Match Committee- Round 15 vs GWS

[Greystache]

If you were on the match committee what changes would you make for next Saturday's game against GWS in Canberra?

As usual a brief explanation for your changes would be good.

[GVGjr]

This should be an interesting discussion

[LostDoggy]

will wait a few days before any attempt is made at being constructive

[bulldogtragic]

will wait a few days before any attempt is made at being constructive
Yep. I've tried twice to post, but I just can't seem to get my thoughts together. But wholesale changes I would have thought.

[bornadog]

Lets see who stands up tomorrow at Willi.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Dahlhaus should be first on the chopping block, I am stunned he's lasted this long.

Jones getting subbed could be a sign -- has been very poor for a while now. Might depend on how Roberts performs, though.

I don't see a spot for Wallis in the side. I'd like to see us drop Boyd but it won't happen.

OUT: Dahlhaus, Jones, Wallis
IN: Howard, Roberts, Goodes

[bornadog]

Dahlhaus should be first on the chopping block, I am stunned he's lasted this long.

Jones getting subbed could be a sign -- has been very poor for a while now. Might depend on how Roberts performs, though.

I don't see a spot for Wallis in the side. I'd like to see us drop Boyd but it won't happen.

OUT: Dahlhaus, Jones, Wallis
IN: Howard, Roberts, Goodes

Howard may be injured? He isnot listed to play anywhere tomorrow unless he was emergency tonight.

[soupman]

I might start this with who I think shouldnt be dropped.

The obvious: Griffen, Libba, Murphy, Macrae, Gia, Smith, Roughead, Minson, Morris, JJ, Talia

The ones I have to justify:
Stringer: As one of the few forwards who looks dangerous with the ball in hand he keeps his spot. Needs to do more without it though.
Jones: Was not the worst tonight. Was crucified by poor delivery, but worked his arse off. *
Hrovat: Not a player we should drop unless its for confidence reasons.
Hunter: Didnt do anything but didnt get very long. Happy to leave him in.
Cordy: Struggled but still a player Id much rather have in the side than the alternatives. Like Jones really suffered from terrible delivery.



Leaving a pool of: Wallis, Boyd, Dahlhaus, Cooney, Dickson, Lower, which tbh doesnt seem big enough.

*I would be prepared to consider dropping Jones however if there was someone good (ie. not markovic) who could replace him and it would be for confidence reasons as much as anything.

[comrade]

Please give Cooney a long spell, then bring him back towards the end of the year and hopefully bump up his trade value.

Injuries have robbed him but now he plays for a paycheck and nothing else.

[bornadog]

.
Hrovat: Not a player we should drop unless its for confidence reasons.

Hrovat played a very good second half picking up 14 disposals and worked very hard, I wouldn't be dropping him, we need games into these kids. The way we are going we will be finishing 17th anyway, so lets get games into him, Hunter, Stringer, Macrae.

[westbulldog]

Outs : Morris Wallis
Ins : Young/Roberts Hunter starts on the ground.

[comrade]

Outs : Morris Wallis
Ins : Young/Roberts Hunter starts on the ground.

Taking away our bravest and most experienced defender would not help us, in my opinion.

[westbulldog]

Taking away our bravest and most experienced defender would not help us, in my opinion.

No issue at all with bravest nor experienced but a real issue with poor form, that is undeniable.

[comrade]

No issue at all with bravest nor experienced but a real issue with poor form, that is undeniable.

I think the leadership value he offers beyond pure man on man defensive work is more than any replacement can reproduce.

He was made to look ordinary in a few marking contests, especially against Dawes but the size difference was massive. Perhaps we can no longer expect him to fight above his weight range anymore and need to find more suitable match ups.

I agree that Roberts needs a taste soon.

[westbulldog]

against Dawes...and Watts

[boydogs]

Out: Cordy, Dahlhaus, Jones
In: Stevens, Young, Grant

[bornadog]

against Dawes...and Watts

Conceding huge height against those.

[bornadog]

Out: Cordy, Dahlhaus, Jones
In: Stevens, Young, Grant

Who goes second ruck Grant?

[SlimPickens]

Out: Cordy, Dahlhaus, Jones
In: Stevens, Young, Grant

Can people stop calling for grant. He will not play a senior game again!

[bulldogtragic]

As a pet, I'm sure BMac will recall Marko. Don't believe me, bookmark this post. :(

[westbulldog]

Conceding huge height against those.

3cm against dawes.

Dispute this fact then - with 15.13 to go in the third quarter MELBOURNE, yes Melbourne, were DOUBLE our score. AFL is of course a professional sport and if you are losing, you make changes, however unpalatable.

[comrade]

3cm against dawes.

Dispute this fact then - with 15.13 to go in the third quarter MELBOURNE, yes Melbourne, were DOUBLE our score. AFL is of course a professional sport and if you are losing, you make changes, however unpalatable.

Morris was not a big factor in our loss.

[westbulldog]

Morris was not a big factor in our loss.

apologies, I must have watched the wrong first quarter when the tone of the match was set.

[comrade]

apologies, I must have watched the wrong first quarter when the tone of the match was set.

I'd point the finger at the midfield and forwards for the lack of defensive pressure which allowed Melbourne to have 20 inside 50s in a quarter. Any defender will struggle under such persistent forward entry, particularly when giving away plenty of height.

Also, no need to be sarcastic. It's ok to disagree with someone, it's not ok to act inappropriately.

[boydogs]

Who goes second ruck Grant?

Roughead forward & second ruck. He's going well back there but we need him up forward more, Young can cover with Morris & Talia. Cooney also needs to go forward

Stevens Grant Cooney
Smith Stringer Roughead


Can people stop calling for grant. He will not play a senior game again!

The thread states "If you were on the match committee what changes would you make for next Saturday's game against GWS in Canberra?"

[GVGjr]

The thread states "If you were on the match committee what changes would you make for next Saturday's game against GWS in Canberra?"

Can I ask why do you want to gift Grant a chance given he hasn't done that much to earn it?

[bulldogtragic]

Roughead forward & second ruck. He's going well back there but we need him up forward more, Young can cover with Morris & Talia. Cooney also needs to go forward

Stevens Jones Cooney
Smith Stringer Roughead



The thread states "If you were on the match committee what changes would you make for next Saturday's game against GWS in Canberra?"
Why all this Roughead forward stuff. I'm sick of it. Lets get it straight.

Roughy was an elite junior tap ruckman who could play forward and kick goals. And often looks out of place down back. Why wouldn't we keep persisting with the FB experiment? After all it's the decision of a rookie coach and rookie coaches like Neeld don't get quesioned or even sacked.

[comrade]

Why all this Roughead forward stuff. I'm sick of it. Lets get it straight.

Roughy was an elite junior tap ruckman who could play forward and kick goals. And often looks out of place down back. Why wouldn't we keep persisting with the FB experiment? After all it's the decision of a rookie coach and rookie coaches like Neeld don't get quesioned or even sacked.

Roughy has done a very good job at FB on multiple occasions this year, you can't deny that. His last few weeks haven't been great but even the mighty Brian Harris took a long time to develop.

It's not like we have a plethora of young key defensive players waiting in the wings and this 'experiment' is stunting their development.

[bulldogtragic]

Roughy has done a very good job at FB on multiple occasions this year, you can't deny that. His last few weeks haven't been great but even the mighty Brian Harris took a long time to develop.

It's not like we have a plethora of young key defensive players waiting in the wings and this 'experiment' is stunting their development.
We need a ruckman who can play KPF. We had one, but thought better of this. Even Carey played well at CHB, but I would have him at CHF everyday of the week.

[GVGjr]

We need a ruckman who can play KPF. We had one, but thought better of this. Even Carey played well at CHB, but I would have him at CHF everyday of the week.

The move was made because we couldn't play 3 talls with reduced bench. Cordy was seen as the as the combination Ruckman and Forward so Roughead was moved to the back line.

Who takes over playing against the tall forwards if we move Roughead?

[LostDoggy]

In: Stevens, Young

Out: Clay (love the kid but went missing too much and butchered it when he had it), Hrovat (just a bit off the pace, has gotten caught because of indecisiveness too much in the last couple of weeks)

[G-Mo77]

Who takes over playing against the tall forwards if we move Roughead?

In the ideal world Fletch Roberts would have been selected quite a few times already this season. Tom Williams is another in that ideal world.

I had Cordy as one of my In's this week but we just looked so slow up forward. Dickson and Gia also doesn't help our cause in terms of speed. Melbourne walked it out of there most of the night.

I'm at a loss right now with my ins and outs.

[bulldogtragic]

The move was made because we couldn't play 3 talls with reduced bench. Cordy was seen as the as the combination Ruckman and Forward so Roughead was moved to the back line.

Who takes over playing against the tall forwards if we move Roughead?
This is the problem with the list. Mako or Austin come to mind. Williams when fit is perfect!

The issue may be Roughy may save two opposition goals per game, as opposed to the others. So I can see the reasoning. But as a forward he should get 2 goals or more per week. So it's a nil all draw. But with forward Wilbur gets a chop out, Roughy is a great second option and Wilbur offers another tall target.

