How do you solve a problem called ‘Our List’

[Dancin' Douggy]

It’s a great problem to have, don’t get me wrong……. but I feel for our match committee.
How the hell do you fit all the talent on our list into a starting 22.

I’ve had a go at a starting 22 and the amount of talent lining up for a spot on the bench is ridiculous.

I’ve thought through this long and hard. And been re-watching last year’s games. Some players name themselves and some just squeeze in over others. But even if you shuffled say… Duryea in for Suckling…. Suckling still ends up on the list jockeying for a spot on the bench.

Anyway, here goes my attempt.

Backline. Suckling. Trengove. Wood.

Suckling edges out quite a few competitors with his experience, his creative play, that incredible kick, and his pace and lurking menace as a long range goal kicker.

Trengove edges out Lewis Young for fullback due to strength and experience. I believe we erred in not naming him for the GWS final. We could have used him out there. But this position could flip to Lewis Young based on form. or opposition match ups. Trengove for the gorillas for example. Either way, it’s one of those two.

Wood. If fit and in form Wood is still a great asset with his aerial skills, strength, experience and natural leadership. He still demands this spot in my opinion.


Half back line. Crozier. Keith. Johannisen.
(This one names itself really)

Crozier absolutely owned this position last year. I had no idea how good he was going to be when we traded him in. Seriously one of the most underrated players in the league

Keith & Johannisen just walk into these 2 positions don’t they? (apologies Bruce)

Centreline. Hunter. Dunkley. Smith.
(don’t think I need to explain these names)

Half forward line. Dickson. Bruce. Schache.

Dickson. Until proven otherwise is a walk up start for a spot in the forward line. If father time catches up with him that’s a different story. But for now. He’s in. Bailey Dale is next in line for this spot. You could flip it either way

Bruce. No brainer. that’s what he’s here for.

Schache. Well, I’m going along with the ‘3 talls’ narrative until it doesn’t work. Also……. I want to keep playing Schache for his own confidence and development. AND he is a reliable goal kicker and can be used in other roles…….. ruck, for example, if needed at a pinch

Full forward line. Lloyd. Naughton. McLean.

Lloyd is a walk up start. Naughton is a walk up start.

Mclean. I threw a few names around but ended up going with Toby. He’s good overhead. Good on the lead. Good in the packs. A good tackler and has genuine X factor. Good field kick and good set shot. I also think he’s due for a bust out season. AND he can rotate through the guts. Plenty of other names could go in here but I’ve settled on Mclean.

Followers.

English. Bontempelli. Macrae. Duh……..no arguments here.

Now……..who gets a spot on the bench out of these 15 legitimate contenders? All whom have shown the capacity to perform at the top level.

Lewis Young. Mitch Wallis. Zaine Cordy. Taylor Duryea. Ed Richards. Tom Liberatore. Patrick Lipinski. Billy Gowers. Bailey Dale. Will Hayes. Bailey Williams. Caleb Daniel. Lachie Young. Lin Jong. Roarke Smith

I’ll go with. Lipinski. Daniel. Liberatore. Cordy (Cordy for flexibility).

This leaves out Bailey Dale, Taylor Duryea, Ed Richards, Mitch Wallis and Bailey Williams. 5 players I would love to put in. Maybe Dale comes in for Cordy?

Then there’s the next wave fighting for a spot.

Rhylee West. Cody Weightman. Brad Lynch. Fergus Greene.
There is some speculation Weightman is already pushing for a spot. Rhylee West has already shown he’s capable at senior level…..as has Lynch. I love Lynch and I reckon he’d be getting a game at most AFL clubs. Greene looked promising and certainly not lost at the top level.

It’s mind boggling. Even if you shuffle a few names around……. there’s so much talent spilling out over the sides it’s ridiculous.

Of course injuries will come into it......... but good luck naming a starting 22

[jeemak]

It's tough, but a better problem to have than not having it at all.

The real question is whichever the combination, do we actually have enough elite talent and can our players bring their game to the required level consistently enough to be relied upon to match it with the best in the competition?

I honestly don't know the answer, a part of me thinks we should be good enough while another part of me is concerned that no matter the mix, we will still fall short. Will be really interesting to see how it plays out.

[mjp]

It’s a great problem to have, don’t get me wrong……. but I feel for our match committee.
How the hell do you fit all the talent on our list into a starting 2

Talent and proven AFL players are not the same thing.

