Well, I don't know what to say...

[bulldogtragic]

Don't know what to say or where to start on this result...

Gob smacked.

[lemmon]

Thinking exactly the same thing, this was a Giants side with the cue in the rack. The harsh reality is we finished 3 games off the bottom.

[bulldogtragic]

I guess we got one over Carlton. They thought they could stuff up the last minute of their game to get pick 5, but we are the masters. If Carlton are interested in Jayden Foster this works very well.....

How do we do this, seriously.

[chef]

Tough end to a tough season.

Pick 5 needs to be a winner.

[bornadog]

All I can say is we need a serious clean out of players below par. I can say at least 10 that need to be cleaned out. More to come as I am on the train and pissed off we get between by that team

[boydogs]

We weren't on all day, only wanting to win for Gia got us back in it

[SonofScray]

It would be tempting to slit my wrists over this result, and I might, but I am going to try hard to not let the fact it was a first loss to an expansion team amplify my reaction. The league has ensured that this scenario will play out for all expansion teams against all clubs at some point.

Allowing for that...

What a kick in the guts to end the year. Rolled by a team that had pulled up stumps. Blown by our brightest star in the forward line when it was there for the taking. Comical performance from the team to find themselves in that scenario in the first place. What a horror.

[KT31]

Why this thread ?
I'm as pissed as the next bloke,and after our local footy most likely more, I know it was disappointing but after a long season surely we don't this and all posts could all be posted in the game day thread.
We entered our 50 over 20 times more than the opposition, if we get a key forward and Crameri, Stringer get the second and third string back man things should be different.

[GVGjr]

I really wanted this win for 3 main reasons

1) For Gia
2) to not lose to GWS
3) to give us some momentum into next year.

I haven't been as gutted after a loss for a while

[bulldogtragic]

I really wanted this win for 3 main reasons

1) For Gia
2) to not lose to GWS
3) to give us some momentum into next year.

I haven't been as gutted after a loss for a while

When I grow up I will try to articulate myself like this. This is a real bad one, I will try humour to dull it, but this is such a bad, bad, bad loss for many reasons. Last year we finished down too but we could look with optimism to the post/pre season.

We need to cut the list hard. Cooney, Minson, Higgins need a serious question as does Boyd. Rookie list clean out.

[The Underdog]

I really wanted this win for 3 main reasons

1) For Gia
2) to not lose to GWS
3) to give us some momentum into next year.

I haven't been as gutted after a loss for a while

We had momentum at the end of last year. Didn't help much. They've got 6 months to get over it. It was a bad loss, now the real work begins.

[The Underdog]

When I grow up I will try to articulate myself like this. This is a real bad one, I will try humour to dull it, but this is such a bad, bad, bad loss for many reasons. Last year we finished down too but we could look with optimism to the post/pre season.

We need to cut the list hard. Cooney, Minson, Higgins need a serious question as does Boyd. Rookie list clean out.

Cooney actually looked pretty great at times today. The chase down in the last to save a goal was excellent. He moved really well.

[Sedat]

I'm actually quite ambivalent about today's loss. We were dreadful defensively and we played bruise free footy. There will be no end of season slapping on the back, which I think is much healthier than our tardy start to this season after finishing last year full of running. We have a ton of work to do and the footy world knows it.

[always right]

Today was disappointing but changes nothing. Bit of a silly thread TBH.

[josie]

I thought Will responded well after being dropped - felt he tried his guts out all day & was better around the ground. I'm upset we lost today too, however clearly not as much as others.

The poor starts are killing us, as is our inaccuracy in front of goal and we must find a way to dig ourselves out of these repeating issues.

I thought there were some quite bright spots for us today e.g. Fletcher held his own really well, Bonti, Hrovat, Stringer early, Morris, Griff, Cramers later in game, Libber & Murphy (as always a shining light) & Koby really added spark when he came on. If we do as much of a cleanout as some woofers seem to be thinking I think we will be putting too much faith in later draft later picks (aka lotto):- unless there are a lot of existing, available, good players from other clubs we can afford.

I thought Jones looked good in last qtr of vfl, playing I think loose man in defence - took some corker marks when pressure was on. All is not lost, and our recruiters have done well in recent years. Have faith !!!

[bulldogtragic]

To be clear, when I mention Will, I am saying we can't have a third season of him rucking 99.9%.

