Off course: AFL return plan rocked by Crows' Barossa training session

[bornadog]

AFL chiefs are furious after the Adelaide Crows admitted a group of their players appeared to have flouted social distancing rules by training as a group on a Barossa Valley golf course, potentially derailing the league's plan to reboot its season.


The apparent breach comes a day after AFL football boss Steve Hocking warned clubs that the season depended on players adhering to the league's strict training protocols and government regulations.


Story continues here (https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/afl-investigates-crows-training-breach-in-barossa-20200507-p54qui.html)

[FrediKanoute]

Well......of course no one is really going to play by the rules

[Mofra]

They just don't do camps well, do they?

[Eastdog]

They just don't do camps well, do they?

Nice one Mofra :D

[Twodogs]

They just don't do camps well, do they?

Their punishment should be getting locked down at that camp they all sooked over until the restrictions are done.

[Happy Days]

Galaxy brain from the Crows - can't miss the finals if the season never starts

[ledge]

Easy fix test them all.

[jeemak]

Galaxy brain from the Crows - can't miss the finals if the season never starts

Dull as a box of hammers. You would be shaking your head if you were on the board of the Crows...……..wondering how.

[jeemak]

More on the rocket surgeons and how they came to make such a blunder:

https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/this-is-our-error-crows-boss-apologises-to-afl-for-training-breach-20200508-p54r13.html

We wouldn't know what an educational approach to addressing a breach of quarantine is in Victoria.

[GVGjr]

I haven't fully read the article but do they now need to start their quarantine period again? I suspect they should because it's hasn't been adhered to

[westdog54]

Easy fix test them all.

That's not the issue.

The issue is that they've started training aa group when Victorian clubs are prohibited from doing so.

The AFL said that there was to be no group training until it could be done by all clubs.

[bornadog]

Dock them points.

[GVGjr]

Dock them points.

Whateley thinks that is the fairest outcome

[bornadog]

Whateley thinks that is the fairest outcome

Didn't see that, but I think a better penalty that a fine

[GVGjr]

Didn't see that, but I think a better penalty that a fine

I think they also need to start another isolation period as they have breached theirs

[comrade]

I've heard suggestions of docking points as well as taking away a draft pick...seems extremely harsh to me.

A fine should suffice, surely.

[Sedat]

Reading this story, I feel as though some parts of the country have gone slightly mad. Is docking points really a consideration? There has been only 1 new case of COVID in the entire state of SA in nearly 3 weeks. It's a stuff-up by the Crows but why are the same predictable, shrill, boring, self-righteous, over-inflated, elitist sections of the sports media demanding such significant penalties? Are they that pathetically desperate for attention from the public, who are discovering how inconsequential sport (and especially sports media) actually is when far more important issues like their mental health and livelihoods have been heavily compromised for the last 2 months (with many more months and possibly even years to follow)?

Surely a fine would suffice.

[jeemak]

That's not the issue.

The issue is that they've started training aa group when Victorian clubs are prohibited from doing so.

The AFL said that there was to be no group training until it could be done by all clubs.

Well that's not really the only issue.

The AFL needs to be able to demonstrate that its players and officials can be disciplined enough to meet strict protocols that are likely to be placed on them when the season starts.

That Adelaide wasn't able to follow the simplest of these protocols when their players were supposed to be quarantined under state laws is a massive issue for the AFL.

[jeemak]

Reading this story, I feel as though some parts of the country have gone slightly mad. Is docking points really a consideration? There has been only 1 new case of COVID in the entire state of SA in nearly 3 weeks. It's a stuff-up by the Crows but why are the same predictable, shrill, boring, self-righteous, over-inflated, elitist sections of the sports media demanding such significant penalties? Are they that pathetically desperate for attention from the public, who are discovering how inconsequential sport (and especially sports media) actually is when far more important issues like their mental health and livelihoods have been heavily compromised for the last 2 months (with many more months and possibly even years to follow)?

Surely a fine would suffice.

I knew Whately piping up would get your attention!

Docking points is pretty serious, removing draft picks is as well. I personally think the officials and players involved knew the rules and were trying to be clever and got caught out and they're stupid for it. But I tend to agree a fine should be enough, with the threat of further breaches being punished more severely.

[bornadog]

I knew Whately piping up would get your attention!

Docking points is pretty serious, removing draft picks is as well. I personally think the officials and players involved knew the rules and were trying to be clever and got caught out and they're stupid for it. But I tend to agree a fine should be enough, with the threat of further breaches being punished more severely.

