Grand Final 2015 - Hawks vs Eagles

[bulldogtragic]

I guess what we can take from this match up is our coach is working on the game game plan and style as the two grand finalists. And once we can get some maturity, games, experiences and an extra top liner or two we can too can get to the big dance. This was after all Simpson's second year coaching the system.

All done, I think Hawthorn could replicate the blood bath from last year.

[comrade]

Pleased to see these two fight it out. Would have been a travesty if North and their band of merry spuds made it into the big dance.

[LostDoggy]

Liked BTs call re: entertainment. Last time these 2 met in a GF it was Angry Anderson in the batmobile.

And a motorcade for people with nothing to do with footy whatsoever, including a speech by Rob De Castella channelling Borat.

Let it be so.

[Remi Moses]

Angry Anderson's got a reclaim Australia rally to attend

[LostDoggy]

Angry Anderson's got a reclaim Australia rally to attend

In the batmobile?? :)

[bornadog]

Angry Anderson's got a reclaim Australia rally to attend

For god sake, bloody bogan. The only people that have a legitimate right to reclaim Australia are the indigenous people.

[craigsahibee]

Anyone going this week?

I managed to secure 3 tickets to the Carlton Draught Front Bar at the MCG, where there is a possibility of winning tickets to the game. In my 40+ years of attending the VFL/AFL I have never been to a Grand Final. As a footy Socialist, I believe in the right for Club Members to be given every opportunity to attend and therefore have never actively sourced a ticket. However, I would love to experience the day just once before I have to go through the emotional torment of attending a GF that the Bulldogs are competing in. This year, hopefully is my last chance. Fingers crossed for the tickets.

[bornadog]

Anyone going this week?

I managed to secure 3 tickets to the Carlton Draught Front Bar at the MCG, where there is a possibility of winning tickets to the game. In my 40+ years of attending the VFL/AFL I have never been to a Grand Final. As a footy Socialist, I believe in the right for Club Members to be given every opportunity to attend and therefore have never actively sourced a ticket. However, I would love to experience the day just once before I have to go through the emotional torment of attending a GF that the Bulldogs are competing in. This year, hopefully is my last chance. Fingers crossed for the tickets.

I have been a few times over the years, but mainly through corporate invites. Even though it is the Grand Final, I just couldn't get excited on the day. However, it is a major sporting event, and good to experience as a sports lover.

[hujsh]

Anyone going this week?

I managed to secure 3 tickets to the Carlton Draught Front Bar at the MCG, where there is a possibility of winning tickets to the game. In my 40+ years of attending the VFL/AFL I have never been to a Grand Final. As a footy Socialist, I believe in the right for Club Members to be given every opportunity to attend and therefore have never actively sourced a ticket. However, I would love to experience the day just once before I have to go through the emotional torment of attending a GF that the Bulldogs are competing in. This year, hopefully is my last chance. Fingers crossed for the tickets.

Lucky enough to go the the 2010 GF because a family member had a spare. It was worth going to

[LostDoggy]

Never been, never will till the Dogs take part.

[Webby]

Never been, never will till the Dogs take part.

Yeah I'm the same.

[Maddog37]

Yeah I'm the same.


Me three.

[LostDoggy]

Like most, after the Prelims I was fairly bullish on the Hawks, but the more I think about the GF, the more I reckon if Eagles are within 4 goals at 1/2 time, they are a huge chance.

Hawks are pretty old and have had 3 trips to Perth in the past 6 weeks (2 of past 3).

Eagles are used to the travel, haven't left home for weeks and got the week off in week 2 of finals.

A big factor is the weather, with a warm 28 degree day currently forecast.

Also, when Hawthorn haven't dominated teams this year, they have really struggled to finish off in closer games.

If the Eagles are in touch at 1/2 time, I reckon they'll run all over Hawthorn.

[Greystache]

Have to say I care less about this grand final than most recently. WCE fans are a disgrace, but Hawthorn's are such smug, arrogant, bandwagoners that I can't be happy with either team being there let alone one of them winning.

It's like in the black and white days when Carlton and Essendon were competitive.

