Who would you have JMac target this year?

[bulldogtragic]

Apparently Sam Reid just re-signed with the swanies

Phew!

So who are now gettable with Reid & Jones signing, and want-able is the question?

[josie]

I like your lateral thinking BT. Also think Webb looked alright playing high half forward against Bombers.

[josie]

Me three for Gunston. Dickson looking the worst for wear. Perfect replacement. Is he versatile eg has he played in other positions?

[divvydan]

Surely pick 6 for Lachie Veale is far worse a manipulation of the trade system from us and Hawks, than say Tippett and pick 30 for pick 75 (St Kilda's 5th coming to us) They signed off on the Veale Deal.

The Veale Deal was one of the primary reasons why the AFL changed its rules around trading so that the AFL has to tick off on all trades and must see them being reasonably fair in order to do so. At the time there was nothing the AFL could really do if clubs wanted to game the system as we and Hawthorn did.

[bulldogtragic]

The Veale Deal was one of the primary reasons why the AFL changed its rules around trading so that the AFL has to tick off on all trades and must see them being reasonably fair in order to do so. At the time there was nothing the AFL could really do if clubs wanted to game the system as we and Hawthorn did.

As they should of. It was a pretty shitty thing to do, and everyone in even remote touch of it (the pick 6) including Nathan Brown and Essendon copped their karmic whack for it (Veale/Rawlings, Jacobs & Bradley stink it up, and poor Naf didn't fire a shot at Richmond).

[azabob]

How much would Jack Billings command to leave the saints?

[bulldogtragic]

How much would Jack Billings command to leave the saints?

Never to be compared to the Bonts ever, ever again. :D

[bornadog]

If we are still good for HBFs next year, I wonder if JJ could be the quick and high pressure forward that can chase down tackle and rush opposition disposal. His goal kicking seems steady and overhead marking also seems ok. Or could we try Lynch in the forward pocket. It's a vital spot these days and I don't see Clay Smith being the versatile, nimble forward pocket type.

JJ is actually more valuable running and bouncing off the HBF. We saw in the finals last year how damaging that can be.

[GVGjr]

What about Gunston? I'd think the Hawks would be keen to trade back into the first round

I think he would be very hard to pry away from the Hawks. They'll let others go before Gunston

[Sedat]

I'd make some enquiries about Papley at the end of the season - smart, skilled, quick, natural goal kicker, great defensive pressure. Surely there will be a squeeze on their salary cap now that Reid has been re-signed.

[1eyedog]

How much would Jack Billings command to leave the saints?

Too much.

[Twodogs]

I wasn't referring to Alir as he has already been discussed previously, just the players I highlighted in bold.


I just like saying Alir Alir I think.

[comrade]

I'd make some enquiries about Papley at the end of the season - smart, skilled, quick, natural goal kicker, great defensive pressure. Surely there will be a squeeze on their salary cap now that Reid has been re-signed.

For sure, just the type of natural forward we're missing and would suit the chaotic nature we bring the ball in.

[azabob]

I'd make some enquiries about Papley at the end of the season - smart, skilled, quick, natural goal kicker, great defensive pressure. Surely there will be a squeeze on their salary cap now that Reid has been re-signed.

How was Papely in the other finals last year? He struggled in the GF.

[Ozza]

How was Papely in the other finals last year? He struggled in the GF.

Kicked 3 in the prelim, kicked 4 in the semi, and 2 in the qualifying. Good finals series from Papley. Even in the Grand Final - although he missed his only shot at goal, he did get the footy 15 times. Was only a 20 year old, and historically, small forward/forward pocket is a tough position to play in Grand Finals/vs the best teams.

[lemmon]

I think he would be very hard to pry away from the Hawks. They'll let others go before Gunston

Not sure they've got that kind of value in their list elsewhere. Breust wants to be a one club player, Cyril is untouchable, perhaps Isaac Smith. Very interesting to see how they get back into the first round.

[bulldogtragic]

Not sure they've got that kind of value in their list elsewhere. Breust wants to be a one club player, Cyril is untouchable, perhaps Isaac Smith. Very interesting to see how they get back into the first round.

Salary might be an issue. He signed on for $650,000 a year, but apparently knocked back offers around the million dollar mark, you know for loyalty and sacrificing money for the team.... A year before that club made it clear it burns you when necessary.... I guess the question is whether he would be happy to continue else where on just $650,000.

[Axe Man]

Me three for Gunston. Dickson looking the worst for wear. Perfect replacement. Is he versatile eg has he played in other positions?

Gunston has been playing in defence for the last month or so and playing very well. So yes - he is versatile. I doubt he is going anywhere though.

[bulldogtragic]

Kicked 3 in the prelim, kicked 4 in the semi, and 2 in the qualifying. Good finals series from Papley. Even in the Grand Final - although he missed his only shot at goal, he did get the footy 15 times. Was only a 20 year old, and historically, small forward/forward pocket is a tough position to play in Grand Finals/vs the best teams.

What do you reckon he's worth trade wise?

[Happy Days]

Kicked 3 in the prelim, kicked 4 in the semi, and 2 in the qualifying. Good finals series from Papley. Even in the Grand Final - although he missed his only shot at goal, he did get the footy 15 times. Was only a 20 year old, and historically, small forward/forward pocket is a tough position to play in Grand Finals/vs the best teams.

He's also improved out of sight since last season. He's one of the more dangerous players around goals already, his skills are great, and he's a speedy little bastard. Big wrap for him, he'd be a great addition.

Liam Ryan in the WAFL has kicked about 60 goals already this year, he's a small forward, only 20 years old and seems to have a knack for doing cool shit. MJP is a big wrap for him too as far as I can remember, and I hope he's someone we're looking hard at.

[boydogs]

seems to have a knack for doing cool shit

I'm in :D

[lemmon]

Liam Ryan in the WAFL has kicked about 60 goals already this year, he's a small forward, only 20 years old and seems to have a knack for doing cool shit. MJP is a big wrap for him too as far as I can remember, and I hope he's someone we're looking hard at.

Invited to the state combine again as I believe he was last year.

[jeemak]

How much would Jack Billings command to leave the saints?

I think you'd have to offer up a minimum four year deal at $650K, probably front loaded with a view to renegotiating and extending prior to term given how eager the Saints will be to keep him. Sure he's no Bont, but he's going to be a very good player and if we had him on our list we'd consider him to be untouchable.

Comparison to Devon Smith at the same age:

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?playerStatus1=A&tid1=16&playerStatus2=A&tid2=25&type=A&pid1=3920&pid2=3652&fid1=O&fid2=O

How much would Smith cost? I only use him as a comparison given he's touted as a trade target, I think Billings will turn out to be more of a midfielder sooner rather than later.

[azabob]

Thanks jeemak. I also rate him highly and he would slot in very very nicely into our midfield and forward line. Money you have suggested sounds about right. We'd probably have to give a player and a high draft pick.

[jeemak]

He'd require a high draft pick, meaning if all goes reasonably well this year we'd only likely go after him if we had an excellent player pinched from under our noses and were able to secure that high draft pick as a result.

Or we could trade a really good player plus our first to get that high pick, but who would be trade?

[bornadog]

According to Brian Waldron on SEN, we are into Tippett :eek:

[Bulldog4life]

According to Brian Waldron on SEN, we are into Tippett :eek:

He also said last week it was a certainty Lever would be at Collingwood next year

[Happy Days]

According to Brian Waldron on SEN, we are into Tippett :eek:

Waldron is a sad, sad man trying to cling to any semblance of relevance he once had. Ignore and pity him only.

[bornadog]

Waldron is a sad, sad man trying to cling to any semblance of relevance he once had. Ignore and pity him only.

That is exactly what I think as well.

[GVGjr]

He also said last week it was a certainty Lever would be at Collingwood next year

Reasonable chance I would say. There are some fairly strong opinions that both Melbourne and Collingwood are ahead of us.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

I seriously hope we've got some irons in the fire and we are just keeping quiet publicly like we did with Boyd.

[ledge]

Reasonable chance I would say. There are some fairly strong opinions that both Melbourne and Collingwood are ahead of us.

According to Lever himself he has not had any meetings with Melbourne.

[GVGjr]

According to Lever himself he has not had any meetings with Melbourne.

He hasn't. His manager has

[bulldogtragic]

Reasonable chance I would say. There are some fairly strong opinions that both Melbourne and Collingwood are ahead of us.

Has Caro changed her view. A couple of weeks back she said Dogs were in front and the Collingwood talks/interview were not good.

[GVGjr]

Has Caro changed her view. A couple of weeks back she said Dogs were in front and the Collingwood talks/interview were not good.

I haven't seen anything from Caro but my mail is that we are in the mix but perhaps behind both Melbourne and Collingwood.

[bulldogtragic]

I haven't seen anything from Caro but my mail is that we are in the mix but perhaps behind both Melbourne and Collingwood.

On dollars or destination? (If you know)

[Happy Days]

I haven't seen anything from Caro but my mail is that we are in the mix but perhaps behind both Melbourne and Collingwood.

I've heard that Collingwood stuffed up their pitch to him, but personally I suspect (purely based on media discussion) we might be behind Melbourne.

Regardless of "mail", it wouldn't really make sense to go past two clubs with extremely bright outlooks to play for one that can't even so much as operate a light switch.

[ledge]

You would think we would be the " go to club" out of the three , Melbourne are looking like rabble again and Collingwood are going through a review of everything while we are just going to get better

[GVGjr]

I've heard that Collingwood stuffed up their pitch to him, but personally I suspect (purely based on media discussion) we might be behind Melbourne.

Regardless of "mail", it wouldn't really make sense to go past two clubs with extremely bright outlooks to play for one that can't even so much as operate a light switch.

I tend to agree, Lever to the Pies probably won't make them that much better in terms of finals contention but they are one of the biggest clubs and would still be regarded as a destination club.
If he came to Melbourne or us then it improves already strong lists that are regarded as finals bound.

You could imagine Adelaide would probably prefer that if he has to go then the Pies can offer them an earlier pick.

[GVGjr]

On dollars or destination? (If you know)

I don't think we will be out bid by any large amount so it's probably not purely a dollar value consideration that gets it done.

[Mantis]

You would think we would be the " go to club" out of the three , Melbourne are looking like rabble again and Collingwood are going through a review of everything while we are just going to get better

In what way?

Sure they were disappointing last week, but they have had a pretty solid year and seem to be on the right path.

