What's going on in the inner-sanctum of our club?

[Eastdog]

As a result of Ryan Griffen's decision to request a trade to GWS today, understandably all of us are extremely disappointed with Griff's decision but what I would like to know is whether this decision is an indictment on our club or whether it's simply a case of GWS offering Griff a big-money offer that he couldn't refuse.

Now there has been rumours recently suggesting that something is wrong with the inside elements of our club or are we barking up the wrong tree here regarding the culture of our club?

Personally I think something need to change inside the club whether that's changing the coach, changing several aspects of our culture or would Griff's intention to leave the club always materialise no matter how well our club may be functioning?

Anyway my question is whether there is something wrong with our club or not in terms of the inner-workings of the club or is it a knee-jerk reaction to today's events because unfortunately if there are issues this may become a recurring problem for the club.

We shouldn't also discount that free agency plays a big role in player movements whether that is directly or indirectly as players have more bargaining power to leave a club even if they're contracted for another year. This has also been demonstrated by Dayne Beams and Collingwood recently and his intention to leave the club as well which is not too dissimilar to Griff's decision to leave the club today.

What are your thoughts on this?

[BulldogBelle]

This had been coming ever since Peter Gordon returned as president. The day he took over I thought "here we go". This guy represents every aspect of the Bulldogs that makes us an underachieving second rate club. He disgusts me with his "poor us, we need help, we're only the Bulldogs, we can't compete, equalisation, equalisation, help us!" attitude. Wether you can see it, understand it or not, when you critically analyse the direction of the club under McCartney, the focus is firmly on a premiership in 5-7 years time. Free agency more than anything means when your in decline, get the bottom quick and get as many draft picks inside 30 as you can. Those that won't be around are a commodity. We won't attract any free agents or quality players until our run at the title starts.
Peter Gordon doesn't understand this, and I would suggest that at this stage most don't. But this is the reality of the free agency age. McCartney understands it and is committed to winning a flag, and understands the current environment. Gordon doesn't, and I believe the sudden interest in a 30 year old KPP to "improve" our short term performance would have come from him. It contradicts the direction the club had been going in over the past few years, and no doubt the players are confused over the whole thing.

[always right]

This had been coming ever since Peter Gordon returned as president. The day he took over I thought "here we go". This guy represents every aspect of the Bulldogs that makes us an underachieving second rate club. He disgusts me with his "poor us, we need help, we're only the Bulldogs, we can't compete, equalisation, equalisation, help us!" attitude. Wether you can see it, understand it or not, when you critically analyse the direction of the club under McCartney, the focus is firmly on a premiership in 5-7 years time. Free agency more than anything means when your in decline, get the bottom quick and get as many draft picks inside 30 as you can. Those that won't be around are a commodity. We won't attract any free agents or quality players until our run at the title starts.
Peter Gordon doesn't understand this, and I would suggest that at this stage most don't. But this is the reality of the free agency age. McCartney understands it and is committed to winning a flag, and understands the current environment. Gordon doesn't, and I believe the sudden interest in a 30 year old KPP to "improve" our short term performance would have come from him. It contradicts the direction the club had been going in over the past few years, and no doubt the players are confused over the whole thing.

So much crap to respond to...so little time.

[1eyedog]

This had been coming ever since Peter Gordon returned as president. The day he took over I thought "here we go". This guy represents every aspect of the Bulldogs that makes us an underachieving second rate club. He disgusts me with his "poor us, we need help, we're only the Bulldogs, we can't compete, equalisation, equalisation, help us!" attitude. Wether you can see it, understand it or not, when you critically analyse the direction of the club under McCartney, the focus is firmly on a premiership in 5-7 years time. Free agency more than anything means when your in decline, get the bottom quick and get as many draft picks inside 30 as you can. Those that won't be around are a commodity. We won't attract any free agents or quality players until our run at the title starts.
Peter Gordon doesn't understand this, and I would suggest that at this stage most don't. But this is the reality of the free agency age. McCartney understands it and is committed to winning a flag, and understands the current environment. Gordon doesn't, and I believe the sudden interest in a 30 year old KPP to "improve" our short term performance would have come from him. It contradicts the direction the club had been going in over the past few years, and no doubt the players are confused over the whole thing.

If you're looking for a rise you're not going to get one suffice to say that PG is one of the best things to happen to our club...ever!

[anfo27]

I'm devastated at this news, i'm in shock to be honest.

I think i'm the biggest bmac fan out there but if Griffen wants out then this changes everything. Someone needs to go and its not the captain. Someone on SEN suggested Garlic was the problem but i can't see players leaving because of him. It has to be the coach and i can't believe i ever would have said this but bmac has to go. Under no circumstances can we trade Ryan.

I'm so flat right now.

