Coaching Group - Under Pressure?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Discuss.

Long list of questions since 2016 and whether you want to agree with them or acknowledge them, 2 goals in one game and then no goals in a whole second half under a roof paints an ugly picture for our football club.

The buck stops with the coaching group.

The ridiculous unnecessary changes since 2016, the match selections, the complete lack of spirit.....

Pressure should be knocking on their door.

[Sedat]

I'm still a Bevo believer but he is absolutely not above question. He can clearly coach and also motivate players - 2015 and 2016 don't just happen, and he got maximum output from players who weren't previously rated with a combination of inspired positional changes and game style changes to accentuate our list strengths.

I think all aspects of the club should be reviewed carefully and properly at the end of the season - list management and recruitment (do we beef up this area?), fitness and conditioning, assistant coaching. The last one in particular needs a shake-up - the same voices in the box for 3 years now, and fresh innovative thinkers need to come in. It will invigorate Bevo as well IMO.

[GVGjr]

I'm still a Bevo believer but he is absolutely not above question. He can clearly coach and also motivate players - 2015 and 2016 don't just happen, and he got maximum output from players who weren't previously rated with a combination of inspired positional changes and game style changes to accentuate our list strengths.

I think all aspects of the club should be reviewed carefully and properly at the end of the season - list management and recruitment (do we beef up this area?), fitness and conditioning, assistant coaching. The last one in particular needs a shake-up - the same voices in the box for 3 years now, and fresh innovative thinkers need to come in. It will invigorate Bevo as well IMO.

Like you I think Bevo is a very good coach but I think he either needs someone to play bad cop alongside of him or he has to start holding players and coaches to account himself. The good natured bloke that puts his arm around the players approach that worked in 2015/16 isn't quite working at the moment.
So the question is why have we fallen back so far given the strength of our list in 2015/16? Given the shitty performance of 2017 did we address the areas of concern in a professional manner at the end of 2017 or take the easy road to write it off as a gap year?

I think we took the easy option and this is supported by minimal player movement and zero changes to an under performing coaching group in 2017 so that has to fall hard on Bevo. Clearly he and others at the club rated our chances this year.

I'm not sure we have to make wholesale changes to the coaching team but it does need a decent shake up.

[Sedat]

So the question is why have we fallen back so far given the strength of our list in 2015/16? Given the shitty performance of 2017 did we address the areas of concern in a professional manner at the end of 2017 or take the easy road to write it off as a gap year?

I think we took the easy option and this is supported by minimal player movement and zero changes to an under performing coaching group in 2017 so that has to fall hard on Bevo. Clearly he and others at the club rated our chances this year.

I'm not sure we have to make wholesale changes to the coaching team but it does need a decent shake up.
The game has never been more reliant on midfield depth and running power and yet our list management strategy has been so lopsided in the last 3 years. Some examples:

Why get Greene if we already got Lipinski and Dunks previously?
Why get Young when we got Collins and re-contracted Fletcher?
Why keep Campbell when we already had Roughy, Boyd and just drafted English?
Why offer Redders a 2 year deal when we traded for Schache?
Why get NM-M when we already have Boyd and Redders?
Why keep Brad Lynch as a rookie for 4 years when we have a plethora of running half backs?
Why get Crozier for the same reason?
Why get Trengove when we have about 8 full backs (even though half of them are always injured)?

[GVGjr]

The game has never been more reliant on midfield depth and running power and yet our list management strategy has been so lopsided in the last 3 years. Some examples:

Why get Greene if we already got Lipinski and Dunks previously?
Why get Young when we got Collins and re-contracted Fletcher?

Our success in 2105 and especially in 2016 was around having about 8 players could could rotate through the midfield but instead of adding that strength we lost depth. Basically we out rotated opposition midfields in those years. Perplexing why we abandoned it

I've mentioned this a few times, we stuffed up at the 2016 trade and draft table. Greene was originally on our radar for a rookie spot, Young for our last pick but when we missed on players we positioned ourselves for we ended up taking Young then Greene earlier than expected. Lipinski was also selected a bit earlier than ideal because we missed out on that 2nd pick.
We have turned Young into a defender because of his quickness and athleticism as I think he played more as a forward for the SA U18 side.



Why keep Campbell when we already had Roughy, Boyd and just drafted English?
Why offer Redders a 2 year deal when we traded for Schache?

Boyd was a questionable starter this year and I didn't think English would come along as quickly as he had. Keeping Campbell seems OK until we traded for Schache and acquired Trengove
Redders should have been a one year deal but I think Richmond were sniffing around. Given the players have him in the leadership group perhaps 2 years was the right deal at the time.



Why keep Brad Lynch as a rookie for 4 years when we have a plethora of running half backs?
Why get Crozier for the same reason?
Why get Trengove when we have about 8 full backs (even though half of them are always injured)?

Yep a surplus of similar defenders makes it hard to justify except Lynch has better skills than most.
Trengove was always supposed to be more of a structure player who could fill in with some key position spots.

[Sedat]

I've mentioned this a few times, we stuffed up at the 2016 trade and draft table. Greene was originally on our radar for a rookie spot, Young for our last pick but when we missed on players we positioned ourselves for we ended up taking Young then Greene earlier than expected. Lipinski was also selected a bit earlier than ideal because we missed out on that 2nd pick.
We have turned Young into a defender because of his quickness and athleticism as I think he played more as a forward for the SA U18 side.
I know we were angling for Long and Hannan with the Lipinski & Young picks but they wouldn't help with our midfield depth either. My problem is that we identified all of these non-mids to begin with, meanwhile as an example a contested bull like Jack Graham slips through to pick 53. Our draft and trade targets were completely in the wrong areas, especially considering we also threw the kitchen sink at Hurley late in 2016.

None of the above examples are necessarily wrong in isolation, but as a collective how can we have been so negligent in not continuing to invest heavily in cultivating and growing our midfield stocks, and over a 3 year period which is an eternity in list management? There are natural ball winners like Tim Kelly running around all over Australia - what are our guys looking at and what do they think the game is going to evolve into with reduced interchange rotations?

[Go_Dogs]

We need an independent review into the entire football department, because at the moment there are concerns relating to the following areas:-

1. List management (yes, we've hired Sam Power who remains untried)
2. Following on from that, draft philosophy and strategy
3. Physical conditioning
4. Injury management
5. All layers of the coaching staff
6. Opposition analysis
7. The continuous rumours of discontent at senior levels also needs to be urgently addressed.

Someone who isn't involved in the club and with no vested interest in the outcome needs to chair this process and engage whoever they require to assist in providing findings.

Tonight I remembered what it's like to be a Bulldogs supporter as the Collingwood ferals got louder and louder....after coming so far in such a short space of time we've regressed at an alarming rate.

We still have quality people and players at the club, so I'm not necessarily advocating wholesale changes, however there are a number of deficiencies and moving parts which aren't aligned which need to be addressed.

I know things are never as good or as bad as they seem, but we need a review and some better governance.

[bulldogtragic]

They got the plaudits after October 1, 2016.

A mere 32 games later, we've kicked 2 goals in 6 of the last 8 quarters and now we are headed a finish in the bottom 5 with many to most of the same list.

32 games. Possibly one the quickest fall from the summit ever. The question must be asked why. Questioning the coaches must be done from those high up in the club.

[G-Mo77]

They got the plaudits after October 1, 2016.

A mere 32 games later, we've kicked 2 goals in 6 of the last 8 quarters and now we are headed a finish in the bottom 5 with many to most of the same list.

32 games. Possibly one the quickest fall from the summit ever. The question must be asked why. Questioning the coaches must be done from those high up in the club.

It's a shame we won 3 in a row. If we're going to be this shithouse I want a top 3 pick!

[SonofScray]

I think the blowtorch has to be turned on the coaching panel. No cohesion across phases of the game and no visible amendments to how we play based on who is out there. It still isn't immediately tangible what we are trying to do. Except for not scoring goals, it's clear we don't think goals matter.

The inky concession I will make in the coach's favour is the number of games lost to injury, plus minutes lost to injury in game between 2015-2018 has been staggering. We have a lot of players hobbled and rarely finish a game with 4 fit on the bench. That puts a lot of stress in the system and the players trying to cover. Coming home to roost after plunging into our depth in 15/16.

[bulldogtragic]

It's a shame we won 3 in a row. If we're going to be this shithouse I want a top 3 pick!

There was a small part of me wanting that. And to be fair, if Brisbane or GCS were just only a little better, we wouldn't have won those. We need to nail what looks like pick 5. And have a game plan from the coaches that reflects our poor skills. There's no point having a gameplan that requires precise kicking, or one where the players are 4 goals down and then go about icing the clock in the last quarter.

I think we need to turn the list refresh into a rebuild. We need to turn the coaching panel from refresh into rebuild too.

[G-Mo77]

Every assitant gets the flick and start a whole new coaching group in 2019. Our list is such a mess it's going to take years to balance we need to at least fix what we can ASAP. Who is our tactical guru down there?

[bulldogtragic]

Every assitant gets the flick and start a whole new coaching group in 2019. Our list is such a mess it's going to take years to balance we need to at least fix what we can ASAP. Who is our tactical guru down there?

