The Rumour Mill

[azabob]

A bit of scuttle butt that Sydney is Ryder's end game, not Brisbane. As Remi said earlier that was the original mail back in early August.

[bornadog]

A bit of scuttle butt that Sydney is Ryder's end game, not Brisbane. As Remi said earlier that was the original mail back in early August.

His wife wants to go back to Perth.

[KT31]

A bit of scuttle butt that Sydney is Ryder's end game, not Brisbane. As Remi said earlier that was the original mail back in early August.

Rich just get richer.:mad::(:eek::mad:

[The Underdog]

I wonder how many pages this will be up to by the time the trading period actually starts. The random speculation based on bugger all season grows stronger every year. It's a total feedback loop at this point. I guess at least the Ryder one and Lumumba have some basis but it's going to be 4 more weeks of teams denying baseless stuff like the Walker to Port one. So far about 50% of the guys who are leaving clubs have signed a contract with them within 48 hours.

[bornadog]

I wonder how many pages this will be up to by the time the trading period actually starts. The random speculation based on bugger all season grows stronger every year. It's a total feedback loop at this point. I guess at least the Ryder one and Lumumba have some basis but it's going to be 4 more weeks of teams denying baseless stuff like the Walker to Port one. So far about 50% of the guys who are leaving clubs have signed a contract with them within 48 hours.
Fun discussing and speculating

[ledge]

Contracts are like bargaining tools nowadays as in soccer they mean shit.

[azabob]

His wife wants to go back to Perth.

Is she from Perth, I thought she had ties to Queensland?

As the underdog said, all just filler at the moment.

[bornadog]

Is she from Perth, I thought she had ties to Queensland?

As the underdog said, all just filler at the moment.
I was going by what a business contact said to me yesterday when I was talking to him in Perth. Ryder is from WA.

[The Underdog]

Fun discussing and speculating

I agree, I love trade season. I guess it just feels like the volume is growing while the factualness decreases and we're at a point where none of them can be acted on officially. Maybe I'm just tired of one sided trade proposals dreamed up by keyboard warriors. Maybe I'm annoyed that a player manager could be so stupid as to put a story about regarding a player involved in final this week (even if he does play for Essendon). On the other side, I guess we do need to up the traffic so speculate away :)

[Remi Moses]

It's like a car crash, as you're are always having a look .

[LostDoggy]

I would go in a heartbeat if I was Ryder, why would you want to be around that club over the next couple of years? He's got a free ticket out of the joint and he'll get offered a 5 year deal worth $700,000 p/a. The perfect storm of the ASADA investigation, sob story about his pregnant wife, intertwined with Paddy playing the best footy of his career has opened up an amazing opportunity for him. Suspect the Lions will do a legitimate trade deal with the Bombers so as to not enforce the clause and open up a can of worms, but it will only be their second rounder.

This is what I have been hoping and praying for with Essendon, crumbling from the inside out!

[1eyedog]

I agree, I love trade season. I guess it just feels like the volume is growing while the factualness decreases and we're at a point where none of them can be acted on officially. Maybe I'm just tired of one sided trade proposals dreamed up by keyboard warriors. Maybe I'm annoyed that a player manager could be so stupid as to put a story about regarding a player involved in final this week (even if he does play for Essendon). On the other side, I guess we do need to up the traffic so speculate away :)

Me too. If the footy season is the Rambo movies the trade season is definitely Days of Our Lives.

[bornadog]

I would go in a heartbeat if I was Ryder, why would you want to be around that club over the next couple of years? He's got a free ticket out of the joint and he'll get offered a 5 year deal worth $700,000 p/a. The perfect storm of the ASADA investigation, sob story about his pregnant wife, intertwined with Paddy playing the best footy of his career has opened up an amazing opportunity for him. Suspect the Lions will do a legitimate trade deal with the Bombers so as to not enforce the clause and open up a can of worms, but it will only be their second rounder.

This is what I have been hoping and praying for with Essendon, crumbling from the inside out!

I would take Ryder myself he wants to leave.

[LostDoggy]

I would take Ryder myself he wants to leave.

Abso-freakin-lutely!!!

[Flamethrower]

Heard today that Liam Jones was not happy about spending the 2nd half of the season at VFL level and wants to explore a trade out of the club.

Just found a link...

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/western-bulldogs-forward-liam-jones-could-be-on-the-move-shaun-higgins-expected-to-leave/story-fni5f22o-1227050067973

[bulldogtragic]

Heard today that Liam Jones was not happy about spending the 2nd half of the season at VFL level and wants to explore a trade out of the club.

Just found a link...

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/western-bulldogs-forward-liam-jones-could-be-on-the-move-shaun-higgins-expected-to-leave/story-fni5f22o-1227050067973

Jones & Higgins walking out would be a shocking look in my opinion. On Jones Freo would need to trade, but he could walk to Brisbane in the PSD for nada. Not the reaction I was hoping for from Liam, getting pissy about getting dropped when he doesn't touch it...

[G-Mo77]

Jones & Higgins walking out would be a shocking look in my opinion. On Jones Freo would need to trade, but he could walk to Brisbane in the PSD for nada. Not the reaction I was hoping for from Liam, getting pissy about getting dropped when he doesn't touch it...

I'd be pissed if I was him as well. He put together some terrific games for Footscray and was completely ignored. We're crying out for a KPF, have one on our list and shelve him for half a season. The MC have been an absolute joke all season and this is the repercussions of pathetic selections.

[GVGjr]

We need to keep Jones. I'm confident he can become a regular senior player for us.

[SlimPickens]

We need to keep Jones. I'm confident he can become a regular senior player for us.

Absolutely, he has talent to burn just needs to find some level of consistency. If we were to trade him, I'd imagine his price will be inflated considering his upside and the position he plays.

[Twodogs]

I agree we have to keep him but if he gets a silly offer (something like we will play you in the seniors when your form warrants it) we don't want to get into a bidding war.

[bulldogtragic]

I'd be pissed if I was him as well. He put together some terrific games for Footscray and was completely ignored. We're crying out for a KPF, have one on our list and shelve him for half a season. The MC have been an absolute joke all season and this is the repercussions of pathetic selections.

That's the counter argument for sure. Either way, if our 'best' KPF and Higgins walk out, I'm not sure how we will attract any top line trades without overpaying. Would be a very, very bad result for many reasons. The pressure on BMac will start on why two elite talents have walked out - fair or unfair, that's the footy media.

[LostDoggy]

I'd be pissed if I was him as well. He put together some terrific games for Footscray and was completely ignored. We're crying out for a KPF, have one on our list and shelve him for half a season. The MC have been an absolute joke all season and this is the repercussions of pathetic selections.

I tend to agree. The MC have come across as extremely two-faced in their approach to rewarding players for good VFL form, but continuing to play those in the senior side who're either injured, shown poor form or simply not at that level. This smells a little of Mickey Arthur and his CA policy from a few years back. We know how that ended, and we saw the result.

I'm not worried about cutting too hard this year, or giving 30+ another contract. I'm more worried about the next crop falling apart before it's ready. Imagine the holes we'd have to fill then.

[Mantis]

I'd be pissed if I was him as well. He put together some terrific games for Footscray and was completely ignored. We're crying out for a KPF, have one on our list and shelve him for half a season. The MC have been an absolute joke all season and this is the repercussions of pathetic selections.

Hard not to agree with all of this.

Going to be a very interesting time at our club over the next couple of months.

[SlimPickens]

That's the counter argument for sure. Either way, if our 'best' KPF and Higgins walk out, I'm not sure how we will attract any top line trades without overpaying. Would be a very, very bad result for many reasons. The pressure on BMac will start on why two elite talents have walked out - fair or unfair, that's the footy media.

Two elite talents is a mild stretch

[bulldogtragic]

Two elite talents is a mild stretch

True, in form and playing to their potential and injured. But the sentiment is the same, we saw the journos attack Brisbane last year with 4 players who had shown less than these two. Not saying it's fair, but it's predictable.

[SlimPickens]

Heard today that Liam Jones was not happy about spending the 2nd half of the season at VFL level and wants to explore a trade out of the club.

Just found a link...

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/western-bulldogs-forward-liam-jones-could-be-on-the-move-shaun-higgins-expected-to-leave/story-fni5f22o-1227050067973

Can someone please explain why Will Minson is mentioned in the article?

[GVGjr]

Can someone please explain why Will Minson is mentioned in the article?

Perhaps reading this forum? ;) It doesn't make a lot of sense to mention him unless they are just referring to his position within the best and fairest

[jeemak]

Seriously, Jones needs to take some responsibility for his predicament this season. He was pathetic, lazy and ineffectual. He has been given chances time and again after only reasonable form at VFL level and funnily enough, has delivered the same half arsed crap time and again.

The MC got this one right for mine. Liam needs to work harder for a longer period of time.

[GVGjr]

Seriously, Jones needs to take some responsibility for his predicament this season. He was pathetic, lazy and ineffectual. He has been given chances time and again after only reasonable form at VFL level and funnily enough, has delivered the same half arsed crap time and again.

The MC got this one right for mine. Liam needs to work harder for a longer period of time.

Agreed, He was given enough opportunities and I'm a little surprised that the finger is being pointed at the MC.

[whythelongface]

Disappointed if Jones does leave as he has much upside and has nowhere reached his potential.

[always right]

It would kill me if Jones left and made his mark as a KPF with another club.

[Cyberdoggie]

Agreed, He was given enough opportunities and I'm a little surprised that the finger is being pointed at the MC.
I think he showed what he is capable of when he applies himself (collingwood game) and then what he dishes up the rest of the time.
Take a look at his games this year:

Description Date Opponent Result K HB D M G B T HO GA I50 FF FA AF SC
Round 15 29th Jun Melbourne W 91-85 0 1 1 0 0 0 3 1 0 0 1 0 16 17
Round 14 21st Jun Port Adel L 56-128 6 3 9 2 0 1 2 0 1 2 1 1 37 42
Round 13 15th Jun CollingW 106-98 13 3 16 5 4 2 6 2 0 4 3 1 112 95
Round 8 10th May Melbourne W 99-83 3 5 8 4 0 0 0 1 2 1 1 1 30 72
Round 7 3rd May Essendon L 65-73 8 4 12 5 1 0 1 3 0 4 0 1 57 63
Round 6 27th Apr Adelaide L 83-92 3 7 10 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 0 28 20
Round 5 20th Apr Carlton L 91-119 6 4 10 4 0 1 2 1 1 3 0 1 45 54
Round 4 12th Apr GWS Win 110-83 7 6 13 5 3 0 1 2 0 0 2 1 71 93
Round 3 5th Apr Richmond W 100-98 8 6 14 6 3 0 1 1 0 3 1 1 75 88
Round 2 30th Mar North Melb L 54-83 5 2 7 4 1 0 2 2 1 1 2 2 43 29

The two games after the pies game were damning for Liam.
He just has the best game of his career then does little against Port and then 1 hb for the game against Melbourne in a win.