Jon Ralph says Higgins to Carlton 'almost certain'. Make of it what you will.

[Eastdog]

Season over

Thanks for coming

[ratsmac]

All I can say is that I am glad that the season is over. I have had an absolute gut full. If it wasn't for Bonts, MaCrae, Stringer, Hrovat and the like, I don't know how I would feel.

Are GWS better than I thought? Maybe
Are we worse than I thought? Maybe
Is it the cattle we have? Maybe
Are we about where we should be given our average age? Maybe
Is it the coach/coaching staff? Maybe

The optimism I had at the end of last year has all but gone. I can't see us making the 8 for a few more years at this point in time. I am at least happy we have pick 5 in the draft but I don't know if that is even a good way to think.

Feeling empty right now :(

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I'm actually quite ambivalent about today's loss. We were dreadful defensively and we played bruise free footy. There will be no end of season slapping on the back, which I think is much healthier than our tardy start to this season after finishing last year full of running. We have a ton of work to do and the footy world knows it.

This is how I see it too.

No wallpapering over the cracks - we're miles off the pace as a coaching and playing group, and there's no shying away from that. Some tough decisions need to be made and astute drafting/trading is critical.

[G-Mo77]

Are GWS better than I thought? Maybe


No they're not. They gave up long ago and were fielding a glorified seconds side.

Feeling similar to you ratsmac. I really think it's got to get worse before it gets better. I can't see how or where the improvment comes from or how teams below don't improve. GWS will finish above us next year, so will Melbourne and we'll be fighting the Saints for dead last.

[F'scary]

Today was like so many other games this year.

From a skills perspective, we often look awful. The other side looks so much more skillful, moves the ball quicker and more efficiently. And yet we are often well in the game.

If we had taken our chances in front of goal with GWS, we should have won - even with our ugly, over possessing, mistake ridden style.

[The Doctor]

Don't know what to say or where to start on this result...

Gob smacked.

Don't worry, we haven't gone backwards coz Macca says so. Read this and you will feel much better. I like the investing part!

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-08-31/slow-progress-for-dogs

[Remi Moses]

I'm actually quite ambivalent about today's loss. We were dreadful defensively and we played bruise free footy. There will be no end of season slapping on the back, which I think is much healthier than our tardy start to this season after finishing last year full of running. We have a ton of work to do and the footy world knows it.

I was thinking the same thing( now after about 3 hours)
Nothing changed from what we've known
There will be no fluffy feel good bulldog stories

[Remi Moses]

No they're not. They gave up long ago and were fielding a glorified seconds side.

Feeling similar to you ratsmac. I really think it's got to get worse before it gets better. I can't see how or where the improvment comes from or how teams below don't improve. GWS will finish above us next year, so will Melbourne and we'll be fighting the Saints for dead last.
Not sure about Melbourne

[bulldogtragic]

Don't worry, we haven't gone backwards coz Macca says so. Read this and you will feel much better. I like the investing part!

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-08-31/slow-progress-for-dogs

Perspective maybe. Is the test on backwards from the end of 2012, 2013, start of 2014 or after our GCS win up North??

The end of season review will be uncomfortable for the coaches as well as some players. I recall everybody at the end of last year saying words like 'See, Macca said we'd need to wait to see improvement and that would be the latter end of the year (2013)'. And we did see that improvement. But in all honesty we have regressed to an extent since those plaudits. So it's a tough gig being a senior coach, some years it's plaudits and other years criticisms. I'm not sure when Macca got the gig he pitched 7 wins in 2014 and that this would be based on our veterans still performing. Whether we like it or not, polite questions around BMac will get very loud by the media next year when they decide who the first coach to be sacked should be.

The bigger risk is shithouse trading to release the pressure ala Rhode and every other coach in the history of the game who felt pressure to win and took their eye off the plan. I don't think the team will allow it, or I hope not, but pressure makes people do funny things.

[lemmon]

Just feels like a 'meh' year when I thought we had an opportunity to make genuine strides. We weren't bad enough to be talked about but we didn't improve our standing on last year, key players got injured at key stages, the kids came on and some of the older guys dropped off, we had good wins just when the blow torch was being turned on and poor losses at times we could have got some momentum going. Feels like we were chasing our tails ever since the big first round loss to the Eagles and never quite got our heads back above water.

