Dogs v Carlton practice match

[Dry Rot]

What do you think our lineup will look like? Who's back this week?

Any key news on Carlton? Will Judd be playing?

[The Coon Dog]

What do you think our lineup will look like? Who's back this week?

Any key news on Carlton? Will Judd be playing?

Everitt to miss along with Harbrow. Crossy going to his brothers wedding so he'll miss too. Might be an opening for Cal Ward.

Gilbee to return.

Judd playing will ensure a decent crowd.

[dogman]

Everitt to miss along with Harbrow. Crossy going to his brothers wedding so he'll miss too. Might be an opening for Cal Ward.

Gilbee to return.

Judd playing will ensure a decent crowd.

So is Everitt injured, or getting rested. I'm assuming his injured.

[The Coon Dog]

So is Everitt injured, or getting rested. I'm assuming his injured.
Yup, you assume correctly. Should be an announcement this arvo.

[bornadog]

Heard on SEN that Carlton are at full strength and only missing two players.

[Dry Rot]

NAB Challenge match
Carlton versus Western Bulldogs
4.20pm (AEDT), Friday March 7 at MC Labour Park in Melbourne

Carlton
1 – Andrew Walker
2 – Jordan Russell
3 – Marc Murphy
4 – Bryce Gibbs
5 – Chris Judd
6 – Kade Simpson
8 – Matthew Kreuzer
10 – Richard Hadley
16 – Shaun Grigg
17 – Setanta O’hAilpin
18 – Paul Bower
19 – Eddie Betts
22 – Shaun Hampson
23 – Adam Hartlett
25 – Brendan Fevola
26 – Joe Anderson
27 – Dennis Armfield
28 – Cameron Cloke
29 – Heath Scotland
30 – Jarrad Waite
31 – Jordan Bannister
32 – Bret Thornton
33 – Ryan Houlihan
36 – Darren Pfeiffer
37 – Jake Edwards
38 – Ryan Jackson
40 – Michael Jamison
44 – Andrew Carrazzo


Western Bulldogs
2 - Robert Murphy
5 - Matthew Boyd
6 - Brad Johnson
7 - Scott West
8 - Mitch Hahn
9 - Lindsay Gilbee
10 - Nathan Eagleton
11 - Peter Street
14 - Callan Ward
15 - Ben Hudson
16 - Ryan Griffen
17 - Adam Cooney
18 - Brennan Stack
19 - Shaun Higgins
20 - Josh Hill
21 - Jason Akermanis
22 - Dylan Addison
23 - Andrew McDougall
24 - Jarrad Grant
25 - Ryan Hargrave
27 - Will Minson
28 - Scott Welsh
30 - Guy O'Keefe
31 - James Mulligan
33 - Tim Callan
35 - Stephen Tiller
37 - Cameron Wight
38 - Dale Morris
44 - Paul O'Shea

http://afl.com.au/tabid/208/Default.aspx?newsid=55880

[LostDoggy]

Ive got a funny feeling we will get flogged Friday night.

[LostDoggy]

Ive got a funny feeling we will get flogged Friday night.

No, I've got a funny feeling you want it to happen and you'll enjoy if it did.

[The Coon Dog]

Ive got a funny feeling we will get flogged Friday night.

Why doesn't that surprise me?

[GVGjr]

Does everyone think we will beat an almost full strength Carlton team given some of the injuries we are facing?

Whilst Jerry is often negative, I don't think we will be starting as the favorite on Friday.

[LostDoggy]

Plus the big crowd and Carlton have been playing well against us lately.

[bornadog]

Does everyone think we will beat an almost full strength Carlton team given some of the injuries we are facing?

Whilst Jerry is often negative, I don't think we will be starting as the favorite on Friday.

agreed, but it won't be about winning. It will be about testing some of our new game plans, particulary the forward structure and the delivery into it, testing out some young players and looking at generally how we are progressing. The result doesn't matter.

[The Coon Dog]

Does everyone think we will beat an almost full strength Carlton team given some of the injuries we are facing?

Whilst Jerry is often negative, I don't think we will be starting as the favorite on Friday.

I'd be extremely disappointed if we didn't win comfortably!

[Dry Rot]

Regardless of the result, are there any specific match-ups that Eade will be looking at? ie trying someone out as a tagger on Judd, who will take Fevola, who will play the role of CHF?

[LostDoggy]

Im looking forward to watching my boy will, and guy okeefe, hes become a real favourite of mine, and hes only played in the bulldogs team once:D.

Should be good just to have another hit out, as long as we dont get any injuries or reports ill be happy win or lose.

[Bulldog Revolution]

I've just re-watched the Essendon game on tape and we really butchered a lot of shots on goal, but I still found positives in patches. Higgins had some classy touches, Will's back tap that created a goal was clever, Hill improved as the game went on, Cooney was continually able to find it etc.

So Whilst we clearly wont be favourite on Friday but I think that playing the young guys again should provide plenty of opportunities for inexperienced guys to step up and contribute

How about our injury list?
Williams, Lake, Giansiracusa, Harbrow, Ray, Everitt, Lynch?

And those are all guys are all legitimately pushing for senior selection

Does anybody think none of them could be right for round 1?

[Scorlibo]

Is Jarrad Grant likely to play? I sure hope he does, hopefully he can kick a goal with his first kick like the other draftees - and then a couple more :). Nah, wouldn't expect all that much from him but it would be nice for him to get the senior experience.

[LostDoggy]

Just a query: Is there a cost to go to the match or is it free sitting? If so, what, in most people's opinions, is the best area to sit in at 'MC Labour Park' .. geez, what a name. I've been to the place so many times (used to live right across Royal Parade from it) but I still can't figure out where the best seats are.

[LostDoggy]

ie trying someone out as a tagger on Judd,
Practice match, Judd first game back from injury( he won't play a full game). I'll be disappointed if we use a tagger.


who will take Fevola,
Doogs most likely. Or Morris.


who will play the role of CHF?
Wight we get a run there. Not sure if that will happen in round 1. A combination of Johnson, Welsh, Murphy, Gia and Hahn more likely.