[Dry Rot]

I'd be pissed if I was him as well. He put together some terrific games for Footscray and was completely ignored. We're crying out for a KPF, have one on our list and shelve him for half a season. The MC have been an absolute joke all season and this is the repercussions of pathetic selections.

While he is under contract, likewise watch out for Talia asking for a trade. And it wouldn't surprise me if Grant did the same.

[bulldogtragic]

While he is under contract, likewise watch out for Talia asking for a trade. And it wouldn't surprise me if Grant did the same.

This just can't happen. If there's an exodus... I don't want to think of that eventuality. It would be soul destroying, and you can spin it around about Brisbane, but they were a basket case this year. Two KPPs and two 1st round pick players wanting out... It just can't happen.

[F'scary]

Something needs to be done to our list. This is something, therefore do it.

[kruder]

Seriously, Jones needs to take some responsibility for his predicament this season. He was pathetic, lazy and ineffectual. He has been given chances time and again after only reasonable form at VFL level and funnily enough, has delivered the same half arsed crap time and again.

The MC got this one right for mine. Liam needs to work harder for a longer period of time.

Hear Hear!

Your can add Grant to the list as well. They both should be embarrassed not to be playing in the 14th ranked team in the competition who has been dying out for a forward for a decade. I've said this before, its great that we are in the VFL finals but in this scenario with the majority of of youth in the seniors, all it shows is they we have some very good VFL players on our list..

[Remi Moses]

Seriously, Jones needs to take some responsibility for his predicament this season. He was pathetic, lazy and ineffectual. He has been given chances time and again after only reasonable form at VFL level and funnily enough, has delivered the same half arsed crap time and again.

The MC got this one right for mine. Liam needs to work harder for a longer period of time.
Exactly. He's had plenty of chances

[Remi Moses]

This just can't happen. If there's an exodus... I don't want to think of that eventuality. It would be soul destroying, and you can spin it around about Brisbane, but they were a basket case this year. Two KPPs and two 1st round pick players wanting out... It just can't happen.

So two key forwards with dodgy work rates.
That's why they don't play regularly, they pick and choose their efforts.
Both can go

[The Pie Man]

Liam's last two senior games after the false dawn of the Pies game were horrible and you'd guess he would've understood being dropped at that point. He was reportedly very good at Footscray following that - inc a bag of 6 - while Redpath struggled to have an impact.

I got the feeling they'd given up - was relieved when I read we were talking to him about a new deal, but can understand Liam feeling his last two months were mismanaged by the MC.

After the GWS loss, Macca mentioned we haven't been training well as a club for weeks...perception that can develop from all this is we're losing control. Not good

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Rich just get richer.:mad::(:eek::mad:

Are you saying Daniel Rich to the Bulldogs?
i'd like a decent rumour about Sam Grimley to the Dogs, he fits the bill.

[jeemak]

While he is under contract, likewise watch out for Talia asking for a trade. And it wouldn't surprise me if Grant did the same.

I don't watch enough of Talia, but the howling positioning errors I saw from him a week ago in the second quarter, showed me he has a way to go.

As for Grant, I can't imagine anyone in their right mind suggesting he has been mistreated this year.

[G-Mo77]

Liam's last two senior games after the false dawn of the Pies game were horrible and you'd guess he would've understood being dropped at that point. He was reportedly very good at Footscray following that - inc a bag of 6 - while Redpath struggled to have an impact.

I got the feeling they'd given up - was relieved when I read we were talking to him about a new deal, but can understand Liam feeling his last two months were mismanaged by the MC.

After the GWS loss, Macca mentioned we haven't been training well as a club for weeks...perception that can develop from all this is we're losing control. Not good

Yep, that's my feelings as well. He's 23 years old and playing the most difficult position in football: a KPF at the WB. A rough couple of weeks at the highest level as well as inconsistency is going to happen. Sure drop him fro it, no problems with that from my end but why leave him out in the cold for half a season? Now our best KPF prospect we've had in a very long time is thinking about leaving just before he hits his peak. Macca is a guy that prides himself on development and he has dropped the ball badly on this one.


Are you saying Daniel Rich to the Bulldogs?
i'd like a decent rumour about Sam Grimley to the Dogs, he fits the bill.

You've started it now. A reporter just needs to see your post and make a story on it. :)

[The Underdog]

I don't watch enough of Talia, but the howling positioning errors I saw from him a week ago in the second quarter, showed me he has a way to go.

As for Grant, I can't imagine anyone in their right mind suggesting he has been mistreated this year.

Talia managed to move behind Austin and Roberts in the key defender stakes which was disappointing. He hasn't seemed to make a lot of progress in the deficiencies in his game which may be an indictment of him, the coaching staff or both.

Grant if anything was rushed back before he was ready. He was subsequently given some time to find form, given some games he probably didn't earn and then played poorly in them. On one hand I'd be disappointed if Jones and Grant left but they have both had plenty of time and chances to make more impact than they have. I think there's more chance Liam becomes a player from this point and I'm not sure we'd get great value for either.

[jeemak]

Yep, that's my feelings as well. He's 23 years old and playing the most difficult position in football: a KPF at the WB. A rough couple of weeks at the highest level as well as inconsistency is going to happen. Sure drop him fro it, no problems with that from my end but why leave him out in the cold for half a season? Now our best KPF prospect we've had in a very long time is thinking about leaving just before he hits his peak. Macca is a guy that prides himself on development and he has dropped the ball badly on this one.

You've started it now. A reporter just needs to see your post and make a story on it. :)

Do you actually think the MC would give up on a player and then try and re-sign them? Or do you think that perhaps they're trying an approach not tried with that player to get a different result than the same results they've been dished up these past three or so years?

If the latter is the case and Jones wants out at the end of it then good riddance. His form was pitiful this year aside from one game - which he followed up with two absolute stinkers - so he should be grateful that we're actually wanting to continue to work with him rather than just cutting him loose and finding a player who's prepared to provide consistent effort.

[Mantis]

Do you actually think the MC would give up on a player and then try and re-sign them? Or do you think that perhaps they're trying an approach not tried with that player to get a different result than the same results they've been dished up these past three or so years?

If the latter is the case and Jones wants out at the end of it then good riddance. His form was pitiful this year aside from one game - which he followed up with two absolute stinkers - so he should be grateful that we're actually wanting to continue to work with him rather than just cutting him loose and finding a player who's prepared to provide consistent effort.

I think the effort isn't the issue, more so consistent performances.

I think the current MC should cut their losses with Jones & Grant... It's obvious that they can't get the best out of them which says as much about the players as it does about the coaching staff.

[ledge]

Is jones over rating himself, he is not even getting a game in a side that won 7 games, unless the manager has heard inquiries from other clubs, I doubt the pay would be much different or the length.

[jeemak]

I think the effort isn't the issue, more so consistent performances.

I think the current MC should cut their losses with Jones & Grant... It's obvious that they can't get the best out of them which says as much about the players as it does about the coaching staff.

A part of me wants them to go to another club and get a decent run at things just to find out whether it was a player issue or a MC issue with each of them!

[G-Mo77]

Do you actually think the MC would give up on a player and then try and re-sign them? Or do you think that perhaps they're trying an approach not tried with that player to get a different result than the same results they've been dished up these past three or so years?

If the latter is the case and Jones wants out at the end of it then good riddance. His form was pitiful this year aside from one game - which he followed up with two absolute stinkers - so he should be grateful that we're actually wanting to continue to work with him rather than just cutting him loose and finding a player who's prepared to provide consistent effort.

What approach was that? Not play him at all for half a season? Who would that approach work on?

I don't think his form was all that bad. I noticed significant improvement in some areas, especially when the ball was not in possession. His defence efforts were pretty solid. His consistency is the issue and always has been.


I think the effort isn't the issue, more so consistent performances.

I think the current MC should cut their losses with Jones & Grant... It's obvious that they can't get the best out of them which says as much about the players as it does about the coaching staff.

Maybe it is for the best. I really think Jones can be a decent forward in this league maybe somewhere else with less pressure will help him.

[Bulldog4life]

Surely Liam can't complain he hasn't received as many chances as he would like. Time and time again he was left in the team after many poor performances. His best is good but he is not consistent. I hope he stays as I believe he can become more consistent but if he wants to go I won't lose any sleep.

[GVGjr]

Surely Liam can't complain he hasn't received as many chances as he would like. Time and time again he was left in the team after many poor performances. His best is good but he is not consistent. I hope he stays as I believe he can become more consistent but if he wants to go I won't lose any sleep.
We just couldn't reward him with senior games when he needed to go back to Footscray and try and find some confidence. Grant had a poor season and didn't take his chances when he got them. The issue with his laconic nature doesn't help his cause when you are down on form. Talia needs to lift his effort and learn how to take the game on more.

It wouldn't be good to lose Jones but if he thinks being gifted games helps him in the long term he is very wrong.
He needs to be our forward who takes a turn in the ruck and should welcome the chance to make that position his own.

[LostDoggy]

Mark Stevens has just said on channel 7 that Shannon Grants contract has not been renewed and he has left the club.
Wonder who his replacement will be.
Maybe Joel Corey.

[jeemak]

What approach was that? Not play him at all for half a season? Who would that approach work on?

I don't think his form was all that bad. I noticed significant improvement in some areas, especially when the ball was not in possession. His defence efforts were pretty solid. His consistency is the issue and always has been.



Maybe it is for the best. I really think Jones can be a decent forward in this league maybe somewhere else with less pressure will help him.

To be fair Liam was given plenty of opportunities in the first half of the season before being dropped for poor form. He was then brought back and played very well against Collingwood, only to stink it up in the ensuing two games before being dropped for eight rounds. So that's not quite half the season, though it is clearly a purposeful and extended period in the two's.

I didn't think he was particularly bad prior to being dropped the first time around, and like you I did notice some improvement off the ball however, he didn't really impact games when we had the ball to any extent which isn't good enough for our primary target.

