It's time

[Twodogs]

The AFL experiment into the Western Suburbs of Sydney is teetering. It's like a giant hole that is sucking money through one end and producing nothing out of the other. A huge revenue wrecking machine.

Now is the time to abandon GWS and move the license to Tasmania in order to shore up an area that is actually interested in AFL football.

[bulldogtragic]

The AFL experiment into the Western Suburbs of Sydney is teetering. It's like a giant hole that is sucking money through one end and producing nothing out of the other. A huge revenue wrecking machine.

Now is the time to abandon GWS and move the license to Tasmania in order to shore up an area that is actually interested in AFL football.
AFL are too stubborn. Maybe two more years of abject failure, low crowds, failure to sign decent FA's, exodus of gun kids etc, then Tassie government to make a serious bid.

[whythelongface]

I was just thinking that myself (not the Tassie move) that the GWS experiment will become a rank failure. They were seriously banking on getting Buddy up here to promote the team. Plus also a number of players already requesting releases back to their home states there must be some serious doubts as to the long term viability of this club as it stands.

Where to from here for the club? Who do they go after? How do they retain their current list?

[Eastdog]

Yeah I reckon the GWS franchise in the Western Suburbs of Sydney has not been a success at all so far. The AFL is hoping to get the support from a clearly Rugby dominated heartland and soccer as well with the huge success of the Western Sydney Wanderers which would of gained a lot of support.

[Murphy'sLore]

It's never going to work. The AFL should pull the pin and invest those resources where they can actually do some good. Unfortunately I can't see them admitting it's all been a 'giant' mistake.

[Eastdog]

The GWS franchise is like having an NRL franchise in Adelaide and Perth for instance which are both AFL mad like ourselves.

[LostDoggy]

Ha! TD, they'd never admit it. They'd be the laughing stock. Instead we'll prop them up for fifteen years, and then move them to Tassie.

[azabob]

They won't be relocated.

They will merge with a Melbourne based club - ala Brisbane & Fitzroy.

[Topdog]

if AD goes to the ATP than it will happen

[bulldogtragic]

I wonder what the GWS ratings are like in NSW?

[Bulldog Joe]

Bit early to call.

They are in for the long haul and TV is still the big issue.

They need to generate enough interest on the TV screens of Western Sydney and I expect a 10 year horizon (and possibly longer0 at least before you can label it a fail.

Sydney have obviously given some grief with the Franklin deal, but that just might give the rivalry they are looking for. A Natanui type player to the Giants can change things pretty quickly.

[Throughandthrough]

Bit early to call.

They are in for the long haul and TV is still the big issue.

They need to generate enough interest on the TV screens of Western Sydney and I expect a 10 year horizon (and possibly longer0 at least before you can label it a fail.

Sydney have obviously given some grief with the Franklin deal, but that just might give the rivalry they are looking for. A Natanui type player to the Giants can change things pretty quickly.



Very early on the AFL called it a 20 or 25 year plan. And they have allready got their $$$ back with the extra $$$$ for the TV deal.

[bornadog]

The AFL experiment into the Western Suburbs of Sydney is teetering. It's like a giant hole that is sucking money through one end and producing nothing out of the other. A huge revenue wrecking machine.

Now is the time to abandon GWS and move the license to Tasmania in order to shore up an area that is actually interested in AFL football.

The money should be pored into us, give us priority picks, pump the money in, wipe the debt, increase the football department spend, get us a premiership - yes 60 years is too long, its time

[comrade]

The money should be pored into us, give us priority picks, pump the money in, wipe the debt, increase the football department spend, get us a premiership - yes 60 years is too long, its time

We could follow the Melbourne model.

Tank for 5 years, appoint incompetent administrators and coaching staff, neglect to implement a development program, burn early draft picks, recruit washed up hacks and the AFL will keep the priority picks flowing, give us a huge wad of cash and hand deliver the most in demand coach in the land.

We shouldn't even touch the debt and just pile all our funds into the footy department. If it goes balls up, the AFL will bail us out. It's worked for the Demons and Port. :D

[Greystache]

We could follow the Melbourne model.

Tank for 5 years, appoint incompetent administrators and coaching staff, neglect to implement a development program, burn early draft picks, recruit washed up hacks and the AFL will keep the priority picks flowing, give us a huge wad of cash and hand deliver the most in demand coach in the land.

Some former posters will tell you we already did all that :D

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

The money should be pored into us, give us priority picks, pump the money in, wipe the debt, increase the football department spend, get us a premiership - yes 60 years is too long, its time

The poorer Melbourne based clubs like Melbourne North Saints and Bulldogs will continue to struggle at the expense of the AFL's need to continue to pour millions of dollars into the likes of GWS and Port Power to protect its National competition which is largely driven dollar wise by the huge membership based clubs such as Collingwood, Hawthorn Carlton and Essendon who will continue to maintain the best draws and TV time spots. The ability of Hawthorn to recruit Hale Gibson Gunston Burgoyne and our own Brian Lake is because of those players wanting to be part of a winning culture that comes from excellent leadership and sound governance. Our task is a monumental one but is achieveable.
Finding an extra 20,000 members would be a good starting point.

[Scorlibo]

Interesting topic. As someone who grew up as a complete footy nut in Canberra, I can't begin to express my excitement when games were played at Manuka Oval, even more so when it was the Doggies.

Footy was always delayed on the telly, footy commentary shows were hard to come by and local coverage was often off the mark. Since I've moved to Melbourne, GWS has come in with 'Canberra' written on their back, the NEAFL has taken off with my junior club Eastlake now competing against AFL players and well-credentialed state league players, TV coverage has improved in the region and to be honest, I'm a big fan of all that's going on.