[LostDoggy]

'MC Labour Park' .. geez, what a name.
MC Hammer park - can't touch this.

[LostDoggy]

Just a query: Is there a cost to go to the match or is it free sitting?


Pretty sure its free if you show your membership card, otherwise its $10, i could be wrong tho.

[Cyberdoggie]

agreed, but it won't be about winning. It will be about testing some of our new game plans, particulary the forward structure and the delivery into it, testing out some young players and looking at generally how we are progressing. The result doesn't matter.

we should win and if we tried to win i believe we would


but for the following reason i think we will won't:

doogs will play on fevola the whole game

[Bulldog Revolution]

Practice match, Judd first game back from injury( he won't play a full game). I'll be disappointed if we use a tagger.



Are you serious about not tagging Judd Ernie?

Surely we aren't just going to let him run around and do his own thing.

Some of our guys like Cooney, Griffen, Higgins, Boyd and Addison could all perhaps learn by spending time on him

[Mantis]

we should win and if we tried to win i believe we would


but for the following reason i think we will won't:

doogs will play on fevola the whole game

Morris usually plays on Fev and has an excellent record. Why would tomorrow be any different especially in our last hit out before season proper? Would prefer Doogs to play on the resting ruckman type. Ie Cloke or Kruezer

[hujsh]

Morris usually plays on Fev and has an excellent record. Why would tomorrow be any different especially in our last hit out before season proper? Would prefer Doogs to play on the resting ruckman type. Ie Cloke or Kruezer

We need to keep testing Doogs unless Morris is a KPP. Would play him on Fev in the real thing for sure but if someone like Doogs could do a good job on him then Morris could play on someone like Lappin (i know he retired but he did kill us last year)

[bornadog]

we should win and if we tried to win i believe we would


but for the following reason i think we will won't:

doogs will play on fevola the whole game

Morris will pick up Fev

[The Coon Dog]

Morris usually plays on Fev and has an excellent record. Why would tomorrow be any different especially in our last hit out before season proper? Would prefer Doogs to play on the resting ruckman type. Ie Cloke or Kruezer

Spot on!!

[wimberga]

Is anyone else getting sick of the constant demoralisation and negative targeting of Mcdougall? I sure as hell am.

Hes wearing the Red White and Blue like all the rest of the guys.

[hujsh]

Is anyone else getting sick of the constant demoralisation and negative targeting of Mcdougall? I sure as hell am.

Hes wearing the Red White and Blue like all the rest of the guys.

Well we need a scapegoat and he just happened to take the old ones jumper;)

[bornadog]

Is anyone else getting sick of the constant demoralisation and negative targeting of Mcdougall? I sure as hell am.

Hes wearing the Red White and Blue like all the rest of the guys.

Yes I am sick and tired of it myself. Last year McDougall started to show some excellent form and in fact I thought he played well against Hawthorn, even thou we got thrashed.

McDougall is one of those big guys that has taken awhile to mature and he has now put on some bulk. Give the guy a go, the season hasn't even started yet. All we have had is a bunch of practise matches, yes PRACTISE, you know, those training sessions in a match format.

Lets see how he goes in the season proper, and if he doesn't cut it then he will be dropped. The upside is he is a big tall guy that has shown potential in the past.

[wimberga]

I a Bulldogs supporter, so the last i checked, Scapegoats were the opposition, or in alot of other cases, the Umpires

[Bulldog Revolution]

He's going to be pretty important to how we start the season.

I cant see Williams being ready for a month, and Lake is in some doubt with the hip

So given they've played Wight forward all preseason I think we can be certain that McDougall will play

Morris will be called upon to play on guys he shouldn't, because he is mentally one of the best competitors in the league, but we still need Doogs.

[hujsh]

No doubt that he could become a favourite player of mine should he succeed, but I'm disappointed he didn't work out up forward.

[LostDoggy]

I think Morris should get the job on Fevola, but wouldn't be upset if they were experimenting with McDougall on him, after all, if they need to find out if he can do it or not I'd like it to be now and not when it actually counts- we know that Morris can do the job so if McDougall were to fail it wouldn't be the end of the world.

I don't think McDougall is useless, far from it, he did do well against Hawthorn and if I remember rightly he did well against Melbourne as well, can't remember too much though.

[LostDoggy]

Is anyone else getting sick of the constant demoralisation and negative targeting of Mcdougall? I sure as hell am.

Hes wearing the Red White and Blue like all the rest of the guys.

Yep, I'm with you here. I find it amazing that "so called" supporters can be so criticl of someone who wears the Bullies jumper.

They would be better off posting over at the Big Footy forum because they havent ever heard of a positive post over there.

[LostDoggy]

Is anyone else getting sick of the constant demoralisation and negative targeting of Mcdougall? I sure as hell am.

Hes wearing the Red White and Blue like all the rest of the guys.

What a hell of a difference the posts have been since the above quote.

Some positive and interesting reading.

McDougall has the size and the speed of a player the dogs badly need. He's shown he can play both forward and back (not consistantly as yet). He needs to mature as a player and deliver the goods.

Rocket must persist tomorrow and in the early rounds in particular, and give him the opportunity (especially with our injuries to our KKP).

I believe he is out of contract at the end of the year - the ball is in his court.

Imagine the options Rocket would have if McDougall can develop into a reliable KKP.

[Dry Rot]

Who's going today? Look forward to your reports.

[GVGjr]

What a hell of a difference the posts have been since the above quote.

Some positive and interesting reading.

McDougall has the size and the speed of a player the dogs badly need. He's shown he can play both forward and back (not consistantly as yet). He needs to mature as a player and deliver the goods.

Rocket must persist tomorrow and in the early rounds in particular, and give him the opportunity (especially with our injuries to our KKP).

I believe he is out of contract at the end of the year - the ball is in his court.

Imagine the options Rocket would have if McDougall can develop into a reliable KKP.

Fully agree DD. McDougall has plenty of work to do and it must be a make or break season but if he could hold down a key defenders position it would free up other players.

