Media Musings about the Bulldogs

[Topdog]

Unfortunately I won't be able to listen.

[G-Mo77]

I wouldn't worry. You heard it all on Thursday.

[GVGjr]

- Knew of some communication problems beforehand
- Brendan is a good guy and showed remarkable resilience. He used to say he had a hard head when the media turned up the heat
- Still doesn't see this as a crisis
- Wont be speculating on Griffen's future or draft strategy
- We won't be cannon fodder for other teams mentioned Ward and Harbrow's departure
- Communication issues for just about every coach who departs a club
- Coaching is a hard job
- FA is not about helping the top 4 teams
- Higgins and Frawley compensation isn't right. Good luck to Melbourne
- We have increased our spend in the footy department substantially and we are about the middle of the range

Sorry, I might have missed some things as the phone was ringing

[wimberga]

I wouldn't worry. You heard it all on Thursday.

I listened in and GVGjr's summary above is pretty spot on for what he said.

However, when asked about Griffen and the strategy there, I felt there was a notable difference in his tone and the way he spoke about him from Thursday. There wasn't the gushing and all out support of Ryan the person and player that we had during the week, and it certainly gave me the impression that we would be looking for a trade.

I can't remember the specifics, but I know that PG said he wouldn't talk about draft or trade strategy, that Ryan is an absolutely elite player, that their aren't many like him going around, that we are concerned with doing the best thing for our club moving forward etc etc.

If anyone else who heard the interview could comment that could be great (as its possible I simply read/heard too much into what he was saying) but I really felt like it was a significant flip from Thursday's comments, which had me concerned we wanted Griff to stay.

[LostDoggy]

I listened in and GVGjr's summary above is pretty spot on for what he said.

However, when asked about Griffen and the strategy there, I felt there was a notable difference in his tone and the way he spoke about him from Thursday. There wasn't the gushing and all out support of Ryan the person and player that we had during the week, and it certainly gave me the impression that we would be looking for a trade.

I can't remember the specifics, but I know that PG said he wouldn't talk about draft or trade strategy, that Ryan is an absolutely elite player, that their aren't many like him going around, that we are concerned with doing the best thing for our club moving forward etc etc.

If anyone else who heard the interview could comment that could be great (as its possible I simply read/heard too much into what he was saying) but I really felt like it was a significant flip from Thursday's comments, which had me concerned we wanted Griff to stay.

Totally agree. It may just be that he has always felt that way and last weeks presser was just just looking to keep all options open r/e Griffen.

[GVGjr]

Wimberga, agreed, the tone on Griffen has changed...it had to.

[bornadog]

Gordon will be on SEN with KB in the next hour. I won't be able to listen, so can't give an update.

[GVGjr]

Gordon having a crack back at Patrick Smith on SEN. Patrick going hard at him.
Great listening

[SquirrelGrip]

Patrick Smith's putting up the hard questions and PG is not happy and sounding too much like a politician - namely not answering the question in the first instance, and only after he gets badgered for not answering the question does he eventually answer. Come on PG, you can do better than that.

[LostDoggy]

Patrick Smith, the guy started out asking hard questions - now hes just being a tossbag.

[Jam Donuts]

Sure is, terrific to hear.

[GVGjr]

Just listing some things as they occur.

Questioned if McCartney resigned or was sacked. PG insists he resigned
They went through the process of supporting McCartney 4 weeks ago. They don't believe they got it wrong
Griffen departure was going to make it difficult for McCartney continue with the playing group going forward.
A slow deterioration was the likely if McCartney stayed
Smith and PG go hard at each other and Smith implied that PG has interviewed 2 coaches. PG denied it.
Bartlett view that we indulged Griffen by removing the coach and PG doesn't see it that way.
PG won't comment on a Griffen trade other than GWS have made it known they are interested.
There has been no breach of contract with McCartney. There was some clauses in his contract.
Lonergan was approached by McCartney but done in the right way.
A contract is a contract is the common theme by Smith. It's getting a bit tedious.
We will deal with the Griffen request in the best interest of the club
Griffen has just played his 200th game, captain of the club, an AA player and one of the most credentialled players. We would seek a substantial compensation

Bartlett ask about West as a coach. PG advises that they have had some interest.
A panel will be put together led by Chris Grant.
Smith questions PG faith in Grant because he commented that Chris was a great person. Said that's what you said about McCartney.
A cheap shot by Smith about Montgomery because of the cafe link.
PG confirmed that McCartney was a good selection back in 2012.
Smith asks if PG has put too much pressure on a new coach because of his finals in the next 10 years comment. PG pushes back as it was what we should aspire to.
3M increased spend in the footy department in recent times

I'm sure I missed a fair bit

[dadsgirl16]

^^ Pretty much covered it...Smith really is a wanker, thought PG handled it ok

[GVGjr]

Smith and Barlett are acknowledging there is a good block of youngsters and the development of the list.

[SquirrelGrip]

Smith was accurate, and PG got defensive about fair questions:

- it was reasonable to ask if there's a conflict of interest with a potential coach if his wife and the President's wife run a business together at the football club
- it was reasonable to follow up about confidence in Chris Grant as this does come under his portfolio. By giving the same response as he did with McCartney only to sack him the next day (sorry, for him to 'resign') does not engender confidence
- PS must have some mail on coaching interviews. pG's denial only serves to say he didn't personally conduct any interviews
- PG has to realise he stuffed up with the 'contract is a contract' thing with what they did with Lonergan and McCartney.

This Polly speak is not what I want in a Pres.

[GVGjr]

Thanks Squirrel, I agree with your comments. What Smith said was fair but he tried to dominate PG and that wasn't going to fly with him. Smith should have kept to the facts rather than trying to pick apart some comments.

[SquirrelGrip]

That's true GVGr, both of them were guilty of trying to dominate each other rather than keep to the facts and answer the questions directly.

[The Doctor]

Fantastic radio, Gordon vs Smith

Two heavyweights going toe to toe.

I gave it to Smith on points

[bornadog]

Can listen here: http://www.sen.com.au/news/patrick-smith-goes-toe-to-toe-with-peter-gordon


Patrick Smith joined Peter Gordon on SEN’s Hungry for Sport this morning and put some tough questions to the Western Bulldogs president regarding the decisions that were made by the club after captain Ryan Griffen requested a trade.“We could say losing a captain may be careless, but losing a coach less than 24 hours later may be incompetent, what’s your response to that?” asked Smith on Hungry for Sport.
“Losing Griff was a shock to the system,” replied Gordon.
“With Macca we had been through a process with the end of season review where there were some significant concerns that he acknowledged.
“The feedback I think made it clear pretty well to everyone and I think that’s reflected in the fact that he resigned.”
However, Smith doubted that McCartney came to the club and said he did not think he was the man for the job.
“Not many people would believe that Peter, that he resigned.
“I’m suggesting not a lot of people really think he resigned... that there was pressure put on him.”
The Australian football writer pressed further asking Gordon why their stance on McCartney’s position had changed since their initial end of season review that concluded he was the man going forward.
“The review that you did, who ran that, that initially said it would be okay for Brendan to continue?
“Who was responsible for that review?
“Because presumable he won’t do another one for you.”
“Me, Chris Grant and Simon Garlick,” replied Gordon.
Smith went on to emphasise that nothing had changed with regards to McCartney’s position and that the issue was with Griffen.
“Isn’t that his problem and not the coach’s problem at that stage?
“He (Griffen) said that he could do it (work with McCartney), he goes on holiday and says I can’t do it.
“Nothing with the coach has changed because he hasn’t spoken to the coach, so it’s really Griffen’s problem,” explained Smith on SEN.

[Go_Dogs]

Thanks for the reports,will need to digest it all tonight.

[Remi Moses]

Smith was accurate, and PG got defensive about fair questions:

- it was reasonable to ask if there's a conflict of interest with a potential coach if his wife and the President's wife run a business together at the football club
- it was reasonable to follow up about confidence in Chris Grant as this does come under his portfolio. By giving the same response as he did with McCartney only to sack him the next day (sorry, for him to 'resign') does not engender confidence
- PS must have some mail on coaching interviews. pG's denial only serves to say he didn't personally conduct any interviews
- PG has to realise he stuffed up with the 'contract is a contract' thing with what they did with Lonergan and McCartney.

