Clay and Lipinski sign new deals

[ledge]

Clay has signed a one year deal and lipinski another two.
Not sure why clay was happy with one year.

[SlimPickens]

Not sure why clay was happy with one year.

Its round 8 in 2017. There is a lot of Footy left this year, so a year extension now is a good result for Clay. After 3 knee recos you have to expect that a year to year contract is the way will continue to go with Clay. If another club comes along and offers more in regards to length of time all the power to them.

[Topdog]

I think Clay is realistic.

Great result for the club.

[ledge]

That's two players we have extended contracts on who haven't played a game yet .. English and lipinski.. Not sure I've ever seen that before. Is it common with other clubs or are we one of the leaders in that department?
I totally understand why. especially a ruckman from another state who will take two years to build up . Don't want to do the hard work with him and he wants to go home.
Long contracts could be a way of getting more out of a club if the player wants to go, maybe that's the thinking also.
Could be many reasons I guess, to keep them to sure up a dynasty . Of course the risk of them not making it or being injured is always there.

[dadsgirl16]

Really happy with this..Clay is such a good citizen.

I know we don't sign on the basis of good person but I for one am rapt for him

[Mofra]

That's two players we have extended contracts on who haven't played a game yet .. English and lipinski.. Not sure I've ever seen that before. Is it common with other clubs or are we one of the leaders in that department?
GWS have done it quite a bit - they signed Ahern to an extension on AFL average salary (~$300k) which is why they off-loading him to North for peanuts after his ACL.

Pretty sure Carlton put one of Murphy or Gibbs in their leadership group before he even debuted!

[Bulldog Joe]

Does the 1 year to the end of 2018 take Clay through to free agency.

That would seem a good spot for him to be able to look for what offers are about.

[bulldogtragic]

JMac has been busy, good hustle by him.

Clay, Lippa, Daniel, Picko, English by Round 7.

Now for JJ, Adams, Dunkley, Crameri & Roberts.

[bornadog]

JMac has been busy, good hustle by him.

Clay, Lippa, Daniel, Picko, English by Round 7.

Now for JJ, Adams, Dunkley, Crameri & Roberts.

Williams?

[Eastdog]

Williams?

Yes would be a good one to secure. Lots of upside.

[Axe Man]

Out of contract at the end of this season (list from Big Footy):

Roarke Smith (2017) (Re-Signed 2016)
Josh Prudden (2017) (Re-Signed 2016)
Brad Lynch (2017) (Re-Signed 2016)
Matthew Boyd (2017) (Re-Signed 2016)
Dale Morris (2017) (Re-Signed 2016)
Declan Hamilton (2017) (Re-Signed 2016)
Jack Redpath (2017) (Re-Signed 2016)
Robert Murphy (2017) (Re-Signed 2016)
Josh Duckley (2017) (Under 2 Year Draftee Deal)
Kieren Collins (2017) (Under 2 Year Draftee Deal)
Marcus Adams (2017) (Under 2 Year Draftee Deal)
Bailey Williams (2017) (Under 2 Year Draftee Deal)
Bailey Dale (2017) (Re-Signed 2015)
Lukas Webb (2017) (Re-Signed 2015)
Mitch Honeychurch (2017) (Re-Signed 2015)
Fletcher Roberts (2017) (Re-Signed 2015)
Jason Johannisen (2017) (Re-Signed 2014)
Stewart Crameri (2017) (Traded For in 2013)
Nathan Mullenger-McHugh (2017) (1 Year Rookie Deal)
Tristan Tweedie (2017) (Category B Rookie Deal)

[Eastdog]

I think Clay is realistic.

Great result for the club.

Yes he has had to deal with this knee reconstructions which is just tough on any player. 1 is tough enough but 3 is very tough. Bad luck as well to Rorake Smith did his knee again in the practice game against Brisbane so hoping his on track and going well in his recovery. We still don't have a lot of luck on the injury front that's for sure.

[bulldogtragic]

Williams?

There's a few more, but those are the headline names. My contracts thread has an up to date full list.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

There's a few more, but those are the headline names. My contracts thread has an up to date full list.

Any chance your contract status thread could be stickied by the moderators?

[Bulldog Revolution]

That's two players we have extended contracts on who haven't played a game yet .. English and lipinski.. Not sure I've ever seen that before. Is it common with other clubs or are we one of the leaders in that department?
.

It seems a fairly common practice at the minute to re-sign young players before their contracts finish - its of benefit to both sides - gives the player time to develop with guarunteed spot on a list, and stops a player coming out of contract

[bulldogtragic]

Any chance your contract status thread could be stickied by the moderators?

I'm hoping so!! It's a pain in the arse digging for it to update the list at every signing.

