Has anyone else lost faith in the AFL?

[chef]

As in to run a fair and even competition with every team having an fairly even chance to win a flag.

I must say I have, maybe it's due to having a few flat and tough seasons but I'm close to giving up hope on every seeing a Western Bulldogs flag.

[ledge]

A lot of people going back to VFL

[Flamethrower]

Hard to lose something that you have never had. AFL stands for Amoral Farcical League.

[Greystache]

Completely and utterly.

I can't remember another time where the game was less about the fans. The entire agenda of the AFL is to manipulate every aspect of the sport to drive it's own short term agenda.

So laughable are the lame excuses offered for blatantly orchestrating outcomes that the public en mass can predict with accuracy what is going to occur.

[azabob]

Chef, I've known and accepted this reality for sometime.

Dogs, Roos, saints, Melbourne will not win a flag in the next fifty years. Only Melbourne has a chance due to the possible off field money they have access to.

I still buy a membership and go to the footy, but it's more so to see mates and my dad.

[bulldogtragic]

The AFL is starting to feel a bit like WWE as a younger kid.

Vince McMahon saying all the things, but it was only ever a race between Stone Cold and The Rock which was where the real money was. Sure Mankind, Kane, The Undertaker and the rest were good, but everything was rigged for maximum dollars to be spent. The AFL mustn't believe that boil overs with the underdogs can be just or even more exciting or profitable.

[Webby]

When is the AFL going to realise that "growing the game" will not be achieved by Collingwood, West Coast, Geelong, Adelaide and Hawthorn dominating year after year. Do they realise that most of the dormant supporters are in Victoria and they follow Melbourne, St Kilda, the Dogs, North, Richmond, Carlton etc etc?

Thing is, 75% of them are finding other things to do with their time other than watching their teams getting repeatedly flogged at 4pm on a Sunday afternoon! Not just that, but KNOWING that they have buckleys and none of seeing their club win a flag.

This is why equalisation is so important. Do you think Collingwood or Geelong are more likely to get their membership up by 20k, or do you think a strong 5 years from Melbourne and the Dogs would be more likely to provide an extra 30k energised members between them!? Victorians largely already have a team. Many simply don't consume the product because their teams are perceived by them as having a snowball's chance in hell. If the competition had an "any given Sunday" feel to it, the AFL would find that the pie grows itself.

Look at the top 4 and the bottom 4 from
2013 to 2014... Did they change??

Christ, the Yanks are the kings of capitalism. The NFL is full of 95% privately owned teams. They're owned by the kings of capitalism in the most capitalist country in the world!!! And even they realise that making the NFL as even as possible is absolutely key to growing their league - and their collective bank accounts.

We have been fully professional since the mid-late 1990's. The NFL has been fully professional since the 1920's. The AFL signed it's first $1M TV deal in the late 1980's. The NFL were signing $100M+ TV deals in the 1970's. We adopted the draft system in the late '80's, the NFL did it in the 1930's.... We are literally decades behind the NFL and have been copying them for years.

The fact that we're so, so far behind on waking up to this says to me that there are just too many egos amongst AFL presidents to allow the league to prosper. Either that or the AFL Commission are just a bunch of grade A dills. There are hundreds of thousands of latent Bulldogs, Melbourne, St Kilda, Richmond and Carlton supporters lying around the place!.... Many more than in greater western Sydney, I guarantee it!!

[Maddog37]

Great post Webby.

[Go_Dogs]

Based on the poll, those who have responded with a post are speaking for everyone.

[Drunken Bum]

I lost faith in the afl a long long time ago, i used to go to every game i could, i loved it and i always held out hope that one day...
i can't even type it it seems so ridiculous to me now.
I didn't make a game this year and have been to maybe 15-20 over the last 10 years, part of it is because i have other things on most weekends but in the past i would make time and plan around the football, now i'm content to download the games on monday and get around to watching them if/when i can. I rarely talk to others about afl at all unless it is me bitching about the afl and how corrupt it is so i try not to because it makes me angry.
Sometimes i just wish we had of folded completely so i could ignore the "competition" completely and get on with my life such is the regard i hold the afl in.

[Rocco Jones]

The AFL is starting to feel a bit like WWE as a younger kid.

Vince McMahon saying all the things, but it was only ever a race between Stone Cold and The Rock which was where the real money was. Sure Mankind, Kane, The Undertaker and the rest were good, but everything was rigged for maximum dollars to be spent. The AFL mustn't believe that boil overs with the underdogs can be just or even more exciting or profitable.

I wish it were like the WWE! We are a bit like Mankind back in the mid to late 90s. They sold him as the unfashionable underdog who won the title against an elitist. I want that!!