In all, I'd prefer to lose some defence as we are bleeding there anyway. Our issue is attack, so depriving ourselves a good target is not helpful. Getting another ruck adds another unanticipated to the team which it does not have. At the end of the year it will be easier to get a Tayte Pears kind of defender to fill the void than a KPF at the other end.

It was worth a go. Cordy, Jones and Grant are not the answer as a forward team. He was a proven junior, so let him play to his natural strengths. I'm sure his cousin would be a handy KPB too, but that's a waste. I'm not convinced we are not making that mistake currently.

[LostDoggy]

It was worth a go. Cordy, Jones and Grant are not the answer as a forward team. He was a proven junior, so let him play to his natural strengths. I'm sure his cousin would be a handy KPB too, but that's a waste. I'm not convinced we are not making that mistake currently.

Don't really agree, Roughead struggled in the ruck and was a shocking kick at goal butchering often simple chances. He isn't a bad field kick a good mark. I'd also back Scarlett in who believes Roughead will become a 200 game top line full back.

Having said that our lack of tall marking forwards is chronic. I am not against shifting Roughy forward like the Weagles bloke (Hunter?) sometimes.

Realistically we should be really hard into Gumbleton. Also should be looking at a player not getting a go at Essendon, Nick O'Brien. Big tank can take a grab, kept Wallis to 14 in the VFL a few weeks ago.

Above all else we need to pick up quality ball users and runners, its chicken and egg is Jones really poor, does he not have enough support or is he getting slaughtered by poor delivery?

[bulldogtragic]

Don't really agree, Roughead struggled in the ruck and was a shocking kick at goal butchering often simple chances. He isn't a bad field kick a good mark. I'd also back Scarlett in who believes Roughead will become a 200 game top line full back.

Having said that our lack of tall marking forwards is chronic. I am not against shifting Roughy forward like the Weagles bloke (Hunter?) sometimes.

Realistically we should be really hard into Gumbleton. Also should be looking at a player not getting a go at Essendon, Nick O'Brien. Big tank can take a grab, kept Wallis to 14 in the VFL a few weeks ago.

Above all else we need to pick up quality ball users and runners, its chicken and egg is Jones really poor, does he not have enough support or is he getting slaughtered by poor delivery?
The current logic is pretty flawed though.

Marko, natural back man - play forward
Austin, natural back man - play forward
Williams, natural back man - play forward
Roughy, natural ruck/fwd - play back

Why the reinvention of the wheel?

[LostDoggy]

Can I ask why do you want to gift Grant a chance given he hasn't done that much to earn it?

Sorry GVGjr, I have to slightly disagree with your post. He has done NOTHING to earn it. With the team playing the way it is, he is still sitting at Willy with his head up his arse.

He's obviously been told he's toast in October.

[LostDoggy]

The current logic is pretty flawed though.

Marko, natural back man - play forward
Austin, natural back man - play forward
Williams, natural back man - play forward
Roughy, natural ruck/fwd - play back

Why the reinvention of the wheel?

Sorry for the double post.

We're reinventing the wheel because we're in a rebuild. That's what you do — rebuild, reinvent, reconfigure.

[comrade]

The current logic is pretty flawed though.

Marko, natural back man - play forward
Austin, natural back man - play forward
Williams, natural back man - play forward
Roughy, natural ruck/fwd - play back

Why the reinvention of the wheel?

Roughy is a better key defender than Marko and Austin, and at the same stage of their careers, he's better than Williams too. Playing them (Austin/Marko) up forward was for structural reasons. They essentially played the Cordy role. They didn't do it well because, well, um, they're not very good footballers.

I'd also disagree that Williams is a natural defender. Yeah, he was played there from day 1 but didn't exactly dominate. He seems to know what he's doing up forward, he leads to good spots and can take a good grab.

It's not reinventing the wheel. There are no wheels to reinvent. We're simply playing a kid in a tough position in which no one else on our list is suitable and he's doing a good job. Yeah, he could also be a decent forward though nothing I've seen suggests he'll be a world beater but then we'd only be robbing Peter to pay Paul.

What we need is to draft a genuine key forward that can also ruck. Tom Boyd is looking pretty good, eh?

But we also need elite midfielders. Can we have a priority pick, Vlad?

[GVGjr]

In the ideal world Fletch Roberts would have been selected quite a few times already this season. Tom Williams is another in that ideal world.

I had Cordy as one of my In's this week but we just looked so slow up forward. Dickson and Gia also doesn't help our cause in terms of speed. Melbourne walked it out of there most of the night.

I'm at a loss right now with my ins and outs.
Bulldogtragic will be disappointed. Roberts was a forward in the TAC :)

[boydogs]

Can I ask why do you want to gift Grant a chance given he hasn't done that much to earn it?

Has Cordy? Markovic? Austin? Best of a bad bunch.


Why all this Roughead forward stuff. I'm sick of it. Lets get it straight.

Roughy was an elite junior tap ruckman who could play forward and kick goals. And often looks out of place down back. Why wouldn't we keep persisting with the FB experiment? After all it's the decision of a rookie coach and rookie coaches like Neeld don't get quesioned or even sacked.

It was a good idea when Williams & Cordy were our forwardline options. Now Williams is injured & Cordy isn't performing, we need to switch gears.

[F'scary]

I might start this with who I think shouldnt be dropped.

The obvious: Griffen, Libba, Murphy, Macrae, Gia, Smith, Roughead, Minson, Morris, JJ, Talia

The ones I have to justify:
Stringer: As one of the few forwards who looks dangerous with the ball in hand he keeps his spot. Needs to do more without it though.
Jones: Was not the worst tonight. Was crucified by poor delivery, but worked his arse off. *
Hrovat: Not a player we should drop unless its for confidence reasons.
Hunter: Didnt do anything but didnt get very long. Happy to leave him in.
Cordy: Struggled but still a player Id much rather have in the side than the alternatives. Like Jones really suffered from terrible delivery.



Leaving a pool of: Wallis, Boyd, Dahlhaus, Cooney, Dickson, Lower, which tbh doesnt seem big enough.

*I would be prepared to consider dropping Jones however if there was someone good (ie. not markovic) who could replace him and it would be for confidence reasons as much as anything.

I think you nailed it but I would add Cordy to the list.

[westbulldog]

I'd point the finger at the midfield and forwards for the lack of defensive pressure which allowed Melbourne to have 20 inside 50s in a quarter. Any defender will struggle under such persistent forward entry, particularly when giving away plenty of height.

Also, no need to be sarcastic. It's ok to disagree with someone, it's not ok to act inappropriately.

Every bulldogs supporter was offended yesterday. What are your answers to the debacle ?

[Rocco Jones]

The current logic is pretty flawed though.

Marko, natural back man - play forward
Austin, natural back man - play forward
Williams, natural back man - play forward
Roughy, natural ruck/fwd - play back

Why the reinvention of the wheel?

Roughy played as a key-defender in underage footy before a growth spurt saw him move to the ruck.

Williams is a natural rugby player. Seeing him forward and back, I would say he seems more natural up forward.

Austin and Markovic are simply not up to it. We need/needed a 2nd ruck and it was worth rolling the dice. I just would never play them again.

[Rocco Jones]

The tough thing about selection at the moment is that there is such a glut of non-performers and there are a heap of guys who (should) have a black mark through their name.

Assuming Dahl, Smith and Jones etc display the right attitude on the track, I would keep playing them. I think going back to Willy to regain confidence is a bit of a furphy. First of all, being dropped could obviously do the direct opposite but more importantly, I think it is a bit of an easy way out. Dahl and Joens especially need to tough it out and find form where it matters.

[GVGjr]

The current logic is pretty flawed though.

Marko, natural back man - play forward
Austin, natural back man - play forward
Williams, natural back man - play forward
Roughy, natural ruck/fwd - play back

Why the reinvention of the wheel?

Markovic was a key forward at the TAC level.

[bulldogtragic]

Markovic was a key forward at the TAC level.
Was a VFL captain down back too.

[GVGjr]

Was a VFL captain down back too.

Versatile player then

[bulldogtragic]

Versatile player then
Yep. Swing man. Perhaps the dons want to upgrade Carlisle or Hurley.

[GVGjr]

Yep. Swing man. Perhaps the dons want to upgrade Carlisle or Hurley.

Quite a bite.

Your logic of natural defender and natural forward doesn't always ring true. A lot of junior players are moved to positions in the AFL that aren't necessarily where they played the majority of their football.

[LostDoggy]

Quite a bite.

Your logic of natural defender and natural forward doesn't always ring true. A lot of junior players are moved to positions in the AFL that aren't necessarily where they played the majority of their football.

Brian Harris played forward in juniors, like Markovic became a defender once in the system.
What is Brian Lake's natural position?

[kruder]

Can I ask why do you want to gift Grant a chance given he hasn't done that much to earn it?

We have been Gifting Jones and Cordy games for years so why not Jones?

[LostDoggy]

We have been Gifting Jones and Cordy games for years so why not Jones?

Jones and Cordy at least play well at vfl level.
Grant hasn't done that. Last week Marko's spot was up for grabs, and Cordy was better than Grant in the vfl. Pretty simple.
Plus Grant is a tall crumber not a key position player.