[LostDoggy]

Eagles are a big go! It's their time, hot day will sap whatever energy the Hawks have left after the travel they have had to do.

Kennedy at the peak of his powers will dominate and Carlton fans will struggle to keep lunch down. They were pretty flat last week so expect them to hit the Hawks from the start and if they do, could break their hearts early. If the Hawks were to get up it would have to be the hardest path ever to take and some will have won it 4 times so I just can't take them on the spoilt factor alone.

Anyway I considered us a very good side this year and won't forget how the Eagles tore us apart so any team who can smash us by a 100 has to be the winner. I would have loved a crack at the Hawks couple of weeks back we would've pushed them and because Freo were the weak link and anything could've happened had we made it.

For me the over 39.5 at $9.50 is a big go!

[Axe Man]

Liked BTs call re: entertainment. Last time these 2 met in a GF it was Angry Anderson in the batmobile.

And a motorcade for people with nothing to do with footy whatsoever, including a speech by Rob De Castella channelling Borat.

Let it be so.

And guess what arrived at the MCG today:

http://s15.postimg.org/h3mqsncyz/12049683_527194594112093_2701295512035226221_n_j.jpg (http://postimage.org/)

[bornadog]

Caleb to represent the Dogs in half time sprint.

Also, Stringer in long kicking challenge at 10am to kick the ball over the yarra river.

[bornadog]

Hawthorn
IN: Jack Gunston
OUT: Billy Hartung


West Coast
No Change

[Twodogs]

I was at the 1982 Grand Final and the 2000 Grand Final. Got given tickets to both otherwise I wouldn't have bothered. Next time I go the dogs will be playing and Stringer will win the Norm Smith.

[Bulldog Joe]

Have Hawthorn reduced their chances at selection.

Gunston is likely underdone, but they have gone for 1 less runner.
Won't help them finish the game off in the heat.

[Twodogs]

Hawthorn have had 3 trips to Perth in 5 weeks including 2 in the last 3. While West Coast have sat at home picking teams off. They might really need that extra runner

[1eyedog]

As I move through the years and my team isn't in the Grand Final my interest in it wanes and wanes. I can barely raise an eyebrow this time around.

Maybe I'm just becoming a grumpy old so and so.

[Sedat]

Have Hawthorn reduced their chances at selection.

Gunston is likely underdone, but they have gone for 1 less runner.
Won't help them finish the game off in the heat.
Gunston is an elite runner himself and would be far more dangerous for West Coke to cover. Also I don't think his missing 2 weeks will hurt his fitness base - if anything he should be well rested and running on top of the ground compared to everyone else.

[AndrewP6]

Wake me up when the new season arrives. State pride says I want Hawthorn to win it, but I really couldn't care less.

[LostDoggy]

Gunston is an elite runner himself and would be far more dangerous for West Coke to cover. Also I don't think his missing 2 weeks will hurt his fitness base - if anything he should be well rested and running on top of the ground compared to everyone else.

No question Gunston comes in when fit. The question is whether Hartung was the right player to drop. Given run could be an issue, maybe their were better candidates.

[jeemak]

I went to all GF's between 1993-1999, and again in 2011 and 2014. It's a great day to experience, though having said all that, I don't know how it would feel if the Dogs were playing and I was there on the day. Dare I say it, almost out of place is the immediate thing that springs to mind.

There's no winners out of today's game as far as I'm concerned. You have two clubs with supporters who are up their own arses completely.

[bulldogtragic]

Gee the Hawks must be happy with the Lake trade. He's been vital already today, with a solid game last year and Normie the year before.

[bulldogtragic]

Bad kicking is bad footy. Must be all sorts of pain for WCE supporters to know their problem and game position is their own fault.

[whythelongface]

Far our Hawthorn are bloody good.

[chef]

Game over. What a team the Hawkers are.

[jeemak]

I could have won the Norm Smith playing Lake's position in 2013 such was the way Fremantle pinpointed every forward movement to him.

He's the perfect player to have sitting across the back of an excellent team defence though, not many have read the high ball better than him and I agree, it's been a very productive partnership.

