Game Day Round 21 2015 - West Coast V Western Bulldogs

[The Underdog]

Oh, reality, Hi. I didn't see you there.

[jazzadogs]

Reality check for sure.

Certainly is, but as a group can we try to stay positive? Not a dig at you BT, but we have fielded our most inexperienced side of the year against the team who I feel should win the flag, at their hostile home ground, and stuck with them for almost three quarters.

We made poor decisions, their mature midfield outworked ours and our team defence suffered. But we're still a young inexperienced side that is going to play finals and is a strong chance of winning at least one.

[jeemak]

We have shown ourselves not to be strong enough, and once again, we have failed on a road trip to Western Australia and disgraced ourselves against a side which is less depleted than us, but much more talented in open football.

I get that Subiaco is a strange shape, but funnily enough, it's pretty similar to Whitten Oval.

We will not garner any credibility until we pull our pants up and toughen the *!*!*!*! up on the road. What a pathetic effort.

[bulldogtragic]

Certainly is, but as a group can we try to stay positive? Not a dig at you BT, but we have fielded our most inexperienced side of the year against the team who I feel should win the flag, at their hostile home ground, and stuck with them for almost three quarters.

We made poor decisions, their mature midfield outworked ours and our team defence suffered. But we're still a young inexperienced side that is going to play finals and is a strong chance of winning at least one.

Sure, but a reality check isn't negative comment on my part.

[Mantis]

How many over the top goals have they kicked today?

Our defenders are getting sucked too far up the ground.

[whythelongface]

We have shown ourselves not to be strong enough, and once again, we have failed on a road trip to Western Australia and disgraced ourselves against a side which is less depleted than us, but much more talented in open football.

I get that Subiaco is a strange shape, but funnily enough, it's pretty similar to Whitten Oval.

We will not garner any credibility until we pull our pants up and toughen the *!*!*!*! up on the road. What a pathetic effort.

Has it really been a disgrace? Sure the last quarter has been a pantsing but we were still in the game midway through the 3rd. It is just one of those games that is a learning curve for our team. We have deficiencies and we all knew that but hey we will learn and come out of it better.

[LostDoggy]

All this talk of finals, will be lucky to get within 6 goals of any side in the 8. Last qtr was one of the most insipid efforts I have seen in a long time.

[comrade]

Who needs a defence when you never lose a clearance.

Bevo had a dirty day, IMO. Needed to make a change to try and curb the ruck dominance.

[Mantis]

We have shown ourselves not to be strong enough, and once again, we have failed on a road trip to Western Australia and disgraced ourselves against a side which is less depleted than us, but much more talented in open football.

I get that Subiaco is a strange shape, but funnily enough, it's pretty similar to Whitten Oval.

We will not garner any credibility until we pull our pants up and toughen the *!*!*!*! up on the road. What a pathetic effort.

So much wrong with this post... Is there a dislike button?

[comrade]

All this talk of finals, will be lucky to get within 6 goals of any side in the 8. Last qtr was one of the most insipid efforts I have seen in a long time.

Wow, that was a quick jump off.

See you next year.

[Bulldog4life]

So much wrong with this post... Is there a dislike button?

We should have a dislike button Mods

[comrade]

Picko and a fit Libba would have been handy.

[LostDoggy]

Wow, that was a quick jump off.

See you next year.

Really !! Tell me what you liked in the second half ? If you want to accept crap like that fine, doesnt mean I have to enjoy it like you. Where was the jump off ? i called it as I saw it, if you dont like it fine.

[bulldogtragic]

Did Pearce get a touch. I don't recall seeing him.

[jazzadogs]

Sure, but a reality check isn't negative comment on my part.

Yeh as I said it wasn't a dig at you, just used your quote of 'reality check' as a starting point.

[jeemak]

So much wrong with this post... Is there a dislike button?

I had a fair tantrum, and the result was that post. It wasn't my best post.

That was a pathetic effort however. We completely crumbled, and there's nothing more to be said about it.

[Mantis]

Did Pearce get a touch. I don't recall seeing him.

To be fair it wasn't a great time to come on... We were cooked.

[Rocket Science]

That was painful, but shouldn't be forgotten that 13 of 22 blokes in that squad boast less than 50 games on their resumes.

A hard but necessary lesson learnt along with Picken, Boyd, Roughead, Roberts and Boyd the younger to return, think we'll be ok.

[bulldogtragic]

To be fair it wasn't a great time to come on... We were cooked.

Nothing against the kid, I just tried to relive some of that last quarter and couldn't recall seeing him.