[comrade]

In what way?

Sure they were disappointing last week, but they have had a pretty solid year and seem to be on the right path.

Up until a fortnight ago, I genuinely thought they were a dark horse for the flag. Not sure what's happened but at their best, they're capable of beating any team in the 8 in my opinion.

[ledge]

They have dropped right away, they are tired and done , I guess this week will tell but they were terrible last week.

[Mantis]

They have dropped right away, they are tired and done , I guess this week will tell but they were terrible last week.

They were terrible last week, but they were playing the 2nd placed team who put in one of their better performances of the year. We on the other hand had to battle our ass off to beat the bottom team.

And Lever's decision will be based on where he sees the team in the next 5-10 years, not right now... and Melbourne look as well positioned as anyone to be at the pointy end of the ladder through this period.

[bornadog]

They were terrible last week, but they were playing the 2nd placed team who put in one of their better performances of the year. We on the other hand had to battle our ass off to beat the bottom team.

And Lever's decision will be based on where he sees the team in the next 5-10 years, not right now... and Melbourne look as well positioned as anyone to be at the pointy end of the ladder through this period.

Melbourne have only won 2 of the last 6 games losing to teams above them, plus North in Hobart.

[Mantis]

Melbourne have only won 2 of the last 6 games losing to teams above them, plus North in Hobart.

Yet we are the flavour of the month again after winning games (not really convincingly) against 3 of the bottom 4 teams + Essendon.. No doubt Melbourne's form has dropped off, but across the year they have been pretty good and as with us have had their share of injuries to deal with.

[Topdog]

For all the news love going their way this year and all the hangover talk we have had to be a game clear of them is surprising.

They've dropped off for sure but they don't look like a rabble just yet. Lose this week and you'd have to question their mental toughness

[ledge]

They were terrible last week, but they were playing the 2nd placed team who put in one of their better performances of the year. We on the other hand had to battle our ass off to beat the bottom team.

And Lever's decision will be based on where he sees the team in the next 5-10 years, not right now... and Melbourne look as well positioned as anyone to be at the pointy end of the ladder through this period.

And in the next 5 to 10 years I see us as being the team to be at the pointy end of the ladder more than Melbourne or Collingwood
Why would you think Melbourne are better placed than us ?
We have Boyd, going this year , Murphy and Morrid will be gone by the end of next year. We will have a backline that is around his age and players like the Bont, Stringer Macrae libber hunter at their best. Our list is very young and has a massive future over the next 5-10 years.

[Mantis]

And in the next 5 to 10 years I see us as being the team to be at the pointy end of the ladder more than Melbourne or Collingwood
Why would you think Melbourne are better placed than us ?
We have Boyd, going this year , Murphy and Morrid will be gone by the end of next year. We will have a backline that is around his age and players like the Bont, Stringer Macrae libber hunter at their best. Our list is very young and has a massive future over the next 5-10 years.

Didn't say that they were.

[ledge]

Didn't say that they were.
Well I don't see them as well positioned as us , plus he is a Romsey , western jet boy, closer to home . If anything we suit him better than any team.

[Remi Moses]

I think he played with Calder

[Remi Moses]

Just watching box hill and Essendon and wonder if we'd look at Paul Puopolo.
Out of contract at the end of 18. Could do with his forward pressure , although he turns 30 this year.

[GVGjr]

I wonder if Levi Casboult should be in the mix. He's very much a structure player but we need a bit of that. Cloke and Redpath haven't quite worked out like we would have hoped and there must be a query on Crameri's future with us. A key forward who can play a role in the ruck and take a contested mark must have some appeal.

[bornadog]

I wonder if Levi Casboult should be in the mix. He's very much a structure player but we need a bit of that. Cloke and Redpath haven't quite worked out like we would have hoped and there must be a query on Crameri's future with us. A key forward who can play a role in the ruck and take a contested mark must have some appeal.

I would certainly be making a pitch for him. He is the number one contested mark in the AFL and he is still only 27 years old (28 at the start of next season) He is also 201cm, making him handy. Of course his major issue is kicking goals, but I would still be interested.

[DOG GOD]

I'm also interested in casboult. Yes he can't kick. Either can most our fwd line, but what he can do is take a contested Mark, something 99% of our current fwd line can't do.

The guy with the most contested marks playing for Carlton. Imagine how many he could take with all our inside 50's.

[GVGjr]

I'm also interested in casboult. Yes he can't kick. Either can most our fwd line, but what he can do is take a contested Mark, something 99% of our current fwd line can't do.

The guy with the most contested marks playing for Carlton. Imagine how many he could take with all our inside 50's.

Check his stats this year, there has been some improvement.

[azabob]

During Casboults last contract negotiations didnt we put an offer to him? Not sure whether to laugh or cry this time.

[jeemak]

I wonder if Levi Casboult should be in the mix. He's very much a structure player but we need a bit of that. Cloke and Redpath haven't quite worked out like we would have hoped and there must be a query on Crameri's future with us. A key forward who can play a role in the ruck and take a contested mark must have some appeal.

Isn't that what Tom Boyd is supposed to do?

[GVGjr]

Isn't that what Tom Boyd is supposed to do?

Yes, we need two players taking a grab up forward

[Sedat]

I wonder if Levi Casboult should be in the mix. He's very much a structure player but we need a bit of that. Cloke and Redpath haven't quite worked out like we would have hoped and there must be a query on Crameri's future with us. A key forward who can play a role in the ruck and take a contested mark must have some appeal.
Carlton are hanging out for a team gullible enough to offer Casboult decent coin so that they can take the pick 18 odd as compo and run. He has one trick - great hands - and nothing else. His 2nd efforts are comically bad. Also doesn't have a big tank so cannot ruck for long periods. His one fantastic strength is nowhere near enough for us to consider him IMO.

[Twodogs]

One thing cars auk has done that no other forward in the AFL seems to bother with is work on and improve his kickin, though he's coming from a low base.

Still a no from me for all the reasons Sedat said, he's basically a one trick pony. We'd be saying "why are we paying him all that money? At least Suckling can kick" In no time.

[GVGjr]

Carlton are hanging out for a team gullible enough to offer Casboult decent coin so that they can take the pick 18 odd as compo and run. He has one trick - great hands - and nothing else. His 2nd efforts are comically bad. Also doesn't have a big tank so cannot ruck for long periods. His one fantastic strength is nowhere near enough for us to consider him IMO.

Fair observation, he's kicked a few goals this year though so it's not just some marking power he provides.

I don't like using stats that much but his 2017 figures are at least interesting:
10 disposals a game, 7 hit outs, just under 6 marks, just under 2 tackles and 31 goals 18 so far.

[GVGjr]

I know the Swans are on a good stretch of performances but I wonder why Aliir Aliir isn't getting a game?
From what I've seen of him there should be a few clubs interested. If we are as interested in Lever as is being reported I guess we wouldn't find Aliir that appealing but he could be a decent back up option if the Swans can't find a spot for him.

[azabob]

I know the Swans are on a good stretch of performances but I wonder why Aliir Aliir isn't getting a game?
From what I've seen of him there should be a few clubs interested. If we are as interested in Lever as is being reported I guess we wouldn't find Aliir that appealing but he could be a decent back up option if the Swans can't find a spot for him.

From what I understand when he got dropped for missing training Lewis Melican came in and hasn't put a foot wrong. Will be interesting to see how bad Melican injury is from yesterday and if Allir is next in line.

[Twodogs]

I know the Swans are on a good stretch of performances but I wonder why Aliir Aliir isn't getting a game?
From what I've seen of him there should be a few clubs interested. If we are as interested in Lever as is being reported I guess we wouldn't find Aliir that appealing but he could be a decent back up option if the Swans can't find a spot for him.


From what I understand when he got dropped for missing training Lewis Melican came in and hasn't put a foot wrong. Will be interesting to see how bad Melican injury is from yesterday and if Allir is next in line.

Yep, got dropped for disciplinary reasons and can't get back. I'd take him over Lever,

[Remi Moses]

I'd heard they were concerned with Allir's kicking , and needed to be worked on.
Agree he's a viable alternative if Lever doesn't come

[Remi Moses]

What are people's thoughts on Matt Taberner?
Pretty good game in a team that got poleaxed

[bornadog]

Carlton are hanging out for a team gullible enough to offer Casboult decent coin so that they can take the pick 18 odd as compo and run. He has one trick - great hands - and nothing else. His 2nd efforts are comically bad. Also doesn't have a big tank so cannot ruck for long periods. His one fantastic strength is nowhere near enough for us to consider him IMO.

According to Pickering, Carlton has offered up $400,000 and he won't accept it. story here
(http://aflnation.com.au/2017/08/13/1758/)

[bulldogtragic]

According to Pickering, Carlton has offered up $400,000 and he won't accept it. story here
(http://aflnation.com.au/2017/08/13/1758/)

Carlton might be strategically using free agency to get good compo returns. If they have pick 1 or 2 and 19 or 20, if they can get a club offering 3+ years on good coin to Casboult or Kruezer, they might have a very, very strong draft. They go to the draft with 4 picks inside the first 22 (maybe more if Gibbs trade happens) and then use late picks to try to fill the holes until their kids develop with targets like Tom Campbell or Jack Redpath (who another poster said they have interest in). I reckon their free agency compo would be a little better than a trade.

[comrade]

Casboult would be a huge blunder. Just another clogger who won't add anything we don't already have on the list.

[bulldogtragic]

Casboult would be a huge blunder. Just another clogger who won't add anything we don't already have on the list.

Yep. No doubt we have a gap up there, Moreso if Redpath leaves. But the most talented tall is Lever. I'd rather pursue this avenue and look at our talls. Adams & Young were forwards before joining the club. Both are excellent marks. Rather than clog up our forwardline with a trade, we should be looking at the list and seeing what we can do with lateral thinking. The key of trading is not height, but talent. I think a Lever, Cordy, Wood & Collins and either Adams or Young would give us a very well rounded defence with smalls too for 5-10 years. If we can get Tom Boyd with another good marking athletic tall in Adams or Young (Cloke next year too) with the other forwards sounds good. So I would chase the A grade tall, and manoeuvre the magnets on the board.