Eagles have been about as hard as a poo sandwich since about the ten minute mark. Hawthorn's kicking accuracy has been something to behold.

[bulldogtragic]

Port Adelaides team from 2007 hoping this continues. Ouch.

[1eyedog]

I guess this is good for Hawks supporters but no one else.

[jeemak]

Shuey's non handball to an open player running into goal in the first quarter. The non-50m penalty against Hodge who held the ball after a free kick for a good five seconds too long and then on the return left if metres short of the WCE player who missed are both instances that resulted in swings to the Hawks after they moved the ball forward and scored.

The WCE players are playing a little timid, not one of them has tried to assert their presence on the field and they've kicked at goal wastefully.

The Hawks on the other hand have been ruthlessly efficient, and haven't had to play hard for the most part. It's been a really lacklustre GF from a physicality perspective.

[bornadog]

So far this is very boring. WCoast are making too many skill errors, whereas Hawks hit targets.

[chef]

Cab drivers in the sprint, thats just crap.

[F'scary]

Cab drivers in the sprint, thats just crap.

they'd win if an Uber driver was used as the rabbit.

[jeemak]

Shuey's been a real prick of a team mate in the forward 50 today.

[bornadog]

Watching this game in HD on 7mate and listening on 774 with digital radio, delay only about a second or two

[bulldogtragic]

All over.

[Eastdog]

I guess this is good for Hawks supporters but no one else.

Yep that's right. Getting a bit sick of them now to be honest.

[bornadog]

Rubbish GF

Eagles Pathetic

[comrade]

Eagles just bottled it today. Real shame.

Hawks with winners all over the park.

[bulldogtragic]

Rubbish GF

Eagles Pathetic

Two rubbish GFs in a row now.

[bornadog]

Two rubbish GFs in a row now.

Worse GF I have watched

[Eastdog]

Worse GF I have watched

Yep it's been boring.

[jeemak]

It seems being great at setting up on a narrow ground but not much else is something not only the Dogs are known for.

WCE have been smashed from a structural perspective today.

[AndrewP6]

Josh Hill in a summary of his career. Floats on to a cheapie, and buggers up the easiest goal.

[bornadog]

It seems being great at setting up on a narrow ground but not much else is something not only the Dogs are known for.

WCE have been smashed from a structural perspective today.

Don't agree with the Dogs comment.

[jeemak]

Don't agree with the Dogs comment.

Sure we beat a lacklustre Richmond early in the year at the G, but the subsequent times we had to set up on that ground we didn't do it very well and were easily scored against.

Which part of that don't you agree with?

[bornadog]

Sure we beat a lacklustre Richmond early in the year at the G, but the subsequent times we had to set up on that ground we didn't do it very well and were easily scored against.

Which part of that don't you agree with?

If , If, we got those set shots and won, what would you say then? 7 points in that game, so could easily have gone the other way

[jeemak]

If , If, we got those set shots and won, what would you say then? 7 points in that game, so could easily have gone the other way

I'd say that I was happy to have won, but we didn't set up well and we were lucky it didn't hurt us more than it did.

As it happened, we didn't set up well and we enabled our opposition to get behind us and score from easy opportunities and we lost the game.

I don't see what the problem is.

[bornadog]

I'd say that I was happy to have won, but we didn't set up well and we were lucky it didn't hurt us more than it did.

As it happened, we didn't set up well and we enabled our opposition to get behind us and score from easy opportunities and we lost the game.

I don't see what the problem is.

Not a problem at all. When we lose, it's natural we pick the negatives. Perhaps we did that most of the season, but I don't believe it was because of the shape of the MCG.

[chef]

Yep. Nothing to do with the shape of the ground, we just fluffed our kicking for goal.

[jeemak]

So are you suggesting that setting up at the MCG and constricting space is just as easy as it is at narrower grounds like Subi and Docklands?

What about my original comment was it that you disagree with then? I don't get it.

Was it the way it was worded, in that I gave the impression that I think setting up at Docklands is the only thing we do well?

[jeemak]

Yep. Nothing to do with the shape of the ground, we just fluffed our kicking for goal.