If he wants to be playing footy beyond this year he must make the most of any opportunities he gets.

[wimberga]

Im heading into the game today, wont be able to comment on it for a fe days though as im going away straight after it. Hope the boys do well.

[Rocket Science]

likewise heading along this arvo and will endeavour to report back within 24 hours-ish of the final siren.

[Mofra]

I've just re-watched the Essendon game on tape...
What kind of sick sadist are you? :p

[bornadog]

Practice match, Judd first game back from injury( he won't play a full game). I'll be disappointed if we use a tagger. .

Why not, good practise for Callan:D

[GVGjr]

Why not, good practise for Callan:D

I don't think Callan could keep up with him. Callan still has plenty to prove and hopefully today is a good day for him.

[Topdog]

We need to keep testing Doogs unless Morris is a KPP. Would play him on Fev in the real thing for sure but if someone like Doogs could do a good job on him then Morris could play on someone like Lappin (i know he retired but he did kill us last year)

Wholeheartedly agree. This is our last chance to give Doogs a go in a game that isn't overly important. Hopefully he grabs it by the neck.

[Mantis]

Yep, I'm with you here. I find it amazing that "so called" supporters can be so criticl of someone who wears the Bullies jumper.

They would be better off posting over at the Big Footy forum because they havent ever heard of a positive post over there.

Which poster's are you referring to??

[GVGjr]

Which poster's are you referring to??

Lets not turn this into another BF thread thanks.

[Mantis]

Lets not turn this into another BF thread thanks.

Then why would Petergm make the comment?

[hujsh]

What a hell of a difference the posts have been since the above quote.

Some positive and interesting reading.

McDougall has the size and the speed of a player the dogs badly need. He's shown he can play both forward and back (not consistantly as yet). He needs to mature as a player and deliver the goods.

Rocket must persist tomorrow and in the early rounds in particular, and give him the opportunity (especially with our injuries to our KKP).

I believe he is out of contract at the end of the year - the ball is in his court.

Imagine the options Rocket would have if McDougall can develop into a reliable KKP.

Not to be negative but he has only shown he can play forward in the NAB cup. Unless i missed something. Or were you talking about at West Coast?

[bornadog]

I don't think Callan could keep up with him. Callan still has plenty to prove and hopefully today is a good day for him.

agree, thats why we should try him in a practise match.

[Scorlibo]

QTR time: Bulldogs - 5.1.31 leading Carlton 3.5.23, Akermanis 11 touches, Kreuzer 9, Judd 6.

[Scorlibo]

HALF Time: Bulldogs 9.4.58 lead Carlton 6.7.43.

[LostDoggy]

Thanks for score updates Scorlibo

Aker dominating again lol.

Cant wait to read a report tonight / know all goalkickers

[hujsh]

Carlton are wining. About 78 to 73

[hujsh]

Carton 86 to Dogs 81. I'm happy. They have a strong team on the field and it is close.

[LostDoggy]

93 to 84, Carlton won. It's all about Carlton on SEN, but I only listened since half time, so I don't know anything about how our guys went.

[Scorlibo]

Carton 86 to Dogs 81. I'm happy. They have a strong team on the field and it is close.

As am I. I had fears of getting beaten atleast convincingly, but to lead for most of the match and only be behind by a bit is good.

[hujsh]

93 to 84, Carlton won. It's all about Carlton on SEN, but I only listened since half time, so I don't know anything about how our guys went.

At the start it was like the racing commentating.

Judd runns out if the centre and walks around....he picks the ball up and handballs it to Gibbs...Who hands it back to JUDD! Listen to the crowd! Now he's on the bench and he's drinking WATER! WHAT A PRO!

After 3 updates on Judd they mentioned the dogs had 2 goals. I thought, "really? " They couldn't care less about the game and i regret turning the radio on.

West 25 Boyd 21 Acker 20. (possies)

[Sedat]

No injuries? We've had enough of those lately. Looking forward to reading the reports from those who went.

[hujsh]

Walker hurt himself in a collision with Murph. Pretty shame.

[LostDoggy]

A Carlton player got suspended, as far as I know that was pretty much the main story. I think it was Waite, perhaps, or Walker, but he was injured- I think it was Waite.

[hujsh]

A Carlton player got suspended, as far as I know that was pretty much the main story. I think it was Waite, perhaps, or Walker, but he was injured- I think it was Waite.

Twas. On Hahn head high.

[hujsh]

Twas. On Hahn head high.

Actually Twasn't. Twas Marc Murphy on Hahn:o

[Scorlibo]

This from the AFL site.

NAB CHALLENGE
CARLTON 3.5 6.7 10.11 13.15 (93)
WESTERN BULLDOGS 5.1 9.4 11.7 12.12 (84)
Goals: Carlton: B Fevola 4 J Edwards 3 J Russell C Judd S Browne A Hartlett C Cloke R Houlihan.
Western Bulldogs: S Welsh 3 B Johnson 2 J Hill 2 S Minson 2 R Griggen S Higgins J Akermanis.

Best: Carlton: M Murphy B Fevola J Waite M Kreuzer C Judd A Carrazzo.
Western Bulldogs: J Akermanis B Johnson S Higgins M Boyd A Cooney S West.

Injuries: Carlton: A Walker (shoulder). Western Bulldogs: Nil. Reports: Carlton: M Murphy (reported by umpire S Stewart for allegedly making forceful front-on contact to M Hahn in the third quarter). Western Bulldogs: Nil.

Umpires: S Ryan S Stewart S Wenn H Kennedy.

Crowd: 10,137 at Princes Park.

Has Muphy down as being reported, but was Waite according to everyone else I've heard from.

[hujsh]

Good to see S.Minson got 2 goals and R.Griggen got 1.;)

[LostDoggy]

Walker hurt himself in a collision with Murph. Pretty shame.

Hope its not the shoulder he got work on at the end of 07'. Damn shame if it is.

And Aker, well, jesus. Talk about the perfect preparation. Our best by far all summer i would say.

