Pick of the 2010 - 2012 Drafts

[Go_Dogs]

Ok, so it's still early days for all of these players, but I think there might be some tight competition in coming years as to which crop is our best. As it stands, based on players still on our list, we have the following.

2010:
Mitch Wallis
Tom Liberatore
Luke Dahlhaus (rookie draft)
Jason Johannisen (rookie draft)

2011:
Clay Smith
Michael Talia
Daniel Pearce
Tory Dickson
Fletcher Roberts (pre-season draft)
Lin Jong (rookie draft)
Tom Campbell (rookie draft)
Alex Greenwood (rookie draft)
Jack Redpath (rookie draft)
Mark Austin (rookie draft)

2012:
Jack Macrae
Jake Stringer
Nathan Hrovat
Lachie Hunter
Josh Prudden
Brett Goodes (rookie draft)


Based on what we have seen, the high end quality of 2010 and 2012 seems very strong, but I'm equally as excited by 2011 - Clay Smith can become a solid senior performer, whilst we appear to have done well in the key position stakes with Talia and Campbell who should both become long term players in important posts.

Crystal balling, which draft do you think will end up our best or most important to our future?

[GVGjr]

They are all very different but most are very important players for us in a club hell bent on developing young players.

I'd say 2010 was the best draft for us. Liberatore is one out of the box and Wallis should be a very good midfielder and spare parts player for us. Dahlhaus still has a couple of levels he can achieve and Johannisen can be a vital small defender for us.

2012 is the next best for mine as Stringer and Macrae look like being damaging players and Hunter and Hrovat very exciting ones. A good blend.

2011 has 4 solid players for us. I doubt they have a star quality about them but are all hard workers. Talia is hopefully a 10 year defender for us and Campbell the ruckman forward that we have been hoping for. Smith will hopefully be the bull midfielder we need.

Some good selections by the recruiting team

[Throughandthrough]

Just to be different I will say Tom Campbell. (Apart from Libba...)

[Happy Days]

Based on the selections you would hope 2012 would be the best draft; 2 top 6 picks and 3 top 21 picks should result in 3 very high level players, plus Hunter looks very likely.

But Liberatore's body of work almost forces me to say 2010; already the best clearance player in the game and doesn't appear to have come close to his ceiling.

[Remi Moses]

Libba stands out obviously.
I think we'll look at 2012 as a turning point, and if you get 3 good players from a draft you've done well.

[boydogs]

2012, those guys haven't had much time to prove themselves compared to the 2010 guys but 5 of them are probably best 22 already, and you haven't counted the trades of Stevens & Young

[The Bulldogs Bite]

What it does highlight is how astute we've been at the draft and trade table in this short period of time. As the post above says, Stevens, Young, Goodes and now Crameri aren't included but the list has dramatically strengthened in a short space of time.

Libba's work to date has been absolutely incredible and Dahlhaus is a special player too, so 2010 is ahead for now, but I think in 2 years time 2012 will be scary good.

2011 is important too, though. None of Smith, Talia and Campbell are or will be elite players but they are very, very important keys to the side moving forward.

[Doc26]

Just to be different I will say Tom Campbell. (Apart from Libba...)

Agree. Although Libba brings me the most pleasure to watch his progress, Campbell was the bargain pick up and possibly the most valuable of the lot. Aside from Naitanui and his freakish ability and potential, who should've been the number one selection ahead of Watts, of the current crop of ruck / forwards going around Tom is capable of matching it if not surpassing any of them based on his progress to date.

As he hits the prime age for a ruckman his stocks will be as high as any going around and keeping him may become our biggest challenge as the vultures come circling.

[bornadog]

What it does highlight is how astute we've been at the draft and trade table in this short period of time. As the post above says, Stevens, Young, Goodes and now Crameri aren't included but the list has dramatically strengthened in a short space of time.

Libba's work to date has been absolutely incredible and Dahlhaus is a special player too, so 2010 is ahead for now, but I think in 2 years time 2012 will be scary good.

2011 is important too, though. None of Smith, Talia and Campbell are or will be elite players but they are very, very important keys to the side moving forward.

just goes to show by not winning many games you get to have early picks which is hard to stuff up these days. The crop of players available in 2012 you couldn't go wrong, even with the compromised draft. We were lucky in 2010 with the FS selections.

overall it's a tough question G16 has asked, but I think Macrae and Stringer are going to be outstanding. In fact I have said it before Macrae will be the big improver this year and will become elite. Libba is a gem and will prove to be even better than his dad.

[always right]

just goes to show by not winning many games you get to have early picks which is hard to stuff up these days. The crop of players available in 2012 you couldn't go wrong, even with the compromised draft. We were lucky in 2010 with the FS selections.

overall it's a tough question G16 has asked, but I think Macrae and Stringer are going to be outstanding. In fact I have said it before Macrae will be the big improver this year and will become elite. Libba is a gem and will prove to be even better than his dad.