This Polly speak is not what I want in a Pres.

I've been uneasy about Monty having a commercial investment in " The Pound"

[Scorlibo]

Just listened to this myself. If Peter's guilty of anything it's using language too advanced for the likes of Patrick Smith to comprehend. The main point that Smith pressed Peter on was his phrasing moving from 'we have no intention to indulge it' (Griffen's request) to 'a contract is a contract'. Where is the contradiction in that? Those two calls are completely harmonious.

Patrick Smith never fails to impress upon me his utter inadequacy as a journalist and commentator.

[bornadog]

Just listened to this myself. If Peter's guilty of anything it's using language too advanced for the likes of Patrick Smith to comprehend. The main point that Smith pressed Peter on was his phrasing moving from 'we have no intention to indulge it' (Griffen's request) to 'a contract is a contract'. Where is the contradiction in that? Those two calls are completely harmonious.

Patrick Smith never fails to impress upon me his utter inadequacy as a journalist and commentator.

I noticed Smith kept saying sacked, but PG never corrected him each time.

[SquirrelGrip]

The main point that Smith pressed Peter on was his phrasing moving from 'we have no intention to indulge it' (Griffen's request) to 'a contract is a contract'. Where is the contradiction in that? Those two calls are completely harmonious.

The issue isn't the inconsistency with forcing that line on Griffen - the issue is that the argument doesn't stand for how they treated McCartney and the approach they took with Lonergan. I guess now that we're on our way with Boyd, it doesn't matter anyway.

[Scorlibo]

The issue isn't the inconsistency with forcing that line on Griffen - the issue is that the argument doesn't stand for how they treated McCartney and the approach they took with Lonergan. I guess now that we're on our way with Boyd, it doesn't matter anyway.

It absolutely does stand. It's not some wishy-washy call for honour in football - to honour your contract - it's Peter Gordon quite rightfully saying that if Griffen's contracted to us then we are not required to indulge his request for a move to Greater Western Sydney. He can want to move, but we hold the cards/the contract. How do you feel that argument is lessened by sounding out Tom Lonergan or McCartney's sacking/resignation?

[jeemak]

We were acting within our contractual obligations when McCartney resigned. There were clauses contained within it that allowed us to move him along. So in this case, a contract is a contract and clauses within it were exercised.

I don't think we would have allowed Grifen's contract to be laden with get out clauses which favoured him, hence us being in a position to hold him to it.

With respect to Lonergan, it's none of our business if he wants to break his contract. We asked questions of him in the trade period, as we are entitled to do. It's up to Geelong if they want to hold him to their contract, or release him for trade.

It's not rocket surgery, and I don't see what the BFD is. Just journo's looking for a cheap story and a chance to rake some muck.

[LostDoggy]

I noticed Smith kept saying sacked, but PG never corrected him each time.

He would've just been hounded on it if he tried. Better to let it through.


It absolutely does stand. It's not some wishy-washy call for honour in football - to honour your contract - it's Peter Gordon quite rightfully saying that if Griffen's contracted to us then we are not required to indulge his request for a move to Greater Western Sydney. He can want to move, but we hold the cards/the contract. How do you feel that argument is lessened by sounding out Tom Lonergan or McCartney's sacking/resignation?


We were acting within our contractual obligations when McCartney resigned. There were clauses contained within it that allowed us to move him along. So in this case, a contract is a contract and clauses within it were exercised.

I don't think we would have allowed Grifen's contract to be laden with get out clauses which favoured him, hence us being in a position to hold him to it.

With respect to Lonergan, it's none of our business if he wants to break his contract. We asked questions of him in the trade period, as we are entitled to do. It's up to Geelong if they want to hold him to their contract, or release him for trade.

It's not rocket surgery, and I don't see what the BFD is. Just journo's looking for a cheap story and a chance to rake some muck.

Thanks jeemak/Scorlibo. Saved me some typing. On the bolded part, I think journos are just getting swept up in a particular theme, rather than reporting on what's actually unfolding. At the moment the theme is that the Dogs are a rabble, are saying one thing and doing another, and are being somehow underhanded in demanding GWS best prospect in return for our best player. Perish the thought.

[josie]

Smith was accurate, and PG got defensive about fair questions:

- it was reasonable to ask if there's a conflict of interest with a potential coach if his wife and the President's wife run a business together at the football club
- it was reasonable to follow up about confidence in Chris Grant as this does come under his portfolio. By giving the same response as he did with McCartney only to sack him the next day (sorry, for him to 'resign') does not engender confidence
- PS must have some mail on coaching interviews. pG's denial only serves to say he didn't personally conduct any interviews
- PG has to realise he stuffed up with the 'contract is a contract' thing with what they did with Lonergan and McCartney.

This Polly speak is not what I want in a Pres.

Kind of agree with the above wrt fair Q's and fair pressing from Patrick, however PG was good too and still communicated the messages/intent of Club very well IMO. Yes it was a bit heated - that's OK, that's negotiation. Imagine what negotiations are happening wrt Griffen and GSW's Boyd? Would love to be fly on the wall !!!

[Scorlibo]

jeemak, it's simply Patrick Smith looking for hypocrisy where there is none. It wound me up because Peter didn't seem to understand the perspective that Smith was attacking from, and so failed to deliver a retort.

[josie]

Patrick at least asks hard Q's, not like that tosser Robbo who is so EFC centric and so anti-dogs he is appalling. For first time ever I sent in an SMS to SEN with feedback on Robbo being an empty headed idiot or something like this. Anyway Dear Moderators - sorry about off this topic thread.

[Webby]

Has Patrick Smith ever done/run anything? Has he ever been subjected to the conflicts of interest and conflicts of loyalty that are thrown at people every day? Particularly those swimming in the big fishbowl?

I do like Patrick Smith, but he does seem to sit in a very lofty tower at times. Players are tapped up for moves all the time. There's nothing new there. Happens all the time. It's just reality. I don't think Geelong have a problem with us nor do I have a problem with North trying to nick Cooney etc etc etc.

However when a captain of a club essentially walks out, I think it's fair and reasonable for the president of said club to feel particularly let down. If that's hypocrisy, then so be it. I'm not too concerned.

One thing that does concern me, however, is PG's wife's interest in the Pound Cafe. Was that arrangement in place before or after the club committed hundreds of thousands of dollars to bring football (and a lot of hungry/thirsty patrons) back to the WO?

Has a bit of a hint of conflict about it if so. I'm sure there's nothing in it, but just want to know how transparent the club is with these potentially tricky little scenarios.

[bornadog]

Patrick at least asks hard Q's, not like that tosser Robbo who is so EFC centric and so anti-dogs he is appalling. For first time ever I sent in an SMS to SEN with feedback on Robbo being an empty headed idiot or something like this. Anyway Dear Moderators - sorry about off this topic thread.

I rarely watch AFL360 these days because Robbo turns me off. My wife sits there and says, that guy slurs his words and seems permanently drunk. I just say, yeah he is a dickhead.

[Scorlibo]

Patrick at least asks hard Q's

Maybe he asks questions with aggression, but if you listen very closely to what he's saying I think you'll find that he misses the point about 90% of the time. Didn't ask a single question in that interview with any logic behind it. My favourite part was when he told Peter that if he were running the Club, the captain and coach wouldn't have left. Well it's a wonder you're not in a job, Patrick.

[bornadog]

Has Patrick Smith ever done/run anything? Has he ever been subjected to the conflicts of interest and conflicts of loyalty that are thrown at people every day? Particularly those swimming in the big fishbowl?

I do like Patrick Smith, but he does seem to sit in a very lofty tower at times. Players are tapped up for moves all the time. There's nothing new there. Happens all the time. It's just reality. I don't think Geelong have a problem with us nor do I have a problem with North trying to nick Cooney etc etc etc.

However when a captain of a club essentially walks out, I think it's fair and reasonable for the president of said club to feel particularly let down. If that's hypocrisy, then so be it. I'm not too concerned.

One thing that does concern me, however, is PG's wife's interest in the Pound Cafe. Was that arrangement in place before or after the club committed hundreds of thousands of dollars to bring football (and a lot of hungry/thirsty patrons) back to the WO?

Has a bit of a hint of conflict about it if so. I'm sure there's nothing in it, but just want to know how transparent the club is with these potentially tricky little scenarios.