[hujsh]

Hope its not the shoulder he got work on at the end of 07'. Damn shame if it is.

And Aker, well, jesus. Talk about the perfect preparation. Our best by far all summer i would say.

What about his kicking? Some BF posters have said he kicked it to no-one.

[GVGjr]

Some positives and negatives out of todays game

Welsh is a far more intelligent player than I have given him credit for. He knows where to lead and how to out position his opponent and how to knock the ball effectively to his teammates

I'm warming to the Minson FF option. He kicked a nice long goal and a very nice left foot snap.He still has plenty to learn but lets stick with him

MacDougall did OK. Ran and carried the ball and kicked long to position. He got beaten on a couple of occasions but I thought they should be happy with him

Street and Hudson worked together well.

Addison did some nice things. Decision making and the occasional error just take some of the shine away from his game.
Hargrave was very good, one bad error cost us a goal but he used the ball well and beat his opponents
Higgins did some nice things and bounced back from a big hip and shoulder.
Tiller played mainly as a defender and looks fitter and stronger than ever.
Gilbee was very classy

Negatives
Eagleton was a long way off it today. I'm a supporter but todays effort wasn't good
Hahn's skill errors hurt us and and he just wasn't effective
Callan has still not shown anything that says he is much more than a depth player

I'm not sure if Wight and Murphy were injured. We didn't see Wight on the ground after Q time and Murphy wasn't sighted in the last.

Griffen needed the gallop and Morris needed some support.

[Scorlibo]

Thanks v much GVGjr. Much appreciated.

[hujsh]

Why is Tiller always back? Is he not a forward?

Or are we just teaching him to have a defensive side?

[GVGjr]

Why is Tiller always back? Is he not a forward?

Or are we just teaching him to have a defensive side?

We had Minson and Welsh as tall forwards plus Hahn and Murphy as the mids. I think it is a great idea to try him back there. He is on a huge learning curve and this will assist him

[hujsh]

We had Minson and Welsh as tall forwards plus Hahn and Murphy as the mids. I think it is a great idea to try him back there. He is on a huge learning curve and this will assist him

So his future is still as a forward? Like Roughead playing back early?

[GVGjr]

So his future is still as a forward? Like Roughead playing back early?

I don't think we should lock him into any position just yet. I think this is a good move though especially with Welsh who is a similar size to him playing as the main forward.

[Mantis]

Agree with your thoughts GVG.

Thought Hahn was Ok in that he worked hard to get the ball, just let himself down a little with his execution.

Not happy with Eagleton's game. As a 'designated' kicker he has to do more with the ball in hand. Helicopters don't cut the mustard.

Impressed with Welsh, used him well early and as you pointed out he has some 'footy smarts'.

Minson worked hard up forward.

Aker looks a different player than last year, got his 'zip' back.

Griffen while needing a run showed his class with a superb goal in the 2nd qtr.

Hill continues to impress.

[GVGjr]

Thought Hahn was Ok in that he worked hard to get the ball, just let himself down a little with his execution.



Hahn doesn't get enough of the ball to make the errors that he did today.
Guys like Aker can make some mistakes but can rebound from it because they attract the ball. Hahn just doesn't have that luxury.

Aker is a very intelligent player. At one stage he was going to be out marked but simply backed into his much taller opponent and got the free. I don't think awareness like that can be taught.

[hujsh]

Hahn doesn't get enough of the ball to make the errors that he did today.
Guys like Aker can make some mistakes but can rebound from it because they attract the ball. Hahn just doesn't have that luxury.

Aker is a very intelligent player. At one stage he was going to be out marked but simply backed into his much taller opponent and got the free. I don't think awareness like that can be taught.

Maybe not taught but Hahn could still learn if you get what I'm saying.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Enjoyed watching the game with GVG

And Yep agree with all of the positives and negatives

Welsh's first half was top notch, kicked 3 set up 2, led well, took a great one on one contested mark 20 out, and converted as he always does. Minson showed good signs.

Not sure Tiller will play from round 1 but he looks to have done everything in his power to put his name in front of the selectors and looks set for his best year at the club wherever he is selected.

Josh Hill was good on a wing, kicking 2, perhaps should have kicked 3 had he not missed a 35 metre wide open running shot in the last quarter, covers the ground well and contested very well in the air, attempted one screamer that he gave away the free kick on, and took one nice flyer.

Guy Okeefe didn't get a whole lot of it, but very much looked the part. I missed all of the 07 pre season so dont know but I wonder if he is at the same stage as Harbrow last year? Perhaps others can comment.

West's best game of the preseason, Cooney was excellent, Boyd comfortable as a midfielder or as a rebounding defender

[Scorlibo]

For those who were there, how did Jarrad Grant go? And Callan Ward?

[Bulldog Revolution]

For those who were there, how did Jarrad Grant go? And Callan Ward?

Neither played, saw Ward with Reid and Ray walking across the ground after the game, did not see Grant

[Scorlibo]

Neither played, saw Ward with Reid and Ray walking across the ground after the game, did not see Grant

Thanks.

[Sockeye Salmon]

I didn't think Aker was our best player today, he was OK but not great. Had a really good first quarter.

For mine Matthew Boyd was our best player. He spent the entire 3rd quarter and half the last quarter on the bench and still got 20+ possies.

West was great in the last quarter especially, more of what we're been seeing for the past 14 years from Scooter.

I thought Griffen was better than some others have given him credit for, very encouraging performance. Conversly, I didn't think Cooney had much of a game.

Hudson was good at the clearances early, exactly what you would expect from him really. He doesn't do much around the ground but he did take 2 contested marks from long kick outs. Street adds nothing. Street spent a short spell at FF and twice had opportunities against a much smaller opponent and couldn't take marks he should have. Took one uncontested mark and then missed from 30m out right in front.

Minson and Welsh were OK. Welsh was fabulous in the first but he does go missing for big chunks of games. Johnson has looked lost with Minson and Welsh around, very little impact from Johnson at all today. Higgins started well but copped a solid shepherd from Betts that looked like it hurt Higgins shoulder. He came back on but wasn't anywhere near as damaging. Promising, though.

