Gold Coast Suns appear as 2016 Draft Powerhouse

[bulldogtragic]

Some media folk are reporting that Prestia has unofficially/officially committed to Richmond. Assuming that's for pick 6 this year and a player or pick next year. Leaving aside any other trades they might do, adding in pick 6 gives them:

4, 6, 9, 21, 22, 25, 28, 32, 34 & 40 (indicative draft order on afl.com.au)

I think there's going to be a lot of clubs looking get involved with them, especially with likely academy players needing points etc. They were apparently after Jong last year, I think I'd let Jong look at their facilities and maybe others to try and get involved. Could we trade up into the top 10 by playing with a player and picks? Could we get a little bit of overs in player value seeing as they can't recruit another 10 kids to play with a lame Ablett.

That's a serious amount of big chips at the table come draft night (or trade weeks).

[Greystache]

Hopefully they don't replace Scott Clayton before the draft, otherwise they could build a decent list with all those picks.

[bulldogtragic]

Hopefully they don't replace Scott Clayton before the draft, otherwise they could build a decent list with all those picks.

They'll take all the wirey flankers though, then who will we invest years into for no return?

[westdog54]

If they were interested in someone like Stevens or Hrovat we could trade up a couple of our 3 fourth rounders so that we have some currency in the bank in the event that we're forced to trade for Hurley.

[bornadog]

Prestia has not confirmed either way what he is doing. All pure speculation at the moment.

[bulldogtragic]

Prestia has not confirmed either way what he is doing. All pure speculation at the moment.

He's only pick 6 in the above 10 picks inside 40. Another top 10 pick makes them everyone's friend at school.

[jazzadogs]

Let's say we have to trade for Hurley, and our first pick roughly pick 11. If we were able to trade someone for a second round pick, then package it up to GC with our original 2nd round pick (say 25 and 29) for their pick 9. If we have to trade for Hurley this then gives us the ability to give up a first round pick (9) but still have our original first round pick (11).

There's no way Essendon would take 25 and 29 for Hurley, but the points system has created a new marketplace and we should be preparing to take advantage of it.

[jeemak]

Hopefully they don't replace Scott Clayton before the draft, otherwise they could build a decent list with all those picks.

Snigger snigger :)

[Remi Moses]

Some more malnourished types for Scotty to recruit

[azabob]

Prestia has not confirmed either way what he is doing. All pure speculation at the moment.

How do you know? Anyhow why would he join Richmond?

[bornadog]

How do you know? Anyhow why would he join Richmond?

What I have been told, whether true or not is another matter.

[Axe Man]

I reckon the Prestia talk is coming straight from Richmond themselves in an effort to deflect some attention away from Hardwick and their abysmal season. Remember Treloar was a sure thing to go there about this time last year as well...

[bulldogtragic]

To the OP about the GCS, what's the best way to deal with them? Aiming to trade into the top 10? Doing like last year and giving up our first rounder for picks 21 & 22, sequential picks Dalrymple likes a lot so he says. Trading mature bodied players to them as they simply can't draft 10 more kids.

[Mofra]

How do you know? Anyhow why would he join Richmond?
$$$$$

They'll have cap space and plenty of it after their "end of season review"

[bornadog]

I reckon the Prestia talk is coming straight from Richmond themselves in an effort to deflect some attention away from Hardwick and their abysmal season. Remember Treloar was a sure thing to go there about this time last year as well...

Treloar was right about the better list.

[bulldogtragic]

Apparently big, big offers coming from some Victorian clubs for Jaeger as well. GCS could even dominate the top 10 if JO & Prestia do leave.

[LostDoggy]

4, 6, 9, 21, 22, 25, 28, 32, 34 & 40 (indicative draft order on afl.com.au)
Could someone please enlighten me on how the hell did they get all those picks :mad:

[Axe Man]

Could someone please enlighten me on how the hell did they get all those picks :mad:

Mostly through exchanging of picks in last years trade period. Eg. they traded picks 3, 10 & 43 to Melbourne in exchange for picks 6, 29 and Melbourne's first pick in 2016. They also picked one up in the Charlie Dixon trade.

