Preseason 2018 . Where do we go ?

[ledge]

So where are we headed, what's our new game plan ? Who will go ?
, will we go more kicking ? Will we replace coaches ?
Will Bob or Matt stay on in some way ?
Where exactly did we go wrong and has the club recognised it and how to rectify it?
Would love to know people's thoughts and how close we actually are to knowing what is actually happening "inside the 4 walls"
I'm well and truely over the media, their rumours and assumptions.

My thoughts are as I've said before it's a breakdown between the forward and mid coach, I still see the list as very good if we play properly.
Kicking from all angles on the run and set shots should be a huge priority.
Lowering our eyes and getting the forwards running to the positions our mids are strong at getting it to would help immensly.

[DOG GOD]

Big men who can take contested marks all over the ground.
A fwd structure that can hold the ball in until we score (like 2016)
Serious need of a goal kicking coach, and new blood into the MC

Whatever our game plan was in 2017, we need to scrap it and go back to 2016 and redefine slightly with a more direct approach into fwd line. Bombing into 50 only a last option.

[dukedog]

Would just love to see the young talls come back bigger next year. English and young. I reckon both will be great players for 10 years. Hope boyd can get back to finals 2016 form. We need him up forward. I think with a fit list. We have all the tools.

[bornadog]

Some Points to correct

* The last three weeks is summoned up in three words, Patton, Dixon, Roughead. We are desperate for a 198cm plus Fullback who can play on the monsters. Forget Cordy, Adams and Roberts and not sure Collins will develop into anything. All good players , but really they are not KPP. They can take on the third talls, but not the monsters of the game. Think Tom Lynch, Buddy, Daniher. The past three weeks these blokes have kicked 13 goals, Daniher kicked 6. We just don't have the monster that can go with these blokes. Forget trying to put Jordan Roughead back to Full back, people have short memories, he was not the answer then and not the answer now.

* We need to fix our injury management, the constant hamstrings to Stringer and Wood and other soft tissue injuries.

* Forward line - Tom Boyd needs to stay at home and forget this rucking BS. This means we need to find another ruckman to help Roughead. Soup is just not the answer. 3 disposals last night says it all.

* We need some midfielders that can actually kick the ball long and accurate and hit targets. As much as guys like Mclean and Dahl have guts and determination and can find the ball, they just can't kick the bloody thing. We also need a good outside mid with genuine pace.

* Assistant coaches - need a clean out and a new lot to come in with fresh ideas, Bevo can't do it on his own, but he can manage people and motivate them, but he needs guys that can teach the basic skills and a senior assistant that is a tactician.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Some Points to correct

* The last three weeks is summoned up in three words, Patton, Dixon, Roughead. We are desperate for a 198cm plus Fullback who can play on the monsters. Forget Cordy, Adams and Roberts and not sure Collins will develop into anything. All good players , but really they are not KPP. They can take on the third talls, but not the monsters of the game. Think Tom Lynch, Buddy, Daniher. The past three weeks these blokes have kicked 13 goals, Daniher kicked 6. We just don't have the monster that can go with these blokes. Forget trying to put Jordan Roughead back to Full back, people have short memories, he was not the answer then and not the answer now.

* We need to fix our injury management, the constant hamstrings to Stringer and Wood and other soft tissue injuries.

* Forward line - Tom Boyd needs to stay at home and forget this rucking BS. This means we need to find another ruckman to help Roughead. Soup is just not the answer. 3 disposals last night says it all.

* We need some midfielders that can actually kick the ball long and accurate and hit targets. As much as guys like Mclean and Dahl have guts and determination and can find the ball, they just can't kick the bloody thing. We also need a good outside mid with genuine pace.

* Assistant coaches - need a clean out and a new lot to come in with fresh ideas, Bevo can't do it on his own, but he can manage people and motivate them, but he needs guys that can teach the basic skills and a senior assistant that is a tactician.
Agree with all the above. On the talk backman, who are these players in other teams? I struggle to think of many 198cm+ fullbackman. Perhaps it's a strength issue with us?