Are you serious in saying that was the only thing we did fundamentally wrong on the day?

[bornadog]

Was it the way it was worded, in that I gave the impression that I think setting up at Docklands is the only thing we do well?

Yes.

[jeemak]

Yes.

I see.

Well if you openly retract your comments and I edit my post in a certain way to make it look like you were completely in the wrong then I think we can move on.

[chef]

Are you serious in saying that was the only thing we did fundamentally wrong on the day?

Did i say that was the only thing we did wrong?

That was what cost us the win though, we didn't play 'great' that night but had more than enough shots from good positions but couldn't put them through the middle. I don't think the shape of the ground played that much of a part.

[jeemak]

Did i say that was the only thing we did wrong?

That was what cost us the win though, we didn't play 'great' that night but had more than enough shots from good positions but couldn't put them through the middle. I don't think the shape of the ground played that much of a part.

Well, yes, essentially you're saying it was goal kicking that cost us the match. I'm saying our inability to defend on the wide expanses of the MCG was just as much of a factor.

[chef]

Well, yes, essentially you're saying it was goal kicking that cost us the match. I'm saying our inability to defend on the wide expanses of the MCG was just as much of a factor.

And that's fair enough, I'm sure we all have different opinions on what cost us the most. To me it was not putting away the goals we should be kicking if we want to be a quality side(we nail those and the other areas we were not great in wouldn't have mattered in reguards to the result), and I agree we were pretty loose defensively too.

[Bulldog4life]

Well, yes, essentially you're saying it was goal kicking that cost us the match. I'm saying our inability to defend on the wide expanses of the MCG was just as much of a factor.

Simple terms we would have won at Etihad

[jeemak]

Simple terms we would have won at Etihad

Perhaps we would have, but it wouldn't have helped us a great deal in setting up the following week against the Hawks.

I guess what I'm saying is there's basic fundamentals that you need to get right when entering a game, and that two of the most important ones include the set up across the ground and the system you use as the basis for moving the ball from defence to attack.

For the Eagles they royally screwed up both of those aspects of their game today. We got one of them wrong on the day in the EF this year and we paid the price for it. Yes, converting opportunities is definitely one as well.

[LostDoggy]

Gee, even MY accuracy must be waning, because I was reading the GF Hawks vs Eagles thread and accidentally found myself instead on the EF Dogs vs Crows.


Never been, never will till the Dogs take part.


Me three.

Likewise. When we make it, the fact it'll be my first time at the GF will only enhance the experience, I reckon. I can wait.


Two rubbish GFs in a row now.

And equalisation is working.

[F'scary]

Well, yes, essentially you're saying it was goal kicking that cost us the match. I'm saying our inability to defend on the wide expanses of the MCG was just as much of a factor.

I agree with jeemak.

[jazzadogs]

Gee, even MY accuracy must be waning, because I was reading the GF Hawks vs Eagles thread and accidentally found myself instead on the EF Dogs vs Crows.

Likewise. When we make it, the fact it'll be my first time at the GF will only enhance the experience, I reckon. I can wait.

And equalisation is working.

I just can't wait until GWS make a GF, the atmosphere will be electric!!

What are thoughts on the Norm Smith? I knew Cyril would get it but can't cop that he was better than Frawley, Mitchell or even Isaac Smith. He's been a good player for a while now but to think he will be a 4 time premiership winner, Norm Smith medallist, multiple AA...he's still overrated in my book.

[jeemak]

I agree with jeemak.

It's been a long road on which you and I have finally come to this conclusion. I am now happy.

[jeemak]

I just can't wait until GWS make a GF, the atmosphere will be electric!!

What are thoughts on the Norm Smith? I knew Cyril would get it but can't cop that he was better than Frawley, Mitchell or even Isaac Smith. He's been a good player for a while now but to think he will be a 4 time premiership winner, Norm Smith medallist, multiple AA...he's still overrated in my book.

I find it hard to go past Gunston or Rioli, they made the most of their opportunities as forwards which is the hardest thing to do in a final however, there was plenty happening in the middle that won Hawthorn the game.