Then we have the issue of how to kick to the forwards. The only way I can see us fixing this is changing assistants, and more importantly numerous possibly unpopular trades. But what the point of playing another season missing easy targets, having horrible inside 50's, not kicking to forwards advantage and of course missing more than 50% of shots at goal. If we can't get this fixed, we are stuffed again. And kids who can kick like Webb, will be else where next year while we play Wallis as a CHF and Smith as our nimble forward pocket just to have one paced inside mids across most lines.

[comrade]

Yep. No doubt we have a gap up there, Moreso if Redpath leaves. But the most talented tall is Lever. I'd rather pursue this avenue and look at our talls. Adams & Young were forwards before joining the club. Both are excellent marks. Rather than clog up our forwardline with a trade, we should be looking at the list and seeing what we can do with lateral thinking. The key of trading is not height, but talent. I think a Lever, Cordy, Wood & Collins and either Adams or Young would give us a very well rounded defence with smalls too for 5-10 years. If we can get Tom Boyd with another good marking athletic tall in Adams or Young (Cloke next year too) with the other forwards sounds good. So I would chase the A grade tall, and manoeuvre the magnets on the board.

Then we have the issue of how to kick to the forwards. The only way I can see us fixing this is changing assistants, and more importantly numerous possibly unpopular trades. But what the point of playing another season missing easy targets, having horrible inside 50's, not kicking to forwards advantage and of course missing more than 50% of shots at goal. If we can't get this fixed, we are stuffed again. And kids who can kick like Webb, will be else where next year while we play Wallis as a CHF and Smith as our nimble forward pocket just to have one paced inside mids across most lines.

Casboult would join the pantheon of the many below average key forwards the Bulldogs have tried to shoe horn into the side that ultimately provide zero return on investment.

[ratsmac]

Casboult would join the pantheon of the many below average key forwards the Bulldogs have tried to shoe horn into the side that ultimately provide zero return on investment.

I couldn't have said it better.

[Twodogs]

Casboult would join the pantheon of the many below average key forwards the Bulldogs have tried to shoe horn into the side that ultimately provide zero return on investment.

They used to say that you weren't washed up as a full forward until you'd been traded to Footscray. I'd hate see us go back to those days.

[Remi Moses]

No to casboult , he sounds Richmond bound .

[josie]

Is Baltic fr Freo any good? Wants to come home to vic. From his draft year it appears he is inside talented midfielder, with more footy smarts to find space rather than speed. Pity he is not quick. Anyone seen his games? I know he played against us earlier in year at Subi where Freo beat us after we wer ahead a 3/4 time.

[GVGjr]

Is Baltic fr Freo any good? Wants to come home to vic. From his draft year it appears he is inside talented midfielder, with more footy smarts to find space rather than speed. Pity he is not quick. Anyone seen his games? I know he played against us earlier in year at Subi where Freo beat us after we wer ahead a 3/4 time.

Harley Balic was a pretty decent junior footballer. Shame he hasn't adjusted to either living in WA or the demands of AFL footy.

Probably worth having a chat to

[Remi Moses]

Daniel Menzel is out of contract and according to Mark Stevens Geelong haven't made an offer !
Also looks like they won't offer Motlop a contact . Any interest , in particular Menzel?

[mjp]

Harley Balic was a pretty decent junior footballer. Shame he hasn't adjusted to either living in WA or the demands of AFL footy.


This story will never come out - Perth is a small town and the journo's are 'concerned' they will lose access to the club if they spill the beans. Would need to be an eastern states journo for an organisation that is not in partnership with the AFL.

Short story - yes, we should be talking to a very clever and capable player.

[bulldogtragic]

Daniel Menzel is out of contract and according to Mark Stevens Geelong haven't made an offer !
Also looks like they won't offer Motlop a contact . Any interest , in particular Menzel?

Motlop 2 years at $350,000 or no. My preference is no.
Menzel. Depends. We have Bob, Roarke, Smith, Redders and Jong with prior ACL injuries. I think a senior poster a while back put up stats that showed exponential risk in recurrence of ACLs in how many they've done. To add in another with horror ACL issues, makes me worried about holding onto that risk.

[mjp]

Motlop 2 years at $350,000 or no. My preference is no.


Did anyone watch Richmond vs Geelong? Motlop is worth DOUBLE that. DOUBLE!

[Sedat]

Carlton might be strategically using free agency to get good compo returns. If they have pick 1 or 2 and 19 or 20, if they can get a club offering 3+ years on good coin to Casboult or Kruezer, they might have a very, very strong draft. They go to the draft with 4 picks inside the first 22 (maybe more if Gibbs trade happens) and then use late picks to try to fill the holes until their kids develop with targets like Tom Campbell or Jack Redpath (who another poster said they have interest in). I reckon their free agency compo would be a little better than a trade.
Yep, they want one more lick of the ND spoon, and losing Casboult as a FA on biggish coin is exactly what they are angling for. Hopefully we aren't involved as he has far too many limitations as a player that his one great asset cannot overcome.

[Twodogs]

Did anyone watch Richmond vs Geelong? Motlop is worth DOUBLE that. DOUBLE!


He as good but the problem is he only produces when he feels like producing it.

[ReLoad]

Can't really reveal my source, but good a good word that Norf are really into Stringer.

Given he is contracted some negotiations need to be done, but it's an interesting one given his age and upside.

Thoughts? I don't think there is anyone (apart from Ben brown who they would never trade out) on their list I'd want?

[bulldogsthru&thru]

No one on their list interests me in a trade with Stringer and that includes Ben Brown. Pick 1-3 would be what we want. Then trade that to GWS for Kelly. I'd be happy with this.

Other than that I wouldn't trade Stringer for much else. He's very valuable to us as he's exactly what we need. He's underperforming right now but so are a lot of other players

[Mantis]

No one on their list interests me in a trade with Stringer and that includes Ben Brown. Pick 1-3 would be what we want. Then trade that to GWS for Kelly. I'd be happy with this.

Other than that I wouldn't trade Stringer for much else. He's very valuable to us as he's exactly what we need. He's underperforming right now but so are a lot of other players

Stringer has been underperforming for 2 years.. when does enough become enough?

And Stringer doesn't equal Kelly which you are suggesting.

[bulldogtragic]

Can't really reveal my source, but good a good word that Norf are really into Stringer.

Given he is contracted some negotiations need to be done, but it's an interesting one given his age and upside.

Thoughts? I don't think there is anyone (apart from Ben brown who they would never trade out) on their list I'd want?


No one on their list interests me in a trade with Stringer and that includes Ben Brown. Pick 1-3 would be what we want. Then trade that to GWS for Kelly. I'd be happy with this.

Other than that I wouldn't trade Stringer for much else. He's very valuable to us as he's exactly what we need. He's underperforming right now but so are a lot of other players

Yep. If North lose their last two, and Carlton beat Hawks this week, they have pick 1. So a straight swap given Stringer is under contract, and this interest. But anything other than 'overs' wouldn't be worth it.

[bornadog]

Stringer has been underperforming for 2 years.. when does enough become enough?

And Stringer doesn't equal Kelly which you are suggesting.


Still our leading goal kicker past two years.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Stringer has been underperforming for 2 years.. when does enough become enough?

And Stringer doesn't equal Kelly which you are suggesting.
Where did I suggest Stringer equals Kelly? The poster mentioned north are into Stringer in a big way. I'm going off market value for a contracted player and if we didn't receive norths first pick in a trade for Stringer I'd be disappointed

[Mantis]

Still our leading goal kicker past two years.

And this excites me in what way?

[Mantis]

Where did I suggest Stringer equals Kelly? The poster mentioned north are into Stringer in a big way. I'm going off market value and if we didn't receive norths first pick in a trade for Stringer I'd be disappointed

By stating we trade the pick that way get from Norf for Stringer to GWS for Kelly... to me that means Stringer and Kelly have the same value.

Kelly is worth more than pick 1-3... A known is worth more than unknown.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

By stating we trade the pick that way get from Norf for Stringer to GWS for Kelly... to me that means Stringer and Kelly have the same value.

Kelly is worth more than pick 1-3... A known is worth more than unknown.
Kelly will be uncontracted and assuming he has nominated us. I'm not sure more than pick 1-3 would be required. Dangerfield was worth picks 9 and 28. Thy can have our 2nd rounder if they really want

[Twodogs]

Judd was worth pick 3 and 20 and a promising (but by no means a certain star) Josh Kennedy to Carlton who got a third rounder back.

Is Kelly worth the promising player and second round pick that West Coast got for Judd? I'd think Judd would be worth a bit more than
Kelly. Not a whole heap but Judd was a Brownlow medalist and premiership captain at the time he changed clubs. Pick 3 is fair for Kelly.

[bornadog]

I am not prepared to give up Stringer, he is a first rounder and could easily have been pick 1, if it wasn't for his broken leg.

He is still a young bloke and can be a match winner.

UNTOUCHABLE.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Stringer has been underperforming for 2 years.. when does enough become enough?

And Stringer doesn't equal Kelly which you are suggesting.

This. So much this.

I am so sick of reading about Stringer's upside and match winning ability. He has been severely under performing for 2 years!

2 years is not a form slump.

It's simple; opposition sides don't allow Jake a free run back to goal ala 2015 and he has not been able to adjust ever since because 1) he doesn't lead up at the ball carrier well 2) his marking is poor and 3) his work rate is crap.

The only option I see is to turn Stringer into a midfielder, but to do so, he needs to get fit enough which I have seen no willing evidence that he wants to do so. For a player of his size and strength, he doesn't win much ball himself either.

If we could get Norf's first round pick I'd take it and run.

[lemmon]

I am not prepared to give up Stringer, he is a first rounder and could easily have been pick 1, if it wasn't for his broken leg.

He is still a young bloke and can be a match winner.

UNTOUCHABLE.

That's the problem with Stringer though, he's had one outstanding season but apart from that we talk about his draft position or the player that's the most talented on the track.

He'll be 24 by round 1 next year and we're yet to see anything but a pretty inconsistent bits and pieces player - North would be nuts to trade a top 3 pick for him.

[Bullies]

This. So much this.

I am so sick of reading about Stringer's upside and match winning ability. He has been severely under performing for 2 years!

2 years is not a form slump.

It's simple; opposition sides don't allow Jake a free run back to goal ala 2015 and he has not been able to adjust ever since because 1) he doesn't lead up at the ball carrier well 2) his marking is poor and 3) his work rate is crap.

The only option I see is to turn Stringer into a midfielder, but to do so, he needs to get fit enough which I have seen no willing evidence that he wants to do so. For a player of his size and strength, he doesn't win much ball himself either.