[Mantis]

I had a fair tantrum, and the result was that post. It wasn't my best post.

That was a pathetic effort however. We completely crumbled, and there's nothing more to be said about it.

That was a young side out there.. We got schooled by a top 2 team late in the game, but we have so much to work with.

Stay the course!

[comrade]

See, this was what I was expecting in 2015.

Then we go and win games and the hope builds.

Let's not forget that Bevo is building for the long term. A finals series for our kids will be massive for their development, as will a belting like this. Shows how far they have to go.

[F'scary]

Expect major changes next week.

[always right]

Who needs a defence when you never lose a clearance.

Bevo had a dirty day, IMO. Needed to make a change to try and curb the ruck dominance.

You mean like trying Redpath, Crameri, Biggs, Jong and Bonti.....and having third men up? Yeah, he's stubborn that way.

[jeemak]

That was a young side out there.. We got schooled by a top 2 team late in the game, but we have so much to work with.

Stay the course!

I am completely aware of the age of our group, I just hate that we always travel west and perform pathetically. We've had much better teams perform less admirably over the course of the journey, hence my comment about us always falling short.

Our club continually embarrasses itself in Perth, and I'm sick of it. We won't be taken seriously until we win on that trip.

As an aside, we want to be taken seriously as a finals or top four aspirant, but we demonstrated that we're not worthy of that consideration. Sure my original post may have seemed harsh, but we can't have it both ways. Capitulating like that isn't good enough, and I bet our current coach thinks the same way as I do.

[Hotdog60]

It wasn't fun was it. I wonder if Minno gets a recall if Tom is unfit or maybe rested with the corky.

[always right]

We had blokes having career best seasons put in absolute shockers. Murph turned the ball over early, Wood missed targets all game, JJ was ineffectual, and Bonts invisible for much of the game. Inagine if Stringer hadn't been playing.

[comrade]

It wasn't fun was it. I wonder if Minno gets a recall if Tom is unfit or maybe rested with the corky.

Roughy should come in.

[Mantis]

It wasn't fun was it. I wonder if Minno gets a recall if Tom is unfit or maybe rested with the corky.

Has to be likely with Goldstein waiting for us.

[comrade]

I wonder if NN makes Bevo think twice about the importance of the ruck?

Only time we looked a chance was when he was off the ground.

[jazzadogs]

657

Terribly inexperienced side. We have all had our hopes up the past few weeks, but this is reality. On our day, with a bit more experience (Boyd and Picken primarily) we can still beat anyone.

Can't wait for the finals.

[LostDoggy]

http://www.woof.net.au/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=657&stc=1

Terribly inexperienced side. We have all had our hopes up the past few weeks, but this is reality. On our day, with a bit more experience (Boyd and Picken primarily) we can still beat anyone.

Can't wait for the finals.

Couldn't agree more.

With the course Bevo has chosen, we were always going to cop a few big whacks along the way, but it doesn't alter anything really.

A lot of our guys will have learnt so much today. No doubt the match committee learnt a bit too.

Massive test of our maturity to see how we bounce back against Roos next week.

[Eastdog]

Disappointed today especially with our last quarter but for 3 quarters we fought very hard. The upside still is that we have played very well mostly this year which has secured us finals footy which we deserve. We need to keep in mind we were probably playing the premiership team possibly this season on their home turf. Back at Etihad next week and we need to account for the Roos and also try and get a big win.

Players I thought did well today: Stringer, Dahlhaus, Hunter, Wallis, Redpath, Bonti I thought was ok. Dicko was there but probably not as influential today as in the past. Our defence struggled today as its been very good to my surprise this year as that was a worry of mine. Talia wasn't great. Still important to have Morris down there.

[Flamethrower]

The only positive from today's debacle is a 7th or 8th place finish will give us an easier fixture in 2016.

[angelopetraglia]

Agree. So very young today and a very strange game to debut not one but two players in when we are so, so young. We hung trough for 2 1/2 quarters but fell away bad in the end.

How we respond against North will say plenty.

[Webby]

Just like round 3 in Launceston, the gunpowder was kept dry + couple of keys left on the tarmac. With Picko and Boyd out, we lacked spine (literally). As good as Bont is, he misses grunt beside him.

We'll learn from today and will come at the finals like the good, young, fearless side that we are... A bit like the Ashes series we're watching (strike that, enduring) at present, there's a fine line between triumph and tragedy.

Our club is made of the right stuff. When we get to finals, we'll be primed and fearless. Look out AFL. Look out Eagles. Today was an aberration. Whether it be this year or sometime in the next 3-4, the day is getting closer when the Dogs rise up in the West.

