List Management 2015

[bulldogtragic]

And none of these have a spot on the list next year, at this stage, either.

I edited my post above. If we get a free agent incoming, we get nothing for Grant. Nothing whatsoever. That's equivalent to a straight delisting. 19 games, his best season and great skills which help the new style doesn't show me that we need to exit him out of the club for nothing.

[bulldogtragic]

What will that compensation be though? I'd be suprised if we got any compensation if Grant was to leave to be honest. He's not likely to get anymore than 2 years. Although Jones got 3 years at 400k so I guess it's possible..

It's equivalent to delisting him. He's at another club and we have nothing. Would you delist him?

[bornadog]

I edited my post above. If we get a free agent incoming, we get nothing for Grant. Nothing whatsoever. That's equivalent to a straight delisting. 19 games, his best season and great skills which help the new style doesn't show me that we need to exit him out of the club for nothing.

Did you notice on Saturday night in the piece of play when Hunter stuffed up the handball over to Crameri, who was lurking on his own having run down from one end to the other. Handball to Crameri, over the top to Grant and bang we win the game.

He has been great this year, and I just hope this is just posturing to get a better deal.

[LostDoggy]

There's got to be a twist here. There is no way he gets so many games this year if they have no plans for him and no trade value.

[bulldogtragic]

If true, it's absolute rubbish by the club.:mad:

Beyond rubbish. In a season where Bevo has dropped players, no matter who they are, he played 19 games including a final. He wasn't gifted games, no one was. He's in his prime and played his best year. Illogical to the point that I can't believe it's true. It's an equivalent delisting on the above facts. Illogical.

[bulldogtragic]

Did you notice on Saturday night in the piece of play when Hunter stuffed up the handball over to Crameri, who was lurking on his own having run down from one end to the other. Handball to Crameri, over the top to Grant and bang we win the game.

He has been great this year, and I just hope this is just posturing to get a better deal.


Almost every game this year he's found himself on his own in the 50 or goal square from gut running, and we missed him a lot of the time. His gut running was surprising this year, his running surprised even me. I don't want to think about that piece of play though....

Just put out a two year offer and play it out that way. He's maligned by enough that he doesn't need rumour and innuendo like this.

[LostDoggy]

It's equivalent to delisting him. He's at another club and we have nothing. Would you delist him?

I wouldn't. I'm not confident he is best 22 if everyone is up and going round 1 next year (which never happens) So clubs need depth. Given his year and improvement I can't see why we wouldn't offer him a couple more years.

[Rocket Science]

I'd suggest Grant's spot has Toby McLean's name on it, but even if so why wouldn't we do more to maximise some return rather than simply letting him walk.

He'd surely have more currency than he did when we last signed him.

[bornadog]

Beyond rubbish. In a season where Bevo has dropped players, no matter who they are, he played 19 games including a final. He wasn't gifted games, no one was. He's in his prime and played his best year. Illogical to the point that I can't believe it's true. It's an equivalent delisting on the above facts. Illogical.

Its just a story and I would think his manager playing games

[bulldogtragic]

Its just a story and I would think his manager playing games

I hope so.

[bornadog]

I hope so.

I just tweeted to JMacc to sign him up.

[G-Mo77]

Its just a story and I would think his manager playing games

This. There was good whispers that he was close to signing a 2 year deal. This sounds like getting leverage on squeezing a 3rd year.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

This. There was good whispers that he was close to signing a 2 year deal. This sounds like getting leverage on squeezing a 3rd year.

Which I hope we don't do.

[boydogs]

http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-trades-2015-harley-bennell-jarrad-grant-and-jed-lamb-consider-their-options-20150914-gjmfs1.html


If true, it's absolute rubbish by the club.:mad:

All it says is we haven't offered him anything yet

[Ghost Dog]

This Link (http://www.aflplayerratings.com.au/Ratings/Player/111515/Jarrad-GRANT) gives an overall summary of his season.

While playing a reasonable role, he hasn't exactly finished the season strongly.
Seems to have done more right than wrong this season. Has played a lot of footy but started as sub more than once.


He's maligned by enough that he doesn't need rumour and innuendo like this.

Do you feel unfairly BT? A lot of his great work is undone by his conversion. I found some stats that say he kicked 11 goals 14 behinds this season. Not sure if these are accurate. (http://finalsiren.com/PlayerStats.asp?PlayerID=1920&SeasonID=2015&Sort=AverageMarks%20Desc#career)

[jazzadogs]

Grant is a very interesting player, and prospect. I would be extremely surprised if we have not offered him a contract of any length, or at least held significant discussions.

I would say the more likely case is, as has been suggested above, we offered less years or money than what he and his manager wanted.

To be honest if we were to lose Grant and gain Kreuzer through FA I'd be strongly in favour.

[chef]

When everyones fit and firing Grant is injury depth, so opening up another spot on the list may be the reason from him not getting a contract. Really isn't that great of a loss if it's true.

[MrMahatma]

Surely if he improves his set shots, he's more than depth... He's a weapon...?

[GVGjr]

For an inexperienced team not offering someone with 80 games playing experience a contract is a significant decision. He had a good season but obviously doubts remain especially around his ability to really hurt opposition teams. Perhaps we have also earmarked someone else within the group to play the role that Grant did this year.

I don't think this is a manager hawking him to entice an offer from the Dogs I think it's a genuine realisation that there is a strong chance Grant won't be with us next season and he needs to find him another club.

We've been so pro-active in signing our players so letting the Grant go unsigned and not even presenting him a contract to consider is a sign that he isn't high on our 'to do' list.

Unless there is a quick change of heart this doesn't look good for Grant being at the club next season.

[F'scary]

My kids love Mikey. They will be devastated if their lovable Microphone Head isn't running around in our colours next year. He and the Sontaran are their favourite players.

[Mantis]

We've been so pro-active in signing our players so letting the Grant go unsigned and not even presenting him a contract to consider is a sign that he isn't high on our 'to do' list.



For that reason I think Talia is unlikely to remain as well.

Both are depth players, Talia more-so, so lets see what are options before jumping in.. If nothing prsents then we re-sign on short term contracts with stipulations that only significant amounts of improvement (or injuries) will see regular AFL action.

[whythelongface]

Did you notice on Saturday night in the piece of play when Hunter stuffed up the handball over to Crameri, who was lurking on his own having run down from one end to the other. Handball to Crameri, over the top to Grant and bang we win the game.

He has been great this year, and I just hope this is just posturing to get a better deal.

Smoke and mirrors I say. Think the club will eventually offer a new contract.

[dukedog]

If Grant is exploring his options for a better deal than whats offered, id let him go. He hasnt shown the improvement required in a reasonable amount of time. Id rather free up a spot for a kid than keep. In saying that. Hes had a reasonable season. Just hasnt produced enough.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Bit strange that someone who played 19 games for us this year is let go

[Ozza]

I believe that the players break for holidays by the end of Wednesday - so you would think that Jarrad will find out where the club stand on things in his end of season interview which you'd imagine is today or tomorrow.

[G-Mo77]

Bit strange that someone who played 19 games for us this year is let go

Not really. You can't retain everyone so it's no surprise some fall through. There was good word that a 2 year deal was there so not sure who to believe here. If he walks we get compensation so maybe we feel we'll get more that way than at the trade table.

[bulldogtragic]

Not really. You can't retain everyone so it's no surprise some fall through. There was good word that a 2 year deal was there so not sure who to believe here. If he walks we get compensation so maybe we feel we'll get more that way than at the trade table.

If we get a free agent into the club, that FA value counts against compo. If the AFL says the incoming player is greater or equal to Grant then we get no compo whatsoever. Equivalent to a straight delisting of a bloke in his career peak who played nearly all season. There's a heap of players that are ahead of being delisting before effectively delisting Grant. Something doesn't make sense in this media musings.

[bornadog]

If we get a free agent into the club, that FA value counts against compo. If the AFL says the incoming player is greater or equal to Grant then we get no compo whatsoever. Equivalent to a straight delisting of a bloke in his career peak who played nearly all season. There's a heap of players that are ahead of being delisting before effectively delisting Grant. Something doesn't make sense in this media musings.

FULLER, DARLEY, AYCE for starters.

BT, the non- believers already putting the daggers in.;)

[bulldogtragic]

FULLER, DARLEY, AYCE for starters.

BT, the non- believers already putting the daggers in.;)

Yep. I find it difficult that defending a player of ours is such. If Grant does sign on, then what would that mean? JMac is incompetent for keeping a list clogger and JMac should be sacked?

[bornadog]

Yep. I find it difficult that defending a player of ours is such. If Grant does sign on, then what would that mean? JMac is incompetent for keeping a list clogger and JMac should be sacked?

Let's see what happens, I don't believe media reports, or player managers.

[ledge]

I think deciding to give our older players another year has put pressure on a few, at the start of the year we would have thought it was Boyd and Morris last year.
Now we have kept then on and rules say we must move on a certain amount a year means a couple who might have been kept on are now going to go.
Luke has said our list is pretty good so i would say we will only move the minimum, unless the odd other player wants to move on.

[G-Mo77]

If we get a free agent into the club, that FA value counts against compo. If the AFL says the incoming player is greater or equal to Grant then we get no compo whatsoever. Equivalent to a straight delisting of a bloke in his career peak who played nearly all season. There's a heap of players that are ahead of being delisting before effectively delisting Grant. Something doesn't make sense in this media musings.

Are we getting a FA? If so then it's financial reasons. Somethings gotta give if that's the case.

[Greystache]

Yep. I find it difficult that defending a player of ours is such. If Grant does sign on, then what would that mean? JMac is incompetent for keeping a list clogger and JMac should be sacked?

And if he gets delisted is Jmac incompetent and Bevo have no clue for delisting a bonafide star?