If we could get Norf's first round pick I'd take it and run. You are right. No one will give up a No:1 pick for Stringer. His work rate is average at best and when things don't go to his liking he can't work his way out of it. Not sure why they have never played him off half back.

[bornadog]

That's the problem with Stringer though, he's had one outstanding season but apart from that we talk about his draft position or the player that's the most talented on the track.

He'll be 24 by round 1 next year and we're yet to see anything but a pretty inconsistent bits and pieces player - North would be nuts to trade a top 3 pick for him.

He kicked 42 goals last year and 56 the year before - who else has done that, only Dickson. This year he has missed games due to hamstring issues. Yeah we talk about him a lot because we expect him to be the best in the AFL, maybe he just isn't. Yes he will be 24 next year and will start to get towards his peak. Stringer is not the problem at the club right now.

For what it's worth, Kelly is not worth $1 million per year, but the market wants him and will pay it. I hope we don't pay that sort of cash.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Last season was certainly disappointing for Stringer but he had his own personal battles to deal with. And this year almost none of our players have really shown much.

I don't want to try make excuses for him. Because he has been poor. But let's not forget he has single handed won us games in the past. Even this season against the saints. We don't win without him. He's on shaky ground no doubt but he's still a vital player for us

[Ozza]

He kicked 42 goals last year and 56 the year before - who else has done that, only Dickson. This year he has missed games due to hamstring issues. Yeah we talk about him a lot because we expect him to be the best in the AFL, maybe he just isn't. Yes he will be 24 next year and will start to get towards his peak. Stringer is not the problem at the club right now.

For what it's worth, Kelly is not worth $1 million per year, but the market wants him and will pay it. I hope we don't pay that sort of cash.

Agree with the vast majority of your post. Except for the part about Kelly not being worth $1m per year. He is worth every bit of that in my view. He will be vying with Bontempelli and Martin as the best midfielder in the game very soon - and the way he runs both ways, hits the scoreboard, and rarely wastes a possession - make him such an appealing prospect to bring into any team.

[Remi Moses]

Gee the blokes had a fair bit going on in his personal life , and at his age would be extra difficult to cope with .
Agree that he needs to be more consistent with his effort and approach to the ball, but I'd be willing to give him 12 months .

[bornadog]

Agree with the vast majority of your post. Except for the part about Kelly not being worth $1m per year. He is worth every bit of that in my view. He will be vying with Bontempelli and Martin as the best midfielder in the game very soon - and the way he runs both ways, hits the scoreboard, and rarely wastes a possession - make him such an appealing prospect to bring into any team.

Don't get me wrong, I would love him at the Dogs. Maybe he is worth that, considering Ward was given $800k a few years ago.

[KT31]

Gee the blokes had a fair bit going on in his personal life , and at his age would be extra difficult to cope with .
Agree that he needs to be more consistent with his effort and approach to the ball, but I'd be willing to give him 12 months .

I love him Remi and even out of form he still managed two major moments in last years final series.
My only concern is as others say his form slump has been two years and thats plenty of time for most of us to get your "ducks in a row", how much will his value be severely reduced if he has a third poor season in a row ?

On a side note I know he was made too be more of a team player, whilst this payed off in the finals last year has he now jeopardised his X-factor too much by looking for the much safer options when in the past he would have kicked the team lifting miraculous goal ?

[comrade]

Stringer isn't prepared to sacrifice his body in a contest and so will always be limited to those opportunistic ground level goals he's able to conjure when given time and space. Repeat leads, contested marking, defensive pressure are all non-existent in his game. If we could get North's first, I'd take it and wish him luck.

A change in scenery might allow him to reach his full potential, as I can't see it happening with us.

[Twodogs]

He kicked 42 goals last year and 56 the year before - who else has done that, only Dickson. This year he has missed games due to hamstring issues. Yeah we talk about him a lot because we expect him to be the best in the AFL, maybe he just isn't. Yes he will be 24 next year and will start to get towards his peak. Stringer is not the problem at the club right now.

For what it's worth, Kelly is not worth $1 million per year, but the market wants him and will pay it. I hope we don't pay that sort of cash.

You're right, he's worth a lot more than that. If a side can get him to sign a long term contract for around a million PA they will be making out like bandits. After all it's football Monopoly money we are talking about not real money-nobody actually deserves a million bucks a year for playing a game but anyway.

[Bulldog4life]

You're right, he's worth a lot more than that. If a side can get him to sign a long term contract for around a million PA they will be making out like bandits. After all it's football Monopoly money we are talking about not real money-nobody actually deserves a million bucks a year for playing a game but anyway.

But eventually Bont will be on a mill too. Can we afford to have 3 millionaires on our playing list? I don't think so.

[azabob]

But eventually Bont will be on a mill too. Can we afford to have 3 millionaires on our playing list? I don't think so.

90% of the list are playing like millionaires, one more surely can't hurt.

[jeemak]

Stringer isn't prepared to sacrifice his body in a contest and so will always be limited to those opportunistic ground level goals he's able to conjure when given time and space. Repeat leads, contested marking, defensive pressure are all non-existent in his game. If we could get North's first, I'd take it and wish him luck.

A change in scenery might allow him to reach his full potential, as I can't see it happening with us.

This is an unspoken truth about Stringer. He doesn't handle physical pressure very well, and often looks to be avoiding it at any cost (particularly in the air).

If he's first to the ball and can break a tackle its different, but if it's in dispute the intensity isn't there.

[bornadog]

This is an unspoken truth about Stringer. He doesn't handle physical pressure very well, and often looks to be avoiding it at any cost (particularly in the air).

If he's first to the ball and can break a tackle its different, but if it's in dispute the intensity isn't there.

When you have had an horrific broken leg as well as a busted shoulder, maybe your confidence gets dented a bit.

[jeemak]

When you have had an horrific broken leg as well as a busted shoulder, maybe your confidence gets dented a bit.

He needs to resolve the issue whatever its cause.

[kruder]

Interesting that Billings is out of contract I was surprised to hear that they haven't locked him in yet.

[Twodogs]

But eventually Bont will be on a mill too. Can we afford to have 3 millionaires on our playing list? I don't think so.


BT is the man to answer that question but with the new broadcast deal there is a bit more cash to splash about.

North are offering 1mil+ to both Kelly and Martin and they have their other young stars to sign up like, umm, errr, ehhhh, the one with the thi... Oh yeah, I see what you mean.

[Happy Days]

Billings has had an awesome year and provides a lot of what we need, but I don't think my psyche can take another dude who can't kick for goal.

[bulldogtragic]

BT is the man to answer that question but with the new broadcast deal there is a bit more cash to splash about.

North are offering 1mil+ to both Kelly and Martin and they have their other young stars to sign up like, umm, errr, ehhhh, the one with the thi... Oh yeah, I see what you mean.

The short answer is yes. Tom Boyd has been front loaded. Kelly could be encompassed in our salary cap banking and the Crameri amount Essendon had to cover, and then resume to a decent, flatter level. Bonts could be back ended after his contract expires in a couple of years.

It's like a Rubix cube. It's all about understanding the moving parts, on all sides. The overly simplistic way of thinking about the CBA is that it roughly pushed everything up by 20%. So for instance Kelly might have been an $850,000 proposition prior to the deal. Add 20% and Kelly is now worth $1,000,000. We all have understand that players contracts have had an inflationary impact, so numbers will be higher.

[Twodogs]

The short answer is yes. Tom Boyd has been front loaded. Kelly could be encompassed in our salary cap banking and the Crameri amount Essendon had to cover, and then resume to a decent, flatter level. Bonts could be back ended after his contract expires in a couple of years.

It's like a Rubix cube. It's all about understanding the moving parts, on all sides. The overly simplistic way of thinking about the CBA is that it roughly pushed everything up by 20%. So for instance Kelly might have been an $850,000 proposition prior to the deal. Add 20% and Kelly is now worth $1,000,000. We all have understand that players contracts have had an inflationary impact, so numbers will be higher.


Is it wrong that my takeaway from that is that "Rubik's" is spelled incorrectly?

[bulldogtragic]

Is it wrong that my takeaway from that is that "Rubik's" is spelled incorrectly?

I blame auto spelling by Apple.

[Twodogs]

I blame auto spelling by Apple.

That's always what I say too.

[boydogs]

Don't trade Stringer. This is the right time for another club to bring him in, when his value is at its lowest, not the right time for us to sell him

[KT31]

Don't trade Stringer. This is the right time for another club to bring him in, when his value is at its lowest, not the right time for us to sell him

Another season like the last two and his value will be even worse.

[Hotdog60]

"GOLD Coast foundation player Brandon Matera looks set to seek a fresh start in 2018."
Any interest? 25 yo he looked very good early on but has had some injury issues of late.

[bulldogtragic]

"GOLD Coast foundation player Brandon Matera looks set to seek a fresh start in 2018."
Any interest? 25 yo he looked very good early on but has had some injury issues of late.

In the glimpses I've seen, which is limited, he looks ok. His stats are impressive too, most disposals 29, most goals in a game 6.

They're allegedly into Webb, maybe a swap.

[Remi Moses]

Does Matera work hard enough defensively? Ability wise, he'd be a good pick up .

[azabob]

Does Matera work hard enough defensively? Ability wise, he'd be a good pick up .

He has what we lack in the type of player he is. But you also make a good point RE his defensive work.

I'd be willing to take a punt on him.

[lemmon]

In the glimpses I've seen, which is limited, he looks ok. His stats are impressive too, most disposals 29, most goals in a game 6.

They're allegedly into Webb, maybe a swap.

Averaging about 17 disposals and 2 goals a game this year. Pretty decent stats

[bulldogtragic]

Averaging about 17 disposals and 2 goals a game this year. Pretty decent stats

In a team that haven't been fully engaged to play this year, that's good. I'd happily have someone like that running around for us.

[Ozza]

Would be very happy with Matera. Smart footballer.

[SlimPickens]

Would be very happy with Matera. Smart footballer.

He is actually the type we need. A genuine classy small forward, with terrific goal sense.

[Happy Days]

I've got really serious questions over his application and work rate. He's undoubtedly a talent, but there's a really high chance that being at the Gold Coast for nearly 8 years has ruined him. Takes a lot of plays off.

[Twodogs]

I don't think I've ever seen Matera tackle another player in 8 years but he has a fair bit to work with talent wise.

