:

- The development of the younger playing group in general.
- The acquisitions of Young, Lower and Stevens
- The rapid development of Roughead and Johannisen
- The management of the older brigade

The questions marks for me are:

- Our skill level still isn't where it needs to be
- A further balancing of the list is required
- Players like Cordy, Howard, Tutt, Grant and Wood are stagnating
- The development of the playing list hasn't necessarily resulted in improved on field results.

Overall I see a lot of improvement for the team and I'm confident we are heading in the right way. The 2nd half of the season will have more than it's share of challenges given we play some strong sides but at the mid way point of the season, and despite only having 3 wins, I think we are vastly improved from 2012.

Thoughts?

[Hotdog60]

I think I have a lot of faith in Macca and I am in the camp that thinks Rocket is one of the best coaches I have seen in my lifetime.
I would like the club to give Macca the extra couple of years on his contract to see if the rookie senior coach has what it takes to bring a team from scratch to a team playing regular finals.

As supporters we need to look at what might be and keep the faith.

Wouldn't be a great story that the dogs gave him a chance to show what he could do and ends up like a Sheedy for the club and give multiple cups.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

How does everyone see the development of the Bulldogs in McCartney's 2nd season?

The positives I see are:

- The development of the younger playing group in general.
- The acquisitions of Young, Lower and Stevens
- The rapid development of Roughead and Johannisen
- The management of the older brigade

The questions marks for me are:

- Our skill level still isn't where it needs to be
- A further balancing of the list is required
- Players like Cordy, Howard, Tutt, Grant and Wood are stagnating
- The development of the playing list hasn't necessarily resulted in improved on field results.

Overall I see a lot of improvement for the team and I'm confident we are heading in the right way. The 2nd half of the season will have more than it's share of challenges given we play some strong sides but at the mid way point of the season, and despite only having 3 wins, I think we are vastly improved from 2012.

Thoughts?
This is a good summation. I wonder whether the players under question you refer to were right choices in the first place. Our recruiting this year has been the best for some years suggesting that BMcC has played a critical role in this area. The big weakness is still an experienced key forward hence the attempts to secure Dawes and Gumbleton and now Crameri. The list still needs more depth and I can see 7-8 players again being moved on at season's end.

[Doc26]

Agree with your assessment GVGJr.

Fom what I hear and see the playing group do seem to have bought into Brendan's mantra and in general are staying the course for longer throughout the four quarters with the fadeouts from 2012 being less stark.

There was great resolve and heart shown in the 2nd half of last week's game against Port in very trying conditions without two of our key playmakers in Boyd and Cooney and losing Williams early. Koby's desire to push through in distress was also a positive sign of fight in the Bulldog.

The decision to back Brett Goodes was somewhat bold but is an affirmed positive given where our defensive stocks are at. Similarly, I was doubtful on what Young could bring but from what I've seen thus far he has slotted in to our back 6 very well.

There has been much discussed on the Lake deal of 2012 and whether fortuitous or not I'm very bullish on what Hrovat will bring to the Club in the coming years. This deal is a win win for both Clubs based on where each are at and for mine highlights the lost opportunity we had with what was on the table for Josh Hill a few seasons back.

There were question marks on Howard, Grant, Tutt, Veszpremi etc stocks well before Brendan inherited them so I'm not going to judge him harshly on whether he can get anymore from them. He can however be assessed on how long he's prepared to keep them from giving others a chance at it.

How much can be attributed to the coach is difficult to qualify but either way we are seeing an extraordinary season from both Will and Ryan, both in All Australian contention, who have obviously bought into the vision.

I am fully supportive of the foundation that is being built under Brendan's reign. I also endorse the 'good person first' philosophy and from some experience he does, with others, practice what he preaches. A small example of this coming only yesterday towards my uncle, who has only weeks/months left to live, who had just flown over from his home base in Perth to be with his family, dined for lunch with my father and his family at The Pound cafe yesterday. It was of no trouble for Brendan, Liam Picken, Big Will and Bobby to take some much appreciated quality time out to share stories / experiences and a few laughs with my extended family. The game has no doubt become more ruthless and cut throat as the business side has taken over. I hope some room is still left for instilling positive values and helping to make 'good people'. Hawthorn through all its success during the mid 70s and 80s became proudly known as the family club which served them very well.