[bornadog]

Agree with all the above. On the talk backman, who are these players in other teams? I struggle to think of many 198cm+ fullbackman. Perhaps it's a strength issue with us?

Yeah there really isn't much around (Liam Jones :D). Even Lever is only 194cm and 85kg, so he is more your CHB attacking type.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Yeah there really isn't much around (Liam Jones :D). Even Lever is only 194cm and 85kg, so he is more your CHB attacking type.

I need to go through all the full backs for every team. But thinking about it perhaps it's either our fullbacks are young and underdeveloped (just thinking about Young, Cordy getting ragdolled easily) OR our team defence just isn't working because we have players all over the ground letting us down leading to our backs being out of position. We didn't have this issue last year. It might be a combination of discipline and youth/inexperience. Discipline at stoppages and from our midfield plus getting a stronger Cordy, a mature Collins and a healthier Adams should fix these problems. Perhaps this is where he interest in Trengove and Shoenmakers has come from. Ready to go mature backmen.

[bornadog]

I need to go through all the full backs for every team. But thinking about it perhaps it's either our fullbacks are young and underdeveloped (just thinking about Young, Cordy getting ragdolled easily) OR our team defence just isn't working because we have players all over the ground letting us down leading to our backs being out of position. We didn't have this issue last year. It might be a combination of discipline and youth/inexperience. Discipline at stoppages and from our midfield plus getting a stronger Cordy, a mature Collins and a healthier Adams should fix these problems. Perhaps this is where he interest in Trengove and Shoenmakers has come from. Ready to go mature backmen.

Although not ideal, we may have to take on these type till our younger guys mature (as you say)

[always right]

Collins is the great white hope when it comes to someone to take on the monster forwards. Let's hope his improvement comes quickly.
Much of the problem might be solved if we can get our best defenders fit and firing. We didn't have the massive key defender last year but we did have a really cohesive backline and the only one of them we are losing is Boyd. If we can get Adams back on the park consistently and get Easton Wood back to his best, I reckon we have a pretty good defence. Certainly Cordy has been one of the positives.

A better performing midfield would also help in preventing the ball coming into the opposition firwardline too easily.

[boydogs]

We didn't have the massive key defender last year but we did have a really cohesive backline and the only one of them we are losing is Boyd

Hamling is gone too

[Doc26]

Some Points to correct

* The last three weeks is summoned up in three words, Patton, Dixon, Roughead. We are desperate for a 198cm plus Fullback who can play on the monsters. Forget Cordy, Adams and Roberts and not sure Collins will develop into anything. All good players , but really they are not KPP. They can take on the third talls, but not the monsters of the game. Think Tom Lynch, Buddy, Daniher. The past three weeks these blokes have kicked 13 goals, Daniher kicked 6. We just don't have the monster that can go with these blokes. Forget trying to put Jordan Roughead back to Full back, people have short memories, he was not the answer then and not the answer now.

* We need to fix our injury management, the constant hamstrings to Stringer and Wood and other soft tissue injuries.

* Forward line - Tom Boyd needs to stay at home and forget this rucking BS. This means we need to find another ruckman to help Roughead. Soup is just not the answer. 3 disposals last night says it all.

* We need some midfielders that can actually kick the ball long and accurate and hit targets. As much as guys like Mclean and Dahl have guts and determination and can find the ball, they just can't kick the bloody thing. We also need a good outside mid with genuine pace.

* Assistant coaches - need a clean out and a new lot to come in with fresh ideas, Bevo can't do it on his own, but he can manage people and motivate them, but he needs guys that can teach the basic skills and a senior assistant that is a tactician.

It's a good summation BD.

Where do we see the future for Roughy in our line up? As much as I love Jordan the person, and his love for the Club, he has proven that he struggles in the role as key defender and has been shown up quite badly in the ruck for the best part of the season. Unless he can make something of his career up forward can we continue to carry him?

[bornadog]

It's a good summation BD.

Where do we see the future for Roughy in our line up? As much as I love Jordan the person, and his love for the Club, he has proven that he struggles in the role as key defender and has been shown up quite badly in the ruck for the best part of the season. Unless he can make something of his career up forward can we continue to carry him?

