Jones to the Blues

[GVGjr]

For pick 46

The Blues win that one.

[Scorlibo]

Fairly disappointing.

[bulldogtragic]

Bad result. Very bad.

[whythelongface]

Thought he was worth more than that, but then again I thought he was a better player than he actually is. Maybe I think too much.

[LostDoggy]

All he is worth on his previous years performances.

[G-Mo77]

Yep poor result but one of those ones where we needed to deal or get nothing.

[Mantis]

That's a shocking result when compared to the Stanley deal.

Not happy with this one.

[Scorlibo]

Given Hawthorn received two picks in that range for Mitch Hallahan, I'll be damned if we haven't been bent over with this one.

[Sedat]

Disappointing result. Mitigated somewhat by the bonus of the Cooney trade but would have still liked to see us stand our ground. Basically it is Jones and Cooney for Biggs and pick 39 - no clear winners but we did drop our strides for Jones.

[Jeanette54]

I think we will regret that trade... :(

[chef]

Seems about right to me.

[1eyedog]

Looks like we tried to do the right thing by him rather than the club. We've cleared out the dead wood anyway. He'll be a more man's Jarrod Waite and Waite ain't no star.

[Rance Fan]

Aww noooo!
Hope doesn't bite us down the track

[whythelongface]

I think we will regret that trade... :(

I think so as well, but then again I always over rated Jones.

[craigsahibee]

$$ relief?

[Bulldog4life]

No other team wanted him. Would have lost him in the PSD for nothing. Let's see who we get for pick 46.

[Doc26]

Very disappointed. Big win for Carlton with this trade.

[G-Mo77]

I wonder if the acquisition of Boyd made Jones expendable.

I still would have rather kept him.

[Sedat]

Redpath now stays surely. That work we put into him as a key defender last year might suddenly come in handy.

[Dancin' Douggy]

Not a great deal. But kind of refreshing.
A clean slate.

[jeemak]

I think we're about 5-10 draft positions short on this one, but not much more.

[always right]

Not sure what else the club could have done.

Assume Tutt goes to the PSD.

[LostDoggy]

Can't win them all. Probably 8-10 pick too low, but we got Biggs for nothign essentially.

Good luck frustrating the hell out of Blues supporters Liam!

[GVGjr]

I think we're about 5-10 draft positions short on this one, but not much more.

Yep, pick 35 would have been around the mark

[hujsh]

Since no one else wanted him and he could go PSD I guess it's probably good we got anything for him

[Sedat]

Yep, pick 35 would have been around the mark
I'm sure we will pick up someone with pick 46 "who we expected to go much earlier in the draft" :D

[bornadog]

I think we're about 5-10 draft positions short on this one, but not much more.

We got desperate in the end and anything would do.

[bulldogtragic]

No tall defenders & Jones gone. I guess Redpath & Austin might be elevated?

[G-Mo77]

No tall defenders & Jones gone. I guess Redpath & Austin might be elevated?

No for Austin. I'm on the fence on Redpath.

I'd rather take the 5 picks.

[bulldogtragic]

No for Austin. I'm on the fence on Redpath.

I'd rather take the 5 picks.

I agree, but I would've but then already. Soon see.

[Remi Moses]

Thought Jones should have gone in the 30's
Probably that much effort into the Boyd / Griffen trade that this one got a bit lost.

[LostDoggy]

I'm glad we just got him to the club he wanted. We've looked after every single player but Tutt, and this will be noted. We've also been totally fair in every single deal we've made this trade season, and I like that about us. Leave the trade nuisance tag to Essendon.

[KT31]

$$ relief?

For me just a relief it's over for another year and we fared pretty darn well.

[Mantis]

I'm glad we just got him to the club he wanted. We've looked after every single player but Tutt, and this will be noted. We've also been totally fair in every single deal we've made this trade season, and I like that about us. Leave the trade nuisance tag to Essendon.

Good call.