Whether the necessary skill development and game plan to suit comes to the fore only time will tell. For me, Brendan has built up enough credit to give him decent time to address the next phase of our development.

[Remi Moses]

How does everyone see the development of the Bulldogs in McCartney's 2nd season?

The positives I see are:

- The development of the younger playing group in general.
- The acquisitions of Young, Lower and Stevens
- The rapid development of Roughead and Johannisen
- The management of the older brigade

The questions marks for me are:

- Our skill level still isn't where it needs to be
- A further balancing of the list is required
- Players like Cordy, Howard, Tutt, Grant and Wood are stagnating
- The development of the playing list hasn't necessarily resulted in improved on field results.

Overall I see a lot of improvement for the team and I'm confident we are heading in the right way. The 2nd half of the season will have more than it's share of challenges given we play some strong sides but at the mid way point of the season, and despite only having 3 wins, I think we are vastly improved from 2012.

Thoughts?

Excellent summation . I think even the harshest critic of McCartney would have to concede he was handed a list that was comparable to some European economies.

[Go_Dogs]

Great assessment GVGjr, agree with the lot.

A challenge will be seeing how much more we can get out of Cordy, Wood and Howard in the second half of the season and once the former 2 return from injury. I have high hopes for Cordy and Wood developing into solid options for us and being consistent members of our best 22. I'm not yet sold on Howard but we have 3 months to see how much improvement he can make.

I really like the way our game style is developing. If we continue to improve our defensive transition, our spread and our skill level we should become a very hard side to play against. Our contested work and our clearance work is at a high level and I have faith that our inside players will develop their games to the level required to compete in cut throat finals and not be bullied by opposition sides.

We need to continue to develop Talia and once he's a consistent performer I think our backline KPP look set for the next 5-8 years.

Adding another key forward who can make an immediate impact over the off-season will go a long way to improving our depth and options in that area of the ground. I think when/if we have a fit Dickson and Higgins it really adds to our class and goal scoring ability and I'm hopeful both of those players can become integral parts of our side over the next 5 years.

We need to continue to select 'good people' - those who will buy in to the message and do everything in their power to ensure they get the most out of themselves and are prepared to play for the team.

It's going to be very interesting to see how the club plays out the contract situation with Macca, but I'd love to see the club show some faith and reward him with a one year extension if we show improvement over the balance of the season. Give the man a reward and back him in so he can focus on his longer term vision without needing to make short term decisions with respect to list management.

All in all, more time is needed but I like the direction we're moving in.

[GVGjr]

We haven't had a good run with injuries either which needs to be considered.

- Our captain Matthew Boyd has missed a large chunk of the season
- Our most experienced key position player in Tom Williams could only manage two games (well one and a bit)
- Our leading goal kicker from 2012 in Tory Dickson has only managed 3 games
- Shaun Higgins had his best preseason in recent years only manged 3 games before a season ending injury

I know injuries happen to all sides but these were telling ones that have impacted the season so far. The likes of Young, Lower and Stevens have certainly helped to fill the void.

[lemmon]

Great summation. For me the big danger was that during the run of losses he would lose the players, the last few weeks shows he obviously hasn't. Look at the way the Dees play, the lack of fight, its obvious they don't want to play for Neeld, that they have no faith in his message. To fight it out the last few weeks shows the fight in the list and the belief in our style of play.

[bulldogtragic]

I don't want o unnecessarily be objectionable, but this is a little optimistic.

[LostDoggy]

I think with another good turnover of the list at season's end, we can start putting decent games together and climbing the ladder again as early as next season.