I actually have trouble PICKING 22.

[comrade]

Talent and proven AFL players are not the same thing.

I actually have trouble PICKING 22.

Let's see it then!

[Dancin' Douggy]

Are you serious? Everyone I've named is a proven AFL player. Maybe Schache doesn't quite get that tick........yet.

But the bench is all proven AFL players.

There are proven AFL players including a dual premiership player who aren't even getting a game.

Mitch Wallis is another proven AFL player who has been left out.

Are you just being ornery?


Talent and proven AFL players are not the same thing.

I actually have trouble PICKING 22.

[Mofra]

Suckling, Dickson, Wood... how many games do we expect these guys to play this year?
Where is Daniel's best spot? Bailey Williams?

Who takes the second wing spot?

Can Schache play in the same side as Dale, given they both play as bruise-free flankers? Can Dickson and Lloyd play in the same side?

For mine the problem isn't picking the best 22 players, it's filling the positional holes we have. We need a distributor off the HB line, and JJ runs the ball so that's Suckling or Caleb Daniel. Can we play both?
How does our F50 pressure stack up against the competition's best?
Who in our midfield is a bastard and is a lock for best 22?

[mjp]

Maybe I am being ornery. But in terms of proven/unproven:




Backline. Suckling. Trengove. Wood.


I'll give you Suckling. Trengove is battling to get a game and Wood has had 50% of us questioning his place in the side over the past 2-3 seasons. Was Wood "PROVEN" once upon a time? Sure. He needs to prove it again if he wants to be a week-in, week-out player.



Half back line. Crozier. Keith. Johannisen.


Crozier is proven. JJ is 'kinda' proven - but as what exactly? Can he fight through a tag? Have we ever worked this out? Where is Bevo going to play him? Harsh call as he will be in the 22 and is an AFL player, but if we are playing the number of interceptors it looks like we will play, is he going to have to lock on to an opponent? And what happens if he does?

Keith is 100% NOT PROVEN. Did it as a fill-in at another club that was battling...that doesn't prove anything. Massive ? mark for me on the role he plays and how he fits in. Ask me in R#22 if he is proven.



Centreline. Hunter. Dunkley. Smith.

Hunter and Dunkley are proven. Smith has had one season - and where does he play this year? As a winger? Well, unproven. As an inside mid? Well, he's done that...but I've heard of a little thing called the 2nd year blues and I'm not counting any chickens...young players often get worse before they get better.



Half forward line. Dickson. Bruce. Schache.

Dickson WAS proven...can he stay fit for a week? A month? A season? Goodness knows.
Bruce is 'proven'...what isn't proven is if he can play alongside Naughton...he has been the 'man' at the Saints for 2 years now and in case you didn't notice, that hasn't worked out too great for them. Schache is NOT PROVEN...and particularly not proven as the '3rd tall' out of 3 and double particularly not proven playing high as a secondary target.




Full forward line. Lloyd. Naughton. McLean.

Lloyd is kind of proven...except when the Tiges won their flag, they were happy to play Townsend and Butler ahead of him. I think he's good but still has to prove that there is steak and not just sizzle for a season and not for a month.
Naughton has played one season in his life as a key forward. NOT PROVEN.
McLean? What position does he play again? Dropped last season...NOT PROVEN.


Followers.
English. Bontempelli. Macrae. Duh……..no arguments here.

English is NOT PROVEN. The other two are amazing.


...bench

I’ll go with. Lipinski. Daniel. Liberatore. Cordy (Cordy for flexibility).

I think you could almost say Lipinski was 'semi proven' after the past two years but will the coach even pick him? Liber is not proven these days...Cordy is 100% not proven particularly given his overall performances last year and the fact you have already selected Keith, Wood, Bruce, Trengove, English, Naughton, Schache...where would he even PLAY in this team? I would like to say Daniel is proven as I love watching him but I think we all know he was a liability at times last year (44% of 1-v-1 contests LOST which is world record pace) and I have no idea where he will play...elite ball user of course but is he the defensive rotator or a mid or WHAT exactly?



This leaves out Bailey Dale, Taylor Duryea, Ed Richards, Mitch Wallis and Bailey Williams. 5 players I would love to put in. Maybe Dale comes in for Cordy?

Dale - Unproven. And I am not sure can play if Schache, Naughton, Bruce, Lloyd and Dickson do.
Duryea - 100% PROVEN.
Richards - PROVEN.
Wallis - too injured to be proven.
Bailey Williams - UNPROVEN.