[Ozza]

Its all well and good to say that he is worth 10 picks more etc.... but we're a bit hamstrung by the fact that Carlton was the only club interested in Jones, and obviously we don't (or he doesn't) see a future for him at the club.

I was always a staunch Jones supporter - but unfortunately he was horrible more often than not, at AFL level.

Perhaps he is worth more than 46 - all things being equal - and if there is interest. And Stanley is a huge result for the saints. But the same as selling your house, it comes down to who wants to buy and what they are prepared to pay for it.

Shaun Hampson to Richmond and Cameron Wood to Collingwood years ago - are two examples of desperate 'buyers'.

[Mofra]

Karma - we did Jones a favour by accepting unders, Sydney gave us Biggs for nothing (we got Darley for peanuts last year too).

I don't see Jones as in Carlton's best 22 but who knows. He's not our player anymore and life goes on with our genuine gun power-forward which Jones was never going to become.

[stefoid]

We may not even end up using 46.

[Bulldog Joe]

For pick 46

The Blues win that one.

I'm not so sure.

Liam needs to improve a lot to be worth a regular game.


That's a shocking result when compared to the Stanley deal.

Not happy with this one.

Yes. It is a little bizarre, but Stanley is more flexible.
Can play back, forward or ruck and probably has more endurance


Given Hawthorn received two picks in that range for Mitch Hallahan, I'll be damned if we haven't been bent over with this one.

I expect Hallahan to be a 100 gamer. Would be getting a regular gig just about everywhere. He was very good in the VFL GF.

[GVGjr]

We may not even end up using 46.

How have you come to that idea?

[Bigboyjp]

I'm not so sure.

Liam needs to improve a lot to be worth a regular game.

I agree he does need to improve his work rate a little lazy.

i thought we'd put too much into him to let him leave! In saying this he seems to have been "one" of the players upset at his end of year assessment.

Good luck to him I think we may have got what we deserved for him. Let's not forget Adam Goodes was picked up at pick 45 from memory?

[stefoid]

If we take some delisted player like that North Melbourne dude as a DFA and upgrade Redpath for example?

Or if we upgrade Redpath and Austin, which isnt outside the realms of possibility given our age profile now.

Just possibilities I aint got no sauce or anything

[Ghost Dog]

Who can say the Blues win that one? Wait and see. Hope! Must be the afterglow of the Boyd pick.

Yeah, Goodes at 45. Brian Lake was pick.....72 from memory? Gives me all the reason to barrack for a smokey.:)

[GVGjr]

Who can say the Blues win that one Gary? Wait and see.

Yeah, Goodes at 45. Brian Lake was pick.....72 from memory? Gives me all the reason to barrack for a smokey.:)

Its hard to get exact valuations but we didn't do badly.

[Ghost Dog]

Its hard to get exact valuations but we didn't do badly.

If Jones hated the hair dryer treatment from Macca, hope he knows who his coach is going to be at the Blues! HAHAHA

[ledge]

We got Honeychurch at 60 , I don't think you can judge until you see who the pick is.

[Scorlibo]

I expect Hallahan to be a 100 gamer. Would be getting a regular gig just about everywhere. He was very good in the VFL GF.

Hallahan has value, no doubt, good luck to him and the Suns. But by the same logic, Jones was very good in the VFL GF also, and you'd expect him to reach 100 games too. The difference with Jones is his upside seems far greater.

I think it's easy to forget the exponential curve of draft picks and success. Once past pick 50, and including the rookie draft, players have more or less the same chance of making it. If we were receiving a pick any later than 50, it would be nearly worthless. Pick 50 and Pick 80 would be closer in their chances of success than pick 10 and pick 15. So getting pick 46 is pretty underwhelming, and I would have far preferred to keep Jones.

[LostDoggy]

Seems about right to me.

Agree Chef

[LostDoggy]

Thank. Christ he's gone!!

[boydogs]

Needed someone else to show interest, but clubs are pretty switched on and know we gave him opportunity after opportunity and he couldn't deliver

[LostDoggy]

More Footscray's loss than the Western Bulldogs isn't it?

