The Malthouse Assistant Coach Empire: Over?

[bulldogtragic]

Once upon a time having Assistant Coach to Mick Malthouse on your resume was a ticket to a senior appointment. Is today officially the end of the empire?

- Watters: Sacked
- Neeld: Sacked
- Scott: Under achieved
- Buckley: Under achieved
- Laidley: Sacked (from North)
- McKenna: Jury still out

That's just off the top of my head, there may be more.

[bornadog]

I have never rated Malthouse.

[Maddog37]

Weird bloke but has won more flags than us.

[Happy Days]

I have never rated Malthouse.

C'mon man.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

C'mon man.

Malthouse got the very best out of some average players during his coaching tenure at the Western Bulldogs. His competitive spirit on the field was matched in getting the best out of the players he coached.WCE had limited success before Malthouse's appointment, where he led them to two premierships.IMO Malthouse rates very highly in the coaching stakes at the WB over the past 30 years.

[Hotdog60]

I would rate him as a coach but I can't warm to him as a person. Is he getting a bit past it? How he goes at Carlton will soon tell.

[Remi Moses]

I would rate him as a coach but I can't warm to him as a person. Is he getting a bit past it? How he goes at Carlton will soon tell.

Crap bloke . Very good coach

[Remi Moses]

Malthouse got the very best out of some average players during his coaching tenure at the Western Bulldogs. His competitive spirit on the field was matched in getting the best out of the players he coached.WCE had limited success before Malthouse's appointment, where he led them to two premierships.IMO Malthouse rates very highly in the coaching stakes at the WB over the past 30 years.

His 87 performance was outstanding.
He says that was his best year coaching and favourite. That team was awful and pre salary cap, so we lost players. Still our best coach in my time.

[bornadog]

C'mon man.

ok, as a person.

as a coach - I do think he is past his best

[Topdog]

ok, as a person.

as a coach - I do think he is past his best

being past his best is very different from "I have never rated him"

[Scorlibo]

The way I see it his hard nosed coaching style is outdated and only still works for him because he's Mick Malthouse and he demands respect. Someone like Mark Neeld once he lost the respect of his players had no way of turning things around because he took the, 'no, I'm right, we'll just keep on ploughing away' attitude like Malthouse. You can see it in Buckley too but Bucks seems to have the footy brain and respect at Collingwood to succeed.

[bornadog]

Malthouse got the very best out of some average players during his coaching tenure at the Western Bulldogs. His competitive spirit on the field was matched in getting the best out of the players he coached.WCE had limited success before Malthouse's appointment, where he led them to two premierships.IMO Malthouse rates very highly in the coaching stakes at the WB over the past 30 years.

Whilst we had a very good season in 1985, Malthouse failed to get us to any other finals in subsequent years. I believe we had the players at the time, but he just didn't have the ability to get them up for many games. I still maintain, we should have won the 1985 prelim, but we were outcoached.

[jeemak]

I think Buckley, dealing with a bunch of wankers and egos is probably doing OK.

How he rebuilds the list and turns around attitude and performance over the next two years will be interesting to see.

[Topdog]

Which Scott was under Malthouse? Laidley is still considered a great tactician and IMO wasn't a failure as a coach.

[Scorlibo]

I think Buckley, dealing with a bunch of wankers and egos is probably doing OK.

How he rebuilds the list and turns around attitude and performance over the next two years will be interesting to see.

And this is where Mick was poor for mine. I've heard Rocket talk privately about his own role at Collingwood and he made it pretty clear that there were some big attitude problems at the club partially the result of Mick being okay with players acting unprofessionally so long as they performed on game day.

[chef]

Which Scott was under Malthouse? Laidley is still considered a great tactician and IMO wasn't a failure as a coach.

Brad.

[bulldogtragic]

Brad.
Yep, & Chris was Freo.

[LongWait]

Which Scott was under Malthouse? Laidley is still considered a great tactician and IMO wasn't a failure as a coach.

Laidley was despised by a good number of the playing group and was perceived within the club as failing abysmally in getting the best out of a number of important players. Laidley took Norf precisely nowhere.

[FrediKanoute]

Whilst we had a very good season in 1985, Malthouse failed to get us to any other finals in subsequent years. I believe we had the players at the time, but he just didn't have the ability to get them up for many games. I still maintain, we should have won the 1985 prelim, but we were outcoached.