Hargrave was excellent (except for the late shot, I thought he got reported), Morris got himself torn a new one by Fevola. Fev kicked 4 goals and missed more than that again.

Mcdougall was OK. He's better than most people think. He still hesitates sometimes when he should attack the ball harder, but that's Mcdougall and he'll never change. Tiller played on Edwards and got beaten on the lead three times for three goals. For the most part was pretty good, his kicking is better than I realised.

Addison and Callen won't make it. Addison's kicking is dreadful, Callen can't play.

Gilbee hardly spent any time on the ground at all. Would have been lucky to have played much more than a quarter.

Hill started poorly. A few skill errors - fumbles and miskicks - but his 2nd half was good. He'll take mark of the year one day but will give away 20 frees trying before he does.

Murphy was totally out of sorts and had a day he'd rather forget. Eagleton was even worse, an absolute shocker.

Hahn was poor as well. He doesn't get it enough and when he does his skills aren't good enough to make the opposition pay. Where do you play him? He can't go back, he's not quick enough yet adds little to the forward line. I'm very worried about Mitch's future. I think he'll spend time at Willi this year.

O'Keefe had little gametime and I only remember him getting one handball. Edit: I do remember O'Keefe getting at least two kicks because they were both right-footers and we commented on it.

[BulldogBelle]

Thanks to all of you, I said all of you ...(to quote the words of Mark Thompson) for the great reports you have all presented. :)

[BulldogBelle]

Thanks for all the effort guys.

Good read.

[The Underdog]

I concur, thanks to all for the reports.

[Templeton31]

ditto on reports. thanks all.

[Raw Toast]

Great report SS, and ta to all the others who let us know what happened as well.

Where was Callan played? The reports we've had on him from Eade seemed to indicate his training's been fairly impressive, but he's done nothing of note in the pre-season matches. Maybe he needs to play for Willi and just try and get his confidence up. I don't think he has the footy brain and awareness to make it as a smallish defender, but I'm sure we'll have spaces available at some stage for a tough nut in the midfield.

I'm not giving up on Addison yet, but this is obviously a key year for him. Hahn does sound a worry. Almost want him to play as a tagger and get led to the ball, but doubt he has the engine for this. I suspect that Minson going forward isn't helping Hahn either. Still he's another who has apparently impressed with his preseason so I'll wait and see what happens when the real thing starts.

Glad to hear that Tiller showed some signs. He's looked keen as mustard the few times I've seen him, and gives the sense that he won't fail for lack of effort which is good.

Who did Doogs play on? With Everitt and Williams under a cloud he's actually pretty important to us as a defensive option. Can't see him missing round 1, though I reckon he'll get an unfair share of the blame if we're beaten.

[GVGjr]

Callan mainly played back but did venture up forward at one stage. He just isn't clean enough with his skills.

I would stick with Addison but trying to find a set position is the hard thing. Yes there is questions over his kicking skills and be is quick, runs hard and has a crack physically so I'd give him some more time.

Doogs had a few opponents like Cam Cloke and while he coughed up a goal or two his rebound and kicking from defense wasn't bad.

Both teams flooded a fair bit yesterday but I thought that our tackling improved from last season especially in defense. Even though Morris was well beaten some of his 2nd and 3rd efforts were terrific.

[LostDoggy]

Hi all,

Great to read others' view of the game, was there till halfway through the third quarter and these are some of my notes (with Sheahan's caveat of 'this is only my opinion'):

- Great day for footy... watching the crowd get on the oval and kick around at half-time was a joy.
- 'MC Labour Park' is a very nice ground for the footy, apart from the disgustingly dirty corridors. Food and drink were pretty expensive.

- Westy dominated at clearances and looked twice as fast and sharp as he did last week -- which makes sense with an eye on his training cycle. Some of his work was so sharp and clean it was blink-and-miss-it kind of stuff. Brilliant. (If Scotty played in a higher profile side over his career he would have long ago been compared to Greg Williams, who made Sheahan's top 10).

- Aker moved really, really well. His disposals were a mixed bag -- some brilliantly weighted passes to a leading player, other hopeful punts to a contest -- but got his hand on it a lot and picked up the from the ground very cleanly, a sign of a class player. Passes into a crowded forward line were the biggest concern. However, clearly a different/markedly improved player to last year.

- Griff looked very impressive the few times he got his hands on it -- the goal that others have already spoken of was sheer class.

- Callan looked an honest trier, clearly outclassed on the lead and not quite up to standing top forwards but very good value I thought as he always gave nothing but the best effort. A depth player, as others have pointed out, but there's no shame in it if this represents the bottom of our list.

- Hill was very classy.. may be the surprise of the year. Still very skinny but moves silkily.

- Eags made two major clangers that I remember from no pressure whatsover but he was certainly pushing the pace (as he does) when he got the ball.

- Some have mentioned that Johnno wasn't very good but I thought that he totally outclassed every opponent he played on. Kicked goals at will when up forward in first quarter, then outran and outmarked every player he played on when playing more in the midfield. Gave the team a lot of run. Made quite a few mistakes too, which is something we've come to hate about Johnno's game, but certainly added far more positives than negatives to the team. One passage of play especially was classic Johnno. A hopeful punt was coming in at the top of a relatively empty square and there is nobody in sight except two Carlton defenders and Johnno who is a mile away and running at an angle away from the ball. Of course, this is just to give himself room to make a late run at the ball and spoil, which he does with brilliant athleticism and someone scores a goal off the crumbs. Totally outnumbered against two defenders who are more than a head taller than him and the result is a goal to the Dogs. Class.

- Hudson is a huge plus to the team.

- McDougall provides a good contest but simply hoofs his clearances. Quality of disposal from the defence -- apart from Lindsay, who had a quiet game anyway -- was a problem all game.

- Farran and Andrejs walked right by in front of me and stopped to chat (I was sitting right in front of Rocket's coaches' box). Both were limping with casts/braces on their ankle/knee respectively. Farran definitely looks a heck of a lot bigger close up than he did last year.