[Go_Dogs]

We only ever got to see Jones' best inconsistently. Whether he will become a consistent performer remains to be seen, but I don't think we can be too disappointed about it.

[azabob]

There is an article in today's Age how Jones is training with for dog James Mulligan.

Below is an extract from it.

Reading the article has actually made me angry and Jones for the first time. Oh and get this I am so surprised he hadn't even seen the blues training base until the day he was traded.





Under Mulligan's guidance at the Fit Centre in Maribyrnong, Jones has been training six days a week for the past three weeks to ensure he is ready to make an impression on his new teammates. Jones has been running and lifting heavy weights every second day and boxing on alternate days.

"I need to obviously work on my aerobic base, just so I can run out games a bit better, and use my speed and strength as repeat efforts," he said.

"I began working on that three weeks ago. I started training earlier than I usually would. I am just looking forward to getting stuck into pre-season and building that aerobic base.

"I think it's been a thing that has improved over the six years I was at the Bulldogs and I am just looking forward to taking that to the next level.

"Once I get that up, everything else is pretty strong."


http://www.watoday.com.au/afl/afl-news/carlton-recruit-liam-jones-take-extra-step-before-new-journey-20141018-1180sp.html

[mighty_west]

So the balls finally dropped for him to work his guts out on his fitness because he's trying to impress his new club?

Good riddance.

[ledge]

Admits he wasn't trying like he should have been.

[jeemak]

Yep. Thanks Liam, and good luck.

Let's see how long it lasts for you at Carlton, hopefully you won't go belly up when things get tough for you in your next stint.

[bulldogtragic]

There is an article in today's Age how Jones is training with for dog James Mulligan.

Below is an extract from it.

Reading the article has actually made me angry and Jones for the first time. Oh and get this I am so surprised he hadn't even seen the blues training base until the day he was traded.





Under Mulligan's guidance at the Fit Centre in Maribyrnong, Jones has been training six days a week for the past three weeks to ensure he is ready to make an impression on his new teammates. Jones has been running and lifting heavy weights every second day and boxing on alternate days.

"I need to obviously work on my aerobic base, just so I can run out games a bit better, and use my speed and strength as repeat efforts," he said.

"I began working on that three weeks ago. I started training earlier than I usually would. I am just looking forward to getting stuck into pre-season and building that aerobic base.

"I think it's been a thing that has improved over the six years I was at the Bulldogs and I am just looking forward to taking that to the next level.

"Once I get that up, everything else is pretty strong."


http://www.watoday.com.au/afl/afl-news/carlton-recruit-liam-jones-take-extra-step-before-new-journey-20141018-1180sp.html

I can honestly say I saw his first vfl Ressies game for Willy. He looked as fit then as he does now, where's the improvement? He looked as talented then as he does now. On this level of improvement I wouldn't be banking on Liam for too much if I was Carlton... But then again they threw $800,000 at Daisy and went after Jaksch while Boyd was gettable. If the gym story is working on Carlton maybe they should've gone after Muligan.

[BulldogBelle]

So now is the time for Liam to put in and try and build his fitness.:rolleyes:

[Remi Moses]

So the penny drops when he wants a new club
I'm sorry but I wish him no luck, and it's an indictment on him to be honest.

[1eyedog]

He'll revert to his old ways it's in his nature. He has something to drive him now but wait until he approaches the first hurdle.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Has he done any training regarding reading the flight of a football in the air?

[divvydan]

Has he done any training regarding reading the flight of a football in the air?

I believe he's enrolled in the Corey McKernan aerodynamics school called "Wait for it".

[LostDoggy]

Hope he benches 150kg, so when the ball bounces of his chest the opposition gain a few extra metres!

[GVGjr]

I still would have preferred to keep Jones as I think he would have benefited by having Boyd in the side. He could have also been handy to give Minson a spell in the ruck.