Maybe. 1986 was horrible. Dougie and Allan Daniels do their knees. So too did Mick McLean from memory. Hardie lost form. Jim Edmond was lured North to Sydney (may have been 1987); Les Bamblett got injured and never recovered. There was so much that went wrong in 86 compared to 85, that you can't lay it all at Mick's feet.

[jeemak]

Laidley was despised by a good number of the playing group and was perceived within the club as failing abysmally in getting the best out of a number of important players. Laidley took Norf precisely nowhere.

I can see that with Laidley, though no coach is perfect. North's biggest issue when Laidley was in charge was that they were extremely ordinary talent wise.

They could push a top four team like us, and beat us when we weren't on our game and didn't work hard enough to move the ball quickly or even get first hands on it in 2008 or thereabouts. But, they just didn't have the talent to perform that way consistently.

Every senior coach has weaknesses, and strengths. Some are very lucky to have very talented players at their disposal which can shield and heighten those respective traits. Others get a lot out of playing lists that aren't that flash.

There's very little question of Laidley's capability as a tactician and a developer of certain types of players.

[Remi Moses]

Maybe. 1986 was horrible. Dougie and Allan Daniels do their knees. So too did Mick McLean from memory. Hardie lost form. Jim Edmond was lured North to Sydney (may have been 1987); Les Bamblett got injured and never recovered. There was so much that went wrong in 86 compared to 85, that you can't lay it all at Mick's feet.

We lost our captain, we had injuries and teams like Carlton got Kernahan Motley, Bradley . Hawks got Platten in, and we got Tim Gepp.
The club was broke and Malthouse did a great job.
If you think it's tough now even in the salary cap era, just imagine back then.

[jeemak]

We lost our captain, we had injuries and teams like Carlton got Kernahan Motley, Bradley . Hawks got Platten in, and we got Tim Gepp.
The club was broke and Malthouse did a great job.
If you think it's tough now even in the salary cap era, just imagine back then.

You can understand why teams like Carlton rallied away from equalisation measures like the salary cap, and you can understand why the bigger teams rally away from equalisation efforts now.

There's been discrepancies in zoning, player access and funds from the outset since we joined the competition.

On topic, most coaches fail. Most coaches get pushed when they don't want to leave a club. New coaches come from teams that have had premiership success, or have been close when they were assistants.

The only reason why ex-Collingwood coaches who have become senior coaches are getting the arse now is because Collingwood could pay enough to get the best talent in for assistant roles and that they oversaw Collingwood playing good footy. It doesn't have a lot to do with Malthouse.

[Topdog]

Laidley was despised by a good number of the playing group and was perceived within the club as failing abysmally in getting the best out of a number of important players. Laidley took Norf precisely nowhere.

How many coaches at North will get the blame before people realise maybe just maybe their players arent very good?

[LongWait]

How many coaches at North will get the blame before people realise maybe just maybe their players arent very good?

I'm referring to Laidley only - not other coaches and not the quality of the playing group.

Laidley is apparently a prick of a bloke and his personality and the way he related to some players became a huge issue for the whole club. See Watters for an insight as to what Laidley was like.

[Topdog]

He may be a prick of a bloke but he is a good coach. Man management he may be terrible in, he didnt fail at the Kangas though IMO

[LostDoggy]

Whilst we had a very good season in 1985, Malthouse failed to get us to any other finals in subsequent years. I believe we had the players at the time, but he just didn't have the ability to get them up for many games. I still maintain, we should have won the 1985 prelim, but we were outcoached.

I agree with you. Never rated Malthouse either. The Eagles had plenty of talent and money to get them to 92 & 94, he took ten years to win a flag with the richest, most resourced, team in the league, fixture on a platter, write your own footy department cheque. And they drew the first Gf before winning it a week later. He doesn't seem to have left Collingwood the healthiest of cultures, and watching Carlton this year it was obvious he's up against it at Visy too. The 2010 flag was his last.

[Twodogs]

We lost our captain, we had injuries and teams like Carlton got Kernahan Motley, Bradley . Hawks got Platten in, and we got Tim Gepp.

And Tony Macguiness, Murray Rance and Max Crow. Gepp came to us because he was delisted by Richmond but he was a mate of Malthouse-no other club would have bothered with him-Michael Rolfe joined from Richmond that year under the same rule.


The club was broke and Malthouse did a great job.

Malthouse did more than most to help get the club into the financial position it was in. He cant break something then complain because or point to the fact it was broken as a reason he didnt succeed.