Chins up Dogs!

[merantau]

Well, I'm glad that's over and we can get on with the rest of the season. We played our worst game for the year against the team I hate the most. It hurts - deeply. But we will bounce back from this. The facts are that we gifted them 3 goals and yet, had Lin Jong kicked straight we would have been 17 points down late in the third, even though, to that point, we had few good players. The last quarter was terrible though, and there is no escaping that. Time and again they took it away from the centre with ridiculous ease. Our blokes were not standing shoulder to shoulder with their direct opponents at the bounce so this made it easier for them.
Do not fear. We will beat North next week. This pantsing will provoke a massive reaction from our boys.
Go Dogs!

[The Underdog]

I could definitely see Macca's imprint on the team today

[SonofScray]

Frustrating that we've turned in another putrid effort in the West. We really struggle with the trip I think.

Not going to write us off on today, as many will. Not sure we fired our best shot, or even put too many bullets in the barrel for what it is worth. If we are flat and get flogged by North I will be disheartened. The good news is that flags don't wag in the regular season. Its about working through the kinks, getting your best team on the park and winning the cut throat finals games to get to the Promised Land.

[LostDoggy]

The only positive from today's debacle is a 7th or 8th place finish will give us an easier fixture in 2016.
Really? You couldn't find something positive at all? What about Stringer's game for a start?

We have shown ourselves not to be strong enough, and once again, we have failed on a road trip to Western Australia and disgraced ourselves against a side which is less depleted than us, but much more talented in open football.

I get that Subiaco is a strange shape, but funnily enough, it's pretty similar to Whitten Oval.

We will not garner any credibility until we pull our pants up and toughen the *!*!*!*! up on the road. What a pathetic effort.
We all get emotional. You're (usually) one of the best posters on WOOF, IMHO, and definitely one of the more measured.

All this talk of finals, will be lucky to get within 6 goals of any side in the 8. Last qtr was one of the most insipid efforts I have seen in a long time.
This is the most insipid posts I have seen in a long time.

I get that we're mad. We were hoping, dreaming, that we'd beat the Eagles over there, cement top 4 and flag threat status and go on to dance into October. It didn't happen that way. Doesn't mean the season is over or that we've lost anything, and I think after watching the effort the boys put in over there against the in-form team of the competition, sure we fell away when the result was put out of doubt and the margin blew up but it's absolutely pathetic to just jump off the blokes after one loss of that sort. These guys owe you nothing in 2015, they've exceeded all expectations and delivered a stellar season, Hawthorn and West Coast games don't detract from that one whit.

See, this was what I was expecting in 2015.

Then we go and win games and the hope builds.

Let's not forget that Bevo is building for the long term. A finals series for our kids will be massive for their development, as will a belting like this. Shows how far they have to go.

Absolutely agree.

I hate West Coast with a fierce passion only surpassed in recent seasons by the whole Essendon thing. And I'm not that fussed. Disappointed, sure: we are not likely to win a flag this year, which we all knew deep down, it just hurts having it stamped on the record sheet for you by a team like the Eagles.

I'm bored with seeing the rich teams constantly dominate, and the Dogs have shown us enough this year to see that in future seasons this trend may just be turned on its head. To see that? Yeah, I'll stay patient.

[Eastdog]

We need to try and fight to get 4th and earn a double chance but that will mean most likely that will be playing in Perth again. Finish 5th or 6th is the next best and that will earn us a home final.

[jeemak]

BAS, thanks for the kudos, I guess I tried to explain my annoyance in subsequent posts.

[Stefcep]

There were key moments in the first 3 quarters where we made crucial mistakes, and gifted them goals. I thought if we could get ahead on the scoreboard it would have an enormous mental effect.

Fact is this is a young team that got taught harsh lessons and too many of them went missing. Bont, Grant, Jong, Johanassen, Dahlhous, Wood.

We also need badly need a key Full back.

[anfo27]

Really disappointed we didn't hang tough till the end but thought we did a hell of a job to stay within 3-4 goals for 3 quarters. You could count the good players on one hand tonight and we were lucky we had someone like Stringer putting on a show whenever he got it to keep us in it.
We got smashed in the centre and contested possessions which gave us no chance in winning. Our defenders were forced to defend one on one far too often, with little pressure up field and players like Hammling & Talia just couldn't cope.
Our tackling was terrible!

