Eade rants upset players

[LostDoggy]

I found this in the Geelong Advertiser this morning and thought you guys may be interested in reading it.

It was part of Cracker Keenan's column, but there was nothing on the internet about it, so I have to type it all out.

Having read most of the stuff that he writes about the dogs over the past 3-4 years, he rarely has a good word for us.

Personally, I didnt read too much into it, just a bit of sensationalism....



"Eade rants upset players" Geelong Advertiser 13/11/2007

As I tipped a few weeks ago, the Western Bulldogs could be in a bit of turmoil.

But it is getting worse. There are now rumblings coach Rodney Eade has lost the players.

I ran into one of his ex-runners at the races last week, who is also a former Bulldog's player, and he wasn't that complimentary of Eade's coaching style.

He told me that Eade's still old fashioned and gives the players an absolute cook.
Some coaches must realise the old days of ranting and raving at players are over.

Most coaches now are tacticians. Eade is as good a tactician as any in the business. But, you must hide your frustrations when things don't come off and a player lets the side down.

There's no secret that Eade had confrontations with Sydney and it's chariman, Richard Colless, and we know that he was replaced after taking it to a grand final.

I hope Eade hasn't lost the players, because I respect him as a coach and as an ex-opponent, and I believe that he has been good for the Bulldogs - although their last half of the season was a disgrace.

The players seemed to lose interest in playing football, and that's a bad sign.

[The Coon Dog]

Who has been a runner? Danny Del-Re & Mark Hunter are the two I can recall.

[GVGjr]

This is consistent with the rumours that have been floating around for a while. Smorgo sort of squashed them the other week but I think there really was some issues.

The more I think about it, the more I agree with Smorgo's approach of getting things out in the open.

[Mantis]

Who has been a runner? Danny Del-Re & Mark Hunter are the two I can recall.

Didn't Crackers say he saw the ex-runner at the races. Isn't one of our ex-runners a professional punter, who could that be???

[Templeton31]

Who has been a runner? Danny Del-Re & Mark Hunter are the two I can recall.

Dimma?

Crackers does write some absoloute b/s though.

[LostDoggy]

Most coaches now are tacticians. Eade is as good a tactician as any in the business. But, you must hide your frustrations when things don't come off and a player lets the side down.



I wont go right into this because it appears my concerns about the way we capitulated in the last half of the season and Eades role in that are not shared by the majority of this group but I thought that the section that I quoted was the most pertinent.
I dont think this is a strong point of Eades. For someone who is so calculating when he speaks to the media he really does let himself down at times with his body language when things are not going our way.

[BulldogBelle]

I dont think this is a strong point of Eades. For someone who is so calculating when he speaks to the media he really does let himself down at times with his body language when things are not going our way.

I agree, it was very evident in the second half of the season when the chips were down, seems the pressure got to him. Now, with coaching his only responsibility to worry about hopefully all will right itself.

[GVGjr]

I agree, it was very evident in the second half of the season when the chips were down, seems the pressure got to him. Now, with coaching his only responsibility to worry about hopefully all will right itself.

I suppose it is hard when a team is getting flogged like we were to keep your composure but it is probably an area he could improve on.

[BulldogBelle]

I suppose it is hard when a team is getting flogged like we were to keep your composure but it is probably an area he could improve on.

Yes, didn't we just - i can picture every game we got hammered in the second half of the season. For a moment or two during those games I thought we had spiralled back and Rhode was our coach. I am sure Eade is aware of what, how and why things went pear shaped and hopefully will rectify the concerns out on the field.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Yes, didn't we just - i can picture every game we got hammered in the second half of the season. For a moment or two during those games I thought we had spiralled back and Rhode was our coach. I am sure Eade is aware of what, how and why things went pear shaped and hopefully will rectify the concerns out on the field.

Eade would privately probably admit he didn't handle the second half of 2007 as well as he might of - and clearly there was turmoil in the footy department some of which he was responsible for. I am prepared to cut him lsome slack for ast year, but he has to bounce back and respond to his own poor 2007 in the same manner we would expect a player to bounce back from a year that failed to live up to expectations. Tactically whatever his reputation was/is we were an open book in 2007 and every team in the competition knew what we were doing and were able to stop it.