There was a whole thread on the Pound ( I will try and find it). His wife in partnership with Monty's are running it.

[LostDoggy]

One thing that does concern me, however, is PG's wife's interest in the Pound Cafe. Was that arrangement in place before or after the club committed hundreds of thousands of dollars to bring football (and a lot of hungry/thirsty patrons) back to the WO?

Has a bit of a hint of conflict about it if so. I'm sure there's nothing in it, but just want to know how transparent the club is with these potentially tricky little scenarios.

I was of the understanding that PG's wife donated all /some of the takings to charity. Stand to be corrected.

[Bulldog4life]

I was of the understanding that PG's wife donated all /some of the takings to charity. Stand to be corrected.

I think you are right or was it the Club.

[SquirrelGrip]

I think you are right or was it the Club.

Is there a difference?

[jeemak]

Has Patrick Smith ever done/run anything? Has he ever been subjected to the conflicts of interest and conflicts of loyalty that are thrown at people every day? Particularly those swimming in the big fishbowl?

I do like Patrick Smith, but he does seem to sit in a very lofty tower at times. Players are tapped up for moves all the time. There's nothing new there. Happens all the time. It's just reality. I don't think Geelong have a problem with us nor do I have a problem with North trying to nick Cooney etc etc etc.

However when a captain of a club essentially walks out, I think it's fair and reasonable for the president of said club to feel particularly let down. If that's hypocrisy, then so be it. I'm not too concerned.

One thing that does concern me, however, is PG's wife's interest in the Pound Cafe. Was that arrangement in place before or after the club committed hundreds of thousands of dollars to bring football (and a lot of hungry/thirsty patrons) back to the WO?

Has a bit of a hint of conflict about it if so. I'm sure there's nothing in it, but just want to know how transparent the club is with these potentially tricky little scenarios.

Irrelevant, as Peter's partner Kerri is donating her profit share back to the club:

http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/news/2014-08-09/barkers-cafe-opens-at-whitten-oval

[Maddog37]

I like Patrick normally and enjoyed today's discussion. It became the Patrick show though unfortunately in the end, with point scoring being valued more than any actual information discovery.

Patrick was also asking questions that he knew the answers to already in an effort to trap Peter into answering a certain way. Peter constantly resisted this tactic which was fine but to many out there it would have been seen as avoiding the question.

No matter what we were/are going to be dragged through the mud after the week we've had. If it was the Hawks it would be a mutual parting of the ways of coach and club and a masterstroke in trade management by releasing an ageing player.

[Webby]

Patrick at least asks hard Q's, not like that tosser Robbo who is so EFC centric and so anti-dogs he is appalling. For first time ever I sent in an SMS to SEN with feedback on Robbo being an empty headed idiot or something like this. Anyway Dear Moderators - sorry about off this topic thread.


Irrelevant, as Peter's partner Kerri is donating her profit share back to the club:

http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/news/2014-08-09/barkers-cafe-opens-at-whitten-oval

If that's the case then not only is there no conflict, it's actually quite honourable. I almost feel a bit grubby for questioning it now! That's the effect of listening to Patrick Smith for too long... You tend to start becoming a cynical conspiracy theorist, too!

Must say though, I quite like Smith 95% of the time.

[Topdog]

Thanks everyone for the reports

[Bulldog Revolution]

I thought PG completely had Smiths length

Smith wanted to attack him and get him riled - he wasn't drawn into that

I felt he answered the questions as well as anyone could have

And the clubs response was later when the Boyd deal was announced

[SonofScray]

I enjoy listening to Smith. However, like with many journalists they have set a particular narrative and use a technique called priming to force a context in which that narrative can play out. I think PG is too clever for that stuff, he is very particular in his phrasing so it is hard to twist his words.

Sometimes it sounds like politician speak, which I am OK with when it is clear that giving a straight answer will not be accepted, or will be misquoted to further the set narrative outlined by the journo.

As a Club of late we've really held fast against that crap. Just flat out not participating. It must frustrate people looking to rake some muck (Smith, Barrett). When they don't get their way, thy get personal and try to goad an emotive response. Didn't work. Smith was quite nasty I thought. Unprofessional. PG got the better of him.

Today was a better day at the office from our leadership. I'm a bit stung by the Macca "resignation" and the Club seeming to make a knee jerk reaction, but I feel that we as Member's have been treated respectfully, been given a reasonably precise and articulate summary of the processes that see us here today and am prepared to take it at face value.

[Twodogs]

Has Patrick Smith ever done/run anything?

He was a decent fast bowler for Prahan in District cricket. He's best remembered for punching a Footscray batsman in the face during a game.

[Remi Moses]

Tony Paone wasn't it?
Made some derrogitive remark about Paone and the area of Footscray .
He does get on his ivory tower sometimes

[GVGjr]

Apparently Will Minson was on MMM this morning but I missed it. Did anyone hear him?

[GVGjr]

Minson apparently very supportive of Gordon and the club

[Twodogs]

Tony Paone wasn't it?
Made some derrogitive remark about Paone and the area of Footscray .
He does get on his ivory tower sometimes

Yep, it was Popeye he hit. I think that incident colours most of the comments he makes about us and is why I don't worry about what he says about anything to do with Footscray/Western Bulldogs. He is incapable of not being biased regarding us. He has a prejudice and should excuse himself from any discussion about us or state his bias before commenting.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Minson apparently very supportive of Gordon and the club
He was very supportive of the club. When asked about Griffen's decision he said something like "all i'll say is i was surprised"

[Axe Man]

Apparently Will Minson was on MMM this morning but I missed it. Did anyone hear him?

I heard a snippet and he said something along the lines of being bemused at being put in the same boat as Griffen and Higgins in wanting out. Said that they did what they did for their own reasons and that was nothing to do with him.

[GVGjr]

The Minson interview is up on MMM now

Griffen is in South Australia pig-shooting after last Friday declaring he wants to move to GWS.
“If he wants to go pig shooting by all means go pig shooting but I was certainly surprised by the comments,” Minson said on Triple M.
Minson said it's unfair to lump him, Ryan Griffen and Shaun Higgins in to the same pile.
“The challenge is to put all of them into the one group and I don’t think that’s fair,” Minson said on Triple M.
“Shaun made his decision and that’s one case.
“As far as I was concerned, I’ve been on record and I was on your radio program a few weeks ago when I was in Singapore, at the time those comments around my end of season meeting with the coach were quite incorrect.
“I wasn’t entirely sure why it was that those comments were floating around.
“I had a constructive meeting with Macca, I’ve worked with Macca for three years.
“Three really good years, one of those being the best years of my career.
“I was focused on making improvements that I needed to make and you do that in end of season reviews.
“I was a little bemused as to why there was so much talk around my situation.
“That said Ryan Griffen is another completely different situation.
“He’s made a decision where he feels the best thing for him is to move on from the Bulldogs.
“I don’t think you can put myself and Higgo and Grif all into the same sentence.
Minson described suggestions that the players had thrown the coach Brendan McCartney out as ‘crazy’.

“To suggest that the decisions that have been made are solely on the feedback of the players would be unfair to the powers at the footy club that make these big decisions,” Minson said on Triple M.

“Largely speaking it’s the board and the CEO and football administration.”

[LostDoggy]

The Minson interview is up on MMM now

Griffen is in South Australia pig-shooting after last Friday declaring he wants to move to GWS.
“If he wants to go pig shooting by all means go pig shooting but I was certainly surprised by the comments,” Minson said on Triple M.
Minson said it's unfair to lump him, Ryan Griffen and Shaun Higgins in to the same pile.
“The challenge is to put all of them into the one group and I don’t think that’s fair,” Minson said on Triple M.
“Shaun made his decision and that’s one case.
“As far as I was concerned, I’ve been on record and I was on your radio program a few weeks ago when I was in Singapore, at the time those comments around my end of season meeting with the coach were quite incorrect.
“I wasn’t entirely sure why it was that those comments were floating around.
“I had a constructive meeting with Macca, I’ve worked with Macca for three years.
“Three really good years, one of those being the best years of my career.
“I was focused on making improvements that I needed to make and you do that in end of season reviews.
“I was a little bemused as to why there was so much talk around my situation.
“That said Ryan Griffen is another completely different situation.
“He’s made a decision where he feels the best thing for him is to move on from the Bulldogs.
“I don’t think you can put myself and Higgo and Grif all into the same sentence.
Minson described suggestions that the players had thrown the coach Brendan McCartney out as ‘crazy’.