He already is. More talented and almost as determined as his father.

[Cyberdoggie]

I think 2012 will be the best draft we've ever had, especially from the recruiters point of view. Apart from Hunter Dalrymple has had to put his neck out and select these players over other equally talented options.
In my opinion he hasn't made any mistakes, they all look like being excellent players.
Prudden will come on slower than the others and he has a lot of competition in his role now but once his body is right and he is able to compete with men, I think he'll surprise a few.
It's not often you look at draft years and see that every player selected will contribute significantly.


Hunter for a late father son selection has surprised me considerably. He showed he had some ability but I thought he may of been a little immature/naïve when drafted. What has surprised me is his cool under pressure and vision on the field. Hunter knows the right spots to be in and where to put it and he seems to be really pushing himself in training, an area where I thought he might be a problem. I can't fault his professionalism so far and I think he's set for a really big year.

This group will catapult the dogs from bottom table to top quality class.

[bulldogtragic]

I think 2012 will be the best draft we've ever had, especially from the recruiters point of view. Apart from Hunter Dalrymple has had to put his neck out and select these players over other equally talented options.
In my opinion he hasn't made any mistakes, they all look like being excellent players.
Prudden will come on slower than the others and he has a lot of competition in his role now but once his body is right and he is able to compete with men, I think he'll surprise a few.
It's not often you look at draft years and see that every player selected will contribute significantly.


Hunter for a late father son selection has surprised me considerably. He showed he had some ability but I thought he may of been a little immature/naïve when drafted. What has surprised me is his cool under pressure and vision on the field. Hunter knows the right spots to be in and where to put it and he seems to be really pushing himself in training, an area where I thought he might be a problem. I can't fault his professionalism so far and I think he's set for a really big year.

This group will catapult the dogs from bottom table to top quality class.

I hope you're right on best ever, if we surpass the class of 99, then Stringer, McCrae and Hunter will all be one club players around the 250 game mark and 300+ goals between them. I can live with this scenario! :)

[bornadog]

He already is. More talented and almost as determined as his father.

Libba senior won a brownlow and is in our team of the century. Long way yo go yet for Tom

[Remi Moses]

Agree, ^^ I reckon Dads years of 90 and in particular 91 ( coming back from a reco he won the b+f)were outstanding.
Unfortunately Dad's latter years are what most remember.

[Bulldog Joe]

The real strength is the combination of 3 years together that will build a very good team.
Just like compound interest we have a chance to develop compound success by doing it right in 3 consecutive years.

[always right]

Libba senior won a brownlow and is in our team of the century. Long way yo go yet for Tom

Libba snr has the runs on the board no doubt....but do you think he's more talented than his son or did he just extract every bit of talent he had?

[w3design]

I think Wal. is getting overlooked a bit here. While his progress has been a little slower than Libba Jnr to-date, I suspect that is merely a development rate issue. Pre drafting I would have thought there was not a great deal between them, and Wal if anything might have been marginally in front at the time. While I expect Libba to go to another level this season, I would not be surprised to see Wal begin to narrow the gap between them once again. I expect in a few years time he might even be our midfield lynch pin, and a young general.

I hope a lot of the other recent draftees do reach their potential, if they do we are in for one hell of a ride. Of the others, Hunter is just a natural, and if he can fully harness and realise his full ability, he will be right up there with our best and most creative.

The next draft is likely to be the last for some years where we will have a high draft pick, and that in a pool less compromised than any for a while. I hope Dalrymple can pull off at least one more ripper draft for us. Then BMac will really have the ammunition to make a serious assault on the flag.

[bornadog]

Libba snr has the runs on the board no doubt....but do you think he's more talented than his son or did he just extract every bit of talent he had?

No doubt senior extracted every bit he had left in him, but he delivered consistently and yes he has the runs on the board. I can see Tom has skills his father never had but its early days yet. If he continues on this path, he will be a true A grader.

[always right]

No doubt senior extracted every bit he had left in him, but he delivered consistently and yes he has the runs on the board. I can see Tom has skills his father never had but its early days yet. If he continues on this path, he will be a true A grader.

I loved Libba snr but if you had the choice today of Libba snr at his peak or Libba jnr in his current state...who would you pick....honestly?

[Twodogs]

I loved Libba snr but if you had the choice today of Libba snr at his peak or Libba jnr in his current state...who would you pick....honestly?



Libba sr. circa 1990-95 easily (maybe not that easily) When Tom has won his Brownlow and B&Fs we can look at their careers.

Tony had a tank like no other. He was quick with his hands, ruthless of mind, knew where the footy was going to land and was good overhead. He had talent.