[bornadog]

I don't respect Crackers one little bit, however, Eade does go off a bit some times. We saw that happen in the Essendon match towards the end of the first quarter as well as at quarter time. Brad Johnstone backed Eade all the way today, but then again I suppose he is the captain.

[BulldogBelle]

I am prepared to cut him some slack for last year, but he has to bounce back and respond to his own poor 2007 in the same manner we would expect a player to bounce back from a year that failed to live up to expectations.

Definitely, I am behind him also, this review was 'the review we had to have' ( I love using that line) it really opened up everyone for scrutiny and a few home truths - Eade will be all the more better for it. I would imagine when he returns from his trip he will be refreshed and raring to go. New season, new beginning and all that.

[LostDoggy]

Well done guys! You played crap for the last 8/9 weeks of the year but you don't need to told that.

[LostDoggy]

Eade would privately probably admit he didn't handle the second half of 2007 as well as he might of - and clearly there was turmoil in the footy department some of which he was responsible for. I am prepared to cut him lsome slack for ast year, but he has to bounce back and respond to his own poor 2007 in the same manner we would expect a player to bounce back from a year that failed to live up to expectations. Tactically whatever his reputation was/is we were an open book in 2007 and every team in the competition knew what we were doing and were able to stop it.

As disappointing as it was to hear some of things that happened and didn't happen I'll cut Eade some slack as well. I think most of us would agree that he is a tactically sound coach and now he can devote his time to that but I also think the others coaches scouted him well after 2006 and he didn't have an alternate plan.
He will need this group to show some fighting spirit and that might be almost as important as the win loss column.

[FrediKanoute]

Its pretty p*ss weak by the players though to suggest that they aren't up to taking a spray. If the coach(s) have given clear instructions and they don't follow them then what do you expect. One thing though that I will say, holding up Geelong as the paradigm of a successful AFL team, maybe what was really lacking was leadership within the group to pull players back into line and let them know that they aren't doing the team thing or aren't following the team plan.

[LostDoggy]

Two of the five players that he was reputed to have been really hard on, have since left. I just hope that this year all the team bonds together and gets behind him, and there won't be anymore singling out certain players for the bulk of the blame for poor performance.

[FrediKanoute]

Two of the five players that he was reputed to have been really hard on, have since left. I just hope that this year all the team bonds together and gets behind him, and there won't be anymore singling out certain players for the bulk of the blame for poor performance.

Now I guess we're talking about Power and McMahon??? Power - fact is that he never worked hard enough and rested heavily on the fact that he was an early draft pick. He was weak at the contest and despite being around for 4 or 5 seasons failed to cement a spot in the side.....he was given numerous opportunities to do so.

McMahon - he had talent and really developed under eade, before going backwards due to personal problems. he for mine is a loss, but then again I think that his leaving allows us to replace him with a guy who may be less skilled, but more physical and defensive, something we need.

[Dry Rot]

A simple observation: I agree with Harry Truman that "the buck stops with me".

However, I also agree with a quote from Joyce in "Year of the Dogs" when damning the players he said he wished he could get out there and help.

I dunno what happened in those last 7 games, but to just blame Eade excuses some pretty ordinary efforts by our players.

[firstdogonthemoon]

A simple observation: I agree with Harry Truman that "the buck stops with me".

However, I also agree with a quote from Joyce in "Year of the Dogs" when damning the players he said he wished he could get out there and help.

I dunno what happened in those last 7 games, but to just blame Eade excuses some pretty ordinary efforts by our players.

Well if the buck stops with you, you need to take a long hard look at yourself and then get down to Whitten Oval and sort out this mess you've made!

[Bulldog Revolution]

Its pretty p*ss weak by the players though to suggest that they aren't up to taking a spray. If the coach(s) have given clear instructions and they don't follow them then what do you expect. One thing though that I will say, holding up Geelong as the paradigm of a successful AFL team, maybe what was really lacking was leadership within the group to pull players back into line and let them know that they aren't doing the team thing or aren't following the team plan.

I dont think we are saying Eade shouldn't bake them from time to time Fredi

More that he didn't handle the second half of the season all that well when it went off the rails. Its up to him to provide some of the leadership required, not all of it, but a pretty critical component.