He's a battler whose done well to eke out as many years as he has, if we think we have more quality to replace him why should that cause such angst.

[westdog54]

If we get a free agent into the club, that FA value counts against compo. If the AFL says the incoming player is greater or equal to Grant then we get no compo whatsoever. Equivalent to a straight delisting of a bloke in his career peak who played nearly all season. There's a heap of players that are ahead of being delisting before effectively delisting Grant. Something doesn't make sense in this media musings.

The only way this makes sense is if we aren't chasing a free agent.

[Greystache]

Given he hasn't been offered a contract you'd have to think Talia is likely to be moved on too. I wouldn't be surprised to see him shopped around during trade week and if we can't find a home for him maybe offer him a one year deal. I can't see him making it, but key defenders are something you need to have some injury cover for, even if it's questionable depth.

[chef]

And if he gets delisted is Jmac incompetent and Bevo have no clue for delisting a bonafide star?

He's a battler whose done well to eke out as many years as he has, if we think we have more quality to replace him why should that cause such angst.

Grants no different to guys like DFA and Dre, the talent just isnt there

[westdog54]

Grants no different to guys like DFA and Dre, the talent just isnt there

The talent is DEFINITELY there. The application is what goes missing.

[bulldogtragic]

And if he gets delisted is Jmac incompetent and Bevo have no clue for delisting a bonafide star?

He's a battler whose done well to eke out as many years as he has, if we think we have more quality to replace him why should that cause such angst.

Ekers don't generally play 19 games in a top 6 team. If he's delisted just as he is returning on some talent and effort then I will wonder how Bevo can rate him all year and in a cut throat final and then see no role whatsoever on the list for him. I'm not sure why supporting a currently listed player, like I've done all year, is causing so much angst.

[bulldogtragic]

Grants no different to guys like DFA and Dre, the talent just isnt there

Grant has no talent? F@*k me dead, I've heard it all now.

[bulldogtragic]

The talent is DEFINITELY there. The application is what goes missing.

In previous years I'd agree, but not on this year.

[Greystache]

Ekers don't generally play 19 games in a top 6 team. If he's delisted just as he is returning on some talent and effort then I will wonder how Bevo can rate him all year and in a cut throat final and then see no role whatsoever on the list for him. I'm not sure why supporting a currently listed player, like I've done all year, is causing so much angst.

I don't think you're causing angst by supporting him BT, you're just getting overly wound up when other supporters doubt him. Plenty of supporters question if he holds value to the list, the club and the football department obviously do too, the fact that he's a strong chance to be moved on shows that he's at best fringe.

Injuries and close to the least experienced list had a lot to do with the number of games he got. Another year of development and experience and a clean injury list it's highly likely he plays out 2016 in the VFL. It seems the coaches think this way too.

Brett Peake played 23 games in a team that finished top of the ladder in 2010 :D

[merantau]

The one thing Grant did not do this year was kick enough majors from the opportunities he had. He is a really gifted player and the time invested in him is starting to reap dividends. He is far more adept at the defensive side of the game now and his running to create and harass has been a revelation. I would hate to see him go to another club.

[chef]

Grant has no talent? F@*k me dead, I've heard it all now.

No more than those other 2, no.

He's the greatest 'what if' player in our history it seems.

[bulldogtragic]

I don't think you're causing angst by supporting him BT, you're just getting overly wound up when other supporters doubt him. Plenty of supporters question if he holds value to the list, the club and the football department obviously do too, the fact that he's a strong chance to be moved on shows that he's at best fringe.

Injuries and close to the least experienced list had a lot to do with the number of games he got. Another year of development and experience and a clean injury list it's highly likely he plays out 2016 in the VFL. It seems the coaches think this way too.

Brett Peake played 23 games in a team that finished top of the ladder in 2010 :D

I don't mind well thought out posts, Mantis post just now while I disagreed was well thought out. With respect to the long time usually quality poster the one line post above saying Grant has no talent. That's just BF rubbish which does annoy me. A bit.

[Ozza]

I'm more concerned about the notion of signing/not signing Talia, than Grant. Its a far more serious issue to consider.

As 'stache alluded to also, Key defence position cover is a far greater need on our list, than forward/winger/utility cover - as we have heaps of those.

I'm not particularly convinced with Talia, and he's certainly behind Hamling, Roberts and Roughead - but given the tendency of all three to get injured and/or have to play other roles - right now Talia gives us a handy back up option, who still might become a good player.

[Ghost Dog]

My kids love Mikey. They will be devastated if their lovable Microphone Head isn't running around in our colours next year. He and the Sontaran are their favourite players.

Sontaran? What's that? Please explain!

[josie]

I would like to keep him, unless we get a great offer. I thought his form was looking AOK towards end of season until his nose was broken. Then he was a bit quiet, even though he did some nice things too.

I just wish he could be a more reliable kick at goal. There are a few in our team who can spray shots too, however Grant is the one I have the least faith in whenever he has a set shot. Must break your team mates hearts to see waster opportunities in front of goal. Hopefully a big focus in the off season - as well as bulking up some of the skinny youngsters.

Like the idea of offering Talia a 1 year deal if no team offers something reasonable. Fair to player, fair to club approach which makes us an ethical club.

[Ghost Dog]

Given he hasn't been offered a contract you'd have to think Talia is likely to be moved on too. I wouldn't be surprised to see him shopped around during trade week and if we can't find a home for him maybe offer him a one year deal. I can't see him making it, but key defenders are something you need to have some injury cover for, even if it's questionable depth.

Exactly - Hawthorn, Adelaide, Essendon, Richmond. They've had some very ungainly types and plain spuds playing down back at various stages.

[Ghost Dog]

I don't mind well thought out posts, Mantis post just now while I disagreed was well thought out. With respect to the long time usually quality poster the one line post above saying Grant has no talent. That's just BF rubbish which does annoy me. A bit.

He's an amazing talent. That's why it's so damn frustrating. If only he would hold a ball so it made decent contact with his boot. Kicking it end up means you have less surface area to contact the ball with. It's a no brainer and I have no idea why he persists.

[Greystache]

I don't mind well thought out posts, Mantis post just now while I disagreed was well thought out. With respect to the long time usually quality poster the one line post above saying Grant has no talent. That's just BF rubbish which does annoy me. A bit.

Fair enough, and we're all guilty of not putting enough time into detailing reasons for certain views at times, which can mean they come off as blunt. I admire people standing by their views, and putting forward a well thought out reason for that, even if I don't agree with them. I've done the same with Dickson, EasternWest did with Addison, and you have with Grant.

[chef]

I don't mind well thought out posts, Mantis post just now while I disagreed was well thought out. With respect to the long time usually quality poster the one line post above saying Grant has no talent. That's just BF rubbish which does annoy me. A bit.

All players that get onto an AFL list have ' talent'.

He's just taken it as far as he can with us is what i mean i guess. No different to Dre and DFA and guys like this.

He's like our version of Jack Watts i guess.

I dont mean to be blunt, i just dont see what you see

[F'scary]

Sontaran? What's that? Please explain!

Caleb Daniel. With his helmet on and his squat physique, he looks like a Sontaran from Doctor Who

https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thelogbook.com%2Ftoy%2Fimages%2Fwho-season4%2Ffull%2Fsontaran.jpg&f=1

[hujsh]

Much as I've supported Grant, at his age he should be cemented as a best 18 player in the prime of his career. However with the improvement of Daniel, McClean, Dale, Webb, possibly Hrovat and the return of Libba and Stevens it's quite likely Grant will drop out of that best 22 unless he improves again next year.

So it's a question of known depth vs unknown draftee. How valuable is he as depth?

[bulldogtragic]

Much as I've supported Grant, at his age he should be cemented as a best 18 player in the prime of his career. However with the improvement of Daniel, McClean, Dale, Webb, possibly Hrovat and the return of Libba and Stevens it's quite likely Grant will drop out of that best 22 unless he improves again next year.

So it's a question of known depth vs unknown draftee. How valuable is he as depth?

Even Hawthorn have a Sphanger and Simpkin. The whole one soldier in, one soldier out of knowing they can play a role. He plays his role well. If others jump ahead of him, great for us. But if they don't then we've got rid of a guy who played 19 games and was selected starting 18 for a cut throat final. We've got three older players who will get general soreness resting again. Concerns for blokes coming off knees and of course other injuries etc. Realistically, if we want to get anything for him then we sign him to two years and trade him next year.

[ledge]

It's a very strong list we have.
Makes you wonder do players look at lists when changing clubs and think I won't get a game ?
They say good players want to go to strong clubs, but their is also a line where they look at the possibility of game time.
Also playing at a struggling club gives you games and probably more chance of playing longer.
I tend to think Jones and Tutt saw us improving too much for them to get a game and thus chased games at a club with more chance and longevity.
I would bet Carlton would make him an offer he is definitely better than those two.

[stefoid]

Hes an RFA right, so he can go out and get an offer and the club has to match it, or we dont match it and get compo.

So thats whats happening. He'll come back to the club with X years at $Y and the club will make a decision based on whether we want to pay him that much, or take the compo instead.

Same with Talia, Minson and Cordy. They arent on the 'must sign' list, so they are free to explore their options.

List Management.

[Sedat]

Brett Peake played 23 games in a team that finished top of the ladder in 2010 :D
That's only because he led the entire competition in shin-kicks to advantage ;)

For mine, Grant has done enough to get another contract but 2 years should be the maximum term. His application and team-oriented play has gone off the charts this season compared to last (admittedly off a very low base). He has finally found his position, and this continuity has benefitted him and in turn he has benefitted the team.