“To suggest that the decisions that have been made are solely on the feedback of the players would be unfair to the powers at the footy club that make these big decisions,” Minson said on Triple M.

“Largely speaking it’s the board and the CEO and football administration.”

Thanks GVGjr. Sorry I missed hearing the interview, I like hearing Minson speak, he's a very clever fellow with his words (off-field! on-field is another topic).

[GVGjr]

Thanks GVGjr. Sorry I missed hearing the interview, I like hearing Minson speak, he's a very clever fellow with his words (off-field! on-field is another topic).

If you log onto MMM you can hear it.

[GVGjr]

Simon Garlick on Trade Radio soon. Might be worth a listen to :)

Pickering made some interesting comments before.

[GVGjr]

Garlick has been impressive on the various stations.

[GVGjr]

Garlick on AW soon.

[whythelongface]

Thanks GVGjr. Sorry I missed hearing the interview, I like hearing Minson speak, he's a very clever fellow with his words (off-field! on-field is another topic).

He is quite articulate our Minno.

[GVGjr]

Jason McCartney on SEN soon. Could be worth a listen to :)

[GVGjr]

Just confirmed he will be on at 8.45am

[GVGjr]

A quick summary

Great day for the club, supporters and members
Boyd is a player to fill that key forward spot
Long term investment, we aren't expecting miracles. It will take time much like Tom Hawkins
Crameri and Stringer were just about the first two texts Jason received once the deal went through.
Good for team structure.
Young list with some quality seniors players

Cooney, Tutt and Jones have all expressed interest in leaving. Jason won't be drawn on the outcome as there is a fair bit to play out

[G-Mo77]

Thanks GVG. Once again I just missed it.

[KT31]

Thanks GVG, loving the involvement and maturity of Stringer over the last week.

[bornadog]

Thanks GVG. Once again I just missed it.

Don't worry you didn't miss much at all.

[GVGjr]

Just listening to KB and the discussion is that we are paying way overs. I think we all get that.

KB is saying it's the biggest risk ever by a club
They are also saying the paying some of Griffen's salary is over the top and we are likely to do the same with Cooney today

[GVGjr]

KB has opened up the lines with the theme to talk about the risks we are taking

[Mantis]

KB has opened up the lines with the theme to talk about the risks we are taking

I think we all understand we are taking a huge risk, but I think we would all agree that it is about time we went 'all-in' rather than just poke around waiting for our turn to come.

[LostDoggy]

People are so hung up on 'risk'. Risk is life. Without taking calculated risks there can be no return other than what you're used too.

Playing safe will always remain safe.

I've had numerous conversations in the last few days about the $ we'd be paying Boyd. People can't get it through their heads that 95% of the salary cap HAS TO BE SPENT each season! If there's a gap it needs to be filled. If we pay some of Griffens or Cooneys wage because there's a gap then who cares? It's flow through money from the AFL, not business specific funds used for player payments.

[stefoid]

seriously, cash in the short term (<=3 years) isnt a problem is it? We have to pay a certain % of the salary cap regardless of how it is divied up.

They look at cash we are paying out, but Higgins, Cooney and Griffen werent on peanuts to start with. Even paying a percentage of their wages for the next 2 or 3 years, and replacing them with draftees, we would be cash positive.

We will be paying Boyd a raw recruits wage next year by law. So in 2015 I see our TPP being less than this year.

Basically $$ in the shorter term for us isnt as big a deal as it is for clubs well stocked with mature talent. So we can leverage that situation to get better trade deals!

Surely paying some short term cash for Coons and getting a 2nd rounder is better than being forced by law to pay a fringe player an extra $100K more than his worth and taking a 3rd rounder for Coons?

Lets leverage our cash situation now to its best advantage, and worry about in 3 years time when our young guns are coming OOC, cooney and griffen are off our balance sheet alltogther, Boyd is in his prime and ripping it up, and inflation of the cap over time has reduced the % of the TPP that boyd is consuming anyway.

Whats the cap going to be in 5 or 7 years time? Boyd deal will look pretty good then when other teams are paying 1.5 mil a year for similar players. Inflation!

[Webby]

Paying part of Griffen and Cooney's salaries as a sweetener is smart business. We're no hope of paying the minimum cap amount in 2015 without it, so if it nets us a slightly better trade deal, it's a good play.

[KT31]

People are so hung up on 'risk'. Risk is life. Without taking calculated risks there can be no return other than what you're used too.

Playing safe will always remain safe.

I've had numerous conversations in the last few days about the $ we'd be paying Boyd. People can't get it through their heads that 95% of the salary cap HAS TO BE SPENT each season! If there's a gap it needs to be filled. If we pay some of Griffens or Cooneys wage because there's a gap then who cares? It's flow through money from the AFL, not business specific funds used for player payments.
Much better this way than the way the Dee's did it with Frawley.

[GVGjr]

I think we all understand we are taking a huge risk, but I think we would all agree that it is about time we went 'all-in' rather than just poke around waiting for our turn to come.

Agree on all counts. We went for the long term fix rather than trying to do the same thing we have for the last 10 years.

[Sedat]

Just listening to KB and the discussion is that we are paying way overs. I think we all get that.

KB is saying it's the biggest risk ever by a club
They are also saying the paying some of Griffen's salary is over the top and we are likely to do the same with Cooney today
It would be a bigger risk to not do anything - do these idiots realise that we've achieved nothing in the last 60 years and that maintaining the status quo would do nothing?

[hujsh]

Playing it safe and taking low risk longshots didn't work out (McDougal etc) so why not take a risk?

[dadsgirl16]

tbh I am a bit over listening to the nay sayers...I am HAPPY HAPPY HAPPY

[LostDoggy]

You need to fix your avatar DG16

[LostDoggy]

I have a different opinion of the "big risk". Im actually in the risk profession (business strategy and risk management). There are so many unknowns about Boyd's contract that we just dont know. Specification of terms and conditions within the contract could significantly minimise our exposure. I.e.
- it could have a performance incentive across all or from year 4 onwards
- it could have injury clause for nominal pay out figure.
PG is a guru of law / contract law. If you look at coach Macca's contract it had a termination clause which covered our financial exposure given a resigniation / termination.

[dadsgirl16]

I know!!! but this is best I could do...kept telling me to make it smaller?????

[Rocket Science]

Barrett currently on trade radio fervently whacking it in reverse and backing over the Boyd deal again and again.

There's too much of a 'revenge factor' from us apparently which clouded our judgement.

Grave concerns whether Boyd was a worthy 1st overall draft pick, that his upside is limited and whether he can realise that upside, even querying the concept of drafting as a massive risk, no guarantees - thanks for that Damo - draft position is meaningless citing the likes of Scully, Watts et al.

Plough playing devil's advocate for the most part but in assessing's Boyd's calibre and pedigree curiously suggesting of their trio of talls Patton was always really the "Giants man" going forward.

And Barrett's piece de resistance, the concept of 'selling hope' is dangerous, ineffective and that Bulldogs supporters are "easily bought" when it comes to that concept.

A bit like the Dogs as basket-case angle is easily bought - and pedalled.

[LostDoggy]

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/tom-boyd-deal-could-ruin-the-western-bulldogs/story-fndv7pj3-1227092259967

Nice article &%^*

[LostDoggy]

Just listened to that as well on Trade Radio, the guy is a tosser. Pretty much saying all Boyd is worth is hope. The comment that we are
''easily bought" got me pretty peeved.

[Sedat]

Barrett currently on trade radio fervently whacking it in reverse and backing over the Boyd deal again and again.

There's too much of a 'revenge factor' from us apparently which clouded our judgement.

Grave concerns whether Boyd was a worthy 1st overall draft pick, that his upside is limited and whether he can realise that upside, even querying the concept of drafting as a massive risk, no guarantees - thanks for that Damo - draft position is meaningless citing the likes of Scully, Watts et al.

Plough playing devil's advocate for the most part but in assessing's Boyd's calibre and pedigree curiously suggesting of their trio of talls Patton was always really the "Giants man" going forward.