Hopefully out of this off season of scrutiny and reviews will emerge the next generation of on field leaders

[Dry Rot]

Well if the buck stops with you, you need to take a long hard look at yourself and then get down to Whitten Oval and sort out this mess you've made!

After my secret October negotiations broke down about re-drafting the great Trent Bartlett, I washed my hands of all this.

I tried.

[Go_Dogs]

Personally, this is an issue that I think gets blown out of proportion these days. I think there is definitely still a need for honest truths and a bit of aggression when it is called for by members of the coaching team. If they're unhappy, they should make it known.

However, increasingly these days the 'softly softly' approach seems to be the one most players/observers like to see. Obviously, it's a matter of getting the mix right, and being able to encourage and improve the squad, whilst also being able to put the foot down on certain issues.

I think a lot of observers, especially since the Pagan saga this year, are quick to jump on the 'old school' style of coaching and blame that. Personally, I don't imagine Eade to be that kind of coach. I think he would certainly give a good blast, but would also be someone who can remain calm and approach the group in the 'softly softly' manner.

I think a lot of the speculation is probably unfounded. However the next year will reveal a lot as to how we can settle back down and get on with the job at hand. Winning football games.

[wimberga]

I think a lot of observers, especially since the Pagan saga this year, are quick to jump on the 'old school' style of coaching and blame that. Personally, I don't imagine Eade to be that kind of coach. I think he would certainly give a good blast, but would also be someone who can remain calm and approach the group in the 'softly softly' manner.

Agree with you here Griffen.

I remember alot of people saying that Eade will make it known if he is unhappy, as we saw when he targetted Gilbee and Harris for a verbal spray in one of the games last season. But Eade is also the first person to congratulate players on things they do well.

I honestly believe that Eade has the support of the players and is good at managing the player. I think any problems relating to the way he coaches would have come from other staff, not the players.

[The Underdog]

Am I wrong or was Eade often quoted last year about not berating players for mistakes?That his philosophy was that he was happy for them to take risks and he wouldn't yell at players for trying to create. Of course this doesn't mean that he wasn't giving it to players for not following the team plan or for their lack of effort. But it seems to have gone 180 pretty quickly from everyone lauding him and his relationship with the players to an out and out bagging of his ability to relate to them.
I think we'll find that everyone has learnt lessons from the way last season finished and that we'll be a better club for it.

[LostDoggy]

The bloke who was on the end of his biggest sprays, won the B&F

We should identify those who can't handle getting a spray and delist them

[The Underdog]

The bloke who was on the end of his biggest sprays, won the B&F

We should identify those who can't handle getting a spray and delist them

A little simplistic I'd say.
Different personalities need to be handled differently. I'd imagine he knows that Harris can handle a spray and thus isn't afraid to let go. He needs to be able to better control who he does spray and understand who it will work on and who will react badly. Just because someone doesn't enjoy being berated in front of their mates doesn't mean they can't do the job on the field. He needs to know the personalities of his players in this regard.

[LostDoggy]

This is a man's game.

These blokes are paid $200,000 + per game and if they disobey team rules or instructions they deserve to be held to account in no uncertain manner.

If they can't handle it, they are mentally weak and unfit for this career.

Simple? Too bloody right it is.

[The Underdog]

This is a man's game.

These blokes are paid $200,000 + per game and if they disobey team rules or instructions they deserve to be held to account in no uncertain manner.

If they can't handle it, they are mentally weak and unfit for this career.

Simple? Too bloody right it is.

Yeah, except a lot of them aren't really men.
Is a coach screaming at a 19 year old for not following a team rule going to make a man or a footballer out of him?
I'd argue that some people just don't respond to that. Are they mentally weak, maybe, but then this isn't the army. Some people aren't motivated by the fear of being belittled, some in fact shrink from that. I'd suggest that spraying everyone when they mess up isn't the way to build a team. I agree that players need to be held to account i just think sometimes there are more constructive ways of doing it.
I'd suggest that not every successful footballer has been a) mentally strong or b)capable of taking a spray from the coach well

[bornadog]

However, increasingly these days the 'softly softly' approach seems to be the one most players/observers like to see. .

yes just like the calm Mr malthouse who never gets angry:D

[LostDoggy]

I'd suggest that not every successful footballer has been a) mentally strong or b)capable of taking a spray from the coach well

I would argue that 16 AFL coaches would vehemently disagree with that.