It's time to stop talking about that mini run in 2013 and realise that we are still a long way off the pace, that was more anomaly than norm.

[Dry Rot]

Why are people saying GWS have pulled up stumps?

Had a cracking go last week, and looked really up for it today (unlike us).

[F'scary]

Why are people saying GWS have pulled up stumps?

Had a cracking go last week, and looked really up for it today (unlike us).

Barring a miracle at the recruiting table, today will be as close as we get to them. They will be thrashing us next year and for years to come.

[Cyberdoggie]

I really wanted this win for 3 main reasons

1) For Gia
2) to not lose to GWS
3) to give us some momentum into next year.

I haven't been as gutted after a loss for a while

Gia had a couple of chances and Stringer should of held that mark, and because they didn't the game went the other way.

But in reality our defence is the worst in the league at the moment.
Again we get smashed on the fast break play goals. Too often get caught out not being goal side and we are too slow to chance them down.

Hoskin-Elliott 5 goals, how can we let that happen and still expect to win games.

A lot of work to do in the off-season and some personel changes down back i think.

[F'scary]

Stringer's dropped mark wasn't a sitter, it was a long kick and he had led out at full pace and taken a big leap to get separation from the players behind him. He didn't quite time his fly for the ball - it would have looked spectacular if he had held it. A bad miss but not a duffer effort a la Minson.

[KT31]

I was thinking the same thing( now after about 3 hours)
Nothing changed from what we've known
There will be no fluffy feel good bulldog stories
This I agree with, agree we should have be disappointed with todays loss but it was not unexpected, after all it was a dead rubber at the end of a long season.
I have noticed quite a negative trend the last couple of weeks ( and many from those that were only to happy to jump on those that questioned the clubs direction not so long back) I to am disappointed with the loss and for Gia but shit happens, nothing has changed from two weeks ago when most were posting positive posts.
If we recruit well and manage to get either both or even one of the key position players needed and the kids continue to develop we will be so much better off next season.

All I can say is I'm glad the season is over and we can finally get back to the Internet Scavenger Hunt.:)

[boydogs]

Stringer's dropped mark wasn't a sitter, it was a long kick and he had led out at full pace and taken a big leap to get separation from the players behind him. He didn't quite time his fly for the ball - it would have looked spectacular if he had held it. A bad miss but not a duffer effort a la Minson.

It seemed to me that he thought the crowd's roar meant he was under pressure, so he jumped early expecting contact that never came

[LostDoggy]

Stringer's dropped mark wasn't a sitter.

Yes it was and he knew it.

[LostDoggy]

Yes it was and he knew it.

100% sitter. Tough on the kid to say that's the reason the dogs lost, but that's football. A good game by Jake tarnished with a glaring mistake.

[jeemak]

Stringer's dropped mark was a sitter. There's no excuses.

I can't wait for him to mature and understand he needs to concentrate on the basics throughout an entire career let alone one game at a time. He will always be a flashy player due to his raw talent and physical attributes, he will often be able to beat his opponent.

Last week it was the missed goal from ten metres out, this week it was the dropped sitter that let himself and the team down. It will be humbling for him, but hopefully he will learn and be a better player as a result of these slips in concentration.

[always right]

He's a player with enormous confidence and god knows we need more like him. Remember the passage of play in the third quarter where he took on three players and had the audacity to bounce the ball as they converged on him? Absolutely rediculous but I much prefer a player who takes a risk than the one who plays it safe. He just needs to get a better sense on when it's smart to take the opposition on and when he should play a little more conservatively (just a little bit;)).

[Sedat]

What are everybody's thoughts on BMac's progress as a tactician on match days? He is a terrific developer of young players but I still have question marks on his match-day tactical nous. We got carved up so easily yesterday by much younger and far less experienced team, and BMac could not counter this at any stage last night.

For mine, the jury is still well and truly out on him purely as a match-day tactician. He needs to improve this aspect of his coaching sharply next year to get another contract extension.

[bornadog]

What are everybody's thoughts on BMac's progress as a tactician on match days? He is a terrific developer of young players but I still have question marks on his match-day tactical nous. We got carved up so easily yesterday by much younger and far less experienced team, and BMac could not counter this at any stage last night.

For mine, the jury is still well and truly out on him purely as a match-day tactician. He needs to improve this aspect of his coaching sharply next year to get another contract extension.