[KT31]

I selected 'Somewhere in the middle', the reason being I am somewhat isolated from most coverage and AFL issues.
I have lost faith in the fact that we will get a equal draw , but I still (naively) believe we will win a flag in my lifetime.
I am sure if I was still in Melbourne and was confronted by the bias each week I would have selected 'yes' hands down.

[anfo27]

Once I saw our fixture for this year that was enough for me. Have hardly watched any Friday or Saturday night games because I have just had enough of being bent over and be expected to come back for more. I challenge anyone to find any team in any year that had a worse fixture than what we had this year. That fixture is something I'd expect from Ross Oakley.

The AFL couldn't give a stuff about us!

[anfo27]

I wish it were like the WWE! We are a bit like Mankind back in the mid to late 90s. They sold him as the unfashionable underdog who won the title against an elitist. I want that!!

We are more like George 'the animal' Steele.

[bulldogtragic]

I wish it were like the WWE! We are a bit like Mankind back in the mid to late 90s. They sold him as the unfashionable underdog who won the title against an elitist. I want that!!

We are of a similar age I'm backing then... :) I think Mankinds development as a character tapped into that narrative perfectly between the hilly billy hero worshipping of Austin and the Yankee's people's elbow arrogant fun of The Rock. Didn't Mankind then join forces with Vince McMahon after that as well from memory? That would be fun, Gillon forcing a deal with a swinging fold up chair and the dogs casually walking down to pin them for the win and the shock value on the crowd...

[azabob]

Sometimes i just wish we had of folded completely so i could ignore the "competition" completely and get on with my life such is the regard i hold the afl in.

A mate text me during the 2nd quarter GWS game and said "Gerard and Jason are not impressed with the dogs".

I'm not proud of my response but it went something along the lines of

Why the F would they be?

Afl should have relocated / killed us off, rather than bring in two new clubs and starve us of draft picks. How is a club meant to improve when you can't access the talent in over four drafts?

[bulldogtragic]

A mate text me during the 2nd quarter GWS game and said "Gerard and Jason are not impressed with the dogs".

I'm not proud of my response but it went something along the lines of

Why the F would they be?

Afl should have relocated / killed us off, rather than bring in two new clubs and starve us of draft picks. How is a club meant to improve when you can't access the talent in over four drafts?

Therein lies the problem at our next tilt. We seem to be seen as just a team that gives the big teams a variety of opponents to beat.

[Stefcep]

1. Any competition where the draw is rigged is a joke.

2. The rule changes to combat things the AFL doesn't like. For example, if a coach uses what are perceived as negative tactics, but is effective and wins games, then its up to the others to come up with a counter to this. Otherwise its just a rigged side show.

3. Expansion at the cost consolidation of existing clubs. There is simply not enough talent to go around, so stop adding more teams in places people do not want those teams.

[hotdog]

I selected 'Somewhere in the middle', the reason being I am somewhat isolated from most coverage and AFL issues.
I have lost faith in the fact that we will get a equal draw , but I still (naively) believe we will win a flag in my lifetime.
I am sure if I was still in Melbourne and was confronted by the bias each week I would have selected 'yes' hands down.

I can relate a lot to this post. I live in Regional NSW. I have fairly limited access to AFL. I do believe that we will win a flag in my lifetime but probably more so as a feel good story for the AFL! Just like a happy story at the end of a news bulletin we will be gifted some concession to enable us to be competitive in the year 2030 after a decade of interstate dominance.

[The Doctor]

AFL PFFFT, just like McDonalds, plastic product and all about money.

2 weeks ago I had the rare privilege of going to a local suburban footy game. Immediately I realised how much our great game at the national level had lost touch with its grass roots support.

There I was amongst the people, hard core footy barrackers with a can of carlton draught firmly grasped, loudly hurling their comical commentary, albeit unheard, to those combatants on field yet appreciated by those fellow supporters jostling for a better view nearby.

I enjoyed seeing a full forward opposed to a full back, wingers vs wingers, half forward flankers and half back flankers taking each other on and so on. Then there were the ruck contests. One team had a dominant ruckman and this team were winning comprehensively. I noticed the opposing ruckman was really struggling. He couldn't get to throw ins on time, he wandered around aimlessly and was always out of breath. On closer inspection he was at least 40+ years old, balding and with no fitness to match the incredible skill he once had. On closer inspection, when he came to the forward pocket for a rest, I realised he was a mate of mine.

You wouldn't believe it, My mate marks, despite his lethargy, in the forward pocket about 15m out on a slight angle. I raise my beer in honour of my old mate and he duly responds by missing. His team lost by 12 goals but we all had a great time at the clubrooms later on. My good old mate is reminded constantly of his shank.

It was beautiful, I loved it yet I didn't know anyone, aside from my old ruckman mate. I was transported back in time, to a time when I used to barrack amongst the people near the fence and with who we unashamedly hurled support for my mighty Bulldogs. I yearn for those days because these were the great days of going to the footy.

