List Management 2017

[The Doctor]

Listed here is our team in positional order and their respective ages for the majority of the 2017 season. The positions are just a guide as some players could easily cross from one group to another.


Key Forwards

Cloke 30, Redpath 26, Boyd 21, Mullenger McHugh 20*


Medium/Small Forwards

Picken 30, Dickson 29, Crameri 28, C.Smith 24, Stringer 23, McLean 21, Hamilton 21, Dale 20, Lipinski 18, Tweedie 18*


Ruckmen

Roughead 26, Campbell 25, English 19


Tall Midfielders

Bontempelli 21, Macrae 22, Jong 23, Dunkley 20, Greene 19


Small Midfielders

Liberatore 24, Wallis 24, Dahlhaus 24, Hunter 22, Honeychurch 22, Webb 21, Daniel 20,


Key Defenders

Morris 34, Roberts 23, Adams, 23 Z.Cordy 20, Collins 19, Young 18


Medium/Small Defenders

Murphy 34, Boyd 34, Suckling 28, Wood 27, Biggs 25, Johannisen 24, Williams 19, Prudden 22*, R.Smith 20*, Lynch 19*,


* Rookie


2016 List Changes

In: Cloke, English, Lipinski, Young, Greene, Mullenger McHugh, Tweedie

Out: Hamling, Minson, Stevens, Hrovat, Adcock, Goetz


Honours/Achievements

* 23 AFL premiership players are on the list
* 12 VFL premiership players are on the list
* 7 All Australians
* 1 Norm Smith Medallist

Age Groups

* 5 veterans 30+
* 13 players in 24-29 age group
* 27 players 23 and under

Games

* 200+ games = 4. Murphy, Boyd, Morris, Cloke

* 100 - 200 games = 5. Dalhaus, Picken, Roughead, Suckling, Wood

* 50-99 games = 9. Bontempelli, Crameri, Dickson, Hunter, Johannisen, Liberatore, Macrae, Stringer, Wallis

* under 50 = 19. Adams, Biggs, T.Boyd, Campbell, Collins, Cordy, Dale, Daniel, Dunkley, Honeychurch, Jong, Mclean, Prudden, Redpath, Roberts, C.Smith, R.Smith, Webb, Williams,

* yet to debut = 8. Hamilton, Lynch, English, Lipinski, Young, Greene, Mullenger McHugh, Tweedie


Notes

* A better balanced list in terms of positional depth
* Tremendous flexibility with many players capable of easily fitting into a secondary classification (ie Z.Cordy Key forward or key defender)
* Almost 60 % of the list is 23 or under
* Almost 60% of the list have played less than 50 games incl 8 premiership players
* All tall bigger bodies midfielders on the list are 23 or younger
* Many premiership players still yet to reach their peak in terms of age and games played
* High level experience and/or leadership in all positional classifications

[bornadog]

Fantastic breakdown DOC.

We now have a balanced team in terms of experience, although we are still weighted towards young.

I think we look good for the 2017 Premiership.

[Dancin' Douggy]

Brilliant work. this really should be a dynasty. And cloke is only 30. I mean, I know 30 isn't young, but I somehow thought he was older. And watching him play, it wasn't his body letting him down (think Petrie or Pavlich) just his. Confidence and general confusion with the 'game plan' (LOL). Could get 3 or 4 big years out of him.

[BulldogBelle]

Brilliant work. this really should be a dynasty. And cloke is only 30. I mean, I know 30 isn't young, but I somehow thought he was older. And watching him play, it wasn't his body letting him down (think Petrie or Pavlich) just his. Confidence and general confusion with the 'game plan' (LOL). Could get 3 or 4 big years out of him.

My gut feel is that Cloke is going to make Bucks look stupid next year.
Cloke needs confidence which he did not get from angry Bucks. Plenty of man love at the kennel for Cloke to soar next year.

[Webby]

Just a comment on this one.

Hasn't the world changed when Tom Liberatore is 2 inches taller than St Kilda's champion centre half forward, premiership and team of the century captain, Darrel Baldock - yet is nowadays categorised as a small midfielder!?

It's the land of the giants nowadays!

[bulldogsthru&thru]

My gut feel is that Cloke is going to make Bucks look stupid next year.
Cloke needs confidence which he did not get from angry Bucks. Plenty of man love at the kennel for Cloke to soar next year.

From all reports Clokey is bloody serious and committed to making something happen. Have a look at the first pre-season sessions. He is in ripping shape. I'm expecting a solid year from him.

[ledge]

The minute it was out he would be coming to us he started to lose weight.. Obviously was told what we wanted him to do very early on way before the draft.

[LostDoggy]

Me thinks Clokey wants to shove it FIGJAM'S face something chronic after getting no love from him and the Filth.

[The Doctor]

The AFL has an interesting breakdown

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-12-03/total-list-breakdown-all-the-key-stats

key points for me

* we have the least number of players recruited from other clubs. I've always been an advocate for grow your own and was very pleased we didn't fall for the trap of "recruiting for the now" this year. Sydney incidently had the 2nd least. So the 2 grand finalists had the least number of players who came from other AFL clubs.

* Geelong and North rank 1st & 3rd for players yet to debut and the numbers are staggeringly high. Their depth is shit. Watch out if they cop an injury run anywhere like ours last season. I wouldn't be surprised if neither side make the finals next year.

* we rank 3rd last for players with 100 games or more

* GWS have the 2nd oldest list by average age

[Remi Moses]

He looks in great shape and if he performs it will be another dagger in the back of Buckley

[GVGjr]

The AFL has an interesting breakdown

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-12-03/total-list-breakdown-all-the-key-stats

key points for me

* we have the least number of players recruited from other clubs. I've always been an advocate for grow your own and was very pleased we didn't fall for the trap of "recruiting for the now" this year. Sydney incidently had the 2nd least. So the 2 grand finalists had the least number of players who came from other AFL clubs.



On the flip side, the Hawks have done sensationally well with acquiring needs based players from other sides. The stats might back the homegrown approach this year but there is nothing wrong in looking to remain in that group of clubs that genuinely have a chance to win a flag by targeting players that fill specific needs.

[stefoid]

Just keep drafting and trading for the right players and how you get them is a non-issue.

So much pressure on spots I cant see how we will suffer a hangover.

[Twodogs]

He looks in great shape and if he performs it will be another dagger in the back of Buckley

Especially if the duds Collingwood got in from other clubs like Maune and Wells don't perform.


On the flip side, the Hawks have done sensationally well with acquiring needs based players from other sides. The stats might back the homegrown approach this year but there is nothing wrong in looking to remain in that group of clubs that genuinely have a chance to win a flag by targeting players that fill specific needs.


There's no hard and fast formula. Clubs just have to make use of both methods of recruiting to their best needs.

[G-Mo77]

Add Tristian Tweedles to the 2017 side. Anyone know much about him?

[bulldogtragic]

Add Tristian Tweedles to the 2017 side. Anyone know much about him?

Hawthorn had Tristan Tweedie as a category B rookie option and were said to be taking him. He's a tall forward who had season ending injuries in both TAC years, but has exciting raw attributes. Played with Mullenger-McHugh. Are we taking him?

[KT31]

Add Tristian Tweedles to the 2017 side. Anyone know much about him?

Did we pick him up as a Cat B Rookie, G-Mo77 ?

[G-Mo77]

Did we pick him up as a Cat B Rookie, G-Mo77 ?

We either have or are going to

[G-Mo77]

Sorry it's Tweedie.

[bulldogtragic]

We either have or are going to

Interesting. I posted last week that I read an article from last week that said Hawthorn have been watching him closely and offered medical assistance to Tweedie this year and that the Ranges footy boss expected Hawthorn to snap him up this week or so as an academy Category B rookie. I wonder how or why they've passed on him or if there's been a bypass from another avenue that we've used?

[1eyedog]

Add Tristian Tweedles to the 2017 side. Anyone know much about him?