Monty is the match day strategist and is the one that needs to be looked at.

[jeemak]

What are everybody's thoughts on BMac's progress as a tactician on match days? He is a terrific developer of young players but I still have question marks on his match-day tactical nous. We got carved up so easily yesterday by much younger and far less experienced team, and BMac could not counter this at any stage last night.

For mine, the jury is still well and truly out on him purely as a match-day tactician. He needs to improve this aspect of his coaching sharply next year to get another contract extension.

Are you referring to the ease at which they were able to get behind our defenders and midfielders pushing forward when the ball was transitioning out of our forward line? I saw the same thing happen against Fremantle continuously.

Defenders allowing quicker opponents to get goal side of them is a cardinal playing sin for mine. They would be better allowing them the opportunity to lead at the ball, take a mark and turn around to be faced with an empty forward line with no targets to kick to.

If our defenders did that, and we didn't turn the ball over with reckless abandon yesterday we'd have kept GWS to 12 goals.

What also stood out was the quality differential in foot skill between their young guns and our general playing spread. We really need to draft a high quality user of the ball by foot this year. We can't continue with shoddy kicks.

I can understand the jury being out on Bmac as a match day coach, though I still think there's insufficient evidence to suggest it's a coaching issue and not a player issue. We have some dumb footballers.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

What are everybody's thoughts on BMac's progress as a tactician on match days? He is a terrific developer of young players but I still have question marks on his match-day tactical nous. We got carved up so easily yesterday by much younger and far less experienced team, and BMac could not counter this at any stage last night.

For mine, the jury is still well and truly out on him purely as a match-day tactician. He needs to improve this aspect of his coaching sharply next year to get another contract extension.

The match day tactics have been a problem all year which I believe has as much to do with the inexperience of our MC. Yesterday highlighted for me however the limitations of our playing group. GWS are inexperienced but they blitzed us for pace and overall talent. It once again highlights the enormous draft concessions granted to GWS at the expense of struggling Melbourne based clubs in St. Kilda Melbourne and the WB. In spite of this we blew many opportunities to win the game in particular Gia twice, Stevens and Stringer.
The stand out performance by Griffen yesterday again highlighted how few elite players we have and there is an urgent need to further bring in more young quality players like Bonti Macrae Stringer and Hrovat.
The lack of class down the spine is still a major concern both in defence and up forward.Macca has built a legacy around contested footy but it still remains to now focus on skill and team football. It would be a good lesson to have the players view the tape of Richmond's win over the Sydney Swans on what it means to play for each other.

[azabob]

Brisbane also smashed us on the break and run forward when we turned the footy over.

[Remi Moses]

What are everybody's thoughts on BMac's progress as a tactician on match days? He is a terrific developer of young players but I still have question marks on his match-day tactical nous. We got carved up so easily yesterday by much younger and far less experienced team, and BMac could not counter this at any stage last night.

For mine, the jury is still well and truly out on him purely as a match-day tactician. He needs to improve this aspect of his coaching sharply next year to get another contract extension.

I'm worried as well. The amount of times our back half got caught on the break was alarming.
Do we have to many players in a contest?

[Remi Moses]

The match day tactics have been a problem all year which I believe has as much to do with the inexperience of our MC. Yesterday highlighted for me however the limitations of our playing group. GWS are inexperienced but they blitzed us for pace and overall talent. It once again highlights the enormous draft concessions granted to GWS at the expense of struggling Melbourne based clubs in St. Kilda Melbourne and the WB. In spite of this we blew many opportunities to win the game in particular Gia twice, Stevens and Stringer.
The stand out performance by Griffen yesterday again highlighted how few elite players we have and there is an urgent need to further bring in more young quality players like Bonti Macrae Stringer and Hrovat.
The lack of class down the spine is still a major concern both in defence and up forward.Macca has built a legacy around contested footy but it still remains to now focus on skill and team football. It would be a good lesson to have the players view the tape of Richmond's win over the Sydney Swans on what it means to play for each other.

Regardless of GWS draft concession ( which are plenty) we had enough experience on the field to win that game.
Thumbs up . There are some great thoughtful posts on this thread

[LostDoggy]

I'm worried as well. The amount of times our back half got caught on the break was alarming.
Do we have to many players in a contest?