[Hot_Doggies]

Even Hawthorn have a Sphanger and Simpkin. The whole one soldier in, one soldier out of knowing they can play a role. He plays his role well. If others jump ahead of him, great for us. But if they don't then we've got rid of a guy who played 19 games and was selected starting 18 for a cut throat final. We've got three older players who will get general soreness resting again. Concerns for blokes coming off knees and of course other injuries etc. Realistically, if we want to get anything for him then we sign him to two years and trade him next year.

Happy to pay a depth player ~300k??

Prefer to trade Grant and use the pick on a kid.

[Grantysghost]

Interesting article regarding Dalrymple. Picks like JJ and Dalhaus seem to be the most rewarding.

Link (http://thenewdaily.com.au/sport/2015/09/14/man-behind-western-bulldogs-incredible-year/)

[Happy Days]

Grant played the vast majority of games this year, and would if he were around next year; why is he a depth player all of a sudden?

[bulldogtragic]

Happy to pay a depth player ~300k??

Prefer to trade Grant and use the pick on a kid.

That's everyone else's assertion about a depth player, not mine. You still need depth players though. But Macrae, Hrovat, Crameri, Boyd, Talia all got dropped this year. Even Grant did. Bevo only plays players in form who do what he wants. Grant racked up 19 games including a final. That's not a depth player and to me not a depth player next year. And the assumption that every kid who has less than 12 months in the AFL system will leap frog him in two years is far from a concrete enevitability. He earned his games, and he's earned a contract.

[bornadog]

Grant played the vast majority of games this year, and would if he were around next year; why is he a depth player all of a sudden?

Because some people have high expectations of a player taken at pick 5. It's not Grant's fault he was chosen at pick 5.

He played all bar 4 games this year and deserved his spot. He has the talent and he has also shown as he has matured, he has the application to be an AFL player.

We will see what happens, but I will be pissed off if he is just let go.

[Cyberdoggie]

Hes an RFA right, so he can go out and get an offer and the club has to match it, or we dont match it and get compo.

So thats whats happening. He'll come back to the club with X years at $Y and the club will make a decision based on whether we want to pay him that much, or take the compo instead.

Same with Talia, Minson and Cordy. They arent on the 'must sign' list, so they are free to explore their options.

List Management.

That's right, the club is happy to float him out in the market to see what interest he gets, if he doesn't get much they can decide to then offer a contract, perhaps at a reduced rate, or if he does get interest it would strengthen any compo pick we get.

Many of the clubs are doing it now, ie Kreuzer at Carlton. As long as that compo pick is there and is quite generous for where you are positioned clubs will dangle players out there like they are now.

I believe Minson has another year on his contract so he will be a bulldog unless we trade him.

We have had a lot of success in the draft in recent years so i'm happy for our list management guys to try and strengthen our position on the table.

[bornadog]

Does Ayce Cordy have a contract?

[Greystache]

Does Ayce Cordy have a contract?

No, and I wouldn't expect he'll be getting one.

[Greystache]

That's only because he led the entire competition in shin-kicks to advantage ;)

If only we gave Howie more games. Oh wait, you said to advantage. Carry on :D

[boydogs]

The only way this makes sense is if we aren't chasing a free agent.


Hes an RFA right, so he can go out and get an offer and the club has to match it, or we dont match it and get compo.

So thats whats happening. He'll come back to the club with X years at $Y and the club will make a decision based on whether we want to pay him that much, or take the compo instead.

Same with Talia, Minson and Cordy. They arent on the 'must sign' list, so they are free to explore their options.

List Management.

That's what I'm thinking as well

It's not meant to be a deep list cut, Grant would have 10 behind him

[Remi Moses]

Because some people have high expectations of a player taken at pick 5. It's not Grant's fault he was chosen at pick 5.

He played all bar 4 games this year and deserved his spot. He has the talent and he has also shown as he has matured, he has the application to be an AFL player.


We will see what happens, but I will be pissed off if he is just let go.

It's not his fault, but he hasn't lived up to the pick 5 billing.
I guess whom we didn't pick is more the frustration, but I thought he improved significantly this season.
He really had to

[Mantis]

It's not meant to be a deep list cut, Grant would have 10 behind him

Which 10?

[LostDoggy]

Hes an RFA right, so he can go out and get an offer and the club has to match it, or we dont match it and get compo.

So thats whats happening. He'll come back to the club with X years at $Y and the club will make a decision based on whether we want to pay him that much, or take the compo instead.

Same with Talia, Minson and Cordy. They arent on the 'must sign' list, so they are free to explore their options.

List Management.

JG is actually UFA.

I don't agree with the idea that we let other teams decide the value of our players. If we think he is worth another contract, we should be putting an offer to him, based on what fits with us and what is a fair reflection of his value to us. Chances are a rival makes a higher offer so we are worse off having to match it.

Players with height, pace, x-factor, who are gut runners, former first rounders (pick #5) and good enough to get 19 games in a strong team will attract decent offers. He has his faults, but will be 26 next year, coming into his best footy.

Forcing a listed FA to the market at a time when you are chasing FAs just does my head in. Got to be more to this.

[G-Mo77]

JG is actually UFA.

I don't agree with the idea that we let other teams decide the value of our players. If we think he is worth another contract, we should be putting an offer to him, based on what fits with us and what is a fair reflection of his value to us. Chances are a rival makes a higher offer so we are worse off having to match it.

Disagree from a list management perspective. We have that option to match but not only that we also get to evaluate what compensation we might get for him. So say Collingwood offer him 3 years at $400k we say thanks for your time and get a 2nd round pick for our troubles. So if he was a RFA if I was list manager I'd do the same.

Unfortunately for us he's not so he can just walk. I'm waiting to hear more about it though. Player managers are not reliable sources when their bread is buttered from squeezing someones balls a little harder.

[bornadog]

SEN speculating Talia to Sydney.

[Ozza]

SEN speculating Talia to Sydney.

It would make sense for the swans to chase a key back, with Ted Richards looking like he is close to the end.

[G-Mo77]

SEN speculating Talia to Sydney.

Have they got their non trade clause lifted yet. :)

[Dry Rot]

SEN speculating Talia to Sydney.

FWIW I've seen some speculation about Talia and our second pick going to the Swans, and we get Jetta.

[Greystache]

FWIW I've seen some speculation about Talia and our second pick going to the Swans, and we get Jetta.

I really hope that's not correct. Jetta does an incredible impression of the invisible man against good teams.

[bulldogtragic]

I really hope that's not correct. Jetta does an incredible impression of the invisible man against good teams.

This. That's horrible if true. Horrible. Nightmare stuff.

[LostDoggy]

Disagree from a list management perspective. We have that option to match but not only that we also get to evaluate what compensation we might get for him. So say Collingwood offer him 3 years at $400k we say thanks for your time and get a 2nd round pick for our troubles. So if he was a RFA if I was list manager I'd do the same.

Unfortunately for us he's not so he can just walk. I'm waiting to hear more about it though. Player managers are not reliable sources when their bread is buttered from squeezing someones balls a little harder.

Yeah, but if we land a FA, then we get no compensation. Dangling any of our FAs out to the market, severely impacts on the value a potential FA has to us. Plus we won't really know what the compensation is until after the deal has been finalised. In truth, it'll be whatever the AFL feels like.

There is also the issue of what all this does for Grant's head given the bulk of his teammates have been offered extensions. Doesn't strike me as the type who would enjoy this process and being valued as marginal.

[ledge]

Here is an update
http://mobile.news.com.au/sport/afl/jarrad-grant-explores-trade-options-from-western-bulldogs/story-fndv8weh-1227527981526

[Ghost Dog]

Fair enough, and we're all guilty of not putting enough time into detailing reasons for certain views at times, which can mean they come off as blunt. I admire people standing by their views, and putting forward a well thought out reason for that, even if I don't agree with them. I've done the same with Dickson, EasternWest did with Addison, and you have with Grant.

And I did with Ed Barlow. Pure entertainment value alone, a real find for us!

[Bulldog Joe]

I really hope that's not correct. Jetta does an incredible impression of the invisible man against good teams.

If Jetta could produce his 2012 form he would be extremely valuable.
I don't understand why his football has fallen away so badly since then, but he was a really important reason for the Swans winning the flag.

[LostDoggy]

FWIW I've seen some speculation about Talia and our second pick going to the Swans, and we get Jetta.

With MacLean, Daniel, Hrovat, Honeychurch, Dale and Webb looking to break into our best 22, I really would hate to think that our list managers would spend good salary cap dollars on a lightly framed small outside midfielder. Especially one that can't win his own ball.

[bornadog]

OFFICIAL

After undergoing its end-of season list review, the Western Bulldogs have made six changes to its primary and rookie lists.The following players have been advised that they will not be offered positions on the playing list for the 2016 season:


Ayce Cordy (25 years old, 27 games)

Sam Darley (22 years old, 20 games)

Matthew Fuller (25 years old, 0 games)

Brett Goodes (rookie, 31 years old, 22 games)

Daniel Pearce (rookie, 22 years old, 6 games)

Jordan Kelly (rookie, 22 years old, 0 games)

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I agree with the sentiments of most here, but understand where BT is coming from.

For mine it has to come down to $$ and years. This is Grant's last and best chance to earn as much money as he can, and after a solid year you can understand why he'd want 2-3 years on 300-400K.

From our perspective, Grant is not worth 300-400K and 3 years. It's all about projecting into the future, not just the short term, but medium term too.

I'm happy to trade Talia and draft/trade in key backs. Seems to be a few decent VFL options. I don't rate Michael at all and haven't seen any strengths translatable to AFL level.