Yes it's Tristan Tweedie. 17 year old from Healesville and son of one of my work colleagues. Tallish flanker with a nice left boot, good disposal and good off either side. I played an exhibition game with him for Indigenous All Stars against eastern Health at Healesville last Feb. Tristan is Indigenous.

[1eyedog]

We either have or are going to

We have picked him up I found out last week.

[1eyedog]

Good kid, his old man is a nutter but to say they're over the moon about getting to the dogs would be an understatement.

[bornadog]

Yes it's Tristan Tweedie. 17 year old from Healesville and son of one of my work colleagues. Tallish flanker with a nice left boot, good disposal and good off either side. I played an exhibition game with him for Indigenous All Stars against eastern Health at Healesville last Feb. Tristan is Indigenous.

Is he the only indigenous player left on our list?

[azabob]

Sam Landsbeger is saying Tweedie plays like Charlie Cameron.

[1eyedog]

Sam Landsbeger is saying Tweedie plays like Charlie Cameron.

Don't know where he got that from. He's played key forward for Coldstream, Healesville and ER. Marks the ball way more than Cameron and more loping than super quick.

BAD yes I believe he is.

[bornadog]

Don't know where he got that from. He's played key forward for Coldstream, Healesville and ER. Marks the ball way more than Cameron and more loping than super quick.

BAD yes I believe he is.

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/625206245402644480/gCGrnYE-.jpg

[1eyedog]

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/625206245402644480/gCGrnYE-.jpg

Thanks yeah he's a nice mark. His Dad was a good footy player for Coldstream and Healesville, much heavier-set and tougher though. Up until 2 years ago his Dad was the junior coach at Coldstream. His Dad is a Wurundjeri Elder named Jason, rough and ready but a ripper of a bloke.

[bulldogtragic]

Tweedie at the beginning of the year was listed at 190cm & 85kg.

[bulldogtragic]

An interview from earlier this year:

Name: Tristan Tweedie
Team: Eastern Ranges
D/O/B: 11/06/1998
Height: 190cm
Weight: 85kg
Position: Key Forward
Barracks For: St Kilda

FP: Hi Tristan, and thanks for taking the time to have a chat with us. First off, what do you feel your main strengths as a footballer are?
TT: Definitely my athleticism, speed and the ability to lead and take a mark.

FP: What would you say then are your main focuses for improvement in 2016?
TT: I ran a 12.5 beep this year at testing, but I was coming off a few achilles niggles in the month leading up to testing which was not ideal – so that’s definitely an area I need to improve on this year. Also, I need continuity on my body and to continue to develop my weaker areas.

FP: As a forward, who influences you the most, or who do you try and model your game on?
TT: The likes of Lance Franklin and Joe Daniher are sources of inspiration – key forwards who like to run and jump at the ball.

FP: Eastern Ranges kicked off the year in style on Thursday, how did it feel bagging six goals?
TT: It was certainly good personally to start the year off well, but it was great for the team – the way the boys turned the ball over and restricted Calder to play on our terms was great. I feel we made a great first impression on the league and hopefully, we can continue to move forward as a team.

FP: That being said, do you think Eastern Ranges can go one better this year?
TT: Of course, within our camp we believe we’ve done the work to reach the ultimate goal. It’s only early though so we’ll have to keep working hard and wait and see.

FP: Apart from yourself, of course, which of your team-mates is worth keeping a close eye on this year?
TT: I wouldn’t be able to pick just one out, the side has a great core with a lot of depth.

FP: Ok, what would you say your main goals for 2016 are?
TT: To play my role in the team and make my teammates better. Hopefully, I play well enough to get invited to metro, but I know that won’t come without team success first and with that, any individual success will hopefully follow.

FP: Perhaps a silly question, but what’s your ultimate goal?
TT: To play AFL football

FP: Thanks again for your time Tristan, and all the best for 2016.

[bulldogtragic]

Hun, Sam Lansberger, 18/11/16

HAWTHORN has special access to an indigenous forward with an “abundance of talent” — but could be forced to secure him with a draft pick.

If creative forward Tristan Tweedie is overlooked at the national and rookie drafts, the Hawks can sign him as a Category B rookie through their next generation talent academy.

But a couple of clubs are also considering Tweedie, who slotted six goals in Round 1 of the TAC Cup.

The Hawks enter next Friday’s national draft at No.81 — the selection received for Brownlow Medallist Sam Mitchell.

If Hawks recruiters want Tweedie, they must decide whether to draft him or roll the dice and hope he slips through as a ‘free hit’.

...

The Hawks provided medical assistance for Tweedie this year as he recovered from a stress fracture in his foot.

Eastern Ranges talent manager Len Villani urged a club to take the Healesville boy.

“He’s a pretty special talent. I can see him playing as a classic third forward, pushing up to the wing and taking marks,” Villani said.

“He’s not quite as dynamic as him, but he plays a little bit like (Adelaide’s) Charlie Cameron.

“He’s elusive, has clean hands and is a text book set-shot for goal.”

Tweedie suffered a stress fracture in his leg in 2015 and has played just four TAC Cup games in two years.

If Tweedie is not selected, he will be invited back to the Ranges to play as a 19-year-old next season.

“If nobody drafts him or rookies him, he would be a free hit for Hawthorn,” Villani said.

“He’s got an abundance of talent — a beautifully natural footballer.

[bornadog]

Dogs add Category B rookie from Eastern Ranges (http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/news/2016-12-06/dogs-add-category-b-rookie)




http://s.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL%20Tenant/WesternBulldogs/Images/Tweedie_620px370px.jpg

The Western Bulldogs 2017 playing list has been finalised with the signing of Tristan Tweedie as a Category B Rookie.
The 18-year-old Tweedie joins the Club through its Next Generation Academy.
“I’ve [already] been welcomed with open arms, Tweedle told westernbulldogs.com.au on Tuesday.
“It’s definitely an exciting opportunity to be a part of a program like this and I look forward to what the future holds.”

Tweedie played two games of football this year before injury ended his season early, but did enough to impress with his versatility and game sense.
Standing at 190cm, Tweedie kicked six goals in round one of the TAC Cup for the Eastern Ranges and has shown that he’s a natural playmaker, clean at ground level and is a reliable set shot.

What they said:

“Tristan’s just got that X-factor – a beautiful footballer who moves really well.
“He is very raw in terms of his body … is a beautiful set-shot, lovely hands on the lead, good in the air, clean below his knees, 190cm, [he’s] going to be really dangerous and hard to match up.”
- Eastern Ranges Talent Manager Len Villani

[1eyedog]

Just spoke to his Dad Jason. Disagreed with the Charlie Cameron likeness. He's more Leon Cameron than Charlie Cameron. A marking Leon Cameron. He's too small for key forward, maybe third tall but he needs to build on his game in order to cut it at AFL level. Good trainer and a good learner, a quiet kid, well-mannered. Very neat disposer of the ball and a great mark, a rangy-type explaining the LC comparison. Does not have the penetration of LC. Effective around goals.

Family of St. Kilda supporters but always had a soft spot for the Doggies (well Jason does anyway). Has a younger brother who is also talented.

[bornadog]

Just spoke to his Dad Jason. Disagreed with the Charlie Cameron likeness. He's more Leon Cameron than Charlie Cameron. A marking Leon Cameron. He's too small for key forward, maybe third tall but he needs to build on his game in order to cut it at AFL level. Good trainer and a good learner, a quiet kid, well-mannered. Very neat disposer of the ball and a great mark, a rangy-type explaining the LC comparison. Does not have the penetration of LC. Effective around goals.

Family of St. Kilda supporters but always had a soft spot for the Doggies (well Jason does anyway). Has a younger brother who is also talented.

You will have to now officially keep us up to date with his progress.

[1eyedog]

You will have to now officially keep us up to date with his progress.

Looks like I have a new player Sponsor. I know his Dad really well.

[The Doctor]

Thanks 1eyedog for the insights. Much appreciated.

I hope the young fellow is over his injuries. He kicked 6 in the season opener this year so he knows where the goals are!

[aker39]

The question has to be asked - why didn't Hawthorn take him.