I'd be inclined to give it to the forwards this time around because it was the most bruise free GF I've ever watched. It was a real pussy fest for the most part, and as such the midfielders kind of got a free pass because of it.

[Topdog]

I just can't wait until GWS make a GF, the atmosphere will be electric!!

What are thoughts on the Norm Smith? I knew Cyril would get it but can't cop that he was better than Frawley, Mitchell or even Isaac Smith. He's been a good player for a while now but to think he will be a 4 time premiership winner, Norm Smith medallist, multiple AA...he's still overrated in my book.

Thought he deserved it. Was brilliant when the game was on the line.

You could have given it to 10 Hawks today and made a case for it being deserved.

[jazzadogs]

I find it hard to go past Gunston or Rioli, they made the most of their opportunities as forwards which is the hardest thing to do in a final however, there was plenty happening in the middle that won Hawthorn the game.

I'd be inclined to give it to the forwards this time around because it was the most bruise free GF I've ever watched. It was a real pussy fest for the most part, and as such the midfielders kind of got a free pass because of it.


Thought he deserved it. Was brilliant when the game was on the line.

You could have given it to 10 Hawks today and made a case for it being deserved.

To be fair I am very anti-everybody-loving-every-single-thing-Cyril-does. But I just didn't really notice him that much? He kicked a snap under little pressure, then a set shot, and had a good intercept in the middle which set up a goal. 18 touches and 2 goals does not a BOG make.

[Topdog]

To be fair I am very anti-everybody-loving-every-single-thing-Cyril-does. But I just didn't really notice him that much? He kicked a snap under little pressure, then a set shot, and had a good intercept in the middle which set up a goal. 18 touches and 2 goals does not a BOG make.

As am I. 18 touches, 2 goals, 11 score involvements.

[bulldogtragic]

To be fair I am very anti-everybody-loving-every-single-thing-Cyril-does. But I just didn't really notice him that much? He kicked a snap under little pressure, then a set shot, and had a good intercept in the middle which set up a goal. 18 touches and 2 goals does not a BOG make.

Yep, exhibit A:

Hodge: 30 touches (80% DE), 8 marks, 7 inside 50's, 4 clearances, 3 tackles, 2 rebound 50's, 1.1
Smith: 23 touches, 5 inside 50's, 3.0
Mitchell: 34 touches, 6 clearances, 0.1
Gunston: 17 touches, 10 marks, 4.2

[Twodogs]

I also dislike the Cyril bandwagon led by Bruce. But Cyril was one of the few who performed memorable acts and played well Brian Lake and Luke Hodge have already got one.

[Sedat]

I'm in awe of Clarkson and this Hawthorn team. Their players can play in multiple positions, they can hit up targets, they make smart decisions with and without the ball, they defend exceptionally well as a team, they attack with speed and precision.

Clarkson has basically won 4 flags with 3 different game plans, after taking over an aging rabble of a playing list. He is by far the best coach in the competition and the best coach in the last 30 years IMO.

Cyril was very good early when it mattered but I thought Smith and Lake were better.

[aker39]

Had the privilege of being on the ground in the centre circle as the players were presented with the medals. Then had the players in the umpires rooms with us before they went back on the the ground at 7.30pm to be presented to the crowd.
I took a photo with Brian and told him he'd clearly made the right decision.

Great day, but very jealous of the Hawks supporters.

[Webby]

I'm in awe of Clarkson and this Hawthorn team. Their players can play in multiple positions, they can hit up targets, they make smart decisions with and without the ball, they defend exceptionally well as a team, they attack with speed and precision.

Clarkson has basically won 4 flags with 3 different game plans, after taking over an aging rabble of a playing list. He is by far the best coach in the competition and the best coach in the last 30 years IMO.

Cyril was very good early when it mattered but I thought Smith and Lake were better.

Sorry, but aging rabble of a playing list is an overreach!.... not that i disagree that it's a mighty effort..