Bevo won't allow it. He shuffled them because he wanted. He's left them there because he wanted. He wanted Honeychurch, so Cloke who had a contract was forced out. He wanted Smith to stay despite him doing nothing. He overrode the rookie draft selection. He won't play rucks when we need them, mainly Campbell. He's stuffing up Boyd's forward development by rucking him. Bains & Gordon will have to impose themselves to see by change. Sam Power is going to have to be strong not to buckle. It's not so much being anti-Bevo, because we all are not, but we are pro-change and that's going to be very hard. I just can't believe we've gone from premiership to cellar dwellers who can't score for a full game or half a game within 32 games. It breath takingly stonishing.

We don't have a tactical guru. Or a goal kicking coach.

[azabob]

Every assitant gets the flick and start a whole new coaching group in 2019. Our list is such a mess it's going to take years to balance we need to at least fix what we can ASAP. Who is our tactical guru down there?

Brett Montgomery was our tactical guru and bad cop and he hasn’t been replaced.

I think the actual decision making on assistant coaches has to be taken away from Beveridge. He has input but not the final say.

He is extremely loyal and just as stubborn - Can he make that tough call?

Is Chris Grant the right person to be footy manager as who ultimately rubber stamped our list management strategy.

It appears that having both Graham Lowe and Brett Montgomery leaving our club within 6 months of each other may have a had a much bigger impact than we previously thought.

[G-Mo77]

Brett Montgomery was our tactical guru and bad cop and he hasn’t been replaced.

Wasn't there some guy Melbourne poached from us after 2016?

[azabob]

Wasn't there some guy Melbourne poached from us after 2016?

Craig Jennings who was our opposition analyst. I think he’s been patched by another club now.

[Remi Moses]

Think Bevo is a great coach , but we need some new eyes and ears in the box .
They’ve made changes to recruiting and list management already, so they don’t come into play yet.
If anything Beveridge has been to loyal to a few injury prone players
We need kicking urgently and more mids . We’re to top heavy in certain areas and skinny in others .

[Remi Moses]

Do we need that many key back men
Adams Morris Roberts Young Cordy Naughton all key backs !
It’s surprising considering most teams have small to medium key forwards

[Remi Moses]

Plus Collins

[bulldogtragic]

Do we need that many key back men
Adams Morris Roberts Young Cordy Naughton all key backs !
It’s surprising considering most teams have small to medium key forwards

I'd let Morris retire a club hero, and cut Roberts loose. That leaves us with Cordy, Adams, Naughton, Young & Collins for next year. Grab Khamis as a NGA who may add some height (not KPP though) if he can grow a couple more cm's.

The list needs balancing. But if 'best available' is a KPD, guess what we will do.

[bornadog]

Every assistant gets the flick and start a whole new coaching group in 2019.?

Agree, I think Richmond did this




I think the actual decision making on assistant coaches has to be taken away from Beveridge. He has input but not the final say.



If you were a manager of people (maybe you are), would you like this? Sorry, Bevo has to have a major say in who he picks as assistants.

[Sedat]

If you were a manager of people (maybe you are), would you like this? Sorry, Bevo has to have a major say in who he picks as assistants.
Disgaree. The Footy Manager makes this call. Hardwick didn't make the call on bringing in Caracella at the end of 2016

[Twodogs]

Agree, I think Richmond did this



If you were a manager of people (maybe you are), would you like this? Sorry, Bevo has to have a major say in who he picks as assistants.


Why? It's not what they did at Richmond. Hardwick was told if he wanted to stay senior coach then his assistants would be appointed with little input from him. I think we indulge senior coaches and their wishes little too much. The coaches were in place when Bevo took over, he had no input into who they would be and that's the coaching team that won a flag. Maybe Bevo us the worst person to nominate his assistants? Maybe he can't make rational decisions when it's people he is close to? I know I have trouble doing things like that.

[bulldogtragic]

Disgaree. The Footy Manager makes this call. Hardwick didn't make the call on brining in Caracella at the end of 2016

Yep. Also, if there wasn't a mandatory minimum 3 list changes, I think Bevo wouldn't make three changes if no players wanted out. There's loyalty, which is great. And then there's blinkers.

[bornadog]

Disgaree. The Footy Manager makes this call. Hardwick didn't make the call on bringing in Caracella at the end of 2016

You can't have people reporting to you if you don't have a say. I didn't say Bevo has a FINAL say, I said MAJOR say.

[SlimPickens]

I’d stick with Rohan Smith and Joel Corey whilst moving on the rest. Both excelled as line coaches in 15/16 so put them back in there. King, Gia and Hansen need to go. Each line they are in charge of, have struggled dramatically since their appointments.

I may be wrong but I believe Jamie Maddox does the opposition analysis, questions need to be asked of him also.

[anfo27]

One can only hope the coaching group comes under the spotlight. Bevo will always be a god but questions need to be asked. We talk about injuries but our kids are doing fine, its our senior guys who are letting us down. Except for Macrae, Mclean, Suckling & Cordy the rest have been rubbish.
Why have our senior players gone backwards, including Bont?
I hate watching us play because our brand is crap to watch! We used to be great to watch, so much so Dennis Pagan said his love for the game had been reinvigorated by the 2016 bulldogs.
Its just so disheartening to be a dogs fan now. If i wasn't at the G to see us win the flag i wouldn't believe this team achieved the ultimate.
I've been a member for 22 years and social club member for 15 & all of a sudden i find myself questioning whether i want to give up my hard earned money to a club where i feel the playing group as a whole are cruising. If the players & coaching group aren't going to invest everything they have why should i?

[ledge]

One can only hope the coaching group comes under the spotlight. Bevo will always be a god but questions need to be asked. We talk about injuries but our kids are doing fine, its our senior guys who are letting us down. Except for Macrae, Mclean, Suckling & Cordy the rest have been rubbish.
Why have our senior players gone backwards, including Bont?
I hate watching us play because our brand is crap to watch! We used to be great to watch, so much so Dennis Pagan said his love for the game had been reinvigorated by the 2016 bulldogs.
Its just so disheartening to be a dogs fan now. If i wasn't at the G to see us win the flag i wouldn't believe this team achieved the ultimate.
I've been a member for 22 years and social club member for 15 & all of a sudden i find myself questioning whether i want to give up my hard earned money to a club where i feel the playing group as a whole are cruising. If the players & coaching group aren't going to invest everything they have why should i?

That's extremely harsh on this group your practically saying they aren't trying , and senior players ? We have practically 3 in the seniors this year , Suckling, Wood and Macrae are about it and to me Macrae and Suckling are going fine , And Wood had missed through injury. you do realise even the Bont is only 23 , Cordy is only 21

[G-Mo77]

That's extremely harsh on this group your practically saying they aren't trying , and senior players ? We have practically 3 in the seniors this year , Suckling, Wood and Macrae are about it and to me Macrae and Suckling are going fine , And Wood had missed through injury. you do realise even the Bont is only 23 , Cordy is only 21

They are?

I'm the same as Anfo right now. I don't want to make the effort to go and watch, only reason I'll go is to get out of the house and do something else, have some me time. I'll probably go on Saturday but I can imagine I'll leave around half time, early 3rd and go and do something else. All respect we gained from 2016 is all but gone, we're a laughing stock, a joke and I'm embarrassed to be a supporter.

[LostDoggy]

I’d stick with Rohan Smith and Joel Corey whilst moving on the rest. Both excelled as line coaches in 15/16 so put them back in there. King, Gia and Hansen need to go. Each line they are in charge of, have struggled dramatically since their appointments.

I may be wrong but I believe Jamie Maddox does the opposition analysis, questions need to be asked of him also.

I agree with this. I have seen Smith and Corey's names pop up repeatedly in player interviews, it seems like they are very competent. We do need a major shake up though so I'd be supportive of the others going and resh blood injected.

[ledge]

I agree with this. I have seen Smith and Corey's names pop up repeatedly in player interviews, it seems like they are very competent. We do need a major shake up though so I'd be supportive of the others going and resh blood injected.

How much fresh blood do you change in a year , we already changed our whole recruiting staff.
Bevo tends to move up coaches , Maple , Hansen for example.

[LostDoggy]

How much fresh blood do you change in a year , we already changed our whole recruiting staff.
Bevo tends to move up coaches , Maple , Hansen for example.

We've gone in with the same coaching group for the past 2 seasons in which time we've gone from premiers with a gamestyle ahead of the pack to a bottom half team with an incoherent game style. If we go in with the identical coaching group again next year I'd be gobsmacked.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Why? It's not what they did at Richmond. Hardwick was told if he wanted to stay senior coach then his assistants would be appointed with little input from him. I think we indulge senior coaches and their wishes little too much. The coaches were in place when Bevo took over, he had no input into who they would be and that's the coaching team that won a flag. Maybe Bevo us the worst person to nominate his assistants? Maybe he can't make rational decisions when it's people he is close to? I know I have trouble doing things like that.
The coup at Richmond was the appointment of Neil Balme as Football Manager who was highly regarded at both Geelong and Collingwood. Balme has an excellent football brain and a key to the Tigers success.