Yes we do seem to stack the contest - which is fine if we can then execute the next kick or handball. Each time we don't execute correctly we are then caught out in the transition by loose opposition. It's happened a lot this year and needs to be addressed. It puts too much pressure on our back line and leads to too many easy goals.

[bornadog]

What we haven't talked about from yesterday was the woeful kicking for goal. 34 shots to 25 says it all, 15.19 is not good football.

[Sedat]

Are you referring to the ease at which they were able to get behind our defenders and midfielders pushing forward when the ball was transitioning out of our forward line? I saw the same thing happen against Fremantle continuously.

Defenders allowing quicker opponents to get goal side of them is a cardinal playing sin for mine. They would be better allowing them the opportunity to lead at the ball, take a mark and turn around to be faced with an empty forward line with no targets to kick to.

If our defenders did that, and we didn't turn the ball over with reckless abandon yesterday we'd have kept GWS to 12 goals.

What also stood out was the quality differential in foot skill between their young guns and our general playing spread. We really need to draft a high quality user of the ball by foot this year. We can't continue with shoddy kicks.

I can understand the jury being out on Bmac as a match day coach, though I still think there's insufficient evidence to suggest it's a coaching issue and not a player issue. We have some dumb footballers.
Nice post Jeemak. I reckon it is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. We certainly do have our fair share of dumb footballers but I also think BMac does get found out during the cut and thrust of game day. Yesterday's game and the Freo game were exactly the games I thought of when I made my initial post - we absolutely dominated key indicators like CP's, clearances, inside 50's, and yet the opposition scored so easily and efficiently from their limited forward entries. And when it happens repeatedly over the course of 120 minutes, the coaching group has to take some share of the responsibility.

[Greystache]

Nice post Jeemak. I reckon it is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. We certainly do have our fair share of dumb footballers but I also think BMac does get found out during the cut and thrust of game day. Yesterday's game and the Freo game were exactly the games I thought of when I made my initial post - we absolutely dominated key indicators like CP's, clearances, inside 50's, and yet the opposition scored so easily and efficiently from their limited forward entries. And when it happens repeatedly over the course of 120 minutes, the coaching group has to take some share of the responsibility.

That's a frustration I'd called out earlier in the season. We can dominate 3.5 quarters of footy yet still be a goal down because team's can score so easily against us, and yet we find it such a hard fought struggle to do the same. BMac keeps talking about hanging in games for longer, but you can't dominate 4 quarters of a game on a consistent basis.

We either need to stop teams scoring and turn matches into a defensive scrap, or we need to score more freely and play shoot out footy. Ideally as we get better we'll be able to do both reasonably proficiently.

We're doing neither at the moment, so hence we can win every statistical measure in the game and still lose.

[bornadog]

Nice post Jeemak. I reckon it is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. We certainly do have our fair share of dumb footballers but I also think BMac does get found out during the cut and thrust of game day. Yesterday's game and the Freo game were exactly the games I thought of when I made my initial post - we absolutely dominated key indicators like CP's, clearances, inside 50's, and yet the opposition scored so easily and efficiently from their limited forward entries. And when it happens repeatedly over the course of 120 minutes, the coaching group has to take some share of the responsibility.

Its not just coaching, we just don't have the players. When you have guys like Austin and Young as your key defenders, and poor old Morris playing on monsters, no run out of the backline and slow midfielders who can't run down the opposition what do you expect.

[Daughter of the West]

What we haven't talked about from yesterday was the woeful kicking for goal. 34 shots to 25 says it all, 15.19 is not good football.

My grandfather always used to say, "Bad kicking is bad football." And he knew a thing or two.

[westdog54]

What we haven't talked about from yesterday was the woeful kicking for goal. 34 shots to 25 says it all, 15.19 is not good football.

Totally agree. GWS' goalkicking, particularly in the last quarter, was magnificent, whilst we were downright wasteful.

We created opportunity after opportunity and then ruined it with poor execution. I hate to pick on a kid for this but JJ is a massive culprit here. Does all the hard work and then overcooks the kick by about 5-10%. He irons out that one flaw in his game (and as a small defender that's the only flaw I'll call him on) he'd be close to elite.

I'll say this much: I wasn't in the rooms after the game nor have I seen any footage, but the Jake Stringer I've seen this year would have been distraught. He's so much better than that. Just got to the right spots all day and made things happen. Hard to believe this was his second year of elite football. He will come out breathing fire next year and be a far better player as a result.