AFL is soft as butter. A fine is nothing to these clubs these days. $5000, $10,000 big deal, they turnover more than $50 million.

What happens next time there is a breach? Another fine?

[Remi Moses]

I think docking of points is overs
It will be a fine

[Twodogs]

Dock points. There is no way that the wrong in this can be overstated. It was a rotten thing to do on so many levels I'd have no problem with taking away draft picks or suspending players for a year either. The old the "next team getting caught get's a worse penalty" doesn't fly in this case

They knew they were taking a chance and cheating the system and the AFL have to come down hard. IMO It's far worse than Essendon's drug cheating.

[bornadog]

Dock points. There is no way that the wrong in this can be overstated. It was a rotten thing to do on so many levels I'd have no problem with taking away draft picks or suspending players for a year either. The old the "next team getting caught get's a worse penalty" doesn't fly in this case

They knew they were taking a chance and cheating the system and the AFL have to come down hard. IMO It's far worse than Essendon's drug cheating.

People think they can get away with it. I just came back from a walk around the park, and lots of people walking in bunches of 5, 6 because they think " well covid-19 infections are low, what does it matter". I saw people arriving at houses with flowers, obviously visiting their mothers. The reason we are where we are is because by and large people have stuck to the rules, as should have the Crows. It was only a day earlier the AFL said they wouldn't tolerate breaking of rules and players have to be on their best behavior, so lets see what penalty is dished out and how tough they are.

[GVGjr]

The AFL should fine the players and the coach who have all just had substantial pay cut and should have known better. This will get the players a bit more interested in following the rules. The players should also have been instructed to start the 14 day isolation period again.

The other option is suspend them all for a game as that will get all clubs very focused on following the rules

It's not as effective in fining the club because of the current financial situation and draft penalties or loss of premiership points is just
a bit harsh.

[bornadog]

delete rumour

[jeemak]

Dock points. There is no way that the wrong in this can be overstated. It was a rotten thing to do on so many levels I'd have no problem with taking away draft picks or suspending players for a year either. The old the "next team getting caught get's a worse penalty" doesn't fly in this case

They knew they were taking a chance and cheating the system and the AFL have to come down hard. IMO It's far worse than Essendon's drug cheating.

I'm going to ask you to unpack this a little bit mate, because I can't see how a bit of circle work outside is worse than a systemic drug program that put player health at direct risk.

[Dry Rot]

Dock points. There is no way that the wrong in this can be overstated. It was a rotten thing to do on so many levels I'd have no problem with taking away draft picks or suspending players for a year either. The old the "next team getting caught get's a worse penalty" doesn't fly in this case

They knew they were taking a chance and cheating the system and the AFL have to come down hard. IMO It's far worse than Essendon's drug cheating.

Yep, docking points is the way to go.

How many offending players? 8?

8 points gone.

[Dry Rot]

Yep, docking points is the way to go.

How many offending players? 8?

8 points gone.


But we have to be consistent.

How many cars did Hunter write off? 4?

4 points gone from us too. :D

[Twodogs]

I'm going to ask you to unpack this a little bit mate, because I can't see how a bit of circle work outside is worse than a systemic drug program that put player health at direct risk.

Sure thing J. Firstly there is a pandemic going around that the medical world haven't got a handle on yet meaning the player's were putting their health at risk without being fully informed on the dangers for a start. Then there is the arrogance of thinking society's rules don't apply to them and then there is the cheating aspect-other club's players can't train together so why do Crows' players think they can?

If any of the player's got the Coronavirus, it developed into Covid-19 and they died would that be OK? It's contagious, drugs aren't. You can be asymptomatic and pass it on to others without realizing you have it, or they can go home and pass it into their kids or partners. At least those kids and partners' (maybe not the kids but you get my point) would get to choose whether or not they take drugs-even PEDs-unless they are held down and forcibly shoved down their throat. That choice isn't available with this highly contagious disease If you come into contact with a sufferer then you will probably catch it.

And why should those club's players who obeyed the rules be behind the 8-ball when it comes to fitness and coordination because another club's players didn't?


You and I played footy at a competitive level, An infectious disease will go through a football clubrooms like a dose of salts-If players go back next week as planned and these blokes are asymptomatic they were putting their own teammates at danger depending on how long they remain contagious which nobody knows yet. I'd be *!*!*!*!ing ropable if my teammates put me at risk like that.

Enough? I have several more, such as endangering the restart of the season, there was a slight chance that it may have restarted but thanks to them that is gone. These blokes have got off lightly IMO. They may as well be licking hand rails in public toilets or stair rails.