[bornadog]

No surprises there

[The Bulldogs Bite]

OFFICIAL

The following players have been advised that they will not be offered positions on the playing list for the 2016 season:


Ayce Cordy (25 years old, 27 games)


Sam Darley (22 years old, 20 games)


Matthew Fuller (25 years old, 0 games)


Brett Goodes (rookie, 31 years old, 22 games)


Daniel Pearce (rookie, 22 years old, 6 games)


Jordan Kelly (rookie, 22 years old, 0 games)

It couldn't be anymore straight forward than that.

Interesting to see what happens with Minson, Grant, Talia and to a lesser extent Hunter (hopefully we re-sign him soon).

[bulldogsthru&thru]

It couldn't be anymore straight forward than that.

Interesting to see what happens with Minson, Grant, Talia and to a lesser extent Hunter (hopefully we re-sign him soon).

Hunter is at least contracted til the end of next year. Not sure on Talia

[bornadog]

It couldn't be anymore straight forward than that.

Interesting to see what happens with Minson, Grant, Talia and to a lesser extent Hunter (hopefully we re-sign him soon).

Is Hunter also out of contract?

Edit - didn't see above post - Pretty sure Talia and Grant are uncontracted.

[bulldogtragic]

No surprises there

Three rookie vacancies. I wonder if Darley is a chance? Hopefully if we want Darcy he gets to the RD too.

There's our three minimum. If we want a trade or FA who is next?

Grant not delisted.

[bulldogtragic]

If the Talia talk is true. Is he worth to Sydney a pick upgrade from our pick 30 to their 16-18 (+/- compo).

Gives us two first rounders. If we use them well then giddy up.

[Greystache]

First round of cuts were pretty simple and I'm happy with all of those.

Where we go from here will be interesting, there's 3 spots on the list available, plus 2 of Minson, Grant, and Talia are probably likely to go. That'd leave us with 5 spots plus 3 rookies before FA and trades. I think ideally we'd want to free up 6 spots and take 4-5 draft selections plus a trade/FA or 2.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

If the Talia talk is true. Is he worth to Sydney a pick upgrade from our pick 30 to their 16-18 (+/- compo).

Gives us two first rounders. If we use them well then giddy up.

In a heartbeat.

[bornadog]

If the Talia talk is true. Is he worth to Sydney a pick upgrade from our pick 30 to their 16-18 (+/- compo).

Gives us two first rounders. If we use them well then giddy up.

Sydney have to be given permission to trade as they are under a ban.

[Ozza]

Barkers on Barkly may be looking for some new staff members (partners of Fuller and Darley work there).

Always feel a tinge of sadness at the delistings. Ayce, Darley and Fuller were probably the obvious three - but a tough day for them. Hopefully they do well wherever they go to next in footy.

[bornadog]

First round of cuts were pretty simple and I'm happy with all of those.

Where we go from here will be interesting, there's 3 spots on the list available, plus 2 of Minson, Grant, and Talia are probably likely to go. That'd leave us with 5 spots plus 3 rookies before FA and trades. I think ideally we'd want to free up 6 spots and take 4-5 draft selections plus a trade/FA or 2.

Based on what Bevo has said, there will be minimum cuts this year and he wants to keep the group together.

I would expect only one more change . My guess is Minson wants out as he is not getting game time.

[lemmon]

Sydney have to be given permission to trade as they are under a ban.

Isn't that only with players on over 350k per season though?

Also was published in The Australian today that the ban may be lifted to not being able to trade for players over 550k, seems the AFL is softening it's stance

[Greystache]

I hope we can keep Goodes at Footscray. He'd be a brilliant captain.

[bornadog]

Barkers on Barkly may be looking for some new staff members (partners of Fuller and Darley work there).

Always feel a tinge of sadness at the delistings. Ayce, Darley and Fuller were probably the obvious three - but a tough day for them. Hopefully they do well wherever they go to next in footy.

Particularly feel for Ayce. Came in with high expectations from all of us, but just never made it.

[Dry Rot]

I am pleased with the rookie list refresh.

[bornadog]

I am pleased with the rookie list refresh.

We weren't particularly smart with the rookie list this year.

[Ozza]

Particularly feel for Ayce. Came in with high expectations from all of us, but just never made it.

Good point - but instinctively I was actually feeling more for the other two, who haven't really been able to fill their AFL ambitions.
Ayce appears to have a fair bit going on for him with study (talk of him heading down the medical career path) and got a long run at it over 7 years or so in the system.

[bulldogtragic]

Particularly feel for Ayce. Came in with high expectations from all of us, but just never made it.

Was it Emma Quayle in his draft year that said he could be as good as Buddy. I think it was.

[LostDoggy]

Rookie List has been very good to us over the years. Excited to see what fresh candidates our recruiters can identify.

[Ozza]

I hope we can keep Goodes at Footscray. He'd be a brilliant captain.

Yep - great person to have around the club, hopefully he stays on playing and working in some capacity.
Would be wonderful to keep the likes of Goodes, Russell and Prismall as long as we can keep them going.

Wouldn't be surprised if Will Hayes got a spot on the rookie list next year, after the season he has had.

[bornadog]

Was it Emma Quayle in his draft year that said he could be as good as Buddy. I think it was.

I have seen this so many times over the years where the big tall athletes excel in junior ranks because the others haven't developed yet and they have height advantage over them. As they all near 19/20 years old, the others catch up and the real talent starts to shine through.

Dare I say, I hope Tom isn't one of those.

[Mofra]

Always feel a tinge of sadness at the delistings. Ayce, Darley and Fuller were probably the obvious three - but a tough day for them. Hopefully they do well wherever they go to next in footy.
It is tough, three guys have just lost arguably the best job they'll ever have.
Darley had actually played decent football at senior level in patches too and would have had high expectations as a GWS signing pre-draft

[G-Mo77]

OFFICIAL

After undergoing its end-of season list review, the Western Bulldogs have made six changes to its primary and rookie lists.The following players have been advised that they will not be offered positions on the playing list for the 2016 season:


Ayce Cordy (25 years old, 27 games)

Sam Darley (22 years old, 20 games)

Matthew Fuller (25 years old, 0 games)

Brett Goodes (rookie, 31 years old, 22 games)

Daniel Pearce (rookie, 22 years old, 6 games)

Jordan Kelly (rookie, 22 years old, 0 games)

Hate this time of year. Ayce I have time for, shattered for the kid after being really hampered by injuries early in his career, really wanted him to make it! I've actually had some nice banter with Darley on Twitter, usually basketball stuff. Like the guy. Goodes is one of my favorite players despite not playing much with the ones. Going to miss them!

[bornadog]

Rumour (Canberra Times)

GWS keen on trading for Will

[bulldogtragic]

Rumour

GWS keen on trading for Will

Will was the only ruckman to school Mumford this year. The thinking better having him to deny someone else having him?

Treloar and Ward for Will. Deal.

[bornadog]

Will was the only ruckman to school Mumford this year. The thinking better having him to deny someone else having him?

Treloar and Ward for Will. Deal.

How about Tomlinson and ????

[kruder]

Almost every game this year he's found himself on his own in the 50 or goal square from gut running, and we missed him a lot of the time. His gut running was surprising this year, his running surprised even me. I don't want to think about that piece of play though....

Just put out a two year offer and play it out that way. He's maligned by enough that he doesn't need rumour and innuendo like this.

I have a soft spot for Grant. I agree with you in regards to him getting in dangerous positions and players not finding him. Even Hunter on Sat night didn't see him when he attempted to handball to Crameri. I'd sign him for 2 years, its the first year the match committee have showed a little faith in him and he has had his best year on the list.

[G-Mo77]

I'd hate it if he went there!

[bulldogtragic]

How about Tomlinson and ????

Enquire if Gryphon wants back do you mean? :D

[bornadog]

Enquire if Gryphon wants back do you mean? :D

no way.

Do we need to trade picks etc?

[bulldogtragic]

Treloar not AA. Tomlinson not AA. Ward not peaked.

Will is an AA player.

No need to trade picks.

[jazzadogs]

GWS are becoming to us, what we were to Geelong...

Street, Callan, Djerkurra, Lonergan almost, McCartney.

Sam Reid, Addison, Ward, Gryphon, Leon Cameron.

[bulldogtragic]

Rumour (Canberra Times)

GWS keen on trading for Will

Through and Through might know if the journo can be trusted on this one.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Would Minson really want to go to GWS to be the guaranteed second banana behind Mumford anyway? Might as well stay where he is in that case.

[Greystache]

Would Minson really want to go to GWS to be the guaranteed second banana behind Mumford anyway? Might as well stay where he is in that case.

He'd get more than the 1 year he has left on his contract with us, that would be appealing. GWS would probably pay him more than we do as well.

[F'scary]

Here is an update
http://mobile.news.com.au/sport/afl/jarrad-grant-explores-trade-options-from-western-bulldogs/story-fndv8weh-1227527981526

thanks for that, Ledge. The article basically says he is gone, not wanted - we haven't even made him an offer.

Let us say that Grant gets a 2 year contract elsewhere for $300k per year. What RFA compensation would we get?

What if it is $350k p.a for 2 years? What if $350k p.a for 3 years?

What if the best is $300k for 1 year contract?

Where I'm heading to is that at some point, it becomes better value for us to retain him. Let's say our first four draft picks are around 11, 33, 55, 77. If the best the AFL is prepared to compensate is 3rd round (pick 56), then I say match the offer and keep him. In my opinion, he is also much better value than compensation pick 34.

It is all a bit mystifying. I think he can build on his form this year. He is in the prime of his career, has 80+ games of experience (something we are short on, expecially if Murph, Moyd or Morris are not playing). He can play a few different positions and roles and next year there is a 4 man bench operating with reduced rotations which might be suited to a player of his type.

[bulldogtragic]

Would Minson really want to go to GWS to be the guaranteed second banana behind Mumford anyway? Might as well stay where he is in that case.