[1eyedog]

I still would have preferred to keep Jones as I think he would have benefited by having Boyd in the side. He could have also been handy to give Minson a spell in the ruck.

He was simply not prepared to work hard enough. As a club the penny finally seemed to drop this year when we went after a key forward at all costs, obviously resigned to the fact that Jones was not going to make it. He's lazy and unfit and really as soon as we confirmed Boyd I think we were pretty keen to get whatever we could for him. Some players get to a level and think they are doing enough and ride on expectation, potential and talent rather than hard work and he was one of them. It must have been quite a shock for him to be dropped for such a long time and I for one am glad Macca finally took a no nonsense approach to him, even if it did take two years. In that time we had a good enough look at him to have serious concerns about the distinct lack of a number of attributes required to play key forward (reading play, positioning, creating space, reading the flight of the ball) which are all mandatory prerequisites for the position he was playing. He possessed none of these and was happy to get by showcasing his aerial capabilities and kicking the odd goal here and there. I'm glad Macca weeded him out because there is no way that style of play holds up in finals and when we reach the big dance the last thing we need is a passenger.

[GVGjr]

I'm not sure I agree with all of that. Jones was sent back to the VFL to work on his deficiencies and from what I heard he accepted the criticism as well as most would.
What he objected to was after he had played some good games and improved the areas he was asked to he wasn't returned to the seniors. It's at that point his issues with McCartney became more evident and he was prepared to look elsewhere.

I think we have motivated him to become a better footballer at another club more than becoming a better footballer for us.
Time will tell if he can perform consistently or if he can achieve another level but to me losing the likes of Hill and Everitt were more understandable than losing Jones.

Jones hasn't just jumped to a club that was lacking a key forward he has gone to one where he will have to fight hard to get a senior game. More than most he has a lot of motivation now to become a better player.

[mighty_west]

I'm not sure I agree with all of that. Jones was sent back to the VFL to work on his deficiencies and from what I heard he accepted the criticism as well as most would.
What he objected to was after he had played some good games and improved the areas he was asked to he wasn't returned to the seniors. It's at that point his issues with McCartney became more evident and he was prepared to look elsewhere.

I think we have motivated him to become a better footballer at another club more than becoming a better footballer for us.
Time will tell if he can perform consistently or if he can achieve another level but to me losing the likes of Hill and Everitt were more understandable than losing Jones.

Jones hasn't just jumped to a club that was lacking a key forward he has gone to one where he will have to fight hard to get a senior game. More than most he has a lot of motivation now to become a better player.

If this was a case of needing to find motivation from being angry and wanting out for another club, then imo it's best for him as a player and for our club, because on that alone he was always going to just go through the motions at our club.

[Maddog37]

Good luck to him. I'm pretty meh about it all now.

[1eyedog]

I'm not sure I agree with all of that. Jones was sent back to the VFL to work on his deficiencies and from what I heard he accepted the criticism as well as most would.
What he objected to was after he had played some good games and improved the areas he was asked to he wasn't returned to the seniors. It's at that point his issues with McCartney became more evident and he was prepared to look elsewhere.

I think we have motivated him to become a better footballer at another club more than becoming a better footballer for us.
Time will tell if he can perform consistently or if he can achieve another level but to me losing the likes of Hill and Everitt were more understandable than losing Jones.

Jones hasn't just jumped to a club that was lacking a key forward he has gone to one where he will have to fight hard to get a senior game. More than most he has a lot of motivation now to become a better player.

Fair enough it sounds like you have inside knowledge re. how he responded to being dropped whereas I don't. It's interesting that he obviously met key criteria at VFL level but was not elevated and I am wondering whether Macca had already lost patience / decided that he probably wasn't going to make it, which, going by Macca's actions (or lack thereof), seemed to suggest that this was the case. This sounds like an oxymoron (doing what was asked and Macca losing patience) but I can't explain it and I guess Macca was in the best position to judge.