[Mofra]

This had been coming ever since Peter Gordon returned as president. The day he took over I thought "here we go". This guy represents every aspect of the Bulldogs that makes us an underachieving second rate club. He disgusts me with his "poor us, we need help, we're only the Bulldogs, we can't compete, equalisation, equalisation, help us!" attitude. Wether you can see it, understand it or not, when you critically analyse the direction of the club under McCartney, the focus is firmly on a premiership in 5-7 years time. Free agency more than anything means when your in decline, get the bottom quick and get as many draft picks inside 30 as you can. Those that won't be around are a commodity. We won't attract any free agents or quality players until our run at the title starts. Peter Gordon doesn't understand this, and I would suggest that at this stage most don't. But this is the reality of the free agency age. McCartney understands it and is committed to winning a flag, and understands the current environment. Gordon doesn't, and I believe the sudden interest in a 30 year old KPP to "improve" our short term performance would have come from him. It contradicts the direction the club had been going in over the past few years, and no doubt the players are confused over the whole thing.
Wrong.
We took Essendon's 3 time goal-kicking champion off them when they were on the up.

[Remi Moses]

I'm devastated at this news, i'm in shock to be honest.

I think i'm the biggest bmac fan out there but if Griffen wants out then this changes everything. Someone needs to go and its not the captain. Someone on SEN suggested Garlic was the problem but i can't see players leaving because of him. It has to be the coach and i can't believe i ever would have said this but bmac has to go. Under no circumstances can we trade Ryan.

I'm so flat right now.

Honestly that call was the biggest load of shit I've ever heard.
He made some reference about Rocket leaving ,and Garlickand went back to Sydney days when rocket traded him.
He called him the GM ( huh!) just so much hysteria going on and it's doing my head in.

[Eastdog]

I think Peter Gordon has been very good since taking over our club. He has worked very hard for our club and don't forget he helped in us getting our own VFL side and put $1million of his own money into the club. He has come out in opposition to things like COLA and wants serious action on equalisation which affects the whole competition. He was partly responsible for saving us back in 1989. Peter is passionate about us and wants us to succeed.

[anfo27]

Honestly that call was the biggest load of shit I've ever heard.
He made some reference about Rocket leaving ,and Garlickand went back to Sydney days when rocket traded him.
He called him the GM ( huh!) just so much hysteria going on and it's doing my head in.

Whats your take Remi? I've backed bmac in from day dot but first thing i thought when i heard the news was the coach has to go. I'm gutted!

[Jeanette54]

Moons is on trade radio at present.

Includes a statement from the Prez.

[Go_Dogs]

Interesting thread, ED.

It's such a difficult situation to get a read on, given the amount of speculation out there about what exactly is going on. Given the volume of players and amount of press about there being an issue, I think it is clear there is one.

I'm slowly becoming more accepting of today's news (but still can't picture Griff in a stupid GWS jumper, makes me feel sick), and remembering why I wasn't unhappy before midday today reading about other potential trades we were contemplating (Cooney, Jones, Tutt etc). We are working towards something, we're setting standards and backing those standards, to the extent that anyone who cannot meet them will be gone. We're creating a group of tough, ruthless and single-minded players who will have come up hard, and together.

If the problems go much deeper than what we are aware of, or can assume, based on today - then we're in serious trouble.

At the moment, everyone involved needs to continue working as hard as they can to get some wins on the board, bring some enthusiasm back to the supporter base and ensure everyone who stays involved (at ay level) is prepared to put the effort in and work together to get us the right outcome.

[AndrewP6]

To badly paraphrase Shakespeare, "Something is rotten in the state of Footscray". Rumours of discontent have swirled around, and this time they're pretty much on the money. Four players leaving (and who knows how many more), is indicative of something major being wrong. PG seems undeterred, but I can't see how they can be so stubborn to keep the coach, given the massive shakeup losing four players including your only true A grader. I haven't been this disillusioned, downhearted, devastated about the club in a long time.

[FrediKanoute]

Something is rotten, but more and more I'm not sure its the President, CEO, Football Manager or Coach. Regardless of whether you think BMac can coach or not, he was appointed by the club because he had a strategy. As a club we have since 1985 gone through up and down cycles, but never had a team that could go beyond a prelim. Some of that is luck, but a lot of that is because players attitudes are wrong - we try to take short cuts which don't stand up to finals football.

BMac came to the club with a strategy that said "I am going to build a playing list from the ground up and we are going to have some non-negotiables". One of those was "cracking in", in essence we were going to be physically strong at the contest and ball. Another of those was that we were going to be hard working and support our team mates. Another non-negotiable was that we were going to forgo the easy way of winning and learn to play a sustainable game that would incrementally make us a better team. Perhaps the final non-negotiable is that the people who are brought into the club are "good" people.