I still see him in the ruck role, but perhaps as second ruck. If he can get an injury free preseason under his belt, then we can see if he can play the role.

[Doc26]

I still see him in the ruck role, but perhaps as second ruck. If he can get an injury free preseason under his belt, then we can see if he can play the role.

This poses the question whether we can afford to have TBoyd at full forward, and Jordan as the resting ruckman in the forward half ? As you say, he's probably not much more than a 2nd ruck; There appears few opposing first rucks that get bashed up physically like Jordan does.

[bornadog]

This poses the question whether we can afford to have TBoyd at full forward, and Jordan as the resting ruckman in the forward half ? As you say, he's probably not much more than a 2nd ruck; There appears few opposing first rucks that get bashed up physically like Jordan does.

I agree it is a dilemma. I thought his tap work last night wasn't too bad.

[boydogs]

Roughead is good depth, he's a versatile type who can stop the bleeding in any area of the ground, but if he's your best in any given position you're struggling

[GVGjr]

This poses the question whether we can afford to have TBoyd at full forward, and Jordan as the resting ruckman in the forward half ? As you say, he's probably not much more than a 2nd ruck; There appears few opposing first rucks that get bashed up physically like Jordan does.

Roughead struggled this year and it had an impact on our midfield. His injury early in the season might be a contributing factor but I'm not sure we can trust that.
There is no doubt that he is a quality guy to have at the club but he isn't quite a number one ruckman and he doesn't take enough marks in the forward line to really make an impression there.
We to either find a better ruckman which is probably doubtful or add some depth in case his form warrants him to be dropped.

I think he starts next year as the number #1 unless we do something unexpected.

[Hotdog60]

I wonder with the change in rules this year if Wilbur may have had more game time.
The one thing about Will was he was durable.

[The Doctor]

I wouldn't mind Wallis being tried in a half back role similar to how Matty Boyd played there.

[Remi Moses]

Good post BAD . The only thing I'll add is that there has to be pressure for the ball coming in to the opp forward half .To often this year that hasn't happened , and the defender has been caught out facing our opponents goal .

[LostDoggy]

I wouldn't mind Wallis being tried in a half back role similar to how Matty Boyd played there.

I like this idea. JJ, Suckling, Biggs and Williams are all a bit underdeveloped as contested players. We missed Boyd's contested toughness across half back this year. Wallis would help in this area. Like Boyd, his disposal effectiveness will probably improve a lot with that smidge more time and space.

[Happy Days]

I wouldn't mind Wallis being tried in a half back role similar to how Matty Boyd played there.

I called this 3 years ago! Do it Bevo!

His skills are pretty good when he's not at the coal-face. Probably (definitely) isn't as good marking the ball at Boyd, but I think his footy nous will be super handy organising what will be a pretty inexperienced back 6 next year, especially with the 600-odd games coming out of it.

[bornadog]

I called this 3 years ago! Do it Bevo!

His skills are pretty good when he's not at the coal-face. Probably (definitely) isn't as good marking the ball at Boyd, but I think his footy nous will be super handy organising what will be a pretty inexperienced back 6 next year, especially with the 600-odd games coming out of it.

Didn't he have a stint on the HBF under BMacc

[Happy Days]

Didn't he have a stint on the HBF under BMacc

Who's B-Mac?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

If Wallis cannot reinvent himself, I don't see how he plays regular senior footy because he isn't good enough to be playing midfield.

HBF isn't a bad suggestion but Boyd was always very sure with his hands, read the play well and took intercepting marks. There's been no evidence to suggest that Wallis has any of these traits, but it could be worth a try.

[Sedat]

Didn't he have a stint on the HBF under BMacc
Didn't everyone? BMac wanted to turn all 22 players on the ground into dirty back pocket plumbers.

[Happy Days]

Didn't everyone? BMac wanted to turn all 22 players on the ground into dirty back pocket plumbers.

Gotta give him credit though - without his help we never would have figured out that trying to turn everyone into what their floor as a player could be doesn't work.