[Bulldog4life]

I’d stick with Rohan Smith and Joel Corey whilst moving on the rest. Both excelled as line coaches in 15/16 so put them back in there. King, Gia and Hansen need to go. Each line they are in charge of, have struggled dramatically since their appointments.

I may be wrong but I believe Jamie Maddox does the opposition analysis, questions need to be asked of him also.

Isn't Smithy with the VFL team?

[bornadog]

Isn't Smithy with the VFL team?

Smith is the AFL development manager

[jeemak]

I would be staggered if they weren't already under significant pressure internally, alongside Chris Grant, given we have a new CEO casting a fresh set of eyes over the group.

It's clear we are a bit stale, though whilst we have had such an inexperienced team playing, seeing the strategy has been difficult because young players are inconsistent in output in all areas. What I have found alarming though is the ability for us to look completely disinterested in the contest over different stages within games or for whole games. Our coaching and leadership group need to get on the same page on what's required, and start enforcing standards otherwise we'll forge an unwanted habit that will only be reversed by a cataclysmic change in personnel at the most senior level.

I'm not as concerned around the balance of the list as others are, though generally agree that we need to inject genuine midfield talent and a small forward as quickly as we possibly can. Morris will retire at the end of this year and I think that both Roberts and Collins will be moved on (whether I think the latter should be moved on is another story) as well. That will leave the KPD stocks about right, providing we can keep Adams on the park.

Our ruck stocks were just about right for this year, as I don't think anyone would have thought English would move up the pecking order as quickly as he did while Tom Boyd was an unknown quantity. I don't see Campbell being at the club next year, meaning that issue will take care of itself should we retain Roughead.

I guess I'm suggesting that a lot of the issues around balance will sort themselves out at the end of this year. How we recover from them is key, and I'm desperately hoping we can land some senior midfield and forward quality this coming trade period.

[Ghost Dog]

I would be staggered if they weren't already under significant pressure internally, alongside Chris Grant, given we have a new CEO casting a fresh set of eyes over the group.

It's clear we are a bit stale, though whilst we have had such an inexperienced team playing, seeing the strategy has been difficult because young players are inconsistent in output in all areas. What I have found alarming though is the ability for us to look completely disinterested in the contest over different stages within games or for whole games. Our coaching and leadership group need to get on the same page on what's required, and start enforcing standards otherwise we'll forge an unwanted habit that will only be reversed by a cataclysmic change in personnel at the most senior level.

I'm not as concerned around the balance of the list as others are, though generally agree that we need to inject genuine midfield talent and a small forward as quickly as we possibly can. Morris will retire at the end of this year and I think that both Roberts and Collins will be moved on (whether I think the latter should be moved on is another story) as well. That will leave the KPD stocks about right, providing we can keep Adams on the park.

Our ruck stocks were just about right for this year, as I don't think anyone would have thought English would move up the pecking order as quickly as he did while Tom Boyd was an unknown quantity. I don't see Campbell being at the club next year, meaning that issue will take care of itself should we retain Roughead.

I guess I'm suggesting that a lot of the issues around balance will sort themselves out at the end of this year. How we recover from them is key, and I'm desperately hoping we can land some senior midfield and forward quality this coming trade period.

Tom Campbell had 72 hit outs on the weekend. You think he will look for other opportunities? Or not up to AFL standard.

[G-Mo77]

Tom Campbell had 72 hit outs on the weekend. You think he will look for other opportunities? Or not up to AFL standard.

Honestly what was the point of keeping him or Roberts if they're never going to get another shot? May as well take another poke in the draft or see what we can get at the trade table. Late picks would have been better than letting players rot in the VFL.

[bornadog]

I would be staggered if they weren't already under significant pressure internally, alongside Chris Grant, given we have a new CEO casting a fresh set of eyes over the group.

It's clear we are a bit stale, though whilst we have had such an inexperienced team playing, seeing the strategy has been difficult because young players are inconsistent in output in all areas. What I have found alarming though is the ability for us to look completely disinterested in the contest over different stages within games or for whole games. Our coaching and leadership group need to get on the same page on what's required, and start enforcing standards otherwise we'll forge an unwanted habit that will only be reversed by a cataclysmic change in personnel at the most senior level.

I'm not as concerned around the balance of the list as others are, though generally agree that we need to inject genuine midfield talent and a small forward as quickly as we possibly can. Morris will retire at the end of this year and I think that both Roberts and Collins will be moved on (whether I think the latter should be moved on is another story) as well. That will leave the KPD stocks about right, providing we can keep Adams on the park.

Our ruck stocks were just about right for this year, as I don't think anyone would have thought English would move up the pecking order as quickly as he did while Tom Boyd was an unknown quantity. I don't see Campbell being at the club next year, meaning that issue will take care of itself should we retain Roughead.

I guess I'm suggesting that a lot of the issues around balance will sort themselves out at the end of this year. How we recover from them is key, and I'm desperately hoping we can land some senior midfield and forward quality this coming trade period.

Jeemak, another quality post and completely agree with you.

[Ghost Dog]

Honestly what was the point of keeping him or Roberts if they're never going to get another shot? May as well take another poke in the draft or see what we can get at the trade table. Late picks would have been better than letting players rot in the VFL.

This is a good point. It's not good for them and and it's not good for us.

[bornadog]

This is a good point. It's not good for them and and it's not good for us.

They are backups, which every team needs.

[Twodogs]

I would be staggered if they weren't already under significant pressure internally, alongside Chris Grant, given we have a new CEO casting a fresh set of eyes over the group.

It's clear we are a bit stale, though whilst we have had such an inexperienced team playing, seeing the strategy has been difficult because young players are inconsistent in output in all areas. What I have found alarming though is the ability for us to look completely disinterested in the contest over different stages within games or for whole games. Our coaching and leadership group need to get on the same page on what's required, and start enforcing standards otherwise we'll forge an unwanted habit that will only be reversed by a cataclysmic change in personnel at the most senior level.

I'm not as concerned around the balance of the list as others are, though generally agree that we need to inject genuine midfield talent and a small forward as quickly as we possibly can. Morris will retire at the end of this year and I think that both Roberts and Collins will be moved on (whether I think the latter should be moved on is another story) as well. That will leave the KPD stocks about right, providing we can keep Adams on the park.

Our ruck stocks were just about right for this year, as I don't think anyone would have thought English would move up the pecking order as quickly as he did while Tom Boyd was an unknown quantity. I don't see Campbell being at the club next year, meaning that issue will take care of itself should we retain Roughead.

I guess I'm suggesting that a lot of the issues around balance will sort themselves out at the end of this year. How we recover from them is key, and I'm desperately hoping we can land some senior midfield and forward quality this coming trade period.


Yeah, I was thinking that at the end of last year.

[hujsh]

They are backups, which every team needs.

Not if you refuse to play them when the guys they're backing up are injured. Honestly I can't see any reason to give a list position to Campbell if we prefer to just play Boyd in the ruck on his own with Dunkley and Bont as the backups.

[G-Mo77]

They are backups, which every team needs.

Backups that they would pick and play would be better. If the coach and MC didn't rate them in 2017 why keep them in 2018? We may as well have started the season with 38 on the list.

[azabob]

Unfortunately still a very relevant question and no clearer answer.

Sam Mitchell, Blake Caracella & Adam Kingsley all out contract at years end (or breaking final year) who are each highly rated.

[Eastdog]

Unfortunately still a very relevant question and no clearer answer.

Sam Mitchell, Blake Caracella & Adam Kingsley all out contract at years end (or breaking final year) who are each highly rated.

A reasonable question. Bevo is safe but might need some new people around him.

[westdog54]

Has Bevo actually brought any assistants in during his time?

[SlimPickens]

Has Bevo actually brought any assistants in during his time?

Yes, his mate from the ammos Jamie Maddox

[Sedat]

Over the last month we are easily the worst team in the entire competition. Worst percentage, worst points for and worst points against.

This isn't just about 'injuries' and 'we're young'. We're actually completely broken in all key facets of the game. Over to you Bevo.

[jeemak]

Over the last month we are easily the worst team in the entire competition. Worst percentage, worst points for and worst points against.

This isn't just about 'injuries' and 'we're young'. We're actually completely broken in all key facets of the game. Over to you Bevo.

Of course the draw (fixture) has nothing to do with that.......right?

Just as it might not be only about being injured and young, it's more about that than it is anything else. Apart from putting in effort every week, which admittedly has been an issue, I honestly don't know what people want in terms of structure and game plan.

[Ghost Dog]

Not enough leadership replaced the losses in recent years. Too much expected of younger players, older players underperforming.

[Sedat]

Of course the draw (fixture) has nothing to do with that.......right?

Just as it might not be only about being injured and young, it's more about that than it is anything else. Apart from putting in effort every week, which admittedly has been an issue, I honestly don't know what people want in terms of structure and game plan.
Hawthorn, Melbourne, West Coke and Port. Not easy but not impossible. Certainly not a 52 points for/105 points against and a 49% draw over a 4 week sample size.

[jeemak]

Hawthorn, Melbourne, West Coke and Port. Not easy but not impossible. Certainly not a 52 points for/105 points against and a 49% draw over a 4 week sample size.

Given it doesn't suit your point, of course not.