By the by, Juddy's touches were by and large efficient but he certainly is still some way from his best -- much slower and kicks are less penetrating than they used to be, but he's still a ball magnet.

[LostDoggy]

Oh, and Big Will was good value to watch up forward. It was good to be able to directly compare someone like Fev to Big Will, and apart from their frames (Will is slightly bigger, if anything), there is little comparison. Fev is quicker and far more mobile and takes a lot of marks on the lead (and is a reasonable contested mark), but they both hoof it a long way. Fev's kicking wasn't great yesterday, but there was a set shot that was almost in identical positions that Fev kicked well but missed, and Will shanked but flew through at post height. Just the fact that there's someone like Will up forward though means that, at the bare minimum, there's one less key defender opponents have for Welsh and Johnno, which can only be a good thing.

[katemeehan]

I'm not sure if Wight and Murphy were injured. We didn't see Wight on the ground after Q time and Murphy wasn't sighted in the last.



Murphy came off late in the 3rd (I think) and when into the rooms. Came out during the 4th in the after-game gear and just sat on the bench. Wight was standing in the race in his trackies for a fair bit of the 4th.
Had seats a few metres from the bench, on the fence. They set up the bike RIGHT in front so for plenty of the time I could only see Mitch Hahns backside...

Closest Ive ever been to them at an actual game, and I gotta say Jonno was a scary sight as they all walked down into the rooms! His huge smile can be reversed pretty severly :D:mad:

Callan Ward was on my tram on the way home too!

[bornadog]

Oh, and Big Will was good value to watch up forward. It was good to be able to directly compare someone like Fev to Big Will, and apart from their frames (Will is slightly bigger, if anything), there is little comparison. .

Fev is only 191 cm but weights around 100kg

[BulldogBelle]

I concur, thanks to all for the reports.

Yes, thanks!
You wouldn't want to be relying on the Age report _ 2 mingy para about us and the rest about the Judd.

Good to see they named Hill third best?????

[Templeton31]

yeh i didnt think anyone else played in the game on friday. not for us or the blues. just Judd.

[hujsh]

Out of curiosity did anyone see Willy play

[Go_Dogs]

Thanks for the reports everyone, good read.

I think Hill has definitely earned himself a start in Round 1 based on his performances over the pre-season. Hopefully he does get rewarded.

[LostDoggy]

Had seats a few metres from the bench, on the fence. They set up the bike RIGHT in front so for plenty of the time I could only see Mitch Hahns backside...


You must have been somewhere near me, i was in the next bay across from the bike, but yeah i was on the end so mitch and boydy was just there :D:D:D.

[Rocket Science]

Concur with much of what's been written about individual players, but didn't come away from the game versus Carlton bounding with positivity I'm afraid.

It's a very presumptuous call before a ball's been kicked in anger, but based on observations through 2 NAB Cup tilts and a pair of NAB Challenge contests there's just too many (familiar) holes in our broader game (personnel, style, application, execution) to suggest we're a bona fide top-eight threat this season. Clearly much could alter that, including events at other clubs which are entirely out of our control, but I'd suggest a real tooth and nail scrap for one of the last 2 finals slots is how we're likely shaping up, with the prospect of again missing out on September action altogether a realistic one.

Anyway, better late than never, as for the Carlton game itself some sporadic observations.

1st Quarter: Arrived midway through the opening term with the good guys up 3 goals to 1...Morris stood Fev and was worryingly both outmuscled in marking contests and beaten cleanly on leads, though a little more upfield pressure on the Blues ball carriers might have aided Dale's cause. Fev got plenty of it and had he brought his kicking boots and perhaps been a little less selfish could have done more damage early....Dogs early forward setup was a fairly conventional mix of Welsh/Johnson/Murphy/Tiller, with Welsh having a 5 minute purple patch resuting in a pair of goals from clever marks...Addison spent some time tagging Judd but struggled to keep up, beaten more by Judd's well timed darting through traffic than pure pace...Notable Eagleton clanger coming out of defence just prior to the first break almost resulted in a Judd goal, prevented only by the siren...Overall, Carlton sprayed some straight forward chances, and we were too easy to play against when not in possession.

2nd Quarter: No frills pair of Minson/Hahn up forward to start the term, with a lively Aker prowling across half-forward...Westy manning Judd at centre bounces, then tagging out with Eagleton who vaguely attempted to follow him around the ground meaning Judd faced minimal man-on-man resistance as he went about his business...Hargrave gave Houlihan a nice late-ish clip in a marking contest on the Blues half-forward line which riled Fev and saw a little bit of harmless niggle...Hudson later thrown into ruck at expense of resting Street with Boyd/Higgins/Akermanis onball trio, with Huddo eagerly scrapping at ground level as required...Though again, application of teamwide pressure when we don't have the footy is ad hoc at best, allowing Blues to string together multiple possessions and work up some rhythm...Pleasingly though, while the Blues challenged strongly going forward during the 2nd half of the quarter, the Dogs backline defended pretty stoutly as a unit (McDougall, Hargrave, Gilbee, Murphy) during that particular phase, contesting smartly, getting to the fall of the ball, intercepting and teaming fairly well by hand and foot out of defence...Griffen also noteworthy for his bold run and carry, but while his inclination and ability to create in this way is invaluable and it's a pleasure to watch him make fools of multiple pursuers, he was collared twice for holding the pill and should be wary of attempting to do too much whilst occasionally ignoring the support of his teammates.

