Bomber, Whoosha & Choco

[The Doctor]

There are 3 premiership winning coaches currently out of a senior job; Mark 'Bomber' Thompson, John 'Whoosha' Worsfold and Mark 'Choco' Williams. I may be mistaken, but none have been linked to our vacant coaching position. Why?

If you were to line up all the prospective coaches in the country up against a wall and had to chose one, playground style, these 3 would be near the front? We are in the glorious position of being able to offer a proven coach a job. Ahead of Beveridge, Sumich, Monty, Tudor and who ever else? Surely we have to be asking them first, if not, why not?

[GVGjr]

Thompson is an interesting one
- His stocks have dropped dramatically in the last 6 weeks.
- His refusal to pay the $30,000 fine could see him stood down for 12 months as well.
- There is also constant speculation that he has too many distractions to fully commit to a senior role
- At a guess I'd say the dismissal of McCartney would rule him out for us.

I wouldn't ask him to apply

Worsfold would be my choice but..
- He is in the committee
- He has ruled himself out of a senior coaches role for 2015

I'd have a real push to get but wouldn't hold my breath

Williams is the wildcard but his name is rarely mentioned as being a candidate for senior roles.

I'd ask him to apply.

Is it worth us chasing a premiership coach given we are a few years off being in that sort of window?

[mjp]

I think Williams is amazing.

No idea why he isn't going hard for the job OR why we aren't trying hard to get him to take it. It really is a curious situation.

[Twodogs]

Thompson is an interesting one
- His stocks have dropped dramatically in the last 6 weeks.
- His refusal to pay the $30,000 fine could see him stood down for 12 months as well.
- There is also constant speculation that he has too many distractions to fully commit to a senior role
- At a guess I'd say the dismissal of McCartney would rule him out for us.

I wouldn't ask him to apply

Worsfold would be my choice but..
- He is in the committee
- He has ruled himself out of a senior coaches role for 2015

I'd have a real push to get but wouldn't hold my breath

Williams is the wildcard but his name is rarely mentioned as being a candidate for senior roles.

I'd ask him to apply.

Is it worth us chasing a premiership coach given we are a few years off being in that sort of window?

I'd have a tilt at Worsfold. At least he's at the club and in on the process. Maybe after he has sat through all the interviews he will think "I'm 10 times the coach than those guys" and it will motivate him to apply? Maybe the rest of the committee will say the same to him and ask him to apply? Maybe that's been our out clause all along-that if we don't find someone suitable then now that we have got Woosha involVed??


I think Williams is amazing.

No idea why he isn't going hard for the job OR why we aren't trying hard to get him to take it. It really is a curious situation.

What do you like about him? Is it fair to say that he is a player's coach.

[mjp]

He is a skills first football teacher. His port teams hit targets under pressure...and played hard for him. If anyone should get s second chance it is a coach who regularly finished the qualifying rounds on top of the ladder, won a gf (despite the chairman wanting him out) and had a group so tightly knit that they just dominated the cross town crows in showdowns.

Plus-he has continued to coach. No media. No footy manager type stuff. He coaches. We should get him.

[lemmon]

Just rewatched 'The Chosen Few' and it turned me off Worsfold to be honest. Not because he can't coach but you could see the fatigue on his face when he talked about the role, I think it took a fair bit out of him and I wouldn't be prepared to offer him the role till we are 100% convinced he is ready to go again for the long haul. I'm liking the idea of Choco more and more, by rights he was deemed good enough for GWS and I like that he's gone to Richmond and worked closely with individual players.

[Twodogs]

If Choco can come in and improve our skills then he would be a great fit for us. It's the stage of our development we are at and the area of our game that needs the most attention. We won't go to the next level until we become a more skilled team

[Remi Moses]

We're in the dark re. Coaches interest in the position.
Does Williams want to coach again?
Worsfold looked completely washed out after his tenure, and is on record for wanting another 12 months of.
I don't think Bomber's interested, after what happened to McCartney
You have to have coaches interested and not have a Malcolm Blight situation .