[jazzadogs]

Mostly through exchanging of picks in last years trade period. Eg. they traded picks 3, 10 & 43 to Melbourne in exchange for picks 6, 29 and Melbourne's first pick in 2016. They also picked one up in the Charlie Dixon trade.

And Harley Bennell?

[bornadog]

And Harley Bennell?

Yes, the Dockers gave up picks 16 and 35 and gained pick 22 from the Suns

[Axe Man]

And Harley Bennell?


Yes, the Dockers gave up picks 16 and 35 and gained pick 22 from the Suns

Yes but not relevant to the 2016 draft, there were no future picks involved.

[bornadog]

Yes but not relevant to the 2016 draft, there were no future picks involved.

Yes correct - thanks

[bulldogtragic]

4, 6, 9, 21, 22, 25, 28, 32, 34 & 40 (indicative draft order on afl.com.au)

Now add in at least one first rounder for Jaeger on top of this, possibly two. They could have 4 picks inside 10, 6 first rounders & 8 picks inside 28.

They need mature hardened players ASAP. Apart from an expected monster offer to Fyffe, I wonder if they still rate Jong very highly and rate the likes of Koby Stevens (or Honeychurch) highly. GCS might offer the best value for a trading partner this year. Best we give them a call.

[chef]

Bit of a worry with Clayton using them.

[bulldogtragic]

Bit of a worry with Clayton using them.

Not for us!

[hujsh]

Bit of a worry with Clayton using them.


Not for us!

Yeah, sounds perfect

[Greystache]

Bit of a worry with Clayton using them.

Also a concern for any team who were chasing skinny flankers with questionable attitudes.

[bulldogtragic]

Pick 4
Pick 6 (Prestia)
Pick 8 (traded for last year)
Pick 14 (Jaeger)
Pick 21
Pick 22
Pick 24
Pick 27
Pick 40 (which they may not even use)

Rumours or offers last year came from GCS for Jong & Hrovat. With Honeychurch possibly looking for more opportunities and GCS stating they need players and not picks, I hope we (JMac) are trying to be their best buds now with uncontracted players or players looking for more opportunities.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Personally I think Clayton has done a wonderful job in burying Gold Coast.

Can we petition for him to move to GWS too?

[bornadog]

Personally I think Clayton has done a wonderful job in burying Gold Coast.

Can we petition for him to move to GWS too?

I think you can attribute most of GC problems to original setup, original coach and the bad culture created.

[chef]

And the players they chose.

[jazzadogs]

And the players they chose.

Pretty sure I saw an article the other day about Pearce Hanley potentially moving to GC. Just what they need.

[chef]

Pretty sure I saw an article the other day about Pearce Hanley potentially moving to GC. Just what they need.

Sounds like Brissie are pretty happy for him to go too.

[GVGjr]

I think you can attribute most of GC problems to original setup, original coach and the bad culture created.

So Scotty gets a big tick?

They are going backwards quickly.

[Ozza]

A brand new franchise with dozens of draft picks...it has just been an amazing opportunity for Scott Clayton to really expand on his history of drafting light bodied, outside, project players.

I'd swim to the other side of port Phillip bay if he couldn't find a few more this season.

[Sedat]

I think you can attribute most of GC problems to original setup, original coach and the bad culture created.
Scott Clayton was there from day 1 - he cannot be exempt from criticism with regard to the original set-up. In fact, from a list composition perspective, he is by far the most culpable and a massive factor in their current state. Some of his decisions have been pure idiocy - have a look at the uncontracted AFL players he brought to the club. Fraser, Brennan, Krakouer, Bock, Brown were all unmitigated disasters.