[Webby]

Well, I'm glad that's over and we can get on with the rest of the season. We played our worst game for the year against the team I hate the most. It hurts - deeply. But we will bounce back from this. The facts are that we gifted them 3 goals and yet, had Lin Jong kicked straight we would have been 17 points down late in the third, even though, to that point, we had few good players. The last quarter was terrible though, and there is no escaping that. Time and again they took it away from the centre with ridiculous ease. Our blokes were not standing shoulder to shoulder with their direct opponents at the bounce so this made it easier for them.
Do not fear. We will beat North next week. This pantsing will provoke a massive reaction from our boys.
Go Dogs!

I agree. I've infiltrated my way into the Roos club for next week and plan to make a right ***t of myself as we put them away!

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

This was arguably our weakest team that we have selected this year which showed up against a premiership contender in the WCE. The weaker opposition we have faced in the past 6-8 weeks certainly didn't help our chances today. It is to be hoped that we do not suffer mentally after today's big loss. It is always tough for Melbourne based Clubs to bounce back the following week after a trip to the West. We will be better equipped next week with the expected return of Picken M Boyd Roughead and Roberts which will give us a far more experience line up. Hrovat must also come into contention being our best player for Footscray in recent weeks. Today was a reality check against a very strong team. I believe we are better than that after what has been such a great year for the Club.

[bornadog]

That was a young side out there.. We got schooled by a top 2 team late in the game, but we have so much to work with.

Stay the course!

Average of 59 games compared to 97. Once more we were the youngest in average games played for the round.

[Smads57]

I'm hoping we get another crack at them in the finals - we need to put ourselves out there if we are to get to the big dance. Go dogs!

[Ghost Dog]

We beat them before - can do it again. Boys had an off day, and of course, we were wearing red so that didn't help.
But if we don't find a KPD who can take Kennedy and a solution to Nic Nat, I'm not sure the result will be different next time Sir Bevo.

Jake Stringer - just amazing and so lucky to have him at the club.

[SonofScray]

Someone talk me through Redpath's game today please.

[jeemak]

............Sorry, bad post and wrong forum......

[Eastdog]

I'm hoping we get another crack at them in the finals - we need to put ourselves out there if we are to get to the big dance. Go dogs!

While Etihad is our home turf where we play our home games we need to get a few more games next year at the MCG where ultimately the finals are played. Need experience on both small and big grounds.

[Eastdog]

Someone talk me through Redpath's game today please.

Jack played well today and was dangerous up forward for us. I also think Crameri did ok today.

[LostDoggy]

While Etihad is our home turf where we play our home games we need to get a few more games next year at the MCG where ultimately the finals are played. Need experience on both small and big grounds.

Another issue today was the amount of slipping over. With so many Etihad games, we just don't get as much exposure to outdoor football variables as we need.

[jeemak]

/
Another issue today was the amount of slipping over. With so many Etihad games, we just don't get as much exposure to outdoor football variables as we need.

All that training at Whitten Oval really holds us back

[LostDoggy]

Training ain't matches

[jeemak]

Training ain't matches

It ain't.

Maybe we just have players that slip over too much.

[LostDoggy]

Maybe, but the more you play in slippery and windy conditions, individually and as a team, the better you handle those conditions.

I think our developing team would benefit from more games away from indoor Etihad.

Especially if we just have players that slip over too much.

[1eyedog]

Someone talk me through Redpath's game today please.

Go for mark, drop mark, go for mark, drop mark, push player in the back in the goal square, give away a goal, go to tackle a player, smack him around the head, give away a goal.

He's taking up Tom Boyd's spot can we PLEASE just get games into Tom?

Hope that summary was ok?

[Eastdog]

Maybe, but the more you play in slippery and windy conditions, individually and as a team, the better you handle those conditions.

I think our developing team would benefit from more games away from indoor Etihad.

Especially if we just have players that slip over too much.

Yes we need a good range across the bigger and smaller grounds and indoor and outdoor conditions. Could though get a home final in the 1st week of the finals at Etihad.

[G-Mo77]

Watched the first half and was reasonably pleased. Went to work and listened to the 2nd half, oh no. ��

[ReLoad]

Wtf.......

[Eastdog]

Wtf.......

What are you referring to Reload?

[ReLoad]

What are you referring to Reload?

Just got off the plane and saw the result.

Got on the plane 17 points down, got off and was pretty much punched in the head by the scoreline :(

[Eastdog]

Just got off the plane and saw the result.

Got on the plane 17 points down, got off and was pretty much punched in the head by the scoreline :(

Not too good in the end. For 3 quarters we did ok but that last quarter was a real letdown.