And Barrett's piece de resistance, the concept of 'selling hope' is dangerous, ineffective and that Bulldogs supporters are "easily bought" when it comes to that concept.

A bit like the Dogs as basket-case angle is easily bought - and pedalled.
Meh, he just wants to see us in our little downtrodden box. Rattled like the rest of the scribes

[Mofra]

Plough playing devil's advocate for the most part but in assessing's Boyd's calibre and pedigree curiously suggesting of their trio of talls Patton was always really the "Giants man" going forward.
Really, Patton?

A 100kg+ player who has just done two knees which will curtail his development is their man, over Cameron who has performed at AFL level and the 200cm agile monster who would not be traded "under any circumstances"?

Ok then...

[GVGjr]

It's a bit rich for Plough to be questioning the boldness of the Boyd deal when at the time the Eagleton one was considered a massive one that threatened the club. Take a longer term view Plough

[Rocket Science]

Really, Patton?

Ok then...

Exactly.


It's a bit rich for Plough to be questioning the boldness of the Boyd deal when at the time the Eagleton one was considered a massive one that threatened the club. Take a longer term view Plough

Worth noting Plough for the most part endorsing the risk we've taken. Just Barrett suggesting it's foolish lunacy.

[GVGjr]

Worth noting Plough for the most part endorsing the risk we've taken. Just Barrett suggesting it's foolish lunacy.

Plough isn't happy about the money and the impacts on the other players though

[dadsgirl16]

dear Mr Barrett...You know nothing Jon Snow

[Mantis]

Plough isn't happy about the money and the impacts on the other players though

It's a fair point.. In 2016 Boyd will be on $1mil.. Bont will be on less than 1/2 of that.

Barrett is a parasite.

[Bulldog4life]

It's a fair point.. In 2016 Boyd will be on $1mil.. Bont will be on less than 1/2 of that.

Barrett is a parasite.

Interesting times ahead.

[LostDoggy]

It's a fair point.. In 2016 Boyd will be on $1mil.. Bont will be on less than 1/2 of that.

Barrett is a parasite.

And if Bont is worth more at that time, we will still have the cap space to offer it. Everybody is assuming our existing player list is never going to get a pay rise ever again.

[Greystache]

Grave concerns whether Boyd was a worthy 1st overall draft pick, that his upside is limited and whether he can realise that upside, even querying the concept of drafting as a massive risk, no guarantees - thanks for that Damo - draft position is meaningless citing the likes of Scully, Watts et al.

Plough playing devil's advocate for the most part but in assessing's Boyd's calibre and pedigree curiously suggesting of their trio of talls Patton was always really the "Giants man" going forward.

And said something along the lines of Boyd's underage performances weren't anything special, nothing comparable with Patton.

WTF? Patton was picked on perceived upside, plenty of key forwards have had better records than him. Boyd has the best record of any forward in a decade.

They just make this shit up to suit their position and hope no one checks.

[Sedat]

And said something along the lines of Boyd's underage performances weren't anything special, nothing comparable with Patton.

WTF? Patton was picked on perceived upside, plenty of key forwards have had better records than him. Boyd has the best record of any forward in a decade.

They just make this shit up to suit their position and hope no one checks.
Yep. Boyd was as clear a stand-out #1 pick as there has been in the last decade. But it doesn't suit their narrative to have him choose to come to the lowly Dogs and for us to be able to secure his services.

Getting Boyd as well as 5 ND picks in the top 50 (of a supposedly deeper talent pool than previous years) is a result that we should be proud of our list management team for pulling off. Quite astonishing when you think about where we were last week.

Huge draft for Dalrymple and his team.

[Maddog37]

It's us against them and as far as I am concerned they can all rot in hell.

[Torpedo]

Barrett was disrespectful, arrogant and sneering when he finished off with the question on who will coach next year with "ask the players - they run the show down there! Ask the players!" Looking to be another human headline. Too much time spent at the Spreadeagle.?

[LostDoggy]

I really hope he gets a disease that affects his genital functions

[GVGjr]

Barrett was disrespectful, arrogant and sneering when he finished off with the question on who will coach next year with "ask the players - they run the show down there! Ask the players!" Looking to be another human headline. Too much time spent at the Spreadeagle.?

Typical channel 9 fool

[LostDoggy]

I really hope he gets a disease that affects his genital functions

The man has no genitalia, so little chance of that happening.

[anfo27]

Really amazed that we seem friendless in this Boyd trade. Yeah we have given up a lot and yeah he is on an amazing amount of cash but look at the bigger picture guys. Hope sells memberships and sponsorship and the increase in revenue from these areas will be massive for the club. Just wait until the kid proves he can play then we will see those areas increase again.

Maybe these journos don't get it because they are not Bulldog fans. We have been treated with contempt by the AFL, every opposition supporter ever and every journo who is not a doggies man. Make no mistake we are a second class citizen of this comp. No player who has so much great footy ahead of him has ever chosen the Whitten Oval as his destination.

This trade has given every bulldog everywhere hope. Hope that maybe this great club will finally have a team that will allow fans to dream of the holy grail. Hope that our cursed luck is going to change. Hope is a very powerful thing and these journos just don't understand it.

Every bulldog supporter everywhere would have been doing cartwheels after hearing the news. Unless you have red, white and blue running through your veins you have no idea what this means to us.

[azabob]

Do you know what?

The reason we are copping it from the media is because Brendan McCartney is no longer our coach.

This time last week - we were media darlings - Ryan Griffen was mud

Friday when Brendan McCartney "resigned" the media started turning on us.

Brendan with good reason was very well liked by 99% of football people.

[The bulldog tragician]

I think Emma Quayle's summary was pretty fair, actually, acknowledging the gamble we've taken but also understanding why we took the risk.
I also like her commentary around Boyd's ability to handle the pressure. She followed him closely for a series she wrote last year, and would have good insight into his maturity.
http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/the-gamechanging-deal-for-bulldogs-and-giants-20141015-116mx7.html

[GVGjr]

Robbo is still crapping on about Boyd on SEN. I hope not many people know he is from Bendigo

[GVGjr]

Unless I'm hearing this wrong, Robbo appears to be saying that Montgomery undermined Brendan McCartney with the players

[wimberga]

This is real journalism
http://boundforglorynews.com/boyd-a-necessary-risk-for-the-dogs/

[Bulldog4life]

Shows what an idiot Barrett is. In June this is what he wrote.

Greater Western Sydney

If you're Tom Boyd...
...you're going to be mightily rankled today at being axed. You'd also be entitled to start pondering the multiple big offers to play elsewhere that are already in front of you.


Well Tom did now you are bagging him. Such a fool he forgets what he has previously written.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-06-27/sliding-doors-round-15

[azabob]

Unless I'm hearing this wrong, Robbo appears to be saying that Montgomery undermined Brendan McCartney with the players

No, your not hearing wrong.

Barrett also was on that wave length last Friday afternoon.

[Bulldog4life]

Unless I'm hearing this wrong, Robbo appears to be saying that Montgomery undermined Brendan McCartney with the players

The media said the same about Wallace and Joyce.

[comrade]

The fact that the imbeciles in the media are against us makes me feel even better about the trade.

[LostDoggy]

Really amazed that we seem friendless in this Boyd trade. Yeah we have given up a lot and yeah he is on an amazing amount of cash but look at the bigger picture guys. Hope sells memberships and sponsorship and the increase in revenue from these areas will be massive for the club. Just wait until the kid proves he can play then we will see those areas increase again.

Maybe these journos don't get it because they are not Bulldog fans. We have been treated with contempt by the AFL, every opposition supporter ever and every journo who is not a doggies man. Make no mistake we are a second class citizen of this comp. No player who has so much great footy ahead of him has ever chosen the Whitten Oval as his destination.

This trade has given every bulldog everywhere hope. Hope that maybe this great club will finally have a team that will allow fans to dream of the holy grail. Hope that our cursed luck is going to change. Hope is a very powerful thing and these journos just don't understand it.

Every bulldog supporter everywhere would have been doing cartwheels after hearing the news. Unless you have red, white and blue running through your veins you have no idea what this means to us.