An extended period in the two's seemed to work for Grant last year, though I'm not suggesting it's going to work for Liam or that it would work for all players. What I am suggesting is that we've had the same inconsistency served up by Liam over a number of years as he's followed a pattern of being dropped for a few games, playing some better than average to good games in the two's and being recalled only to perform at the same inconsistent levels again.

Why would we continue down the same well worn path and expect to get a better result from him?

[ledge]

Mark Stevens has just said on channel 7 that Shannon Grants contract has not been renewed and he has left the club.
Wonder who his replacement will be.
Maybe Joel Corey.
Just quietly I was never a fan.
I think there is better quality.. Maybe Gia takes over ?

[LostDoggy]

I never had a problem and it is very hard to know from the outside.

Could be that they want to freshen up the coaching staff.

[SlimPickens]

Mark Stevens has just said on channel 7 that Shannon Grants contract has not been renewed and he has left the club.
Wonder who his replacement will be.
Maybe Joel Corey.

Good call IMO. We should look at Rohan Smiths position also with the hope of getting Matt Scarlett on full
time as defensive coach. Maybe that'll happen with Rohan moving into a forward coaching role.

[ReLoad]

Given our forward lines inept performances over the last 4 years we certainly did need a change in this department, im of the opinion that fresh faces and ideas are needed in our line coaches. which includes getting those that have external experience from other clubs, as opposed to those who have only lived in our ecosystem.

[ledge]

Mitch Clarke anyone ?
Would be bargain basement and maybe the excruciating bad culture at Melbourne was a factor in his mind set.

[The Underdog]

Mark Stevens has just said on channel 7 that Shannon Grants contract has not been renewed and he has left the club.
Wonder who his replacement will be.
Maybe Joel Corey.

While we don't know how the coaching staff functions, I have to say the lack of progress in some of our forwards and forward line functionality generally probably means fresh blood ain't a bad idea.

[soupman]

Any possibility that Gia takes the forward coaching role? I'm not advocating it, I would like him to build up to a more senior assistant role, but I wouldn't be particularly surprised.

[The Underdog]

Any possibility that Gia takes the forward coaching role? I'm not advocating it, I would like him to build up to a more senior assistant role, but I wouldn't be particularly surprised.

I'd be pretty keen to bring in somebody fresh ideally. Think a new voice might be helpful both in the box and for the players

[soupman]

I'd be pretty keen to bring in somebody fresh ideally. Think a new voice might be helpful both in the box and for the players

Oh I completely agree. I would like us to poach someone from one of the better performing clubs who has experience in a forward setup role and can give a different outlook on how our overall gameplan should function. I'm all for developing players but I would like to get some readymade coaches in as well.

However Gia is a logical appointment. Experienced and smart forward who is joining the coaching team without a specific role assigned yet, has already been working closely with many of our young forwards and seems to get along well with BMac. Just saying I think he is as likely a choice as any.

[Twodogs]

Mark Stevens has just said on channel 7 that Shannon Grants contract has not been renewed and he has left the club.
Wonder who his replacement will be.
Maybe Joel Corey.


Somebody who can teach the players how to kick straight hopefully.

[Bulldog4life]

Oh I completely agree. I would like us to poach someone from one of the better performing clubs who has experience in a forward setup role and can give a different outlook on how our overall gameplan should function. I'm all for developing players but I would like to get some readymade coaches in as well.

However Gia is a logical appointment. Experienced and smart forward who is joining the coaching team without a specific role assigned yet, has already been working closely with many of our young forwards and seems to get along well with BMac. Just saying I think he is as likely a choice as any.

According to Macca Gia will be working with the players who are dropped from the seniors and also the development of players.

[Remi Moses]

Mitch Clarke anyone ?
Would be bargain basement and maybe the excruciating bad culture at Melbourne was a factor in his mind set.

Sounds like he is in the right head space.
His feet would need to be looked at, and a fit Clark is a better proposition than Frawley ( $)

[azabob]

Melbourne should refuse to delist Clark.

Irrespective of why he left, it is a pretty low act in my opinion to now want to come back and play AFL, but not for Melbourne.

[bulldogtragic]

Melbourne should refuse to delist Clark.

Irrespective of why he left, it is a pretty low act in my opinion to now want to come back and play AFL, but not for Melbourne.

Can they not trade him if he's on the list still?

[G-Mo77]

Melbourne should refuse to delist Clark.

Irrespective of why he left, it is a pretty low act in my opinion to now want to come back and play AFL, but not for Melbourne.

I guess that depends on where he plays. If he comes back to Victoria and plays for a team not Melbourne then it would be a real slap in the face. I don't think they'd have an issue if he played closer to home.

[G-Mo77]

To be fair Liam was given plenty of opportunities in the first half of the season before being dropped for poor form. He was then brought back and played very well against Collingwood, only to stink it up in the ensuing two games before being dropped for eight rounds. So that's not quite half the season, though it is clearly a purposeful and extended period in the two's.

I didn't think he was particularly bad prior to being dropped the first time around, and like you I did notice some improvement off the ball however, he didn't really impact games when we had the ball to any extent which isn't good enough for our primary target.

An extended period in the two's seemed to work for Grant last year, though I'm not suggesting it's going to work for Liam or that it would work for all players. What I am suggesting is that we've had the same inconsistency served up by Liam over a number of years as he's followed a pattern of being dropped for a few games, playing some better than average to good games in the two's and being recalled only to perform at the same inconsistent levels again.

Why would we continue down the same well worn path and expect to get a better result from him?

Sorry I can't agree with the way he was handled. Drop a player by all means but when they perform consistently, which he did then play him. At least Grant had the chance to return to the team and perform Jones was left in the cold. We've also refused to give Roberts time in the seniors and instead chose to trod out Austin week in week out. The only reason we played Fletch in the last game was because we had no choice had Roughhead played Roberts would have been playing for Footscray. I have a real issue with the way some of our players have been handled this year, these two being the most concerning.

Have you given up on Jones jeemak?

[azabob]

Can they not trade him if he's on the list still?

They can trade him, could they command a first round pick for him?

I guess, karma has come to bite Melbourne on this one.

[Pickenitup]

Shannon Grant Goneski

[bulldogtragic]

They can trade him, could they command a first round pick for him?

I guess, karma has come to bite Melbourne on this one.

I think it's along the lines of the Nathan Thompson trade, let him get to where he wants and ask for fair compensation. I can't see more than St Kilda's or our 2nd rounder (20+). If his ankles are good and we were a fresh start and good match for him I'd love him. He'd walk into our best forward and probably second best ruck relief too.

[bornadog]

Sorry I can't agree with the way he was handled. Drop a player by all means but when they perform consistently, which he did then play him. At least Grant had the chance to return to the team and perform Jones was left in the cold. We've also refused to give Roberts time in the seniors and instead chose to trod out Austin week in week out. The only reason we played Fletch in the last game was because we had no choice had Roughhead played Roberts would have been playing for Footscray. I have a real issue with the way some of our players have been handled this year, these two being the most concerning.

Have you given up on Jones jeemak?

I tend to agree with this.

There are 8 other players I would be delisting before letting Jones and Grant go.

[Remi Moses]

Melbourne should refuse to delist Clark.

Irrespective of why he left, it is a pretty low act in my opinion to now want to come back and play AFL, but not for Melbourne.

FWIW dees paid Clark out . Reached a settlement . Not sure what that means list wise

[LostDoggy]

Good call IMO. We should look at Rohan Smiths position also with the hope of getting Matt Scarlett on full
time as defensive coach. Maybe that'll happen with Rohan moving into a forward coaching role.

I have seen nothing to show me that Scarlett would do a better job than Smith.

[azabob]

Good call IMO. We should look at Rohan Smiths position also with the hope of getting Matt Scarlett on full
time as defensive coach. Maybe that'll happen with Rohan moving into a forward coaching role.

So Smith is now the forward coach or you are speculating?

[LostDoggy]

Roberts would have been playing for Footscray. I have a real issue with the way some of our players have been handled this year, these two being the most concerning.

I went looking for the VFL best and fairest list to get some idea of how a few of these players went for the year.

Jones, Grant and Talia not even in the top 10. Roberts number 4.

I've been a Jones supporter all along and really wanted him to make it, disappointed with this rumor.

[Bumper Bulldogs]

So Smith is now the forward coach or you are speculating?

Do you think that BMac has had a chat with his old mate "Bomber" he has made it perfectly clear that he will not coach along side of James.

He would also be a huge help on game day!

[azabob]

Do you think that BMac has had a chat with his old mate "Bomber" he has made it perfectly clear that he will not coach along side of James.

He would also be a huge help on game day!

That would be an amazing outcome having Bomber land at Whitten Oval!

[SlimPickens]

So Smith is now the forward coach or you are speculating?

Sorry, to clarify Smith hasn't been moved forward but from what I have seen from Scarlett and from how the players react to him, I would love him to be at the club in a greater capacity.

[SlimPickens]

I have seen nothing to show me that Scarlett would do a better job than Smith.

I'll have to take your word on it, obviously you have a fair bit of knowledge about the inner dealings of the club. From what I've read, the players really rate what he is doing.

[LostDoggy]

I'll have to take your word on it, obviously you have a fair bit of knowledge about the inner dealings of the club. From what I've read, the players really rate what he is doing.
Never said I did. I just said I have not seen anything and I am happy for you to provide what ever you have read so I can read it also.

[jeemak]

Sorry I can't agree with the way he was handled. Drop a player by all means but when they perform consistently, which he did then play him. At least Grant had the chance to return to the team and perform Jones was left in the cold. We've also refused to give Roberts time in the seniors and instead chose to trod out Austin week in week out. The only reason we played Fletch in the last game was because we had no choice had Roughhead played Roberts would have been playing for Footscray. I have a real issue with the way some of our players have been handled this year, these two being the most concerning.

Have you given up on Jones jeemak?

I haven't given up on Jones. I do think he can be a very good first forward for us, though only if he can consistently impact the game when it's going not so well and otherwise alike. The way I look at it is he's had a free pass for two years and finally this year he was held to account and failed badly. His performances this year didn't stack up, and it's not as if he was lacking for chances. I have no issues with him being left in the cold after round 15, he's served up too much tripe over the last three years for me to think any swift return to the one's is going to help him improve on any level. We've covered that ground already.

[Remi Moses]

Let's be honest Jones's massive gap between his best and worst hasn't changed .
Get yourself super fit, better second and third efforts. He just tries to take hangers to often.

[DISHLICKERS]

I posted a couple of weeks back how the club should sign Jones ASAP as their were a couple of clubs after his services.

Since then I would say that he is more likely to ask for a trade than stay.