[ledge]

Put it in perspective, we went in with two 100 game players, we served it up to them for 2 and a half quarters and lost 3 players to injury, one being an over 100 game player.
We are young and have far exceeded out expectations.
We won 9 of our last 11 ? And people want to hammer us for one bad loss against the best team in the comp which have an average winning margin of 50 points at home.
Get a grip everything we have done has been a huge bonus from what happened in the off season.

[Mantis]

Jack played well today and was dangerous up forward for us.

No he didn't... Kicked a couple of goals, but otherwise was very poor.

[SonofScray]

Go for mark, drop mark, go for mark, drop mark, push player in the back in the goal square, give away a goal, go to tackle a player, smack him around the head, give away a goal.

He's taking up Tom Boyd's spot can we PLEASE just get games into Tom?

Hope that summary was ok?
Ta. I heard snippets n the radio and in a few plays it sounded like he was going really well. Then I watched the last quarter and allowing for a lack of supply and him having to ruck in the middle it looked like our selections/injuries etc really put a halt on his recent OK form. Perhaps Boyd plays v Nth.

[1eyedog]

Ta. I heard snippets n the radio and in a few plays it sounded like he was going really well. Then I watched the last quarter and allowing for a lack of supply and him having to ruck in the middle it looked like our selections/injuries etc really put a halt on his recent OK form. Perhaps Boyd plays v Nth.

I was being fairly sarcastic obviously which was borne out of frustration with him because while his leading patterns are ok and so is his timing he drops simple marks on a consistent basis and lets himself down. He works hard and attacks the contest but is prone to giving away free kicks. I think Tom will overtake him next year and with a glut of talented forwards on the list he'll be hard pressed finding a spot down there moving forward. I'll be very frustrated if Redpath plays again this year while Tom is playing at Footscray.

[Mofra]

I wonder if NN makes Bevo think twice about the importance of the ruck?
No, I still think Bevo believes rucks are very important as he's indicated all year, as has Dalrymple publically talking about chasing one.

[Stefcep]

Murphs handball
Bonts cross field kick
Kick in straight to Le Cras
Soft free to Nic Nat 15 meters from goal
Jongs set shot miss
At least two frees given away by our tall forward after the team busted a gut to get it to him.

We are talking a 4-7 goal turnaround GIFTED to West Coast, when the game was in the balance. OTOH we worked our guts out for every goal we scored. This not only hurts on the scoreboard, but kills the players mentally and shifts momentum.

I

[Eastdog]

No he didn't... Kicked a couple of goals, but otherwise was very poor.

I thought at times though he was ok. Is a good presence up forward. What about Crameri Mantis? Stringer was very good.

[1eyedog]

I thought at times though he was ok. Is a good presence up forward. What about Crameri Mantis? Stringer was very good.

Redpath was a witches hat for most of the game, an aggressive one sure, but a witches hat just the same.

What was he ok at?

[Mantis]

I thought at times though he was ok. Is a good presence up forward. What about Crameri Mantis? Stringer was very good.

Crameri looked sharp.. Lack of supply hurt.

[Eastdog]

Redpath was a witches hat for most of the game, an aggressive one sure, but a witches hat just the same.

What was he ok at?

As Mantis said kicking those couple of goals so he contributed s little. Stringer definitely was our best forward yesterday.

[Ozza]

Crameri looked sharp.. Lack of supply hurt.

His marking has been great for 5 or 6 weeks now. Grabbing more than his fair share of 50/50s or tough leading marks with a defender on his hammer.

[merantau]

I would persevere with Redpath. He has done enough in the past two weeks to get a game.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

I would persevere with Redpath. He has done enough in the past two weeks to get a game.

Redpath didn't measure up against tougher opposition. I wouldn't be surprised to see him dropped this week to allow Roughead to return. We are fortunate to have better forwards at the moment in Stringer Crameri and Dickson which has covered up for the lack of a genuine key forward.

[Eastdog]

Bonts? How did we rate his match. Try to get into it but didn't get in there enough.

[1eyedog]

As Mantis said kicking those couple of goals so he contributed s little. Stringer definitely was our best forward yesterday.

He also said he was poor. If we didn't have Tom Boyd at the club I'd be all for letting Redpath have a long, long run at it. But we've got Tom Boyd and I reckon he needs to come in because we play straighter with him there.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Didn't watch it as I was working, but that's quite a poor result in the end.

It certainly raises the question - can we only play our best footy at Etihad? I know we beat Sydney at the SCG and the Tigers at the MCG, but they're appearing to be exceptions given heavy losses to Hawks/Eagles and poor losses to Cats/Dees.

[Remi Moses]

I think like most young sides it will evolve that we play good footy everywhere.
Eade's teams of the mid 2000's were the same,but they were better away from Etihad in 08 onwards .