[Sedat]

A lot of junior players are moved to positions in the AFL that aren't necessarily where they played the majority of their football.
Mick Martyn kicked 100 goals at FF in North's U19's before becoming one of the greatest FB's of all time.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Roughy has done a very good job at FB on multiple occasions this year, you can't deny that. His last few weeks haven't been great but even the mighty Brian Harris took a long time to develop.

It's not like we have a plethora of young key defensive players waiting in the wings and this 'experiment' is stunting their development.

We also do not have a quality big forward and that is why we were 6 goals to 15 at 3/4 time. Cordy Jones and Stringer were simply not in the game. Cordy and Jones had little if any impact in the ruck. Roughead's marking alone up forward and around the ground would have far more impact. Roughead has been very serviceable down back but if you cannot kick goals we will continue to struggle. The fact that Gia has been our best forward in the past 4-5 games doesn't say much for the others.

[Greystache]

Mick Martyn kicked 100 goals at FF in North's U19's before becoming one of the greatest FB's of all time.

Cameron Ling was a full forward, and Tim Walsh was a good footballer.

[Ozza]

Staggering discussion about Roughead. Not sure if anyone noticed - but he is our best defender these days.

In regards to Dahlhaus - yes, on form there is a case to drop him. But because of his pace - we need him. We went with too slow a forward line as it was on the weekend - I'm not in favour of making it slower by dropping a quick bloke. The effort is there...he just chases tail all game at the moment and isn't getting the footy. Hopefully a good week v GWS will get him going. Pretty sure Dahl is only 20 years old - still learning the game and subject to the inconsistency all young players face - expecially once they start attract the oppositions best stopper.

Out: Lower, Cordy, Smith or Wallis
In: Goodes, Young, Stevens

Dickson lucky - but Macca indicated he 'needed the run' - which would indicate he'll play.

[bornadog]

Staggering discussion about Roughead. Not sure if anyone noticed - but he is our best defender these days.
Out: Lower, Cordy, Smith or Wallis
In: Goodes, Young, Stevens

Dickson lucky - but Macca indicated he 'needed the run' - which would indicate he'll play.

Roughead is not our best defender, Morris still holds that privilege. I think Roughead has a long way to go. I have been less than impressed on the way he has played this year. Everytime the ball comes into the backline, I shudder what is going to happen. Richmonds Vickery looked like a champion last week, Roughead just doesn't know how to play the talls. His eyes move from the ball to the man and then he is all lost at sea. I am sure he will learn as he is still young.

I doubt very much Cordy will be dropped.

I think Goodes, Stevens, Tutt, Addison and Grant (Sorry Slimpickens) all have a show in coming in after the weekend.

[Greystache]

Roughead is not our best defender, Morris still holds that privilege. I think Roughead has a long way to go. I have been less than impressed on the way he has played this year. Everytime the ball comes into the backline, I shudder what is going to happen. Richmonds Vickery looked like a champion last week, Roughead just doesn't know how to play the talls. His eyes move from the ball to the man and then he is all lost at sea. I am sure he will learn as he is still young.

I doubt very much Cordy will be dropped.

I think Goodes, Stevens, Tutt, Addison and Grant (Sorry Slimpickens) all have a show in coming in after the weekend.

I think Roughead has been better than Morris this season, and Morris has been a concern in recent weeks.

[Ozza]

Roughead is not our best defender, Morris still holds that privilege. I think Roughead has a long way to go. I have been less than impressed on the way he has played this year. Everytime the ball comes into the backline, I shudder what is going to happen. Richmonds Vickery looked like a champion last week, Roughead just doesn't know how to play the talls. His eyes move from the ball to the man and then he is all lost at sea. I am sure he will learn as he is still young.

I doubt very much Cordy will be dropped.

I think Goodes, Stevens, Tutt, Addison and Grant (Sorry Slimpickens) all have a show in coming in after the weekend.

I have to strongly disagree with your assessment on Roughead. I love Dale Morris, but (possibly due to his broken leg/recovery) he isn't as balanced and sturdy in one on one contests anymore.

Roughead is the player that effects the crucial spoils, who marks opposition kicks, reads the ball in the air well and kicks the ball better than Morris.

Personally, I think Roughead is on the way to being one of the very very good tall defenders in the competition, and considering how much ball hits our defensive 50 at the moment - he has stood up grandly. Particularly for a (guessing) 40 game player.

If you haven't noticed - I am a big fan - and thats only since he went to defence.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I think Roughead has been better than Morris this season, and Morris has been a concern in recent weeks.

I'd almost be inclined to say that Young has been our best defender prior to injury, but I agree with you on Morris. He's had a couple of good games, but he's probably had more average to poor than what we're used to.

I do think Morris' days of playing on bigger opponents are over -- needs to play on the smalls and mediums.

[Mantis]

In: Picken, Stevens, Young, Grant, Tutt

Out: Lower, Wallis, Smith, Dickson, Stringer

[Sedat]

I think Roughead has been better than Morris this season, and Morris has been a concern in recent weeks.
Agreed. Morris has played more 'bad' games (relative term) this season that he did over the course of his entire career up to his broken leg. Roughy has definitely been the better defender this season. Actually I've been really impressed by Talia as a pure defender - he looks the most completely natural lock-down defender on talls and small that I've seen since Morris came from nowhere in 2005.

[always right]

Agreed. Morris has played more 'bad' games (relative term) this season that he did over the course of his entire career up to his broken leg. Roughy has definitely been the better defender this season. Actually I've been really impressed by Talia as a pure defender - he looks the most completely natural lock-down defender on talls and small that I've seen since Morris came from nowhere in 2005.

Agree.....he and JJ have been real positives this year in defence.

[Ozza]

We have definitely missed the flexibility Tom Young gives us. Looking forward to getting him back in.

[soupman]

Roughead's marking alone up forward and around the ground would have far more impact.

Rougheads ability to mark would have been of no benefit in the first half because our midfield almost never put it to our forwards advantage.

Besides, Roughead has never shown he is more than the occassional solid marking target up forward. This year he has finally emerged as a best 22 player, and thats in defence. Jones has undoubtably shown more as a forward target than Roughead.

[Greystache]

Agreed. Morris has played more 'bad' games (relative term) this season that he did over the course of his entire career up to his broken leg. Roughy has definitely been the better defender this season. Actually I've been really impressed by Talia as a pure defender - he looks the most completely natural lock-down defender on talls and small that I've seen since Morris came from nowhere in 2005.

I agree with that, and with his comparative lack of height but good blend of strength and athleticism he gives us a good mix with Roughead be able to play on the slower gorilla types.

We just need to have more rebounding options with good kicking skills to help Talia cover for his horrible disposal. Unfortunately we don't at the moment, but that's not really his fault.

[bornadog]

Actually I've been really impressed by Talia as a pure defender - he looks the most completely natural lock-down defender on talls and small that I've seen since Morris came from nowhere in 2005.

I have said the same thing in many threads Talia looks more like a natural defender than Roughead. Unfortunately for Morris he has had to punch out of his weight division again.

[bornadog]

In: Picken, Stevens, Young, Grant, Tutt

Out: Lower, Wallis, Smith, Dickson, Stringer

You think think Goodes will come straight in if fit?

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

In:Picken Goodes Young Stevens
Out: Cordy Wallis Dahlhaus Hunter
The team against Melbourne was poorly selected. Cordy didn't have form with Williamstown to be selected. Cooney was still selected at half back after indifferent form in defence previously. Cordy Jones Dahlhaus and Dickson were poor up forward and yet Murphy spent long periods in defence. Wallis hasn't come on as a midfielder which is disappointing. Dahlhaus needs to find form at Willy as he has been indifferent this year.We sadly missed Picken's determination against the Demons. He is better than many in our current line up.

[soupman]

In:Picken Goodes Young Stevens
Out: Cordy Wallis Dahlhaus Hunter
The team against Melbourne was poorly selected. Cordy didn't have form with Williamstown to be selected. Cooney was still selected at half back after indifferent form in defence previously. Cordy Jones Dahlhaus and Dickson were poor up forward and yet Murphy spent long periods in defence. Wallis hasn't come on as a midfielder which is disappointing. Dahlhaus needs to find form at Willy as he has been indifferent this year.We sadly missed Picken's determination against the Demons. He is better than many in our current line up.

Just curious how your swaps work?

You've brought in 3 defenders and one forward/mid, for 3 forwards and a mid. I assume Jones rucks a bit but beyond that it leaves us with forward options of: Murphy, Jones, Gia, Cooney, Dickson, and pure defenders of Morris, Talia, Roughead, Young, Goodes, JJ, with Picken, Lower and Boyd all playing in defence or negating roles in the middle.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Just curious how your swaps work?

You've brought in 3 defenders and one forward/mid, for 3 forwards and a mid. I assume Jones rucks a bit but beyond that it leaves us with forward options of: Murphy, Jones, Gia, Cooney, Dickson, and pure defenders of Morris, Talia, Roughead, Young, Goodes, JJ, with Picken, Lower and Boyd all playing in defence or negating roles in the middle.

Picken and Stevens can both go forward. Goodes similarly played his best football at Williamstown as a forward. I would personally prefer to see Roughead play as a key forward which would take the pressure off both Jones and Stringer. The team I selected did in fact have a preference to play Roughy as a forward. Stringer is still adjusting to league football, whilst I have never been convinced that Cordy and Jones are our best key forward options. Cordy doesn't look comfortable as a forward having been given a number of chances with limited success. At best he appeals more as a ruckman.