Players on my chopping block so far:
Grant — the time to shit or get off the pot has passed. Get off the pot.
Howard — Hasn't shown nearly enough to remain.
Tommy Williams — It breaks my heart, I love Tommy, but they've got to make the hard call and let him go. Do everything they can to look after him, but time to move on.
Veszpremi — Gone
Austin — Gone
Cross — Again, breaks the heart, love him to death, but if he's out of the side and out of future plans, time to retire him.
Gia — Serving us well at the moment, and I'm no Gia-basher, but as a club we hang onto players too long and Gia is in his last season for mine.

[Mofra]

Players on my chopping block so far:
Grant — the time to shit or get off the pot has passed. Get off the pot.
Howard — Hasn't shown nearly enough to remain.
Tommy Williams — It breaks my heart, I love Tommy, but they've got to make the hard call and let him go. Do everything they can to look after him, but time to move on.
Veszpremi — Gone
Austin — Gone
Cross — Again, breaks the heart, love him to death, but if he's out of the side and out of future plans, time to retire him.
Gia — Serving us well at the moment, and I'm no Gia-basher, but as a club we hang onto players too long and Gia is in his last season for mine.
Sadly, that's pretty much it. Austin may get a game or two given absences of Roberts & Cordy.
Even if we keep Williams, he cannot be in our long term plans - body just doesn't hold up.

Rookies will be an interesting one - obviously Goodes stays elevated, I have no faith in Redpath at all, Greenwood performed well late last year so that will be the hard call.

That's 7 players off the main list with one permanent elevation (Goodes). Sounds about right, perhaps roll the dice with one or two mature agers late in the draft.

[LostDoggy]

Sadly, that's pretty much it. Austin may get a game or two given absences of Roberts & Cordy.
Even if we keep Williams, he cannot be in our long term plans - body just doesn't hold up.

Rookies will be an interesting one - obviously Goodes stays elevated, I have no faith in Redpath at all, Greenwood performed well late last year so that will be the hard call.

That's 7 players off the main list with one permanent elevation (Goodes). Sounds about right, perhaps roll the dice with one or two mature agers late in the draft.

Yah, time to get as ruthless as possible without doing a Melbourne

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Surely Tutt is delisted.

I'll be absolutely amazed if he's on our list next year.

[Dry Rot]

Excellent summation . I think even the harshest critic of McCartney would have to concede he was handed a list that was comparable to some European economies.

That's the difficulty with assessing him fairly. We still have holes all over the park NB no tall forwards.

[GVGjr]

That's the difficulty with assessing him fairly. We still have holes all over the park NB no tall forwards.

We have moved on a lot of players as well. You simply can't move on 12 players in one season either.
I'm sure Jason McCartney has a good handle on the list management requirements and will work towards addressing the many gaps.

[Mofra]

Surely Tutt is delisted.

I'll be absolutely amazed if he's on our list next year.
I think Tutt offers us more than anyone on BASs' list and I would give him another year. If he is ever played as a midfielder (his best position IMO) he may just take his chance.

[LostDoggy]

We have moved on a lot of players as well. You simply can't move on 12 players in one season either.
I'm sure Jason McCartney has a good handle on the list management requirements and will work towards addressing the many gaps.

He seems to be really good, glad we have him.

[LostDoggy]

How does everyone see the development of the Bulldogs in McCartney's 2nd season?

The positives I see are:

- The development of the younger playing group in general.
- The acquisitions of Young, Lower and Stevens
- The rapid development of Roughead and Johannisen
- The management of the older brigade

The questions marks for me are:

- Our skill level still isn't where it needs to be
- A further balancing of the list is required
- Players like Cordy, Howard, Tutt, Grant and Wood are stagnating
- The development of the playing list hasn't necessarily resulted in improved on field results.

Overall I see a lot of improvement for the team and I'm confident we are heading in the right way. The 2nd half of the season will have more than it's share of challenges given we play some strong sides but at the mid way point of the season, and despite only having 3 wins, I think we are vastly improved from 2012.

Thoughts?