[bornadog]

Didn't watch it as I was working, but that's quite a poor result in the end.

It certainly raises the question - can we only play our best footy at Etihad? I know we beat Sydney at the SCG and the Tigers at the MCG, but they're appearing to be exceptions given heavy losses to Hawks/Eagles and poor losses to Cats/Dees.

We took the youngest team (average 59 games, compared to 97) for the whole of the AFL round, to Perth and played some amazing football in the first half. The ball was moving from one end to the other with amazing speed. The stupid commentators who think we should be bringing in rules to change the game, should watch a game like this (except the last quarter) .

Where we were beaten was Nic Nat ruck work to advantage and some poor skill errors executed under little pressure. We had little contribution from Jong, Grant, Smith, Dickson, Redpath and Dahl wasn't as influential as he has been, but some how Stringer and Crameri kept us in the game. Three injuries also didn't help out cause, so in the end the WC midfield got on top and we just ran out of puff in the last quarter.

The WC players are a little more mature and their forward press and general pressure stands up on a ground like Subi due to more preseasons in them and giving them an edge in fitness.

[1eyedog]

Didn't watch it as I was working, but that's quite a poor result in the end.

It certainly raises the question - can we only play our best footy at Etihad? I know we beat Sydney at the SCG and the Tigers at the MCG, but they're appearing to be exceptions given heavy losses to Hawks/Eagles and poor losses to Cats/Dees.

Obviously knocked over GC up there as well. We can win away from home and I thought we were in the match against Port over there until 3qt and against Geelong almost to the end.

[Stefcep]

We took the youngest team (average 59 games, compared to 97) for the whole of the AFL round, to Perth and played some amazing football in the first half. The ball was moving from one end to the other with amazing speed. The stupid commentators who think we should be bringing in rules to change the game, should watch a game like this (except the last quarter) .

Where we were beaten was Nic Nat ruck work to advantage and some poor skill errors executed under little pressure. We had little contribution from Jong, Grant, Smith, Dickson, Redpath and Dahl wasn't as influential as he has been, but some how Stringer and Crameri kept us in the game. Three injuries also didn't help out cause, so in the end the WC midfield got on top and we just ran out of puff in the last quarter.

The WC players are a little more mature and their forward press and general pressure stands up on a ground like Subi due to more preseasons in them and giving them an edge in fitness.


I didn't see the last quarter, and I agree with the bolded bit, but in reality what killed the game when it was still up for grabs were 4 goals we gifted to them (Murphy, Bont, the kick in to Le cras, and the soft free to Nic Nat). Then Jongs miss, plus some utter stupidity in giving frees away from one of our big forwards. All when we had momentum and threatened to get over the top of them.

The game is often won and lost on key moments. These were key moments.

The positive is that those sorts of mistake won't be repeated by those players probably for the rest of their careers.

[Ozza]

Would have been interesting to see how things may have panned out should Stringer get awarded the free against Hurn (when he got poleaxed)...and we get within (I think) 2 goals.

I know its a long bow....but a massive impact on the game when we had been right in it.

[Bulldog Joe]

Would have been interesting to see how things may have panned out should Stringer get awarded the free against Hurn (when he got poleaxed)...and we get within (I think) 2 goals.

I know its a long bow....but a massive impact on the game when we had been right in it.

also that unpaid free resulted in a rebound that gave West Coast an immediate goal.

There is effectively a 2 goal turnaround right there. We could have been very close at the last break, but we were never really going to win it.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

We took the youngest team (average 59 games, compared to 97) for the whole of the AFL round, to Perth and played some amazing football in the first half. The ball was moving from one end to the other with amazing speed. The stupid commentators who think we should be bringing in rules to change the game, should watch a game like this (except the last quarter).


Obviously knocked over GC up there as well. We can win away from home and I thought we were in the match against Port over there until 3qt and against Geelong almost to the end.

Some good responses. We are only young and I am sure we'll improve in this area as the years pass, but it still concerns me that away from Etihad we haven't been able to play our best footy.

Yes we got over GC in the last but play them at Etihad and I sincerely doubt the first 3 quarters happen. Play Geelong at Etihad and we simply wouldn't lose. We smashed Port at Etihad (who beat Hawks 2 weeks later at the same venue) but were seriously out run in Adelaide, as we were v WCE (when in round 1 we defeated them at Etihad).

Whilst I know there can be some reasoning (injuries etc), at this stage we certainly play our best and most consistent venue at our home ground and have not been able to sustain that anywhere else long enough. Something for the group to work on - we've still come a long way this year.