Malthouse is the luckiest and most overrated coach in VFL/AFL history. He put himself ahead of the club on several occasions.

[azabob]

Malthouse did more than most to help get the club into the financial position it was in. He cant break something then complain because or point to the fact it was broken as a reason he didnt .

Are you able to elaborate more ?

[Happy Days]

And Tony Macguiness, Murray Rance and Max Crow. Gepp came to us because he was delisted by Richmond but he was a mate of Malthouse-no other club would have bothered with him-Michael Rolfe joined from Richmond that year under the same rule.



Malthouse did more than most to help get the club into the financial position it was in. He cant break something then complain because or point to the fact it was broken as a reason he didnt succeed.


Malthouse is the luckiest and most overrated coach in VFL/AFL history. He put himself ahead of the club on several occasions.

Okay so 25 years ago he sold us down the river (maybe, this all pre dates me so I'll take your word for it) but not even 4 years ago he won a premiership, his third one by the way, which is three more than the vast majority of coaches ever will.

You guys are all letting your hatred blind you here.

[Greystache]

I agree with you. Never rated Malthouse either. The Eagles had plenty of talent and money to get them to 92 & 94, he took ten years to win a flag with the richest, most resourced, team in the league, fixture on a platter, write your own footy department cheque. And they drew the first Gf before winning it a week later. He doesn't seem to have left Collingwood the healthiest of cultures, and watching Carlton this year it was obvious he's up against it at Visy too. The 2010 flag was his last.

Ten years to win a flag at a club that had won 1 in the previous 50 is not fast enough?

If you look at each club and his tenure there it's pretty hard to argue against.

Footscray- 84-89, 6 years 1 preliminary final

West Coast- 90-99, 10 years, 3 grand finals, 2 premierships

Collingwood- 2000-2012- 13 years, 4 grand finals, 1 premiership

You can argue he had a heap of advantages and a host of other things, but those club's he coached only have 2 premierships between them since the 60's and their inception respectively without Malthouse coaching them.

[Remi Moses]

And Tony Macguiness, Murray Rance and Max Crow. Gepp came to us because he was delisted by Richmond but he was a mate of Malthouse-no other club would have bothered with him-Michael Rolfe joined from Richmond that year under the same rule.



Malthouse did more than most to help get the club into the financial position it was in. He cant break something then complain because or point to the fact it was broken as a reason he didnt succeed.


Malthouse is the luckiest and most overrated coach in VFL/AFL history. He put himself ahead of the club on several occasions.

Surely you couldn't be going into bat for Hardie?
Not sure what you're implying that Malthouse was overpaid?

[Twodogs]

No. I'm saying we payed insane amounts of money we didn't have in transfer fees and contracts for players in Malthouse's time. We unearthed a few gems but there were lots of duds on good money to go with them.

[LongWait]

He may be a prick of a bloke but he is a good coach. Man management he may be terrible in, he didnt fail at the Kangas though IMO

He quit the team midway through his seventh season with a 48% win/loss record over his senior coaching career. Under Laidley, North played in 5 finals, winning only one of them.

Laidley is a very ordinary to poor coach, whose tactical nouse couldn't make up for the serious deficiencies in most other areas.

If Laidley was any good at all, he would have been appointed to another gig during an era when many clubs have struggled to find a suitably qualified and experienced coach.

[Sedat]

If Laidley was any good at all, he would have been appointed to another gig during an era when many clubs have struggled to find a suitably qualified and experienced coach.
Don't disagree with your comments on Laidley but to be fair to him, it has been all the rage in the last few years for clubs to appoint young unproven rookie coaches to the senior gig, leaving the likes of Laidley to be pigeon-holed into that senior assistant role, and he's had no trouble securing those types of gigs since he left Norf.

[LongWait]

Don't disagree with your comments on Laidley but to be fair to him, it has been all the rage in the last few years for clubs to appoint young unproven rookie coaches to the senior gig, leaving the likes of Laidley to be pigeon-holed into that senior assistant role, and he's had no trouble securing those types of gigs since he left Norf.

Was he considered for our job? What about at Carlton? Melbourne? Brisbane? Fremantle? There are at least five recent coaching appointments where a young coach was not the first/preferred option. Will he be considered seriously by St.Kilda?

Could it be that young coaches are being appointed because the available older coaches are not that good. The better older coaches always seem to get at least one more crack at it, if not more.