But it's the reality. It's why we seem OK for a half, then get fatigued and then get picked apart by more experienced teams week in and week out, without having different gears to go to or different plans to fall back on.

It's not rosy by a stretch, but having played four of four teams that are likely to finish in the eight, what did you expect from the last four games at this stage of the year?

[Sedat]

Given it doesn't suit your point, of course not.

But it's the reality. It's why we seem OK for a half, then get fatigued and then get picked apart by more experienced teams week in and week out, without having different gears to go to or different plans to fall back on.

It's not rosy by a stretch, but having played four of four teams that are likely to finish in the eight, what did you expect from the last four games at this stage of the year?
Well Brisbane beat Hawthorn in recent memory, as did Freo beat Port. And North have been struggling badly in recent weeks but beat up on West Coke yesterday. Imagine what Richmond would do to us in our current form?

I get we are young and I get we have injuries, but we shouldn't be an 18th team in the competition given how much quality (some in name only to be fair) we still have in the team at present. What I can't see (even in our competitive first halves the past 10 weeks) is any system, any cohesion and any remotely dangerous ball movement. I think we are so far off Broadway at the moment that our truly appalling form is being papered over - we shouldn't be this wretched, and we're talking worse than Carlton and Gold Coast levels of wretched. It's concerning to put it mildly - it's one thing to be an 8-10 win also-ran, but quite another to be plumbing the depths of worst in the comp 18 months after being best in the comp.

[Rocket Science]

Well Brisbane beat Hawthorn in recent memory, as did Freo beat Port. And North have been struggling badly in recent weeks but beat up on West Coke yesterday. Imagine what Richmond will do to us in our current form?

I get we are young and I get we have injuries, but we shouldn't be an 18th team in the competition given how much quality (some in name only to be fair) we still have in the team at present. What I can't see (even in our competitive first halves the past 10 weeks) is any system, any cohesion and any remotely dangerous ball movement. I think we are so far off Broadway at the moment that our truly appalling form is being papered over - we shouldn't be this wretched, and we're talking worse than Carlton and Gold Coast levels of wretched. It's concerning to put it mildly - it's one thing to be an 8-10 win also-ran, but quite another to be plumbing the depths of worst in the comp 18 months after being best in the comp.

Fixed!

[westdog54]

Yes, his mate from the ammos Jamie Maddox

So he's handpicked only one assistant over four seasons? That seems exceptionally low.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Continues to be a 'watch this space', but I'm not convinced we'll make many - or any - changes. We seem hellbent on sticking with what we have and trusting the 'good people' within our people, despite 2 appalling seasons.

[Mantis]

Do we know how many of our assistants are out of contract at the end of this season?

I heard on SEN this morning that all out of contract assistants need to be offered a new contract by the end of today otherwise they are informed they won’t be with the club next season.

[GVGjr]

Do we know how many of our assistants are out of contract at the end of this season?

I heard on SEN this morning that all out of contract assistants need to be offered a new contract by the end of today otherwise they are informed they won’t be with the club next season.

The contract situation and timeframe on the notification is correct, I'm not sure who might be out of contract but I was told at least one assistant coach would be going. I wasn't given any names.

[GVGjr]

So he's handpicked only one assistant over four seasons? That seems exceptionally low.

It is exceptionally low, I think the club needs to bring in some additional support to the current coaching numbers

[Rocket Science]

I for one welcome Shocktober 3.

Who knew this would become a Star Wars style epic?

[bornadog]

So he's handpicked only one assistant over four seasons? That seems exceptionally low.

There have been a few changes with Maddocks, Russell and Grace coming in. Smith has changed role to AFL Development, and I can't remember the others that have moved out of coaching roles.

[SlimPickens]

There have been a few changes with Maddocks, Russell and Grace coming in. Smith has changed role to AFL Development, and I can't remember the others that have moved out of coaching roles.

Russell was at the club in 2014 and stepped up to a part time development role around the end of 14.

[bornadog]

Russell was at the club in 2014 and stepped up to a part time development role around the end of 14.

part time, he didn't really go into the role full time, till he finished up in the VFL

[Greystache]

Bevo has to be safe for now. He's contracted for starters but his runs on the board are undeniable. The coaching team have had a disastrous year. We spent the preseason trying to reinvent players in new roles they showed no potential to perform in and it showed in the the first 2 rounds where we looked comical in our disorganisation. We chucked some of it out after round 2 which meant preseason was completely wasted. Even more concerning is other things that haven't worked we seem to be stubbornly sticking to rather than accept we made mistakes and rectifying them.

We moved around the assistant coaches after a premiership because we wanted to keep them fresh, then after a very ordinary season the following year, we decided to keep things the same. So effectively if it worked we change it, if it doesn't we keep it the same.

The same has happened with players and positions. Defence has been inexperienced and leaking like the Titanic, yet we continue to play JJ forward where he's shown almost nothing. Meanwhile our forward line is league worst. Bont has played big minutes forward where he's only been serviceable, meanwhile our midfield is underperforming, we don't have enough players rotating through, and have too many players who can't execute basic skills. We have no target forward to structure around, yet we bomb the ball in high and blindly almost exclusively, meanwhile Boyd plays mostly in the ruck where he's only been serviceable, and at times when we play a second ruckman we have them playing as a forward. None of it works but we persist with it.

I have great fears our coaching team would rather be clever than effective and that we're getting further and further from doing what we do well. A clear out of assistant coaches is needed to recalibrate what we're doing and to challenge Bevo if he's losing touch with reality. If we don't make changes as season's end my fears will be more outright terror.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

It is exceptionally low, I think the club needs to bring in some additional support to the current coaching numbers

Chris Grant needs to step up to the plate like Neil Balme was able to do at Richmond with a complete overall of our Assistant coaching panel. Collingwood likewise have taken similar measures. Ours is a unique Club and would love to see the likes of Scott West, Daniel Cross, Matthew Boyd and even Dale Morris be added to the fold. These were all very hardened tough competitors and would put some Bulldog spirit back into the place which has been sadly lacking over the past two years. Desperate times require desperate measures.

[DOG GOD]

Bevo has to be safe for now. He's contracted for starters but his runs on the board are undeniable. The coaching team have had a disastrous year. We spent the preseason trying to reinvent players in new roles they showed no potential to perform in and it showed in the the first 2 rounds where we looked comical in our disorganisation. We chucked some of it out after round 2 which meant preseason was completely wasted. Even more concerning is other things that haven't worked we seem to be stubbornly sticking to rather than accept we made mistakes and rectifying them.

We moved around the assistant coaches after a premiership because we wanted to keep them fresh, then after a very ordinary season the following year, we decided to keep things the same. So effectively if it worked we change it, if it doesn't we keep it the same.

The same has happened with players and positions. Defence has been inexperienced and leaking like the Titanic, yet we continue to play JJ forward where he's shown almost nothing. Meanwhile our forward line is league worst. Bont has played big minutes forward where he's only been serviceable, meanwhile our midfield is underperforming, we don't have enough players rotating through, and have too many players who can't execute basic skills. We have no target forward to structure around, yet we bomb the ball in high and blindly almost exclusively, meanwhile Boyd plays mostly in the ruck where he's only been serviceable, and at times when we play a second ruckman we have them playing as a forward. None of it works but we persist with it.

I have great fears our coaching team would rather be clever than effective and that we're getting further and further from doing what we do well. A clear out of assistant coaches is needed to recalibrate what we're doing and to challenge Bevo if he's losing touch with reality. If we don't make changes as season's end my fears will be more outright terror.

Brilliant post...totally agree.

[Twodogs]

I have great fears our coaching team would rather be clever than effective and that we're getting further and further from doing what we do well. A clear out of assistant coaches is needed to recalibrate what we're doing and to challenge Bevo if he's losing touch with reality. If we don't make changes as season's end my fears will be more outright terror.

I particularly agree with that.

[Grantysghost]

Bevo has to be safe for now. He's contracted for starters but his runs on the board are undeniable. The coaching team have had a disastrous year. We spent the preseason trying to reinvent players in new roles they showed no potential to perform in and it showed in the the first 2 rounds where we looked comical in our disorganisation. We chucked some of it out after round 2 which meant preseason was completely wasted. Even more concerning is other things that haven't worked we seem to be stubbornly sticking to rather than accept we made mistakes and rectifying them.

We moved around the assistant coaches after a premiership because we wanted to keep them fresh, then after a very ordinary season the following year, we decided to keep things the same. So effectively if it worked we change it, if it doesn't we keep it the same.

The same has happened with players and positions. Defence has been inexperienced and leaking like the Titanic, yet we continue to play JJ forward where he's shown almost nothing. Meanwhile our forward line is league worst. Bont has played big minutes forward where he's only been serviceable, meanwhile our midfield is underperforming, we don't have enough players rotating through, and have too many players who can't execute basic skills. We have no target forward to structure around, yet we bomb the ball in high and blindly almost exclusively, meanwhile Boyd plays mostly in the ruck where he's only been serviceable, and at times when we play a second ruckman we have them playing as a forward. None of it works but we persist with it.

I have great fears our coaching team would rather be clever than effective and that we're getting further and further from doing what we do well. A clear out of assistant coaches is needed to recalibrate what we're doing and to challenge Bevo if he's losing touch with reality. If we don't make changes as season's end my fears will be more outright terror.