As far as getting killed on the rebound like we do, surely this is a setup/structure issue. Our coaches aren't stupid. I've no doubt that players aren't playing to instruction when it comes to this. We have players who get sucked into the contest and forget about where they need to be. I read a post in the three things thread suggesting we needed a Franz Beckenbauer style sweeper. I don't know if it's the answer but it's not the stupidest idea I've ever heard.

Any way you look at it, we blew it big time last night.

[bornadog]

Any way you look at it, we blew it big time last night.
Not really we get Pick 5 instead of 6. :) A draw would have been good.

[westdog54]

Not really we get Pick 5 instead of 6. :) A draw would have been good.

That might be a side benefit, but I'm not willing to accept that losing that game was a positive for our club.

[BulldogBelle]

Not really we get Pick 5 instead of 6. :) A draw would have been good.

If Frawley leaves Melbourne we will probably end up with pick 6 because they will more than likely get a 1st rounder after their first pick.

[F'scary]

Yes it was and he knew it.


100% sitter. Tough on the kid to say that's the reason the dogs lost, but that's football. A good game by Jake tarnished with a glaring mistake.


Stringer's dropped mark was a sitter. There's no excuses.


Sorry guys, but a sitter, by definition, is a mark that you or I could have taken.

[westdog54]

Sorry guys, but a sitter, by definition, is a mark that you or I could have taken.

Actually, by definition a sitter is a catch where the item to be caught is sitting perfectly for the catcher.

That ball was sitting beautifully for Jake and he dropped it cold.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Nice post Jeemak. I reckon it is 6 of one and half a dozen of the other. We certainly do have our fair share of dumb footballers but I also think BMac does get found out during the cut and thrust of game day. Yesterday's game and the Freo game were exactly the games I thought of when I made my initial post - we absolutely dominated key indicators like CP's, clearances, inside 50's, and yet the opposition scored so easily and efficiently from their limited forward entries. And when it happens repeatedly over the course of 120 minutes, the coaching group has to take some share of the responsibility.

One of the major traits of Hawthorn's Clarkson is to recruit players who can dispose of the ball correctly. We have too many players on our list with poor skills. Geelong similarly are a very skillful team. I would doubt that a player like Clay Smith would be recruited by Hawthorn because of his poor foot skills. Matthew Boyd has consistently over many years turned the ball over far too much. Macrae who is a prolific ball getter needs a lot of work on his disposal. Dahlhaus is another who needs to do better by foot. Yesterday was a case in point where GWS kicked some outstanding goals, when we in similar circumstances missed too many opportunities. There is little point being one of the best at winning the hard ball contests, if in fact we lose the initiative through shoddy disposal.

[F'scary]

Actually, by definition a sitter is a catch where the item to be caught is sitting perfectly for the catcher.
...


Which concurs with my definition. I will stick with Stringer's attempt was a bad miss without it being a sitter.

[F'scary]

Ok, I took another look at it. For an AFL player, it was a sitter.

[Hotdog60]

It's not all doom and gloom, In the game yesterday two players were the instigators of our comeback and near win from a shambles.

Bonti, I would say he was feeling the effects of a long season but when this guy gets his fitness base up he will be one of those players that when the team in sinking into a bucket of poo he will grab the game by the scruff of the neck and lead us to the surface. A few times this season he has sparked a revival.
Griffen, quite first half by his standards but lead from the front and got us moving. We have the base to build on and if we can do well in the draft and maybe the odd FA or castoff. who know we may surprise next year.

[bornadog]

One of the major traits of Hawthorn's Clarkson is to recruit players who can dispose of the ball correctly. We have too many players on our list with poor skills. Geelong similarly are a very skillful team. I would doubt that a player like Clay Smith would be recruited by Hawthorn because of his poor foot skills. Matthew Boyd has consistently over many years turned the ball over far too much. Macrae who is a prolific ball getter needs a lot of work on his disposal. Dahlhaus is another who needs to do better by foot. Yesterday was a case in point where GWS kicked some outstanding goals, when we in similar circumstances missed too many opportunities. There is little point being one of the best at winning the hard ball contests, if in fact we lose the initiative through shoddy disposal.

Our biggest issue with field kicking is turnovers. In the second quarter we won the ball many times only to give it straight back with poor kicking skills and they made us pay.