So ornery or not, whilst I 100% agree we are talented I think the problem with picking 22 is that we don't actually KNOW about a lot of the players on the list...a lot of them are between 15-30 games and - as many are at that stages of their career - have been wildly inconsistent. I mean, did we win games late last year because Bailey Dale kicked bags of goals or did he kick bags of goals because the rest of the side was playing well? The truth is most likely somewhere in the middle but we seriously have NO IDEA.

[hujsh]

Did you mean to say Richards is proven there mjp? If so why? Only one there I didn't quite follow the logic of.

[mjp]

Did you mean to say Richards is proven there mjp? If so why? Only one there I didn't quite follow the logic of.

I think Richards IS proven and is under-rated by supporters.

He has played 40 games as an outside runner in two years moving between wing and half back. He gets it about 15 times every week, has good balance between contested and uncontested, runs and carries, kicks it ok...I think he has been better at HB than wing and suffered a bit from the change but to me he is the man who will line up across from Hunter and has the best credentials to do so.

I'm not sure why he isn't more of a favourite...I just know that we all seem to love everyone BUT Ed.

[mjp]

Oh - I guess I have Richards and Lipinski in the same boat. Good, consistent performers who seem to be undervalued by 'US' and to an extent by the MC...though to be fair Richards has hardly missed a game in two seasons.

[Mofra]

Oh - I guess I have Richards and Lipinski in the same boat. Good, consistent performers who seem to be undervalued by 'US' and to an extent by the MC...though to be fair Richards has hardly missed a game in two seasons.
Lipinski's VFL time last year was pretty well telegraphed to fans - he needed to work on his inside game which is the one aspect of his game that wasn't shown at AFL level.

He did his time, developed his inside game, and wasn't dropped again.

Richards has been thrown around like a dog toy. The knock on him is production but the question is - how many ball winners can we carry? Richards runs the ball and uses it well and all signs point to the MC rewarding players who try to make the play.

[hujsh]

My issue with Richards last year was that for a man you can kick a beautiful ball he didn't do enough with the limited posession he had (missed goals and poor field kicking). Otherwise I like a lot of what he brings to the team but wouldn't have thought he was proven if Lipinski isn't.

Perhaps grouping them together is fair

[bornadog]

The best way to solve the OP's question is we pick the inform players at the time of selection. There will always be players with niggles, injuries, issues etc . When we pick the best players, they should be the best suited for the role we need them to play.

I know this is fence sitting and not naming them, but, I want to see who is ready for the start of the season.

[Remi Moses]

My god you could go through every list and see “unproven “ players

[bornadog]

My god you could go through every list and see “unproven “ players

I don't think that is the point.

It is not as hard to pick the best 22 as the OP may make out, as there is lots of potential/talent that we as Bulldog supporters tend to over rate when they haven't proven anything yet.

[mjp]

I don't think that is the point.

It is not as hard to pick the best 22 as the OP may make out, as there is lots of potential/talent that we as Bulldog supporters tend to over rate when they haven't proven anything yet.

I guess this sums it up for me as well BAD.

I 100% agree our list is talented. But (to pick an example) the fact that Bailey Williams has 'TALENT' isn't the same as saying Bailey Williams needs to be in the 22. Everyone has talent. To really 'DEMAND' a spot you need to be a proven, consistent performer who has the trust of the match committee.

If (to keep the example going) I was to compare Williams to Crozier...both have TALENT. But Crozier is a proven commodity as an AFL half-back who has repeatedly 'stood up for us...Crozier would be HARD to leave out of the 22. Williams would be UNLUCKY to miss out based on his talent, but when you look at his body of work, it is not unreasonable to think he will spend time in the VFL.

I wasn't trying the run down the list - what I was saying was sometimes as supporters we get carried away with a flash here or there and think that is enough for selection...It isn't. It is enough for an opportunity. What happens after that? Well...

[macca]

Love the positivity of this post ,, many players on this list pushing for limited spots so it's a good problem to have
Talent and execution and ability to outplay,, outrun and out muscle your open is a other thing ,. The last game against gws showed the gap in toughness and consistency gap. Our wholeist needs to play for 4 full quarters and just menace opponents .

We are getting there and the day which we scare the sh$$&#*t out of opponents and see the fear in their eyes when we smash them in every tackle, is the day I will enjoy watching them bleed.