3rd Quarter: McDougall again at full back and handling a healthy amount of the kickout duties, generally preferring the long roost...Tiller also swung into defence and Gilbee playing quite deep who while involved at times, was understandably less active than normal with upfield forays...Addison still getting the occasional run between halfback and half forward but general endeavour again undone by skill errors with the footy...On the plus side, Hill more noticeable at wing/half forward and beginning to work his way into the game after a quiet first half, attempted a couple of hangers which while unsuccessful demonstrates a certain flair and headiness we could do with more of, he's shown enough to earn a spot methinks and am looking forward to seeing how he acclimates to senior footy this year...Higgins also more noticeable with some handy passages going forward, makes generally sound decisions with the footy, another quality in reasonably rare supply...More extended niggle between Minson and O'Hailpin during the term which continued for several minutes with the ball down the other end...Hudson again busy at ground level when we aren't in possession, fantastic endeavour from a big bloke and wish it would rub off on some of his midfield pals...Ultimately though, our turnovers by foot hurt us this quarter, allowing an occasionally lazy and disorganised Blues outfit back into the contest, getting to within 2 points at the last break with a big sniff and an edge in momentum.

4th Quarter: Minson/Welsh/Johnson/Higgins/O'Keefe mix starting up forward...Minson showing occasional signs of being useful near goal, albeit he'll never be a conventional key forward...doesn't do a bad job of stooging for frees which is a necessary weapon in any key forward's arsenal...Welsh much quieter in 2nd half after handy opening half...Johnno busy as usual thoughout the game and more involved with play upfield, as far up as half back at times and often repeatedly involved in the same passage of play which saw the ball travel from half back to our forward 50...Cooney too quiet for mine overall this day, played the sort of high-energy yet passive game in the mould of a certain teammate wearing #10, and struggled to impact proceedings, even in spurts, in the manner expected of him...Agree with others that Callan hasn't shown he's up to AFL standard right now, he's a trier but has too many basic limitations in his game ranging from skill level to play reading and barring a mid-year developmental spurt if he's a regular this season I'd suggest we're in some strife...

McDougall tried all day though and while needing to add some polish and steel in equal measures, was amongst our better players...Hill also continued to dazzle in patches, chiming in with a cracker of a snap where he leapt to grab a loose ball in mid-air about 20m out on a slight angle and in one action before his feet hit the ground thrust boot at ball for full points, very much a la Daniel Wells' 2004 goal of the year...The kid's got panache...Sadly though, as a squad we didn't finish the game in glowing fashion...Goals generally dried up for the Dogs in the last term as the Blues overran us and ran out 10 point winners...Worth noting that despite all this talk of us adding bulk, whether due to fatigue or poor technique our tackling frequently let us down with opponents too often able to break free of traffic with the ball...

Biggest issue for mine is that we appear too reliant on opposition skill errors to regain possession after committing turnovers. Carlton were happy to oblige on this front, but if this laxity without the footy remains unchanged we're going to have major trouble against better drilled teams who are less wasteful in possession and use the ball more frugally than the Carlton's of this world. It's simply too costly to have routine turnovers in our forward 50 predictably end up as scoring chances for the opposition in our defensive 50, with nary a Bulldog getting a hand on the footy in between. Unless we want the backline continually under seige, we can't afford to concede the entire middle of the ground when we lose possession up forward, that means forwards and midfielders must be prepared to work twice as hard when we don't have the footy.

I'm typed out so that's about it. Thanks for reading if you got this far.

Lets hope the pre-season can serve as a much needed tune up and that we can overcome this ridiculous, almost annual spate of early season injuries to the tackle real stuff with more cohesion and purpose.

[bornadog]

Lets hope the pre-season can serve as a much needed tune up and that we can overcome this ridiculous, almost annual spate of early season injuries to the tackle real stuff with more cohesion and purpose.

Good report RS. Personally I don't take as much notice of preaseason form as some others do. Some how when the real season starts, there is this mental thing that kicks in with players and suddenly, all the work and hard yards the players have gone through comes together. If a player has had an interrupted preseason, they start the year poorly and it takes a while to get match fit.

Whether we have the cattle on the ground to win games or not is yet to be seen. If we had no injuries at all, I believe we would have the players to win alot of games.

Lets hope we don't get anymore major injuries and we can start to field a full side by at least round three.

[BulldogBelle]

Excellent analysis there RS, very impressive.

[hujsh]

What you've typed is almost as impressive as how much you have typed RS;).

Good job

[Sockeye Salmon]

Thanks for the report, RS, but I can't help thinking that you're a bit pessimistic about it all.

I came away quite happy with the hitout. I thought we were by far the better team in the first half and they were only in it because of Fev and some straight kicking from Edwards.

We only played 23 players (Carlton played 26), Wight lasted 10 minutes, Murphy had gastro, Gilbee was underdone and had reduced minutes, Boyd and Hahn both had corkies (I was sitting behind the bench near the exercise bike so I can tell you how little game time Boyd and Hahn got after half time).

On a warmish day we were always going to get overrun.

[mjp]

...and some straight kicking from Edwards.


How did young Jake go SS?

(From an obviously interested observer).

[Rocket Science]

Thanks for the report, RS, but I can't help thinking that you're a bit pessimistic about it all.

Fair point, and to be honest after relaying the report I felt similarly to a degree...There were obvious caveats regarding the game itself as you've mentioned, and it can't be emphasized enough that we haven't played a minute of the real stuff as yet, but that 'overall' assessment of where we're at is the product of four games, not solely the Carlton game.

Very simply, based on what's been served up so far while it's not entirely a tale of woe, and there are certainly some positive aspects of our development to enthuse about, I just can't find sufficient signs of improvement in the key areas which have let us down against quality opposition in the recent past, and the broader manner in which we go about our football.

Team and individual form fluctuates and things can change very quickly as we all know, but that's my honest, if unwelcome view right now...though would love nothing better than to be proven wrong come ten weeks into the season.

[Sockeye Salmon]

How did young Jake go SS?

(From an obviously interested observer).

Very well.

He leads hard and has sticky fingers but the highlight of his play is his kicking. Fevola owned the corridor so if Edwards wanted to get a kick he had to lead wide - and then he nailed 3/3 from deep in the pockets.

He started on Wight (hamstring after 10 minutes) then played mostly on Tiller. 10 kicks, 6 marks and 3 goals I read somewhere. Tiller had his measure when they were shoulder to shoulder but Edwards won out when he moved.

I think he has real talent and would love him at WO. I heard some gossip about Butch not being happy with him at Carlton - not getting a decent go as long as Fev's at FF.