[Scraggers]

I would be happy with Woosha or Bomber but if it were my choice I would be throwing the kitchen sink at Chocco or Ayres. Both have proven results of getting the best out of young groups.
But I'll state it here and now ... If Sumich gets the job I will be ripping up my 18th year membership and sending it back to the club with a big NO THANK YOU !!! The guy is a dead-set numpty. If both the Perth teams over looked him it's certainly telling you something. Just like Chocco Royal ... He should stay an assistant for the rest of his being !!!!

[GVGjr]

Doc, who would be your preferred candidate? I'm amazed that Worsfold and Williams haven't been linked to us as making a real play at them.

Would it come down to money?

[Scorlibo]

But I'll state it here and now ... If Sumich gets the job I will be ripping up my 18th year membership and sending it back to the club with a big NO THANK YOU !!!

That's disappointing.

[1eyedog]

I would be happy with Woosha or Bomber but if it were my choice I would be throwing the kitchen sink at Chocco or Ayres. Both have proven results of getting the best out of young groups.
But I'll state it here and now ... If Sumich gets the job I will be ripping up my 18th year membership and sending it back to the club with a big NO THANK YOU !!! The guy is a dead-set numpty. If both the Perth teams over looked him it's certainly telling you something. Just like Chocco Royal ... He should stay an assistant for the rest of his being !!!!

You would rip up your membership? Wow.

[Scraggers]

That's disappointing.


You would rip up your membership? Wow.

I cannot think of a bigger statement to express my disappointment and anger in such a stupid decision.

I'm all smoke and mirrors and would probably never do it ... but we have to vote with our feet.

[Bulldog4life]

I cannot think of a bigger statement to express my disappointment and anger in such a stupid decision.

I'm all smoke and mirrors and would probably never do it ... but we have to vote with our feet.

Just wondering Scraggers would it be your 2014 or 2015 membership you'd tear up? :)

[Scraggers]

Just wondering Scraggers would it be your 2014 or 2015 membership you'd tear up? :)

Depends when the decision is made :cool: but probably this years ... I mean, I wouldn't want to rip up a perfectly good 2015 membership now would I??? :p

[Twodogs]

I cannot think of a bigger statement to express my disappointment and anger in such a stupid decision.

I'm all smoke and mirrors and would probably never do it ... but we have to vote with our feet.


Just wondering Scraggers would it be your 2014 or 2015 membership you'd tear up? :)


Depends when the decision is made :cool: but probably this years ... I mean, I wouldn't want to rip up a perfectly good 2015 membership now would I??? :p

Buy two membership and only rip up one. Problem solved.

[The bulldog tragician]

Please tell more about your dislike of Sumich??

the Daniel Southern incident turned me off him completely but I realise this is completely irrational (the guy had the gall to complain that when Daniel put him in a choker hold he feared he would die - and this irritates me:) ). But he just has that kind of demeanour that does not appeal.

The reasons why Thompson is being overlooked have been widely canvassed in other threads, and increasingly in mainstream media. No thanks.

I don't mind Choco, for the also irrational reason that when my sister and I were walking out of the 09 PF, he actually initiated a conversation with us saying we were completely robbed and it was the worst umpiring he'd ever seen. He has a bit of eccentricity about him that I think would resonate with our fans. Life wouldn't be dull I suspect.

None of us really know, we just have to hope the club gets this right!

[Ghost Dog]

That's not a bad gimmick idea. A fake 'microwavable' membership for stress relief. Richmond would sell a heap!

[Twodogs]

I'm starting to warm to Williams.

[Ghost Dog]

Never forget the show after Port won their first premiership. The whole 'choker' thing.

[Templeton31]

He is a skills first football teacher. His port teams hit targets under pressure...and played hard for him. If anyone should get s second chance it is a coach who regularly finished the qualifying rounds on top of the ladder, won a gf (despite the chairman wanting him out) and had a group so tightly knit that they just dominated the cross town crows in showdowns.