[always right]

Libba sr. circa 1990-95 easily (maybe not that easily) When Tom has won his Brownlow and B&Fs we can look at their careers.

Tony had a tank like no other. He was quick with his hands, ruthless of mind, knew where the footy was going to land and was good overhead. He had talent.

The most mentally tough player ever to play at the club....but had major deficiences i.e. lack of pace, poor kick, didn't kick goals. A tribute to him that despite this he still carved out an outstanding career.

What are Libba jnr's deficiencies? I would suggest lack of pace although he has shown marked improvement over the last 12 months. He tackles almost as well as his father, he has similar determination and will to compete. He is a vastly superior kick, more creative by hand, looks to be more of a goal kicker and I reckon he's smarter and reads the play as well if not better than his father. I think the only area his old man has on him is longevity...for obvious reasons.

[bulldogtragic]

Libba sr. circa 1990-95 easily (maybe not that easily) When Tom has won his Brownlow and B&Fs we can look at their careers.

Tony had a tank like no other. He was quick with his hands, ruthless of mind, knew where the footy was going to land and was good overhead. He had talent.

The problem is flogs like Mike Sheehan interview Snr for 30 minutes and spend 29 and three quarter minutes talking about how he pushed boundaries, smacked Knights and was generally disliked. Snr was it and a bit, he was the only player in history as far as I'm aware to win the under 19's, reserves and senior league (AFL) best and fairest.

[Ozza]

One thing Senior had - was that he played well every week.
Week in week out you got the same ferocious appetite for the contest, and maximum effort.
If Tom can mimic these traits over his whole career - with the talents he has - then he'll be one hell of a player.

[Maddog37]

Where do people think Snr rated as a player in his best years? Top 5 in league?

[bulldogtragic]

Where do people think Snr rated as a player in his best years? Top 5 in league?

Geez, that's about the toughest question I've seen here for a while... His Brownlow suggests he was, but instinctively I'd say not, but I think that's because everything about Snr's history from the media is not focused on his talent. But the Brownlow alone says he's top 5. So yes.

[anfo27]

Agree that senior is miles ahead with an amazing CV. Only player to ever win a Morrish medal, Gardner medal & Brownlow medal & this from a player who had little natural ability. Senior would be the sportsman i admire more than anyone. To achieve what he did with his ability is hard to believe & watching his career i would say he has the biggest heart of any player i have ever seen.

Tom on the other hand has been blessed with a truckload of natural ability. Tom is better in just about every category than dad (except tackling) so definitely has the ability to finish his career a better player. First thing that stood out about Tom the first time i saw him play was how great his hands were. Very difficult to stop players like that so i think we have a bulldog great on our hands.

In answer to the question of the thread, well that is a tough question. The 2010 draft has 3 potential A grade players & another good player in JJ but 2012 could prove to be better. I think our first 4 picks of 2012 could be A graders. Hunter has been the biggest surprise, have been really impressed at how clever he is. Exciting times ahead.

[azabob]

I am with AR on the Liberatore clan. To be having this debate so early in Tom's career is a testiment to how good he is and will be.

[Dazza]

If 2012 develops to their potential I think it will be a better draft than 2010.

Both are great drafts though. We've got a pretty good list of kids coming through.

[Mantis]

Geez, that's about the toughest question I've seen here for a while... His Brownlow suggests he was, but instinctively I'd say not, but I think that's because everything about Snr's history from the media is not focused on his talent. But the Brownlow alone says he's top 5. So yes.

He was lucky to be best 5 in our team the year he won the Brownlow.

[Remi Moses]

He was lucky to be best 5 in our team the year he won the Brownlow.

I actually agree with this, and thought he was better in 91.

[bulldogtragic]

I actually agree with this, and thought he was better in 91.

Disposal stats back that up, although he had less tackles and gave away more frees in 1991.

On frees, from 1992 until the end of his career, Libba had more frees given to him, then paid against him. Not sure Mike Sheehan knows that for all Libba's baggage, he got more frees than he gave.

[Twodogs]

Ok, so it's still early days for all of these players, but I think there might be some tight competition in coming years as to which crop is our best. As it stands, based on players still on our list, we have the following.

2010:
Mitch Wallis
Tom Liberatore
Luke Dahlhaus (rookie draft)
Jason Johannisen (rookie draft)

2011:
Clay Smith
Michael Talia
Daniel Pearce
Tory Dickson
Fletcher Roberts (pre-season draft)
Lin Jong (rookie draft)
Tom Campbell (rookie draft)
Alex Greenwood (rookie draft)
Jack Redpath (rookie draft)
Mark Austin (rookie draft)

2012:
Jack Macrae
Jake Stringer
Nathan Hrovat
Lachie Hunter
Josh Prudden
Brett Goodes (rookie draft)


Based on what we have seen, the high end quality of 2010 and 2012 seems very strong, but I'm equally as excited by 2011 - Clay Smith can become a solid senior performer, whilst we appear to have done well in the key position stakes with Talia and Campbell who should both become long term players in important posts.