[jeemak]

I understand all of that TD, but the actual risks are small and the same folks would be able to go to their local shopping centre and do a lot worse every day.

That's the silly thing about this whole situation.

I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but there seems to be a lot of contradictions out there and most of them are in some way aligned to overall risk. With that in mind and in the context of the AFL, I think injecting players without keeping records or really knowing what you're injecting into them in the first place is worse.

[Twodogs]

I understand all of that TD, but the actual risks are small and the same folks would be able to go to their local shopping centre and do a lot worse every day.

That's the silly thing about this whole situation.

I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but there seems to be a lot of contradictions out there and most of them are in some way aligned to overall risk. With that in mind and in the context of the AFL, I think injecting players without keeping records or really knowing what you're injecting into them in the first place is worse.

That's one I can't understand either. But that doesn't make what the Crow's players did right. They knew the rules and flouted them.

And players take stuff they have no idea about the effects of all the time. You know how it is. The coach/doctor tells a player take/do/say something and 99% of them will without question because they don't want to be the odd man out or looked at as trouble maker. There will come a time at some stage in the future when your spot on the list or in the team will come down to how 'co-operative" or "pliable"they were in the past.

[soupman]

Geez fine the players individually and be done with it. Draft pick penalties and docking points is incredibly harsh and sets an ugly precedent for middle ground offences.

[GVGjr]

The options to me are:
Suspend the players and the coach concerned for one or two weeks
Fine the players and coach for not understanding the social distancing rules that everyone else knows
Fine the club, basically a token gesture
Dock premiership points, harsh but sends a strong message to all clubs
Remove draft picks, well overs for mine
A combination of a couple of the above options

Does docking them points simply hand them a better draft pick?

[bornadog]

Geez fine the players individually and be done with it. Draft pick penalties and docking points is incredibly harsh and sets an ugly precedent for middle ground offences.

The trouble is, the AFL, came out days before spouting how tough they will be clubs/players breaking the rules.

[Axe Man]

Correct me if I am wrong but aren't the only rules the Crows have breached the AFL training protocols? They trained in groups of 8 which is allowed under South Australian social distancing regulations. So I'm not sure why we are discussing Covid-19 risk, etc? Their only crime as far as I understand it is trying to gain an unfair competitive advantage. If 3 of our players were busted training together in a park in Adelaide would you be happy for us to lose draft picks and premiership points?

They will get heavily fined and rightfully so, but the hyperbole in this thread baffles me.

[GVGjr]

Correct me if I am wrong but aren't the only rules the Crows have breached the AFL training protocols? They trained in groups of 8 which is allowed under South Australian social distancing regulations. So I'm not sure why we are discussing Covid-19 risk, etc? Their only crime as far as I understand it is trying to gain an unfair competitive advantage. If 3 of our players were busted training together in a park in Adelaide would you be happy for us to lose draft picks and premiership points?

They will get heavily fined and rightfully so, but the hyperbole in this thread baffles me.

I favor fining or suspending the players and coach.

If 3 of our players did the same I'd still be happy with the approach above

[bornadog]

Penalties

Barrett Reporting

Crows assistant coach Ben Hart stood down for six weeks over training breach. The 16 players escape serious sanction, all receiving a one match suspended sanction. More to come on

Ben Hart isn't able to have access to players or be at the club facility until June 22 as well as his six-week stand down from coaching

EDIT Full statement here (https://www.afl.com.au/news/433093)

[GVGjr]

Penalties

Barrett Reporting


Ben Hart isn't able to have access to players or be at the club facility until June 22 as well as his six-week stand down from coaching

EDIT Full statement here (https://www.afl.com.au/news/433093)

Hart should have stopped it straight away, a strong penalty on him but I feel it's a weak one for the players concerned
They all should have known better

All that leadership training amounts to bugger all when they are in a group

[bornadog]

Hart should have stopped it straight away, a strong penalty on him but I feel it's a weak one for the players concerned
They all should have known better

All that leadership training amounts to bugger all when they are in a group

Yes the players would have known. Someone should have stood up

[GVGjr]

Yes the players would have known. Someone should have stood up

Doedee is in the leadership group and should be stood down for a week or two. If a coach and a player that has been voted into the leadership group can't make the correct call, it's not a great advertisement for the effectiveness of leadership training

We should get into the ear of McAsey

[Remi Moses]

Got smacked with a wet lettuce
How does that Vic bias go again ?

[GVGjr]

A somewhat weak response from the AFL. I know it's easy to say but it should have been a bit tougher

[Twodogs]

Was that a a cigarette in Ben Hart's mouth on the footage on the news last night?