The first three 'question marks' are better posed to the other McCartney and, more particularly, to his predecessor. As for 'improved on-field results', I can see them; they were especially evident on Sunday when we played our style of footy against a supposedly better team and were just one power forward shy of a famous victory. If the scoreboard is the only measure of success then we are making inroads there, too. I haven't checked, but I'd be interested in comparing our percentage this year to last - it's another good indicator of how well a team is performing. The list will get another big shake up this year and our average age will go down again - with a corresponding dip in performance early next year - but we will have fewer underperformers and the beginnings of greater depth. McCartney's second season is also the (revitalised) club's second season, in my mind. It is the first time in living memory that we have had an actual plan and the people with the bottle to execute it properly. I agree, GVGjr, that the second half of the season will be interesting, and I'm strapping myself in for a hell of a ride; other teams might start to fear our ability to shape their seasons. PS Michael Talia will be a much better player than his brother. He knows when to go and when to stay. Is it the Scarlo influence?

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

The first three 'question marks' are better posed to the other McCartney and, more particularly, to his predecessor. As for 'improved on-field results', I can see them; they were especially evident on Sunday when we played our style of footy against a supposedly better team and were just one power forward shy of a famous victory. If the scoreboard is the only measure of success then we are making inroads there, too. I haven't checked, but I'd be interested in comparing our percentage this year to last - it's another good indicator of how well a team is performing. The list will get another big shake up this year and our average age will go down again - with a corresponding dip in performance early next year - but we will have fewer underperformers and the beginnings of greater depth. McCartney's second season is also the (revitalised) club's second season, in my mind. It is the first time in living memory that we have had an actual plan and the people with the bottle to execute it properly. I agree, GVGjr, that the second half of the season will be interesting, and I'm strapping myself in for a hell of a ride; other teams might start to fear our ability to shape their seasons. PS Michael Talia will be a much better player than his brother. He knows when to go and when to stay. Is it the Scarlo influence?

We still lack a quality forward such as a Cloke, Franklin or Hawkins. Our current best forwards are Murphy and Gia who are both in the veteran stage of their careers. A lack of pace in the midfield and up forward is still a problem apart from Griffen who stands out like a beacon. A further delisting of 7-8 players at the end of the year becomes necessary to continue to improve the depth of talent required, to move out of the bottom half of the ladder. BMcC has done a good job with the talent at his disposal, but we are still a long way off the pace. Talia did play his best game for the club against Collingwood and you would hope that Fletcher Roberts will likewise become another quality key positional player.

[Webby]

It is the first time in living memory that we have had an actual plan and the people with the bottle to execute it properly.

I'm both pleased and relieved to see that someone else recognises this.. Well done!
The Dogs didn't win a final between '61 and '85.. 24 years between drinks. That's enough to give any club insecurities.. In the 25 years after '85, we made seven prelims. That's despite never really setting ourselves a long term plan. That should give us confidence. Since the introduction of the salary cap and draft in the late 80's, the landscape has changed... Sure, it took ten or so years to purge cheats like Carlton and Essendon, however the system now gives us a chance. The first club to cotton onto the virtues of 'going young' with your list in a draft and cap system was North circa 1988. They became "the team of the 90's"....vomit!

Brisbane obviously went young in the late 90's. They won a spoon in '98. Geelong went young in 2001 and spent 3 long years between 5th last and 2nd last.

After a dozen or so years of mediocrity, Hawthorn said enough's enough. Funnily enough the draft brought their glory years to an end in the early '90's, but they still had the confidence of a good club to say "bugger it, let's go young!" They realised that in a draft/cap system they needed to plan for 4-5 years ahead. They moved on Hay, Thompson, Everitt etc as they were deemed too old to be able to play in a HFC premiership window. They traded Croad - because the price was right - and drafted young talent. Finals and prelims aren't enough at Hawthorn.

The result? They were the 2nd worst performed team in the AFL between 04 & 06... (BTW, the young Geelong team were the 3rd worst performed team in the AFL between 01 & 03)... These clubs won the 07, 08 & 09 flags between them. Point is, when the Geelongs and Hawthorns are finishing bottom with young lists, they're 'building'... When the Doggies are struggling with a young list, we're 'imploding'... We need to start thinking of ourselves as a good club - no different to a Geelong of 10 years ago... Because we're certainly not a Melbourne!! We need to get out of that 1970s mindset. We're a good, honest club with a good football culture that's building something here. Despite the PR BS that Smorgon fed us, the day Chris Grant and co appointed McCartney was the day the club said "bugger it, let's go young!" McCartney was clearly brought in because he does have the bottle to execute, and stick to, a plan. He may not be in the chair in 5 years time, but he's the right man for the immediate future.