Jones has been inconsistent but he is only 23yo a key forward in a side that is at the bottom part of the ladder.

Do not underestimate the impact the forward line coaching has had on players like Jones, Grant etc. Our forward line coaching is non existent. We think a key forward will solve all our problems but it wont unless the coaching staff especially the forward line coaches give clear instructions to all players how a forward line should function and we address roles of each player and how the ball comes in.

Jones has not been developed because we cannot develop key forwards and teach them how to play and teach the side how to bring the ball in etc, this has had a bigger impact on Jones than what we think.

Jones is only one of a couple of players who are considering their place in the club because of a variety of reasons. We are searching for key a forward to solve all our problems but what we need is a forward line coach who knows how to use players like Jones.

The clubs that are after Jones haven't pitched any special to him just clear guidelines on his role, How far from goals he will play, where he will run and how he can expect the ball to come in and he wont be rucking.

If we want to keep Jones then we have a lot of work to do to convince him to stay. Need to tread carefully because Grant, Talia, Fletch and Wood are similar to Jones.

[Greystache]

I posted a couple of weeks back how the club should sign Jones ASAP as their were a couple of clubs after his services.

Since then I would say that he is more likely to ask for a trade than stay.

Jones has been inconsistent but he is only 23yo a key forward in a side that is at the bottom part of the ladder.

Do not underestimate the impact the forward line coaching has had on players like Jones, Grant etc. Our forward line coaching is non existent. We think a key forward will solve all our problems but it wont unless the coaching staff especially the forward line coaches give clear instructions to all players how a forward line should function and we address roles of each player and how the ball comes in.

Jones has not been developed because we cannot develop key forwards and teach them how to play and teach the side how to bring the ball in etc, this has had a bigger impact on Jones than what we think.

Jones is only one of a couple of players who are considering their place in the club because of a variety of reasons. We are searching for key a forward to solve all our problems but what we need is a forward line coach who knows how to use players like Jones.

The clubs that are after Jones haven't pitched any special to him just clear guidelines on his role, How far from goals he will play, where he will run and how he can expect the ball to come in and he wont be rucking.

If we want to keep Jones then we have a lot of work to do to convince him to stay. Need to tread carefully because Grant, Talia, Fletch and Wood are similar to Jones.

Jones finishes nearly last in every endurance test and has done for the 6 years he's been on the list. Is that forward line coaching failure, or can we not teach players how to run either?

[DISHLICKERS]

Jones finishes nearly last in every endurance test and has done for the 6 years he's been on the list. Is that forward line coaching failure, or can we not teach players how to run either?

You maybe correct yes his endurance is low so then play him to his strengths if you must. Low endurance and you put him into the ruck? Jones has great hands and a decent pack mark so use that if you are convinced you are not going to get his endurance up.

If his endurance is the problem why has he been on the list for 6 years then? After 4 years you would think the club would know we need this type of forward and Jones endurance will never get there so let us cut him now.

[LostDoggy]

Not sure if this has been mentioned yet but the Jones contract isn't in our court..

http://bit.ly/1uFofRT

If he does seek a trade, what do you think we would receive... a third round?

[stefoid]

Do not underestimate the impact the forward line coaching has had on players like Jones, Grant etc. Our forward line coaching is non existent. We think a key forward will solve all our problems but it wont unless the coaching staff especially the forward line coaches give clear instructions to all players how a forward line should function and we address roles of each player and how the ball comes in.

Jones has not been developed because we cannot develop key forwards and teach them how to play and teach the side how to bring the ball in etc, this has had a bigger impact on Jones than what we think.

If we want to keep Jones then we have a lot of work to do to convince him to stay. Need to tread carefully because Grant, Talia, Fletch and Wood are similar to Jones.

This is disastrous if true.

Was Grant our old forward coach? Who will it be now - Gia?

[Doc26]

This is disastrous if true.

Was Grant our old forward coach? Who will it be now - Gia?

Shannon Grant - Forward coach (now ex)

Steven King - Midfield coach

Rohan Smith - Backline coach

Brett Montgomery - Strategy coach

[Greystache]

You maybe correct yes his endurance is low so then play him to his strengths if you must. Low endurance and you put him into the ruck? Jones has great hands and a decent pack mark so use that if you are convinced you are not going to get his endurance up.

If his endurance is the problem why has he been on the list for 6 years then? After 4 years you would think the club would know we need this type of forward and Jones endurance will never get there so let us cut him now.

So play him as a full forward out of the goal square like the 1970's? I suppose it would eliminate any need for us to have a forward coach.

We obviously think he has the capacity to improve his endurance with hard work. We're now making him work harder and not gifting him senior games and he thinks the world is too tough and he wants out. That doesn't reflect poorly on anyone but him.

[Cyberdoggie]

To be honest he does seem a little immature from the videos off the WB website over the years.

If we can get something worthwhile for him then send him on his way.

As much as we want him to be the next big thing and although he has teased us, the reality is he's not and if he's not prepared
to work harder to be the best then we can't force him.

It may be that he could go to a top club like Hawthorn and then he'll realize that he can't get away with what he has with us.
He would be the fresh meat that is expected to train and perform at their standard.


If he wants to go, let's get a good trade for him and send him to another struggling club so he can fail there as well.
Maybe the saints might be interested.

[DISHLICKERS]

To be honest he does seem a little immature from the videos off the WB website over the years.

If we can get something worthwhile for him then send him on his way.

As much as we want him to be the next big thing and although he has teased us, the reality is he's not and if he's not prepared
to work harder to be the best then we can't force him.

It may be that he could go to a top club like Hawthorn and then he'll realize that he can't get away with what he has with us.
He would be the fresh meat that is expected to train and perform at their standard.


If he wants to go, let's get a good trade for him and send him to another struggling club so he can fail there as well.
Maybe the saints might be interested.

That sounds like a good plan Lets get a good trade for him but let's make sure we send him to the club we want him to go to so he is guaranteed to fail.

And yes Hawthorn is a good example on how you structure a forward line and everyone work in sync. Have a look at how smart they use Gunston, Hale, Bruest and Puopolo etc next to Ruffy.

[whythelongface]

As much as we want him to be the next big thing and although he has teased us, the reality is he's not and if he's not prepared
to work harder to be the best then we can't force him.

Do you know for fact he is not prepared to work hard. He may be working his guts out but has not got to the level required.





If he wants to go, let's get a good trade for him and send him to another struggling club so he can fail there as well.
Maybe the saints might be interested.

Really. Do you like seeing others fail? Good luck to the kid if we wants to try somewhere else and makes a success of it. Different clubs offer individuals different conditions where a change of environment might see them prosper.

Hoping he fails is childish and really uncalled for.

[whythelongface]

That sounds like a good plan Lets get a good trade for him but let's make sure we send him to the club we want him to go to so he is guaranteed to fail.



Again I find hoping some fails is really disappointing and disrespectful and certainly not what one would expect from members of our club.

[jeemak]

I think DISHLICKERS was being sarcastic.

[F'scary]

To be honest he does seem a little immature from the videos off the WB website over the years.

If we can get something worthwhile for him then send him on his way.

As much as we want him to be the next big thing and although he has teased us, the reality is he's not and if he's not prepared
to work harder to be the best then we can't force him.

It may be that he could go to a top club like Hawthorn and then he'll realize that he can't get away with what he has with us.
He would be the fresh meat that is expected to train and perform at their standard.


If he wants to go, let's get a good trade for him and send him to another struggling club so he can fail there as well.
Maybe the saints might be interested.

And let us note as a precedent when he goes the response of the Adelaide Crows when Tippet left:

"We've got rid of a bloke who doesn't want to be at the footy club; that's already a win." Crows list manager David Noble said.

[Remi Moses]

Can't pin it on the forward coach that Jones still hasn't got any tank still.
Been in the system long enough, and to be a forward now you need to have a tank .
Same with Grant, as he still only commits on his own terms. ( that's a mental aptitude)
Forward pressure is now the key, and to be honest I think these two don't get that.

[lemmon]

Regardless of who's to blame for Jones' lack of development, if he were to go to any other club and get anywhere close to his potential it would be the worst piece of business since Cal Ward and we won't get anywhere near the same level of remuneration. It would be a disaster of a trade period if we finish it one key forward lighter than we started. I'm still a believer in his talents, priority number one for me now is ensuring he re-signs.

[Cyberdoggie]

Really. Do you like seeing others fail? Good luck to the kid if we wants to try somewhere else and makes a success of it. Different clubs offer individuals different conditions where a change of environment might see them prosper.

Hoping he fails is childish and really uncalled for.

Settle down, I was merely trying to point out that very point that he could thrive if he was pushed at a new environment with high expectations amongst the players, and that I wouldn't want to see that happen as it would again rub salt in our wounds of not being able to find a Key forward.

I'm not wishing him unwell or anything, just expressing my disappointment that because he got dropped a few times he's put his tail between his legs and wants out

[whythelongface]

Settle down, I was merely trying to point out that very point that he could thrive if he was pushed at a new environment with high expectations amongst the players, and that I wouldn't want to see that happen as it would again rub salt in our wounds of not being able to find a Key forward.

I'm not wishing him unwell or anything, just expressing my disappointment that because he got dropped a few times he's put his tail between his legs and wants out

Settle down!! I was just merely responding to your statement:

'let's make sure we send him to the club we want him to go to so he is guaranteed to fail.'

Apologies if I misinterpreted the statement but that is how it read (or at least how I read it).

I would be extremely disappointed as well that he hasn't hit his straps with us (as yet) and that if he does go somewhere else and he does succeed it would really piss me off. Let's hope if he does succeed it is not against us :)

[doggies ftw]

So Twodogs anything new on that rumour you posted a few months back, something along the lines of we've already got the biggest name we've ever traded into the club, to commit to us? :P

[Go_Dogs]

Regarding Jones, like most I hope we are able to get him signed up.

I'm not convinced he's been treated poorly, although that may be his perception. He had a few poor games and we needed to bring Redpath in who had been knocking the door down. Later in the season we played Campbell which also worked against Jones coming back in.

I'm also not convinced his performances have quite been consistent enough at VFL level. It seems his last game had a standout quarter but was otherwise disappointing which is often the knock on him - consistency in games, as well as week to week.

I guess we will learn more over the coming weeks.

[Dry Rot]

Need to tread carefully because Grant, Talia, Fletch and Wood are similar to Jones.

Similar in what way?