Plus-he has continued to coach. No media. No footy manager type stuff. He coaches. We should get him.

I agree with this strongly. We've been bold with Boyd, we've got a list manager who seems to know his stuff and a recruiting guy who's nailed a few picks in the last few years. What we want is the best coach we can get and its hard to see how Chocco doesnt look at least the equal of the best coach and a great fit.

[LostDoggy]

Just to clarify,are we talking Chocco Williams or Chocco Royal?

[GVGjr]

Just to clarify,are we talking Chocco Williams or Chocco Royal?

Williams

[BulldogBelle]

I would be happy with Woosha or Bomber but if it were my choice I would be throwing the kitchen sink at Chocco or Ayres. Both have proven results of getting the best out of young groups.
But I'll state it here and now ... If Sumich gets the job I will be ripping up my 18th year membership and sending it back to the club with a big NO THANK YOU !!! The guy is a dead-set numpty. If both the Perth teams over looked him it's certainly telling you something. Just like Chocco Royal ... He should stay an assistant for the rest of his being !!!!

I don't think that Sumich is a numpty, dolt, airhead, dimwit, dork, dunce, lunkhead, or lamebrain. He just seems to be that way because of his slow speech. I wouldn't send my membership back if they picked Sumich as coach, I'd probably just die of a heart attack.

I like Montgomery, I think that he has more to offer then he has shown. Seems to be a clever guy.

[LostDoggy]

Cheers ;)

[jeemak]

Never forget the show after Port won their first premiership. The whole 'choker' thing.

Whilst it wasn't a great look he'd just won a premiership after being labelled a choker in the media for two years running, and had the club's major sponsor and chairman saying he wasn't the right man to get the job done.

Adelaide is a tough place to be a coach under those circumstances, so one might forgive a slight lapse in grace.

[1eyedog]

Whilst it wasn't a great look he'd just won a premiership after being labelled a choker in the media for two years running, and had the club's major sponsor and chairman saying he wasn't the right man to get the job done.

Adelaide is a tough place to be a coach under those circumstances, so one might forgive a slight lapse in grace.

I'm sure not one Port Adelaide fan gave a shite either. If he won a Premiership for us he could drop his dacks on the day and still go down a Bulldog legend.

[Webby]

Whilst it wasn't a great look he'd just won a premiership after being labelled a choker in the media for two years running, and had the club's major sponsor and chairman saying he wasn't the right man to get the job done.

Adelaide is a tough place to be a coach under those circumstances, so one might forgive a slight lapse in grace.

Well, even the bloke who it was all aimed at took it well, so fair game IMO. I wouldn't be upset if Chocco got the gig.. Although I'd still have Tudor and Beveridge ahead of him...

Just had a thought, if you'd told me 15 years ago that a bloke nicknamed "Chocco" would coach the Dogs, I'd have conjured up images of a completely different person..

[jeemak]

Well, even the bloke who it was all aimed at took it well, so fair game IMO. I wouldn't be upset if Chocco got the gig.. Although I'd still have Tudor and Beveridge ahead of him...

Just had a thought, if you'd told me 15 years ago that a bloke nicknamed "Chocco" would coach the Dogs, I'd have conjured up images of a completely different person..

Well I'm glad you've moved past racial classifications of coaches and slang nicknames for them. :)

[Twodogs]

I'm sure not one Port Adelaide fan gave a shite either. If he won a Premiership for us he could drop his dacks on the day and still go down a Bulldog legend.


If anything it would probably add to the legend! :D

[Twodogs]

Well I'm glad you've moved past racial classifications of coaches and slang nicknames for them. :)

I reckon more people would know who you were talking about if you said Chocco Royal than if you said Brian Royal though.