[LostDoggy]

yes just like the calm Mr malthouse who never gets angry:D
Aside from Paul Roos and maybe Neil Craig, I can recall seeing every coach being caught on film screaming at one or more of their players at one time or another. I don't think Eade carried on like this any more excessively than other coaches. Two incidents were highlighted in '07- Harris and Gilbee. In fact I'm surprised he didn't blow a gasket more often given what was happening out on the field, particularly after the mid season break.

[The Underdog]

I would argue that 16 AFL coaches would vehemently disagree with that.

I just don't think it's that black and white

[mjp]

Some players/people simply switch off when they are yelled at and the message is lost. Yet others are inspired by a spray, and return to the field trying to 'prove a point'. Others dwell on the criticism and don't recover as well/bounce back, for fear of making another mistake.

None of these reactions are wrong or a sign of mental weakness. They are just people being people - and all of us need to improve ourselves in some way (yes, even players and even me!). Just like coaches are people being people when they lose their cool and scream at a player/group from time to time.

I suspect that 99.9% of coaches would rather not yell and rant and rave. They want their comments/criticism to be direct and to the point, whilst offering the player/group a potential solution to the problem that they faced and struggled to overcome. It is about providing feedback in a manner that is helpful and provides a way forward.

I think treating your players with respect when times are tough, and offering them a solution rather than adding to their problems is probably the best way to go - after all, just yelling at blokes to 'go harder' probably isn't going to help too much in most situations. I also think Eade does this on the majority of occasions, but the pressure and difficulty of not playing to expectation EARLY in 2007 (yes, when we were winning games) would have been difficult to deal with - and when things started going really poorly, well...where do you go then?

Anyway - I think expectations (inside and outside) the club are very different approaching 2008, and Eade will be a different coach as a result. Plus, Bond isn't there with the pressure of trying to get a senior coaching role on his back next to him, and perhaps this will help too. And come 2009, as we enter the season as defending premiers, well, perhaps then we will see if Eade has learnt from what happened during 2007 in terms of managing and responding to expectations.

And yes, Malthouse, Pagan, Worsfold etc scream as well...but is that really the point? And do I care about them? No, not really.

[LostDoggy]

This is a man's game.

These blokes are paid $200,000 + per game and if they disobey team rules or instructions they deserve to be held to account in no uncertain manner.

If they can't handle it, they are mentally weak and unfit for this career.

Simple? Too bloody right it is.

Totally disagree. When managing a large group of people within the basic guidelines of what is right and wrong a good people managers know what to say to get the best out of the group. Some people only respond to a firm hand but you need to have some different approaches to get the best out of a diverse group.

Its definitely not a sign of being mentally weak.

[Mantis]

Some players/people simply switch off when they are yelled at and the message is lost. Yet others are inspired by a spray, and return to the field trying to 'prove a point'. Others dwell on the criticism and don't recover as well/bounce back, for fear of making another mistake.

None of these reactions are wrong or a sign of mental weakness. They are just people being people - and all of us need to improve ourselves in some way (yes, even players and even me!). Just like coaches are people being people when they lose their cool and scream at a player/group from time to time.

I suspect that 99.9% of coaches would rather not yell and rant and rave. They want their comments/criticism to be direct and to the point, whilst offering the player/group a potential solution to the problem that they faced and struggled to overcome. It is about providing feedback in a manner that is helpful and provides a way forward.

I think treating your players with respect when times are tough, and offering them a solution rather than adding to their problems is probably the best way to go - after all, just yelling at blokes to 'go harder' probably isn't going to help too much in most situations. I also think Eade does this on the majority of occasions, but the pressure and difficulty of not playing to expectation EARLY in 2007 (yes, when we were winning games) would have been difficult to deal with - and when things started going really poorly, well...where do you go then?


You would think last year would have been one of the more frustrating in Eade's career. The message it seemed just didn't get through. From the lack of personnel available to the poor form shown by many of the players things just didn't go right.

It showed late in the season when Eade was just about out of answers. Everything he tried backfired and the lack of fight and spirit shown by the playing group would have been very dis-concierting. If he had hair he would have been pulling it out and most would agree that he was entitled to.