[bornadog]

I don't think I've ever seen Matera tackle another player in 8 years but he has a fair bit to work with talent wise.

Averages just over two a game.

[GVGjr]

"GOLD Coast foundation player Brandon Matera looks set to seek a fresh start in 2018."
Any interest? 25 yo he looked very good early on but has had some injury issues of late.

He could be worth having a talk to. The injuries are a concern and maybe it's just me but I'd like to be extra careful with GC players

[Twodogs]

Averages just over two a game.


Easy enough to miss.

[bornadog]

Easy enough to miss.

Eddie Betts, the expert small forward averages 3.3, which is pretty good. Dickson on 2.8

[boydogs]

Rated him early on but hasn't gone on with it. Much like the whole club really. Not sure whether he could turn it around elsewhere

[jeemak]

A defencive mindset can be taught in reasonable time, knowing how to get the ball and how to put it through the sticks is much harder to teach.

If Matera is able to pass a medical and can commit to what our club wants then we should do all we can to nab him.

He could be a gun for us, and we could all believe if we concentrate on the things he can do rather than those he supposedly can't.

[Bullies]

A defencive mindset can be taught in reasonable time, knowing how to get the ball and how to put it through the sticks is much harder to teach.

If Matera is able to pass a medical and can commit to what our club wants then we should do all we can to nab him.

He could be a gun for us, and we could all believe if we concentrate on the things he can do rather than those he supposedly can't. He is the sort of small we need in the forward line as we have no one beside Dickson with any goal sense. He is also a good kick at goal which is something we don't have. Ballantyne would also be worth looking at for a year or two as we have no one small who kicks goals consistently.

[bornadog]

He is the sort of small we need in the forward line as we have no one beside Dickson with any goal sense. He is also a good kick at goal which is something we don't have. Ballantyne would also be worth looking at for a year or two as we have no one small who kicks goals consistently.

I think Ballantyne has had his day, I practically can't remember him kicking a goal for 3 years. :D

[westbulldog]

He is the sort of small we need in the forward line as we have no one beside Dickson with any goal sense. He is also a good kick at goal which is something we don't have. Ballantyne would also be worth looking at for a year or two as we have no one small who kicks goals consistently.

not in anyone's lifetime

[Twodogs]

Ballantyne is still on an AFL list? The one from Freo?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

He is actually the type we need. A genuine classy small forward, with terrific goal sense.

This.

Has some flaws, but plenty to work with and the type of player we simply don't have on the list.

[always right]

This.

Has some flaws, but plenty to work with and the type of player we simply don't have on the list.
I actually think Caleb could play this role very well....but he is needed further up the field.

[bornadog]

Billings has signed for two years

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Billings has signed for two years

They got him fairly cheap. But 2 years is interesting

[bornadog]

They got him fairly cheap. But 2 years is interesting

I would have thought at least 3 years.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

They got him fairly cheap. But 2 years is interesting

Reading a bit too much into it. Doesn't he now come out of contract end of 19 like Bont, and they were from the same draft year.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Reading a bit too much into it. Doesn't he now come out of contract end of 19 like Bont, and they were from the same draft year.

Yes but I would assume Bonts next contract (which I hope is done next year) will be a big one.

I think Jack is thinking he's got a fair bit of improvement in him and will command 800k+ in the next 2yrs. 500k is great value for the saints

[Twodogs]

This.

Has some flaws, but plenty to work with and the type of player we simply don't have on the list.

Yeah, I think sometimes we get caught up too much with what a player can't do and tend to overlook what he does well.

[GVGjr]

Yeah, I think sometimes we get caught up too much with what a player can't do and tend to overlook what he does well.

Spot on.
Footy is very much a popularity and perception contest now and so many focus on a perceived flaw in a player and make it out to be a bigger issue than it probably is.

[Twodogs]

Spot on.
Footy is very much a popularity and perception contest now and so many focus on a perceived flaw in a player and make it out to be a bigger issue than it probably is.

The Terry Wheeler philosophy. "show me what you can do well and I'll give you a place in my footy team to do it"

[Remi Moses]

Michael-Angelo Rucci reckons if Lever goes, it's too us.
After what happened with Hurley , who knows ?

[bulldogtragic]

Michael-Angelo Rucci reckons if Lever goes, it's too us.
After what happened with Hurley , who knows ?

Well, let's hope he hasn't all but promised his services to us and then renege. Like Hurley. I'd really like him.

[Twodogs]

Michael-Angelo Rucci reckons if Lever goes, it's too us.
After what happened with Hurley , who knows ?


Well, let's hope he hasn't all but promised his services to us and then renege. Like Hurley. I'd really like him.


Adelaide aren't likely to continuity up the money they are offering Lever until they are breaking their salary cap to keep all their stars like Essendon did with Hurley.

[kruder]

Im keen on Lever who looks to be a player that can play both ends of the ground its just a matter of price. He isn't a gun defender yet, there is still question marks about his one one one capability, I noticed last night the crows had a kid playing on Franklin so I'm not sure I'd be giving up 2 first round selections( Hurley is worth 2 first round selections). It will be interesting to see what we are willing to give up but promising signs Michaelangelo is linking him with us at this stage of the game.

[bulldogtragic]

Looking most likely as having pick 9, or pick 8 if St Kilda jump us.

A small silver lining. Now get shopping JMac. Lever, Kelly, Kruezer & Matera covers some areas.

[Remi Moses]

We might as well finish 11th now .Lever, Kelly let's have a crack

[josie]

Kelly and Alir. If we cannot get Kelly then Lever and Alir.

[GVGjr]

I don't think we can land Kelly with a top 10 pick, we would need to cough up next years pick as well but we might something back
That would be a massive financial and list management investment

I'm not sure what it would take to get Lever.

The real consideration for the club is if they genuinely believe the 2017 season is an aberration or if we will need a couple of years before we become genuine contenders again? Based on what I've seen this season it might not be a quick bounce back.
Huge decision to make.

[Remi Moses]

Whatever it takes for Kelly

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

I'm in the Kelly camp if its a choice between him and Lever.
We need a skilled mid who can help connect our forward line and who can help take the load off Bont. Right now its a no brainer for opposition coaches as to how to shut us down : Stop Bont.
But i don't think we're even in the convo for Kelly.
I can say this if we have another off season like last where we failed to address key list weaknesses its likely to be another frustrating season.

[bulldogtragic]

Why not have both?

Let's put someone of value up to get both.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Why not have both?

Let's put someone of value up to get both.

Work your magic Tradinator...work your magic..

[Sedat]

Why not have both?

Let's put someone of value up to get both.
Stringer, Dahlhaus and our first 2 picks for starters? We'll need to be bold.

[bulldogtragic]

Work your magic Tradinator...work your magic..

It's not going to be popular... But I subscribe to the notion that you have to give something of value to get something of value. So maybe we've got to hit free agency hard, put down our picks 9, 27 & 40 and Liberatore/Stringer or for a lesser value trade Hunter/Wallis/Roughead.

We need to move some bad kicks out, and try to keep Webb. Which we won't. It's a bizarre world when we're overstocked for slow poor kicks, and good kickers like Hrovat & Webb will have left for bugger all after costing us heaps to get them.

[bulldogtragic]

Stringer, Dahlhaus and our first 2 picks for starters? We'll need to be bold.

Stringer is my first tradable. He takes up large salary cap, is inconsistent and now developing hammy issues. For that salary cap I want consistency of top level performance. If we can use him to engineer Kelly coming, we'd be turning that swap in investment of salary cap into a better one for the club. Sure he might not fly for (and drop) big marks, and kick some freakish goals, but we are not seeing the ROI in Stringer and next year his manager will want a lot more.

Ideally a club paying overs and needing a marketable face is his new home. I don't dislike Jake, but the question is if Kelly & Stringer are on the same wage, who would you bank on across a season. I'd pump it into Kelly. Stringer could be anything, but we are not seeing it.

[Sedat]

It's not going to be popular... But I subscribe to the notion that you have to give something of value to get something of value. So maybe we've got to hit free agency hard, put down our picks 9, 27 & 40 and Liberatore/Stringer or for a lesser value trade Hunter/Wallis/Roughead.

We need to move some bad kicks out, and try to keep Webb. Which we won't. It's a bizarre world when we're overstocked for slow poor kicks, and good kickers like Hrovat & Webb will have left for bugger all after costing us heaps to get them.
Libba is a keeper for mine if he is committed to his career. His skill set is in short supply at our club and he has beautiful disposal skills by both hand and foot. He is elite at his best.

Of course if he is not 100% committed he is fair game for trade. But there are other players with greater deficiencies who I would be looking at trading out first.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Yep, as much as Stringer has great 'potential' I'd trade that for consistent impact week in week out in a Josh Kelly.
Dahl too, has great attributes, but he is one of the largest culprits when it comes to poor ball use. I could see him having value for a team who needs and desires a contest terrier.

Jeez.. given what these guys have given us in 2016..it really feels like heresy to be considering this.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Libba is a keeper for mine if he is committed to his career. His skill set is in short supply at our club and he has beautiful disposal skills by both hand and foot. He is elite at his best.

Of course if he is not 100% committed he is fair game for trade. But there are other players with greater deficiencies who I would be looking at trading out first.

Absolutely, if he's up for the challenge he's a keeper, but you have to wonder whether the club is running out of patience.
At his best he almost has no peer in the competition in his hunger and desire to get from contest to contest and influence the terms under which a ball comes out of a congested pack.

But the 2017 version is just a plodding liability who sometimes does enough to remind you of the larger talent that he is wasting.

[bulldogtragic]

I hope those Ablett rumours about us from earlier this year are real. Stuff Geelong pressuring GCS to get him for nothing, if we provide an alternative destination not far from Geelong, then maybe they will deal with us. Package Matera up and give us a quote GCS.

[comrade]

Yep, as much as Stringer has great 'potential' I'd trade that for consistent impact week in week out in a Josh Kelly.
Dahl too, has great attributes, but he is one of the largest culprits when it comes to poor ball use. I could see him having value for a team who needs and desires a contest terrier.

Jeez.. given what these guys have given us in 2016..it really feels like heresy to be considering this.

I know what you mean, but they will always be Bulldogs heroes.

I'm firmly on the 'trade Stringer' bandwagon for a few reasons. He is extremely talented, there is no doubting that. But he seems to be stuck in a massive rut that only a change of scenery may reverse. He's currently contracted, meaning we have some leverage.