JJ forward. I couldn't believe my frozen eyes on Sunday. He moved back to half back (where he won a Norm Smith and premiership) against Melbourne (?) and has been in pretty good form and alas he's forward again. I even watched an interview on our website where he clearly stated he loves playing off half back. Bewildering.

[kruder]

It feels so long ago when Bevo first came in and we started playing breathtaking footy. Does anyone remember that game against Adelaide at Etihad early in the season? Our ball movement was off the charts gee we were an exciting team. A lot has been said about the 2016 finals series but I still believe regular season 2015 was our best regular season I can remember. I know the team has changed a lot and I'm still bullish about the list with the right amount of changes going into 2019 but its the style that has me worried. I sill remember the players talking about Bevo backing in their strengths, focusing on what they can do, Picken and Matty Boyd were perfect examples of excellent coaching. As discussed above we now have too many examples of players going in the opposite direction JJ forward, and Boyd playing first ruck while Roughead plays forward etc are perfect examples. We basically have become the Freemantle football club on field, unable to score and unable to defend its so hard to watch.

I really believe the 2018 off-season is a sliding doors moment for Bevo and the club, with the right amount of change off-field and some astute trading/drafting we can become relevant again quickly. I dare not to think what happens if we stay the same again one thing is for sure it will end ugly if we do.

[Pickenitup]

Gee I loved that game against the crows in 2015 Jake was on fire 3015 was a heck of a year

[bulldogsthru&thru]

There were some pretty amazing performances in 2015....only a few months after a torrid 2014. Although looking back on it is frustrating again when you see what Stringer, Dickson, Picken, Dahlhaus, Daniel, Crameri, Jong and others were doing. Even Boyd probably played his best season then as he was played as an actual forward

[ratsmac]

I just read that the Saints have let Gilbee go. Now he is someone we might have a job for. Skills coach, and he'll have his work cut out.

[Grantysghost]

I just read that the Saints have let Gilbee go. Now he is someone we might have a job for. Skills coach, and he'll have his work cut out.

Ah no. I've intimate knowledge of his abilities and we want to avoid.

[GVGjr]

I just read that the Saints have let Gilbee go. Now he is someone we might have a job for. Skills coach, and he'll have his work cut out.

I'm not sure if this means anything but he was at the game in Ballarat.

[Bullies]

I'm not sure if this means anything but he was at the game in Ballarat. i think he does the analysis for the saints as well on the next team they play.

[azabob]

According to Mark Stevens all our assistant coaches are contracted for 2019...

[Grantysghost]

Reading Sam Mitchell wants to come back to Victoria. He'd be the type of guy I think we should chase. May have a connection with Bevo from days at Hawks.

[bulldogtragic]

According to Mark Stevens all our assistant coaches are contracted for 2019...

Then Gordon needs to find his inner coach sacker (which he has) and get to work.

[Sedat]

According to Mark Stevens all our assistant coaches are contracted for 2019...
If true, that's appalling and simply cannot be signed off by Gordo and Ameet. No meaningful change at all to the coaching personnel for a number of years, and for the last 2 years that group has delivered 16 wins and no finals (straight after 2 finals campaigns and a flag). On what metrics are they being measured to simply let them continue without change/challenge?

Our coaching group are an echo chamber of same ideas with not a skerrick of alternative thought and perspective - that simply cannot continue.

[jeemak]

I'm disgusted if that's the case and we make no changes, however, there's no reason why we can't actually bring in additional resources or allow the ones we have to pursue other options.

[Greystache]

According to Mark Stevens all our assistant coaches are contracted for 2019...

So IF that is true that mean even if we wanted to make changes we can't.

Is that just more bad luck?

[bornadog]

I'm disgusted if that's the case and we make no changes, however, there's no reason why we can't actually bring in additional resources or allow the ones we have to pursue other options.
Of course we should be able add guys in

[Twodogs]

So IF that is true that mean even if we wanted to make changes we can't.

Is that just more bad luck?


Sheer bad luck.


And contract law.

[bulldogtragic]

Of course we should be able add guys in

Isn't there a cap on footy department spending?

[bornadog]

Isn't there a cap on footy department spending?
There is but I doubt we are fully spent

[bulldogtragic]

There is but I doubt we are fully spent

Why wouldn't we be fully spent, or close? What do you think we've spent of our cap?

We've got a lot of staff under the footy department umbrella.

[bornadog]

Why wouldn't we be fully spent, or close? What do you think we've spent of our cap?

We've got a lot of staff under the footy department umbrella.

just a guess like everyone else does on WOOF, but when I look at other teams they have a lot more assistants than us. Maybe we spend in the wrong areas.

[bulldogtragic]

just a guess like everyone else does on WOOF, but when I look at other teams they have a lot more assistants than us. Maybe we spend in the wrong areas.

Would be a tragic case of irony if Sam Mitchell was in fact interested in a senior assistant role with us but we couldn't give him a market rate for his skill sets and he goes elsewhere to a team who can/does. While we keep a bunch of people who have for two years gone backwards quickly, year on year, because for some reason they're all contracted.

[Bulldog4life]

just a guess like everyone else does on WOOF, but when I look at other teams they have a lot more assistants than us. Maybe we spend in the wrong areas.

Made me chuckle.

[Twodogs]

I think that the salary cap for the footy dept is a soft cap. It's only is only fines/slap on the wrist for breaching it.

[Bulldog Joe]

Isn't there a cap on footy department spending?

This is the soft cap.

Clubs are still free to spend whatever they can afford, but if they exceed the cap, they are then subject to an AFL imposed tax of (I think) 40% for every dollar of excess spending.

So effectively if the cap is $10m (I don't have figures) and they spend $12m they then need to find another $800K to pay to the AFL.

I am sure the AFL accept rubbery figures when it suits them.

[Greystache]

This is the soft cap.

Clubs are still free to spend whatever they can afford, but if they exceed the cap, they are then subject to an AFL imposed tax of (I think) 40% for every dollar of excess spending.

So effectively if the cap is $10m (I don't have figures) and they spend $12m they then need to find another $800K to pay to the AFL.

I am sure the AFL accept rubbery figures when it suits them.

Exactly. And unlike the salary cap there's no minimum spend requirement. Club's can spend whatever they think is responsible. I would think we'd be well below the cap when you look at the football department costs in the end of year reports. We can add extra coaches if we choose but that doesn't change the fact that we've managed to have all our assistant coaches coming out of contract at the same time. To not have them staggered is beyond amateur resource management.

[Scraggers]

Like others here, I don't understand the swap of coaches after the 2016 Premiership and no change after the 2017 season.

I would hope fresh blood is brought in as a matter of urgency. In saying all of that, listening to our assistant coaches speak at different functions I have attended, I truly believe they continue to have a lot to offer our club.

In regards to Bevo's tenancy as Head Coach (from an outsiders point of view), he can hold the position as long as he sees fit. From my perspective he brought me (and thousands of other Bulldog faithful) something we hadn't felt in my lifetime ... the ultimate success and expectation for more of that. The way I judge my Bulldogs now compared to pre-premiership is always going to be harsher; and I love that feeling of expectation ... Bevo gave me that !!

[Bulldog Joe]

Like others here, I don't understand the swap of coaches after the 2016 Premiership and no change after the 2017 season.

I would hope fresh blood is brought in as a matter of urgency. In saying all of that, listening to our assistant coaches speak at different functions I have attended, I truly believe they continue to have a lot to offer our club.

In regards to Bevo's tenancy as Head Coach (from an outsiders point of view), he can hold the position as long as he sees fit. From my perspective he brought me (and thousands of other Bulldog faithful) something we hadn't felt in my lifetime ... the ultimate success and expectation for more of that. The way I judge my Bulldogs now compared to pre-premiership is always going to be harsher; and I love that feeling of expectation ... Bevo gave me that !!

I understand your sentiment and Bevo will always be the hero of 2016.

However, the world does not wait. If the current malaise is not addressed the person in charge must take responsibility.
Previous success does not provide exemption from the requirements for ongoing success.

As a club we need to strive for continuous achievement.

[bulldogtragic]

I understand your sentiment and Bevo will always be the hero of 2016.

However, the world does not wait. If the current malaise is not addressed the person in charge must take responsibility.
Previous success does not provide exemption from the requirements for ongoing success.

As a club we need to strive for continuous achievement.

Great post. Everyone's legacy from 2016 will last forever as something great from the past. But everyone's current performance and ability to return us to 2016 like success in the future are the two major questions facing the club going forward into the off season.

[GVGjr]

Like others here, I don't understand the swap of coaches after the 2016 Premiership and no change after the 2017 season.

I would hope fresh blood is brought in as a matter of urgency. In saying all of that, listening to our assistant coaches speak at different functions I have attended, I truly believe they continue to have a lot to offer our club.

In regards to Bevo's tenancy as Head Coach (from an outsiders point of view), he can hold the position as long as he sees fit. From my perspective he brought me (and thousands of other Bulldog faithful) something we hadn't felt in my lifetime ... the ultimate success and expectation for more of that. The way I judge my Bulldogs now compared to pre-premiership is always going to be harsher; and I love that feeling of expectation ... Bevo gave me that !!