[Twodogs]

So Twodogs anything new on that rumour you posted a few months back, something along the lines of we've already got the biggest name we've ever traded into the club, to commit to us? :P

The player I was talking about is supposed to have resigned a contract with his club but Im still a bit curious because I still can't find any announcement.

[azabob]

So Twodogs anything new on that rumour you posted a few months back, something along the lines of we've already got the biggest name we've ever traded into the club, to commit to us? :P

I was thinking of that post a few weeks back....

[azabob]

The player I was talking about is supposed to have resigned a contract with his club but Im still a bit curious because I still can't find any announcement.

Did you need some help searching for confirmation? :) ;) :D

[bulldogsthru&thru]

The player I was talking about is supposed to have resigned a contract with his club but Im still a bit curious because I still can't find any announcement.

Argh that's very disappointing if said player had committed to us. Not a good sign if we can't attract players

[anfo27]

The player I was talking about is supposed to have resigned a contract with his club but Im still a bit curious because I still can't find any announcement.

It's not Ben Reid is it?

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Argh that's very disappointing if said player had committed to us. Not a good sign if we can't attract players

We've NEVER been able to attract good players, still in their prime. So its hardly 'not a good sign'. Its the norm.
Crameri is the closest we've got to a high profile signing in my 38 years of following the club.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Double post

[Webby]

We've NEVER been able to attract good players, still in their prime. So its hardly 'not a good sign if we can't attract players'. Its the norm.
Crameri is the closest we've got to a high profile signing in my 38 years of following the club.

Don't be too down in the mouth about this!!

In the days pre-salary cap we were too poor to out cheque-book Carlton, Essendon and Collingwood. Then, over the past 25 years, there's been a draft and a salary cap in place.

And since Free Agency's come in, we've been cellar dwellers... We have the same access to the salary cap as anyone else. We have a good young core of under 22 players and are seen as a team on the rise (albeit with a poor past month and a half).

We can legitimately pluck some talent in the days ahead. Particularly if we package up some draft picks with want always like Liam Judas Jones.

PS. Just prior to the salary cap coming in place, we attracted the then best player in the country - All Australian, Tassie and Simpson Medallist, Brad Hardie. Believe me, he and Kernahan were the hottest properties in football prior to '85. We're due for one, but we're a year away from being on the cusp of finals.

Two years ago, no one wanted to go to Port Adelaide. In fact, they were desperately trying to hold onto Travis Boak. Now they're being linked to all sorts of quality players. It will turn, but I think we might need to wait a year or so.

[DISHLICKERS]

Similar in what way?

Similar in that they seem on the fringe of regular senior football and seem to be the first to be sent to the seconds.

I can see how you could have taken this comment as they are also seeking to be traded. I don't know about them but I am concerned Wood has not re-signed

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Don't be too down in the mouth about this!!

In the days pre-salary cap we were too poor to out cheque-book Carlton, Essendon and Collingwood. Then, over the past 25 years, there's been a draft and a salary cap in place.

And since Free Agency's come in, we've been cellar dwellers... We have the same access to the salary cap as anyone else. We have a good young core of under 22 players and are seen as a team on the rise (albeit with a poor past month and a half).

We can legitimately pluck some talent in the days ahead. Particularly if we package up some draft picks with want always like Liam Judas Jones.

PS. Just prior to the salary cap coming in place, we attracted the then best player in the country - All Australian, Tassie and Simpson Medallist, Brad Hardie. Believe me, he and Kernahan were the hottest properties in football prior to '85. We're due for one, but we're a year away from being on the cusp of finals.

Two years ago, no one wanted to go to Port Adelaide. In fact, they were desperately trying to hold onto Travis Boak. Now they're being linked to all sorts of quality players. It will turn, but I think we might need to wait a year or so.
Excuse my lack of articulation. I'm not down in the mouth about this. I am concerned that given we are unlikely to land a big fish this trade period, it may be used as fuel to justify the agenda of anti Macca groups ( not specifically the poster I responded to) when historically it has been an issue for us.

[bulldogtragic]

Excuse my lack of articulation. I'm not down in the mouth about this. I am concerned that given we are unlikely to land a big fish this trade period, it may be used as fuel to justify the agenda of anti Macca groups ( not specifically the poster I responded to) when historically it has been an issue for us.

I agree with your sentiment, but I'm predicting the media to run that agenda.

[doggies ftw]

The player I was talking about is supposed to have resigned a contract with his club but Im still a bit curious because I still can't find any announcement.

Cheers for that mate, pretty disappointing if we thought they were coming and now they've resigned. Any chance you could tell us who they are seeing as its seeming unlikely now? All good if not, I just hate not knowing these things haha :p

[Twodogs]

It was Ben Reid.

[Doc26]

The player I was talking about is supposed to have resigned a contract with his club but Im still a bit curious because I still can't find any announcement.


It was Ben Reid.

I can recall earlier on in the season when it was announced on Foxtel's The Club that Ben Reid had signed a four year deal. From memory, it was announced as an exclusive on the show in conjunction with Sidebottom and Nathan Brown's re-signing.

[doggies ftw]

It was Ben Reid.

Cheers again, *!*!*!*! that would have been lovely :(

[chef]

Cheers again, *!*!*!*! that would have been lovely :(

He could have taken Williams spot in the rehab group.

[bornadog]

Twitter feed

Giants utility Kristian Jaksch is meeting with Melbourne clubs, believed to include Carlton and Western Bulldogs,

[Webby]

Twitter feed

Giants utility Kristian Jaksch is meeting with Melbourne clubs, believed to include Carlton and Western Bulldogs,

I really think that this is where we should be aiming at this point in time. Right age, right size and skillset. We need to build a defence with a view to completing the puzzle over the next two years. IMO, much more sensible than joining the Clarke race. Add Z Cordy and J Foster, as well a our pick 5/6 to the list and we're looking in much better shape.

If we were then to get the opportunity to land a young tall forward, then we should go for it, but the percentage game is to build up our back line.

[The Underdog]

I really think that this is where we should be aiming at this point in time. Right age, right size and skillset. We need to build a defence with a view to completing the puzzle over the next two years. IMO, much more sensible than joining the Clarke race. Add Z Cordy and J Foster, as well a our pick 5/6 to the list and we're looking in much better shape.

If we were then to get the opportunity to land a young tall forward, then we should go for it, but the percentage game is to build up our back line.

Be happy to have a crack at both Jaksch and Frost. Frost looked reasonable in the games I saw him in. Not sure what the market price for one or both would be though.

[bulldogtragic]

Happy to hear he's at least meeting with us.

[bornadog]

Be happy to have a crack at both Jaksch and Frost. Frost looked reasonable in the games I saw him in. Not sure what the market price for one or both would be though.

Melbourne in talks with Frost

[LostDoggy]

The following is probably counter-intuitive, but the aim of the conversations with O'Rourke, Jaksch, Frost et al should be along the lines of:
- Look at the core next level of our age group
- These are the areas we need added strength in
- Look at where you fit in
- These are the qualities we feel you'd bring

Now nominate us.

Seriously, if they're favouring Melbourne over us, which isn't a given, but if this is the case, then we've got some major marketing problems.

[bornadog]

The following is probably counter-intuitive, but the aim of the conversations with O'Rourke, Jaksch, Frost et al should be along the lines of:
- Look at the core next level of our age group
- These are the areas we need added strength in
- Look at where you fit in
- These are the qualities we feel you'd bring

Now nominate us.

Seriously, if they're favouring Melbourne over us, which isn't a given, but if this is the case, then we've got some major marketing problems.

O'Rourke in talks with Collingwood

[LostDoggy]

O'Rourke in talks with Collingwood

Everyone's in talks with Collingwood mate :). They even keep wrong numbers on the phone to see what their plans are.

[bulldogtragic]

Everyone's in talks with Collingwood mate :). They even keep wrong numbers on the phone to see what their plans are.

Our pitch is 'look what Collingwood did to Jesse White'.

[Mofra]

Our pitch is 'look what Collingwood did to Jesse White'.
Almost as effective as "your coach would be Nathan Buckley"

[chef]

Frawley sounds like he'll end up at Geelong.

[whythelongface]

Our pitch is 'look what Collingwood did to Jesse White'.

What did happen to Jesse? Did he get injured or did he struggle with form?

Another decent player that lost his way at Collingwood was the Q man. He retired this year after a couple of inglorious years with the pies. Nathan must have some sort of touch.

[Bulldog4life]

Our pitch is 'look what Collingwood did to Jesse White'.


Or look at what Jesse White did to Collingwood.;)

[Ozza]

What did happen to Jesse? Did he get injured or did he struggle with form?
Another decent player that lost his way at Collingwood was the Q man. He retired this year after a couple of inglorious years with the pies. Nathan must have some sort of touch.

Moreso struggled with form than anything else. Played 18 games, only ever missed one week at a time - so no injuries of significance. About 10 possessions, 3 marks and a goal per game.

Q and White both played quite high up the ground, clearing some space for Cloke and providing a target up the field. Both pretty unsuccessful at it.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

I can recall earlier on in the season when it was announced on Foxtel's The Club that Ben Reid had signed a four year deal. From memory, it was announced as an exclusive on the show in conjunction with Sidebottom and Nathan Brown's re-signing.

It was early April. Curious when this rumour started as he re-signed at the start of the season

[Templeton31]

White played the same as he has for most of his career. the thing is 2013 at the swans was a better year than the rest of his career.

[bornadog]

It was early April. Curious when this rumour started as he re-signed at the start of the season

yes story here: http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/ben-reid-steele-sidebottom-and-nathan-brown-resign-with-collingwood/story-fni5f6hd-1226872800069

[bulldogsthru&thru]

yes story here: http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/ben-reid-steele-sidebottom-and-nathan-brown-resign-with-collingwood/story-fni5f6hd-1226872800069

Could it have been Sam Reid instead of Ben that committed to us? :D

[F'scary]

Almost as effective as "your coach would be Nathan Buckley"

:D:D:D Quip-of-the-day winner for mine.

[Axe Man]

Could it have been Sam Reid instead of Ben that committed to us? :D

Knowing our luck we have probably signed Dr Bruce Reid.

[bornadog]

Knowing our luck we have probably signed Dr Bruce Reid.

or his father Bruce Reid.

[Maddog37]

Or his niece Tara Reid!

[westdog54]

or his father Bruce Reid.

Or ex WA pace Bowler Bruce Reid

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I'm a little disappointed that we aren't being linked to some defensive options available (Frawley and Frost) as this is a huge deficiency of ours. Understandable that it seems Frawley is headed to Geelong, but somebody like Frost could be a good (and cheapish) option to play as a second key defender.