[Bulldog Joe]

Having attended the game and now returned and watched the replay (except last quarter), I definitely feel that the doom I have read is unjustified.

Realistically in quarter 3 we were right in the game. Pay the free to Stringer and goal and the margin would have been a mere 11 points and we were definitely posing a real threat to them. Even a conversion by Jong would have had them entering the last quarter really concerned about us.

This ignores about 5 goals we gifted to them with disposal errors.

We will be a better team if we meet them again with Roughead, Roberts, M Boyd and Picken included.

It has been a great year and there is much to look forward too.

[Sedat]

Some good responses. We are only young and I am sure we'll improve in this area as the years pass, but it still concerns me that away from Etihad we haven't been able to play our best footy.

Yes we got over GC in the last but play them at Etihad and I sincerely doubt the first 3 quarters happen. Play Geelong at Etihad and we simply wouldn't lose. We smashed Port at Etihad (who beat Hawks 2 weeks later at the same venue) but were seriously out run in Adelaide, as we were v WCE (when in round 1 we defeated them at Etihad).

Whilst I know there can be some reasoning (injuries etc), at this stage we certainly play our best and most consistent venue at our home ground and have not been able to sustain that anywhere else long enough. Something for the group to work on - we've still come a long way this year.
I'm not worried at all by the reliance we seem to have on Etihad this season (I wasn't expecting much from us at Etihad this season either), but if the trend continues in the next couple of years that would be a cause for concern. Would love to get a finals win at the MCG this season (if we are lucky enough to play there) just to dispel this trend. There's no reason why we can't from a structural and game style perspective.

[jeemak]

I'm not worried at all by the reliance we seem to have on Etihad this season (I wasn't expecting much from us at Etihad this season either), but if the trend continues in the next couple of years that would be a cause for concern. Would love to get a finals win at the MCG this season (if we are lucky enough to play there) just to dispel this trend. There's no reason why we can't from a structural and game style perspective.

The odd grounds we've struggled from a system perspective at have no resemblance to the MCG (aside from the Melbourne game). They are Adelaide Oval, Kardinia Park and Subiaco, all long and narrow grounds.

Etihad is a short and narrow ground that enables us to move the ball quickly, with long ball assisting our quick ball movement (making the lack of space a non-issue). On the long and narrow grounds it's easy for things to become congested, and without local knowledge you run out of space quickly unless you can kick the ball short along the lines (over the defence), or move diagonally forward through the centre which we haven't been able to do each time we've played them.

Games on the G won't present any issue for us IMO. It's the prefect size for modern footy. Wide and long.

[1eyedog]

The odd grounds we've struggled from a system perspective at have no resemblance to the MCG (aside from the Melbourne game). They are Adelaide Oval, Kardinia Park and Subiaco, all long and narrow grounds.

Etihad is a short and narrow ground that enables us to move the ball quickly, with long ball assisting our quick ball movement (making the lack of space a non-issue). On the long and narrow grounds it's easy for things to become congested, and without local knowledge you run out of space quickly unless you can kick the ball short along the lines (over the defence), or move diagonally forward through the centre which we haven't been able to do each time we've played them.

Games on the G won't present any issue for us IMO. It's the prefect size for modern footy. Wide and long.

I'm still baffled how a ground 10 metres longer and 2 metres narrower than our home ground can make such a difference to our structure and overall performance to be honest, but there you go.

[jeemak]

I'm still baffled how a ground 10 metres longer and 2 metres narrower than our home ground can make such a difference to our structure and overall performance to be honest, but there you go.

I always look at the distance between the point of the centre square and its closest point to the boundary. Docklands is very small in this area, and this is where it's short. It's just one kick in-board and then you're away.

Adelaide Oval, Subiaco and Kardinia have very straight boundary lines but as the 50m mark meets the boundary line it's quite wide, meaning you can find yourself congested with no more width to find if you go beyond 50-60m from defencive goal.

The G being almost a circle has huge amounts of space to move within if you hit the flanks. It's just that when you do, you're almost as many kicks away from goal as when you started from full back.

[1eyedog]

I always look at the distance between the point of the centre square and its closest point to the boundary. Docklands is very small in this area, and this is where it's short. It's just one kick in-board and then you're away.

Adelaide Oval, Subiaco and Kardinia have very straight boundary lines but as the 50m mark meets the boundary line it's quite wide, meaning you can find yourself congested with no more width to find if you go beyond 50-60m from defencive goal.

The G being almost a circle has huge amounts of space to move within if you hit the flanks. It's just that when you do, you're almost as many kicks away from goal as when you started from full back.