[The Doctor]

Medium/Small Defenders

Murphy 34, Boyd 34, Suckling 28, Wood 27, Biggs 25, Johannisen 24, Prudden 22*, R.Smith 20*, Lynch 19*,


* Rookie


Age Groups

* 5 veterans 30+
* 13 players in 24-29 age group
* 27 players 23 and under

Games


* 100 - 200 games = 5. Dalhaus, Picken, Roughead, Suckling, Wood





I can see us making a play for Jasper Pittard from Port during this year's trade period. He looks a Bevo player to me with that run and carry and taking the game on style. We know how much Bevo loves his half back flankers.

He will be an unrestricted free agent at the end of the year. At 27 with 100 games behind him he is at the peak of his powers fits an age group and position that could use a bit more depth

[Mofra]

I can see us making a play for Jasper Pittard from Port during this year's trade period. He looks a Bevo player to me with that run and carry and taking the game on style. We know how much Bevo loves his half back flankers.

He will be an unrestricted free agent at the end of the year. At 27 with 100 games behind him he is at the peak of his powers fits an age group and position that could use a bit more depth
JJ, Biggs, Wood, Suckling, Bailey Williams - and we'll play 3 tall defenders at times. That's assuming Prudden doesn't play and that Webb is a midfielder.
Decent player but is his type really a priority?

[Happy Days]

I can see us making a play for Jasper Pittard from Port during this year's trade period. He looks a Bevo player to me with that run and carry and taking the game on style. We know how much Bevo loves his half back flankers.

He will be an unrestricted free agent at the end of the year. At 27 with 100 games behind him he is at the peak of his powers fits an age group and position that could use a bit more depth

Please no. I've said it on here before but I haven't seen a skilled player who treats the ball with less care than he does. There's taking the game on and then there's pissing possession up against a wall.

[Bulldog4life]

Just spoke to his Dad Jason. Disagreed with the Charlie Cameron likeness. He's more Leon Cameron than Charlie Cameron. A marking Leon Cameron. He's too small for key forward, maybe third tall but he needs to build on his game in order to cut it at AFL level. Good trainer and a good learner, a quiet kid, well-mannered. Very neat disposer of the ball and a great mark, a rangy-type explaining the LC comparison. Does not have the penetration of LC. Effective around goals.

Family of St. Kilda supporters but always had a soft spot for the Doggies (well Jason does anyway). Has a younger brother who is also talented.

Any news when Tristan will be playing 1eyedog?

[The Doctor]

Listed here is our team in positional order and their respective ages for the majority of the 2017 season. The positions are just a guide as some players could easily cross from one group to another.


Key Forwards

Cloke 30, Redpath 26, Boyd 21, Mullenger McHugh 20*


Medium/Small Forwards

Picken 30, Dickson 29, Crameri 28, C.Smith 24, Stringer 23, Dale 20, Lipinski 18,


Ruckmen

Roughead 26, Campbell 25, English 19


Tall Midfielders

Jong 23, Macrae 22, Bontempelli 21, Dunkley 20, Greene 19


Small Midfielders

Liberatore 24, Wallis 24, Dahlhaus 24, Hunter 22, Honeychurch 22, McLean 21, Daniel 20,


Key Defenders

Morris 34, Roberts 23, Adams, 23 Z.Cordy 20, Collins 19, Young 18


Medium/Small Defenders

Suckling 28, Wood 27, Biggs 25, Johannisen 24, Williams 19, R.Smith 20*, Lynch 19*


* Rookie



Have updated this to include recent list changes,


Off - Murphy, Boyd, Prudden, Hamilton, Tweedie


The players in bold have current question marks on their future

Potential On - Trengove 27 (key defender)

[ledge]

Going by the latest news article Libber and Dalhaus have no questions about their future.
The club and the managers have made it clear they are staying.

[ledge]

I think Cloke has a question mark though.

[bornadog]

Any news when Tristan will be playing 1eyedog?

Wonder what happens with Tristan and the other rookies (yes Prudden Gone)

[The Doctor]

I think Cloke has a question mark though.

Cloke is contracted isn't he?

[ledge]

Cloke is contracted isn't he?

Yes but is undecided on whether he wants to go on from what I've read .
Clubs left it up to him I think.
Personally I think he still has value even if it's a few games in VFL teaching our younger forwards and playing AFL when needed.

[The Doctor]

If Campbell wasn't contracted there might be a cloud over him as well.

Really think we stuffed up last trade period. Not doing enough to retain any or all of Hamling, Stevens & Hrovat.

[GVGjr]

If Campbell wasn't contracted there might be a cloud over him as well.

Really think we stuffed up last trade period. Not doing enough to retain any or all of Hamling, Stevens & Hrovat.

Agreed, we missed some opportunities and it's going to be hard to correct.

[Remi Moses]

I disagree on Hamling . The guy asked the club to return to W.A because his father was sick . What were they meant to do?
Hold the guy to ransom ?

[Mantis]

Really think we stuffed up last trade period. Not doing enough to retain any or all of Hamling, Stevens & Hrovat.

We couldn't do much with Hamling as he was offered a new contract, but how could we do more to retain Hrovat & Stevens when an offer to see more game time would've been a lie given where they sat in the pecking order?

[bornadog]

We couldn't do much with Hamling as he was offered a new contract, but how could we do more to retain Hrovat & Stevens when an offer to see more game time would've been a lie given where they sat in the pecking order?

Hrovat and Stevens are average players at best. We tend to overate our players.

[The Doctor]

Hold the guy to ransom ?

Ransom? What?

I understand the desire to return home but was that really the full story? I'm not so sure. The Freo offer was better than ours. We were throwing big money at Hurley which was considerably more than we were prepared to give our premiership winning CHB. Had some of that been used to form a better offer perhaps that would have tempted him to stay. I think we could have tried harder but weren't prepared to.

We missed him this year.

[The Doctor]

We couldn't do much with Hamling as he was offered a new contract, but how could we do more to retain Hrovat & Stevens when an offer to see more game time would've been a lie given where they sat in the pecking order?

They were best 22 when they weren't injured. I might be in the minority but I thought they were both good players. Trading them away for next to nothing eroded away our depth and I thought this would be damaging to us at the time. Put it this way. I would have preferred to retain Hamling, Stevens & Hrovat over Jong, Hamilton and Honeychurch.

[Remi Moses]

Ransom? What?

I understand the desire to return home but was that really the full story? I'm not so sure. The Freo offer was better than ours. We were throwing big money at Hurley which was considerably more than we were prepared to give our premiership winning CHB. Had some of that been used to form a better offer perhaps that would have tempted him to stay. I think we could have tried harder but weren't prepared to.

We missed him this year.

I'm going by the comments from the club and Hamling , not speculation .

[Remi Moses]

They were best 22 when they weren't injured. I might be in the minority but I thought they were both good players. Trading them away for next to nothing eroded away our depth and I thought this would be damaging to us at the time. Put it this way. I would have preferred to retain Hamling, Stevens & Hrovat over Jong, Hamilton and Honeychurch.

Wouldn't have made a skerrick of difference . Neither played in the finals ( when we had injuries) Hamilton, I'd agree .
You don't decent picks for fringe players

[Sedat]

Hindsight showed we erred in not pruning harder, but after a premiership and with a young list profile it was not unreasonable to assume there would be more incremental improvement within the list than what actually transpired.

We will correct thing this off season as we should. The ladder doesn't lie in 2017 - we are currently a middle of the road team and need an injection of talent (via draft and trade/FA) in order to contend again.

[bornadog]

Hindsight showed we erred in not pruning harder, but after a premiership and with a young list profile it was not unreasonable to assume there would be more incremental improvement within the list than what actually transpired.

We will correct thing this off season as we should. The ladder doesn't lie in 2017 - we are currently a middle of the road team and need an injection of talent (via draft and trade/FA) in order to contend again.

How much harder would you have liked to prune the list? We brought in 5 new players, and will probably do the same this year, maybe 6. I think that is a reasonable amount for such a young list.