Given his inconsistent playing track record at our club over a long period of time it's safe to say that you have more confidence in his ability to turn himself around as an AFL player than I. I seriously question whether he can sustain the motivation he'll need not only to crack into the senior team at Carlton but also handle the constructive criticism that Mick will undoubtedly hand out. Who knows, maybe he'll respect Mick more than he respected Macca and he'll be happy to tow the coach's line no matter what. Good luck to him.

[Bulldog4life]

I still would have preferred to keep Jones as I think he would have benefited by having Boyd in the side. He could have also been handy to give Minson a spell in the ruck.

I read GVG that he was more determined to leave when finding out we traded for Boyd.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Jones has a lot of serious limitations that he has never been able to overcome, and that is without going into the fact that he struggles to play well v decent defenders. When I compare him with Grant, at least the latter has a high footy IQ and the capability to trouble/beat/play well on some quality defenders. Having said that - Grant's attitude/application means it's hard to see him lasting beyond next season.

If you are a key forward and you don't have a large endurance base, or you don't lead to the right spot and you can't read the play/flight of the ball - you simply won't make it.

He might be able to improve his endurance, but after 6 years and no improvement I highly doubt it. I expect him to deliver a handful of good games next season for Carlton, but his overall product will be more of the same - a run and jump player who frustrates far more than he pleases.

[GVGjr]

I read GVG that he was more determined to leave when finding out we traded for Boyd.

I don't really know but he does play his best football when he is not the main target. I think Boyd in the side would have helped him. I think the added versatility of Jones being able to spend some time in the ruck as well would have been invaluable for us.

[1eyedog]

Duplicate post

[1eyedog]

I don't really know but he does play his best football when he is not the main target. I think Boyd in the side would have helped him. I think the added versatility of Jones being able to spend some time in the ruck as well would have been invaluable for us.

I think going hard at Boyd the way we did shows what we really thought of Jones in the end. Added to this we didn't really try to hold onto him and took pittance to help him on his way. Rather than assist Jones' career, Boyd effectively stamped his papers in terms of having a future with us. It became obvious that Jones was more inclined than not to stay when Macca resigned but when Boyd came on-line that seemed to change again. I think Jones would have played under sufferance knowing that Boyd was the man and that he (Jones) could never live up to it. Who knows what was going on inside his head following the VFL GF...

[Ozza]

Good to hear he is in the gym working hard. Great news story.
I'm also looking forward to hearing that Shaun Higgins is having a great pre-season.

October-February is a great period for all of the under achievers to be up and about.

[LostDoggy]

Hope he benches 150kg, so when the ball bounces of his chest the opposition gain a few extra metres!
Like it.

I'm not sure I agree with all of that. Jones was sent back to the VFL to work on his deficiencies and from what I heard he accepted the criticism as well as most would.
What he objected to was after he had played some good games and improved the areas he was asked to he wasn't returned to the seniors. It's at that point his issues with McCartney became more evident and he was prepared to look elsewhere.

I think we have motivated him to become a better footballer at another club more than becoming a better footballer for us.
Time will tell if he can perform consistently or if he can achieve another level but to me losing the likes of Hill and Everitt were more understandable than losing Jones.

Jones hasn't just jumped to a club that was lacking a key forward he has gone to one where he will have to fight hard to get a senior game. More than most he has a lot of motivation now to become a better player.

This is only my opinion, I don't live in his head. However: I don't think he is really motivated to become a better player, I think his motivation is simply to get into the senior team. Every time he was dropped to the VFL he'd meet criteria, get another senior gig and before you know it, revert to type. Because he'd already achieved his goal: playing senior footy.

I think we need more than that to persevere with a bloke.

[Remi Moses]

He has serious issues when a defender interrupts his run at the football in which most AFL defenders do.
Not a great reader of the ball in flight either and regardless of whether he wants to be 1st 2nd or whatever forward you do require second and third efforts on a consistent basis . He does it at the lower level, but once he steps up he is very inconsistent .