No one can deny what he has achieved but after 2 unconvincing years since the flag he has to come up with a winning formula next year because as well all know it's hugely important for the club to have healthy membership and sponsorship levels.
This won't occur if we put in 3rd sub standard year

[Go_Dogs]

No one can deny what he has achieved but after 2 unconvincing years since the flag he has to come up with a winning formula next year because as well all know it's hugely important for the club to have healthy membership and sponsorship levels.
This won't occur if we put in 3rd sub standard year

He needs to get back to being the biggest backer of our people and galvanising the group with his ability to form strong connections - we haven't heard much about it in recent times but was a constant theme early on.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

No one can deny what he has achieved but after 2 unconvincing years since the flag he has to come up with a winning formula next year because as well all know it's hugely important for the club to have healthy membership and sponsorship levels.
This won't occur if we put in 3rd sub standard year

And this presents a very interesting dilemma given where our list stands now in terms of age profile. And the prospect that we will, with departures, present possibly even younger next year, achieving consistent, winning football in 2019 will be a tough ask.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

No one can deny what he has achieved but after 2 unconvincing years since the flag he has to come up with a winning formula next year because as well all know it's hugely important for the club to have healthy membership and sponsorship levels.
This won't occur if we put in 3rd sub standard year

The fallout from our 2016 flag has been nothing short of dramatic, both on and off the field. Without Picken Stringer Dickson and Boyd kicking 3 goals the forward line has been decimated. The defence lost Hamling M Boyd, Roberts after being deemed good enough to play on Swans powerhouse in Franklin, the long time injuries of Wood and Morris plus the sudden fall off in JJ who demanded a huge contract increase and simply hasn’t performed to the level expected. For different reasons Boyd and Roughead stars in our Premiership have for the most part gone missing. Dunkley a good midfielder in our flag win has spent weeks in the VFL and our best midfielder in Liberatore is out for the season through injury.
Our off field woes has seen a succession of CEO’s leave the Club and now we have seen the departures of our two key Recruiting personnel in Dalyrmple and MCCartney and the unusual decision to dramatically change the responsibilities of each of the Assistant Coaches. Is it any wonder that we have fallen away to an unacceptable level. We face the prospect of at least a couple of lean years. On the positive side the emergence of new recruits in Richards Naughton Schache and English have all been fine gains. Crozier is another who has now cemented his place in the team to be one of our better players in recent weeks. Our midfield and forward line clearly lacks depth and class and both areas require urgent attention.

[Sedat]

And this presents a very interesting dilemma given where our list stands now in terms of age profile. And the prospect that we will, with departures, present possibly even younger next year, achieving consistent, winning football in 2019 will be a tough ask.
I don't think wins and losses are the only KPI's we should be measured against in 2019, considering we will likely be younger and even more bereft of senior players in that 22-28yo bracket than we had this year with a likely 5-17 record. It shows what a disgraceful season 2018 has been and how difficult it will be to improve from this low base with a younger list next year.

My big worry is that we will continue the downward trajectory that afflicted Freo after winning the minor premiership in 2015 - they haven't fired a shot since and look like being in the wilderness for a number of years to come despite having an absolute champion like Fyfe in his prime. We have now had 2 consecutive years of failure, and if I was a betting man there is more likelihood of 3 more years outside the top 8 right now than there is of contending again in 2019-21. And if that prospect doesn't justify an injection of fresh and cutting edge ideas into the coaching group, I don't know what will.

[Ghost Dog]

The stalwart leaders like Matt Boyd and Bob have been replaced with a new generation. If the thread is about coaching, I think on field leadership plays a big part, carrying out the coaches instructions. We could really use a few older players to settle the group. Our fade-outs a case in point.

[Bullies]

Why wouldn't we be fully spent, or close? What do you think we've spent of our cap?

We've got a lot of staff under the footy department umbrella. i believe from the stats that were available we are one of the lowest in what we spend in the footy department. We should have no issue in paying out some of these guys to make change.

[bornadog]

i believe from the stats that were available we are one of the lowest in what we spend in the footy department. We should have no issue in paying out some of these guys to make change.

Who would you pay out?

[Axe Man]

i believe from the stats that were available we are one of the lowest in what we spend in the footy department. We should have no issue in paying out some of these guys to make change.

Where are those stats? I have tried to find them but all I can come up with is this for 2017:

Football Department spending
Collingwood ($28,366,146) – includes AFLW, VFL.
GWS – ($27,227,800)
Sydney – ($26,519,571)
Geelong – ($25,981,512)
West Coast – ($25,669,094)
Western Bulldogs ($25,489,964)
Fremantle – $25,476,311
Melbourne – ($24,223,494)
Brisbane – ($24,712,245)
Port Adelaide – ($24,701,910)
North Melbourne – ($23,851,745)
Carlton – ($23,841,372)
St Kilda – ($23,715,001)
Essendon – ($23,687,766)
Hawthorn – Not Available
Richmond – Not Available
Adelaide – Not Available
Link (http://www.footyindustry.com/?page_id=4121)

Obviously it includes players payments and other costs outside the footy department cap of $9.3 million, but I am unsure exactly what it does include and how comparable the figures really are with other clubs. Our women's team and VFL may inflate our figure also?

[Bullies]

Where are those stats? I have tried to find them but all I can come up with is this for 2017:

Football Department spending
Collingwood ($28,366,146) – includes AFLW, VFL.
GWS – ($27,227,800)
Sydney – ($26,519,571)
Geelong – ($25,981,512)
West Coast – ($25,669,094)
Western Bulldogs ($25,489,964)
Fremantle – $25,476,311
Melbourne – ($24,223,494)
Brisbane – ($24,712,245)
Port Adelaide – ($24,701,910)
North Melbourne – ($23,851,745)
Carlton – ($23,841,372)
St Kilda – ($23,715,001)
Essendon – ($23,687,766)
Hawthorn – Not Available
Richmond – Not Available
Adelaide – Not Available
Link (http://www.footyindustry.com/?page_id=4121)

Obviously it includes players payments and other costs outside the footy department cap of $9.3 million, but I am unsure exactly what it does include and how comparable the figures really are with other clubs. Our women's team and VFL may inflate our figure also? I was referring to the actual footy department and the numbers we employ in regards to recruiters/development/assistants etc. We are very lean with recruitment.

[Axe Man]

I was referring to the actual footy department and the numbers we employ in regards to recruiters/development/assistants etc. We are very lean with recruitment.

I understand what you are talking about, I am asking where are the figures as I can't find any. You can't say we are lean in footy department spending without something to back it up. I understood we had increased our spend in the last few years and would be interested to know how far off the cap we are and how we compare to other teams.

[bornadog]

I understand what you are talking about, I am asking where are the figures as I can't find any. You can't say we are lean in footy department spending without something to back it up. I understood we had increased our spend in the last few years and would be interested to know how far off the cap we are and how we compare to other teams.

We certainly don't have this many assistants:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dji0xFjUYAAYuyS.jpg

Mark Maclure labels majority of coaches as ‘sheep’, calls for club coach restrictions (https://www.foxsports.com.au/afl/afl-2018-mark-maclure-labels-majority-of-coaches-as-sheep-calls-for-club-coach-restrictions/news-story/a305ce9d1507e614d07f7aee40d8690b)

[jeemak]

I still don't know why Mark Maclure gets to talk on so many platforms.

[Twodogs]

I still don't know why Mark Maclure gets to talk on so many platforms.

It's because he has his mouth open and his eyes and ears closed 99% of the time. I like the guy (anyone who gets his nickname from modelling Peter Sellars' behaviour is OK with me) but I wouldn't take anything he says about footy seriously.

[azabob]

I still don't know why Mark Maclure gets to talk on so many platforms.

Cause he’s lucky. What was said?

[Twodogs]

Cause he’s lucky. What was said?

He could be a Freemason.

[bornadog]

I still don't know why Mark Maclure gets to talk on so many platforms.

He doesn't BS, he says it as it is. He is a miserable old fart, but I like listening to him.

[westdog54]

He doesn't BS, he says it as it is. He is a miserable old fart, but I like listening to him.

He says it as 'he sees it'. There's a distinction.

[DOG GOD]

He doesn't BS, he says it as it is. He is a miserable old fart, but I like listening to him.
I agree Bornadog. I personally love listening to him cause he speaks with a “take no prisoners” type attitude and doesn’t give a toss what people think, instead of the sheep that plagued talk shows/footy shows etc.

[bornadog]

Brett Ratten available

[jeemak]

He says it as 'he sees it'. There's a distinction.

Correct. Massive difference between the two.

[DOG GOD]

Brett Ratten available

A big fan, way better than our current regime.

[S Coast Simon]

Brett Ratten in and Lindsay Gilbee as skills coach

[Go_Dogs]

I wonder whether we could get all of Ratten, Mitchell and Boyd (not necessarily all as assistant coaches)? Would give us a very different look and some recent players who have had success and understand the demands of the modern game.

[DOG GOD]

I wonder whether we could get all of Ratten, Mitchell and Boyd (not necessarily all as assistant coaches)? Would give us a very different look and some recent players who have had success and understand the demands of the modern game.