[Mantis]

They were best 22 when they weren't injured. I might be in the minority but I thought they were both good players. Trading them away for next to nothing eroded away our depth and I thought this would be damaging to us at the time. Put it this way. I would have preferred to retain Hamling, Stevens & Hrovat over Jong, Hamilton and Honeychurch.

Hamling was best 22, which is why we were reluctant to lose him, but when push came to shove both Stevens & Hrovat weren't... as evidenced by team selection for last years finals team.

Would prefer Hrovat over HC, but would Hrovat have remained if there was no guarantee that he was going to get a regular senior game? Which would've been the case given the improvement seen with McLean & Dale, who are & will continue to be superior players.

Jong over Stevens every day of the week.

[Sedat]

How much harder would you have liked to prune the list? We brought in 5 new players, and will probably do the same this year, maybe 6. I think that is a reasonable amount for such a young list.
I've forgotten the contract status at the end of last season but I would have thought Hamilton, Campbell and Honeychurch were all fortunate to be on the list this year.

[anfo27]

Hamling was best 22, which is why we were reluctant to lose him, but when push came to shove both Stevens & Hrovat weren't... as evidenced by team selection for last years finals team.

Would prefer Hrovat over HC, but would Hrovat have remained if there was no guarantee that he was going to get a regular senior game? Which would've been the case given the improvement seen with McLean & Dale, who are & will continue to be superior players.

I think Stevens was best 22 when fully fit but as we've seen when with us once his injured he is probably the worst player in the comp coming back from injury. His game first game back against the giants last year stands out as how bad can a player be when underdone. Always seemed to be in the side when he was fully fit & not coming back from injury. Koby is harshly judged by most on here.

Hrovat never got a clear run at it with us. I don't think it was a bad move getting rid of them as we saved some coin there but it cost us in depth & we gave them away for nothing.

[Mofra]

Hamling was best 22, which is why we were reluctant to lose him, but when push came to shove both Stevens & Hrovat weren't... as evidenced by team selection for last years finals team.

Would prefer Hrovat over HC, but would Hrovat have remained if there was no guarantee that he was going to get a regular senior game? Which would've been the case given the improvement seen with McLean & Dale, who are & will continue to be superior players.

Jong over Stevens every day of the week.
Hrovat would have played over Honeychurch but I still wouldn't have thought with a full list Hrovat was best 22 - and that was before Bailey Dale's huge improvement this year as that forward finisher who can run on the wing.

[Remi Moses]

Jong and Stevens were lineball for me, although I think Jong has a few better attributes. You couldn't have Hrovat getting a gig over Dale . Also had McLean coming on rapidly , I think Hamilton was probably the lucky one .

[Remi Moses]

Good lord if you thought it was Doomsday on here, just check out the kiddies on Big Footy :rolleyes:

[bornadog]

Good lord if you thought it was Doomsday on here, just check out the kiddies on Big Footy :rolleyes:

I dare not go there.

[Remi Moses]

I dear not go there.

The temper tantrums are mildly amusing

[The Pie Man]

Jong and Stevens were lineball for me, although I think Jong has a few better attributes. You couldn't have Hrovat getting a gig over Dale . Also had McLean coming on rapidly , I think Hamilton was probably the lucky one .

I assumed Hamilton was signed on cheap as opposed to Hrovat/Stevens, with the faint possibility he might come on.

[bornadog]

Another way to look at our list:

List by the numbers- link (http://www.westernbulldogs.com.au/news/2017-09-15/list-by-the-numbers)

The list: By experience

250-300 games
Travis Cloke (256)

200-249 games
Dale Morris (241)

150-199 games
Liam Picken (198)

100-149 games
Matthew Suckling (141)
Luke Dahlhaus (137)
Jordan Roughead (126)
Easton Wood (125)
Tom Liberatore (116)
Mitch Wallis (105)

50-99 games
Stewart Crameri (99)
Jack Macrae (99)
Jake Stringer (89)
Tory Dickson (88)
Marcus Bontempelli (86)
Jason Johannisen (84)
Lachie Hunter (84)
Shane Biggs (58)
Clay Smith (55)
Caleb Daniel (54)
Lin Jong (51)

0-49 games
Tom Boyd (49)
Fletcher Roberts (47)
Tom Campbell (42)
Toby McLean (38)
Jack Redpath (34)
Bailey Dale (30)
Zaine Cordy (30)
Josh Dunkley (24)
Mitch Honeychurch (22)
Marcus Adams (21)
Lukas Webb (19)
Bailey Williams (18)
Lewis Young (7)
Roarke Smith (2)
Tim English (2)
Kieran Collins (1)
Patrick Lipinski (1)

Yet to debut
Nathan Mullenger-McHugh
Tristan Tweedie
Brad Lynch
Fergus Greene

The list: By age

30-34 years of age
Dale Morris (34)
Liam Picken (31)
Travis Cloke (30)

25-29 years of age
Tory Dickson (29)
Stewart Crameri (29)
Matthew Suckling (29)
Easton Wood (28)
Shane Biggs (26)
Jordan Roughead (26)
Jack Redpath (26)
Tom Campbell (25)
Tom Liberatore (25)
Luke Dahlhaus (25)

20-24 years old
Mitch Wallis (24)
Clay Smith (24)
Jason Johannisen (24)
Marcus Adams (24)
Lin Jong (24)
Fletcher Roberts (24)
Jack Macrae (23)
Jake Stringer (23)
Tom Boyd (22)
Mitch Honeychurch (22)
Lachie Hunter (22)
Toby McLean (21)
Bailey Dale (21)
Lukas Webb (21)
Roarke Smith (21)
Marcus Bontempelli (21)
Caleb Daniel (21)
Bradley Lynch (20)
Zaine Cordy (20)
Josh Dunkley (20)
Tim English (20)
Nathan Mullenger-McHugh (20)

18-19 years old
Kieran Collins (19)
Fergus Greene (19)
Bailey Williams (19)
Tristan Tweedie (19)
Patrick Lipinski (19)
Lewis Young (18)

[ledge]

That's a very balanced list.

[kruder]

I disagree on Hamling . The guy asked the club to return to W.A because his father was sick . What were they meant to do?
Hold the guy to ransom ?


Offer the same deal that we are suggested to have offered Trengove and he stays.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Offer the same deal that we are suggested to have offered Trengove and he stays.

It's a reasonable point but I don't believe that offer is legit - 4 years at that money for a solid yet unspectacular big

[Remi Moses]

Offer the same deal that we are suggested to have offered Trengove and he stays.

Why do people on here put their own spin on what happens ?
Hamling wanted to return to W.A because of a sick father ( that's on public record)

[always right]

Offer the same deal that we are suggested to have offered Trengove and he stays.

Source?

[GVGjr]

Good lord if you thought it was Doomsday on here, just check out the kiddies on Big Footy :rolleyes:

No need to bag another site.

[GVGjr]

I disagree on Hamling . The guy asked the club to return to W.A because his father was sick . What were they meant to do?
Hold the guy to ransom ?

We didn't make up our mind early enough that we really wanted him. Had we backed him early I think he would have stayed

[kruder]

Why do people on here put their own spin on what happens ?
Hamling wanted to return to W.A because of a sick father ( that's on public record)

It wasn't just a sick father, money would have played a big role fore sure.

[kruder]

Source?

Me. It happens in many organisations people that come in are offered more money and overvalued than people currently in the job. Id take Hamling over Trengove everyday off the week but we obviously didn't rate him highly enough, our offer wasn't anywhere near Fremantle. The club stuffed up its simple on this one.

[azabob]

We didn't make up our mind early enough that we really wanted him. Had we backed him early I think he would have stayed

On the flip side not sure he played well enough in the first half of the season to justify an automatic contract.

[bulldogtragic]

On the flip side not sure he played well enough in the first half of the season to justify an automatic contract.

Wasn't he playing as a pinch hit forward in the VFL he was that out of form down back?

[hujsh]

Wasn't he playing as a pinch hit forward in the VFL he was that out of form down back?