[Mofra]

Scott Clayton was there from day 1 - he cannot be exempt from criticism with regard to the original set-up. In fact, from a list composition perspective, he is by far the most culpable and a massive factor in their current state. Some of his decisions have been pure idiocy - have a look at the uncontracted AFL players he brought to the club. Fraser, Brennan, Krakouer, Bock, Brown were all unmitigated disasters.
Wasn't it Clayton who wanted to throw a chequebook at Minson and got shouted down?

He gets a tick there although I think he favours light-bodied outside types far too much at the draft table.

[bornadog]

Scott Clayton was there from day 1 - he cannot be exempt from criticism with regard to the original set-up. In fact, from a list composition perspective, he is by far the most culpable and a massive factor in their current state. Some of his decisions have been pure idiocy - have a look at the uncontracted AFL players he brought to the club. Fraser, Brennan, Krakouer, Bock, Brown were all unmitigated disasters.

Agree he must also be part of the blame, but there are many other factors like development of players, club culture etc. No doubt Clayton also picked some very good players over the years.

[Twodogs]

Scott Clayton was there from day 1 - he cannot be exempt from criticism with regard to the original set-up. In fact, from a list composition perspective, he is by far the most culpable and a massive factor in their current state. Some of his decisions have been pure idiocy - have a look at the uncontracted AFL players he brought to the club. Fraser, Brennan, Krakouer, Bock, Brown were all unmitigated disasters.


100% correct.

[soupman]

I did a post on this a while back. I believe it showed that Clayton had actually drafted pretty well, where Gold Coast failed was:

-The mature age recruits they grabbed had little upside, longevity and failed to define the culture of the club as a strength. The only one who was a proven winner and could lift the side was Ablett and he is the quiet type anyway. Compare this to GWS who recruited players that either had a lot of upside still in their game, had experience in good sides and managed to breed a culture of confidence/arrogance that is a natural fit with their highly talented group.

-They failed to develop their high picks for a variety of reasons. Some attitudinal, like Bennel, others have been hampered by injury, like Swallow, others have a had a combo, like Dixon. They've probably had less out and out misses with high draft picks like GWS have (O'Rourke, Plowman, Marchbank, Jaksch etc.) but they've also failed to develop the really good ones into elite or outstanding players. Lynch is probably the only one that has really come on.

-They have gotten no value for the players they've lost. When GC trade their players, it is very rarely for similar value to what they recruited them for. Bennell has turned from pick 2 into pick 17, Dixon similiar etc. This means their return on investment from these players has been poor, especially considering the outlay on them at the start. O'Meara looms as another addition to this category if he goes to Hawthorn.

-They're a shambles off field. Shit coaches, shit gameplans, shit leaders, shit town to develop players in, far from home for most amplifying the homesick factor, and unlike GWS who drafted heaps of players from the same squads meaning they instantly had mates at the club GC has struggled to create that tight knit group of players.

Clayton is largely responsible for the first point, maybe partly for the third, but aside from that he has drafted fairly well when considering what else was available to him. By all means criticise him, I certainly don't want him back, but he's been unlucky in some regards and let down by the club environment in others.

[GVGjr]

I did a post on this a while back. I believe it showed that Clayton had actually drafted pretty well, where Gold Coast failed was:



There is no denying that Clayton and his team have drafted good players but they also had a number of early picks which helps them enormously. Too many of them though have fallen well short of being good citizens which I think is his biggest weakness.

They've got rid of one coach and given they have gone backwards again I'm amazed there has been no change with their recruitment set-up. Does it fall all on Rocket if they don't improve next season?

[bornadog]

There is no denying that Clayton and his team have drafted good players but they also had a number of early picks which helps them enormously. Too many of them though have fallen well short of being good citizens which I think is his biggest weakness.

They've got rid of one coach and given they have gone backwards again I'm amazed there has been no change with their recruitment set-up. Does it fall all on Rocket if they don't improve next season?

You would have to think so.

[bulldogtragic]

Updated: Assuming Hrovat requests a trade to North at their pick 32. We could do a points trade with GCS with Honeychurch. The 300 point differential is around pick 50.