Spot on Ando
Love the passion
Whether the big gamble comes off or not at least we had a calculated try and not just sit on the fence and go through the motions
Big ticks to the club giving us the big forward that we have been wanting... patience from our surporters now not to expect the gun to kck 100 goals next season

[Axe Man]

Liked this bit in Robbo's article on the trade period:


The Bulldogs are the most intriguing. Tweeted on Wednesday: “Dogs lost captain, coach, No.6, integrity, respect and generally lost their way. And they bring in Boyd on a mill a year ... #good luck.''

Fair to say Dogs fans were not happy, including Neighbors actor Scott McGregor, who joined the cyber attack squad.

Insulting tweet by Robbo, then he sooks it up when he gets called out on it.

If the AFL is happy with the current trade climate, then there are major issues (http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-premiership/if-the-afl-is-happy-with-the-current-trade-climate-then-there-are-major-issues/story-e6frf3e3-1227093046837#itm=newscomau%7Chome%7Cnca-homepage-news-plus-story%7C3%7Cheading%7Chomepage%7Chomepage&itmt=1413499533919)

[soupman]

Liked this bit in Robbo's article on the trade period:



Insulting tweet by Robbo, then he sooks it up when he gets called out on it.

If the AFL is happy with the current trade climate, then there are major issues (http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-premiership/if-the-afl-is-happy-with-the-current-trade-climate-then-there-are-major-issues/story-e6frf3e3-1227093046837#itm=newscomau%7Chome%7Cnca-homepage-news-plus-story%7C3%7Cheading%7Chomepage%7Chomepage&itmt=1413499533919)

Still can't spell Griffen correctly. Despite him leaving it still annoys the hell out of me.

[LostDoggy]

Well that's really put it into perspective. I was happy about the trade period, but i didn't realise Scott McGregor, Neighbours actor, wasn't fully satisfied with it.

[Twodogs]

Liked this bit in Robbo's article on the trade period:



Insulting tweet by Robbo, then he sooks it up when he gets called out on it.

If the AFL is happy with the current trade climate, then there are major issues (http://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-premiership/if-the-afl-is-happy-with-the-current-trade-climate-then-there-are-major-issues/story-e6frf3e3-1227093046837#itm=newscomau%7Chome%7Cnca-homepage-news-plus-story%7C3%7Cheading%7Chomepage%7Chomepage&itmt=1413499533919)

When I get some time I might go back over Robbo's articles at the end of trade period from last year. I'm speculating but I'm guessing I'll find more than one bemoaning the lack of player movement and complaining about how boring it all was.

[GVGjr]

Well that's really put it into perspective. I was happy about the trade period, but i didn't realise Scott McGregor, Neighbours actor, wasn't fully satisfied with it.

I think he went hard at Robinson over his anti Bulldog theme. It got a bit personal.

[always right]

When I get some time I might go back over Robbo's articles at the end of trade period from last year. I'm speculating but I'm guessing I'll find more than one bemoaning the lack of player movement and complaining about how boring it all was.

While you're at it...try and dig out any of his articles imploring us to be bold in seeking a KPF.

[LostDoggy]

While you're at it...try and dig out any of his articles imploring us to be bold in seeking a KPF.

That's the comparison i'd like to see. The copy & paste insert for every end of trade period - "They failed to get a genuine KP forward target".

[Maddog37]

I think he went hard at Robinson over his anti Bulldog theme. It got a bit personal.

Nothing he didnt deserve though. He just throws cheap shots around without thinking and twitter etc is a chance for the people in the street to have their say. I am new to twitter but enjoy reminding journos when they flip flop. Jay Clark was all too keen to have a crack at us over the Boyd deal but I felt it was more to do with him being shown up for stating it was 1000/1 against than the actual merits of the trade.

[G-Mo77]

Nothing he didnt deserve though. He just throws cheap shots around without thinking and twitter etc is a chance for the people in the street to have their say. I am new to twitter but enjoy reminding journos when they flip flop. Jay Clark was all too keen to have a crack at us over the Boyd deal but I felt it was more to do with him being shown up for stating it was 1000/1 against than the actual merits of the trade.


I'm a huge fan of Scott McGregor after seeing what he said to Robbo

http://s15.postimg.org/whq8vdd8r/Capture.jpg

[chef]

Great stuff. He deserves a few cheap shots back. Wish they'd rid 360 of him so it could become watchable.

[KT31]

Great stuff. He deserves a few cheap shots back. Wish they'd rid 360 of him so it could become watchable.

On the cusp of cancelling my Foxtel because of dicks like him.

[LostDoggy]

I'm a huge fan of Scott McGregor after seeing what he said to Robbo

http://s15.postimg.org/whq8vdd8r/Capture.jpg

That's awesome! Fat bald alco stupidopinions.

I still won watch neighbours but I like this guy!

[KT31]

That's awesome! Fat bald alco stupidopinions.

I still won watch neighbours but I like this guy!

I was wondering who this bloke was, at first I thought it was the bloke off 'Better Homes and Gardens' but his picture was not right.

[Happy Days]

Still can't spell Griffen correctly. Despite him leaving it still annoys the hell out of me.

I'm more offended that a professional journalist seems to think he's above pronouns.

[bornadog]

I'm more offended that a professional journalist seems to think he's above pronouns.

People in public that have twitter accounts really should not be having a stoush with the general public, that is really unprofessional as well.

[KT31]

Something a little more positive.

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Draft picks: 26, 27, 39, 45, 46, 82, 100 and 118.
Arrived: Tom Boyd, Shane Biggs, Zaine Cordy (father-son), picks 39 and 46
Departed: Ryan Griffen, Adam Cooney, Liam Jones (traded) Shaun Higgins (free agency) Daniel Giansiracusa, Tom Williams (retired) Brett Goodes, Tom Young, Christian Howard (delisted), picks 6, 37 and 64
2015 Premiership odds: $101
Trade activity: Pulled off the recruiting coup of the club's history by snaring key forward prodigy Tom Boyd. The 19-year-old from GWS did come at a hefty price, costing them their disgruntled skipper Ryan Griffen and pick 6. Brownlow medalist Adam Cooney had also become stale at Whitten Oval and was offloaded to Essendon, while Jones never took the ample opportunities he received and ended up at Carlton. The Dogs received second and third round picks for them respectively. Former Swan Biggs will add poise, sure kicking and run off half-back while versatile tall defender Cordy looms as bargain.
Trade misses: The Bulldogs made the best offer for Levi Greenwood, but he chose Collingwood. Kangaroo Kieran Harper had a medical at the club but a deal never eventuated. The 21-year-old may still end up at Whitten Oval as delisted free agent. They were also into Cat Tom Lonergan but that deal fell through when coach Brendan McCartney was sacked.
Trade period mark: Long criticised for having a conservative approach at the trade table, the Dogs for once have been daring and they should be applauded for it. Boyd may have come at a high cost, but you don't often get the chance to recruit a blue-chip 200cm key forward, something they have craved since club great Chris Grant retired in 2007. Griffen, Cooney, Jones and Higgins all wanted out after a turbulent 2014, so the Dogs did well to get what they did for them. 8/10 - Ryan Davidson

More : Part 1 http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-10-17/trade-period-washup

Part 2 http://www.afl.com.au/video/2014-10-16/trade-wrap-part-2-we-rate-your-club (http://www.afl.com.au/video/2014-10-16/trade-wrap-part-2-we-rate-your- club)

[The bulldog tragician]

Have no idea who Scott McGregor is, but a new hero of mine.

[GVGjr]

The one thing that the summary misses is that we made a play for Darcy Moore at the father son and academy players bidding.
In the highly unlikely scenario of Collingwood refusing to match our bid, we wouldn't have had pick 6 to trade along with Griffen to GWS for Boyd.

That tells me at the start of trade week we really didn't have Boyd coming to us in our short term plans and things just fell our way.
With hindsight we might have missed an opportunity to trade pick 6 for something a little later and still been able to satisfy GWS for Boyd.

[Axe Man]

With hindsight we might have missed an opportunity to trade pick 6 for something a little later and still been able to satisfy GWS for Boyd.

That's a good point, I didn't think of that. I wonder if we could have done something along the lines of trading pick 6 to the likes of West Coast (11), Richmond (12), or Freo (13) in return for their pick plus a solid player or a second round pick and still got the Boyd deal done with that later pick?

[Pickenitup]

He is a Great Bulldogs man Scotty seen him at plenty of games glad he gave it to Slobbo.
I have had just about enough of Damian Barrett he seriously hates our club.