[BulldogBelle]

I'm a little disappointed that we aren't being linked to some defensive options available (Frawley and Frost) as this is a huge deficiency of ours. Understandable that it seems Frawley is headed to Geelong, but somebody like Frost could be a good (and cheapish) option to play as a second key defender.

I think Frawley would be a step sideways (an expensive one). He might help us get to 10th before he starts to think retirement. Plus, I think free agency drives 27/28 year olds to clubs on the rise. When we finish 4th-8th, that's when we need free agents, and it's when free agents will want to come to us. Better off getting games into Talia.
We obviously want Frost to be something, but I doubt he would be anything other than a filler, and we already have one in Austin. And before we go off about Austin's value, I'm sure he wasn't our worst tall defender all year.

[LostDoggy]

I'm a little disappointed that we aren't being linked to some defensive options available (Frawley and Frost) as this is a huge deficiency of ours. Understandable that it seems Frawley is headed to Geelong, but somebody like Frost could be a good (and cheapish) option to play as a second key defender.

Doesn't mean it's not happening. BMc, JMc, Garlick etc are pretty quiet movers imo.....as much a we might like to see the headlines.

[GVGjr]

Twitter "AFL Off Season" is reporting the following:

"Carlton have offered a four year deal for Kristian Jaksch, whilst the Western Bulldogs have offered five"

[bulldogtragic]

Twitter "AFL Off Season" is reporting the following:

"Carlton have offered a four year deal for Kristian Jaksch, whilst the Western Bulldogs have offered five"

5???? Maybe for a Patton type of gun KPP, but Jaksch offered 5. Not sure I'm sold on giving him 5 years at this point.

[GVGjr]

They are also reporting the following:

In a deal that'll see Lumumba head to the Dees, the Pies can expect Mitch Clark back the other way with several teams pulling out of the race for the key forward.

[LostDoggy]

Jesus, five for a kid who could barely get a game with GWS. That's bold.

[GVGjr]

Jesus, five for a kid who could barely get a game with GWS. That's bold.

It's also Twitter.

[jeemak]

There you go TBB! On demand.

[doggies ftw]

If we get Jaksch I want to develop the kid at CHF. 5 years isn't a huge deal for me, its more about the money and it would be front loaded too. Someone made a good point, even if we signed him for 3 years, chances are he will get another contract after that even if he's a little bit underwhelming and will probably get 5 years to show his stuff anyway. Only difference is we can get a lot of his contract out of the way by that stage when Bonts, Stringer, Macrae etc are coming out of their contracts and want some decent coin.

[ratsmac]

The HS reporting that clubs are circling Carlisle and trying to get him to use the same get out clause that Paddy Ryder is using. I hope we are one of those teams.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

The HS reporting that clubs are circling Carlisle and trying to get him to use the same get out clause that Paddy Ryder is using. I hope we are one of those teams.

It would be amazing on so many levels if we snagged Carlisle.

Mainly because we'd have screwed Essendon over, again. :D

[Dry Rot]

Twitter "AFL Off Season" is reporting the following:

"Carlton have offered a four year deal for Kristian Jaksch, whilst the Western Bulldogs have offered five"

Talk of a 5 year deal for Jaksch smacks of panic down at WO.

Yes, they realise that no Jones and no Crameri next year leaves the forward cupboard bare, but 5 years for an unproven not Hogan/Boyd/patton type tall is ridiculous.

[Remi Moses]

Talk of a 5 year deal for Jaksch smacks of panic down at WO.

Yes, they realise that no Jones and no Crameri next year leaves the forward cupboard bare, but 5 years for an unproven not Hogan/Boyd/patton type tall is ridiculous.

No something about Crameri?

[Dry Rot]

No something about Crameri?

ASADA are going to nail the 34 present and past Dons players. They shouldn't have rejected a Cronulla like deal.

[Remi Moses]

ASADA are going to nail the 34 present and past Dons players. They shouldn't have rejected a Cronulla like deal.

Remains to be seen.

[Webby]

ASADA are going to nail the 34 present and past Dons players. They shouldn't have rejected a Cronulla like deal.

Can't see that happening. I can see sanctions being dealt out, but the players won't get more than two months. Heaps of precedents in the NFL. Natural justice will be served with Essendon's players being effectively declared free agents on the back of breach of duty of care.

Which is how it should be. Essendon are punished, Hird's head rolls and the Bombers take years to recover. It's the only just outcome.

[lemmon]

Twitter "AFL Off Season" is reporting the following:

"Carlton have offered a four year deal for Kristian Jaksch, whilst the Western Bulldogs have offered five"

If my recollection is correct that group was notoriously unreliable last year. I've made a resolution not to believe anything until pen hits contract paper this off-season...as boring as that may be

[G-Mo77]

If my recollection is correct that group was notoriously unreliable last year. I've made a resolution not to believe anything until pen hits contract paper this off-season...as boring as that may be

Yeah they are unreliable. This is the rumor mill though.

[Templeton31]

I think reading between the lines Carlisle is going nowhere. Just the Hun drumming up a story in the silly season.

[always right]

I think reading between the lines Carlisle is going nowhere. Just the Hun drumming up a story in the silly season.

Not sure there is anything wrong with the story or it's accuracy. Do you doubt that in the wake of the Ryder story clubs would not have made inquiries about other Essendon players? I'd be disappointed if our club didn't entertain this.

[Greystache]

Talk of a 5 year deal for Jaksch smacks of panic down at WO.

Yes, they realise that no Jones and no Crameri next year leaves the forward cupboard bare, but 5 years for an unproven not Hogan/Boyd/patton type tall is ridiculous.

We've put 7 years into Grant and 6 years into Jones for next to no reward, and many supporters want to give both at least another year to try to make it. Why would 5 years into a 20 year old KP be so desperate?

[G-Mo77]

We've put 7 years into Grant and 6 years into Jones for next to no reward, and many supporters want to give both at least another year to try to make it. Why would 5 years into a 20 year old KP be so desperate?

I don't think so, it's a gamble but one that may pay off.

This post was a perfect response to the "proposed" 5 year deal.


If we get Jaksch I want to develop the kid at CHF. 5 years isn't a huge deal for me, its more about the money and it would be front loaded too. Someone made a good point, even if we signed him for 3 years, chances are he will get another contract after that even if he's a little bit underwhelming and will probably get 5 years to show his stuff anyway. Only difference is we can get a lot of his contract out of the way by that stage when Bonts, Stringer, Macrae etc are coming out of their contracts and want some decent coin.

[Ozza]

I read somewhere that we were chasing Ty Vickery - but I don't recall seeing this anywhere on Woof.

Anybody know anything about this?

[bulldogsthru&thru]

I read somewhere that we were chasing Ty Vickery - but I don't recall seeing this anywhere on Woof.

Anybody know anything about this?

I hope it wasnt the Vickery for Dahlhaus rubbish on BF

[bornadog]

I hope it wasnt the Vickery for Dahlhaus rubbish on BF

That would be stupidity of the upmost.

[soupman]

I'm another one to not tbe bothered by offering Jaksch a 5 year deal. If we do think he is talented, this coaching setup has already demonstrated that they are more than happy to give recruits plenty of time to develop the attributes they were drafted for. I would agree with doggies ftw that even if he was given just a three year contract, seeing as we clearly rate him highly unless he was absolutely terrible we would be extending it anyway.

[Ozza]

I hope it wasnt the Vickery for Dahlhaus rubbish on BF

No I only fleetingly saw something about Vickery, and it being linked with our first pick (whether trading of picks was a part of it I'm not sure).

Probably rubbish.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

No I only fleetingly saw something about Vickery, and it being linked with our first pick (whether trading of picks was a part of it I'm not sure).

Probably rubbish.

I dont want anything to do with Vickery. He has that 'laziness' thing about him similar to Jarrad Grant. Do not want players like that but regardless he would only be worth a 2nd round pick

[Ozza]

I dont want anything to do with Vickery. He has that 'laziness' thing about him similar to Jarrad Grant. Do not want players like that but regardless he would only be worth a 2nd round pick

I would be interested in him. Recently turned 24 years old, mature bodied, coming into his best 5-6 years of footy, is a forward/ruck, plenty of upside that may well be tapped into by getting a fresh start.

I'd be happy to hear it if we were at least discussing it.

I also know that won't be popular with some on here who don't rate him. That's fine. But I could see him as being effective as the second ruck, who could take a contested mark and hopefully contribute 30 goals in a fwd line with Stringer and Crameri.

[whythelongface]

I would be interested in him. Recently turned 24 years old, mature bodied, coming into his best 5-6 years of footy, is a forward/ruck, plenty of upside that may well be tapped into by getting a fresh start.



Sorry but I am over under performing big men who want/ need fresh starts. Our recent history is filled with a litany of these types of players who fail to deliver based on their expectations. Let us learn and steer away from such players. I would rather develop our own or if we trade it is for a very good forward who has consistently delivered or a young up and comer (in the 19 to 21 age bracket)

[Remi Moses]

I would be interested in him. Recently turned 24 years old, mature bodied, coming into his best 5-6 years of footy, is a forward/ruck, plenty of upside that may well be tapped into by getting a fresh start.

I'd be happy to hear it if we were at least discussing it.

I also know that won't be popular with some on here who don't rate him. That's fine. But I could see him as being effective as the second ruck, who could take a contested mark and hopefully contribute 30 goals in a fwd line with Stringer and Crameri.

God no. He is lazy and disinterested, and plays from behind to often.
Added to that he has zero workrate.
Next

[Templeton31]

Not sure there is anything wrong with the story or it's accuracy. Do you doubt that in the wake of the Ryder story clubs would not have made inquiries about other Essendon players? I'd be disappointed if our club didn't entertain this.

I dont doubt the stories accuracy 0 I'm sure in the wake of the supplements stuff and now Ryder story that clubs and managers will be making inquiries. I just dont think this will result in Carlisle leaving or that he's even interested in leaving.

[Remi Moses]

No retort from Essendon however . Interesting

[Twodogs]

Yeah but no but yeah

I don't know what to think about Vickery. I thought he was having a good patch just before his suspension. I'm a bit wary about the king hit thing too.

[Remi Moses]

I hope it wasnt the Vickery for Dahlhaus rubbish on BF

Speaking of Big Footy
I think they have possibly the worst internet footy forum contributer in the universe .
That MattDougie bloke is an embarrassment . It's like a car prang over there. I'm done going over there .