[Mantis]

You think think Goodes will come straight in if fit?

Nah, he wasn't performing all that well before his injury.

[F'scary]

In: Picken, Stevens, Young, Grant, Tutt

Out: Lower, Wallis, Smith, Dickson, Stringer

Sorry but Grant is past the stage of being gifted games against 18 on the ladder. If he gets a call up when he is only showing average form in the 2's, it has to be against, say, Essendon or Hawthorn in a few weeks time. Because he is meant to be one of our leaders by now.

[Happy Days]

Sorry but Grant is past the stage of being gifted games against 18 on the ladder. If he gets a call up when he is only showing average form in the 2's, it has to be against, say, Essendon or Hawthorn in a few weeks time. Because he is meant to be one of our leaders by now.

Grant was pretty good on the weekend.

I haven't seen the game from Saturday night, but based on Williamstown form you could make a case for Cross, Young, Tutt, Picken, Grant and Addison to be included. Is there space/players who deserve to be dropped for these guys and who could make way?

[Mantis]

Sorry but Grant is past the stage of being gifted games against 18 on the ladder. If he gets a call up when he is only showing average form in the 2's, it has to be against, say, Essendon or Hawthorn in a few weeks time. Because he is meant to be one of our leaders by now.

Agree in part, but the ball won't get down to our forward line against the teams you mentioned.

Give him a month in the seniors and see how he goes, hopefully he can build some confidence this week and go from there.

[F'scary]

Grant was pretty good on the weekend.

I haven't seen the game from Saturday night, but based on Williamstown form you could make a case for Cross, Young, Tutt, Picken, Grant and Addison to be included. Is there space/players who deserve to be dropped for these guys and who could make way?

Well, if he's breaking the barn door down now - good to hear it and GWS here Grant comes.

[F'scary]

Grant was pretty good on the weekend.

I haven't seen the game from Saturday night, but based on Williamstown form you could make a case for Cross, Young, Tutt, Picken, Grant and Addison to be included. Is there space/players who deserve to be dropped for these guys and who could make way?

There has to be consequences for losing to Melbourne. Six changes would certainly give the message.

I was only able to listen on the radio but Dickson, Dahlhaus, Lower, Wallis & Smith seemed fairly ordinary. The taller forwards: Cordy, Jones - both ordinary games. Stringer & Hrovat would only be retained if there is an agenda to get games under their belts at all cost (I am pretty confident of their longer term value, don't get me wrong).

So in my opinion, plenty of choices for 6 promotions from the magoos. And good reason.

[bornadog]

There has to be consequences for losing to Melbourne. Six changes would certainly give the message.

I was only able to listen on the radio but Dickson, Dahlhaus, Lower, Wallis & Smith seemed fairly ordinary. The taller forwards: Cordy, Jones - both ordinary games. Stringer & Hrovat would only be retained if there is an agenda to get games under their belts at all cost (I am pretty confident of their longer term value, don't get me wrong).

So in my opinion, plenty of choices for 6 promotions from the magoos. And good reason.

Hrovat was very good in the second half and even had a chance to help put us in front with a minute to go. He was running and bouncing the ball along the wing, but his delivery was poor. Beside that he picked up 14 Disposals after half time. I wouldn't be dropping him, or Stringer. We must get games into these players.

[1eyedog]

Hrovat was very good in the second half and even had a chance to help put us in front with a minute to go. He was running and bouncing the ball along the wing, but his delivery was poor. Beside that he picked up 14 Disposals after half time. I wouldn't be dropping him, or Stringer. We must get games into these players.

Agree, if we are persisting with Jones as a forward we need to persist with Stringer as a forward as well who has showed he has tricks and can deliver. Likewise Hrovat, we need some more run and he provides that.

I'm at a loss as to what to do about Cordy.

[azabob]

Boyd out for 3 weeks with a fractured jaw.

Could this be a replica of Brad Johnsons last season?

[bornadog]

I'm at a loss as to what to do about Cordy.

The MC are persisting with him, so lets give him some games.

He is a big unit and has shown he can take a mark. That mark and goal he kicked to get us within two points shows the value of a tall at the end of a game.

[azabob]

So does Cross come in for Boyd?

[bornadog]

So does Cross come in for Boyd?

or Stevens

[azabob]

The MC are persisting with him, so lets give him some games.

He is a big unit and has shown he can take a mark. That mark and goal he kicked to get us within two points shows the value of a tall at the end of a game.

And his mark and goal at the start of the game. Hopefully he can start getting a few more in between! ;)

[bornadog]

And his mark and goal at the start of the game. Hopefully he can start getting a few more in between! ;)

Yeah a few times he tried to grab one handers and listening to Barry Hall, he was yelling out two hands two hands.

[always right]

There has to be consequences for losing to Melbourne. Six changes would certainly give the message.

I was only able to listen on the radio but Dickson, Dahlhaus, Lower, Wallis & Smith seemed fairly ordinary. The taller forwards: Cordy, Jones - both ordinary games. Stringer & Hrovat would only be retained if there is an agenda to get games under their belts at all cost (I am pretty confident of their longer term value, don't get me wrong).

So in my opinion, plenty of choices for 6 promotions from the magoos. And good reason.

Would be reluctant to drop Smith as he has been pretty good recently. Can't see them dropping Wallis after one game back nor Dickson and Cordy for the same reason.

Don't see anyone in GWS who demands a hard tag (although we have a habit of kick starting players careers:() so no need for Picken or Lower. Dahlhaus deserves a spell with Williamstown and whilst many want Jones dropped, I think the MC might see GWS as a perfect team for Jones to build confidence against.

In: Grant (pace up forward), Goodes (to allow Murphy to play forward), Stevens
Out: Lower, Dahlhaus, Hunter (unlucky)

[bornadog]

Would be reluctant to drop Smith as he has been pretty good recently. Can't see them dropping Wallis after one game back nor Dickson and Cordy for the same reason.

Don't see anyone in GWS who demands a hard tag (although we have a habit of kick starting players careers:() so no need for Picken or Lower. Dahlhaus deserves a spell with Williamstown and whilst many want Jones dropped, I think the MC might see GWS as a perfect team for Jones to build confidence against.

In: Grant (pace up forward), Goodes (to allow Murphy to play forward), Stevens
Out: Lower, Dahlhaus, Hunter (unlucky)

Don't forget Boyd out for three weeks.

[always right]

Don't forget Boyd out for three weeks.

Just noticed that. Bring in Young. Not like for like but Young stiffens up our defence. Or does Crossy replace his best mate?

[lemmon]

Would be reluctant to drop Smith as he has been pretty good recently. Can't see them dropping Wallis after one game back nor Dickson and Cordy for the same reason.

Don't see anyone in GWS who demands a hard tag (although we have a habit of kick starting players careers:() so no need for Picken or Lower. Dahlhaus deserves a spell with Williamstown and whilst many want Jones dropped, I think the MC might see GWS as a perfect team for Jones to build confidence against.

Would you run with Ward? Should be talked about as an AA candidate for mine.

[always right]

Would you run with Ward? Should be talked about as an AA candidate for mine.

You could argue that we should send someone to Ward...or Scully....or Shiel as each has the ability to do damage. I think Smith would be a good match-up for Ward without being a hard tag. Couple of tough nuts there.

[Ozza]

Does anyone know when Boyd brke his jaw? His best footy for the night was in the last quarter where he got plenty of clearances.

We all have our frustrations with Boyd's kicking - but nobody could question his toughness.

[Greystache]

Does anyone know when Boyd brke his jaw? His best footy for the night was in the last quarter where he got plenty of clearances.

We all have our frustrations with Boyd's kicking - but nobody could question his toughness.

What about Talia then earlier in the year? Broke his jaw, played out the game, and then didn't even go to see a doctor until the next day before being ruled out for 6 weeks.

[Ozza]

What about Talia then earlier in the year? Broke his jaw, played out the game, and then didn't even go to see a doctor until the next day before being ruled out for 6 weeks.

Even better when they are YOUNG, Tough blokes!

[Bulldog Joe]

Would be reluctant to drop Smith as he has been pretty good recently. Can't see them dropping Wallis after one game back nor Dickson and Cordy for the same reason.

Don't see anyone in GWS who demands a hard tag (although we have a habit of kick starting players careers:() so no need for Picken or Lower. Dahlhaus deserves a spell with Williamstown and whilst many want Jones dropped, I think the MC might see GWS as a perfect team for Jones to build confidence against.

In: Grant (pace up forward), Goodes (to allow Murphy to play forward), Stevens
Out: Lower, Dahlhaus, Hunter (unlucky)

Just cannot comprehend how anyone could ask for Grant to come in at the expense of Hunter.

Hunter has more of just about everything and especially pace.

[Greystache]

Even better when they are YOUNG, Tough blokes!

And Lin Jong broke his leg and tried to play on :)

[bulldogtragic]

And Lin Jong broke his leg and tried to play on :)
Yep. Proud history, like Luke Penny quitting after being teased... :) :)

But yes, I like Jong's kamikaze attitude. I just read this now, is this racist?