They would be great gets, but if our assistants are all contracted like it’s been said for 2019, I highly doubt our club would have the balls to sack them.

[Rocket Science]

Maybe we can talk Mitchell and Boydy into pulling the boots back on.

I'm only half joking.

[DOG GOD]

Maybe we can talk Mitchell and Boydy into pulling the boots back on.

I'm only half joking.

At least they’d tackle better than 75% of our current team

[Ozza]

Gilbee is a ripper bloke - but I'm not interested in getting him as a coach. The mail on Gilbs is the players love him, but that he doesn't have the application and work ethic required. These assistant coaches have to be absolute workhorses and leave no stone unturned.

Ratten does sound appealing though.

[Grantysghost]

Bevo from this morning's press conference.

"LB: I couldn’t be happier with our coaches. They are same panel that helped us win flag, they’ve been great support for me. They’re are all definitely wanted."

[azabob]

Brett Montgomery was our tactical guru and bad cop and he hasn’t been replaced.

I think the actual decision making on assistant coaches has to be taken away from Beveridge. He has input but not the final say.

He is extremely loyal and just as stubborn - Can he make that tough call?

Is Chris Grant the right person to be footy manager as who ultimately rubber stamped our list management strategy.

It appears that having both Graham Lowe and Brett Montgomery leaving our club within 6 months of each other may have a had a much bigger impact than we previously thought.

OK I’m getting into dangerous territory quoting myself from back in May, but reading the quote from Beveridge presser more than ever someone needs to make the change for him.

[chef]

Bevo from this morning's press conference.

"LB: I couldn’t be happier with our coaches. They are same panel that helped us win flag, they’ve been great support for me. They’re are all definitely wanted."
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-y-2s6nPHgls/UG19Eutn40I/AAAAAAAAAfg/FAtkHLXGfPE/s1600/nothing-to-see-here.jpg

[bulldogtragic]

Same assistants who have overseen us crash in epic style too...

Selective memory..,

[azabob]

Wow - the quotes from AFL media Ryan Davidson are even worse than what the club tweeted. Apparently no room for Ratten.

[Mofra]

They would be great gets, but if our assistants are all contracted like it’s been said for 2019, I highly doubt our club would have the balls to sack them.
They're contracted but does that necessarily mean within their current roles? We have switched roles around a few times in recent years.

[Greystache]

Bevo from this morning's press conference.

"LB: I couldn’t be happier with our coaches. They are same panel that helped us win flag, they’ve been great support for me. They’re are all definitely wanted."

https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/004/130/bagdad-bob.jpg

[Greystache]

Or maybe

https://i.imgflip.com/2f70a7.jpg

[bulldogtragic]

Or maybe

https://i.imgflip.com/2f70a7.jpg

The sad thing is, that's not the joke. It appears those above him with power, Grant, Bains & PG are going along with it. That's the real joke.

[Twodogs]

https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/004/130/bagdad-bob.jpg

Ah yes Mohammed al Sahhaf. I've been thinking about him a fair bit lately.

[lemmon]

Bevo from this morning's press conference.

"LB: I couldn’t be happier with our coaches. They are same panel that helped us win flag, they’ve been great support for me. They’re are all definitely wanted."

Shouldn't really be his call in the end. More and more I think we need a Geelong-style sweeping review

[The Pie Man]

Is it just the time of year for these questions to be asked in pressers given the contractual stuff or have we had more guests to this site/thread ...again?

[jeemak]

Shouldn't really be his call in the end. More and more I think we need a Geelong-style sweeping review

This situation reminds me of a Metalica studio documentary (for want of a better word) I saw, where in one part they're sitting in the studio talking lyrics and Lars is creaming over some shite the band has just come up with saying how amazing it is, all the while the music is going from bad to worse at a rate of knots.

[Greystache]

This situation reminds me of a Metalica studio documentary (for want of a better word) I saw, where in one part they're sitting in the studio talking lyrics and Lars is creaming over some shite the band has just come up with saying how amazing it is, all the while the music is going from bad to worse at a rate of knots.

From a leadership perspective having an unquestioning belief in your people can be a blessing and a curse at the same time. It empowers your people and gives them the belief to do their best, but it can also prevent you from truly analyzing if they're doing well or even more critically if there are other people who could be doing the job better.

That's why strong and objective senior leadership overseeing operations is important. I'm not convinced we have our mix right.

[bornadog]

Luke Beveridge says there won't be any changes with his coaching panel next season. Also said the club didn't have room to accommodate Brett Ratten.

[azabob]

Luke Beveridge says there won't be any changes with his coaching panel next season. Also said the club didn't have room to accommodate Brett Ratten.

Unlike you to be late to the party.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Luke Beveridge says there won't be any changes with his coaching panel next season. Also said the club didn't have room to accommodate Brett Ratten.

So in essence.. we've had two years of worsening outcomes across many kpi's.....and our response seems to be more of the same, from the same...

[bornadog]

So in essence.. we've had two years of worsening outcomes across many kpi's.....and our response seems to be more of the same, from the same...

From his presser


Coaching panel

Assistant coaches are always a topic of conversation this time of the year and Beveridge expressed full confidence in his existing group.


“I couldn't be happier with our coaches.


“Our coaches are the same panel that helped us win the 2016 flag, they've been enormous support for me and great contributors in their areas. At the moment the horse has slightly gone out from under us but we know that once we bring that horse back in underneath us as a coaching group then we'll be right to go.


“As I said earlier on hopefully that will happen in the immediate future rather than too far down the track, but they've been enormous and definitely wanted.”

[bornadog]

Unlike you to be late to the party.

yeah, didn't check the previous page, it has been a busy morning

[Rocket Science]

Luke Beveridge says there won't be any changes with his coaching panel next season. Also said the club didn't have room to accommodate Brett Ratten.

So we've plumbed sufficient depths on field that there's another significant cull of the playing list forecast.

But no such scrutiny for the blokes running the show.

Righto.

[bulldogtragic]

Every time I think this year has hit rock bottom, I look up to see the underside of the last rock bottom. I think we are hitting another rock bottom. Is this it for 2018, or I dare look upward again?

[jeemak]

From a leadership perspective having an unquestioning belief in your people can be a blessing and a curse at the same time. It empowers your people and gives them the belief to do their best, but it can also prevent you from truly analyzing if they're doing well or even more critically if there are other people who could be doing the job better.

That's why strong and objective senior leadership overseeing operations is important. I'm not convinced we have our mix right.

Yes, I agree and feel the structure is compromised further when those leading have unquestioned belief in themselves.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Bevo from this morning's press conference.

"LB: I couldn’t be happier with our coaches. They are same panel that helped us win flag, they’ve been great support for me. They’re are all definitely wanted."

Hang on, i'm confused. Wasn't the flag a complete fluke where the planets aligned for 4 weeks!? And now we're using that lucky flag as the basis to retain under-performing coaches!? Mixed messages again!

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Unbelievable if we roll into next year unchanged.

This is where Grant needs to do his job and earn his money by coming over the top of Beveridge, because to me it seems quite clear that Beveridge's judgement is severely clouded.

Bev's stubbornness was probably one of the reasons we won the flag, but if he continues along the same path it might also be the reason he's out of a job in the future.

[jeemak]

Unbelievable if we roll into next year unchanged.

This is where Grant needs to do his job and earn his money by coming over the top of Beveridge, because to me it seems quite clear that Beveridge's judgement is severely clouded.

Bev's stubbornness was probably one of the reasons we won the flag, but if he continues along the same path it might also be the reason he's out of a job in the future.

All of this does have a success or oblivion feel about it.

[bornadog]

So we've plumbed sufficient depths on field that there's another significant cull of the playing list forecast.

But no such scrutiny for the blokes running the show.

Righto.

You could look at it another way. These blokes delivered a premiership and were rewarded with a two year contract. They haven't had the players at their disposal over the pass two years to years to give us a better performance, so us on the outside want to sack them.

Personally I would have liked a new face to come in and bring some fresh ideas, but hey I am not the head of the footy department.

[Scraggers]

From a leadership perspective having an unquestioning belief in your people can be a blessing and a curse at the same time. It empowers your people and gives them the belief to do their best, but it can also prevent you from truly analyzing if they're doing well or even more critically if there are other people who could be doing the job better.

That's why strong and objective senior leadership overseeing operations is important. I'm not convinced we have our mix right.

Also, with four rounds to go you are not going to publicly berate your assistants. From a leadership point of view, your public persona about your leadership team is rosy; behind closed doors and during leadership meetings it is always a different story. I agree, a strong leader from football operations is required to make the hard decisions.

[Mofra]

Is it just the time of year for these questions to be asked in pressers given the contractual stuff or have we had more guests to this site/thread ...again?
Coaching staff contract date is 1 August each year.

[Sedat]

This is where Grant needs to do his job and earn his money by coming over the top of Beveridge, because to me it seems quite clear that Beveridge's judgement is severely clouded.

Bev's stubbornness was probably one of the reasons we won the flag, but if he continues along the same path it might also be the reason he's out of a job in the future.
After his poorly advised comments in the media a few months ago, I don't have faith at all in Turtle being a strong and decisive head of football. He's been underwhelming in the role to be frank, and I hate myself for saying anything critical about one of my most loved ever players.