[Ozza]

Dahlhaus' kicking is a serious concern. He can't move into the midfield with the way he uses it. And as a forward he needs to nail his set shots on goal. 17 goals 23 behinds is woeful for a small forward who kicks most of his goals from within 20m. 2 goals 8 to finish the last 5 games. Really disappointing and potentially game changing at times.

Another disappointing observation from the weekend was only 18 tackles to half time.

We didn't win every aspect of the game as suggested. We got smashed for pressure and only had more disposals on the back of overuse under pressure.

[Sedat]

Dahl's kicking was the reason for him slipping through to the RD. It still needs some work to put it mildly.

[Twodogs]

He was a Rookie pick I think.

[Sedat]

Yep, that's what I meant Twodogs. Fixed.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I know Dahl averaged more possessions per game this year, but he didn't have a good year IMO. Agree with the above - his kicking in general was poor this year, and absolutely woeful for goal.

He's not a midfielder. Needs to be chained to the forward pocket position.

[Ozza]

I know Dahl averaged more possessions per game this year, but he didn't have a good year IMO. Agree with the above - his kicking in general was poor this year, and absolutely woeful for goal.

He's not a midfielder. Needs to be chained to the forward pocket position.

I meant to say in my post - that Dahlhaus' form was very very good this year. Possibly top 3 b&f, probably top 5. If his kicking, particularly for goal, was better - then it's not an outrageous stretch for him to have been amongst AA discussion. His capabilities if he improves his overall attention to detail, is enormous.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I don't rate his decision making in midfield traffic, and it was compounded this year by his poor ball use. He may finish high up in the B&F but personally I thought he had a below par season. The capabilities are there, absolutely, but kicking skills are a fundamental part of the game, if you turn it over it ruins the rest of your game (ala Boyd).

[bulldogtragic]

I don't rate his decision making in midfield traffic, and it was compounded this year by his poor ball use. He may finish high up in the B&F but personally I thought he had a below par season. The capabilities are there, absolutely, but kicking skills are a fundamental part of the game, if you turn it over it ruins the rest of your game (ala Boyd).

Trade Bait?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Trade Bait?

Nope, considering there doesn't appear to be any superstar KPF's available (which is the only instance I'd be prepared to trade him).

I would have him play forward a hell of a lot more though next season, particularly if we get somebody like Casboult.

[1eyedog]

I meant to say in my post - that Dahlhaus' form was very very good this year. Possibly top 3 b&f, probably top 5. If his kicking, particularly for goal, was better - then it's not an outrageous stretch for him to have been amongst AA discussion. His capabilities if he improves his overall attention to detail, is enormous.

We generally had a poor year but I agree with your post. Dahl got a lot of attention from the opposition this year and learnt new ways to make a solid contribution throughout the season. The AFL player MVPs (votes cast by all AFL players for the best 3 players at each club) were published today with Dahl heading the tally at our club. I'd say he's top 3 for B&f this year.

Disposal efficiency of Bob Murphy and half of his possessions contested. If your looking at pure stats he's up on everything except goals / goal assists for obvious reasons and I would argue that having him run through the midfield has taken a bucketload of work off Griffen and probably helped the likes of Cooney as well.

[lemmon]

We generally had a poor year but I agree with your post. Dahl got a lot of attention from the opposition this year and learnt new ways to make a solid contribution throughout the season. The AFL player MVPs (votes cast by all AFL players for the best 3 players at each club) were published today with Dahl heading the tally at our club. I'd say he's top 3 for B&f this year.

Disposal efficiency of Bob Murphy and half of his possessions contested. If your looking at pure stats he's up on everything except goals / goal assists for obvious reasons and I would argue that having him run through the midfield has taken a bucketload of work off Griffen and probably helped the likes of Cooney as well.
Agree with that, I still think we can utilise him better through the middle than we have though. He may not be a great kick but his run and carry could be a huge asset, there are very few mids who'd catch him on the outside. I'd like to see us cut back on the in and under work he does and feed the ball to him more on the outside. Granted his scrapping and 1 v 1 ability is on par with anyone at the club but I think we need to work harder to get the ball to guys who will take the space and put defences under pressure.

[Dry Rot]

I don't rate his decision making in midfield traffic, and it was compounded this year by his poor ball use. He may finish high up in the B&F but personally I thought he had a below par season. The capabilities are there, absolutely, but kicking skills are a fundamental part of the game, if you turn it over it ruins the rest of your game (ala Boyd).