If we're going to make an almighty play at Lever and Kelly, a player of his calibre will need to be involved in any deal.

And as much as I'm all in on the trade Stringer bandwagon, I'm all in on the keep Dahlhaus wagon. You don't trade the heart out of a playing list and have it end well.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

I just hope we don't go the Casboult route.... He may've improve his goalkicking..but he's still faulty...

[bulldogtragic]

I just hope we don't go the Casboult route.... He may've improve his goalkicking..but he's still faulty...

I think we should work on extremes for trade targets:

(1) They're very good to guns (Lever, Kelly, Kruezer)
(2) They're very good to guns, but injury or falling out with coach has held them back (Matera), or 'go home' or age (GAJ)

No plodders at all in between (ie Casboult)

(3) They're very good kids, great kicks, who can't get a game (Webb) and cost very little

[josie]

What picks would Wally, Libba, Webb, Dickson, Stringer, Dahl, Hunter be worth? Not saying I want to trade them - just asking.

[Go_Dogs]

Cordy, Adams, Biggs
Wood, Lever, JJ
Hunter, Macrae, Kelly
Bont, Young, McLean
Dale, Boyd, Dahl
Roughead, Liberatore, Daniel
Jong, Wallis, Williams, Suckers

If I'm throwing together a best 22 based on the comments in this thread (ie. Trade Stringer, Morris retires, no Dickson, maybe Picken not best 22, Lever and Kelly in etc) this is what I'm coming up with.

The difficulties I had:-
Our midfield is still too bare based on 2017 output and requiring Bont to play forward.
We require Bont forward because we have no consistent goal kickers and no one who consistently leads at the ball - maybe having Tom Boyd and Lewis Young up front can help that - but that's an unknown.
Could Lipinski play a role up front in 2018?
Can Libba, Walllis, Jong return and be consistent midfield cogs?
Can we rely on the likes of Daniel and McLean to take our midfield to that next level?
Is Roughead going to bounce back (he had a few pretty good weeks, but started slowly after his injury and wasn't at his best most of the year) and if not, who else can we play there so we can keep TB forward?

Do Lever and Kelly help? Yes - if we can get one or both of them we should do it.
If we can't get both or either?
Well to give us flexibility up front I would like a ready made defender, but there may not be a lot of options.
If we can a midfielder, do we have a crack at Dusty? Who else will be a difference maker?
On the flip side, we could get a couple of very good players through the draft, is that sufficient and a proven formula we can continue to follow?


Plenty of questions and no standout answers.

[Twodogs]

Watching Trengrove play for Port yesterday...

He even kicks straight. He's got everything we need. Two of him would be ideal.

[Twodogs]

And, yes, I know there are almost two of him but Melbourne's is broken.

[Remi Moses]

Young and Boyd as key forwards ? Not sure that'd work .

[Hotdog60]

The funny thing is we had a team that took us to the ultimate prize so what has changed since last year.
The coaching panel had a shuffle, which is good for their career and expanding their knowledge base but has it had a large outcome on how we have performed this year.
Players have built up a confidence with a coach that got the best out of them and now they are looking after someone else. How many interviews have we seen which players giving praise to their teachers.
May be the shuffle had a de stabilizing effect on the group that was just small enough to make a difference to the results on the ground.
Yes JMac needs to target some talent to fill up some holes and Kelly would be gold in more ways than one.
Adams has become the new Tom Williams which I hope not but he has struggled to say on the park and his absence is usually long term.
So a key defender that can cope with the monster forwards would be good, Lever doesn't look like that type but if the team defence would return he could be very handy.
I think our list isn't that bad and do we need to make radical changes to get back to the required level. I think changes off field may have influenced this season and is very noticeable with the connection between our mids and forwards.
Also as a whole have we gotten too far ahead of ourselves and had the group over achieved last year and some maturity is needed for it to all gel again.
As in games during a season a young group will have it's up and downs so might the seasons.
I hope our recruiting team can weave some magic in the off season and snare a talent and 2018 will be the test on the group where the changes need to be made either on the field or off.

[GVGjr]

I just hope we don't go the Casboult route.... He may've improve his goalkicking..but he's still faulty...

If you check his stats this year he has improved in a couple of other areas as well. He's kicked 33 goals and if he finishes the season with 2 goals in his last game I think most would concede that 35 goals is a fair return from a player in a lowly ranked team

I wouldn't normally be interested but he is a structure player that might address something we lack plus it's only a salary cap consideration by not having to trade for him.

I'd say it's very unlikely we would be interested.

[GVGjr]

Watching Trengrove play for Port yesterday...

He even kicks straight. He's got everything we need. Two of him would be ideal.

Do you mean Westhoff? Trengrove didn't play

[Remi Moses]

Got his hipster beard types wrong

[Go_Dogs]

Young and Boyd as key forwards ? Not sure that'd work .

Why not?

Granted we haven't seen much of Boyd forward this year and none of Young at AFL level, but they can run and jump and take marks. I think it removes some of the caution and indecision we saw Young take with his disposal after his debut game.

They also offer flexibility, Boyd some minutes in the ruck, Young can swing back and Cordy/Adams can swing forward.

[ledge]

I don't understand . We won a flag last year and people here are already saying put up a lot for trade ., we are still young and had injuries .. Our forward 50s were enormous during the year that tells us we just need to get out forwards and mids on same page.
The names i am seeing mentioned on here as trade is unbelievable.
Talk about turn on your own.
Change or rearrange of coaching staff is more the problem in my eyes.
Let the recruiters get the players to replace the ones retiring or delisted .
Funny how at the beginning of the year we couldn't really think of players to delist now I'm seeing put up half the list as tradable !
We won a flag about two years to early .. This club doesn't experience it often it's a learning curve about how to continue it , just like our membership people were overwhelmed after the flag they had no idea how to handle the onslaught and were no way prepared.
The reasons for our drop would not be the list but a combination of many things.
Mental prep, injuries , being the hunted, a rule change that went against our strengths. Etc etc
But I will not go throwing out young kids who won a flag so early in their career.
Let's just settle down a little.

[boydogs]

What picks would Wally, Libba, Webb, Dickson, Stringer, Dahl, Hunter be worth? Not saying I want to trade them - just asking.

I'll have a crack. Wallis - 10-20, Libba - 5-10, Webb - 30-40, Dickson - 30-40, Stringer - 1-5, Dahlhaus - 5-10, Hunter - 5-10

[always right]

Some of the players being mentioned here as potential trade options are a little surprising. If they were playing for other teams I'm sure we would be nominating them as players we should be chasing.

[Twodogs]

If you check his stats this year he has improved in a couple of other areas as well. He's kicked 33 goals and if he finishes the season with 2 goals in his last game I think most would concede that 35 goals is a fair return from a player in a lowly ranked team

I wouldn't normally be interested but he is a structure player that might address something we lack plus it's only a salary cap consideration by not having to trade for him.

I'd say it's very unlikely we would be interested.

I'm not advocating his recruitment but Levi Casboult is a shining example that a footballer can improve their kicking even after they have entered the rariefied air of a place on an AFL list. Sav Rocca has done what any competent junior club coach would have done with any kid learning the game and taught him the correct technique to kick a ball with and a simple routine to go through before taking his shot.

He was coming of a low base with Casboult but he has donor wonders. I really hope we can talk him or his brother into coming over and teaching our blokes the same thing. Is recruiting coaching staff part of Jmac's remit? Then that's what I want. A goalkicking coach.

All of our forwards should use the same technique to take shots for goal, like all golfers putt the same. You don't see golfers twirl the club head around or spin the handle in their hands as they take their shot do you? They don't lift their heads or look at the hole as they take their shots. Because those are all stupid ways if putting that mean you will miss the shot. But we see players twirling the ball in their hands as they walk in or leaning one way or the other or backwards as they kick the ball or run in from strange angles when we should see them walk in standing up straight and have their head over the footy as they kick the ball. That's it, that's the big secret and all you have to remember about kicking for goal. One day a coach will teach that to his forwards, win a premiership with a straight kicking team and be hailed as a genius.




Do you mean Westhoff? Trengrove didn't play

There you go, you can't always believe your own son. He had the footy record and early on I asked him who one of the Port players was. (Can't remember what number he was now, 12 I think) and he said it was Trengrove. Westhoff is 39. Spent a lot of the time walking up and down along the boundary in front of us. Never really thought of him as recruit material.

[Remi Moses]

Why not?

Granted we haven't seen much of Boyd forward this year and none of Young at AFL level, but they can run and jump and take marks. I think it removes some of the caution and indecision we saw Young take with his disposal after his debut game.

They also offer flexibility, Boyd some minutes in the ruck, Young can swing back and Cordy/Adams can swing forward.
For a team looking to get back into September having Young and Boyd as key forwards won't get us there. I like swinging Adams forward , but we haven't seen young swing forward .

[ledge]

For a team looking to get back into September having Young and Boyd as key forwards won't get us there. I like swinging Adams forward , but we haven't seen young swing forward .

To me young is a natural forward but Luke is helping him learn his trade by going down back and letting him see how back man work to better his future up forward.
Luke believes every player should be able to play multiple roles and Young is a perfect example of this.

[Remi Moses]

To me young is a natural forward but Luke is helping him learn his trade by going down back and letting him see how back man work to better his future up forward.
Luke believes every player should be able to play multiple roles and Young is a perfect example of this.

You might be right , but as a starting key forward in a team looking to return to the pointy end , I'm not sure .

[Twodogs]

You might be right , but as a starting key forward in a team looking to return to the pointy end , I'm not sure .


Which tall forward role would he be best suited to? Would we bulk him up and play him as the monster (we already have Boyd) or keep him off too many proteins and use him as the rangy, mobile forward roaming around forward of the centre makng a target forward of the centre and linking up play to the deep forwards.

I say keep him mobile. He likes to get the ball in his hands and use it. And he's good when the ball isn't kicked to his advantage-he stays in the contest. That can be important the way the ball is delivered into our forward line.

[Bullies]

Which tall forward role would he be best suited to? Would we bulk him up and play him as the monster (we already have Boyd) or keep him off too many proteins and use him as the rangy, mobile forward roaming around forward of the centre makng a target forward of the centre and linking up play to the deep forwards.