I met some Bairnsdale boys at the footy who'd come down to see him play one of his first games. They were saying that his nickname around the club when he played at Bairnsdale was Kaiser because his surname was Royal and he was the king.

[jeemak]

I don't doubt it, nobody in my family ever referred to him as Brian.

[Ghost Dog]

Whilst it wasn't a great look he'd just won a premiership after being labelled a choker in the media for two years running, and had the club's major sponsor and chairman saying he wasn't the right man to get the job done.

Adelaide is a tough place to be a coach under those circumstances, so one might forgive a slight lapse in grace.

Oh no, I thought it was brilliant. Love to see a bit of eccentric emotion in a game full of cardboard cut outs.
Remember the tears streaming down his face. Can't remember the last coach I saw cry, after wining a final.

[Scraggers]

Please tell more about your dislike of Sumich??

the Daniel Southern incident turned me off him completely but I realise this is completely irrational (the guy had the gall to complain that when Daniel put him in a choker hold he feared he would die - and this irritates me:) ). But he just has that kind of demeanour that does not appeal.

The reasons why Thompson is being overlooked have been widely canvassed in other threads, and increasingly in mainstream media. No thanks.

I don't mind Choco, for the also irrational reason that when my sister and I were walking out of the 09 PF, he actually initiated a conversation with us saying we were completely robbed and it was the worst umpiring he'd ever seen. He has a bit of eccentricity about him that I think would resonate with our fans. Life wouldn't be dull I suspect.

None of us really know, we just have to hope the club gets this right!

I have met him twice ... once non-football related, and once through football. Both times were very negative experiences (that I'm not going to go into in a public forum).

My concerns in relation to our club are :-
1. His communication skills (talks slowly and mumbles ... not my words, just what I have read)
2. Was passed up by both WA clubs (according to the Perth newspaper ... Nisbett revealed that Sumich has been briefed on why West Coast management opted to appoint Adam Simpson as Worsfold’s replacement last year. “We’ve discussed all of those issues with Peter and they’re better off left with Pete,” he said. LINK (http://www.perthnow.com.au/sport/afl/peter-sumich-and-simon-lloyd-could-depart-fremantle-being-targeted-by-rival-afl-clubs/story-fniv64vs-1227109306612) )
3. We need an experienced coach (it really scares me that we are looking at untried coaches)

[The Doctor]

Peter Gordon said, and I paraphrase, we need a coach who can teach how to win, so why isn't Choco Williams in the mix? Or is he?

[chef]

Maybe he's happy doing what he's doing already, had his time as head honcho.

[Remi Moses]

We haven't heard.
Maybe he's not interested

[Scraggers]

Peter Gordon said, and I paraphrase, we need a coach who can teach how to win, so why isn't Choco Williams in the mix? Or is he?

Precisely

[GVGjr]

Peter Gordon said, and I paraphrase, we need a coach who can teach how to win, so why isn't Choco Williams in the mix? Or is he?

I might be wrong here but he just expressed an opinion and noted he wasn't on the selection panel.
The mere fact that we have interviewed inexperienced coaches including Montgomery means that Gordon's opinion wasn't a directive for the committee. They need to appoint the person best placed to take the club forward.

It's up to the committee to make their recommendations and I guess the board will approve.

[1eyedog]

I'm surprised there's been very little about Choco.

http://www.3aw.com.au/blogs/3aw-sport-blog/williams-the-man-for-dogs-healy/20141029-3j5ki.html

[azabob]

A lot of similarities with Williams and when we selected Eade. We required an experienced coach who coould bring everyone together and sell hope to the supporters and membership base. Willams has had time away from the main job, whilst staying involved in the game and appears to have a good rapport with the younger players.

If we are not talking to him, i hope there is a very good reason.

[Remi Moses]

Maybe they enquired and he's not interested.
We're all speculating to be honest, but I don't think Williams would sell extra memberships for the club .
I think Beveridge is hot favourite .

