Franklin vs Carey

[GVGjr]

Mark Robinson has an article today comparing Franklin and Carey. John Longmuir who played with Carey at his best and has coached Franklin can't split them

On paper Franklin has him covered but to be honest I think Carey was the better player mainly around his marking ability and that he really carried North for a good while.
Carey played 272 games and kicked 727 goals
Franklin has played 300 games so far and has kicked 944 goals

Who do you think was the better player and I'd appreciate it if you would explain why?

[westdog54]

Looking forward to some fascinating discussion.

I'll say that Franklin is probably the better player, with the irony being that what is probably his greatest weakness (Marking) was Carey's greatest strength.

Beyond that, Lance Franklin is, physically, the prototype for the perfect footballer.

He has a combination of height, strength, skill, speed, agility and smarts that is unmatched among his peers and unlikely to be replicated in years to come.

Bit of sliding doors stuff here, imagine for a moment Carey and Longmire hadn't been sold by the Swans to North for the princely sum of $10,000. Sydney would have been a powerhouse through the 90s, probably don't recruit Tony Lockett (He probably would have ended up at Collingwood), and North may well have been in the wilderness and not won the 92 and 94 premierships. They would have been even worse financial trouble, probably merge with Fitzroy instead of Brisbane (That may have even happened earleir, also).

[hujsh]

Looking forward to some fascinating discussion.

I'll say that Franklin is probably the better player, with the irony being that what is probably his greatest weakness (Marking) was Carey's greatest strength.

Beyond that, Lance Franklin is, physically, the prototype for the perfect footballer.

He has a combination of height, strength, skill, speed, agility and smarts that is unmatched among his peers and unlikely to be replicated in years to come.

Bit of sliding doors stuff here, imagine for a moment Carey and Longmire hadn't been sold by the Swans to North for the princely sum of $10,000. Sydney would have been a powerhouse through the 90s, probably don't recruit Tony Lockett (He probably would have ended up at Collingwood), and North may well have been in the wilderness and not won the 92 and 94 premierships. They would have been even worse financial trouble, probably merge with Fitzroy instead of Brisbane (That may have even happened earleir, also).

96 and 99?

[Bulldog Joe]

As a pure footballer I rate Carey ahead.

He was so strong in the contest and stood up in critical moments.

it would have been rare for him to miss a clutch goal.

Franklin is the superior athlete and has thrived without ever being capable of the pack marking that epitomised Carey.

I think Clarkson devised a system to suit Franklin, but Longmire has got him playing more contested style footy.

While Franklin is a freakish kick and can kick a long goal, I think Carey has him covered with his reliability.

[Axe Man]

96 and 99?

Maybe there was another sliding door moment when North relocated to Perth?

[bornadog]

Hard to judge this as Carey was more of aCHF, which is much harder to play than a pure FF.

Goal kicking Franklin wins hands down but marking Carey was a great cont Mark.

Overall I would rate Franklin the guy I would have in my team due to his athletic ability

[Twodogs]

Can I say Kelvin Templeton?

And that it's close to heresy to say any different!!!!!!

[bulldogtragic]

Carey. Was a gun CHF and gun CHB when required - Could play multiple roles. Young captain. Carried North. Two time premiership player. Should've been 3 or 4. A main strategy was simply isolating the entire 50 just for Carey, which was a regularly winning strategy. Real shit bloke. Shit. Bloke.

Franklin. Some career discipline issues, including at least one strike, but seems well passed them. Has never really sorted out his goal kicking to the level you'd hope it would've got to. Marking not a huge strength, despite his size. Two time premiership player, should've been three and he 'would've if weren't for you meddling kid Bulldogs'. Great athlete. Does the freakish and makes it look easy. Kicked 100 in a season. Can't really play anywhere but forward, but plays it outstandingly well, so does he need to?

Points decision to Carey.

[Bulldog Joe]

Can I say Kelvin Templeton?

And that it's close to heresy to say any different!!!!!!

So in a choice between C and F you find the better option is neither.

Can't disagree with your choice. Surely the most under appreciated key forward EVER.

[Axe Man]

Can't really play anywhere but forward, but plays it outstandingly well, so does he need to?

Do you think Buddy could play on a wing like Richo did late in his career? Similar size and athletic attributes. Richo almost won a Brownlow that year.

[Bulldog Joe]

Do you think Buddy could play on a wing like Richo did late in his career? Similar size and athletic attributes. Richo almost won a Brownlow that year.

Would agree with this.

Buddy played mostly forward, but I feel his athletic attributes actually were always suited to the wing.

[Mofra]

Do you think Buddy could play on a wing like Richo did late in his career? Similar size and athletic attributes. Richo almost won a Brownlow that year.
Yes, definitely.

Rcho moved to the wing to help develop young Tigers forwards though (Jack Riewoldt). I'm not sure that is required by Franklin at Sydney as he has to be the main man, with Reid fragile and Tom McCarton not a no 1 KPF.

[Axe Man]

Yes, definitely.

Rcho moved to the wing to help develop young Tigers forwards though (Jack Riewoldt). I'm not sure that is required by Franklin at Sydney as he has to be the main man, with Reid fragile and Tom McCarton not a no 1 KPF.