Yeah and came into the AFL to do it but was shit at it so we swapped him and Cordy but then he came good all of a sudden

[bulldogtragic]

Yeah and came into the AFL to do it but was shit at it so we swapped him and Cordy but then he came good all of a sudden

That's how I remember it too. Should our 4 year deal to him have come straight after that game or later?

Also, Freo identified he and Kersten as a package deal in time well before he got back into the seniors. It seems to me Freo were prepared to take a punt on a couple of WA mates playing VFL to come good eventually. Like a 20-1 shot, that won. That's not a big mistake in my book. We had our money on the safe bet. Some list management decisions you win, Tom Boyd/Grphyone, and some you don't. You just have to try to win more than you lose. Getting him as a DFA and turning it into pick 35 isn't bad in the totality of his stay.

[azabob]

Yeah and came into the AFL to do it but was shit at it so we swapped him and Cordy but then he came good all of a sudden

Was it round 19 down at Geelong?

[bornadog]

Wasn't he playing as a pinch hit forward in the VFL he was that out of form down back?

I recall he couldn't focus properly and couldn't work out the team defence positions so they decided to chuck him up forward.

You can't blame the club if he was out of form and not even up to VFL standard at that stage.

[bulldogtragic]

I recall he couldn't focus properly and couldn't work out the team defence positions so they decided to chuck him up forward.

You can't blame the club if he was out of form and not even up to VFL standard at that stage.

You can, but it's unfair criticism on the club. I guess another way of looking at it is... The team defence won us a premiership. Hamling took far too long to get the same defensive positioning which resulted in our offer stalling. Would we go back in time to remove the defensive structure so we could offer Hamling a contract a bit sooner which he may or may not accept?

No for me. Give me the flag.

[hujsh]

Was it round 19 down at Geelong?

Definitely the Geelong game

[Go_Dogs]

Based on what's floating around:-

Out:-
Murphy, Boyd, Hamilton, Crameri, Honeychurch (im not holding my breath on getting a return, if we can bank some late points for next year that'd be good)

Campbell - I'd trade him. We hardly played him when fit, Trengove and English give us 2 other options and Tom Boyd should be back playing - Port may be interested if moving on from Lobbe, so perhaps he's steak knives in an Impey deal?

Stringer - wait and see, but let's say we trade him for pick 11.

In:-
Trengove - FA
Impey - this isn't my area, but could we trade Campbell, 26 and 39 for 29, 47 and Impey? He's a former pick 21 with 70 games but not a top line performer - no idea what Port may want
Crozier - would pick 47 from above get it done?

We'd then go in with 4 picks being 9, 11, 29 and something in the 80's.

I'd be happy to trade 29 to Geelong for say 51 this year and their second round next year if it helps them with getting GAjnr back from the Gold Coast. We'd bank some points and flexibility for 2018.

So where does that leave our side:-

Morris, Cordy, Biggs
Williams, Trengove, Wood
McLean, Macrae, Hunter
JJ, Adams, Daniel
Impey, Boyd, Dale
Roughead, Bontempelli, Liberatore
Dahlhaus, Jong, Young, Wallis,

Picken, Suckling, Crozier, Dunkley, Webb, Cloke, Smith, Dickson, Roberts, Collins, Redpath, English, Lipinski, Greene, plus a couple of top 12 picks.

We can upgrade Smith if we want with pick 80+.

Crozier and Impey aren't walk up starts to our 22 based on how I see it, so I'm reluctant to sell the farm, but could be important pieces up front where we lack options (particularly if McLean, Dale, Dahl continue to play more midfield minutes) with the ability to play down back too.

Our depth looks largely one paced and we have a bit of height, so players with speed and flexibility would be my preference with the earlier picks and we should look to add a ruck to develop too.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-10-04/forgotten-power-ruckman-seeks-fresh-start

"It was a last-minute opportunity that the Bulldogs put on the table, which was a pretty high first round pick and I think another pick at the time, which Port didn't see coming," Doughty said.

"I tried to get hold of Matthew, I think he was in Vietnam at the time, and I think we were about to fly over with the Bulldogs' recruiting manager (Simon Dalrymple) and CEO (David Stevenson) and coach (Luke Beveridge) to make the meeting happen, but it all fell through."

"The coach (Ken Hinkley) decided that he wanted to keep Matt, and that was the end of that trade option.

"It was a tough one for Matt, because he hadn't met the players, been through the club or anything. Obviously being overseas at the time, it was a really tough decision for him to make. The Bulldogs were happy to fly over and meet him and get the deal done, which would have been more money and an extra year, so it was a missed opportunity for Matt."

WTF were we thinking? That would have been a diabolical trade and the benefit of hindsight was certainly not required here.

[GVGjr]

WTF were we thinking? That would have been a diabolical trade and the benefit of hindsight was certainly not required here.

Bevo is credited for being someone who was looking to reinvent the ruck position but in all honesty he wanted a traditional ruckman and we tried to accommodate that. Our efforts to get Kreuzer, Martin and Lobbe weren't fabrications.

He might now have changed that approach but when he got here he wanted a ruckman a bit better than Roughead.

[Rocket Science]

I listened to that with horror.

So did Ken Hinkley I imagine.

[LongWait]

I listened to that with horror.

So did Ken Hinkley I imagine.

It was Hinkley that stopped the trade. Thanks Ken.

[Rocket Science]

It was Hinkley that stopped the trade. Thanks Ken.

Hence his horror.

[comrade]

Bevo is credited for being someone who was looking to reinvent the ruck position but in all honesty he wanted a traditional ruckman and we tried to accommodate that. Our efforts to get Kreuzer, Martin and Lobbe weren't fabrications.

He might now have changed that approach but when he got here he wanted a ruckman a bit better than Roughead.

Kreuzer and Martin aren't anything like Lobbe.

[Axe Man]

Western Bulldogs ruckman Tom Campbell explores trade options (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/western-bulldogs/western-bulldogs-ruckman-tom-campbell-explores-trade-options/news-story/b2844852bf3cd5f64689671d8e8c1884)

WESTERN Bulldogs ruckman Tom Campbell will explore his trade options to potentially escape the big man logjam at the kennel.

Campbell, 26, has slid back in the ruck pecking order behind Jordan Roughead, new free agent pick-up Jackson Trengove, premiership hero Tom Boyd and potentially first-round draftee Tim English for next season.

The 205cm English, who has been likened to West Coast champion Dean Cox for his athletic abilities, has already been re-signed until the end of 2020 after an encouraging first year.

The glut of ruckmen has prompted the 200cm Campbell to consider his options after playing only seven senior games this season and 42 matches in total over the past six years.

Coach Luke Beveridge pulled a major selection surprise when the Dogs selected the spindly English over Campbell in Rounds 10 and 12 this year.

The Herald Sun understands the Dogs would be open to a deal if Campbell can find another new home in this year’s trade period.

He could give another club a strong presence in the ruck contests.

The strong-bodied Campbell averaged 33 hitouts, two marks and nine possessions a game this season.

But his prospects at the kennel next year may be limited as Beveridge has a strong preference for his ruckmen to be heavily involved in the game around the ground and at ground level.

Campbell started strong in the Dogs’ 2016 premiership season but suffered a heel injury which kept him sidelined after Round 13.

He has one more year to run on his contract at Whitten Oval.

[GVGjr]

I can understand why TC would be looking elsewhere but I won't be disappointed if he stays with us.

[bulldogtragic]

A heap on here predicted this. I think he needs a fresh start to keep the dream alive for him. Ideally he lands at a club who we are trading with to steak knife a deal.

[GVGjr]

A heap on here predicted this. I think he needs a fresh start to keep the dream alive for him. Ideally he lands at a club who we are trading with to steak knife a deal.

With Mumford likely to be going from GWS could a Honeychurch and Campbell package net us an upgrade?

[bulldogsthru&thru]

A heap on here predicted this. I think he needs a fresh start to keep the dream alive for him. Ideally he lands at a club who we are trading with to steak knife a deal.

Brisbane. In a Schache deal?

[bulldogtragic]

With Mumford likely to be going from GWS could a Honeychurch and Campbell package net us an upgrade?

Yeah, but what are you asking for it?