Fair point. Unless they're selling a twin towers bash em up game plan next year. Unless he wants to hang around the Cornes Boys best mate, aka ruck coach, aka Dean Brogan. Seems a strange rumour as you point out.

[Rocco Jones]

Is Lachie Hunter under contract?

[Happy Days]

Would Minson really want to go to GWS to be the guaranteed second banana behind Mumford anyway? Might as well stay where he is in that case.

You're right; if they get Will, then Mumford is really expendable - straight swap?

[Rocco Jones]

Fair point. Unless they're selling a twin towers bash em up game plan next year. Unless he wants to hang around the Cornes Boys best mate, aka ruck coach, aka Dean Brogan. Seems a strange rumour as you point out.

The only way a Mummy and Will ruck combo will work is if they also trade for a delorean that can take them back to 1982.

[Dry Rot]

Is Lachie Hunter under contract?

Yes for next year.

[Dry Rot]

Cordy delisted, maybe Will leaves.

If we can't trade in a good ruckman, do we need to rookie a VFL ruckman as insurance?

If so, who do you like?

[Axe Man]

Is Lachie Hunter under contract?

Signed until the end of 2016 I believe.

http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/news/2013-12-23/another-pup-recommits


After turning heads in his maiden season, father-son recruit Lachie Hunter has extended his contract until 2016.

[Rocco Jones]

Yes for next year.

I wouldn't mind an extension!

[Greystache]

Is Lachie Hunter under contract?

Yes, until the end of 2016

[Rocco Jones]

Thanks to all.

[Rocco Jones]

Cordy delisted, maybe Will leaves.

If we can't trade in a good ruckman, do we need to rookie a VFL ruckman as insurance?

If so, who do you like?

I think Beveridge is the type of coach who will try to manipulate the ruck if he can not have a quality ruckman,

[Axe Man]

For anybody wondering about current contract lengths, this list on big footy is excellent:

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/current-contract-lengths.967859/

[Ozza]

The only way a Mummy and Will ruck combo will work is if they also trade for a delorean that can take them back to 1982.

As outrageous as it sounds, I did hear a whisper from a former Bulldogs player during the year - that Mummy would be at the Bulldogs in 2016. With Mumford being a contracted player - it sounded far fetched...

[Rocco Jones]

As outrageous as it sounds, I did hear a whisper from a former Bulldogs player during the year - that Mummy would be at the Bulldogs in 2016. With Mumford being a contracted player - it sounded far fetched...

Mummy is an elite ruckman when fit. He has never played 20 games in a year so would have to be really managed if we want to go deep into September with him. I would be delighted with Mummy for Will but not sure GWS were created to help us.

[LostDoggy]

Mummy is an elite ruckman when fit. He has never played 20 games in a year so would have to be really managed if we want to go deep into September with him. I would be delighted with Mummy for Will but not sure GWS were created to help us .

And certainly not 2 years in a row...

[GVGjr]

Smoke and mirrors I say. Think the club will eventually offer a new contract.

While this is of course a real chance, it's not a great list management approach. Grant and his manager should already be very clear if he is a required player or not.

[GVGjr]

If Grant is exploring his options for a better deal than whats offered, id let him go. He hasnt shown the improvement required in a reasonable amount of time. Id rather free up a spot for a kid than keep. In saying that. Hes had a reasonable season. Just hasnt produced enough.

I don't think this is an accurate assumption. There is nothing to suggest he has been exploring his options but he should be now.

[GVGjr]

Hes an RFA right, so he can go out and get an offer and the club has to match it, or we dont match it and get compo.

So thats whats happening. He'll come back to the club with X years at $Y and the club will make a decision based on whether we want to pay him that much, or take the compo instead.

Same with Talia, Minson and Cordy. They arent on the 'must sign' list, so they are free to explore their options.

List Management.

Minson has a contract for next year

[jazzadogs]

Given the strong approach to list management over the past couple of years since JMac's appointment, I find it surprising that so many people are taking the word of Grant's manager.

IMO there is no chance that discussions have not been had about his future. This is just manager spin to get other clubs interested. It doesn't mean that Grant will definitely stay, but attacking the club and saying it's a disastrous approach is a bit over the top.

If the rumours are true and we are targeting Lewis Jetta, I know who I'd prefer on a wing.

[GVGjr]

If the Talia talk is true. Is he worth to Sydney a pick upgrade from our pick 30 to their 16-18 (+/- compo).

Gives us two first rounders. If we use them well then giddy up.

I can't see that happening. I think the Swans have another academy player or two they need to accommodate.

[LostDoggy]

Curtly Hampton from GWS seeking trade. Shoulder injury derailed last year and a bit, but great size for a flanker/winger type(186/88), very talented and still only 22. If the price is right, could be useful.

[bulldogtragic]

Curtly Hampton from GWS seeking trade. Shoulder injury derailed last year and a bit, but great size for a flanker/winger type(186/88), very talented and still only 22. If the price is right, could be useful.

Straight for Will is that random GWS rumour with him is true...

[Rocco Jones]

Curtly Hampton from GWS seeking trade. Shoulder injury derailed last year and a bit, but great size for a flanker/winger type(186/88), very talented and still only 22. If the price is right, could be useful.

I rated what I saw of him in 2014. Need another decent HB prospect with Bob and Boydy getting on.

[Throughandthrough]

possibly off topic and should be on another thread, but i thing that Jason McCartney and Dalrymple have both re-signed is a massive testament to the healthy state of our list. Look at Hawthorn, their list Manager (Buckenara) quit a while ago and is now actively seeking the same role in other clubs as he wants to start again. I think that says a lot about the long term health of our respective lids. Exhibit B is Brisbane, 3 flags, a losing GF and then nothing since.

[Rocco Jones]

possibly off topic and should be on another thread, but i thing that Jason McCartney and Dalrymple have both re-signed is a massive testament to the healthy state of our list. Look at Hawthorn, their list Manager (Buckenara) quit a while ago and is now actively seeking the same role in other clubs as he wants to start again. I think that says a lot about the long term health of our respective lids. Exhibit B is Brisbane, 3 flags, a losing GF and then nothing since.

I think the list management thread is a pretty good place to talk about the list manager and recruiter.

[The Doctor]

Updated.


Listed here is our team in positional order and their respective ages as at the start of the 2016 season. In this thread we can discuss what we need to do to improve our list, trade and recruiting ideas & rumours, types of draftees we need etc. The positions are just a guide as some players could easily cross from one group to another.


Key Forwards

Boyd 20, Stringer 22, Redpath 25,


Medium/Small Forwards

Crameri 27, Grant 27, Dickson 28, Honeychurch 21, McLean 20, Hamilton 20, Dale 19,


Ruckmen

Minson 31, Roughead 25, Campbell 24,


Tall Midfielders

Bontempelli 20, Macrae 21, Stevens 25, Jong 23,


Small Midfielders

Liberatore 24, Wallis 23, Picken 29, Dahlhaus 23, Hrovat 22, C.Smith 23, Hunter 21, Daniel 20,


Key Defenders

Morris 33, Talia 23, Hamling 23, Roberts 23, Z.Cordy 19


Medium/Small Defenders

Murphy 34, Boyd 33, Wood 26, Johannisen 23, Prudden 21, Webb 20, Biggs 24, R.Smith 19*

[Rocco Jones]

I think Hunter is more of a midfielder now and I see Caleb Daniel as a HF/runner type.

[The Doctor]

I think Hunter is more of a midfielder now and I see Caleb Daniel as a HF/runner type.

agree with Hunter call

[Remi Moses]

SEN speculating Talia to Sydney.

My old teacher at high school( recruiter for Sydney) was watching Footscray play Willi early in the year.
Clearly Sydney watching Talia play

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Hampton could be worth a look if he comes relatively cheap.

[LostDoggy]

Hampton could be worth a look if he comes relatively cheap.

GWS have said they will assist him to find a trade, so they sound open for business. I think he could be a definite possible.

[boydogs]

Which 10?

Here's 15, without counting the rookies: Darley (2 games this year), Fuller (0), Campbell (6), Minson (10), A Cordy (7), Roughead (16), Hrovat (7), C Smith (3), Talia (14), Honeychurch (11), Prudden (4), Hamilton (0), Hamling (11), Roberts (12), Redpath (12)

[Ghost Dog]

Caleb Daniel would be more of an in and under ball magnet. Such clean, quick skills would be ideal in a pack situation no?
Mentioned on here, slower than our ruckman. Simply cannot wait to see how he develops. Love the way he gets involved.
If you haven't seen his SANFL final video check it out. Makes you feel lucky to have him.

[Mofra]

Curtly Hampton from GWS seeking trade. Shoulder injury derailed last year and a bit, but great size for a flanker/winger type(186/88), very talented and still only 22. If the price is right, could be useful.
Only if he has somehow learned that football is a team sport, a fact that bewildered him as an 18-19 year old


* Source: teammate

[Sedat]

Only if he has somehow learned that football is a team sport, a fact that bewildered him as an 18-19 year old


* Source: teammate
Yep, I'm personally cold on him. Has absolutely no idea how to defend, which is a basic requirement for a running half-back.

[G-Mo77]

Not related to our list but Footscray's

VFL NEWS:
Footscray Bulldogs plan to offer Brett Goodes a spot on their roster next year if he decides to play on.
The 33 year old was recently delisted from the Western Bulldogs.
Having played 158 state games and helping Footscray win the flag last year as well as the Norm Goss medal. It would be a great addition with a similar role to when Bulldogs were align to Williamstown a few years back.
But North Ballarat may considering offering Goodes a spot. With North Ballarat going stand alone next season, Goodes maturity and VFL history would be a great addition since Goodes played majority of his VFL career at North Ballarat and help win two flags while there.

Would love him to stay on with us.