[Remi Moses]

I think going hard at Boyd the way we did shows what we really thought of Jones in the end. Added to this we didn't really try to hold onto him and took pittance to help him on his way. Rather than assist Jones' career, Boyd effectively stamped his papers in terms of having a future with us. It became obvious that Jones was more inclined than not to stay when Macca resigned but when Boyd came on-line that seemed to change again. I think Jones would have played under sufferance knowing that Boyd was the man and that he (Jones) could never live up to it. Who knows what was going on inside his head following the VFL GF...

I thought he said he wanted a change after 2013. Regardless I think he'd made his mind up in the exit interviews
He's gone now so it's a moot point, but he wanted out and got his wish.

[LostDoggy]

has he done any training regarding reading the flight of a football in the air?

heh heh!!!!!!!!;)

[LostDoggy]

Let's look at it this way: we're playing Carlton and have to match up Jones. How many minutes does our defender have to study for?

[westdog54]

Given Jarrad Grant's departure I think this is worth revisiting.

We need to trust the List Management Team. They got this one massively right.

[BulldogBelle]

Got told this by someone in the know that Carlton offered Jones $400k+ to leave.
He refused and will stay to the end of his contract.
Don't how true it is but interesting scenario.

[always right]

Got told this by someone in the know that Carlton offered Jones $400k+ to leave.
He refused and will stay to the end of his contract.
Don't how true it is but interesting scenario.
Sounds like a joke to me.

[bulldogtragic]

Got told this by someone in the know that Carlton offered Jones $400k+ to leave.
He refused and will stay to the end of his contract.
Don't how true it is but interesting scenario.

He gets $750-800,000 to stay and play VFL. Hes the highest paid VFL player now so why leave?

[Dancin' Douggy]

i still get great deal of smug satisfaction from this trade, and the length and size of his contract.
How worlds have turned.

[LostDoggy]

Waiting for the preseason reports saying he's training the house down ect ect..

Reminds me of my cricket career, could train the house down and look a million bucks, but struggle out in the middle.

[Ghost Dog]

What did we get for Jones?

[GVGjr]

What did we get for Jones?

Caleb Daniel was the player we selected with the pick Carlton gave us for Jones.

[LostDoggy]

Pick 46 I think which we used to get Biggs or Honeychurch or was it Caleb? :confused:

[LostDoggy]

Either way we are miles ahead in this trade.

[Ghost Dog]

Paying someone to leave is pretty funny. List clogger in the truest sense. Some Italian mobsters in a Visy van might visit him late in the night and break his ankles.

[Rocco Jones]

I think he is worse than a list clogger. He has a poor attitude which is a bit of a cancer on a team trying to develop/do the right things.

[LostDoggy]

Paying someone to leave is pretty funny. List clogger in the truest sense. Some Italian mobsters in a Visy van might visit him late in the night and break his ankles.

Or put a Horse's Head on his pillow.

[bornadog]

I think he is worse than a list clogger. He has a poor attitude which is a bit of a cancer on a team trying to develop/do the right things.

How do you know this?

[Rocco Jones]

How do you know this?

His onfield manner is proof enough. Not saying he is a bad guy, plenty of good people don't care about their jobs but not the type I'd want in a developing squad.

[bulldogtragic]

His onfield manner is proof enough. Not saying he is a bad guy, plenty of good people don't care about their jobs but not the type I'd want in a developing squad.

Too harsh. Once we see this awesome new marking technique and he takes the league by storm we will be suffering in our jocks.

[BulldogBelle]

It still gives me a laugh when l think how excited all the Blues supporters were in getting Jones.
They would not listen to the Dogs supporters when told that he was shit.

[KT31]

Either way we are miles ahead in this trade.

I would have done the deal for a couple of old minties wrappers.

[stefoid]

Too harsh. Once we see this awesome new marking technique and he takes the league by storm we will be suffering in our jocks.

I dont want to suffer there!

[Twodogs]

I dont want to suffer there!


It's an interesting phrase when you look at it.