Brisbane. In a Schache deal?

That'd be nice.

[bulldogtragic]

Geelong now not interested in Crameri. Presumably getting Watts.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Geelong now not interested in Crameri. Presumably getting Watts.

Apparently they can't deal for Watts? AFL.com.au reporting as such

[bulldogtragic]

Apparently they can't deal for Watts? AFL.com.au reporting as such

I just caught the trade radio tweet saying they're not after Stew now.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

I just caught the trade radio tweet saying they're not after Stew now.

Ah ok. AFL website summarising Stephen Wells' interview and it mentioned they are not getting Watts because they won't have the trade assets for him indicating he will most likely go to port or swans.

[bulldogtragic]

Ah ok. AFL website summarising Stephen Wells' interview and it mentioned they are not getting Watts because they won't have the trade assets for him indicating he will most likely go to port or swans.

So they get Jake & Watts to waste their times inspecting their tax payer funded facilitates and talk to coach and players, knowing they can't actually trade for them....

[GVGjr]

Yeah, but what are you asking for it?


I've got something in mind with Fremantle, GWS and us but it needs some more work.

[GVGjr]

So they get Jake & Watts to waste their times inspecting their tax payer funded facilitates and talk to coach and players, knowing they can't actually trade for them....

I think Stephen Wells is a lot better than that. He has forged a good reputation over a long period of time.

He thinks it's hard to trade for Jake given we were very clear with what we wanted that included players that they won't move on but he feels like they could be part of a bigger trade that facilitates a Stringer trade.

I wouldn't rule them out yet

[1eyedog]

I just caught the trade radio tweet saying they're not after Stew now.

Hahahaha that's for giving away your future picks you laughing stock hand baggers. Worst trade period ever.

[bulldogtragic]

Afl.com.au - If Stringer goes, it could help:

THE WAITING game continues for out-of-contract Western Bulldogs forward Stewart Crameri, who will be forced to wait until the end of the NAB AFL Trade Period before learning where his future lies.

However, the imminent departure of premiership player Jake Stringer could make it more likely he stays at the club, and Crameri believes he has up to five years left in his career.

Crameri, 29, twice had surgery this year, after being sidelined 2016 with a drug ban as part of his time at Essendon.

A dodgy hip meant he lined up in just the opening two games of the year.

Bulldogs coach Luke Beveridge told Crameri his future would not be known until the Trade Period ended next Thursday.

"Some tough conversations obviously with 'Bevo'. Hard year, not playing and not playing the year before, so we couldn't discuss football necessarily, but it was more about what I want to do next year and where I want to go," Crameri told NAB AFL Trade Radio on Thursday.

"He just said it's going to be a hard slog during Trade Period. We've got to wait and see what happens."

Declaring he was "mentally refreshed", the former Bomber would be willing to move interstate if he was discarded by the Dogs.

"It's just going to have to take another week and hopefully I can stay, but if not, I'd be more than happy to pursue my career at another club," Crameri said.

Stringer is contracted for 2018 but is likely on his way to Essendon.

"If Jake goes, I'm not sure where that sits for me. I assume it would help somewhat but I've just got to wait and see and find out probably at the end of Trade period, I'll sit down with (list manager) Jason McCartney and see what he thinks," Crameri said.

Retirement is not in Crameri's plans.

"I've actually started a little bit later in my career, so I think I've got at least three, four or five years left, so it would be disappointing not to get a chance next year," Crameri said.

He began running in the last month and continues to his rehab at the Dogs' Whitten Oval base, after having suffered his original hip injury early in 2017.

"It happened at the start of the year and I prolonged it (surgery). Should've got the operation at the start of the year but I waited too long and then the rest of the season was pretty much finished," Crameri said.

Those issues are done with, in Crameri's mind.

"I think I'm passed that and I'm really mentally refreshed and my body's refreshed, so I'd be really excited to play again next year. I'm just looking forward to getting past this period," Crameri said.

"It seems like it's dragged on forever really."

His path to another club will likely be as a delisted free agent.

"I had interest (from other teams) initially, but I think in my case, if the club decided not to re-sign me, I'll be a delisted free agent so clubs will be interested after they find out what the go is with the Western Bulldogs, whether they take me or not," Crameri said.

"As frustrating as it is, it's a waiting game really. I'm sure there are a couple of clubs out there that are interested, but we'll have to wait and see."

He sees himself as being the same player who booted at least 30 goals between 2011-15.

"I haven't lost my ability so I'm pretty keen to get out there," Crameri said.

[bulldogtragic]

Ninja!

[Bulldog4life]

Good cop, bad cop: Beveridge's change may force out big Dog

Western Bulldogs coach Luke Beveridge is changing his style - ditching his 'good guy' reputation in an attempt to get more out of his lacklustre pups.

Beveridge has been brutally honest during his exit interviews with players as he tries to realign the player-coach relationship.

The revered figure and 2016 premiership coach has been critical of almost the entire list following the club's disappointing premiership defence that saw it miss finals.

The issues surrounding Jake Stringer which damaged morale among the playing group have also been a factor in Beveridge's transformation from fatherly mentor to hardened taskmaster in the hope it can elevate his team back to its lofty heights of last season.

But the fallout from one such negative interview is believed to be the cause for big man Tom Campbell seeking greener pastures.

The contracted 26-year-old is exploring his options after a critical reflection of his 2017 campaign.

That, coupled with the recruitment of Port Adelaide's Jack Trengove, who is expected to take the No. 2 ruck mantle at the Whitten Oval, has prompted Campbell to search for increased opportunities elsewhere.

The wantaway ruckman, who has been cruelled by foot and ankle injuries in his six-year, 42-game career, was almost Fremantle-bound last year when he was out of contract.

But officials at the Bulldogs convinced him last season to re-commit to a two-year deal.

The Dockers still have the capacity to lure Campbell following the delistings of Zac Clarke and Jonathon Griffin.

Campbell's manager Scott Lucas did not return calls from ESPN.

http://www.espn.com.au/afl/story/_/id/20996910/good-cop-bad-cop-luke-beveridge-tom-campbell-leave-bulldogs

[bulldogtragic]

Campbell & Honey (onto GWS) and pick swap for Crozier?

[GVGjr]

I didn't see TC to Fremantle. Very interesting if true

[GVGjr]

Campbell & Honey (onto GWS) and pick swap for Crozier?

Plenty of things bubbling away

[bulldogtragic]

Plenty of things bubbling away

JMac needs to channel his inner Michael Corleone. Near the end, execute all our big name trades.

[Happy Days]

I didn't see TC to Fremantle. Very interesting if true

Straight swap for Crozier? I'm down.

[GVGjr]

Straight swap for Crozier? I'm down.

Me to or is Clarke in play as well? Could it be TC and pick 40 for Clarke and Crozier?

[Happy Days]

Me to or is Clarke in play as well? Could it be TC and pick 40 for Clarke and Crozier?

Clarke's been delisted already so I don't think they can trade him; we'd have to sign him as a DFA.

[Bulldog4life]

Trade radio reporting the following ...

Hayden Crozier is a Bulldog. Dockers get pick 40 & 82 in exchange for Crozier & future 4th round pick

[GVGjr]

Trade radio reporting the following ...

Hayden Crozier is a Bulldog. Dockers get pick 40 & 82 in exchange for Crozier & future 4th round pick

Great deal for us.

[bulldogtragic]

Small fry trades done.

Now dazzle us gentlemen.