I wonder how Honeychurch will compare with Dal in 3-5 years time?

[Maddog37]

To my eye, Dal as a forward pocket is in the Ballantine, Milne class. As an onballer he is just another mid.

[1eyedog]

To my eye, Dal as a forward pocket is in the Ballantine, Milne class. As an onballer he is just another mid.

Is that just because we've seen so much more of him forward than midfield and that there is a tendency to lean toward big body mids now?

[soupman]

I'm happy for Dahlhaus to be played through the midfield this and next season.

Winning games isn't of vital importance, so if his overall contribution to the team is less its ok. Therefore he can hopefully develop into a midfielder without the pressure to have to be a really good one, and if he fails after next season we have a readymade dangerous small forward for when we are good, or if he succeeds we have a dangerous midfielder to add into the mix. I think its win win.

If we were a finals contender now though I'd be more reluctant to play him so much in the middle.

[bornadog]

I'm happy for Dahlhaus to be played through the midfield this and next season.

Winning games isn't of vital importance, so if his overall contribution to the team is less its ok. Therefore he can hopefully develop into a midfielder without the pressure to have to be a really good one, and if he fails after next season we have a readymade dangerous small forward for when we are good, or if he succeeds we have a dangerous midfielder to add into the mix. I think its win win.

If we were a finals contender now though I'd be more reluctant to play him so much in the middle.

I have mentioned in other threads, that early in the year Macca said at a function, Dahl will continue going through midfield and Hrovat and Hunter will follow his path, ie forward line then slowly into the midfield as part of the rotations.

[1eyedog]

I'm happy for Dahlhaus to be played through the midfield this and next season.

Winning games isn't of vital importance, so if his overall contribution to the team is less its ok. Therefore he can hopefully develop into a midfielder without the pressure to have to be a really good one, and if he fails after next season we have a readymade dangerous small forward for when we are good, or if he succeeds we have a dangerous midfielder to add into the mix. I think its win win.

If we were a finals contender now though I'd be more reluctant to play him so much in the middle.

I think he has the attributes to be a goal kicking midfielder ala Joey Montagna with a bit more zip. He's only played a handful of games in the midfield so I'd certainly like to see more. He is only 22 with 70 odd games to his name. I agree with the sentiments that we miss him playing deep forward though. If only there were two of him...

[Ozza]

I think we get the most out of Dahlhaus' strengths when he is forward, and doesn't have the same impact on ball.
I can see Hrovat as eventually strengthening the midfield and being suited there...but to me, Dahlhaus is a forward every day of the week.

[bornadog]

I think we get the most out of Dahlhaus' strengths when he is forward, and doesn't have the same impact on ball.
I can see Hrovat as eventually strengthening the midfield and being suited there...but to me, Dahlhaus is a forward every day of the week.

I tend to agree.

[F'scary]

I think we get the most out of Dahlhaus' strengths when he is forward, and doesn't have the same impact on ball.
I can see Hrovat as eventually strengthening the midfield and being suited there...but to me, Dahlhaus is a forward every day of the week.

I'll add to the chorus and agree. Dahlhaus also improved his marking this year. Previously, he showed just about nothing in the air.

Hrovat looks like your classic 1st rover. I am impressed with him.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

I'll add to the chorus and agree. Dahlhaus also improved his marking this year. Previously, he showed just about nothing in the air.

Hrovat looks like your classic 1st rover. I am impressed with him.
Honeychurch is another small that will be a better senior player next year. His determination and courage will take him a long way. Hrovat has always looked good because his skills are better than our smaller brigade.

[F'scary]

Honeychurch is another small that will be a better senior player next year. His determination and courage will take him a long way. Hrovat has always looked good because his skills are better than our smaller brigade.

Besides the basic bag of elite level skills, Hrovat has shown a couple of extra tricks that could mean he will go a long way. He doesn't panic when he gets the ball in traffic; he backs himself to find that bit of extra time and space to do something constructive.

[F'scary]

Honeychurch is another small that will be a better senior player next year. His determination and courage will take him a long way. Hrovat has always looked good because his skills are better than our smaller brigade.

I getting right behind this bloke. Bulldog mosquito fleet in the making that will rival the great ones of past eras.