I'm actually horrified by Bevo's comments. If I was just a casual observer who didn't support the club, I would deduce that Bevo has a bunch of yes-men working under him in the coaches box so as to foster a Group Think mentality and eliminate any robust discussion. I am also deeply concerned that we have drawn a line through any new assistants/additions to the coaching group - we as members and supporters are being asked to accept the notion that the same group of people, who have managed our on-field performance from 19 wins to 5 in 18 months, can simply continue on without question whatsoever. It's madness.

[SonofScray]

Every time I think this year has hit rock bottom, I look up to see the underside of the last rock bottom. I think we are hitting another rock bottom. Is this it for 2018, or I dare look upward again?

We're about to get belted by St Kilda.


I'm feeling concerned. Need to hear from Leadership where the line in the sand is.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

After his poorly advised comments in the media a few months ago, I don't have faith at all in Turtle being a strong and decisive head of football. He's been underwhelming in the role to be frank, and I hate myself for saying anything critical about one of my most loved ever players.

I'm actually horrified by Bevo's comments. If I was just a casual observer who didn't support the club, I would deduce that Bevo has a bunch of yes-men working under him in the coaches box so as to foster a Group Think mentality and eliminate any robust discussion. I am also deeply concerned that we have drawn a line through any new assistants/additions to the coaching group - we as members and supporters are being asked to accept the notion that the same group of people, who have managed our on-field performance from 19 wins to 5 in 18 months, can simply continue on without question whatsoever. It's madness.

I think Jeemak summed it up well - it’s success or oblivion.

We can only hope it’s the former because the method certainly doesn’t instil us with confidence.

[kruder]

Expect at least one change to the coaching group after Bevo's comments.

[Ghost Dog]

We will win. Looking at our team today I'll be genuinely surprised if we lose, but that will paper over the dismal season. No personality cults, coaching team review welcome.

[DOG GOD]

Expect at least one change to the coaching group after Bevo's comments.
What makes you think that Kruder ?

[hujsh]

Expect at least one change to the coaching group after Bevo's comments.

The old 'They have our full confidence' routine?

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

After his poorly advised comments in the media a few months ago, I don't have faith at all in Turtle being a strong and decisive head of football. He's been underwhelming in the role to be frank, and I hate myself for saying anything critical about one of my most loved ever players.

I'm actually horrified by Bevo's comments. If I was just a casual observer who didn't support the club, I would deduce that Bevo has a bunch of yes-men working under him in the coaches box so as to foster a Group Think mentality and eliminate any robust discussion. I am also deeply concerned that we have drawn a line through any new assistants/additions to the coaching group - we as members and supporters are being asked to accept the notion that the same group of people, who have managed our on-field performance from 19 wins to 5 in 18 months, can simply continue on without question whatsoever. It's madness.
Bevo Sheedy Jeans Kennedy and Clarkson all had strong character traits good enough to achieve the ultimate success. PG has a similar personality not unlike Jeff Kennett. We shouldn’t also under estimate the importance of the recruiting staff which has served us well in recent times with the likes of Bont Macrae McLean and more recently Naughton Richards Schache Crozier Trengrove and Greene. The Club in a short time has achieved record memberships and financial stability. Very impressed with the new CEO, Ameet Bains, who will help stabilise the Club. It has an outstanding Ops Manager in Nick Truelson together with a very competent staff. Chris Grant is a different personality that will compliment both Bev and PG. Matthew Croft is a great addition to the Board. The acid test will be now on both Sam Power and Nick Austin who now head up Recruitment to perform. The biggest challenge is to build up our depth of talent with our lack of depth in talent when injuries and loss of form occurs as we have experienced over the past couple of years.

[ledge]

I don't have much of a problem with our list it has a good balance of heights and talent, I think our major worry is the injury list that keeps happening, something we are doing in the body preparedness isn't right.
I have my doubts about the difference in the whitten oval surface to the Etihad surface, we train and prepare on one that gets all the weather , gets soft and muddy but play on one that's hard, that must have an effect on ankles , hamstrings etc.

[Eastdog]

I don't have much of a problem with our list it has a good balance of heights and talent, I think our major worry is the injury list that keeps happening, something we are doing in the body preparedness isn't right.
I have my doubts about the difference in the whitten oval surface to the Etihad surface, we train and prepare on one that gets all the weather , gets soft and muddy but play on one that's hard, that must have an effect on ankles , hamstrings etc.

Bevo doesn’t believe the surface of the grounds are really a factor but we have an extensive injury list. Was speaking to a Bulldog mate last night and they said we just need to get all our players back on the park and then we might be competitive once again.

Libba I was looking forward to seeing him play this year after a very positive pre season and poor 2017 but went out again with injury. Was there when he did his first knee back in 2015 at the Whitten Oval in that pre season game. Was a good match day experience winning but bad with Libba getting injured.

[ReLoad]

I know one thing for sure, we don’t want any ex St Kilda coaches coming aboard.

How they didn’t tag JJ was beyond comprehension

[GVGjr]

I know one thing for sure, we don’t want any ex St Kilda coaches coming aboard.

How they didn’t tag JJ was beyond comprehension

Tend to agree, I bet North don't let him run free this week

[Ozza]

I know one thing for sure, we don’t want any ex St Kilda coaches coming aboard.

How they didn’t tag JJ was beyond comprehension

They did send Newnes to JJ....he just didn't do a good job of it!

[Ghost Dog]

They are?

I'm the same as Anfo right now. I don't want to make the effort to go and watch, only reason I'll go is to get out of the house and do something else, have some me time. I'll probably go on Saturday but I can imagine I'll leave around half time, early 3rd and go and do something else. All respect we gained from 2016 is all but gone, we're a laughing stock, a joke and I'm embarrassed to be a supporter.

Really? I'm not embarrassed about Bont, Moz, Wally, Luke D, Cordy, Billy G, Pickers, Jack M. They represent us as fans. We Have a good core. I feel proud when Jongy gets on the park. As much as people want to make fun of some of our lesser skilled players, they really try their guts out. Mitch H, R. Smith, to name a few. They want to be the players you want, and try hard even if they fall short

[azabob]

Really? I'm not embarrassed about Bont, Moz, Wally, Luke D, Cordy, Billy G, Pickers, Jack M. They represent us as fans. We Have a good core. I feel proud when Jongy gets on the park. As much as people want to make fun of some of our lesser skilled players, they really try their guts out. Mitch H, R. Smith, to name a few. They want to be the players you want, and try hard even if they fall short

Quoting G-Mo from May probably isn’t fair.

Even so Picken isn’t in the conversation as he hasn’t played this year and Dahlhaus has been extremely extremely underwhelming the last 2 years.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Brett Ratten has joined St Kilda

[bornadog]

Brett Ratten has joined St Kilda

Big changes at the Saints. We may even see Brett takeover mid next year.

[DOG GOD]

Big changes at the Saints. We may even see Brett takeover mid next year.

I think that’s the whole idea regarding the appt.

[bornadog]

Footscray Bulldogs looks set to have a new head coach next season with rumors saying Daniel Giansiracusa will take over Steve Grace role.


Steve Grace likely to replace Gia as the stoppages coach

[azabob]

Appears no changes to the group just a couple of role changes.

Disappointing, but not surprising.

[lemmon]

Appears no changes to the group just a couple of role changes.

Disappointing, but not surprising.

I don't get it from the coach's point of view either. Surely a guy like Gia, with aspirations to one day be a head coach, would be better off broadening his own experience by going elsewhere. He's been at the club for two decades now without having seen how other sides operate

[azabob]

I don't get it from the coach's point of view either. Surely a guy like Gia, with aspirations to one day be a head coach, would be better off broadening his own experience by going elsewhere. He's been at the club for two decades now without having seen how other sides operate

Really good point. This way Gia does tick the box of coaching your own team and still within an AFL club.

But as you say he needs to go and experience another environment.

[Mantis]

I don't get it from the coach's point of view either. Surely a guy like Gia, with aspirations to one day be a head coach, would be better off broadening his own experience by going elsewhere. He's been at the club for two decades now without having seen how other sides operate

Maybe he sounded out going to another club and there was no option to do so??

[Rocket Science]

Chris Bond's just walked out of Freo.

Should we sound him out for an encore with us?

[azabob]

Chris Bond's just walked out of Freo.

Should we sound him out for an encore with us?

Or moved on? Apparently their CEO is handling list management!

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Or moved on? Apparently their CEO is handling list management!

Chris Bond was highly regarded by the senior players during his time at the WB. Would be an ideal Football Manager or similar and provide badly needed support to Bevo.

[jeemak]

Maybe he sounded out going to another club and there was no option to do so??

Irrespective of what some supporters think of Gia, there's no doubt that he's a very smart football person and what he was able to do with our forward set up in the 2016 finals series would hold him in high regard within the industry. We went from not being able to kick a score throughout the season, to being extremely difficult to defend against as a forward group under the high pressure of finals.

His performance in stoppages has been hampered by poor ruck stocks, a lack of in form or available midfielders and a change in rules surrounding third man up post that finals series.

If he was sounding out opportunities elsewhere, being contracted notwithstanding, I'm sure he'd find a pretty good gig.