[bornadog]

Melbourne and Saints chasing Hrovat

[Cyberdoggie]

Melbourne and Saints chasing Hrovat

Sounds like Talia, Hrovat, Grant and Minson's futures are all up in the air.
I would hate to lose Hrovat cheaply, I think he could be a very good player if given enough opportunity. I think his decision making at times has let him down, and that is an issue with the coaching staff but he could end up playing some very good football elsewhere.

From the way he finished off the year at Footscray, and that others were chosen often ahead of him when he did play well, screams out that he would be happy to go elsewhere to seek a change. Doesn't surprise me.

[azabob]

We hold all the cards with Hrovat as he is under contract.

[F'scary]

Hrovat swap for Watts?

[Templeton31]

Melbourne and Saints chasing Hrovat

says Greg Baum so take it with a grain of salt. A very LARGE grain.

[Templeton31]

Hrovat swap for Watts?

Not for mine. Hrovat is young and could/will be good. Watts is not so young and shown he will be just ordinary.

[bulldogtragic]

Hrovat swap for Watts?

God no.

[Doc26]

says Greg Baum so take it with a grain of salt. A very LARGE grain.

Greg Denham I believe and I agree with you, he is the worst of the worst for credible commentary.

[Greystache]

Melbourne and Saints chasing Hrovat

Reported by Greg "venom" Denham, so you can rule out those two clubs.

He's also reporting Melbourne have offered Melksham a 4 year deal, which now also puts a line through that.

BT will be hoping he has the inside scoop Grant is out the door, then he can be safely assured he's staying.

I sometimes think Greg Denham is an actor playing an incompetent sports journalist who constantly has scoops that are always wrong, but then I realise KB isn't bright enough to do something as clever as that.

[KT31]

Hrovat swap for Watts?

I really want and need something better out of the Lake trade, Lake for Watts doesn't cut it for me.

[bulldogtragic]

Needs to be a quality KPP if true. McDonald, Goddard etc. they won't part with that so he stays.

[Bulldog Joe]

I would hope that any trade we do will fill a specific need or improve our draft position.

So happy for trades to upgrade picks or bring in the ruckman/KPD that will take us forward.

[F'scary]

I really want and need something better out of the Lake trade, Lake for Watts doesn't cut it for me.

Fair enough but wasn't the deal with the Hawks a swap of Lake for pick 42 (Kobe Stevens) and an upgrade of pick 28 to pick 21 (Hrovat)?

[Mantis]

Needs to be a quality KPP if true. McDonald, Goddard etc. they won't part with that so he stays.

Why does he stay? He seems excess to our requirements when you factor in the depth we have in small forward/ mid stakes.

I would be very open to trading him.

[Maddog37]

Reported by Greg "venom" Denham, so you can rule out those two clubs.

He's also reporting Melbourne have offered Melksham a 4 year deal, which now also puts a line through that.

BT will be hoping he has the inside scoop Grant is out the door, then he can be safely assured he's staying.

I sometimes think Greg Denham is an actor playing an incompetent sports journalist who constantly has scoops that are always wrong, but then I realise KB isn't bright enough to do something as clever as that.

Very nice work Stache. Denham really does seem like a made up character. I personally like it when people ring up and disagree with him and he starts calling them "Pal".

[1eyedog]

Hrovat swap for Watts?

I just vomited in my mouth.

[1eyedog]

Why does he stay? He seems excess to our requirements when you factor in the depth we have in small forward/ mid stakes.

I would be very open to trading him.

Because he's a better player than Honeychurch. Is he better than Daniel? Possibly! He went 21 for a reason.

[Mantis]

Because he's a better player than Honeychurch. Is he better than Daniel? Possibly! He went 21 for a reason.

What reason is that?

We can't play all of Dahlhaus, McLean, HC, Daniel, Dale & Hrovat in the one team so someone (maybe more than 1) will have to make way.. If Hrovat has currency (which he has) and isn't a first choicer (which he isn't) then we see how the market values him.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Agree Hrovat is expendable, but I think he's a better player than Honeychurch. The likes of McLean and maybe Daniel will overtake him though.

I'm open to it if there's an attractive deal on the table for us.

[Sedat]

Why does he stay? He seems excess to our requirements when you factor in the depth we have in small forward/ mid stakes.

I would be very open to trading him.
Yep, some of us are going all 'Dodoro' in rating the worth of Hrovat. I'd prefer to keep him as his value is low at the moment, and if he gets continuity in training in the off-season he has the capacity to be a starting 18 players for us in 2016. But if the offer is right, I wouldn't begrudge him or the club for making the call.

Koby Stevens ended up being part of the overall Lake trade. Basically it was Lake and Tim O'Brien for Hrovat and Stevens.

[1eyedog]

I think we need to keep Hrovat and the call is 50/50 for mine whether he will or won't be better than Daniel. Aside from this year Hrovat's early career form was very good and I think he offers more than both Daniel and Honeychurch. He covers more ground and carries the ball more than the other two, which is a valuable asset. He's as hard as both of them in the contest and uses the ball way better than Honeychurch.

I understand he represents a player-type we have in spades, I guess it comes down to who other teams want and if they want Hrovat so be it, I'm just loathe to offload good young players who have high potential to be best 22.

[Twodogs]

Needs to be a quality KPP if true. McDonald, Goddard etc. they won't part with that so he stays.

Oh yeah. Either of those would be good. We'd have to sweeten the deal though.

[Happy Days]

Oh yeah. Either of those would be good. We'd have to sweeten the deal though.

I'd happily give our first round pick and Hrovat for McDonald. He's a jet.

[stefoid]

I just vomited in my mouth.

pro tip - open your mouth when you vomit.

[Cyberdoggie]

Yep, some of us are going all 'Dodoro' in rating the worth of Hrovat. I'd prefer to keep him as his value is low at the moment, .

The risk of keeping him is if he spends another year majority at Footscray then his value will decrease. Right now he's seen as a high draft pick, played some good footy, stars at VFL level, possibly just not getting opportunities because of a strong squad keeping him out.

Another year on and he could become a midfielder that has been in the system for over 3 years and still can't get a game. As soon as you roll over another year you become yesterdays news, just like the coaches that miss out for senior coaching roles after applying for a few and missing out.

I think in another year he would be less appealing to other clubs.

[stefoid]

I think we need to keep Hrovat and the call is 50/50 for mine whether he will or won't be better than Daniel. Aside from this year Hrovat's early career form was very good and I think he offers more than both Daniel and Honeychurch. He covers more ground and carries the ball more than the other two, which is a valuable asset. He's as hard as both of them in the contest and uses the ball way better than Honeychurch.

I understand he represents a player-type we have in spades, I guess it comes down to who other teams want and if they want Hrovat so be it, I'm just loathe to offload good young players who have high potential to be best 22.

Daniel is a first year player coming off an interrupted preseason. We'll have a lot better idea what hes capable of once he can get through a full preseason and put some power onto that tiny frame.

[Dry Rot]

FWIW rumours that Swans are interested in Talia are well founded.

[Dry Rot]

Agree Hrovat is expendable, but I think he's a better player than Honeychurch. The likes of McLean and maybe Daniel will overtake him though.

I'm open to it if there's an attractive deal on the table for us.

Agreed.

What would an attractive but fair/realistic deal with the Demons look like?

IMO, thoughts of upgrading our first round pick are unrealistic.

[bulldogtragic]

FWIW rumours that Swans are interested in Talia are well founded.

Almost everyone that has ever traded with Sydney lose. We need to make sure we get a good trade if Talia wants out to them.

[Bulldog4life]

Almost everyone that has ever traded with Sydney lose. We need to make sure we get a good trade if Talia wants out to them.

They seem to be able to turn player's careers around consistently.

[Bulldog Joe]

Almost everyone that has ever traded with Sydney lose. We need to make sure we get a good trade if Talia wants out to them.

Not sure what you base that on.

I think the strength of Sydney's trading has been around what they have achieved with players not wanted at the previous club.
Prime example Ted Richards.

[G-Mo77]

Because he's a better player than Honeychurch. Is he better than Daniel? Possibly! He went 21 for a reason.

I don't think it's fair to compare them. I'd rather Honeychurch as a small crumbing forward but if it were a midfield position I'd prefer Hrovat. I'd like to keep Hrovat but he is a player we have a lot of.

[Twodogs]

FWIW rumours that Swans are interested in Talia are well founded.

He seems a good Sydney project. He's solid and he works on his game.

[Dry Rot]

I don't think it's fair to compare them. I'd rather Honeychurch as a small crumbing forward but if it were a midfield position I'd prefer Hrovat. I'd like to keep Hrovat but he is a player we have a lot of.

This is the elephant in the room with drafting best available.

If you favour this approach, then logically you must be willing to trade surplus of a particular type.

[G-Mo77]

This is the elephant in the room with drafting best available.

If you favour this approach, then logically you must be willing to trade surplus of a particular type.

Yeah, if they're good enough they can be turned into something you need more so I don't see a problem with it.

[boydogs]

Why does he stay? He seems excess to our requirements when you factor in the depth we have in small forward/ mid stakes.

I would be very open to trading him.


Yep, some of us are going all 'Dodoro' in rating the worth of Hrovat. I'd prefer to keep him as his value is low at the moment, and if he gets continuity in training in the off-season he has the capacity to be a starting 18 players for us in 2016. But if the offer is right, I wouldn't begrudge him or the club for making the call.


This is the elephant in the room with drafting best available.

If you favour this approach, then logically you must be willing to trade surplus of a particular type.

Not only is Hrovat's value at a low point, but we can't be sure he's the one who should be squeezed out yet. Hunter finished the year very well but really it's only half a dozen good games he has played, Honeychurch played more than Hrovat but is still very much fringe, Daniel & McLean only got a handful of games in their first year

[bulldogtragic]

Not sure what you base that on.