[boydogs]

Rioli was in everything in the first half. He's like a cat the way he can compete in the air then land on his feet, dodge an opponent and get a clean kick away

[Sedat]

Sorry, but aging rabble of a playing list is an overreach!.... not that i disagree that it's a mighty effort..
Hawthorn in 2004 were an aging rabble. Their list was woeful at the time. As soon as Clarkson came on board, they nailed some key drafts, off-loaded some overpaid veterans (Hay, Thompson) and the rest is history. Sounds a bit like what we did in 2014 ;)

[bulldogtragic]

Hawthorn in 2004 were an aging rabble. Their list was woeful at the time. As soon as Clarkson came on board, they nailed some key drafts, off-loaded some overpaid veterans (Hay, Thompson) and the rest is history. Sounds a bit like what we did in 2014 ;)

And think of the players drafted who left: Hay and Thompson, in their prime as you say, plus, Rawlings, Buddy, Ellis, Savage, Young (in his prime), Kennedy, McGlyn, Williams (in his prime), and others.

1. Imagine what th could be a few of them still there...
2. They nailed a lot of top draft selections and top trades is losing those players. There's no consistently bad run ie. Walsh, Power, Williams, pick 6 and PSD 1 on Rawlings, pick 17 on Koops (D. Mundy), massive overs on Street, A. Cordy, Howard.

Gotta hope we keep up the good run at the draft and trade.

[comrade]

I think West Coast improve after this. They were clearly overwhelmed by the occasion - some of their missed tackles and disposals were just woeful.

Now they've got it out of their system, I can see them pressing again next year.

In fact, if we make a GF, I kind of expect us to perform like WC did yesterday, especially if we come up against a team like Hawthorn or Sydney. You almost need to lose one, get close to the summit, before you can actually get to the top.

[Dancin' Douggy]

If Hawthorn win ANOTHER flag in my lifetime I'll spew up.

[Ghost Dog]

I think West Coast improve after this. They were clearly overwhelmed by the occasion - some of their missed tackles and disposals were just woeful.

Now they've got it out of their system, I can see them pressing again next year.

In fact, if we make a GF, I kind of expect us to perform like WC did yesterday, especially if we come up against a team like Hawthorn or Sydney. You almost need to lose one, get close to the summit, before you can actually get to the top.

Yeah I was watching the gutted WC fans and thinking the same thing. It was probably how we would have gone V Hawks, had we snuck in.
However, they have a few downhill skiers in their list. I've always thought Josh Hill was suspect in some key areas, ( Hangs his head far too easily ) Sharrod Wellingham also. To win a Granny, need all hands on deck.

[westdog54]

And think of the players drafted who left: Hay and Thompson, in their prime as you say, plus, Rawlings, Buddy, Ellis, Savage, Young (in his prime), Kennedy, McGlyn, Williams (in his prime), and others.

1. Imagine what th could be a few of them still there...
2. They nailed a lot of top draft selections and top trades is losing those players. There's no consistently bad run ie. Walsh, Power, Williams, pick 6 and PSD 1 on Rawlings, pick 17 on Koops (D. Mundy), massive overs on Street, A. Cordy, Howard.

Gotta hope we keep up the good run at the draft and trade.

It would be simplistic in the extreme to make some quip here about equalisation, but Hawthorn have made every right decision possible in a purely football sense, starting with getting Al Clarkson as coach. They've Recruited well, managed well and maintained stability within the club.

[bulldogtragic]

It would be simplistic in the extreme to make some quip here about equalisation, but Hawthorn have made every right decision possible in a purely football sense, starting with getting Al Clarkson as coach. They've Recruited well, managed well and maintained stability within the club.

We head hunter Eade and by the time Hawthorn were up with the fact a Hawthorn hero was heading to us, they took more time and they picked Clarko. It would be very interesting to know if the roles were reversed and Eade went back 'home' to Hawthorn whether

A) We would've replaced Cheap as Chips with another untried coach in Clarko
B) If we did select Clarko, what he would've done with the list
C) Whether he would be as successful a coach with us

[Ghost Dog]

Had the privilege of being in the centre circle as the players were presented with the medals. Then had the players in the umpires rooms with us before they went back on the the ground at 7.30pm to be presented to the crowd.
I took a photo with Brian and told him he'd clearly made the right decision.