[LostDoggy]

I love the fact we're (rumored) offering big deals to a KPP. Really in need.

Can someone tell me how to pronounce Jaksch?

Jakshh? Jacks? Jash?

[Ozza]

Sorry but I am over under performing big men who want/ need fresh starts. Our recent history is filled with a litany of these types of players who fail to deliver based on their expectations. Let us learn and steer away from such players. I would rather develop our own or if we trade it is for a very good forward who has consistently delivered or a young up and comer (in the 19 to 21 age bracket)

Vickery isn't out there saying he wants/needs a fresh start. I'm suggesting he might benefit from it.
Being a top 10 draft pick has placed huge expectation on him at Richmond, in a forward line that has been pretty unstable, and the expectations haven't been aligned with how long 200cm forwards generally take to handle the game at AFL level.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Speaking of Big Footy
I think they have possibly the worst internet footy forum contributer in the universe .
That MattDougie bloke is an embarrassment . It's like a car prang over there. I'm done going over there .

Its bad. I really need a cure during trade period as its bad for my health reading the garbage on there

[Remi Moses]

Its bad. I really need a cure during trade period as its bad for my health reading the garbage on there
I've just taken my medication

[Remi Moses]

Vickery isn't out there saying he wants/needs a fresh start. I'm suggesting he might benefit from it.
Being a top 10 draft pick has placed huge expectation on him at Richmond, in a forward line that has been pretty unstable, and the expectations haven't been aligned with how long 200cm forwards generally take to handle the game at AFL level.

Just don't know if a change of scenery is going to change his attitude.
Just because you're a top draft pick doesn't hide major defincies, and you just have to look at Watts.

[LostDoggy]

In regards to Vickery, heard he was training like a man possessed after his suspension, couldn't crack back into the team as Griffiths was playing so well. He seemed to take the suspension well, I wouldn't be against having a look at him.

[Bulldog4life]

Yeah but no but yeah

I don't know what to think about Vickery. I thought he was having a good patch just before his suspension. I'm a bit wary about the king hit thing too.


Is that you Vicki Pollard?

[GVGjr]

I would be interested in him. Recently turned 24 years old, mature bodied, coming into his best 5-6 years of footy, is a forward/ruck, plenty of upside that may well be tapped into by getting a fresh start.

I'd be happy to hear it if we were at least discussing it.

I also know that won't be popular with some on here who don't rate him. That's fine. But I could see him as being effective as the second ruck, who could take a contested mark and hopefully contribute 30 goals in a fwd line with Stringer and Crameri.

Vickery could be worth a chat to. I wouldn't be prepared to give too much for him but he could add a bit to our structure especially if Jones is considering another club. I don't quite see Campbell as a forward who has 5 minutes bursts in the ruck each quarter but Vickery might be able to fill that role.

I'm not convinced if he is the right fit for us but like you I wouldn't be upset if we did meet with him.

[EasternWest]

We've put 7 years into Grant and 6 years into Jones for next to no reward, and many supporters want to give both at least another year to try to make it. Why would 5 years into a 20 year old KP be so desperate?

I'm completely comfortable with a 5 year offer for a guy that age and I agree with what you've said here Greystache.


Is that you Vicki Pollard?

Shut up.

[boydogs]

Can someone tell me how to pronounce Jaksch?

Jakshh? Jacks? Jash?

Yakshh I think

[Bulldog4life]

I'm completely comfortable with a 5 year offer for a guy that age and I agree with what you've said here Greystache.



Shut up.


You don't know what ya talking about.

[ReLoad]

The only player on Richmond list that I would want at our club is Alex Rance and he is going nowhere, so can we please install an auto filter to remove any references to Richmond or any of their players being involved in trade discussions.

[SlimPickens]

Keep hearing that Ryder may end up at Sydney and not Brisbane. Just water cooler stuff but from
multiple sources. That has to make it right, yeah?

[azabob]

Keep hearing that Ryder may end up at Sydney and not Brisbane. Just water cooler stuff but from
multiple sources. That has to make it right, yeah?

That was the initial rumour back in mid August.

[Greystache]

Keep hearing that Ryder may end up at Sydney and not Brisbane. Just water cooler stuff but from
multiple sources. That has to make it right, yeah?

Good enough for me, he's a Swan next year.

With LRT retiring I'm sure they'll claim they now have $900k spare in their salary cap :rolleyes:

[westdog54]

Good enough for me, he's a Swan next year.

With LRT retiring I'm sure they'll claim they now have $900k spare in their salary cap :rolleyes:

Plus O'Keefe and probably Malceski too.

[The Doctor]

Plus O'Keefe and probably Malceski too.

Gee they could probably afford Ablett now

[ledge]

And maybe Tom Mitchell going

[KT31]

Heard a whisper tonight that Higgins will end up at a club that is still featuring in the finals (not specified which club) and figures are a bit lower than quoted.

[Dry Rot]

Let's face it, we're currently not a destination club. Indeed, I wouldn't be surprised if Jaksch ends up at Carlton. And I wouldn't be surprised if Reid ends up at the Lions or Freo.

IMO if we land someone instead like Vickery or Butcher, then the club is panicking. As Fronk said about ten thousand posts ago, keep our salary cap for 2015 bidding.

Even then, we may not land a big fish but we may at least be able to push the price of players up, cutting successful bidding teams out of bidding for other players.

In 2015, if we can't land Cameron or Boyd then I hope they stay at GWS on huge salaries. Makes it more difficult for GWS to keep other players eg WHE.

And say that GWS do retain Cameron, Tomlinson and Boyd on 3 year contracts, then players like McCarthy and Stewart (if they have half a brain) will realise that their future is not with GWS and that gives us an opportunity.

Moreover, if Jones and Higgins leave (and maybe the unsigned Wood) IMO we'll finish bottom 3 next year (I fear that Morris and Murphy will fall off the cliff). I also think that GWS will begin their climb the ladder, so they'll have a first round pick of 9 or 10 and we'll have a pick of 1, 2 or 3. Maybe we can snare a player like McCarthy and Stewart with that pick.

[The Doctor]

Heard a whisper tonight that Higgins will end up at a club that is still featuring in the finals (not specified which club) and figures are a bit lower than quoted.

Kangas?

[Remi Moses]

Don't think Carlton are a destination club either.
Our list looks better than there's. You'd sell the futureas we've got a great batch under 23's.

[LostDoggy]

He's just been to Sydney to meet with GWS. Kangas still the front runners. Wants to stay in Melb as he's renovating but happy to move most places (not adelaide or Perth) for the right coin. Main issue is wants to play midfield, feels he's been forced to play out of position (pleeeeze) and is gone unless we force the issue and match the offer. Would think that is very unlikely.

[Webby]

He's just been to Sydney to meet with GWS. Kangas still the front runners. Wants to stay in Melb as he's renovating but happy to move most places (not adelaide or Perth) for the right coin. Main issue is wants to play midfield, feels he's been forced to play out of position (pleeeeze) and is gone unless we force the issue and match the offer. Would think that is very unlikely.

Firstly, he's not an inside midfielder's bootlace. Secondly, when I wake up in a cold sweat about players we've lost to Arden St over the years, it's Gary Dempsey I'm picturing - certainly not Higgins... In fact, Keenan Reynolds would be ahead of him in the queue... Just behind Moccha Dunstan!.. I'll take the compo pick, thanks!

[bulldogtragic]

Firstly, he's not an inside midfielder's bootlace. Secondly, when I wake up in a cold sweat about players we've lost to Arden St over the years, it's Gary Dempsey I'm picturing - certainly not Higgins... In fact, Keenan Reynolds would be ahead of him in the queue... Just behind Moccha Dunstan!.. I'll take the compo pick, thanks!

Jade Rawlings, Sam Power, Malcolm Lynch (via Port Melbourne)???

[The Doctor]

Firstly, he's not an inside midfielder's bootlace.

Actually he was a dynamic inside midfielder in his junior days. On one occasion I remember him almost single handedly winning a game at the elite junior level when he was sent into midfield to "get us back in the game". I've often wondered why he hasn't been played there at AFL level more often.

[Remi Moses]

Didn't Colin Seery end up at Norf?
He was their runner for a long period.
It hurt like hell when Dempsey upped and left for them( to play in a flag)
Thankfully never happened.

[Webby]

Actually he was a dynamic inside midfielder in his junior days.

C'mon Doc, you're better than that! I was a dynamic midfielder in my junior days, as, I'm sure, were many other WOOFers!! He does not have the size nor the durability to play AFL footy as an inside mid for 25 weeks. He can barely sheepdog a flank for 20 weeks!

[The Doctor]

C'mon Doc, you're better than that! I was a dynamic midfielder in my junior days, as, I'm sure, were many other WOOFers!! He does not have the size nor the durability to play AFL footy as an inside mid for 25 weeks. He can barely sheepdog a flank for 20 weeks!

just reporting what I saw (not just once) and I repeat he was good at it

[Webby]

Don't think Carlton are a destination club either.
Our list looks better than there's. You'd sell the futureas we've got a great batch under 23's.

Yeah, well, a lot of AFL players aren't hunting premierships. They're hunting easy money. I say, better we sort out the wheat from the chaff sooner rather than later.

[Webby]

just reporting what I saw (not just once) and I repeat he was good at it

Yes, but for how many weeks? He's not got the size nor the durability to play inside regularly, and his feet are too fragile to carry extra weight. He's a decent flanker with good disposal (albeit poor peripheral vision) and I, for one, won't fret if he leaves... Particularly if he earns us decent compo... I wish him all the luck for his life in a big house with zero premiership medallions.

[Webby]

Didn't Colin Seery end up at Norf?
He was their runner for a long period.
It hurt like hell when Dempsey upped and left for them( to play in a flag)
Thankfully never happened.

Geez, that's an obscure name!! No, he was at Norf via interstate or something prior to coming to us at a very dark time for all of us!

[Remi Moses]

Geez, that's an obscure name!! No, he was at Norf via interstate or something prior to coming to us at a very dark time for all of us!

Think Seery was from S.A . Another obscure one is Bill Berry ( moved like an oak tree) finished his career there.

[Remi Moses]

C'mon Doc, you're better than that! I was a dynamic midfielder in my junior days, as, I'm sure, were many other WOOFers!! He does not have the size nor the durability to play AFL footy as an inside mid for 25 weeks. He can barely sheepdog a flank for 20 weeks!

I just don't think he'd find his own ball enough to play in the midfield, and as an outside player he doesn't have either pace or any urgency .