Crystal balling, which draft do you think will end up our best or most important to our future?

I count 20 players selects selected, 14 still with us (9 are, ah. Premiership players) and 2 on other lists. That's 16 still on AFeL lists. Not bad.

[Mofra]

Macrae, Stringer and Hunter is an excellent haul (throw in Wines and that's arguably the 4 best players in the draft) but I still like 2010 as so many other teams fluffed it so we gain a competitive advantage.

[1eyedog]

Yep 2010:
Mitch Wallis
Tom Liberatore
Luke Dahlhaus (rookie draft)
Jason Johannisen (rookie draft)

Two fell into our lap but the other two were inspired selections.

[Twodogs]

Yep 2010:
Mitch Wallis
Tom Liberatore
Luke Dahlhaus (rookie draft)
Jason Johannisen (rookie draft)

Two fell into our lap but the other two were inspired selections.

Dalrymple had to fight to be able to take two unknowns with our rookie selections. From memory the coaching staff were pressuring him to take a recycled hack that would have probably played games a few games the next season and then be gone type.

I don't know how hard to really argue his case for Dal and JJ but thank god he did. Dalhaus pretty much did walk into the side the next season and started playing at a level above your standard AFeL hack would have played. He kicking a few goals and did this thing called tackling that none of our other forwards had seen another forward do before. In fact I think the only game he missed was because we didn't have a player on the LTI list for him to cover.

Dalhaus is almost our most important player. He's certainly the player who's injury we struggled the most to cover last season.

[Mofra]

Dalrymple had to fight to be able to take two unknowns with our rookie selections. From memory the coaching staff were pressuring him to take a recycled hack that would have probably played games a few games the next season and then be gone type.

I don't know how hard to really argue his case for Dal and JJ but thank god he did. Dalhaus pretty much did walk into the side the next season and started playing at a level above your standard AFeL hack would have played. He kicking a few goals and did this thing called tackling that none of our other forwards had seen another forward do before. In fact I think the only game he missed was because we didn't have a player on the LTI list for him to cover.

Dalhaus is almost our most important player. He's certainly the player who's injury we struggled the most to cover last season.
I remember being really disappointed at the 2011 intra-club that some tiny rookie with dreadlocks was getting heaps of the ball making our established players look silly.

Shit, if a rookie who will be lucky to play a few games in 2012 is flogging us, what will other teams do?

[westdog54]

I count 20 players selects selected, 14 still with us (9 are, ah. Premiership players) and 2 on other lists. That's 16 still on AFeL lists. Not bad.

Didn't we also draft Markovic and Thorne in 2010?

And what year was Zeph Skinner drafted?

[bornadog]

Didn't we also draft Markovic and Thorne in 2010?

And what year was Zeph Skinner drafted?

Markovic (pick 63) and Thorne (pick 76), 2009,
Skinner pick(88), 2010

Not exactly first rounders - :D

[Go_Dogs]

I remember Dahl playing for whoever our VFL affiliate was in his first year at the old Football Park in SA - boy he was impressive with how he moved around the contests. It was obvious he had a lot of skills to translate to the AFL.

If forced to choose, I'd go with 2010. We were gifted 2 (as we kind of were in 2012 with those very early selections) but to hit Dahl and JJ in the rookie draft - that'd have to be one of the greatest efforts ever and they've both got many years left.

[westdog54]

Markovic (pick 63) and Thorne (pick 76), 2009,
Skinner pick(88), 2010

Not exactly first rounders - :D

Right you are.

We also drafted Jayden Schofield and Tom Hill in 2010.

It really was a shallow draft.

[Twodogs]

Right you are.

We also drafted Jayden Schofield and Tom Hill in 2010.

It really was a shallow draft.

shallow enough to let a Norm Smith medallist and a kid ready to step up to AFL level almost straightaway. Lucky for us though.

Was Dalhaus overlooked because of his height, or lack of height? Now everyone is looking for the new Caleb Daniel pocket rocket, soon kids will be making themselves shorter on their CVs.

[bornadog]

shallow enough to let a Norm Smith medallist and a kid ready to step up to AFL level almost straightaway. Lucky for us though.

Was Dalhaus overlooked because of his height, or lack of height? Now everyone is looking for the new Caleb Daniel pocket rocket, soon kids will be making themselves shorter on their CVs.

Dahl was overlooked because of his kicking.

[The Pie Man]

Dahl was overlooked because of his kicking.

I remember reading an interview about how his kicking efficiency was very low, though he & his agent tried to (successfully in WB's case) illustrate that a heap of his possessions were won in heavy traffic and hence under pressure.

The rest, as they say...