Great day, but very jealous of the Hawks supporters.

I wore my Bulldogs T-Shirt with pride yesterday. So many people saying how much they enjoy watching us play.
They won't enjoy it as much when we pummel them. Hawks have made a good blueprint, and only better than that will beat them.
Eagles I felt didn't show enough heart. You have to stay in the game, and sometimes luck can go your way.

[LostDoggy]

I'm in awe of Clarkson and this Hawthorn team. Their players can play in multiple positions, they can hit up targets, they make smart decisions with and without the ball, they defend exceptionally well as a team, they attack with speed and precision.

Clarkson has basically won 4 flags with 3 different game plans, after taking over an aging rabble of a playing list. He is by far the best coach in the competition and the best coach in the last 30 years IMO.

Cyril was very good early when it mattered but I thought Smith and Lake were better.

Clarkson will end up with a medal named after him. Destined for Legend status one day. At least if they build a statue they'll save money on the bronze.

I thought Cyril deserved the Norm Smith. Yes, other players cut the Eagles to pieces, but it was Cyril setting up and winning the match in the first quarter that piled on all that scoreboard pressure and allowed his team mates to dine out.

Overrated? Perhaps. Perhaps not. But if he came west we'd grovel at his feet.

Now they have the three peat they'll be going all out to hit up four in a row and really join the immortals. When they do fall they'll hit the deck fairly hard. Bulldogs to do a 2004 Port Adelaide, I hope.

[Webby]

Hawthorn in 2004 were an aging rabble. Their list was woeful at the time. As soon as Clarkson came on board, they nailed some key drafts, off-loaded some overpaid veterans (Hay, Thompson) and the rest is history. Sounds a bit like what we did in 2014 ;)

Hawthorn had undergone a couple of years of concerted rebuilding prior to Clarkson's arrival. Peter Schwabb had a very ordinary list - one that was not so much a rabble as just simply heading nowhere. The were mid table nothing's. No direction and heading nowhere. They began sorting that out in 2003 and Clarkson had a pretty healthy young list of players under the age of 22 when he coached his first game in 2005. Admittedly they weren't quite ready as yet, but he had a 22yo Sam Mitchell, Hodge (pick 1), Roughead (pick 2), Lewis (pick 6), Franklin (pick 4) to accompany Shane Crawford with 4 seasons left in him. Hawthorn's recruiting was exceptional from 2003 onwards and their list was acknowledged as having some gun young talent and big upside when he took the job.

I'd consider an ageing rabble more akin to the 2015 Carlton list! Hawthorn of 2005 were more akin to the 2015 Doggies list... Certainly not a ageing list. Clarkson deserves the credit he's getting, but Hawthorn's recruiting staff have looked after him extremely well. And their work commenced in 2002. So here's hoping he Dogs are following suit! :)

[1eyedog]

Yeah I was watching the gutted WC fans and thinking the same thing. It was probably how we would have gone V Hawks, had we snuck in.
However, they have a few downhill skiers in their list. I've always thought Josh Hill was suspect in some key areas, ( Hangs his head far too easily ) Sharrod Wellingham also. To win a Granny, need all hands on deck.

Wellingham was far from their worst and had at least the will to attack the ball on Saturday. He's a nice player.

[jeemak]

I'd love Wellingham in our side.

[Ghost Dog]

Wellingham was far from their worst and had at least the will to attack the ball on Saturday. He's a nice player.

Had a very ordinary day.

[bornadog]

Admittedly they weren't quite ready as yet, but he had a 22yo Sam Mitchell, Hodge (pick 1), Roughead (pick 2), Lewis (pick 6), Franklin (pick 4) to accompany Shane Crawford with 4 seasons left in him. Hawthorn's recruiting was exceptional from 2003 onwards and their list was acknowledged as having some gun young talent and big upside when he took the job.

The draft system works if you do it right.

[LostDoggy]

Wellingham was far from their worst and had at least the will to attack the ball on Saturday. He's a nice player.

That contest he hit at top speed in the first quarter was brilliant.