I applaud the club's approach, because 57 years is way too long and prelims aren't enough anymore.

[Go_Dogs]

Great post Webby, thanks.

[always right]

Quality post Webby.

[whythelongface]

Bloody good post Webby.

Agree that if you don't have a long term plan then you are never going to achieve your true potential. McCartney not only appears to have a vision and a long term plan, but he also looks like he has the ability to implement change and deliver on his plan. Time will tell whether or not his plan is a success but from what I have seen thus far we are certainly heading in the right direction.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

I'm both pleased and relieved to see that someone else recognises this.. Well done!
The Dogs didn't win a final between '61 and '85.. 24 years between drinks. That's enough to give any club insecurities.. In the 25 years after '85, we made seven prelims. That's despite never really setting ourselves a long term plan. That should give us confidence. Since the introduction of the salary cap and draft in the late 80's, the landscape has changed... Sure, it took ten or so years to purge cheats like Carlton and Essendon, however the system now gives us a chance. The first club to cotton onto the virtues of 'going young' with your list in a draft and cap system was North circa 1988. They became "the team of the 90's"....vomit!

Brisbane obviously went young in the late 90's. They won a spoon in '98. Geelong went young in 2001 and spent 3 long years between 5th last and 2nd last.

After a dozen or so years of mediocrity, Hawthorn said enough's enough. Funnily enough the draft brought their glory years to an end in the early '90's, but they still had the confidence of a good club to say "bugger it, let's go young!" They realised that in a draft/cap system they needed to plan for 4-5 years ahead. They moved on Hay, Thompson, Everitt etc as they were deemed too old to be able to play in a HFC premiership window. They traded Croad - because the price was right - and drafted young talent. Finals and prelims aren't enough at Hawthorn.

The result? They were the 2nd worst performed team in the AFL between 04 & 06... (BTW, the young Geelong team were the 3rd worst performed team in the AFL between 01 & 03)... These clubs won the 07, 08 & 09 flags between them. Point is, when the Geelongs and Hawthorns are finishing bottom with young lists, they're 'building'... When the Doggies are struggling with a young list, we're 'imploding'... We need to start thinking of ourselves as a good club - no different to a Geelong of 10 years ago... Because we're certainly not a Melbourne!! We need to get out of that 1970s mindset. We're a good, honest club with a good football culture that's building something here. Despite the PR BS that Smorgon fed us, the day Chris Grant and co appointed McCartney was the day the club said "bugger it, let's go young!" McCartney was clearly brought in because he does have the bottle to execute, and stick to, a plan. He may not be in the chair in 5 years time, but he's the right man for the immediate future.

I applaud the club's approach, because 57 years is way too long and prelims aren't enough anymore.

This is a very good response. You cannot beat good management and good coaching and this is where Geelong, Hawthorn and the Sydney Swans have stolen a march on the opposition. Club Presidents in Frank Costa, Ian Dicker and Richard Colless, respectively have led the way in bringing quality leadership into their organisations.

[F'scary]

Firstly, I wanted Eade to be retained and thought it was a bad move not giving him a new contract for 2-3 years.

But I am very impressed with the cohesion at our club under Macca and the recruiting. I have a feeling that if we just stick at it for another season, suddenly it will all click on field and we will be a top 4 side again.

[comrade]

I agree with much that you write, Webby.

Unfortunately for us, Geelong and Hawthorn didn't have the expansion teams to battle against on their rise up the ladder. The AFL has essentially given us the finger and given the new teams premierships on a silver platter whilst we are forced to pick up the scraps at the draft.

A decade ago it was easier to rebuild, not so much any more. And to think Melbourne might get more priority picks this year.

Thanks, Vlad.