[G-Mo77]

Stevens will probably take on more of a role in the midfield now that Boyd is out for 3.

Stevens, Goodes and Young I'd have as my In's at this stage. I also heard Grant was pretty strong last week in the VFL maybe he gets a call up. Picken and Cross I'm sure will come into the mix.

Boyd the obvious out and I think Lower may get a spell. Stringer is another who'll be lucky to hold his place.

[F'scary]

But yes, I like Jong's kamikaze attitude. I just read this now, is this racist?

We can all have a kamikaze attitude.

[bornadog]

Does anyone know when Boyd brke his jaw? His best footy for the night was in the last quarter where he got plenty of clearances.

We all have our frustrations with Boyd's kicking - but nobody could question his toughness.

When he clashed heads with Dickson - was it the first quarter?

[always right]

Just cannot comprehend how anyone could ask for Grant to come in at the expense of Hunter.

Hunter has more of just about everything and especially pace.

Yes Hunter would be unlucky as I stated. I just think Dahlhaus needs to find form in the VFL but it does rob us of pace......something we are in short supply of. Whilst not a direct like for like replacement, Grant does have genuine pace and plays more like a crumbing forward than a marking one. As for your claim that Hunter is quicker than Grant.....we simply disagree. :)

[Bulldog Joe]

Yes Hunter would be unlucky as I stated. I just think Dahlhaus needs to find form in the VFL but it does rob us of pace......something we are in short supply of. Whilst not a direct like for like replacement, Grant does have genuine pace and plays more like a crumbing forward than a marking one. As for your claim that Hunter is quicker than Grant.....we simply disagree. :)

I seem to recall some reports from early training that had Hunter near the top of our 20m sprints.

[Go_Dogs]

I'm really at a bit of a loss as far as selections should go this week.

I guess Boydy is definitely out with injury, but I wonder if wholesale changes should be made or whether we give the blokes a chance at redemption? At the end of the day, it was a young side, we had a few guys back for their first senior games for a while in Dickson and Cordy, and really, besides perhaps Addison, Picken and Cross there doesn't seem to be many I'd want to include based on the weekends reports from Willy.

Therefore, I'd go with:-

Ins:- Addison, Picken
Outs:- Dahlhaus, Boyd(inj)

Reasoning, Dahl can have a rest and Addison gets another shot to beat up on a weaker opponent. Picken comes in for Boyd which hopefully means that Smith and Wallis can play more inside roles which they are better suited at. Picken can fill a role forward, back and through the middle as required. I was tempted to include Lower as an out and Cross as an in, but perhaps we send Lower to Ward this week.

I'd give Young and Stevens (assuming he's fit to resume) another game at Willy before considering them so we don't come in again with too many underdone players.

[always right]

I'd give Young and Stevens (assuming he's fit to resume) another game at Willy before considering them so we don't come in again with too many underdone players.

Why do you think Stevens is underdone?

[Go_Dogs]

Why do you think Stevens is underdone?

Because I believe he has missed a few weeks now. I could be wrong.

[LostDoggy]

http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/video/2013-07-03/press-conference-mccartney-03-july-13

Macca throws up Dylan Addison, Jarrad Grant, Liam Picken and Daniel Cross as potential inclusions on vfl form.

[bulldogtragic]

http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/video/2013-07-03/press-conference-mccartney-03-july-13

Macca throws up Dylan Addison, Jarrad Grant, Liam Picken and Dylan Addison as potential inclusions.
I'd say DFA is a certainty then :)

[LostDoggy]

Fixed that, one was meant to be Crossy.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

I'm really at a bit of a loss as far as selections should go this week.

I guess Boydy is definitely out with injury, but I wonder if wholesale changes should be made or whether we give the blokes a chance at redemption? At the end of the day, it was a young side, we had a few guys back for their first senior games for a while in Dickson and Cordy, and really, besides perhaps Addison, Picken and Cross there doesn't seem to be many I'd want to include based on the weekends reports from Willy.

Therefore, I'd go with:-

Ins:- Addison, Picken
Outs:- Dahlhaus, Boyd(inj)

Reasoning, Dahl can have a rest and Addison gets another shot to beat up on a weaker opponent. Picken comes in for Boyd which hopefully means that Smith and Wallis can play more inside roles which they are better suited at. Picken can fill a role forward, back and through the middle as required. I was tempted to include Lower as an out and Cross as an in, but perhaps we send Lower to Ward this week.
I'd give Young and Stevens (assuming he's fit to resume) another game at Willy before considering them so we don't come in again with too many underdone players.

I am not sure why you couldn't bring both Young and Stevens back this week as they have been pretty much in the senior line up for most of the season. Cordy after a poor game in the VFL the previous week, didn't earn selection against Melbourne and played like it. Wallis was also poor against the Demons once again showing his lack of leg speed as a problem. I do not think dropping Picken was a wise move as we lacked his hardness at the ball last week and he should be recalled. I agree with you on Dahlhaus who has been disappointing for most of the season. I have somewhat reluctantly decided to elevate Grant this week who probably at the moment is on a par with both Jones and Stringer. Stringer with a good pre-season behind him will become a good player but is still underdone.
In. Picken Grant Young Goodes and Stevens
Out. Cordy, Wallis, Dalhaus, Hunter and Boyd, (inj).
It will be hard to imagine the MC making 5 changes but given the effort against Melbourne for three quarters they can be justified. I am not sure of the value in bringing back Addison who in spite of his endeavor is border line going forward.

[G-Mo77]

Roughy a chance to miss? The article here (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/dogs-look-forward-for-change-20130703-2pb0f.html) says he injured his shoulder but returned. He's had previous shoulder problems before this so I'm a little concerned.

[azabob]

Roughy a chance to miss? The article here (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/dogs-look-forward-for-change-20130703-2pb0f.html) says he injured his shoulder but returned. He's had previous shoulder problems before this so I'm a little concerned.

You would think so.

IMO the three we can't afford to lose to injury are Griffen, Minson and Roughead.

[F'scary]

Looking forward to the naming of the team tonight.

Boyd is definitely out, we know that much already. Coach has indicated Kobe Stevens will be a likely inclusion.

Young has played one match now with Willi and apparently played ok but like a player having his first match back after a lay-off with injury. Sounds like he needs a second week in the VFL.

Picken, Cross & Addison played well for Willi.

I would like to see a bit of turnover after last week's shocking loss. So,

In: Stevens, Picken, Cross & Addison.

Out: Boyd (inj), Dahlhaus, Dickson & Lower.

Clay Smith can start as the sub because of his poor game last week.

Cooney should play in the center.

I don't care about this succession planning with Cross right now. I just want to see players picked on form. So play him.

[G-Mo77]

I read somewhere, Twitter I think, that Hunter won't be playing this week. Disappointing if true.

I can't see Dickson being dropped F'scary, first game back last week and hopefully will be better for the run. I think he's safe.

[F'scary]

I read somewhere, Twitter I think, that Hunter won't be playing this week. Disappointing if true.

I can't see Dickson being dropped F'scary, first game back last week and hopefully will be better for the run. I think he's safe.

I can't stand the idea of a largely unchanged team after that insipid performance on Saturday night. :mad:

[G-Mo77]

I can't stand the idea of a largely unchanged team after that insipid performance on Saturday night. :mad:

Neither can I mate. I think we'll get 4 changes at least. Would that be enough? :)

I wouldn't be surprised if one of Jones or Stringer is missing at 6:25.

[bornadog]

I can't stand the idea of a largely unchanged team after that insipid performance on Saturday night. :mad:

I think there will be at least four changes, but that is a guess.

out: Boyd, Jones, Hunter, Lower

In: Picken, Grant, Stevens, Addison

[G-Mo77]

I think there will be at least four changes, but that is a guess.

out: Boyd, Jones, Hunter, Lower

In: Picken, Grant, Stevens, Addison

There's been a bit of talk about Grant this week, I think he'll come in as well.

[G-Mo77]

Supercoach news is more reliable than the media outlets with that Goodes won't be playing this week.

[F'scary]

Neither can I mate. I think we'll get 4 changes at least. Would that be enough? :)

I wouldn't be surprised if one of Jones or Stringer is missing at 6:25.

Four was what I was proposing too based on who is available to come in.

Would be surprised if either of Jones or Stringer was dropped due to lack of replacements. Grant was just middling at Willi last week from what I can tell from the media. He really needs to smash his way back in to the seniors.

[F'scary]

I think there will be at least four changes, but that is a guess.

out: Boyd, Jones, Hunter, Lower

In: Picken, Grant, Stevens, Addison

Interesting - Grant for Jones, I presume. We'll see in under an hour. But I will be spewing oil if there is only mandatory changes.

[Happy Days]

Would be surprised if either of Jones or Stringer was dropped due to lack of replacements. Grant was just middling at Willi last week from what I can tell from the media.

Grant was good on the weekend.

[Go_Dogs]

In Jason Tutt, Brett Goodes, Koby Stevens

Out Lachie Hunter (Omitted), Matthew Boyd (Cheekbone), Nick Lower (Omitted)

[LostDoggy]

In: Goodes, Stevens, Tutt

Out: Boyd, Lower, Hunter

A little bit surprised to see Tutt, but he certainly has the attributes we need right now, Good luck to young Jason.
Very Happy with Goodes and Stevens in. On form we're not losing a lot with Boyd out, given what Goodes and Stevens bring.