This is the strategy, not to build a team for the 2 to 3 year run, but to build a team which has a 5 or 10 year stint in the top 6 and wins premierships as a result - like the Swans, like the Cats, like the Hawks. I don't think that BMac has mislead anyone, not the players, not the Board, not the fans. He has been open in what he is trying to achieve. We have backed this. We haven't always agreed. We haven't always been happy about not winning. We have though backed this.

In many ways the loss to GWS in Round 23 was shattering for BMac and the club, not because it was a crap way to end the year, or because we failed to win more games than the previous year, but because so many of our non-negotiables were cast aside and players, played in a manner that went against the way the club wants to play and we lost as a result. I have no doubt that this riled BMac and the Board and I have no doubt that the blood letting we are seeing now is effectively a line in the sand moment where the match committee have essentially said enough - you don't play the way we want you to play everytime you step on to the park then play somewhere else - here's looking at you Cooney, Tutt, Jones, Higgins.

Griffin asking for a trade is difficult to swallow. I doubt the club saw this coming, and in many ways they are at fault here, but Culturally I would expect the club to stay the course and finish the program - if that doesn't work for Griff then adios amigo. The old adage that you can't sack all the players hence the coach gets it for once is being turned on its head. The club is bigger than the players. Its our club, we pay though our season tickets, raffle tickets, club gear, club functions, even by watching on TV. No individual gets to tell the club how and what it should do. We have strategy and the sad thing is that the strategy has passed a number of players by. The couldn't adapt/haven't adapted.

[1eyedog]

Something is rotten, but more and more I'm not sure its the President, CEO, Football Manager or Coach. Regardless of whether you think BMac can coach or not, he was appointed by the club because he had a strategy. As a club we have since 1985 gone through up and down cycles, but never had a team that could go beyond a prelim. Some of that is luck, but a lot of that is because players attitudes are wrong - we try to take short cuts which don't stand up to finals football.

BMac came to the club with a strategy that said "I am going to build a playing list from the ground up and we are going to have some non-negotiables". One of those was "cracking in", in essence we were going to be physically strong at the contest and ball. Another of those was that we were going to be hard working and support our team mates. Another non-negotiable was that we were going to forgo the easy way of winning and learn to play a sustainable game that would incrementally make us a better team. Perhaps the final non-negotiable is that the people who are brought into the club are "good" people.

This is the strategy, not to build a team for the 2 to 3 year run, but to build a team which has a 5 or 10 year stint in the top 6 and wins premierships as a result - like the Swans, like the Cats, like the Hawks. I don't think that BMac has mislead anyone, not the players, not the Board, not the fans. He has been open in what he is trying to achieve. We have backed this. We haven't always agreed. We haven't always been happy about not winning. We have though backed this.

In many ways the loss to GWS in Round 23 was shattering for BMac and the club, not because it was a crap way to end the year, or because we failed to win more games than the previous year, but because so many of our non-negotiables were cast aside and players, played in a manner that went against the way the club wants to play and we lost as a result. I have no doubt that this riled BMac and the Board and I have no doubt that the blood letting we are seeing now is effectively a line in the sand moment where the match committee have essentially said enough - you don't play the way we want you to play everytime you step on to the park then play somewhere else - here's looking at you Cooney, Tutt, Jones, Higgins.

Griffin asking for a trade is difficult to swallow. I doubt the club saw this coming, and in many ways they are at fault here, but Culturally I would expect the club to stay the course and finish the program - if that doesn't work for Griff then adios amigo. The old adage that you can't sack all the players hence the coach gets it for once is being turned on its head. The club is bigger than the players. Its our club, we pay though our season tickets, raffle tickets, club gear, club functions, even by watching on TV. No individual gets to tell the club how and what it should do. We have strategy and the sad thing is that the strategy has passed a number of players by. The couldn't adapt/haven't adapted.

I read this post, which I agree with, and thought of Jacksch when I read the bolded line. I think we thought he was a good player and suited our needs but we cooled at the interview stage not because he wasn't a good person, but because he was not the right person.

[F'scary]

I'm not saying they intended things to quite go as they have but I'm backing PG & BMc because, as I have been saying for weeks, we really need to turn the list over and it is so hard to do in any way other than incrementally under normal circumstances. Well, they have certainly fast tracked things.

Looking at things in the cool of the evening, what are we losing? Griffen still played some excellent games this year but for the majority looked like a hack and GWS are taking a big risk on him because their coach Cameron is close to Griffen. That's why. Cooney...hack. Higgins...peripheral. Jones...reserves star. Tutt...perpetual fringe player. Et Cetera. Those that survive this year have had a rocket put up them.

This is the Bulldog revolution that needed to happen.