[lemmon]

Yes, but for how many weeks? He's not got the size nor the durability to play inside regularly, and his feet are too fragile to carry extra weight. He's a decent flanker with good disposal (albeit poor peripheral vision) and I, for one, won't fret if he leaves... Particularly if he earns us decent compo... I wish him all the luck for his life in a big house with zero premiership medallions.
You keep referencing size and I'm really not sure why. Granted the official listings are never totally accurate but going by eye his listed weight of 89kgs seems about right. He looks just as big as Boyd (listed at 88kgs), Robbie Gray (listed at 87kgs), Rory Sloane (listed at 79kgs) or Daniel Cross (listed at 86kgs). If you think any of those guys look significantly bulkier I'll have to retune my telly. Fair enough to talk about his running capacity but in terms of pure size he fits the inside mould as well as most guys running around, Josh Kennedy and Jobe Watson remain the exceptions to the rule in terms of mass.

[jeemak]

Actually he was a dynamic inside midfielder in his junior days. On one occasion I remember him almost single handedly winning a game at the elite junior level when he was sent into midfield to "get us back in the game". I've often wondered why he hasn't been played there at AFL level more often.

Because we've had nobody to play in the positions he's had to fill over the years. It's like Gia and Johnno all over again.

[Greystache]

You keep referencing size and I'm really not sure why. Granted the official listings are never totally accurate but going by eye his listed weight of 89kgs seems about right. He looks just as big as Boyd (listed at 88kgs), Robbie Gray (listed at 87kgs), Rory Sloane (listed at 79kgs) or Daniel Cross (listed at 86kgs). If you think any of those guys look significantly bulkier I'll have to retune my telly I think. Fair enough to talk about his running capacity but in terms of pure size he fits the inside mould as well as most guys running around, Josh Kennedy and Jobe Watson remain the exceptions to the rule in terms of mass.

I've heard from some pretty good junior watchers that Higgins was a good mix of inside and outside mid. Geelong loved him but weren't prepared to take him early due to his injury history as a junior.

He may have listed height and weight going for him, but nothing he's shown in the 9 years he's been in the AFL could make you describe him as physical or capable of playing an inside midfielder role. Like many juniors, his eventual role at AFL level is quite dissimilar to their junior career.

He's all cream and no cake for me. If we were a top team he'd do a few nice things each game and the ignorant media would be declaring him a star if he played for a bottom club, but in reality he needs good players around him to carry him and his limitations.

[Happy Days]

I'm willing to give him some slack for all his injuries. It's not like you rack up all of that damage to your body, come out the other end and you're as good as new. Wasn't his collarbone injury his first year meant to be car-crash type stuff?

I think people are being unfair to Shaun here.

[Pedro Sanchez]

I'm willing to give him some slack for all his injuries. It's not like you rack up all of that damage to your body, come out the other end and you're as good as new. Wasn't his collarbone injury his first year meant to be car-crash type stuff?

I think people are being unfair to Shaun here.

Yep agreed. And there's been a bunch of other injury battles too that have never been reported, rather just swept up under the dreaded umbrella of reoccuring OP.

[Greystache]

I'm willing to give him some slack for all his injuries. It's not like you rack up all of that damage to your body, come out the other end and you're as good as new. Wasn't his collarbone injury his first year meant to be car-crash type stuff?

I think people are being unfair to Shaun here.

It was an elbow, and I don't think I've ever heard an injury not described as like a car crash victim.

[Sedat]

C'mon Doc, you're better than that! I was a dynamic midfielder in my junior days, as, I'm sure, were many other WOOFers!! He does not have the size nor the durability to play AFL footy as an inside mid for 25 weeks. He can barely sheepdog a flank for 20 weeks!
Marc Murphy was the standout mid in the draft class of 2005 and he has stated that Higgins was easily the best mid he played against at U18 level that season.

I remember getting very excited by a midfield trio of Cooney, Griffen and Higgins back in 2006 - never happened for Higgins unfortunately.

[Webby]

You keep referencing size and I'm really not sure why. Granted the official listings are never totally accurate but going by eye his listed weight of 89kgs seems about right. He looks just as big as Boyd (listed at 88kgs), Robbie Gray (listed at 87kgs), Rory Sloane (listed at 79kgs) or Daniel Cross (listed at 86kgs). If you think any of those guys look significantly bulkier I'll have to retune my telly. Fair enough to talk about his running capacity but in terms of pure size he fits the inside mould as well as most guys running around, Josh Kennedy and Jobe Watson remain the exceptions to the rule in terms of mass.

I don't really want to get into a debate on this, but Higgins would be lucky to have peaked at 79kg prior to his foot issues. Now he'd be lucky to weigh 75kg. Boyd would weigh close to 85kg and Josh Kennedy, Nat Fyfe, Barlow, Watson and Pendlebury would be nudging 90kgs. Higgins is nowhere near big enough or durable enough to be an inside midfielder in that traffic over a full year.

Midfielders are getting big. Too big for Higgins.

[Maddog37]

Patty Veszpremi was a gun junior too.

[Twodogs]

Didn't Colin Seery end up at Norf?
He was their runner for a long period.
It hurt like hell when Dempsey upped and left for them( to play in a flag)
Thankfully never happened.


Other way around Remi. Seery played his first game of league footy at North.

[Remi Moses]

Other way around Remi. Seery played his first game of league footy at North.

Good pick up TD. What a memorable time that was

[Twodogs]

Good pick up TD. What a memorable time that was


It certainly was. I can remember smiling faces as far as the eye could see. Great players like Colin Seery and Brian Perrin playing in all those great wins.

[LostDoggy]

Have heard quite a bit the last couple of days about a Victorian club putting a huge offer to Carisle.

Considering the game he played against us and our list screaming out for a player of that capabilitity, I really hope we are that club.

If we are prepared to give a highly talented, but yet to be proven at AFL level kid 5 years, then I wonder what we would throw at Carisle...

[ledge]

I've heard it's us with a 6 year deal

[Webby]

Have heard quite a bit the last couple of days about a Victorian club putting a huge offer to Carisle.

Considering the game he played against us and our list screaming out for a player of that capabilitity, I really hope we are that club.

If we are prepared to give a highly talented, but yet to be proven at AFL level kid 5 years, then I wonder what we would throw at Carisle...

I know some will laugh at me for saying this, but one thing in our favour is that Carlisle was a mad Dogs supporter as a kid.. Sometimes that can help get a guy over the line...

[whythelongface]

I've heard it's us with a 6 year deal

Now I know this is the rumour mill and that most rumours are way off the mark. Would love this to happen.

Any truth to this?

[Axe Man]

Have heard quite a bit the last couple of days about a Victorian club putting a huge offer to Carisle.

Considering the game he played against us and our list screaming out for a player of that capabilitity, I really hope we are that club.

If we are prepared to give a highly talented, but yet to be proven at AFL level kid 5 years, then I wonder what we would throw at Carisle...

Jordan Roughead might be willing to chip in some of his own pay packet so he never has to play on Carlisle again!

[bornadog]

22 year-old Adelaide defender, Jarryd Lyons is thought to want a move back home to Melbourne according to 1116 SEN.

[Webby]

22 year-old Adelaide defender, Jarryd Lyons is thought to want a move back home to Melbourne according to 1116 SEN.

Don't know much about Lyons. Just a small defender, isn't he?

[Happy Days]

Don't know much about Lyons. Just a small defender, isn't he?

T&T loves him so stand by.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Lyons looks a likely type - good tackler, good kick - is he quick?

[chef]

I've heard it's us with a 6 year deal

Would take our pick 5 to get it done.

[Webby]

Would take our pick 5 to get it done.

Not if he's declared effectively FA in court?

[Maddog37]

I would pay pick 5 for him

[chef]

Not if he's declared effectively FA in court?

Doubt thats going to happen.

[chef]

I would pay pick 5 for him

So would I. Exactly what we need.

[ReLoad]

Perfect age, perfect playing style, we would be a very different team overnight, in fact I know the bombers wouldn't get within 8 goals of us :)

Where do we sign?

[GVGjr]

AFL Off Season via Twitter is reporting that Melbourne are interested in Jason Tutt. I wonder in GWS who play some games in Canberra might also look at him?

[bulldogtragic]

AFL Off Season via Twitter is reporting that Melbourne are interested in Jason Tutt. I wonder in GWS who play some games in Canberra might also look at him?

Did the recruiters miss that demonsland blog? :)

I like Tutty, but he's only really a good depth player. I doing see him going to the next level at MFC, not even close.

[Dry Rot]

Re Carlisle, what about ASADA waiting to mete out punishment to past and current players?

[Maddog37]

Good point. It devalues him a little......

[Webby]

I think the Essendon players will get 6 weeks maximum... It's the club that's cooked via contracts being torn up and effective free agency for their players. I'd grab Carlisle with both hands if he's keen to wear red, white and blue.

[bulldogtragic]

Re Carlisle, what about ASADA waiting to mete out punishment to past and current players?

A Stupid offer got Tippett to Sydney in the PSD. If we are offering more years and more money than Melb, Bris, GWS or Saints would match, then he's ours for free in the PSD. The ASADA risk just makes a gamble to poach in the PSD order more dangerous. At the current rate of ASADA, Stew and anyone else would be retired before any action.

[Remi Moses]

Interesting with Frawley going to Geelong even though they maybe on a downward spiral.

[Remi Moses]

I think the Essendon players will get 6 weeks maximum... It's the club that's cooked via contracts being torn up and effective free agency for their players. I'd grab Carlisle with both hands if he's keen to wear red, white and blue.

Ditto for me . Don't think their players will be whacked

[Twodogs]

Re Carlisle, what about ASADA waiting to mete out punishment to past and current players?

I'd still take him even if he missed most of his first year. Sydney did it with Tippett.

[Eze Dog]

This is my hope/prediction for the trade and draft period:

Trade:

End of First round/Second round draft pick to GWS for Kristian Jaksch.
Pick 5 and Liam Jones/Jason Tutt/Easton Wood for Pick 3.
Melbourne only get an end of first round compensation pick for Frawley.

Draft:

St Kilda pick 1 for McCartin
Melbourne pick 2 for Petracca
Dogs pick 3 for Wright (reason for pick is he is 203cm and apparently has elite running for his size and can take a contested mark)

Second round pick for Cordy/Unknown.

Third round pick Cordy/Foster.

Fourth round pick Foster/Unknown.

A Long shot but who knows, oh and the hail mary Carlisle in the PSD.

[bornadog]

I doubt Carlisle will be going anywhere