GCS - Picks 22, 23, 25 = 2,400 points (if 25 was substituted with 29 then the differential is 200 points or pick 56)
Dogs - Picks 18, 32 & 39 = 2,100 points

Take to Draft or trade: GCS - 3, 6, 8, 14, 18, 29, 30, 37, 42, 43
Take to Draft or trade: Dogs - 22, 23, 25/29

Dalrymples Sweet Spot: (2014) McLean, Webb (2015) Dunkley, Collins. He says he loves back to back picks, that's nearly back, to back, to back, to back. Could always ask Carlton to swap 24 for 25 (1 pick) additionally for Hrovat since they'll be trading it on. Giving Dal 22, 23 & 24.

[bulldogtragic]

Scouring through the first round and it opens up a potential heist.

- GCS demand pick 6 for Prestia and get it. They have 4, 6 & 8.
- Pick 5 Carlton & Pick 7 GWS. These two clubs are already trading on Marchbank, Stewart, Pickett etc.
- GWS take a slight hit and give two high end players for an upgrade from pick 16 to pick 5 (Carlton do well)

- GCS grab 4, 6 & 8 and GWS 5 & 7

- They have a formal agreement to not bid on each other academy players. They plunder 5 gun early rounders, and when the real clubs get picks and nominate their academy picks they pay using late first rounders for early first round talents.

They could rip the guts out of the first round of this draft and there's not a thing anyone can do but watch it unfold on draft night. I guess they'd like more late first round picks and points into the bank to still have plenty of points banked, I guess we could help for the right offer.

[1eyedog]

Assuming Koby & Hrovat requests trades to St Kilda or Essendon & Carlton. We could do a straight points trade with GCS:

GCS - Picks 22, 23 & 25 = 2,400 points
Dogs - Picks 18, about 30 (Koby & 59) 37 & 43 (Hrovat to Carl) = 2,500 points

Take to Draft or trade: GCS - 3, 6, 8, 14, 18, 29, 30, 37, 42, 43
Take to Draft or trade: Dogs - 22, 23, 25

Dalrymples Sweet Spot: (2014) McLean, Webb (2015) Dunkley, Collins. He says he loves back to back picks, that's nearly back, to back, to back, to back. Could always ask Carlton to swap 24 for 25 (1 pick) additionally for Hrovat since they'll be trading it on. Giving Dal 22, 23 & 24.

Great work Dal.

[boydogs]

Scouring through the first round and it opens up a potential heist.

- GCS demand pick 6 for Prestia and get it. They have 4, 6 & 8.
- Pick 5 Carlton & Pick 7 GWS. These two clubs are already trading on Marchbank, Stewart, Pickett etc.
- GWS take a slight hit and give two high end players for an upgrade from pick 16 to pick 5 (Carlton do well)

- GCS grab 4, 6 & 8 and GWS 5 & 7

- They have a formal agreement to not bid on each other academy players. They plunder 5 gun early rounders, and when the real clubs get picks and nominate their academy picks they pay using late first rounders for early first round talents.

They could rip the guts out of the first round of this draft and there's not a thing anyone can do but watch it unfold on draft night. I guess they'd like more late first round picks and points into the bank to still have plenty of points banked, I guess we could help for the right offer.

That's all assuming that the points system underrates early picks and overrates late picks. That may have been the case last year with the draft not being as deep and academy clubs accumulating unwanted later picks to pay for their players but may not be the case every year

[bornadog]

If Gold Coast receives No.6 and 10 next week...

Suns' picks: 4, 6, 8, 10, 22, 24, 30, 44

Tigers' picks: 27, 46, 64

Hawks' picks: 57, 68, 70

[bulldogtragic]

If Gold Coast receives No.6 and 10 next week...