[bulldogtragic]

Including Grant would make our forward line less potent...

[LostDoggy]

Hunter has a really solid debut, then gets made the sub, played 1 quarter and struggled to get into the game which every young player struggles with when coming on as sub.

Then get's dropped for a bloke who is hardly knocking the door down at Willy.

I hate it.

[Go_Dogs]

Hunter has a really solid debut, then gets made the sub, played 1 quarter and struggled to get into the game which every young player struggles with when coming on as sub.

Then get's dropped for a bloke who is hardly knocking the door down at Willy.

I hate it.

I would've preferred to see us give Lachie another game and move out Dahlhaus this week.

[Before I Die]

Including Grant would make our forward line less potent...

And that is based on your personal dislike of him, or his game last weekend?

I am surprised there is no change to the forward setup after last week's very ordinary performance. At least there are no forward inclusions, but there may be a reshuffle.

[Remi Moses]

I'm shocked Hunter got dropped.Not surprised by Lower though

Big chance for Tutt to press his claims .

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Hunter gets dropped for Tutt?

I feel sick.

[chef]

Hunter gets dropped for Tutt?

I feel sick.

This.

[bulldogtragic]

And that is based on your personal dislike of him, or his game last weekend?

I am surprised there is no change to the forward setup after last week's very ordinary performance. At least there are no forward inclusions, but there may be a reshuffle.
Sorry, I forgot to add sarcasm, my bad.

I can't imagine a less potent forward line like the one we produced last week. But the match committee thinks it is worth persisting with.

I would have thought it was worth a shot with Grant. But I'm just a armchair critic.

[SlimPickens]

Big chance for Tutt to press his claims .

That's the way I look at it. Lachy will play a couple more this year, he has had a taste and hopefully it makes him even more hungry.

[Throughandthrough]

I'm expecting a reasonable number of our "just" fringe players to get a run in the next two months, aiming that hopefully they show just enough so we can offer them as trade bait. In my opinion the Dogs did exactly the same last year.

[wimberga]

Unless I am mis-remembering, it felt like Bob Murphy played almost all of last week in defence against Howe, so moving him back forward should help us out a bit.

Just on this game, there is one other thing I dont want to see.

And that is Cooney or Smith in the backline. Cooney should run through the middle and rest forward. Goodes is back which should help provide a bit more drive, and Cooney just adds so much more through the middle and forward half. With Clay, he has a nack for scoring goals and his hardness in the contest is great but he is not a natural defender. Please macca, play them forward of centre!
-

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I'm expecting a reasonable number of our "just" fringe players to get a run in the next two months, aiming that hopefully they show just enough so we can offer them as trade bait. In my opinion the Dogs did exactly the same last year.

If our aim is to do this and lose at the expense of injecting games into quality young kids, then playing Tutt is a masterstroke.

[bulldogtragic]

This.
WTF is going on. Where is the signal to the players that let us down last week??

Which defenders need to be pulled up?
What impotent forward needs to be held accountable?
Which experienced player let the team down?
Which coaches pet like Dahl who has done nothing for two months got a wake up call?
Who is responsible? Who wears the blame with a game or two in the magoos?

Lachie Hunter... Lets string him up off Teddys statue. I knew it was his fault.

I find it near impossible to support much of BMac ATM.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

WTF is going on. Where is the signal to the players that let us down last week??

Which defenders need to be pulled up?
What impotent forward needs to be held accountable?
Which experienced player let the team down?
Which coaches pet like Dahl who has done nothing for two months got a wake up call?
Who is responsible? Who wears the blame with a game or two in the magoos?

Lachie Hunter... Lets string him up off Teddys statue. I knew it was his fault.

I find it near impossible to support much of BMac ATM.

I've agreed with some of the selections this year (ie. Cross/Picken/Lower being dropped, playing of Stringer/Macrae/Hrovat/Hunter) but there's far too much I disagree with. Cooney/Smith in the back half is bewildering, Dahl being given a free reign and now the dropping of a kid who played really well, who then got demoted to sub (another ridiculous decision) and who is now dropped in favour of a player that should be delisted.

I was a fan of McCartney's appointment, I've said on multiple occasions his vision is solid, but I can't help but side with BT and many others. McCartney and the coaching panel need to be moved on at year's end -- he's so far out of his depth it's getting embarrassing.

[chef]

WTF is going on. Where is the signal to the players that let us down last week??

Which defenders need to be pulled up?
What impotent forward needs to be held accountable?
Which experienced player let the team down?
Which coaches pet like Dahl who has done nothing for two months got a wake up call?
Who is responsible? Who wears the blame with a game or two in the magoos?

Lachie Hunter... Lets string him up off Teddys statue. I knew it was his fault.

I find it near impossible to support much of BMac ATM.

I'm starting to struggle.

[LostDoggy]

I would've preferred to see us give Lachie another game and move out Dahlhaus this week.

Agreed, Clay Smith can consider himself lucky too, was missing for most of last week.

[lemmon]

Seriously who does Dahl have pictures of? I don't mind Tutt in but it should have been in place of Dahl not Hunter. Koby back is the only positive

[bornadog]

Hunter has a really solid debut, then gets made the sub, played 1 quarter and struggled to get into the game which every young player struggles with when coming on as sub.

Then get's dropped for a bloke who is hardly knocking the door down at Willy.

I hate it.

Yes, I think he should be playing.

[bulldogtragic]

I'm starting to struggle.
From the website:

Senior Coach Brendan McCartney says the Western Bulldogs’ selection panel will name a team that are willing to grab this weekend’s opportunity with both hands. (Ok...)

After a sound review of last weekend’s game, the level-headed coach has opted for a balanced approach to the week, to ensure his team have learnt from the recent loss, but can move their focus quickly to GWS. (How's that working out so far).

“We are going to pick a team this week that is hell-bent on playing better footy,” McCartney said. (As opposed to last week)

“The key thing is not to be over-reactive and too emotional and have enough aggression about the game as a coaching group and a playing group,” he said. (God forbid a poor loss stirs up emotion in your mind, I would have thought under reactive is worse)

“Right now our most important mission is this training session to prepare our boys for GWS on the weekend, to get them into a really good frame of mind to play some good footy.” (Training is the sole answer)

Williamstown’s 25-point victory against the top of the table Box Hill Hawks saw six Bulldogs hit the scoreboard while a number more were credited for solid performances.

“Knocking on the door, the alignment team are playing really well at the moment,” he said.

“Dylan Addison is playing good footy, Jarrad Grant is playing some good footy and Liam Picken and Crossy both had good games. (Glad you singled them out)

“The challenge we have at the moment is… do we bring a couple of forwards in who might be a bit different, or do we back in some people who didn’t have their best day last week but didn’t have great supply either (keep backing them in FFS).


What is happening?

[LostDoggy]

So I think it's almost a consensus that Hunter is unlucky to be out rather than a few others.

[bornadog]

Cross is definitely gone by years end. Boyd out and he can't crack a game.

[F'scary]

Grant was good on the weekend.

Good to hear - I was going on German's review which seemed a little qualified.

[ReLoad]

This is a joke, is it The match committee? or the cabbage patch committee?

[F'scary]

:mad::mad::mad:

"Block Hands" Tutt injects pace into one area only: the sprint to the interchange bench.

If someone made turnovers a stock, Goodes would be instantly hired by Goldman Sachs.

Maybe Dahlhaus will at least be demoted to Sub.

[Eastdog]

Cross is definitely gone by years end. Boyd out and he can't crack a game.

Boyd injured of course but yeah his not exactly setting the world on fire and his our captain.

[LostDoggy]

Do we still pass the hat around on this forum to help fund a rookie? Recall it a few years back, driven by Coon Dog from memory (correct me if I'm wrong).

Maybe we need to do it to fund a experienced senior assistant.

[jeemak]

I'm loving the butt hurt in this thread.

[F'scary]

i'm loving the butt hurt in this thread.

:d:d:d

[choconmientay]

Playing players out of positions. Dropping players who shouldn't be dropped. Playing players who shouldn't get a game ahead of 'others' .... sound familiar anyone ;)


we are definitely in the middle of ... 'operation getting tom boyd'

[GVGjr]

How lucky is Dahlhaus? He has been below average for many weeks now

[G-Mo77]

How lucky is Dahlhaus? He has been below average for many weeks now

Jones and Stringer as well.

[GVGjr]

Jones and Stringer as well.

I can live with Jones being given an extended run because I think he is still learning. Stringer needs a spell.

We should put Stringer on Cameron and see how he goes

[Eastdog]

I wonder when Grant will be selected. He certainly has been out of favour and from what I hear of his performances for Williamstown I can see why.

[LostDoggy]

I can live with Jones being given an extended run because I think he is still learning. Stringer needs a spell.

We should put Stringer on Cameron and see how he goes

Don't give BMac ideas !

[boydogs]

We should put Stringer on Cameron and see how he goes

That kind of move is why we have no forward line

[AndrewP6]

Don't give BMac ideas !

Someone needs to! :eek:

[GVGjr]

That kind of move is why we have no forward line

No scope for a bit of development? Forward or nothing?