[The Doctor]

Updated as at 14th Oct (halfway through trade period)

Listed here is our team in positional order and their respective ages for the majority of the 2017 season. The positions are just a guide as some players could easily cross from one group to another.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Key Forwards

Cloke 30, Redpath 26, Boyd 21, Mullenger McHugh 20*


Medium/Small Forwards

Picken 30, Dickson 29, Crameri 28, C.Smith 24, Stringer 23, Dale 20, Lipinski 18,


Ruckmen

Roughead 26, Campbell 25, English 19


Tall Midfielders

Jong 23, Macrae 22, Bontempelli 21, Dunkley 20, Greene 19


Small Midfielders

Liberatore 24, Wallis 24, Dahlhaus 24, Hunter 22, Honeychurch 22, McLean 21, Daniel 20,


Key Defenders

Morris 34, Trengove 27, Roberts 23, Adams, 23 Z.Cordy 20, Collins 19, Young 18


Medium/Small Defenders

Suckling 28, Wood 27, Biggs 25, Johannisen 24, Crozier 24, Williams 19, R.Smith 20*, Lynch 19*

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Rookie
Have updated this to include recent list changes,


Off - Murphy, Boyd, Hamilton, Prudden*, Tweedie*

On - Trengove, Crozier


The players in bold have current question marks on their future. Stringer & Campbell have been linked with trade speculation. Crameri & Honeychurch are uncontracted. R. Smith likely to be upgraded to the main list depending on trade outcomes.

I would still like to see another key forward come in.

[azabob]

Thanks Doctor. What the list really highlights is it’s a young mans game.

At a glance the key forwards do look light. What age / devolpment stage would you want to bring in?

[LostDoggy]

The small/mid forwards also look light on. Too many are either aging or questionable formwise and not enough have the high intensity pressure required. A forward of this type in his early/mid 20s would be a great addition to our list. Many have JJ going forward which seems a good call but he is not really a high pressure/manic tackling type either.

[Dry Rot]

So Crameri and Honeychurch get delisted?

[Mantis]

Our decision to re-sign Redpath for 2 years looks pretty *!*!*!*!ing stupid about now.

[bulldogtragic]

So Crameri and Honeychurch get delisted?

Yep. Gone for nada.

[divvydan]

I think these are our changes from trade period

In: Trengove, Schache, Crozier, 16, 2018 4th Rd

Out: Stringer, 28, 41, 83, 2018 2nd Rd


Crameri and Honeychurch uncontracted.


2017 Picks: 9, 16, 82, 101.

[jazzadogs]

So it's:
OUT: Bob, M Boyd, Hamilton, Stringer, ???, ???
IN: Trengove, Schache, Crozier, + 3 at the draft

Honeychurch is definitely gone. Is Crameri the only other option? It's a shame because I think we would benefit from him in the forward line next year.

[Rocket Science]

I think these are our changes from trade period

In: Trengove, Schache, Crozier, 16, 2018 4th Rd

Out: Stringer, 28, 30, 41, 83, 2018 2nd Rd


Crameri and Honeychurch uncontracted.


2017 Picks: 9, 16, 82, 101.

Minor correction.

[divvydan]

30 wasn't ours to begin with so I didn't include that as it's not a net loss.

[The Doctor]

I would still like to see another key forward come in.

Got my wish!

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Got my wish!

Who said wishes don't come true! And all it took was for a very talented player to reveal himself to be a shit person who became a devisive figure within the club and then (breathe) for fans to ride a trade fortnight of ups and downs and wills and wont's and do's and don'ts and making Essendon pwn us before we somewhat salvage things with the acquisition of a highly touted key forward with some ? marks on his mental application...
Sigh..we never seem to make wishes come true the conventional way... #stilllovemyDogs

[The Doctor]

Updated as at 25th Oct (after trade period)

Listed here is our team in positional order and their respective ages for the majority of the 2017 season. The positions are just a guide as some players could easily cross from one group to another.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Key Forwards

Redpath 26, Boyd 21, Josh Schache 20, Mullenger McHugh 20*


Medium/Small Forwards

Picken 30, Dickson 29, Crameri 28, C.Smith 24, Dale 20, Lipinski 18,


Ruckmen

Roughead 26, Campbell 25, English 19


Tall Midfielders

Jong 23, Macrae 22, Bontempelli 21, Dunkley 20, Greene 19


Small Midfielders

Liberatore 24, Wallis 24, Dahlhaus 24, Hunter 22, Honeychurch 22, McLean 21, Daniel 20,


Key Defenders

Morris 34, Trengove 27, Roberts 23, Adams, 23 Z.Cordy 20, Collins 19, Young 18


Medium/Small Defenders

Suckling 28, Wood 27, Biggs 25, Johannisen 24, Crozier 24, Williams 19, R.Smith 20*, Lynch 19*

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Rookie

Have updated this to include recent list changes,


Off - Murphy, Boyd, Stringer, Hamilton, Cloke, Prudden*, Tweedie*

On - Trengove, Crozier, Schache

- Currently space for only 2 draft picks (3 is mandatory)

Crameri & Honeychurch are uncontracted and one will most likely be delisted to make up the extra draft spot. R. Smith likely to be upgraded to the main list.

From this listing we need small/medium goal kickers. Stringer gone, Crameri likely to be gone, Picken & Dickson heading into the twighlight years leaves this area a bit light on. I'm talking about genuine goal kickers with some x factor, not the midfield hybrid type

Whilst this list doesn't analyse player traits the need for speed in midfield/forward would be be welcome.

[dog town]

If you go off an absolute max of 2 tall forwards, 1 ruck and 3 tall defenders a game then we have 9 talls missing out every week. That's regardless of how much they develop or how well they are playing. We have got the mix wrong over the last couple of years.

[jazzadogs]

If you go off an absolute max of 2 tall forwards, 1 ruck and 3 tall defenders a game then we have 9 talls missing out every week. That's regardless of how much they develop or how well they are playing. We have got the mix wrong over the last couple of years.

Agree that we're top heavy. I would think that Greene is in the tall forward category as well, but I don't watch much.

Our picks in the national draft must be pacy skilful goal scoring mids. It is the primary area that we are significantly lacking.

I would like our rookie pick to be a small forward. They tend to be hit and miss and a rookie listing would seem a safer option.

I have no names that I want to target, but those are my categories.

[Webby]

With Schache suddenly landing and Trengove coming to the club, should Fletch Roberts have been under the microscope in hindsight??

[Mantis]

Agree that we're top heavy. I would think that Greene is in the tall forward category as well, but I don't watch much.

Our picks in the national draft must be pacy skilful goal scoring mids. It is the primary area that we are significantly lacking.

I would like our rookie pick to be a small forward. They tend to be hit and miss and a rookie listing would seem a safer option.

I have no names that I want to target, but those are my categories.

He's 187cm, so fits into the mid-sized forward section... Didn't get much a run at it through injury, but he's got a reasonable tank and some nice traits.

Agree on the other points... most defintely need to add pace, run and kicking ability to the squad.


With Schache suddenly landing and Trengove coming to the club, should Fletch Roberts have been under the microscope in hindsight??

Most definitely. The decision to re-sign him at the time was poor, it looks down right stupid now.

He really should be in the same position as HC & Crameri, un-signed and under the pump to remain.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Agree that we're top heavy. I would think that Greene is in the tall forward category as well, but I don't watch much.

Our picks in the national draft must be pacy skilful goal scoring mids. It is the primary area that we are significantly lacking.

I would like our rookie pick to be a small forward. They tend to be hit and miss and a rookie listing would seem a safer option.

I have no names that I want to target, but those are my categories.

100% this is exactly what we need. Unfortunately pacy, skilful goal-kicking mids don't grow on trees. And i hope we just don't reach for them in the draft for the sake of it and end up with another Christian Howard. I'm backing Dal though even if Christian was a rookie mistake for him.

[ledge]

I think Declan Hamilton was a shocker I never saw anything in him except a primary school kid in high school who's voice hadn't broken.
And that was in VFL !