[Templeton31]

thanks for the effort on the report RS. Top work.

[hujsh]

Very well.

He leads hard and has sticky fingers but the highlight of his play is his kicking. Fevola owned the corridor so if Edwards wanted to get a kick he had to lead wide - and then he nailed 3/3 from deep in the pockets.

He started on Wight (hamstring after 10 minutes) then played mostly on Tiller. 10 kicks, 6 marks and 3 goals I read somewhere. Tiller had his measure when they were shoulder to shoulder but Edwards won out when he moved.

I think he has real talent and would love him at WO. I heard some gossip about Butch not being happy with him at Carlton - not getting a decent go as long as Fev's at FF.

I thought Tillers speed was his strength not his muscle

[mjp]

Interesting.

Jake was running 2.9's over 20m at 16/17. He would be amongst the quickest in the competition over that distance now I would wager. His agility was never 'elite' though.

What this means is that for his size, he is best suited to one of two positions: FF or FB - where his straight line acceleration will be of most benefit. I have been surprised that Carlton have not tried him down back to this point in time. I share Butch's concern that Jake will not be truly successful unless he is able to play in the key spot - I am just not sure he has the physical capabilities to be successful elsewhere (I dont see him getting many opportunist type goals that a secondary target needs to pick up every week).

Anyway, I obviously taught him all the good stuff - the rest is either genetic or learnt from that stupid dual premiership coach Denis Pagan.

[Sockeye Salmon]

I thought Tillers speed was his strength not his muscle

It's all relative.

Edwards was definately quicker, but as Mike has just pointed out, Edwards' speed is elite for his size.

Tiller looked much bigger in the upper body than Edwards, but that doesn't mean Tiller is big, just bigger than Edwards. Tiller was also a bit smarter in his positioning.

[Twodogs]

Interesting.

Jake was running 2.9's over 20m at 16/17. He would be amongst the quickest in the competition over that distance now I would wager. His agility was never 'elite' though.

What this means is that for his size, he is best suited to one of two positions: FF or FB - where his straight line acceleration will be of most benefit. I have been surprised that Carlton have not tried him down back to this point in time. I share Butch's concern that Jake will not be truly successful unless he is able to play in the key spot - I am just not sure he has the physical capabilities to be successful elsewhere (I dont see him getting many opportunist type goals that a secondary target needs to pick up every week).

Anyway, I obviously taught him all the good stuff - the rest is either genetic or learnt from that stupid dual premiership coach Denis Pagan.



Has anyone mentioned his grandad played in the '54 premiership?

[Sockeye Salmon]

Has anyone mentioned his grandad played in the '54 premiership?

And his great-grandad was 'Dolly Aked', ex-player and club legend.

[LostDoggy]

I thought Tillers speed was his strength not his muscle

Not from what I've seen. He has a poor turning circle and isn't blessed with pace.

[Twodogs]

Not from what I've seen. He has a poor turning circle and isn't blessed with pace.


First time I saw him in match training in his first preseason he was on Grant. Constantly led Grant to the ball and at one stage turned him inside out and kicked a goal while Grant was sprawled on the ground watching him run away. I've seen Grant do it to about a 1000 other players but Tiller's one of the few I've seen do it to Grant.

Thing is when I saw him earlier this year he looked much bigger in the legs, shoulders/ arms and chest. So maybe he's lost a bit of pace and agility. I dont mind that so much because we need a forward who can wrestle and we've got three or four other blokes around the 183-189 mark with plenty of toe and agilty, Welsh, Murphy, Johnno, Hargrave etc. A big bloke staying in the square and actually take an overhead mark an actually kick straight would be worth his weight in cockie poop for us.


Strange thing is he's spent more time playing in the backline than the forward line in pre-season match practice.

[LostDoggy]

He has done a knee since arriving at the club hasn't he?

[aker39]

. He has a poor turning circle.

Couldn't agree more.

Against Essendon he was appalling. I actually said on the night that he had a bigger turning circle than the Queen Mary.

[GVGjr]

He has done a knee since arriving at the club hasn't he?

I don't think so. Was it an ankle and then a foot injury?

[hujsh]

Not from what I've seen. He has a poor turning circle and isn't blessed with pace.

This was based on the comments made by Eade and his selection pannel on channel 7 last year. They talked about his pace off the mark

[Twodogs]

I don't think so. Was it an ankle and then a foot injury?



Yep. He has a long term ankle problem and then a broken bone in his foot. It probably hasnt helped his pace or turning circle if the truth is to be told.

[ledge]

Jakes cousin is shane obree at collingwood , so the edwards clan are quite big , just let you all know a couple of years back jake was playing dowling shield and was giving up cricket because he had a bad back, well thats what butch mentioned from memory, i asked butch(his dad,who we all know) which club he would like him to play for and he mentioned Collingwood as they treated him well when he was playing.
Jakes older brother Tuddy also had injury problems, pity as they are all great footballers, all come from Melton, think Tuddy is still there, and Butch is still the same old good bloke.Well not so much the old, tip is dont get in a shout with him.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Jakes cousin is shane obree at collingwood , so the edwards clan are quite big , just let you all know a couple of years back jake was playing dowling shield and was giving up cricket because he had a bad back, well thats what butch mentioned from memory, i asked butch(his dad,who we all know) which club he would like him to play for and he mentioned Collingwood as they treated him well when he was playing.
Jakes older brother Tuddy also had injury problems, pity as they are all great footballers, all come from Melton, think Tuddy is still there, and Butch is still the same old good bloke.Well not so much the old, tip is dont get in a shout with him.

When Butch returned to Melton after leaving the Dogs, he agreed to play for beer tickets. Half way through his first season they asked if they could put him on match payments because the beer ticket deal was costing the club too much!

[Bulldog Revolution]

Young Edwards looks a super talent - good hands athletic, didn't get a feel for his agility in the practice match but he is certainly a great prospect

Tiller however has had an impressive pre-season for my money, still needs to get a bit cleaner and stronger, but has made massive improvements, and physically doesn't look far off it.