I think the strength of Sydney's trading has been around what they have achieved with players not wanted at the previous club.
Prime example Ted Richards.

I will rephrase. Clubs who trade with Sydney often lose. Sydney seem to be excellent at identifying undeveloped talent and getting good compo for spudly types. See us get Vezpremi, Brisbane Amon Buchanan, Hawthorn next to nothing for Kenney & McGlyn, Adelaide nothing for Tippett. Rhyce Shaw for 15 spot downgrade late draft, Morton pick 79, exited Trent Dennis Lane for pick 45, Jesse a White 42.

I'm trying to say Sydney win a lot more trades than they lose. We just need not to be another losing trader/tradee.

[Dry Rot]

He seems a good Sydney project. He's solid and he works on his game.

Problem is the trade.

Swans needs their 2015 picks for Academy players, and there's no-one we'd want that they would trade (some talk on BF about their young ruck man Nankervis, but they'd need him too - Pyke is almost done).

Hence my suggestion of Talia and our second for Swans 2016 first rounder.

[Dry Rot]

Not only is Hrovat's value at a low point, but we can't be sure he's the one who should be squeezed out yet. Hunter finished the year very well but really it's only half a dozen good games he has played, Honeychurch played more than Hrovat but is still very much fringe, Daniel & McLean only got a handful of games in their first year


We don't know yet whether Hunter has changed his mind about leaving.

[Greystache]

We don't know yet whether Hunter has changed his mind about leaving.

He isn't leaving and is contracted for next year. He sees himself as an extremely important member of the team in coming years.

[Bulldog Joe]

I will rephrase. Clubs who trade with Sydney often lose. Sydney seem to be excellent at identifying undeveloped talent and getting good compo for spudly types. See us get Vezpremi, Brisbane Amon Buchanan, Hawthorn next to nothing for Kenney & McGlyn, Adelaide nothing for Tippett. Rhyce Shaw for 15 spot downgrade late draft, Morton pick 79, exited Trent Dennis Lane for pick 45, Jesse a White 42.

I'm trying to say Sydney win a lot more trades than they lose. We just need not to be another losing trader/tradee.

I understand what you are saying.
Clearly Sydney have done well, but it just shows that they are astute rather than difficult.

Our last trade with them was Veszpremi for Everitt and we clearly did not do well, but we hardly lost as Everitt was not getting a game with us either. That might have been the classic lose/lose trade.

[Greystache]

I understand what you are saying.
Clearly Sydney have done well, but it just shows that they are astute rather than difficult.

Our last trade with them was Veszpremi for Everitt and we clearly did not do well, but we hardly lost as Everitt was not getting a game with us either. That might have been the classic lose/lose trade.

And he was one of the first fringe players out the door at Sydney when they started trying to pretend they're under the salary cap after recruiting Buddy and Tippet.

[Dry Rot]

He isn't leaving and is contracted for next year. He sees himself as an extremely important member of the team in coming years.

So he's changed his mind? Good. Liked the second half of his season.

[bornadog]

So he's changed his mind? Good. Liked the second half of his season.

DR not sure what you mean? When did he say he was leaving?

[bulldogtragic]

I understand what you are saying.
Clearly Sydney have done well, but it just shows that they are astute rather than difficult.

Our last trade with them was Veszpremi for Everitt and we clearly did not do well, but we hardly lost as Everitt was not getting a game with us either. That might have been the classic lose/lose trade.

No argument, I was trying to say they were good at this caper and I don't think they're difficult, I'm sorry if it came across that way. I was merely pointing out that they far more than often than not do better from trades so some caution needs to be considered when dealing with them. So from a history point of view you've got to work harder to make sure Sydney does get the jump on a trade. As a analogy, the house (Sydney) always wins and trading is all about betting on odds of players/picks to succeed. We just need to count cards and make sure our bets come off against the house. I don't want to be the next mug punter to lose to the house.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

DR not sure what you mean? When did he say he was leaving?

Apparently very annoyed with the way his suspension was handled by the club earlier in the year. Thought the leadership group handing out the punishment were hypocrites.....times very well could have changed since then though but we will want to have extended him early next year

[Dry Rot]

DR not sure what you mean? When did he say he was leaving?

Apparently he was very unhappy about disciplinary action earlier this year and wanted out. Dunno what he thinks now.

EDIT: see post above.

[bornadog]

Apparently very annoyed with the way his suspension was handled by the club earlier in the year. Thought the leadership group handing out the punishment were hypocrites.....times very well could have changed since then though but we will want to have extended him early next year


Apparently he was very unhappy about disciplinary action earlier this year and wanted out. Dunno what he thinks now.

EDIT: see post above.

Yeah, not sure if he wanted out.

[KT31]

Apparently he was very unhappy about disciplinary action earlier this year and wanted out. Dunno what he thinks now.

EDIT: see post above.

In the Hun last week Hunter spoke about the disciplinary action and said at the time he thought was very harsh but now sees the reasoning behind and it and it has helped him focus and become a better footballer.

[Sedat]

I will rephrase. Clubs who trade with Sydney often lose. Sydney seem to be excellent at identifying undeveloped talent and getting good compo for spudly types. See us get Vezpremi, Brisbane Amon Buchanan, Hawthorn next to nothing for Kenney & McGlyn, Adelaide nothing for Tippett. Rhyce Shaw for 15 spot downgrade late draft, Morton pick 79, exited Trent Dennis Lane for pick 45, Jesse a White 42.

I'm trying to say Sydney win a lot more trades than they lose. We just need not to be another losing trader/tradee.
They did get Suckling and Stratton with the picks - more of a win-win trade. Really Kennedy is the rolled gold for Sydney - McGlynn has been just another plonker who goes in hard but butchers the ball. He was genuinely horrible for Sydney against Freo last week.

Not every Sydney trade has been a roaring success - they did give up mid range picks for absolute potatoes like Henry Playfair and Paul Chambers, as well as a high pick for Mark Seaby.

[stefoid]

Almost everyone that has ever traded with Sydney lose. We need to make sure we get a good trade if Talia wants out to them.

We have a list manager now.

Perhaps we can arrange a three way.

[bulldogtragic]

We have a list manager now.

Perhaps we can arrange a three way.

I mean I like you, and Jason seems nice. But I think it would ruin the friendship.

[Mofra]

Not every Sydney trade has been a roaring success - they did give up mid range picks for absolute potatoes like Henry Playfair and Paul Chambers, as well as a high pick for Mark Seaby.
Ditto the Bradshaw deal.

Sydney have a lot of success stories but they have historically traded in more than other clubs so have their share of trades that didn't work as well.
The Tippett deal is already under scrutiny - and some of the rumours suggest he and Buddy won't play on the same team again anyway.

[GVGjr]

I will rephrase. Clubs who trade with Sydney often lose. Sydney seem to be excellent at identifying undeveloped talent and getting good compo for spudly types. See us get Vezpremi, Brisbane Amon Buchanan, Hawthorn next to nothing for Kenney & McGlyn, Adelaide nothing for Tippett. Rhyce Shaw for 15 spot downgrade late draft, Morton pick 79, exited Trent Dennis Lane for pick 45, Jesse a White 42.

I'm trying to say Sydney win a lot more trades than they lose. We just need not to be another losing trader/tradee.

The Barry Hall deal was reasonable, they couldn't have been fairer with Biggs.

They do their homework well but they're hardly like Essendon to deal with.

Trades are trades, they won't always be a win win outcome.

I can't see why we wouldn't work with them.

[jeemak]

He isn't leaving and is contracted for next year. He sees himself as an extremely important member of the team in coming years.

I understood what you meant..........

:)

[bulldogtragic]

The Barry Hall deal was reasonable, they couldn't have been fairer with Biggs.

They do their homework well but they're hardly like Essendon to deal with.

Trades are trades, they won't always be a win win outcome.

I can't see why we wouldn't work with them.

I'm not saying not to work with them, merely my thought that they tend to trade in at a good price, and trade out average players at reasonable prices. So if they usually win, trading partners usually lose. They're obviously very good at it, they convinced us Vezpremi was a great option!!

[boydogs]

So if they usually win, trading partners usually lose

We did pretty well with Biggs

[jeemak]

Couldn't it be easy enough to suggest they've won a premiership and been thereabouts these past few years because they held on to their good players, brought other good players in and let go of their ordinary players?

[hujsh]

I'm not saying not to work with them, merely my thought that they tend to trade in at a good price, and trade out average players at reasonable prices. So if they usually win, trading partners usually lose. They're obviously very good at it, they convinced us Vezpremi was a great option!!
A couple of times now you've made it sound like we gave the world for Vez. It was a very fair trade of two underperforming 1st round picks. Neither performed that great or stayed at the club. What was Everitt really worth?

[GVGjr]

I'm not saying not to work with them, merely my thought that they tend to trade in at a good price, and trade out average players at reasonable prices. So if they usually win, trading partners usually lose. They're obviously very good at it, they convinced us Vezpremi was a great option!!

Not so sure that is correct, we shopped Everitt around because the coach didn't think he had the intensity to make it and they offered up Vesz. Two former first round draft picks were just swapped.

Like WC with Hill, Swans simply got more out of Everitt than we that we could. We have a history of moving players on early.

[LostDoggy]

Not so sure that is correct, we shopped Everitt around because the coach didn't think he had the intensity to make it and they offered up Vesz. Two former first round draft picks were just swapped.

Like WC with Hill, Swans simply got more out of Everitt than we that we could. We have a history of moving players on early.

In fairness, Everitt was not much more consistent or empassioned with Sydney than he was with us. We've palmed a few ordinary ones to Sydney over the years. Not sure many up there will remember too fondly Shannon Corcoran, Graeme Cordy or Stuart Wigney.