[Before I Die]

Playing players out of positions. Dropping players who shouldn't be dropped. Playing players who shouldn't get a game ahead of 'others' .... sound familiar anyone ;)


we are definitely in the middle of ... 'operation getting tom boyd'

I so hope you are wrong, but it is ckear that winning games is not the number one priority. Then again, that has been the case all year.
I still have belief in BMac, mainly because the alternative is less palatable. It does appear that a decision has been made regarding the future structure of our forward line and that structure is going to be persevered with no matter what. I may have to live in a cave until 2015.

[1eyedog]

I've got no problem with Hunter being ommitted. He played well for a game and a quarter and now he can get some separation and digest it. You couldn't say he was in 'form' as such so there is not a lot lost by giving him some separation. Maybe he requires this, how would we know?

I don't mind having a look at Tutt either, it seems the MC are doing their due diligence on our fringe players between now and the end of the season. It's clearly the only way to know the keepers from the rest. If this prove to be the case obviously Grant and Vez will have a run between now and the end of the year. This week though it's Tutt's turn, hope he goes ok.

I've not lost faith in the coach. He has had a long enough apprenticeship to know how it works. He's got a big plan and I still believe he has many pieces of the puzzle to put together. He's not building a team that has enough tricks to slip into the eight, he's building a top 4 force. I hope he knows how to do it.

Cut the guy some slack -we were lauding him after St. Kilda and Port.

[Hotdog60]

I've got no problem with Hunter being ommitted. He played well for a game and a quarter and now he can get some separation and digest it. You couldn't say he was in 'form' as such so there is not a lot lost by giving him some separation. Maybe he requires this, how would we know?

I don't mind having a look at Tutt either, it seems the MC are doing their due diligence on our fringe players between now and the end of the season. It's clearly the only way to know the keepers from the rest. If this prove to be the case obviously Grant and Vez will have a run between now and the end of the year. This week though it's Tutt's turn, hope he goes ok.

I've not lost faith in the coach. He has had a long enough apprenticeship to know how it works. He's got a big plan and I still believe he has many pieces of the puzzle to put together. He's not building a team that has enough tricks to slip into the eight, he's building a top 4 force. I hope he knows how to do it.

Cut the guy some slack -we were lauding him after St. Kilda and Port.

I think I'm with you on this one and I can hold my nerve until the second half of next year were I would be expecting some good performances and players showing a lot more. It's a long way to the top if you want to Rock 'n' Roll.

[wimberga]

I've got no problem with Hunter being ommitted. He played well for a game and a quarter and now he can get some separation and digest it. You couldn't say he was in 'form' as such so there is not a lot lost by giving him some separation. Maybe he requires this, how would we know?

I don't mind having a look at Tutt either, it seems the MC are doing their due diligence on our fringe players between now and the end of the season. It's clearly the only way to know the keepers from the rest. If this prove to be the case obviously Grant and Vez will have a run between now and the end of the year. This week though it's Tutt's turn, hope he goes ok.

I've not lost faith in the coach. He has had a long enough apprenticeship to know how it works. He's got a big plan and I still believe he has many pieces of the puzzle to put together. He's not building a team that has enough tricks to slip into the eight, he's building a top 4 force. I hope he knows how to do it.

Cut the guy some slack -we were lauding him after St. Kilda and Port.

Well said.

[LostDoggy]

Is Jarrod Grant this years Matthew Panos? Played well for Willy, strong grabs, good team play and has pace in the forward line, is there something we don't know?

[Eastdog]

Is Jarrod Grant this years Matthew Panos? Played well for Willy, strong grabs, good team play and has pace in the forward line, is there something we don't know?

His played some poor games also for Willy but I'm one who reckons he should get a go.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I've got no problem with Hunter being ommitted. He played well for a game and a quarter and now he can get some separation and digest it. You couldn't say he was in 'form' as such so there is not a lot lost by giving him some separation. Maybe he requires this, how would we know?

I don't mind having a look at Tutt either, it seems the MC are doing their due diligence on our fringe players between now and the end of the season. It's clearly the only way to know the keepers from the rest. If this prove to be the case obviously Grant and Vez will have a run between now and the end of the year. This week though it's Tutt's turn, hope he goes ok.

I've not lost faith in the coach. He has had a long enough apprenticeship to know how it works. He's got a big plan and I still believe he has many pieces of the puzzle to put together. He's not building a team that has enough tricks to slip into the eight, he's building a top 4 force. I hope he knows how to do it.

Cut the guy some slack -we were lauding him after St. Kilda and Port.

Why does Hunter need separation though? Separation from what? He needs games to learn and develop as quickly as possible. He's already too good for VFL level and is deserving of a senior spot, so IMO, it's a dumb exercise to drop him. Worse than that, they drop him for Tutt. How many opportunities does Tutt need to be given to convince the coaching staff he doesn't belong? He's produced some of the most insipid efforts I have ever seen at any level. If I hear how he brings something we lack again, I might go clinically insane. The only time his pace is evident is when he's running laps around Whitten Oval. He's timid, lacks football IQ, has average skills, can't tackle, is brushed off the ball with utter ease and fumbles. Howard is a better player than Tutt, and I'm no fan of Howard.

There isn't much evidence to suggest McCartney and the coaching panel know what they are doing. Picken/Cooney/Smith regularly played out of position, Jones initially played at FF (he's a CHF/HFF -- can't play deep), Austin/Markovic's selections and field positioning, Dahl getting countless opportunities and the complete and utter lack of any system and/or game plan. The only thing that I will give him credit for is the selling of a message, but it takes much more than that to build a successful side. He isn't the only one at blame, as his assistants can hardly be called that, but the frustration of the majority isn't born out of thin air.

I don't think anyone was lauding him after the St. Kilda/Port games. We played OK but the Saints are crap and Port were in the middle of their consecutive losses. To be fair, they dominated the first half and the last quarter, but simply couldn't capitalize.

[G-Mo77]

I can live with Jones being given an extended run because I think he is still learning. Stringer needs a spell.

We should put Stringer on Cameron and see how he goes

I can live with both of them getting an extended run. They're pretty lucky they play for us though.

Disappointed about Hunter's omission, same thing happened with Hrovat and I'm pretty sure Macrae was dropped/rested after one or two games.

The most surprising for me was that one of Addison and Picken did not come into the game. I was almost certain one or both would come in.

[Remi Moses]

Why does Hunter need separation though? Separation from what? He needs games to learn and develop as quickly as possible. He's already too good for VFL level and is deserving of a senior spot, so IMO, it's a dumb exercise to drop him. Worse than that, they drop him for Tutt. How many opportunities does Tutt need to be given to convince the coaching staff he doesn't belong? He's produced some of the most insipid efforts I have ever seen at any level. If I hear how he brings something we lack again, I might go clinically insane. The only time his pace is evident is when he's running laps around Whitten Oval. He's timid, lacks football IQ, has average skills, can't tackle, is brushed off the ball with utter ease and fumbles. Howard is a better player than Tutt, and I'm no fan of Howard.

There isn't much evidence to suggest McCartney and the coaching panel know what they are doing. Picken/Cooney/Smith regularly played out of position, Jones initially played at FF (he's a CHF/HFF -- can't play deep), Austin/Markovic's selections and field positioning, Dahl getting countless opportunities and the complete and utter lack of any system and/or game plan. The only thing that I will give him credit for is the selling of a message, but it takes much more than that to build a successful side. He isn't the only one at blame, as his assistants can hardly be called that, but the frustration of the majority isn't born out of thin air.

I don't think anyone was lauding him after the St. Kilda/Port games. We played OK but the Saints are crap and Port were in the middle of their consecutive losses. To be fair, they dominated the first half and the last quarter, but simply couldn't capitalize.

Gotta take you to task on a few points .
First of all Cooney clearly cannot run out a game in the midfield .
We need run out of the back 6 and only JJ delivers that.
Markovic is clearly third or fourth cab off the rack for that forward role.
Where would you play Picken?
I agree with you on the lack of a game plan ( reckon he needs a senior assistant)
Jones needs a bigger tank granted, but our forward entries are abysmal.
I honestly still couldn't give a definitive answer on the coach, but I would like to see our list with more experience before I answer it.
People can have their opinions, but every problem the club has now shouldn't be just attributed to McCartney and his coaching panel.
Previous list managers and recruiting has hurt this club badly.

[Ozza]

I can live with Jones being given an extended run because I think he is still learning. Stringer needs a spell.

We should put Stringer on Cameron and see how he goes

But isn't Dahlhaus still learning too? Dahlhaus has played 41 games, which is less than Jones, Roughead and Liberatore....I think sometimes this gets lost.

He and Jones have a pretty hard task at the moment....Dahlhaus usually gets teh best small defender, and Jones gets the best key backman - they get poor supply - and they are really still in the infancy of their careers.

[jeemak]

But isn't Dahlhaus still learning too? Dahlhaus has played 41 games, which is less than Jones, Roughead and Liberatore....I think sometimes this gets lost.

He and Jones have a pretty hard task at the moment....Dahlhaus usually gets teh best small defender, and Jones gets the best key backman - they get poor supply - and they are really still in the infancy of their careers.

Well said.