[Mantis]

If Wallis cannot reinvent himself, I don't see how he plays regular senior footy because he isn't good enough to be playing midfield.

HBF isn't a bad suggestion but Boyd was always very sure with his hands, read the play well and took intercepting marks. There's been no evidence to suggest that Wallis has any of these traits, but it could be worth a try.

I'm in agreeance, I too don't see the skills required for this role in Mitch... but I'm not sure what other options there are for him as we have depth in his most suited role and his skill-set doesn't have him in front of any, and his limitations have him behind others.

[Happy Days]

I'm in agreeance, I too don't see the skills required for this role in Mitch... but I'm not sure what other options there are for him as we have depth in his most suited role and his skill-set doesn't have him in front of any, and his limitations have him behind others.

Not that it's super relevant, but I definitely didn't see the skills in Boyd to do it before he was moved there too. Wallis is a very clever, if not super athletic footballer. I can't see the skills currently, but I can foresee them. Wouldn't shock me at all if he was something of a revelation in that role.

[comrade]

Wally doesn't have the overhead ability or clean hands that Boyd always had. In fact, his hands were concrete like at times in the VFL on the weekend.

Not saying it couldn't work - who saw Boyd becoming an AA HBF'er - but I don't see it happening.

[WBFC4FFC]

How about Stringer on the Half-Back line? At least he will be dragged into the play, has a burst of pace and can get it moving forward quickly. (Mind you, we will have to still put up with the obligatory 2 holding the ball decisions a game, but the positives should outweigh the negatives).

[always right]

Wally doesn't have the overhead ability or clean hands that Boyd always had. In fact, his hands were concrete like at times in the VFL on the weekend.

Not saying it couldn't work - who saw Boyd becoming an AA HBF'er - but I don't see it happening.
Mitch doesn't have the skills on his wrong side either. Boydy ended up being a very proficient left foot kick. His hands were also brilliant.

Perhaps Wallis will need to go back to a negating role.

[comrade]

Mitch doesn't have the skills on his wrong side either. Boydy ended up being a very proficient left foot kick. His hands were also brilliant.

Perhaps Wallis will need to go back to a negating role.

Mitch is a very reliable set shot. Maybe more of a permanent role in the forward line could be on the cards?

[Sedat]

Mitch is a very reliable set shot. Maybe more of a permanent role in the forward line could be on the cards?
The Toby Greene template? Ball winning mid with crap disposal skills but has become a serious weapon up forward. Worth a shot as I fear for his future as a mid with no hurt factor.

[always right]

Mitch is a very reliable set shot. Maybe more of a permanent role in the forward line could be on the cards?

Yes he is a reliable set shot but finds it difficult get separation on his defender. I think its midfield or bust with him.

[Mantis]

Mitch is a very reliable set shot. Maybe more of a permanent role in the forward line could be on the cards?

From inside 35m.. but isn't this the role Dickson fills? Can't see how you play them both in this role as neither is quick or strong overhead.

[westbulldog]

Goalkicking accuracy needs to be addressed. If we had been closer in the race for the 8, our inaccuracy / poor % would have cost us anyway.
Roughhead is not the answer at fullback, someone like May or McGovern is and Collins may be. Roberts never was unfortunately.
We also need a seasoned ruckman, recruit Kruezer.
Jake Stringer needs a massive pre-season aerobically and he could be a midfield gun.
Smith, Cloke, Webb, Honeychurch are borderline.
Throw a bucket of $ at Eric Hipwood.

[Twodogs]

From inside 35m.. but isn't this the role Dickson fills? Can't see how you play them both in this role as neither is quick or strong overhead.

Yep. Was thinking the same thing.

[kruder]

-Continuity instead of flexibility and that goes to all areas of the field.
-Kicking club instead of the handball club.

[comrade]

From inside 35m.. but isn't this the role Dickson fills? Can't see how you play them both in this role as neither is quick or strong overhead.

I think we need to start planning for life after Dickson. Injury prone and once he's copped one, he takes months to get back to full fitness. Doesn't strike me as a bloke who will play well into his 30s.