[hujsh]

The one thing that the summary misses is that we made a play for Darcy Moore at the father son and academy players bidding.
In the highly unlikely scenario of Collingwood refusing to match our bid, we wouldn't have had pick 6 to trade along with Griffen to GWS for Boyd.

That tells me at the start of trade week we really didn't have Boyd coming to us in our short term plans and things just fell our way.
With hindsight we might have missed an opportunity to trade pick 6 for something a little later and still been able to satisfy GWS for Boyd.

If it was before we knew Griffen was leaving then we wouldn't have had the necessary tools to trade for Boyd.

[azabob]

The one thing that the summary misses is that we made a play for Darcy Moore at the father son and academy players bidding.
In the highly unlikely scenario of Collingwood refusing to match our bid, we wouldn't have had pick 6 to trade along with Griffen to GWS for Boyd.

That tells me at the start of trade week we really didn't have Boyd coming to us in our short term plans and things just fell our way.
With hindsight we might have missed an opportunity to trade pick 6 for something a little later and still been able to satisfy GWS for Boyd.


If it was before we knew Griffen was leaving then we wouldn't have had the necessary tools to trade for Boyd.

Liam Pickering is on record saying he and the list management team at the Bulldogs had a meeting just after the season ended to discuss the possibility and interest level of trying to get Tom Boyd to the football club.

The Ryan Griffen decision to leave and choose GWS was a total coincidence and hence speed up the process of getting Boyd to the Bulldogs.

GVGjr are you saying we shouldn't have added pick six to the trade?

Personally I wonder what sweetner card was played first out of pick six and paying Griffen's salary.

[LostDoggy]

I agree that this trade looks like it lacked a bit of finesse from our club, and probably could've involved another club to ensure we got a second round pick or decent player as well.

GWS would've taken up to around pick 10 or 11 IMO. Anyway what's done is done, and what was done landed us Tomboy!

[GVGjr]

GVGjr are you saying we shouldn't have added pick six to the trade?

Personally I wonder what sweetner card was played first out of pick six and paying Griffen's salary.

I'm saying we might have lost pick 6 to Darcy Moore and not really had enough to satisfy GWS. It's all just a bit of speculation.

I think we all agree that we paid overs for Boyd but most realise we couldn't just keep doing what we have for the last 15 years and still expected to land a genuine key forward like Boyd. We went 'all in' and I think we had to.

[Remi Moses]

I know we're all a bit on edge with the happenings at the club, but gee some in the media like to use weasel words and conduct themselves appallingly .
Example tonight on AW that obnoxious thing Dwayne Russell points out that Cooney says we have no fans and should be offended.
All Cooney said was that he looks forward to big crowds and big games.
Blantantly obvious this is the case, but to imply we have no fans is just weasel words and not What Cooney said.
Just another case of stirring up a shit storm

[Maddog37]

I know we're all a bit on edge with the happenings at the club, but gee some in the media like to use weasel words and conduct themselves appallingly .
Example tonight on AW that obnoxious thing Dwayne Russell points out that Cooney says we have no fans and should be offended.
All Cooney said was that he looks forward to big crowds and big games.
Blantantly obvious this is the case, but to imply we have no fans is just weasel words and not What Cooney said.
Just another case of stirring up a shit storm


He just wants to people to talk about him. If everyone pretends he is not there he may actually disappear. When he is on the radio just turn it off or over to another channel. He is an oxygen thief.

[Remi Moses]

It's almost like they say something controversial and get a reaction
Twist some words around and incite some outrage.
Caught a bit of Robbo Thursday night and he wants to hear from Brett Montgomery .
Tried to imply in his loud way that he may have had something to do with events.

[jeemak]

I don't know why any of you bother with the mainstream media, to be honest.

I'll admit I take the easy way out and get most of my news from Woofers who seemingly take a bullet for me, but I suppose I do it out of not wanting to get riled up over a fourth estate that sold its integrity out a long time ago.

[G-Mo77]

I don't know why any of you bother with the mainstream media, to be honest.

I finally clicked after the trade period and stop following the reporters on Twitter I really don't like, although the list is drying up because I can't keep my keyboard from giving them a piece of my mind and they block me.

I got blocked by Barrett long ago, Ralphy and a few radio guys can't remember their names. To Robbo's credit he will take a Twitter flame pretty well unlike Ralphy who blocked me after I pointed out that Monty was with Port Adelaide when he had a go at Ramanauskas after he tried to find a theme in culture after Minson sledged Peace. I wasn't polite about it but he was certainly a bit precious.

[Webby]

Interesting. Year of the Dogs 2.

Let's do a cleanout.

Robbo's article in the Scum today is comparing Montgomery to Wallace in Year of the Dog. I've heard many say that Robbo trawls WOOF, but was never 100% convinced, myself. I think that as of this morning, he's definitely been in WOOF the past couple of days.

Seems an easy job, journalism!

[chef]

Sounds like the fat drunk has got an angle and he's going to run with it.

Always better to be first with the news than right with the news with these flogs.

[azabob]

On the upside Gerard Wheatley is all for the dogs and the bold move to recruit Boyd.

[GVGjr]

On the upside Gerard Wheatley is all for the dogs and the bold move to recruit Boyd.

Is that in today's paper or from a previous article?

[azabob]

Is that in today's paper or from a previous article?


In today's Herald Sun, it is literally only two sentences "I'm with the Bulldogs here. Be Bold and don't die wondering".

The sun has a few articles about us today - I see a couple of the more negative ones have been posted, but not the positive one Jay Clarke wrote about how we went to all of Tom Boyd's games this year regardless of the venue.

How we also believe he was too heavy and will be a more "streamlined version" in 2015.

[azabob]

I finally clicked after the trade period and stop following the reporters on Twitter I really don't like, although the list is drying up because I can't keep my keyboard from giving them a piece of my mind and they block me.

I got blocked by Barrett long ago, Ralphy and a few radio guys can't remember their names. To Robbo's credit he will take a Twitter flame pretty well unlike Ralphy who blocked me after I pointed out that Monty was with Port Adelaide when he had a go at Ramanauskas after he tried to find a theme in culture after Minson sledged Peace. I wasn't polite about it but he was certainly a bit precious.

I have also had the twitter cleanse post trade period - down from 178 to 117 and still a few to go.

G-Mo77 I don't understand why people respond so aggressively to jurno's whose opinion you don't agree with. I doubt you would respond with the same venom if you saw them in the street of pub.

[Bulldog4life]

I have also had the twitter cleanse post trade period - down from 178 to 117 and still a few to go.

G-Mo77 I don't understand why people respond so aggressively to jurno's whose opinion you don't agree with. I doubt you would respond with the same venom if you saw them in the street of pub.

Gotta admit that I for one prefer the clever put down of the journos rather than the personal insults.

[Webby]

In today's Herald Sun, it is literally only two sentences "I'm with the Bulldogs here. Be Bold and don't die wondering".

The sun has a few articles about us today - I see a couple of the more negative ones have been posted, but not the positive one Jay Clarke wrote about how we went to all of Tom Boyd's games this year regardless of the venue.

How we also believe he was too heavy and will be a more "streamlined version" in 2015.

Saw that, too. I like Whateley. He's a good Yin to Robbo's Yang. From memory, the crux of Whateley's point was that this is the beginning of a spate of mega-deals. So a slightly more complimentary undertone than the "group think" among some journos that it's just the dumb little dogs being desperate.

Whateley's intellect allows him to firstly be a broader thinker than most of his colleagues and, secondly, to have the self-assurance to go against the boys' club consensus. I've always held his opinion in far, far higher regard than the lump who sits next to him on AFL360. So his subtle nod to the Boyd trade is enough for me.

[G-Mo77]

I have also had the twitter cleanse post trade period - down from 178 to 117 and still a few to go.

G-Mo77 I don't understand why people respond so aggressively to jurno's whose opinion you don't agree with. I doubt you would respond with the same venom if you saw them in the street of pub.

Probably would Aza. I doubt I could resist having a crack at Barrett or Robbo if I ever saw them on the street.

[azabob]

Saw that, too. I like Whateley. He's a good Yin to Robbo's Yang. From memory, the crux of Whateley's point was that this is the beginning of a spate of mega-deals. So a slightly more complimentary undertone than the "group think" among some journos that it's just the dumb little dogs being desperate.