Anyway - I think expectations (inside and outside) the club are very different approaching 2008, and Eade will be a different coach as a result. Plus, Bond isn't there with the pressure of trying to get a senior coaching role on his back next to him, and perhaps this will help too. And come 2009, as we enter the season as defending premiers, well, perhaps then we will see if Eade has learnt from what happened during 2007 in terms of managing and responding to expectations.



Agree that if we can move forward this coming year and beyond, 2007 will go down to one big learning experience. A year when hopefully Eade learnt what strings he can pull with the playing group in terms of motivation and criticism and year when the playing group learnt what is expected and demanded of them from both the coaching staff and the suit wearer's of the club.

[beaser]

Surely the players should be man enough to take it on the chin if there not performing im sure Eade had plenty of supporters going off tap too with the second half.
Hes the appointed coach of the club and like the boss at work hes not there to win a popularity contest.

[LostDoggy]

I play footy for a club with a fairly bad name...not proud of it, but it's the closest place to home. Anyway, my coach has had a few screaming sessions with us, attacking each individual player around the circle, so if a bunch of girls can suck it up and play on, then I think a bunch of grown men can too.

[The Underdog]

I play footy for a club with a fairly bad name...not proud of it, but it's the closest place to home. Anyway, my coach has had a few screaming sessions with us, attacking each individual player around the circle, so if a bunch of girls can suck it up and play on, then I think a bunch of grown men can too.

But did it make you play better, go out on the field more motivated? Or do you just hate your coach?

[mjp]

Surely the players should be man enough to take it on the chin if there not performing im sure Eade had plenty of supporters going off tap too with the second half.
Hes the appointed coach of the club and like the boss at work hes not there to win a popularity contest.


Correct. He is there to win games of football...

If screaming at players (if the rumours are true and Eade is screaming at players!) is not helping achieve this goal, then whether some people on here believe it is a sign that the players are metally weak, or whether the fact that a bunch of girls can suck it up and play after a spray and so should hardened AFL players, well the reality is those comments simply are not important or relevent. If it is having a negative impact on performance then the screaming has to stop.

You have summarised it beautifully. It is not about being popular - equally it is not about engaging in self-indulgence by ranting and raving...it is about winning footy games, and whatever helps do that is what should be done.

[LostDoggy]

Any coach watching Harris give Petrie 30 metres space for an entire quarter or witnessing Mc Mahon spearing passes to the opposition on their forward line or watching Mc Mahon behave like a rabbit caught in the headlights when the ball was kicked into the air to Lappin is entitled to spew forth his venom at the offender.

And if the offender does not respond in a positive manner to this and withdraws into himself he has no place on a football field and is very definitely weak - mentally or otherwise.

I'm not talking about screaming and yelling for the sake of it but when this sort of incompetence occurs, which renders the team's effort useless, then it is entirely appropriate and understandable. Especially when these blokes are paid more than the Prime Minister of the country for their skills.

[The Underdog]

Surely the players should be man enough to take it on the chin if there not performing im sure Eade had plenty of supporters going off tap too with the second half.
Hes the appointed coach of the club and like the boss at work hes not there to win a popularity contest.

And when your boss screams at you does that make you go, well I really need to pick up my game or does it make you go, gee that guys a prick?

My point all the way through is that ranting and raving just isn't the most effective way to motivate most people. Sure it's got a place and it might make us feel better to see Eade going off when we play badly. But it didn't appear to help the players out much. Screaming at players seems to be the bastion of a coach who doesn't have anything left, nothing else to pull out of the hat. The coach should be the last person to be overly emotional out there. He needs to be the one who stays calm and sees things clearly.

[LostDoggy]

We are all made up differently. Ranting and raving does not do it for me. A coach who has many ways of getting the best out each individual.........who gives them confidence and ability to take the risks they should....will always achieve better outcomes than those who try the one size fits all approach. Distant and remote coaches have power but not commitment. Footballers are no different to anyone else in society where taking risks, showing leadership, showing courage is more likely to happen if we feel good about ourselves and what we are doing. I cannot see how self belief can be instilled if we are slagging off players. And at the end of the day, it's whatever it takes to reach that button that makes us run on top of the ground.