The reaction which I generally experience from people in Melbourne is the traditionalist us vs them, VIC vs NSW, AFL vs NRL view. Obviously people want to protect their club and the WB/FFC will always come before the AFL for me, but it's a national game and I can assure you that there are hardcore footy fans living in NSW who will be absolutely loving the direction the AFL is heading in.

Fundamentally, I have faith in the quality of our sport and that given the right exposure it will compete with the rugby codes in the rugby heartland. If it's financially viable for the AFL (which it appears to be) then I say it's a wonderful thing. Just a different perspective.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Interesting topic. As someone who grew up as a complete footy nut in Canberra, I can't begin to express my excitement when games were played at Manuka Oval, even more so when it was the Doggies.

Footy was always delayed on the telly, footy commentary shows were hard to come by and local coverage was often off the mark. Since I've moved to Melbourne, GWS has come in with 'Canberra' written on their back, the NEAFL has taken off with my junior club Eastlake now competing against AFL players and well-credentialed state league players, TV coverage has improved in the region and to be honest, I'm a big fan of all that's going on.

The reaction which I generally experience from people in Melbourne is the traditionalist us vs them, VIC vs NSW, AFL vs NRL view. Obviously people want to protect their club and the WB/FFC will always come before the AFL for me, but it's a national game and I can assure you that there are hardcore footy fans living in NSW who will be absolutely loving the direction the AFL is heading in.

Fundamentally, I have faith in the quality of our sport and that given the right exposure it will compete with the rugby codes in the rugby heartland. If it's financially viable for the AFL (which it appears to be) then I say it's a wonderful thing. Just a different perspective.
Great to read Scorbilo, if there is that potential market there then let's give them AFL, the best thing possible. Do Canberrans see themselves as more connected to NSW than Vic generally? As a Victorian, which gave birth to ACT because Melb was the capital of Aus and the nancies in Sydney got upset about that and all of that, do Canberrans recognise the connection with Melbourne and hence AFL v Rugby League?

[Scorlibo]

Great to read Scorbilo, if there is that potential market there then let's give them AFL, the best thing possible. Do Canberrans see themselves as more connected to NSW than Vic generally? As a Victorian, which gave birth to ACT because Melb was the capital of Aus and the nancies in Sydney got upset about that and all of that, do Canberrans recognise the connection with Melbourne and hence AFL v Rugby League?

There's definitely more of a NSW connection mate but Canberra's a funny place - people come from all over Australia to find a job in the public service there and so what you find is that there will be a smattering of die hard footy fans who come from Victoria, Tassie, WA and SA. My mother as a case in point grew up in Footscray then transferred from Melbourne to Canberra from within the public service in the eighties.

In the nineties and early noughties NRL and Union were quite popular because the Canberra Raiders and ACT Brumbies won premierships in their respective codes. Since then it's levelled out. League fans are far less fanatical than AFL and Union followers generally speaking.

The unfortunate thing is that free to air TV has for years dictated which sport kids grow up following. As probably the most AFL-crazy kid you could find, I still followed the NRL pretty avidly because that's what was broadcast. I was lucky to have a grandfather who cut out Bulldogs articles from the herald sun and mailed them off to me on a weekly basis :).

I don't visit Sydney all that often, but purely from a Canberran's perspective there is a lot of potential there for AFL to take hold. I have a GWS membership.

[LostDoggy]

In terms of on field performance, i think we need to remember how bad Gold Coast were in there second season. They got smashed all year and started showing little glimpses towards the end of the year.

Then we all saw the improvement in there third year.

Another preason for the Giants will make a huge difference, as it did with the Suns. Mumford is a huge recruit and if they can pick up 1 or 2 more quality mature players i could see them winning 5/6 games next season.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

There's definitely more of a NSW connection mate but Canberra's a funny place - people come from all over Australia to find a job in the public service there and so what you find is that there will be a smattering of die hard footy fans who come from Victoria, Tassie, WA and SA. My mother as a case in point grew up in Footscray then transferred from Melbourne to Canberra from within the public service in the eighties.

In the nineties and early noughties NRL and Union were quite popular because the Canberra Raiders and ACT Brumbies won premierships in their respective codes. Since then it's levelled out. League fans are far less fanatical than AFL and Union followers generally speaking.

The unfortunate thing is that free to air TV has for years dictated which sport kids grow up following. As probably the most AFL-crazy kid you could find, I still followed the NRL pretty avidly because that's what was broadcast. I was lucky to have a grandfather who cut out Bulldogs articles from the herald sun and mailed them off to me on a weekly basis :).

I don't visit Sydney all that often, but purely from a Canberran's perspective there is a lot of potential there for AFL to take hold. I have a GWS membership.

I walked on Manuka Oval in 1970 with a Canberran who was showing me the team that he played for's (grammar:o) home ground. So it was an Australian Rules ground way back then, so there's been a long term connection with the code in Canberra. He and other Canberrans were boarders at St Bede's College in Mentone, so there's another connection with Melbourne and the code. These connections can't be bought a la GWS from NRL followers with allegiances, there needs to be a prior connection or disenchantment.
So much of footy is loyalty and the heart and the heart doesn't open itself up too readily. Obviously Melb Storm have had success in getting support but I would guess it has been incredibly costly and no doubt at the expense of some of the traditional teams in the NRL.
I think GWS is important for the long term health of AFL, The largest state must have two teams for the health of the national competition but I wish we were still the VFL. Footy was more fun then, less corporate, more the people's game, more local, more communal, more primal.