[jeemak]

I think it's garbage to suggest Wallis can't be an effective cog within our midfield mix, particularly after a solid preseason. What he achieved this year is overlooked by his struggle in some games in which much of the team was ordinary and under performing. His disposal deficiencies are overblown, and his hands in close are outstanding when he is in form.

We should be fostering his ability to get forward and kick a goal from time to time as a midfielder, not looking to reinvent his game or move him on. With Liberatore out of form and Bont having to play forward it was clear a lot was left for Wallis to do in the grunt stakes, and this clearly took a toll on him throughout the year.

[jeemak]

-Continuity instead of flexibility and that goes to all areas of the field.
-Kicking club instead of the handball club.

Why can't we be both?

[Mantis]

I think it's garbage to suggest Wallis can't be an effective cog within our midfield mix, particularly after a solid preseason. What he achieved this year is overlooked by his struggle in some games in which much of the team was ordinary and under performing. His disposal deficiencies are overblown, and his hands in close are outstanding when he is in form.

We should be fostering his ability to get forward and kick a goal from time to time as a midfielder, not looking to reinvent his game or move him on. With Liberatore out of form and Bont having to play forward it was clear a lot was left for Wallis to do in the grunt stakes, and this clearly took a toll on him throughout the year.

I think it's naive to believe that we can go back to what didn't work this year and believe all is well.. It's fact that that our midfield lacks pace and kicking depth & precision so we need to change up the mix. McLean was a welcomed addition to the midfield in the latter part of the year and it was no surprise to see Daniel get more midfield minutes at the expense of the like of Dahlhaus & Wallis who weren't being effective in those roles.

I will watch with interest how we move forward with regard to our midfield mix.

[jeemak]

I think it's naive to believe that we can go back to what didn't work this year and believe all is well.. It's fact that that our midfield lacks pace and kicking depth & precision so we need to change up the mix. McLean was a welcomed addition to the midfield in the latter part of the year and it was no surprise to see Daniel get more midfield minutes at the expense of the like of Dahlhaus & Wallis who weren't being effective in those roles.

I will watch with interest how we move forward with regard to our midfield mix.

It would be naive, and there's no way I would suggest we should leave things as they are!

I like the idea of Dahl and McLean rotating through the middle, with the former spending a greater portion of time forward than he has in recent times (past 24-36 months). We need someone with genuine pace and tenacity to apply forward defencive pressure, as we really struggle to keep the ball in there without flooding the space which makes it difficult to score and us too easy to score against on the break. To cover Dahl's absence in the middle, we need to inject more pace into the mix from external sources whilst giving more midfield time to Daniel.

It will be interesting to see what happens with Libba, we can't have both him and Wallis playing with the same productivity delivered in 2017. I'm confident the latter will progress over the preseason, I'm not comfortable with the former - something at the back of my mind says things with him won't be fixed easily within a short period of time.

[Bulldog4life]

I think it's garbage to suggest Wallis can't be an effective cog within our midfield mix, particularly after a solid preseason. What he achieved this year is overlooked by his struggle in some games in which much of the team was ordinary and under performing. His disposal deficiencies are overblown, and his hands in close are outstanding when he is in form.

We should be fostering his ability to get forward and kick a goal from time to time as a midfielder, not looking to reinvent his game or move him on. With Liberatore out of form and Bont having to play forward it was clear a lot was left for Wallis to do in the grunt stakes, and this clearly took a toll on him throughout the year.

Agree. We have to remember too the Wally came back after that serious leg injury so It wasn't unusual that he found the end of the year tough. His last full season 2015 he finished in the top 10 at the B & F so he is still a valuable player for us. After a full pre season I think he will come back to his best form

[always right]

I would prefer we play Dahlhaus predominately as a small forward with less time spent in the midfield. He just doesn't do enough with his disposal whereas up forward he can provide pressure and snag the odd goal. His midfield minutes should be taken by Stringer.