Whateley's intellect allows him to firstly be a broader thinker than most of his colleagues and, secondly, to have the self-assurance to go against the boys' club consensus. I've always held his opinion in far, far higher regard than the lump who sits next to him on AFL360. So his subtle nod to the Boyd trade is enough for me.

Totally agree Webby. As Gerard suggested its the beginning of a brand new era and for once we are at the front of the forward thinking (along with Liam Pickering and Sydney ) ;)

[LostDoggy]

Completely agree that in the very near future these type of deals will be the order of the day.

The only thing that slightly irks me about our particular deal is that if we offered that sort of money to any high quality forward free agent, (maybe not this year but over the next two years or so say a Jack Reiwolt or Tex, we would have gotten them for free whereas going after Tommy has cost us at least 2 possibly 3 top ten picks.

With the cap space we have we need to be all over the FA thing next year it is literally a free hit, doesn't cost you anything but cash which we have a bucket load of in our cap. We can pick up a couple of decent defenders next year that are 26 -27 and will have 4 or 5 great years left ahead of them, front load them up so that enough cash is around for Bonti, Macrae, Stringer, etc in a couple of years.

[wimberga]

Completely agree that in the very near future these type of deals will be the order of the day.

The only thing that slightly irks me about our particular deal is that if we offered that sort of money to any high quality forward free agent, (maybe not this year but over the next two years or so say a Jack Reiwolt or Tex, we would have gotten them for free whereas going after Tommy has cost us at least 2 possibly 3 top ten picks.

With the cap space we have we need to be all over the FA thing next year it is literally a free hit, doesn't cost you anything but cash which we have a bucket load of in our cap. We can pick up a couple of decent defenders next year that are 26 -27 and will have 4 or 5 great years left ahead of them, front load them up so that enough cash is around for Bonti, Macrae, Stringer, etc in a couple of years.

Your absolutely right re: picks and getting other guns like riewoldt or tex. However the big thing is that tom actually wanted to come to us. The bulldogs.

That happens rarely enough as it is, let alone with key forwards. Now that we have tommy, we might hopefully get more people wanting to come to us.

[ledge]

Robbo has a short memory.. What about the deal of Alistair Lynch, that was many years ago then add Judd, Franklin, it's not exactly new. They didn't have a go at any of them and we actually have done it smart by getting him young. Those blokes were well
Into their career.
Robbo is in for a hell of a shock and a huge apology in about 4 years time.

[LostDoggy]

I have also had the twitter cleanse post trade period - down from 178 to 117 and still a few to go.

G-Mo77 I don't understand why people respond so aggressively to jurno's whose opinion you don't agree with. I doubt you would respond with the same venom if you saw them in the street of pub.

I gave Mike Sheahan a bake at Southbank one morning, have told Wilson what I thought of her journalism in Collins Street and would dearly love to run into Robinson in a pub.

They don't present their opinion as opinion, they write it as fact. I don't have an issue with opinions at all, but when somebody questions or disagrees with these muppets they launch a "campaign". In my opinion (gotta love the irony here) you're entitled to one if you back it up with some reasonable facts, and are prepared to change it if you come across new facts and ideas.

Otherwise, they should keep it to themselves and just write about what's actually happening.

[Happy Days]

I don't know why any of you bother with the mainstream media, to be honest.

I'll admit I take the easy way out and get most of my news from Woofers who seemingly take a bullet for me, but I suppose I do it out of not wanting to get riled up over a fourth estate that sold its integrity out a long time ago.

I get my hard news from Twitter (140 characters is much more coppable than having to read Robbo/Ando/Stevo/Niallo go long form; one of them (cant remember who) legitimately used a fart joke as a lede in a match report this year) and create my own opinion and discourse from there because I am smarter than they are, much like all of us on here.

The obligation for all media to act as a watchdog is mitigated and totally undermined by the necessity of pandering to a readership comprised mainly by the lowest common denominator. That's why gay marriage is a debate, not a law, why banning the burqa exists as a movement and not a hate crime, and why Robbo wins awards for his grammatically erroneous hot takes.

[ledge]

Now they have started the bontempelli wants a new contract theme because Boyd is getting so much.. How come these points were t bought up at the swans deal last year or judd at Carlton , and he walked in as captain!!

[hujsh]

The obligation for all media to act as a watchdog is mitigated and totally undermined by the necessity of pandering to a readership comprised mainly by the lowest common denominator. That's why gay marriage is a debate, not a law, why banning the burqa exists as a movement and not a hate crime, and why Robbo wins awards for his grammatically erroneous hot takes.

And of course the climate 'debate'

[LostDoggy]

Now they have started the bontempelli wants a new contract theme because Boyd is getting so much.. How come these points were t bought up at the swans deal last year or judd at Carlton , and he walked in as captain!!

Perhaps because salary caps at both caps are a sensitive issue.

[w3design]

Tom Boyd will be on Triple M this morning at 7:30am.

[always right]

Any chance of this "football" thread not becoming a forum to push personal political views?

[Hot_Doggies]

Now they have started the bontempelli wants a new contract theme because Boyd is getting so much.. How come these points were t bought up at the swans deal last year or judd at Carlton , and he walked in as captain!!

Judd was a Brownlow medalist , premiership captain, champion payer etc etc.

[ledge]

Judd was a Brownlow medalist , premiership captain, champion payer etc etc.

Understand that but no Matter who it is its still Salary cap space just because they are great footballers doesn't mean salary cap is any different, the point they are getting at is how do we afford to keep
Other players., why haven't they made that call in other clubs before ?
Also if I was VC of a club, done the hard yards at the club and all
Of a sudden another guy comes to the club and takes away all your chances of your chances of being captain wouldn't that upset a few ?.

[westdog54]

Robbo has a short memory.. What about the deal of Alistair Lynch, that was many years ago then add Judd, Franklin, it's not exactly new. They didn't have a go at any of them and we actually have done it smart by getting him young. Those blokes were well
Into their career.
Robbo is in for a hell of a shock and a huge apology in about 4 years time.

I can just see it now. Boyd wins the Coleman on the way to a top 4 finish and Peter Gordon comes out wearing a chef's hat and apron, carrying a massive 'humble pie' for any who might be hungry.

[G-Mo77]

Understand that but no Matter who it is its still Salary cap space just because they are great footballers doesn't mean salary cap is any different, the point they are getting at is how do we afford to keep
Other players., why haven't they made that call in other clubs before ?
Also if I was VC of a club, done the hard yards at the club and all
Of a sudden another guy comes to the club and takes away all your chances of your chances of being captain wouldn't that upset a few ?.

The trend I have found coming from opposition supporters is "How can we afford him?" I think that spills over to the knobs in the media as well because lets face it they're glorified fans and nearly anyone on here can come up with better stories than these muppets.

There is a salary cap everyone has the same amount of money to spend (NSW clubs don't count) even the lowly Bulldogs can throw money around if it's there. We lost close to $1.5M in contracts this season, probably more. We've got plenty of room for Tom and plenty more to pay our young players coming through and other FA's in the coming years.

[w3design]

I can just see it now. Boyd wins the Coleman on the way to a top 4 finish and Peter Gordon comes out wearing a chef's hat and apron, carrying a massive 'humble pie' for any who might be hungry.

Hopefully he is carrying the pie in 1 hand, because the other hand is busy holding the premiership cup....:)

[LostDoggy]

I can just see it now. Boyd wins the Coleman on the way to a top 4 finish and Peter Gordon comes out wearing a chef's hat and apron, carrying a massive 'humble pie' for any who might be hungry.

Jeeeezus, you're right: It'll be 30 years next year since a Dog won the Coleman. (sorry to go off-topic, this probably deserves its own)

[Axe Man]

Link to Triple M Tom Boyd interview and also Darcy talking about being on the new coach panel: Link (http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/shows/hot-breakfast-eddie-mcguire/)

[Greystache]

Link to Triple M Tom Boyd interview and also Darcy talking about being on the new coach panel: Link (http://www.triplem.com.au/melbourne/shows/hot-breakfast-eddie-mcguire/)

Darcy didn't even know Clay Smith wears 14.

Now that he does however, he believes he's an elite player in our competition and loves the way he goes about it.