Thnaks for explaining it. I never considered it I just looked at the raw numbers and thought about how they affect the ability to score re. total distance rather than all the variables that go into moving the ball effectively and having the ability to find space and win the contest.

[jeemak]

Thnaks for explaining it. I never considered it I just looked at the raw numbers and thought about how they affect the ability to score re. total distance rather than all the variables that go into moving the ball effectively and having the ability to find space and win the contest.

For what it's worth, I think the original size and shape of VFL park would be perfect for the modern game and 18 players a side. Pretty hard to get a roof over a stadium that big though.

[mjp]

The margin in the West Coast game (at q-time, half time and 3q-time) flattered us. Yes, there was some exciting passages of play and we kicked a lot of goals, but WCE looked like scoring every time they went forward...at the ground the blow-out just felt inevitable.

Why our mids allowed west coast to get the ball outside the contest (almost from the start) was baffling. But without Picken and Boyd....

[bornadog]

The margin in the West Coast game (at q-time, half time and 3q-time) flattered us. Yes, there was some exciting passages of play and we kicked a lot of goals, but WCE looked like scoring every time they went forward...at the ground the blow-out just felt inevitable.

Why our mids allowed west coast to get the ball outside the contest (almost from the start) was baffling. But without Picken and Boyd....

Inexperienced in the midfield and they smashed us.

[Mitcha]

The margin in the West Coast game (at q-time, half time and 3q-time) flattered us. Yes, there was some exciting passages of play and we kicked a lot of goals, but WCE looked like scoring every time they went forward...at the ground the blow-out just felt inevitable.

Why our mids allowed west coast to get the ball outside the contest (almost from the start) was baffling. But without Picken and Boyd....
Could be argued we looked just as dangerous every time we got the footy forward of centre where Crameri and in particular Stringer were off the leash. Basically the only point of difference was Natanui who gave their mids an armchair ride and left our backs fighting a losing battle.

[mjp]

Inexperienced in the midfield and they smashed us.

Inexperienced is one thing but allowing the ball outside all the time? That isn't inexperienced - they would have/should have been prepared for what he was going to do and to allow the outside hit-zones to be continually used was just a bit silly.

I am happy with the argument about Kennedy and Darling = Stringer and Crameri...unfortunately that doesn't take into account the 13000 other goal-kickers West Coast had due to their sheer weight of forward entries. Hamling and Talia were beaten (and badly) by their opponents but where Hurn, Shepherd, Bennell, Yeo and co made a fair fist of defending 'everyone else' it was as if anyone who happened to wander into the WCE forward line was gifted a goal.

We have had an amazing year but the effort last week - and almost from the start - was pretty poor. We did not 'fight the fight' against the Eagles and that was very disappointing.

[LostDoggy]

Inexperienced is one thing but allowing the ball outside all the time? That isn't inexperienced - they would have/should have been prepared for what he was going to do and to allow the outside hit-zones to be continually used was just a bit silly.

I am happy with the argument about Kennedy and Darling = Stringer and Crameri...unfortunately that doesn't take into account the 13000 other goal-kickers West Coast had due to their sheer weight of forward entries. Hamling and Talia were beaten (and badly) by their opponents but where Hurn, Shepherd, Bennell, Yeo and co made a fair fist of defending 'everyone else' it was as if anyone who happened to wander into the WCE forward line was gifted a goal.

We have had an amazing year but the effort last week - and almost from the start - was pretty poor. We did not 'fight the fight' against the Eagles and that was very disappointing.

It felt like Eagles went forward with monotonous regularity last week, but they surprisingly only went inside 50 51 times (to 43) which is actually quite low for a winning team (10 teams went in more often last week).

Where we truly broke down was in the back 50, with 51 entries resulting in 37 scoring shots - a ratio of over 70%, the highest for any team in over 2 years.

Although last week was horrible, we only got smashed late after Campbell, Grant, Talia and Morris got injured during the game, also after we replaced 2 hard, experienced def/mids (Picken, Boyd) with kids.

Tellingly, our scores conceded per I50 was about average for 2 1/2 quarters, but late in the game we conceded score with almost every entry - with Morris off, Boyd not playing and Talia hurt (and seemingly devoid of confidence) our team defensive structure simply collapsed.

At the same time, our lack of a 1st Ruck gave NicNat free license to utterly control stoppages. Also, a lack of fit players on the bench resulted in a lack of rotations which will always lead to run suffering, especially late in the game.

No doubt it was a substandard performance, but I think there are reasons to excuse it as an aberration.