The amount of work each of these players has put into them by the opposition on a weekly basis is huge.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Gotta take you to task on a few points .
First of all Cooney clearly cannot run out a game in the midfield .
We need run out of the back 6 and only JJ delivers that.
Markovic is clearly third or fourth cab off the rack for that forward role.
Where would you play Picken?
I agree with you on the lack of a game plan ( reckon he needs a senior assistant)
Jones needs a bigger tank granted, but our forward entries are abysmal.
I honestly still couldn't give a definitive answer on the coach, but I would like to see our list with more experience before I answer it.
People can have their opinions, but every problem the club has now shouldn't be just attributed to McCartney and his coaching panel.
Previous list managers and recruiting has hurt this club badly.

Cooney should be played forward rather than back. His defending is poor, his defensive positioning is even worse.

Markovic shouldn't get games period. He was ahead of Talia in the pre-season for example, which was absurd.

Picken plays either as a midfield tagger or not at all. He played as a BP two years ago and was terrible, yet this coaching group have tried to do it again. Results have been abysmal, took them too long to figure it out.

No doubt previous list management has hurt us, but at some point, the coaching group need to take control and responsibility of what is happening right now. Besides Griffen, Minson, Roughead, JJ and Libba's improvement, there aren't too many other positives or improvements from an individual or team perspective.

[Maddog37]

Talia has improved. Macrae And the other new kids have performed well. Young and Stephens have been good at times.

If we can get some games into Roberts and Prudden before the year is out we will have more to be happy about.


We are just so young and too old all at the same time.

[bornadog]

Cooney should be played forward rather than back. His defending is poor, his defensive positioning is even worse.

Markovic shouldn't get games period. He was ahead of Talia in the pre-season for example, which was absurd.

Picken plays either as a midfield tagger or not at all. He played as a BP two years ago and was terrible, yet this coaching group have tried to do it again. Results have been abysmal, took them too long to figure it out.

No doubt previous list management has hurt us, but at some point, the coaching group need to take control and responsibility of what is happening right now. Besides Griffen, Minson, Roughead, JJ and Libba's improvement, there aren't too many other positives or improvements from an individual or team perspective.

This ^^^.

If we lose this week, serious questions need to be asked by the Board of Directors.

[1eyedog]

Why does Hunter need separation though? Separation from what? He needs games to learn and develop as quickly as possible. He's already too good for VFL level and is deserving of a senior spot, so IMO, it's a dumb exercise to drop him. Worse than that, they drop him for Tutt. How many opportunities does Tutt need to be given to convince the coaching staff he doesn't belong? He's produced some of the most insipid efforts I have ever seen at any level. If I hear how he brings something we lack again, I might go clinically insane. The only time his pace is evident is when he's running laps around Whitten Oval. He's timid, lacks football IQ, has average skills, can't tackle, is brushed off the ball with utter ease and fumbles. Howard is a better player than Tutt, and I'm no fan of Howard.

There isn't much evidence to suggest McCartney and the coaching panel know what they are doing. Picken/Cooney/Smith regularly played out of position, Jones initially played at FF (he's a CHF/HFF -- can't play deep), Austin/Markovic's selections and field positioning, Dahl getting countless opportunities and the complete and utter lack of any system and/or game plan. The only thing that I will give him credit for is the selling of a message, but it takes much more than that to build a successful side. He isn't the only one at blame, as his assistants can hardly be called that, but the frustration of the majority isn't born out of thin air.

I don't think anyone was lauding him after the St. Kilda/Port games. We played OK but the Saints are crap and Port were in the middle of their consecutive losses. To be fair, they dominated the first half and the last quarter, but simply couldn't capitalize.

Who knows what the reason is but I'm certain the MC are in a better position than us to know whey he isn't playing this weekend. How do you know what he needs exactly?

Give Tutt a break, has he played 10 games yet? What do you expect of him?

All of a sudden the Saints and Power win look pretty good for us if you ask me.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Talia has improved. Macrae And the other new kids have performed well. Young and Stephens have been good at times.

If we can get some games into Roberts and Prudden before the year is out we will have more to be happy about.


We are just so young and too old all at the same time.

We desperately need a quality key forward which would make a huge difference. We have had something like 8 new players this year including those from other clubs. Apart from Griffen Minson Murphy Morris and Gia there hasn't been too many with experience doing well. Roberts would give us another bigger player that can go back or forward. Tutt does have outside pace which we lack. Our smaller to medium size players generally lack speed apart from Dahlhaus and JJ. This has been a noticeable weakness of our recruiting.

[Eastdog]

We desperately need a quality key forward which would make a huge difference. We have had something like 8 new players this year including those from other clubs. Apart from Griffen Minson Murphy Morris and Gia there hasn't been too many with experience doing well. Roberts would give us another bigger player that can go back or forward. Tutt does have outside pace which we lack. Our smaller to medium size players generally lack speed apart from Dahlhaus and JJ. This has been a noticeable weakness of our recruiting.

We need an imposing figure up forward that's for sure. We had it when Barry Hall was there but since he retired its been lacking. We heavily rely on our midfielders to get our goals which is ok but not always the best. With what we have now what is the best structure for our forward line to function well you reckon.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

We need an imposing figure up forward that's for sure. We had it when Barry Hall was there but since he retired its been lacking. We heavily rely on our midfielders to get our goals which is ok but not always the best. With what we have now what is the best structure for our forward line to function well you reckon.

I reckon we will eventually become a better balanced side when Talia and Roberts become our two key defenders with Roughead moving to CHF and second ruck to Minson. Stringer as the attributes to play as a leading FF with Jones becoming our third tall operating out of a FP.
Murphy and Dickson would occupy half forward flanks with Gia and Dahl alternating in the other FP. There has been too much pressure I believe on Jones to be our No. 1 forward which I do not think he is at this stage. I do not see Cordy as a full forward. If he is to make it at League level it will be as a ruckman.

[Eastdog]

I reckon we will eventually become a better balanced side when Talia and Roberts become our two key defenders with Roughead moving to CHF and second ruck to Minson. Stringer as the attributes to play as a leading FF with Jones becoming our third tall operating out of a FP.
Murphy and Dickson would occupy half forward flanks with Gia and Dahl alternating in the other FP. There has been too much pressure I believe on Jones to be our No. 1 forward which I do not think he is at this stage. I do not see Cordy as a full forward. If he is to make it at League level it will be as a ruckman.

Cordy for me was really frustrating last week.

[The Underdog]

I reckon we will eventually become a better balanced side when Talia and Roberts become our two key defenders with Roughead moving to CHF and second ruck to Minson. Stringer as the attributes to play as a leading FF with Jones becoming our third tall operating out of a FP.
Murphy and Dickson would occupy half forward flanks with Gia and Dahl alternating in the other FP. There has been too much pressure I believe on Jones to be our No. 1 forward which I do not think he is at this stage. I do not see Cordy as a full forward. If he is to make it at League level it will be as a ruckman.

Why wouldn't Talia and Roughead be our two key defenders with Roberts as our key forward? By the time any of this occurs Gia will be retired.

[Eastdog]

Why wouldn't Talia and Roughead be our two key defenders with Roberts as our key forward? By the time any of this occurs Gia will be retired.

How would he connect with Stringer?

[bornadog]

How would he connect with Stringer?

Stringer isnot considered a tall, he will eventually have stints as a midfielder /forward

[The Underdog]

How would he connect with Stringer?

Verbally, visually, physically, karmically, questionably.

Stringer can play ff but he needs talls around him. He's not big enough to play against a Carlisle type.

[GVGjr]

But isn't Dahlhaus still learning too? Dahlhaus has played 41 games, which is less than Jones, Roughead and Liberatore....I think sometimes this gets lost.

He and Jones have a pretty hard task at the moment....Dahlhaus usually gets teh best small defender, and Jones gets the best key backman - they get poor supply - and they are really still in the infancy of their careers.

I think Dahlhaus will be better for a run with Williamstown and I feel more confident with Jones.

I think Dahlhaus is great but he is well down on his best. 2 weeks at Williamstown will get him back to his best

[bornadog]

I think Dahlhaus will be better for a run with Williamstown and I feel more confident with Jones.

I think Dahlhaus is great but he is well down on his best. 2 weeks at Williamstown will get him back to his best

If we weren't playing GWS I would agree. At least he gets to play against his own age. Another reason why Hunter should have played.

[Twodogs]

Jeremy Cameron might be a late out for GWS.

[chef]

Jeremy Cameron might be a late out for GWS.

Hope so, can see him kicking a bag against us today.

[Before I Die]

I think Dahlhaus will be better for a run with Williamstown and I feel more confident with Jones.

I think Dahlhaus is great but he is well down on his best. 2 weeks at Williamstown will get him back to his best

But Williamstown dont have a game this week, so is Dahlhaus better off playing or sitting out for a week? A rest will be good for Hunter, Dahlhaus needs to play.

[G-Mo77]

Jeremy Cameron might be a late out for GWS.

Great news for us!

[Bulldog4life]

Jeremy Cameron might be a late out for GWS.

No he is in

[Topdog]

But Williamstown dont have a game this week, so is Dahlhaus better off playing or sitting out for a week? A rest will be good for Hunter, Dahlhaus needs to play.

A rest good for Hunter? He pretty much had last week off