Maybe next season if Joe Daniher ends up there.

[Twodogs]

So in a choice between C and F you find the better option is neither.

Can't disagree with your choice. Surely the most under appreciated key forward EVER.

That is precisely what I did.

Royce Hart was my next answer, if you held my head down the dunney and threatened to pull the flusher unless I named a non bulldog player I would have said Royce Hart.

[The Underdog]

Buddy is an athletic freak of a footballer. On his day there’s probably no one quite like him. He’s quite literally unstoppable when he’s on. Aesthetically a joy to watch, you’d go to a game just to watch him a la Ablett Sr.
However if you’re looking for consistent output and the ability to drag a team along with him then it’s Carey (I have no regard for Carey as a human being, but he’s one of the 10 best footballers I’ve ever seen play). It’s an almost impossible task but I feel like Carey takes it by a hair.

[The Underdog]

Can I say Kelvin Templeton?

And that it's close to heresy to say any different!!!!!!

You can but much like a politician answering a question with their own unrelated talking points, you’re not really addressing the question at hand.

[FrediKanoute]

Two different players, playing in 2 different era's despite the fact they missed each other by 5 years. In the 90's the emphasis was on structure - 2 key forwards, a stong spine etc. Carey and Longmire provided this for North. Carey was a 1 position player, but was a elite contested mark; elite shot for goal and a very accurate shot for goal. He was exactly what you wanted from you CHF and he delivered.

Franklin played in an era where versatility and mobility became more important. Teams stopped kicking to packs and possession football and running power became more important as teams sought to control possession. Franklin was ideal because he was a big bodied bloke with mobility of a small. It made him hard for traditional backs to match up on.

I think its hard to compare who was better. In some ways Franklin had it a little easier as his physique was ahead of where his direct opponents were. There were/are not many 6'10" players who can run, jump and move the way he does. With Carey, he was pitted against guys the same size as him - Jacovich, Grant - he was just better at marking and moving.

[westdog54]

96 and 99?

Yeah, them ones. Oops

[jeemak]

I find this argument to be a little bit like the Cripps vs. Bontempelli argument. In theory and at a quick glance the players should be comparable but when you think about it a bit more it gets harder and harder to justify the comparison in itself.

Carey played in a different era and brought different things to the game that Franklin couldn't or just hasn't, and vice versa. What Carey can do in a pack, Franklin can't, what Franklin can do with a loose ball and with a bit of space Carey couldn't because he just didn't have the physical attributes to manage it.

Bont has played 26 more games than Cripps, but has kicked 68 more goals. He kicks the footy more, but handballs less, with both players almost hitting 70% disposal efficiency. Both players have three B&F's, two AAs, one has a premiership and a coaches player of the year award, the other doesn't have a premiership but has a players player of the year award. One has played solely midfield in a poor midfield generally, the other has played midfield and forward, with more quality midfield competition within his own team.

For some reason the latter two get compared as if they play the same roles for their teams, and it's silly. They don't, and they're players with different attributes anyway. Same goes for Franklin and Carey, albeit there's also a different era and literally a different game in which to compare them, so if it's silly trying to compare two players who shouldn't get judged as comparable in the same era, I can't see how you can compare two who are different and played in different eras.

[Ozza]

Carey for me.

When he emerged as a star at 20/21 years old - he completely turned his footy club around in a way I haven't seen before or since. Carey played with some good footballers, but nowhere near the talent that Buddy has played with at Hawthorn and Sydney - with Carey being the biggest individual influence on the team being able to win premierships.

Franklin is an amazing player - but his team mates at Hawthorn went on to win 2 more without him, and he hasn't been able to get another at Sydney (who had won it it 2012).

Carey was probably the best player I've seen (I'm talking probably 1989-2020 as my proper 'watching years') along with Ablett Snr and Lockett.

I have Franklin in the next tier with Ablett Jnr, Judd, Hird, Voss, Buckley, Grant, Martin.

[Twodogs]

Carey for me.

When he emerged as a star at 20/21 years old - he completely turned his footy club around in a way I haven't seen before or since. Carey played with some good footballers, but nowhere near the talent that Buddy has played with at Hawthorn and Sydney - with Carey being the biggest individual influence on the team being able to win premierships.

Franklin is an amazing player - but his team mates at Hawthorn went on to win 2 more without him, and he hasn't been able to get another at Sydney (who had won it it 2012).

Carey was probably the best player I've seen (I'm talking probably 1989-2020 as my proper 'watching years') along with Ablett Snr and Lockett.

I have Franklin in the next tier with Ablett Jnr, Judd, Hird, Voss, Buckley, Grant, Martin.


That's why Carey was the better player. He virtually dragged North over the line to two premierships on his own back. When a game was there to be won, in those crunch moments that decided the contest I can only ever remember Carey being beaten once. We came from 40 points behind at 3/4 time one day at Marvel Stadium to hit the front and it basically came down to one marking contest in North's goalsquare at the 33 minute mark of the last quarter.

Wayne Carey and Matthew Croft waiting under the ball and most times you would have just given up and headed for the exit to beat the crowd. But this day Croft beat Carey in the vital contest.