[Templeton31]

afl.com saying we've offered Talia a 2 year contract.

[bornadog]

afl.com saying we've offered Talia a 2 year contract.

and also this


St Kilda and Carlton have emerged as the most ardent suitors of Bomber Jake Carlisle, rival clubs believe the Bulldogs could yet re-enter the race for the key defender if Michael Talia decides to leave for Adelaide

[bulldogtragic]

and also this

What is Talia worth to them? They're no chance to get him in the PSD and hopefully Hwthorn stretch them from talls in defence. He schooled Walked earlier this year so their fans might think he's ok. Upgrade our pick 33 to 15 (after fa compo)?

[bornadog]

What is Talia worth to them? They're no chance to get him in the PSD and hopefully Hwthorn stretch them from talls in defence. He schooled Walked earlier this year so their fans might think he's ok. Upgrade our pick 33 to 15 (after fa compo)?

WE will swap for Dangerfield:D

[bulldogtragic]

WE will swap for Dangerfield:D

Maybe we can make a play for Dodoro before trade week then. :)

[chef]

I'd rather keep Talia if possible. Him, Hamling and Roberts(maybe Zaine too) gives us a good group of KPD and plenty of depth with Roughie also able to do a job there too.

Trading him just makes it an area we need to focus on and there is a player in there somewhere, hope we haven't given up on him just yet.

[bornadog]

I'd rather keep Talia if possible. Him, Hamling and Roberts(maybe Zaine too) gives us a good group of KPD and plenty of depth with Roughie also able to do a job there too.

Trading him just makes it an area we need to focus on and there is a player in there somewhere, hope we haven't given up on him just yet.

I think it's more him than us.

[bulldogtragic]

I'd rather keep Talia if possible. Him, Hamling and Roberts(maybe Zaine too) gives us a good group of KPD and plenty of depth with Roughie also able to do a job there too.

Trading him just makes it an area we need to focus on and there is a player in there somewhere, hope we haven't given up on him just yet.

I'm with you, but the jungle drums are very loud on him wanting out not on us shopping him.

[chef]

I think it's more him than us.

Does think he's hard done by?

[bulldogtragic]

Does think he's hard done by?

That's the idle gossip that hasn't been confirmed anywhere that I know of.

[chef]

I'm with you, but the jungle drums are very loud on him wanting out not on us shopping him.

That's annoying if true.

[bornadog]

Does think he's hard done by?

Gossip is he thinks he should be playing everyweek, but won't do the team thing and plays for himself.

[hujsh]

Talia: Of course I should play every week. I'm so good that i get moved forward to cover for the team not being good enough and because no one else on our team can play there and there's plenty of other key defenders. If anything I'm a victim of being too good.

[1eyedog]

He knows he's behind Roughie, Roberts and Hamling down there, and he is.

[Greystache]

That's the idle gossip that hasn't been confirmed anywhere that I know of.

He thinks he should be playing every week, but concedes he's getting monstered every week. Not a lot of logic on display.

If he played better he'd play.

[bulldogtragic]

He thinks he should be playing every week, but concedes he's getting monstered every week. Not a lot of logic on display.

If he played better he'd play.
That's akin to Chief Wiggam telling Ralph his nose bleeds because he picks it too much, or not enough...

[Remi Moses]

He either is one step behind his opponent, or gets out bodied in a one on one .
If letting Talia and Grant leave for obtaining Martin and Carlisle, I'd be happy

[G-Mo77]

Gossip is he thinks he should be playing everyweek, but won't do the team thing and plays for himself.

I've got no problem with thinking he should play every week. He should use that to drive him and work hard to become better. From what I have seen I haven't seen him play selfishly so IMO I wouldn't believe the plays for himself stuff. What I see with Talia is a guy struggling with confidence. I saw something in the player who played early on in the season after that he just couldn't get to that level or improve. I'd be disappointed to lose him but I'd hold firm on the 2 year offer.

[Webby]

Here's a hair brained scenario for you. We trade Talia to Adelaide (for nix - or pick 70+) on the proviso that they nudge Dangerfield towards going FA to us rather than Geelong - who've tapped him up for two years...

I know it may sound mad, but we are 40 mins from Geelong, are going to be in a window for the remainder of his career, and he won't want to burn his bridges with the Crows if he can avoid it. In that scenario, the Crows get their compo pick AND the brother of their AA defender.. Potentially a win/win/win.

[stefoid]

I mean I like you, and Jason seems nice. But I think it would ruin the friendship.

fnarr, fnarr - story of my life

[bulldogtragic]

Jon Ralph stating clubs all scared off Kruezers foot and is absolutely now staying at Carlton. Chris Yarran has not turned up to the B&F and wants out.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Would rather a second (or third) round pick than keep Talia.

[ledge]

Chris Yarran wouldn't touch him, a sook and hasn't done himself any favours by cracking it and playing disinterested.

[The Underdog]

Here's a hair brained scenario for you. We trade Talia to Adelaide (for nix - or pick 70+) on the proviso that they nudge Dangerfield towards going FA to us rather than Geelong - who've tapped him up for two years...

I know it may sound mad, but we are 40 mins from Geelong, are going to be in a window for the remainder of his career, and he won't want to burn his bridges with the Crows if he can avoid it. In that scenario, the Crows get their compo pick AND the brother of their AA defender.. Potentially a win/win/win.

I can't see how the Crows would have any influence over where Dangerfield goes. It'll be between him and his manager and I'm guessing the deal with Geelong is in the bag already. If we're in on him it's a massive secret and likely to cost us some players down the line.

[Remi Moses]

Yarran has zero defensive side . Richmond need some grunt in the middle, and they have Yarran types in Grigg and Houli.

[Webby]

I can't see how the Crows would have any influence over where Dangerfield goes. It'll be between him and his manager and I'm guessing the deal with Geelong is in the bag already. If we're in on him it's a massive secret and likely to cost us some players down the line.

It's just a thought that Dangerfield's motives for leaving Adelaide are that he wants to come home. He loves Adelaide and the people at the club and would want to part on the best possible terms. If that means Adelaide saying "You can go to the Dogs with our blessing, but you go to Geelong without our blessing" it might just influence his decision.

The understanding in Adelaide is that Danderfield is leaving for Geelong. If the word was, he went to his second choice club in order to look after the Crows via Talia, then he'd potentially be remembered fondly in Adelaide. This could be the point of influence.

As I say, it's just a thought.

[Dancin' Douggy]

Dangerfield is a surfer. He loves surfing and he wants to be near the sea. FACT.

The difference between living / playing in Geelong or Melbourne is actually massive in this case.

If he plays for Geelong he can live in Torquay. Get up for an early surf. 10 minutes to the water. 10 minutes back and a 20 minute drive in to Kardinia park. If you live in Melbourne, it's a 3 hr round trip just to get to the surf and back and that's not counting any time in the water. Forget it. If he moves, he moves to Geelong.

END OF STORY.

[Happy Days]

Here's a hair brained scenario for you. We trade Talia to Adelaide (for nix - or pick 70+) on the proviso that they nudge Dangerfield towards going FA to us rather than Geelong - who've tapped him up for two years...

I know it may sound mad, but we are 40 mins from Geelong, are going to be in a window for the remainder of his career, and he won't want to burn his bridges with the Crows if he can avoid it. In that scenario, the Crows get their compo pick AND the brother of their AA defender.. Potentially a win/win/win.

Because that worked so well last time!

[Webby]

Dangerfield is a surfer. He loves surfing and he wants to be near the sea. FACT.

The difference between living / playing in Geelong or Melbourne is actually massive in this case.

If he plays for Geelong he can live in Torquay. Get up for an early surf. 10 minutes to the water. 10 minutes back and a 20 minute drive in to Kardinia park. If you live in Melbourne, it's a 3 hr round trip just to get to the surf and back and that's not counting any time in the water. Forget it. If he moves, he moves to Geelong.

END OF STORY.

Okay, then. Its a FACT..

END OF STORY. Silly me.

[Dry Rot]

The ruck situation is getting murky.

Luenburger is linked to other clubs, and Kruezner tipped to stay at Carlton (foot). And if LB leaves the Lions, you'd think they'd hang onto Martin, who is under contract.

[Twodogs]

The ruck situation is getting murky.

Luenburger is linked to other clubs, and Kruezner tipped to stay at Carlton (foot). And if LB leaves the Lions, you'd think they'd hang onto Martin, who is under contract.

Lots of nature agers around in state leagues who could come come in and pkay a role. I reckon Jmac will know each one. Lots of other clubs have guts ready to go waiting for a chance. We will find a ruckman more in tune with our game style. Kruezer and Luenberger, as good as both are, were big risks to chance our future on. Too much risk for the reward on offer with those two and their injury history.

[divvydan]

Looks very likely that Martin will stay. Seems his g/f wanted to move back to Melbourne for acting jobs but he's happy up there and they've sorted something out.

[LostDoggy]

Lots of nature agers around in state leagues who could come come in and pkay a role. I reckon Jmac will know each one. Lots of other clubs have guts ready to go waiting for a chance. We will find a ruckman more in tune with our game style. Kruezer and Luenberger, as good as both are, were big risks to chance our future on. Too much risk for the reward on offer with those two and their injury history.

Agree. There are also project Ruckmen on AFL lists our List Managers will be all over. Players like Scott Lycett, Luke Lowden and Daniel Currie are all in that 24-26 age, have done multiple AFL preseasons and are just starved of opportunity due to the specialist nature of the Ruckman (behind NicNat, Jacobs, Goldy respectively). If one of these are suitable types for us, we'll be pouncing, Biggs or Hamling style, with no fanfare and little expense.