[The Doctor]

Updated as at 25th Oct (after drafting)

Listed here is our team in positional order and their respective ages for the majority of the 2017 season. The positions are just a guide as some players could easily cross from one group to another.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Key Forwards

Redpath 26, Boyd 21, Josh Schache 20, Mullenger McHugh 20*


Medium/Small Forwards

Picken 30, Dickson 29, C.Smith 24, Dale 20, Lipinski 18, Gowers 21


Ruckmen

Roughead 26, Campbell 25, English 19


Tall Midfielders

Jong 23, Macrae 22, Bontempelli 21, Dunkley 20, Greene 19


Small Midfielders

Liberatore 24, Wallis 24, Dahlhaus 24, Hunter 22, Honeychurch 22, McLean 21, Daniel 20, Porter 17


Key Defenders

Morris 34, Trengove 27, Roberts 23, Adams, 23 Z.Cordy 20, Collins 19, Young 18, Naughton 17


Medium/Small Defenders

Suckling 28, Wood 27, Biggs 25, Johannisen 24, Crozier 24, Williams 19, R.Smith 20*, Lynch 19* Richards 17

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Rookie

Have updated this to include recent list changes,


Off - Murphy, Boyd, Stringer, Hamilton, Cloke, Crameri Prudden*, Tweedie*

On - Trengove, Crozier, Schache

- R. Smith likely to be upgraded to the main list.

From this listing we need small/medium goal kickers. Stringer & Crameri are gone, Picken & Dickson heading into the twighlight years leaves this area a bit light on. I'm talking about genuine goal kickers with some x factor, not the midfield hybrid type

Whilst this list doesn't analyse player traits the need for speed in midfield/forward would be be welcome.

[Mofra]

Thanks for the outline - one tiny point though, isn't Fergus Greene more a forward at this stage?
HC plays as a pressure forward as much as a mid too.
Webb is an interesting one - he's been thrown around everywhere, dominates as a VFL mid but can't make the transition to AFL mid. Not sure where he'd be included really.

Agree on the goal kicking mids though - I really would like Coffield at 9 as he has Macrae's step and should transition into the midfield, but does that mean O'Brien & Murphy who have played HB at times this year may be off the radar?
I doubt Higgins slips to our pick 16 and Gryan Miers might be a reach at 16 but Dal knows best.

[The Doctor]

I wouldn't be surprised if we went for a player like Brander or Balta. Both key position size and capable swingmen. they are also goal kickers and could play that mobile CHF type role. The best CHF at the club at the moment imo is The Bont!

I also say this in view of the likes of Cloke, Crameri, Stringer all departing

O'Brien would suit us!

[Mofra]

I wouldn't be surprised if we went for a player like Brander or Balta. Both key position size and capable swingmen. they are also goal kickers and could play that mobile CHF type role. The best CHF at the club at the moment imo is The Bont!

I also say this in view of the likes of Cloke, Crameri, Stringer all departing

O'Brien would suit us!
One rumour had us interviewing Oscar Allen, although I imagine we do many interviews at this time of year.

I expect that with both picks inside the first round we go best available, with the exception of ruling line through Hayes as a ruckman after taking one last year.

[GVGjr]

Thanks for the outline - one tiny point though, isn't Fergus Greene more a forward at this stage?
HC plays as a pressure forward as much as a mid too.
Webb is an interesting one - he's been thrown around everywhere, dominates as a VFL mid but can't make the transition to AFL mid. Not sure where he'd be included really.

Agree on the goal kicking mids though - I really would like Coffield at 9 as he has Macrae's step and should transition into the midfield, but does that mean O'Brien & Murphy who have played HB at times this year may be off the radar?
I doubt Higgins slips to our pick 16 and Gryan Miers might be a reach at 16 but Dal knows best.

I've really been impressed by Greene and hope he has an injury free run at it next year.

I rate the players you have mentioned.

[LostDoggy]

One rumour had us interviewing Oscar Allen, although I imagine we do many interviews at this time of year.

I expect that with both picks inside the first round we go best available, with the exception of ruling line through Hayes as a ruckman after taking one last year.
I saw an interview with Allen where he said (as of the combine) that 16 clubs have interviewed him so far, if we are 1 of the 16, I'm not sure it's hugely indicative of our level of interest.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I've really been impressed by Greene and hope he has an injury free run at it next year.

I rate the players you have mentioned.

Is Greene quick GVG?

[Bulldog Revolution]

Is Greene quick GVG?

Don't know about his burst but he has a Huge aerobic tank - and courageous in the air - looked a real surprise packet early in the vfl season - I'm excited to see his development in 2018

[GVGjr]

Is Greene quick GVG?

Yes, he's quick and has a great endurance base but there are two other traits with his game that I value.
1) I saw him out mark Sam Durdin in contest by out positioning him with his body. He was giving away about 10cm in height and nearly 20kg in weight.
2) He is an accurate kick for goal with a great routine

At the Legends and Young Guns function he sat at my table and I was impressed with his knowledge on how he timed his contact with Durdin and that his father stepped him through a goal kicking routine. He's a really good young bloke as well.

I'm as excited by his potential as I am with English, Lipinski and Young. He had some challenges this year with a rib injury and then a wrist injury so it's vital he gets some continuity with his football in 2018.

His 15.6 beep test got him noticed but there is a bit more to him than just that.

[Twodogs]

Yes, he's quick and has a great endurance base but there are two other traits with his game that I value.
1) I saw him out mark Sam Durdin in contest by out positioning him with his body. He was giving away about 10cm in height and nearly 20kg in weight.
2) He is an accurate kick for goal with a great routine

At the Legends and Young Guns function he sat at my table and I was impressed with his knowledge on how he timed his contact with Durdin and that his father stepped him through a goal kicking routine. He's a really good young bloke as well.

I'm as excited by his potential as I am with English, Lipinski and Young. He had some challenges this year with a rib injury and then a wrist injury so it's vital he gets some continuity with his football in 2018.

His 15.6 beep test got him noticed but there is a bit more to him than just that.


Bestowing a good goal kicking routine is a fatherly duty.

Manys the time I'm watching a game with my son and hear "how hard is it to keep your head over the ball as you kick it?" when an easy goal is missed

[GVGjr]

Bestowing a good goal kicking routine is a fatherly duty.

I think you could spend some time with Greene and then use a copy of his routine to fix some of the flaws with the other guys.

[Twodogs]

I think you could spend some time with Greene and then use a copy of his routine to fix some of the flaws with the other guys.

I'm serious when I say that kicking really has to be one of the factors that our recruits have to be pretty good at. We have to make up for the lousy kicks in our team or it will reach some sort of critical mass.

[Bulldog4life]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2017-10-28/one-year-on-your-clubs-2016-draftees

Pick 19: Tim English
The West Australian appeared an absolute steal on draft night, and that's what the mobile ruckman looks destined to be. While he only performed serviceably in his two senior games this season, it was the form that the lightly-built 20-year-old showed at VFL that has the Dogs very excited. For a player of 206cm, English has fantastic foot skills, has a smart football brain and has a lovely pair of hands. Look for him to make big strides next season.

Pick 28: Patrick Lipinski
The classy medium forward made a final-round senior debut after playing some good football in the VFL. The Northern Knights product can win the ball on the inside and outside, and is also strong overhead. Should get more opportunities in 2018 after injuries stymied his progress at times. Should be a midfield option in the future when he builds his fitness.

Pick 49: Lewis Young
Arriving at Whitten Oval as a key forward prospect, the South Australian was trialed down back in the VFL with promising results. Strong state league form was rewarded with a debut in round 17 against Carlton, and didn't lose his place for the remainder of the season. The football world was abuzz after he took several intercept marks in a starring performance versus the Blues. Only draft eligible by a week, another pre-season in the gym should allow him to play on the bigger bodies.

Pick 70: Fergus Greene
The smart medium forward burst onto the scene with eight goals in his first two VFL matches, with his leading and game sense a standout. A wrist injury and rigors of a long season only allowed the 19-year-old to play seven state league games. In the mould of teammate Tory Dickson, Greene will be looking for luck in 2018.

Rookie selection pick 18: Nathan Mullenger-McHugh
The versatile key position prospect was trialed at both ends of the ground in the VFL with promising results. Very raw, the Eastern Ranges product has a strong pair of hands, good closing speed and is very competitive. A productive summer in the gym could see him ready for a senior debut.

Rookie selection pick 35: Josh Prudden
After being delisted after several injury-ravaged seasons on the senior list, the midfielder missed a fair chuck of the VFL season with a hamstring injury. Another season bereft of continuity saw 23-year-old delisted again without adding to four senior games. – Ryan Davidson