[josie]

Is it possible libba's ankle injury last year is one he will never fully recover from? Did he play on adrenalin in the finals and playing through it caused irreparable damage? Hope not, just a thought that crossed my mind. I know the club and medicos would never intend long term harm to players but sometimes there are unintended outcomes. Will be interesting if Selwood recovers well after he returns seeing as I understand he had same op with same surgeon.

Agree with Dahl as small forward rather than permanent mid as his kicking is average.

Also agree Wallis may not be best 22 especially if Libba comes good and if Jong recovers from acl and starts kicking more goals like he did in '15.

[jeemak]

Is it possible libba's ankle injury last year is one he will never fully recover from? Did he play on adrenalin in the finals and playing through it caused irreparable damage? Hope not, just a thought that crossed my mind. I know the club and medicos would never intend long term harm to players but sometimes there are unintended outcomes. Will be interesting if Selwood recovers well after he returns seeing as I understand he had same op with same surgeon.

Agree with Dahl as small forward rather than permanent mid as his kicking is average.

Also agree Wallis may not be best 22 especially if Libba comes good and if Jong recovers from acl and starts kicking more goals like he did in '15.

I guess the reasonable question to ask might be along the lines of whether an ankle/leg injury that was seemingly able to be managed through a high intensity finals series - but had to be operated on pre-season - is actually season defining the coming year.......

Or, perhaps he was underdone post surgery in the pre-season and being in that position requires a level of discipline he wasn't able to deliver.

I know which scenario I'd choose.

[Remi Moses]

Agree. We have to remember too the Wally came back after that serious leg injury so It wasn't unusual that he found the end of the year tough. His last full season 2015 he finished in the top 10 at the B & F so he is still a valuable player for us. After a full pre season I think he will come back to his best form

Pretty shocked Mitch was so good early, but then wasn't shocked he faded .

[bornadog]

Pretty shocked Mitch was so good early, but then wasn't shocked he faded .

I think with another preseason under his belt from the broken leg, he will come back stronger than ever.

[always right]

After watching the VFL final on Sunday, I was again reminded what a poor tackler Lewis Young is. Hardly ever sticks a tackle.

Big pre-season in the gym is an obvious need but work on his tackling technique and intent is badly needed.

[Rocket Science]

A suggestion to remedy any 'hunger' issues heading into next year...

'Essendon made finals in 2017. We didn't.'

Paint it in large letters on the wall of the gym and text it to every player weekly until this time next year.

Seeing gimps like Hooker prepare for this week while our blokes are golfing sticks in my craw.

[Twodogs]

A suggestion to remedy any 'hunger' issues heading into next year...

'Essendon made finals in 2017. We didn't.'

Paint it in large letters on the wall of the gym and text it to every player weekly until this time next year.

Seeing gimps like Hooker prepare for this week while our blokes are golfing sticks in my craw.


Bugger putting it in the gym. Put it up in ten foot letters right where it said "Premiers 2016" all through last preseason.

[comrade]

A suggestion to remedy any 'hunger' issues heading into next year...

'Essendon made finals in 2017. We didn't.'

Paint it in large letters on the wall of the gym and text it to every player weekly until this time next year.

Seeing gimps like Hooker prepare for this week while our blokes are golfing sticks in my craw.

I'm still pissed off Hurley made the AA team after turning his back on us at the 11th hour. Hope they get belted this week.

[Rocket Science]

Bugger putting it in the gym. Put it up in ten foot letters right where it said "Premiers 2016" all through last preseason.

http://i66.tinypic.com/f0dgyx.png

[EasternWest]

http://i66.tinypic.com/f0dgyx.png

That's great Rocket.

[boydogs]

Hooker's injured, it's going to need an edit ;)

[Rocket Science]

http://i68.tinypic.com/21en4ep.png

[Eastdog]

"The enemy north of the Maribyrnong made it".

[always right]

Would be more shameful if It replaced Essendon with Mark Baguely. Mark f**ken Baguely.

[azabob]

"The enemy north of the Maribyrnong made it".

I think that might go over the players head.

[Daughter of the West]

http://i68.tinypic.com/21en4ep.png

I just spat out my tea! Excellent work RS.