[FrediKanoute]

The draw has to be corrected. TBH, at some point I believe the AFL has to create a 34 round competition where everyone plays each other 2x. It is too biased otherwise.

My suggestion is mid-week games - team playing on a Friday/Saturday play on a Tuesday. Teams on a Saturday night/Sunday play on Wednesday. You do this for the first 10 weeks of the season leading up to the break.

You also increase list sizes to 40/42 and introduce a player games cap, so that no player can play more than 26/27 games in a season (including finals).

Wont be popular amongst players initially, but will remove a large inequity in the draw.

[Stefcep]

Mid-week games would be a failure for attendances, but could work as a TV "product".

[bornadog]

I am in my 50's, and now doubt I will ever see us in a GF let alone win one.

[bulldogtragic]

AFL PFFFT, just like McDonalds, plastic product and all about money.

2 weeks ago I had the rare privilege of going to a local suburban footy game. Immediately I realised how much our great game at the national level had lost touch with its grass roots support.

There I was amongst the people, hard core footy barrackers with a can of carlton draught firmly grasped, loudly hurling their comical commentary, albeit unheard, to those combatants on field yet appreciated by those fellow supporters jostling for a better view nearby.

I enjoyed seeing a full forward opposed to a full back, wingers vs wingers, half forward flankers and half back flankers taking each other on and so on. Then there were the ruck contests. One team had a dominant ruckman and this team were winning comprehensively. I noticed the opposing ruckman was really struggling. He couldn't get to throw ins on time, he wandered around aimlessly and was always out of breath. On closer inspection he was at least 40+ years old, balding and with no fitness to match the incredible skill he once had. On closer inspection, when he came to the forward pocket for a rest, I realised he was a mate of mine.

You wouldn't believe it, My mate marks, despite his lethargy, in the forward pocket about 15m out on a slight angle. I raise my beer in honour of my old mate and he duly responds by missing. His team lost by 12 goals but we all had a great time at the clubrooms later on. My good old mate is reminded constantly of his shank.

It was beautiful, I loved it yet I didn't know anyone, aside from my old ruckman mate. I was transported back in time, to a time when I used to barrack amongst the people near the fence and with who we unashamedly hurled support for my mighty Bulldogs. I yearn for those days because these were the great days of going to the footy.

Amen to that. I've been to more local footy, VFL and TAC this year than ever before for exactly the things you point out. The culture and game styles are more authentic (I think is the word). When you feel that you realise how much you've missed it, my moment was earlier this year in the country round of TAC with 3 games back to back in Bendigo, sunny day, cool Beveridge and atmosphere with kids playing to win, generally quicker and with more skill. Sunday was enjoyable too.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Australian Football is the greatest sport in the world, however i now look forward to the NFL and NBA seasons more than i do AFL. Its a real shame but it is the result of the boys club of the AFL and certain club presidents.

The league is a farce and as far from equal as it has ever been. So many issues i dont want to get into else it will just turn into a rant but the league is all for the $ and couldnt give a crap about its fans. It bewilders me as to how the AFL cannot see the issues it is creating with its rule changes and fixturing. Have a team play 4:40 sundays every other week and zero friday nights?? Seriously?? How on earth is that going to help the club. And dont give that bullshit excuse of performance when collingwood and calrton get at least 5 friday nights each next year....here comes the rant so all ill say is AFL has gone from my no 1 sport to no 4 in the last 4-5 years

[Daughter of the West]

1. Any competition where the draw is rigged is a joke.

2. The rule changes to combat things the AFL doesn't like. For example, if a coach uses what are perceived as negative tactics, but is effective and wins games, then its up to the others to come up with a counter to this. Otherwise its just a rigged side show.

3. Expansion at the cost consolidation of existing clubs. There is simply not enough talent to go around, so stop adding more teams in places people do not want those teams.

Got it in three.

The game now couldn't be any more scripted if they tried. I can see myself attending far more VFL than AFL games next year, especially if there are more at the Whitten Oval.

[mjp]

I am obviously in the minority but I have lost faith in the dogs, not in the afl. 2 years ago port were a 'basket case' and apparently they were bankrupt and about to fold. They have now made their second consecutive finals series...they suffered though the exact same draft concessions stuff we did.

They acted and changed. What have we done?

I am glad our games haven't been on Friday / Saturday nights...it means I can actually enjoy a game of footy without the spectre of another disappointing dogs game souring my mood.