[Axe Man]

I'm hoping so!! It's a pain in the arse digging for it to update the list at every signing.

That's why I always refer to the Big Footy one - it's stickied to the top of the page so I know where it is. I didn't even know you had done one!

[ratsmac]

Great news. If anyone heard Bevo's presser after the Richmond game it would come at no surprise that Clay had signed.

[comrade]

Great news. If anyone heard Bevo's presser after the Richmond game it would come at no surprise that Clay had signed.

Yeah, real smooth from Bevo ;)

[ledge]

Good to see Bevo was bought up watching great English comedy , faulty towers, Morecombe and Wise ..

[bornadog]

Clay has signed a one year deal

Was this a mistake by the club? Should we have waited till the end of season? He has had a shocking season, probably the worse of all premiership players.

[Doc26]

Was this a mistake by the club? Should we have waited till the end of season? He has had a shocking season, probably the worse of all premiership players.

At present he looks an ordinary VFL player. It was a mistake.

[bornadog]

At present he looks an ordinary VFL player. It was a mistake.

Didn't play very well today, so barely makes a VFL player at the moment.

[Remi Moses]

Really poor after 1/4 time . He looks frustrated , and is playing that way . Gave away a silly down field and it got worse after that.
He dished up tripe this year

[GVGjr]

Was this a mistake by the club? Should we have waited till the end of season? He has had a shocking season, probably the worse of all premiership players.

We rewarded a player with a contract who simply came back in 2017 in poor condition. I'm not sure what example that sends the playing list or why we accepted it.
Given his limitations with his skill level to me unless he is fit and a competitive beast with his contested work he will struggle to be an effective player for us.
Has the penny dropped with him? He should consider himself fortunate but I somehow doubt it.

[Rocco Jones]

Lipsinki on the other hand....love the look of him. Upside is mammoth.

[bornadog]

Lipsinki on the other hand....love the look of him. Upside is mammoth.

Just turned 19, will be very good.

[kruder]

Just turned 19, will be very good.

Where do you see his best position? I find it hard place him at this stage he is kinda playing a similar role to Dunkley but I think maybe he has a little more polish.

[Rocco Jones]

Where do you see his best position? I find it hard place him at this stage he is kinda playing a similar role to Dunkley but I think maybe he has a little more polish.

'Little more polish'? It's like saying a Jaguar has a little more polish than a ute. He is so smooth, has good hands and is intelligent. Looks a HFF/wing type but could develop more of an inside game with those clean hands.

[Twodogs]

Really poor after 1/4 time . He looks frustrated , and is playing that way . Gave away a silly down field and it got worse after that.
He dished up tripe this year

He looked a bit like Stevie J was earlier in the season. Like he game had gone past him and all he can do us give away silly frees to try and slow it down again. Hope I'm wrong.


Where do you see his best position? I find it hard place him at this stage he is kinda playing a similar role to Dunkley but I think maybe he has a little more polish.

Centre half foward. He marks well overhead, turns and hits the ground running and his foot passing is pin point.

[bulldogtragic]

We rewarded a player with a contract who simply came back in 2017 in poor condition. I'm not sure what example that sends the playing list or why we accepted it.
Given his limitations with his skill level to me unless he is fit and a competitive beast with his contested work he will struggle to be an effective player for us.
Has the penny dropped with him? He should consider himself fortunate but I somehow doubt it.

By 'we' it was JMac that signed it up. Why would JMac do that?

[GVGjr]

By 'we' it was JMac that signed it up. Why would JMac do that?

You don't think the senior coach and the assistants would have been part of the decision?

[bulldogtragic]

You don't think the senior coach and the assistants would have been part of the decision?

Yes, but I'd like to have this discussion. Shouldn't JMac be able to push them back somewhat? Isn't he meant to protect the list from the wishes of others? There's been a few questionable re-signings over the last 12 months, and Crameri possibly going back to Essendon for SFA while they have Merrett (yes a BMac one).

I think it's a philosophical question for the club, and those interested in thinking about it, about what a list manager does, should do and role of others in that. To that end, if JMacs role is to sign blokes Bevo or assistants want then we can get a year 10 work experience kid for virtually free to do it and save the wage.

[GVGjr]

Yes, but I'd like to have this discussion. Shouldn't JMac be able to push them back somewhat? Isn't he meant to protect the list from the wishes of others? There's been a few questionable re-signings over the last 12 months, and Crameri possibly going back to Essendon for SFA while they have Merrett (yes a BMac one).

I think it's a philosophical question for the club, and those interested in thinking about it, about what a list manager does, should do and role of others in that. To that end, if JMacs role is to sign blokes Bevo or assistants want then we can get a year 10 work experience kid for virtually free to do it and save the wage.