[1eyedog]

Maybe they enquired and he's not interested.
We're all speculating to be honest, but I don't think Williams would sell extra memberships for the club .
I think Beveridge is hot favourite .

At a superficial level he sounds like the most uninspiring candidate. Let's hope we got it right if he gets the gig.

[GVGjr]

Garlick on 3AW

Mark Williams: 'We had a large list that we worked down and the decision we came to was to progress without him'

[Bulldog4life]

Garlick on 3AW

Mark Williams: 'We had a large list that we worked down and the decision we came to was to progress without him'

Well that settles that now.

[Templeton31]

Garlick on 3AW

Mark Williams: 'We had a large list that we worked down and the decision we came to was to progress without him'

I hope they know what they're doing.

[GVGjr]

I hope they know what they're doing.

Certainly the decision to not interview Williams is a very definite response by the committee.

[Templeton31]

the process seems to be based a lot on 'consulted the football industry'. If it is then I'm presuming the 'football industry' wasn't overly positive about Chocco...(or Bomber and presume Woosha said no I'm not coaching)

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Certainly the decision to not interview Williams is a very definite response by the committee.

I'm sure they have their reasons but on face value as a member, it's disappointing he wasn't even interviewed.

[The Doctor]

I would love to be convinced of this. But on past evidence I doubt it

[Remi Moses]

Maybe he wasn't interested?

[chef]

Maybe he's not head coach material anymore considering the number of clubs that have passed over him since he was sacked from Port.

[The Underdog]

There's clearly a perception within the industry that he's not worth taking the risk on, whether it's that he's too much of a loose cannon or whether it's something else, but he's missed out on a number of jobs he's clearly qualified for. GWS decision to stick with Sheedy for an extra year rather than go to Williams being the weirdest and possibly most telling.

[Templeton31]

Maybe he's not head coach material anymore considering the number of clubs that have passed over him since he was sacked from Port.

I'm sure plenty in the football industry thought Ken Hinkley wasn't head coach material because he had been passed over so many times...

[bornadog]

Bomber is heading for a complete ban from the AFL after not paying his fine of $30,000

[chef]

I'm sure plenty in the football industry thought Ken Hinkley wasn't head coach material because he had been passed over so many times...

Ken was(but was a bridesmaid a copule of times) considered and interviewed by a few clubs before finally getting a gig.

Choco isn't even making it to the interview stage, which I guess says everything.

[jeemak]

There's clearly a perception within the industry that he's not worth taking the risk on, whether it's that he's too much of a loose cannon or whether it's something else, but he's missed out on a number of jobs he's clearly qualified for. GWS decision to stick with Sheedy for an extra year rather than go to Williams being the weirdest and possibly most telling.

Considering how much of a loony Sheedy was when he was finishing his career........

[Templeton31]

Ken was(but was a bridesmaid a copule of times) considered and interviewed by a few clubs before finally getting a gig.

Choco isn't even making it to the interview stage, which I guess says everything.

Yeh fair point of difference.

I think though someone who has been a head coach before is in some ways disadvantaged as their deficiencies are known/exposed. In the case of Chocco having been round so long they are probably so well "known" that his strengths get forgotten or minimised. Alternatively assistant coaches who haven't been exposed to the head coach position are viewed as all upside and all the focus is on their strengths..(or potential strengths).

[Murphy'sLore]

Yeh fair point of difference.

I think though someone who has been a head coach before is in some ways disadvantaged as their deficiencies are known/exposed. In the case of Chocco having been round so long they are probably so well "known" that his strengths get forgotten or minimised. Alternatively assistant coaches who haven't been exposed to the head coach position are viewed as all upside and all the focus is on their strengths..(or potential strengths).

Not unlike the difference in value between a draft pick and a traded player...

[Bulldog Revolution]

Why did GWS decide they didn't want Williams?

[Rocket Science]

Why did GWS decide they didn't want Williams?

Suspect they deferred to Sheeds who was there to promote the code as much as coach the footy club.