[southerncross]

We are all made up differently. Ranting and raving does not do it for me. A coach who has many ways of getting the best out each individual.........who gives them confidence and ability to take the risks they should....will always achieve better outcomes than those who try the one size fits all approach. Distant and remote coaches have power but not commitment. Footballers are no different to anyone else in society where taking risks, showing leadership, showing courage is more likely to happen if we feel good about ourselves and what we are doing. I cannot see how self belief can be instilled if we are slagging off players. And at the end of the day, it's whatever it takes to reach that button that makes us run on top of the ground.

Same here. Yelling at the group is one thing but singling out some wont get the best results all the time. Guys like Harris might respond to it well but Everitt probably wouldn't. Eade would be acutely aware of this though.

[Mofra]

The AFL players obviously have fairly strong contacts with each other, despite not playing for the same club (senior players especially).

If Eade has "lost the players", why would Hudson & Welsh look at the Bulldogs as their preferrered destination (as did Aker last year)? They'd know the score far more than any of us would.

[GVGjr]

The AFL players obviously have fairly strong contacts with each other, despite not playing for the same club (senior players especially).

If Eade has "lost the players", why would Hudson & Welsh look at the Bulldogs as their preferrered destination (as did Aker last year)? They'd know the score far more than any of us would.


I guess that Aker had to leave the Lions and saw us as a chance to keep him in the finals.
Hudson hadn't behaved well in SA and realised that our ruckman hadn't performed and knew he could get the number one position. He liked the area as well after his stint with Werribee.
Welsh knows we need a key forward and its his best chance of getting a regular senior gig.

Now that might sound a bit cynical but the Bulldogs are a good fit for all of these guys regardless of Eade.

[The Underdog]

I guess that Aker had to leave the Lions and saw us as a chance to keep him in the finals.
Hudson hadn't behaved well in SA and realised that our ruckman hadn't performed and knew he could get the number one position. He liked the area as well after his stint with Werribee.
Welsh knows we need a key forward and its his best chance of getting a regular senior gig.

Now that might sound a bit cynical but the Bulldogs are a good fit for all of these guys regardless of Eade.

And when it comes down to it, there's only 15 other clubs to choose from once you've decided to leave a club and realistically (unless you're C.Judd) only 3-4 are going to be intersted in a certain player.
All of these guys fit needs we have, for a ruck, a forward and a HFF with a big mouth and a big off-field profile;)

[LostDoggy]

But did it make you play better, go out on the field more motivated? Or do you just hate your coach?

Umm, probably the best example would be our '06 prelim, we were 2 goals something to their 5 goals at three quarter time (very low scoring, we don't usually do that bad..in case you were wondering), and so we obviously needed to outscore our last 3 quarters. She tears us to shreds, 'you've got hips so f***ing use them' was used a few times, and so on. I didn't go on in the last quarter, she made no changes during the quarter, but we ended up kicking three goals and a few points to their 0.0, and at the end of the match we were all so happy that no-one cared what she'd said.

[beaser]

And when your boss screams at you does that make you go, well I really need to pick up my game or does it make you go, gee that guys a prick?

My point all the way through is that ranting and raving just isn't the most effective way to motivate most people. Sure it's got a place and it might make us feel better to see Eade going off when we play badly. But it didn't appear to help the players out much. Screaming at players seems to be the bastion of a coach who doesn't have anything left, nothing else to pull out of the hat. The coach should be the last person to be overly emotional out there. He needs to be the one who stays calm and sees things clearly.
Stay calm and see things clearly i agree.But its the coach who runs game day and the team needs to get behind him.

[LostDoggy]

Giving a team a spray like the example given by Dales_girl38 is one thing, continually singling out certain players for a spray and ignoring other players who are just as deserving is another thing. Young Cam Waite went down hill towards the end of last year, a strong contrast to the way he finished off the 2006 season. He is a young developing player, that needs his confidence built up - not crushed.

[Dogs 24/7]

Giving a team a spray like the example given by Dales_girl38 is one thing, continually singling out certain players for a spray and ignoring other players who are just as deserving is another thing. Young Cam Waite went down hill towards the end of last year, a strong contrast to the way he finished off the 2006 season. He is a young developing player, that needs his confidence built up - not crushed.


Excellent point. I thought Wight was primed for a solid 2007 but in real terms he slipped back a bit and I think it was a lot to do with a lack of confidence.