Is the Crameri example you have raised, especially given it wasn't a questionable decision, in anyway relevant to the Clay Smith example on this thread?

Coaches should be able to identify a player or two that they want to bring into the side and they certainly should have some say on the players being offered contract extensions. It's a fine line to balance though.
The list manager, from my limited understanding, is to do the required work on building a list management strategy and presenting the opportunities that present with players coming out of contract or contracted players looking for opportunities elsewhere. He also needs to manage the TPP and oversee the delistings etc. All this needs to be done with the coaches input but I suspect there are vigorous debates at times and the GM of Footy would need to work with both the Senior Coach and the List Manager to sort out the challenges.

In these changing times it's probably a decent debate to work out how much input senior coaches should have.

[bornadog]

Is the Crameri example you have raised, especially given it wasn't a questionable decision, in anyway relevant to the Clay Smith example on this thread?

Coaches should be able to identify a player or two that they want to bring into the side and they certainly should have some say on the players being offered contract extensions. It's a fine line to balance though.
The list manager, from my limited understanding, is to do the required work on building a list management strategy and presenting the opportunities that present with players coming out of contract or contracted players looking for opportunities elsewhere. He also needs to manage the TPP and oversee the delistings etc. All this needs to be done with the coaches input but I suspect there are vigorous debates at times and the GM of Footy would need to work with both the Senior Coach and the List Manager to sort out the challenges.

In these changing times it's probably a decent debate to work out how much input senior coaches should have.

I think the coach has to be involved, it would make no sense if he wasn't. The MC would make the final decision as a working group in the players the club wants to eep or delist. The list manager needs to negotiate with the player managers and ensure we keep those players. The duties of the list manager would be as you say above.

One of the biggest issues we had prior to JMac coming to the club, was list management as we didn't have a dedicated list manager. Fantasia tried to do both the Football management and list management and this cost as guys like Ward and Harbrow.

[Twodogs]

I think the List Managers main function is to save the coach from himself. If it were left to the coaching staff they'd recruit the first 43 blokes who walked through the door and then stand around arguing about the fact they ain't allowed any more after that. A List Manager is the bloke who gets to say "sorry, but no" to the coach.

[GVGjr]

One of the biggest issues we had prior to JMac coming to the club, was list management as we didn't have a dedicated list manager. Fantasia tried to do both the Football management and list management and this cost as guys like Ward and Harbrow.

I get what you are saying but I don't quite agree with this, for many years we had Scott Clayton who was doing both the recruiting and list management roles and he was largely left alone. Wallace in particular left recruiting alone but like both he and Eade the coaches had a lot of say on who was coming and going via trades and who was being offered contract extensions.
I know why we lost Harbrow and there wasn't much anyone could do but both the coach and the GM made significant errors with the Ward negotiation.

[bornadog]

I get what you are saying but I don't quite agree with this, for many years we had Scott Clayton who was doing both the recruiting and list management roles and he was largely left alone. Wallace in particular left recruiting alone but like both he and Eade the coaches had a lot of say on who was coming and going via trades and who was being offered contract extensions.
I know why we lost Harbrow and there wasn't much anyone could do but both the coach and the GM made significant errors with the Ward negotiation.

At the time the coach kept telling Fantasia to stitch up Ward, but he kept saying he had it in hand. I still think we could have kept Harbrow. I don't believe in the "I want to go back to family in Queensland". Half his family live in Mooroopna.

Clayton may have been largely left alone, but that was a mistake in hindsight. Not sure what you don't agree with? Do you mean not having a dedicated list manager?

[GVGjr]

At the time the coach kept telling Fantasia to stitch up Ward, but he kept saying he had it in hand. I still think we could have kept Harbrow. I don't believe in the "I want to go back to family in Queensland". Half his family live in Mooroopna.

Clayton may have been largely left alone, but that was a mistake in hindsight. Not sure what you don't agree with? Do you mean not having a dedicated list manager?

I was disagreeing with the notion that we didn't have a list manager until J-Mac arrived. The role was split by then but Clayton was never just the recruiter of junior football talent. His role was more than that. Fantasia had too much on and I don't think he was good at recruiting or list management anyway.

I'll leave the Ward one alone. We have differing views.

Clayton had two long term coaches with us and they both never really got involved with recruiting. They certainly did with trading and player contracts but largely he and the team were left alone with recruiting the younger players.

It's changed now and coaches are more active in that area. Defining how much say they should have might be difficult.

[bornadog]

I was disagreeing with the notion that we didn't have a list manager until J-Mac arrived.

You left out one word I said dedicated list manager, meaning someone that just performed that role.