I say keep him mobile. He likes to get the ball in his hands and use it. And he's good when the ball isn't kicked to his advantage-he stays in the contest. That can be important the way the ball is delivered into our forward line. By all accounts Boyd is their number 1 choice of ruckman and a pinch hit forward. We missed Boyd with his around the ground work. His stats didn't always show the good stuff he did. Also as he gets stronger he will be so much harder to move in the contest.

[josie]

Get what your saying Ledge. As Hawthorn proved though you have to give up something good to get something good. And I do not think we can rely on draft to fill the gaps with ready made players. So folks asking what players are worth is not treachery, I think it is the reality of afl as a business. Not sure many if any of us want to get rid of a lot of the list at all. We need midfield speed, another KPB and we need a little polish right round the ground. We possibly also need a ruckman who can compete with monsters.I think our forward line is not so bad if TBoyd can return successfully and if we play him there. I think with some really good trading we can compete well in'18, especially given we will have an easier draw. Oh, and lots of marking and goal kicking practice in the off-season too. Go Dogs!!

[Twodogs]

By all accounts Boyd is their number 1 choice of ruckman and a pinch hit forward. We missed Boyd with his around the ground work. His stats didn't always show the good stuff he did. Also as he gets stronger he will be so much harder to move in the contest.

He straightens us up too. We go more directly and don't stuff around with the ball as much when Tom is in the goal square. Tom doesn't always hold the simplest of marks when it is kicked to him but that's another story for a different day,:)

[josie]

If we could get 10 to 15 for Wally I'd take it, but he is RWB thru and thru so might disrupt the players and culture of our club.

[GVGjr]

If we could get 10 to 15 for Wally I'd take it, but he is RWB thru and thru so might disrupt the players and culture of our club.

I can't see him going. Despite some limitations as a player he's a great addition to our club with his professionalism

[ledge]

I can't see him going. Despite some limitations as a player he's a great addition to our club with his professionalism

Like Vandenburg at Hawthorn and the last premiership captain at Collingwood, sometimes the personality and drive is worth more than the players talent.
You can't pull out the heart of the club and expect it to function without repercussions, be mindful of what a player can bring to a club other than being an outstanding player.

[bulldogtragic]

Back to topic. I will call out my free agents, now we know where Brisbane (pick 1 or 2) & Carlton (pick 3 or 4) are going to end up. So it's in their interests to lose a free agent like Rockliff & Kruezer who would command the contract to get them the compo. I'd happily offer both 3 years on a good salary. We obtain a genuine ruckman who can go with or beat other big rucks, and kick goals. Rockliff gives us a midfielder who can hit targets. I think that addresses two key needs without impacting draft picks to trade, leaving say a Lever or Kelly in play (maybe).

[Remi Moses]

So what happens with Roughead ? Don't get me wrong I like Kruezer, but just can't see it .
Rockliff would be a decent get also, but by the sounds of it the crows are favoured . Rockliff one on one in the forward half is extremely dangerous .

[bulldogtragic]

So what happens with Roughead ? Don't get me wrong I like Kruezer, but just can't see it .
Rockliff would be a decent get also, but by the sounds of it the crows are favoured . Rockliff one on one in the forward half is extremely dangerous .

Campbell will request a trade out, 99% I think. Roughy becomes second ruckman and has to find form to knock Kruzer out, or knock a big forward out, or knock a KPD out. Hopefully competition brings the best out of him.

[Remi Moses]

Wonder if Jack Watts will be at Melbourne next year?
Possible target ? I'll see myself out

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Wonder if Jack Watts will be at Melbourne next year?
Possible target ? I'll see myself out

I know its been a tough year Remi, but must we resort to self flagellation?

[kruder]

Dunkley is a player I'd use to help get Lever in the club. We are seriously long his skill set and I think he would be attractive enough for them to help bolster their midfield. Wether its possible or not I'm sot sure and what we would to add to sweeten the deal but its something id be comfortable with.

[Sedat]

I don't understand . We won a flag last year and people here are already saying put up a lot for trade ., we are still young and had injuries .. Our forward 50s were enormous during the year that tells us we just need to get out forwards and mids on same page.
The names i am seeing mentioned on here as trade is unbelievable.
Talk about turn on your own.
Change or rearrange of coaching staff is more the problem in my eyes.
Let the recruiters get the players to replace the ones retiring or delisted .
Funny how at the beginning of the year we couldn't really think of players to delist now I'm seeing put up half the list as tradable !
We won a flag about two years to early .. This club doesn't experience it often it's a learning curve about how to continue it , just like our membership people were overwhelmed after the flag they had no idea how to handle the onslaught and were no way prepared.
The reasons for our drop would not be the list but a combination of many things.
Mental prep, injuries , being the hunted, a rule change that went against our strengths. Etc etc
But I will not go throwing out young kids who won a flag so early in their career.
Let's just settle down a little.
It's a fine line between doing too many list changes and not enough. Hindsight suggests we didn't do enough pruning last year and relied on incremental improvement within the existing list that never materialised.

If you stand still you're dead in this comp, so we do need to be more aggressive in our list changes this off season IMO. We have holes in areas that need to be addressed, and I'd like to think we will decisively address these holes.

[GVGjr]

Campbell will request a trade out, 99% I think. Roughy becomes second ruckman and has to find form to knock Kruzer out, or knock a big forward out, or knock a KPD out. Hopefully competition brings the best out of him.

I think Campbell has to accept he is a 2nd ruckman. I'm not sure he's any better off at another side.

[GVGjr]

It's a fine line between doing too many list changes and not enough. Hindsight suggests we didn't do enough pruning last year and relied on incremental improvement within the existing list that never materialised.

If you stand still you're dead in this comp, so we do need to be more aggressive in our list changes this off season IMO. We have holes in areas that need to be addressed, and I'd like to think we will decisively address these holes.

Totally agree. We actually slid back a bit between the end of 2016 and the start of 2017 and as a result have seen a significant slide.
Many people write off the ruck position but yesterday was fair old reminder that good ruckman can provide your midfield more opportunities.

I get the attraction with Rockliff and maybe Kruezer but we have a couple of more gaps as well. We didn't address them last year and need to be more active this year and that might mean losing a decent player or two ourselves.

[Twodogs]

Like Vandenburg at Hawthorn and the last premiership captain at Collingwood, sometimes the personality and drive is worth more than the players talent.
You can't pull out the heart of the club and expect it to function without repercussions, be mindful of what a player can bring to a club other than being an outstanding player.


I agree. I think talent is one of three things you have to have to make it in professional sports, determination and courage being the other two. Players make it with varying degrees of those three gifgs but they must have a degree of all three. In football talent might get you on an AFL list but if you don't have determination and courage then you won't stay on the list for very long.

Talent isn't even the most important thing I reckon. Prodigious talent is great but 99% of us don't have it so have to rely more on our determination more than anything and courage to a lesser extent.

I know its been a tough year Remi, but must we resort to self flagellation?

I've always thought that self flagellation sounded like far too much fun for us but now that we're winning premierships I guess everything is on the table.


Totally agree. We actually slid back a bit between the end of 2016 and the start of 2017 and as a result have seen a significant slide.
Many people write off the ruck position but yesterday was fair old reminder that good ruckman can provide your midfield more opportunities.

I get the attraction with Rockliff and maybe Kruezer but we have a couple of more gaps as well. We didn't address them last year and need to be more active this year and that might mean losing a decent player or two ourselves.

I don't know why it's become fashionable to downplay the ruck position. Do these people go our of their way to avoid Port games and wonder if Paddy Ryder makes a big difference to them this year? I understand not playing a ruckman for the sake of it but if we have no confidence in our ruckman to do the job then we need to get a ruckman. At the moment we have Campbell (not) playing second ruckman to no one and Roughead who they seem to want to play anywhere but the ruck and Tom Boyd has been unavailable but has to be played predominantly forward next year surely?

[Happy Days]

So apparently we're out of the race for Lever.

We're officially the new Collingwood of recruiting.

[bornadog]

Time to bring the mates together.

https://scontent-syd2-1.cdninstagram.com/t51.2885-15/e35/14714452_1831312130489178_2635106978925379584_n.jpg

[kruder]

So apparently we're out of the race for Lever.

We're officially the new Collingwood of recruiting.

Yeah this year could hurt us more than just ladder position

[bulldogtragic]

Operation Get Josh Kelly then.

[Ozza]

Operation Get Josh Kelly then.

Absolutely.

Lever is a very good player - but Kelly will be in the top handful in the league for some time. I hope we can afford him.

[bulldogtragic]

Absolutely.

Lever is a very good player - but Kelly will be in the top handful in the league for some time. I hope we can afford him.

Yep, that's the catch from the trade side. North will have pick 1 to 4, St Kilda with two top 10 picks. So they're in the box seat. If we end up with pick 9, we are still going to have to put up something else. A good player who also frees up salary cap seems the obvious say to do unless GWS have someone in mind on our list.

[Remi Moses]

Yeah this year could hurt us more than just ladder position

So how is Collingwood in the hunt ? Apparently Norf have offered Martin 1.5 for 7 years.Maybe they think Kelly is staying at GWS or going somewhere else.

[bornadog]

Yep, that's the catch from the trade side. North will have pick 1 to 4, St Kilda with two top 10 picks. So they're in the box seat. If we end up with pick 9, we are still going to have to put up something else. A good player who also frees up salary cap seems the obvious say to do unless GWS have someone in mind on our list.

It won't be just the money that lures Kelly.

An interesting perspective I heard on the radio, some months ago was the length of contract. Although North is offering up 10 years, this person (can't remember who), said Kelly would be crazy to take ten years as who knows what will happen to AFL salaries beyond the next 5 or so years. He could possibly earn even more after his next negotiation as the cap goes up again.

[bulldogtragic]

It won't be just the money that lures Kelly.

An interesting perspective I heard on the radio, some months ago was the length of contract. Although North is offering up 10 years, this person (can't remember who), said Kelly would be crazy to take ten years as who knows what will happen to AFL salaries beyond the next 5 or so years. He could possibly earn even more after his next negotiation as the cap goes up again.

Too true. That would also stuff his FA window too.

It would be great for the rivalry to steal Kelly from them too, after Tom Boyd winning helping to win us a flag. And Sam Darley.

[Ozza]

Lever specifically 'ruling out the bulldogs' - makes me think he is at least leaving Adelaide.

I'd prefer he goes to Collingwood. I think Melbourne are more likely our 'rivals' if we get back up into contention over the next few years - Collingwood, I'm not so sure.