Our young players look the goods and are developing...but if this is the case, why aren't our results improving? I watch hawthorn lose half their side to injury and simply keep rolling on. As supporters, we bemoan the loss of Griff for a few weeks and point to that as a reason for mediocre results. Where is our commitment to performance under adversity? Richmond are 3-10 and talk finals...and make it. We are 0-0 at the start of the year and the club still won't commit to being a 'challenger', of aspiring to be good. We criticise north and brad Scott but at least they fight the fight - winning games against top sides. Who can remember when we last did that? And if north are as bad as we all seem to think, why are they playing this weekend and we aren't?

We can blame the afl all we like but my frustration with footy at the moment is a lot closer to home.

[Rocco Jones]

We are of a similar age I'm backing then... :) I think Mankinds development as a character tapped into that narrative perfectly between the hilly billy hero worshipping of Austin and the Yankee's people's elbow arrogant fun of The Rock. Didn't Mankind then join forces with Vince McMahon after that as well from memory? That would be fun, Gillon forcing a deal with a swinging fold up chair and the dogs casually walking down to pin them for the win and the shock value on the crowd...

Hahaha well quickly it went something like this...
Vince pretended to like Mankind in really patronising and condescending way. Mankind was all naive and long story short, Vince screwed him to basically hand the title to The Rock. From there on, Mankind became underdog hero. He beat The Rock to win the title in massive underdog moment.

[Greystache]

In WWE terms we remind me of the 80's tag team The Rockers. Have decent support levels and the administration figures they'll still hold some appeal even if given poor time slots and rarely allowed to win. Basically a profitable B league team.

[Happy Days]

In WWE terms we remind me of the 80's tag team The Rockers. Have decent support levels and the administration figures they'll still hold some appeal even if given poor time slots and rarely allowed to win. Basically a profitable B league team.

And if we win the flag they'll probably film it on tape delay and never air it?

[Rocco Jones]

In WWE terms we remind me of the 80's tag team The Rockers. Have decent support levels and the administration figures they'll still hold some appeal even if given poor time slots and rarely allowed to win. Basically a profitable B league team.

I really hope Bonts doesn't put Stringer through a barber shop window.

[Happy Days]

Came here to say, after the handling of the Ray Rice sage "well at least it's not the NFL".

Then I remembered the one week, non-AFL imposed suspension of Nathan Bock. And its virtual silence on the several sexual assault cases over the past few years.

The AFL is terrible.

[BulldogBelle]

The demise of the AFL is happening as the fans loose their understanding of the game. People don't understand the draw, are constantly confused by different interpretations of the rules, and are flabergastered by the tactics of the modern game. The most disappointing thing is that the AFL doesn't care. They are no longer sports administrators but the producers of a tv show. So long as there is a tv audience on pay TV, then the AFL protects it's main income stream. At the live games, the teams loose out, not the AFL, when you only get 15000 at Etihad.

The worse thing is that while the AFL gets enormous revenue from TV rights, nothing else matters. The expansion teams are about increasing the TV audience, not about getting people through the gate. The TV rights are worth more when there are more games to televise, hence GCS and GWS.

The AFL is a TV show.

[Webby]

People don't understand the draw.

I agree. First thing, however, is that it's not a draw, it's a fixture... Because it's fixed!

A competition has no integrity when everyone is not playing everyone an even number of times. Secondly, a competition is not commercially fair when certain clubs are afforded more "blockbusters" than other clubs. In the EPL, every club gets to host Man United once per season. In baseball, every club in the American League gets to host the Yankees. (Obviously more so for clubs in their division).

The AFL is so compromised from both a competitive and commercial viewpoint, it's not funny. It's become very contrived and very plastic. It's got to be either 34 rounds or 17 rounds and the DRAW needs to be DRAWN out of a barrel. Not fixed.

That way, they'll find that the competition grows because it has credibility. No gimmicks, no contrived outcomes. Just a credible product.

[bulldogtragic]

2 brave people. Or 2 taking the piss I wonder? :)

[BulldogBelle]

And I didn't even mention the byes!!! How stupid. Why not just play a split round over two weekends? To easy??? Not confusing enough???? Aarrhhhh

[LostDoggy]

2 brave people. Or 2 taking the piss I wonder? :)

You'll always get some people willing to drink the Kool-Aid!

[mjp]

A competition has no integrity when everyone is not playing everyone an even number of times. Secondly, a competition is not commercially fair when certain clubs are afforded more "blockbusters" than other clubs. In the EPL, every club gets to host Man United once per season. In baseball, every club in the American League gets to host the Yankees. (Obviously more so for clubs in their division).

The AFL is so compromised from both a competitive and commercial viewpoint, it's not funny. It's become very contrived and very plastic. It's got to be either 34 rounds or 17 rounds and the DRAW needs to be DRAWN out of a barrel. Not fixed.

That way, they'll find that the competition grows because it has credibility. No gimmicks, no contrived outcomes. Just a credible product.
Are you seriously holding up the epl and MLB as examples of 'fair' competitions?

Wow.