Suns' picks: 4, 6, 8, 10, 22, 24, 30, 44

Tigers' picks: 27, 46, 64

Hawks' picks: 57, 68, 70




I want to target their picks in the 20's. Great for them, but they can't keep drafting to develop players for the rest of the comp. May as well re brand them a University or Academy team.

[1eyedog]

If Gold Coast receives No.6 and 10 next week...

Suns' picks: 4, 6, 8, 10, 22, 24, 30, 44

Tigers' picks: 27, 46, 64

Hawks' picks: 57, 68, 70




Melbourne's are worse.

[bornadog]

If Gold Coast receives No.6 and 10 next week...

Suns' picks: 4, 6, 8, 10, 22, 24, 30, 44

Tigers' picks: 27, 46, 64

Hawks' picks: 57, 68, 70




they now have: picks 4, 6, 8, 10 & 73 in this year's draft

[bulldogtragic]

they now have: picks 4, 6, 8, 10 & 73 in this year's draft

That's huge if they can keep the kids.

[comrade]

That's huge if they can keep the kids.

Plenty of good kids to be had on the cheap in a few years time :)

[bulldogtragic]

Plenty of good kids to be had on the cheap in a few years time :)

Funny because it's true. On their kids, what happened to the we completely stuffed up Tom Boyd and should've got Peter Wright movement?

[westdog54]

Funny because it's true. On their kids, what happened to the we completely stuffed up Tom Boyd and should've got Peter Wright movement?

Didn't know there was one.

In saying that, 2MP will be a damn fine player for them.

Speaking of draft picks, having not read many threads and not seen if there's been any discussion on it, I find it absolutely comical that Hawthorn's first pick in the draft is number 88.

[bulldogtragic]

Didn't know there was one.

In saying that, 2MP will be a damn fine player for them.

Speaking of draft picks, having not read many threads and not seen if there's been any discussion on it, I find it absolutely comical that Hawthorn's first pick in the draft is number 88.

Yep, I wonder how many rookie upgrades will make up their three picks from 88-105?

[westdog54]

Yep, I wonder how many rookie upgrades will make up their three picks from 88-105?

Or a delistee from another club perhaps?

You'd have to think there would be little left of any value at pick 88.

[bulldogtragic]

Or a delistee from another club perhaps?

You'd have to think there would be little left of any value at pick 88.

Good call. They traded their first and second contested ball winners, maybe they give Barlow a pick. Maybe even Mitch Brown for depth of anything happens to their better defenders.

[azabob]

Or a delistee from another club perhaps?

You'd have to think there would be little left of any value at pick 88.

I assume Brad Lynch being under a rookie contract can't be drafted?

[bulldogtragic]

I assume Brad Lynch being under a rookie contract can't be drafted?

If he's accepted an extension from us and hasn't nominated for the draft. From memory he had a one year rookie contract.

[azabob]

If he's accepted an extension from us and hasn't nominated for the draft. From memory he had a one year rookie contract.

I seriously hope we offered and he accepted.

[westdog54]

I assume Brad Lynch being under a rookie contract can't be drafted?

I believe he can still nominate for the draft if he thinks he's a chance to get selected, but has the insurance policy of a guaranteed rookie spot with us.

[soupman]

If he's accepted an extension from us and hasn't nominated for the draft. From memory he had a one year rookie contract.

I may be wrong but don't rookies drafted interstate get two years?

[bulldogtragic]

I may be wrong but don't rookies drafted interstate get two years?

There was some comment on this a while back. Apparently, it's one year with him and being an interstate the club paid his relocation costs. In the contract info on all players I researched, it had him contracted to 2016. I'm assuming he will stick with us as a rookie, with he and Roarke likely to get some upgrading time and next year if we have 6+ list movements that we would offer him an upgrade then, if his trajectory keeps rising. But that's my assumption that he takes another rookie year since he wasn't traded or requested a trade.

[soupman]

I'd imagine he will stay. Th club seems very positive about his development, as do our VFL watchers. Also he seems to be pretty well liked by the playing group so less likely to be a homesickness threat.