[Remi Moses]

I reckonLever's a fine prospect, but is his role any different fromEaston Wood? Doesn't get the big boys , and they had Keath on Franklin Friday night . I know I'm throwing up names, but would Zaharakis be on our radar ?

[Bulldog4life]

Lever might be lured by playing regularly at the MCG as well as in big games there.

[bulldogtragic]

I reckonLever's a fine prospect, but is his role any different fromEaston Wood? Doesn't get the big boys , and they had Keath on Franklin Friday night . I know I'm throwing up names, but would Zaharakis be on our radar ?

Zaharakis 'bullied' Hurley into coming back to Essendon. I think he's drunk the cool aid big time over there. So probably not.

[Mofra]

I reckonLever's a fine prospect, but is his role any different fromEaston Wood? Doesn't get the big boys , and they had Keath on Franklin Friday night . I know I'm throwing up names, but would Zaharakis be on our radar ?
Lever's about 4 inches taller for a start

[always right]

Lever's about 4 inches taller for a start

And I see no downside to having 2x Easton Wood.

[Mantis]

And I see no downside to having 2x Easton Wood.

Depends which model you get, Easton Wood of 2015-2016 is a welcomed addition to the team, but not so much the 2017 version.

[The Doctor]

I hope the Dogs media dept gives the writer Peter Ryan a "Please Explain"

The article doesn't say anything. Seems like click bait to me.

Who is this guy and what credibility does he have? Did he hear it from some clown like Tony Sheahan and thats why there is no meat on the bones in the article? I'd wager a $ or two on that being the case.

[G-Mo77]

I hope the Dogs media dept gives the writer Peter Ryan a "Please Explain"

The article doesn't say anything. Seems like click bait to me.

Who is this guy and what credibility does he have? Did he hear it from some clown like Tony Sheahan and thats why there is no meat on the bones in the article? I'd wager a $ or two on that being the case.

Another article suggests we've pulled our offer

[Happy Days]

Lever is good and would have made our side not only a lot better, but would have instilled the confidence to play a different, more open style by allowing more faith to be placed in the back 6. I'm really unhappy he's knocked us back (reasonably certain this is what's happened reading between the lines).

Still think that KPD is our biggest hole. Hope we're in Allir Allir's ear.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Another article suggests we've pulled our offer

I read that. Apparently we've become frustrated with the amount of time it's taking him to decide

[bulldogsthru&thru]

FYI for the link. This one at least has a quote from Jakes manager

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/adelaide-crows/adelaide-crows-defender-jake-lever-prepared-to-wait-until-afl-season-ends-to-decide-future-a-time-lag-frustrating-the-western-bulldogs/news-story/1908d5322daff23d3cfb694be595af14

[Twodogs]

So apparently we're out of the race for Lever.

We're officially the new Collingwood of recruiting.

At least he told us now and not halfway through the last day of trade week.


Too true. That would also stuff his FA window too.

It would be great for the rivalry to steal Kelly from them too, after Tom Boyd winning helping to win us a flag. And Sam Darley.

Footscray premiership hero Sam Darley.


I reckonLever's a fine prospect, but is his role any different fromEaston Wood? Doesn't get the big boys , and they had Keath on Franklin Friday night . I know I'm throwing up names, but would Zaharakis be on our radar ?

I think we need Kelly more than we need Lever.

[GVGjr]

Twodogs, you were never sold on adding Lever to the side, what do you think we have dodged?

[comrade]

FYI for the link. This one at least has a quote from Jakes manager

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/adelaide-crows/adelaide-crows-defender-jake-lever-prepared-to-wait-until-afl-season-ends-to-decide-future-a-time-lag-frustrating-the-western-bulldogs/news-story/1908d5322daff23d3cfb694be595af14

If this is correct, and we're pulling our offer due to the time it's taking, then surely we have another big deal on the horizon. Why else would timing be such a factor?

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

If this is correct, and we're pulling our offer due to the time it's taking, then surely we have another big deal on the horizon. Why else would timing be such a factor?

Or just that we don't want to get deep into our plans for trade period with uncertainty . I kinda think we got blindsided by Hurley last year and got somewhat caught with our trade pants down and did not have any other options to cover his change of mind.

[bornadog]

Or just that we don't want to get deep into our plans for trade period with uncertainty . I kinda think we got blindsided by Hurley last year and got somewhat caught with our trade pants down and did not have any other options to cover his change of mind.

Hurley pulled out the very last minute due to a bigger offer from the Bummers then it was too late to look at anyone else.

I agree we want some certainty this year and need some time to work out another deal if we can't get Lever.

[Happy Days]

If this is correct, and we're pulling our offer due to the time it's taking, then surely we have another big deal on the horizon. Why else would timing be such a factor?

I think it's more that we've cultivated an excess of cash to sign Lever, and want to find a way to best use it alternately, rather than be stranded with it and have a hole burning in our pocket. Would suck to be like North or Collingwood and be forced to overpay for leftovers after being spurned by a big fish.

I also think it's untrue and we've just been told by Jake that he doesn't want to play for us.

[Sedat]

Yep, that's the catch from the trade side. North will have pick 1 to 4, St Kilda with two top 10 picks. So they're in the box seat. If we end up with pick 9, we are still going to have to put up something else. A good player who also frees up salary cap seems the obvious say to do unless GWS have someone in mind on our list.
Spitballing here - Stringer and pick 9 for Kelly. Maybe we can also get GWS' 3rd round pick back seeing as they are highly unlikely to use it.

Pretty attractive option for GWS compared to just early picks. Depends what is coming through the pipe in their academy zone and whether or not they need the picks/points.

[always right]

Depends which model you get, Easton Wood of 2015-2016 is a welcomed addition to the team, but not so much the 2017 version.

I could say something similar about many otherbulldogs players. Wood has been well off his best but better than plenty of teammates. I'm pretty confident he can recapture his form next year.

[bulldogtragic]

Spitballing here - Stringer and pick 9 for Kelly. Maybe we can also get GWS' 3rd round pick back seeing as they are highly unlikely to use it.

Pretty attractive option for GWS compared to just early picks. Depends what is coming through the pipe in their academy zone and whether or not they need the picks/points.

I suspect something like that is what will be required. Either Stringer directly, or if we can get a good offer for him, then that and pick 9.

[chef]

God i hope we dont trade Stringer.

[GVGjr]

If this is correct, and we're pulling our offer due to the time it's taking, then surely we have another big deal on the horizon. Why else would timing be such a factor?

GWS withdrew their offer to Franklin when they realised they had been trumped by Sydney. I'm not saying this as a definite but perhaps it suits us more to get out of the speculation around Lever if we are somewhat convinced he isn't interested.

It could mean we have just put up the "open for business" sign to every other player we have an interest in.
By the way, I don't think we are 100% out of the picture but we are a long way behind

[bornadog]

God i hope we dont trade Stringer.

Agree, you don't get rid of a top 5 pick who we know is a freak. That would be plain stupid.

[bulldogtragic]

Agree, you don't get rid of a top 5 pick who we know is a freak. That would be plain stupid.

Hypothetical. Josh Kelly tells us and St Kilda I'm happy with your offers. St Kilda offer up picks 7 & 8. We offer up pick 10 and what?

[Remi Moses]

I'd do the trade , but can't see it happening . Kelly is consistentand would up with Bont as our best player.

[Happy Days]

No way I'm trading Stringer; a mercurial, 55-goal a year AA forward not yet 24 is the sort of guy you trade in, not out.

Dahlhaus and 9 for Kelly though...

[bornadog]

Hypothetical. Josh Kelly tells us and St Kilda I'm happy with your offers. St Kilda offer up picks 7 & 8. We offer up pick 10 and what?

Depends on the type of player they are looking for?

[bulldogtragic]

No way I'm trading Stringer; a mercurial, 55-goal a year AA forward not yet 24 is the sort of guy you trade in, not out.

Dahlhaus and 9 for Kelly though...

Thanks for putting up a name into the discussion, much appreciated. Would GWS want Dahl, or would someone with a late top 10 pick like St Kilda make a trade for him?

[ratsmac]

Hypothetical. Josh Kelly tells us and St Kilda I'm happy with your offers. St Kilda offer up picks 7 & 8. We offer up pick 10 and what?

And promise not to boo them at their home ground again!

Nah it would have to be a player I'd say. One of ours or a 3 way. The problem is what do they need? It's like trying the buy a gift for someone who has everything.

[bulldogtragic]

Depends on the type of player they are looking for?

Name, names my friend! :D

Who is tradable from our top group if players, in any position, either to GWS or to get a very good pick to get the trade down.

[Sedat]

No way I'm trading Stringer; a mercurial, 55-goal a year AA forward not yet 24 is the sort of guy you trade in, not out.

Dahlhaus and 9 for Kelly though...
Dahl won't be enough to get the deal done. I mentioned in another thread that Dahl might be a tradeable commodity because of his sharp regression in 2017 with regard to ball use and decision making, but after thinking about it in more detail I agree with Comrade in that he is a fabric player that would damage the culture of the club if traded away.

Kelly's worst game will be low 20's possessions, a goal and probably 3-4 tackles. Stringer's worst game has him listed as a missing person on a milk carton. Stringer at his best is dynamic, but it is an increasingly rare occurrence and his tank will always prevent him from being any more than a short burst player in the midfield. And I love Stringer - that goal in the last qtr of the GF is something that maybe 2-3 players in the comp could have kicked - but you have to be bold to get better.

[bulldogtragic]

And promise not to boo them at their home ground again!

Nah it would have to be a player I'd say. One of ours or a 3 way. The problem is what do they need? It's like trying the buy a gift for someone who has everything.

Yep. The only player they have gone hard at repeatedly and knocked them back is Michael Wolters. Two top 10 picks might be enough if they can't identify anyone else.

[bornadog]

Name, names my friend! :D

Who is tradable from our top group if players, in any position, either to GWS or to get a very good pick to get the trade down.

ok, Hunter, Suckling ;)

[bulldogtragic]

ok, Hunter, Suckling ;)

Mantis hack your account again? :D

Come on, give me some names. Got to give quality, to get quality.

[bornadog]

Mantis hack your account again? :D

Come on, give me some names. Got to give quality, to get quality.

Very funny.

I have to think about it. Could it be this years and next years first rounders, but would that do it? I am not good at this stuff.