List Management thread (For 2022)

[Vred]

Alright, so Bevo has had this list for 7 years now and frankly it's pretty bad where it currently sits, we are truly 'Bevos Bulldogs' now and not the team he inherited and coached to a grand final in 16.

What do we do to fix it during this coming off season?

Who do we target?

Re-sign?

Trade for?

Let go of?

Let's hear some ideas on how we improve from where we currently are that don't involve sacking the coaching staff (as tempting as that is right now).

[Vred]

Looking at who we currently have out of contract, our key to the next off season is seeing who we chose to retain, for me number one priority like it or not is English, if we lose him we're in a world of trouble and our number one target should be a ruck spot.

We need ready-made KPD's and most likely two of them considering Keath at the moment, if that currently means losing one of our midfield than I am fine with it, Smith or Dunkley? If I have to pick one to keep it's probably Smith, specially if we can turn Dunks into a ready-to-go KPD, both Smith and Dunkley have really questionable kicking but I do think Smith has plenty of development left in him.

Half our backline is out of contract this year, Daniel, Keath, Schache, Cordy, Duryea, Khamis - this is where we need the biggest help, I'd be looking to target one of Freo's 30 KPD players (Pierce of Hamling) and hope to god Darcy comes on as a KPD so we have some big men down back to help with this, if it means letting one of our 40 half-back flankers go than again, fine with it.

Not sure how we fix the two-way-refuse-to-defend running problem in the middle, but I don't think we need to trade in for mid-field players when we have Garcia and West waiting in the two's, with McLean to return as well.

Forwardline will be fine once Bruce returns but we do need to see more out of VDM, Scott/McNeil and Cody, I think our forward line problem is more entries and coaching than actual personal.

Everything for me this off season hinges on English staying or leaving, but we must go after some KPD depth if we are keen to challenge in the next few years and not let this list go to waste.

[josie]

Eloquently said Vred. Agree 100%. I’ll put my hand up and say I was a dubious about English however his form before he was concussed last year and his dramatic improvement this year have swung me around. If he was to put his hand up for WC or Freo and if our form line does not markedly improve I think it will make for an interesting and likely tumultuous off-season.

[DOG GOD]

I’d have to think more, but a ruckman is a no brainer.
Dunkley and Hunter I would move on.
A player like Gunston/mihocek required.
A FB to allow Keath to play the lever role.
And a whole swag of delisting headed by Wallis.
I’d play Bont 60/40 half forward.
Move Williams into mid rotations/wing.

We have to be ruthless to move fwd.

[Grantysghost]

I’d have to think more, but a ruckman is a no brainer.
Dunkley and Hunter I would move on.
A player like Gunston/mihocek required.
A FB to allow Keath to play the lever role.
And a whole swag of delisting headed by Wallis.
I’d play Bont 60/40 half forward.
Move Williams into mid rotations/wing.

We have to be ruthless to move fwd.

Don't agree on Dunks he's a keeper.

[DOG GOD]

Don't agree on Dunks he's a keeper.
Fair enough Grantysghost but we can’t have Dunkley and Libba, so Libba goes.
If Libba isn’t in the guts 80% of his ground time, he’s a liability.

[Grantysghost]

Fair enough Grantysghost but we can’t have Dunkley and Libba, so Libba goes.
If Libba isn’t in the guts 80% of his ground time, he’s a liability.

I think it's Libbas final season so yeah accurate. Dunks takes over next season with maybe a Garcia?

[DOG GOD]

I think it's Libbas final season so yeah accurate. Dunks takes over next season with maybe a Garcia?
Agree. That’s more the likely scenario, so we should be getting more time into Garcia instead of the likes of Scott and butler.

[Grantysghost]

Silver lining - another Bailey Smith draft pick apparently awesome draft! xD

[EasternWest]

I think it's Libbas final season so yeah accurate. Dunks takes over next season with maybe a Garcia?

Agree with this, we need to get a good look at Garcia. I've liked what I've seen.

[Vred]

I think it's Libbas final season so yeah accurate. Dunks takes over next season with maybe a Garcia?

Libba signed for two mid last year and reportedly wanted three, like it or not we’re stuck with him until end of 2023.

Garcia tho is coming along nicely and I like the look of him, as long as his knees stay attached I do think we have a great developing kid in him.

[Grantysghost]

Libba signed for two mid last year and reportedly wanted three, like it or not we’re stuck with him until end of 2023.

Garcia tho is coming along nicely and I like the look of him, as long as his knees stay attached I do think we have a great developing kid in him.

Thanks Vred I thought he ended this year.

He had covid, so it's entirely plausible that's still affecting his fitness hence the forward minutes.

I really want him in the guts more often. I think he's still got value there.

Libba had 28 pressure acts last night, as a comparison Dunkley had 11.

Dunks attended 15 centre bounces, Libba 8.

[DOG GOD]

Thanks Vred I thought he ended this year.

He had covid, so it's entirely plausible that's still affecting his fitness hence the forward minutes.

I really want him in the guts more often. I think he's still got value there.

Libba had 28 pressure acts last night, as a comparison Dunkley had 11.

Dunks attended 15 centre bounces, Libba 8.

And surely with Dunkleys marking ability he would be better suited in the fwd line allowing Libba more guts time.

[MrMahatma]

Libba is being played out of position and should be in the centre square. I don’t agree at all that he’s cooked.

[Grantysghost]

Libba is being played out of position and should be in the centre square. I don’t agree at all that he’s cooked.

Contract year for Dunks need to appease appease!

All seriousness I think he will spend more time in there soon, probably just easing him in after Covid (I hope).

You don’t take the best clearance player away from the clearances. Be like playing Tom Lynch at full back.

[Mantis]

And surely with Dunkleys marking ability he would be better suited in the fwd line allowing Libba more guts time.

Do you really want Dunkley kicking the ball? He is either in the middle doing the grunt work or he doesn't have a role.

[Mofra]

We need to factor in our cap position and who is gettable.
I'd still ask the question of Jackson Payne who is under contract but can't get a game for the Lions. We asked about him previously so he knows we're interested and I doubt he's on big coin.

I'd keep a close eye on Brayden Crossley at Southport, 198cm ruck/forward and strong body. He showed signs at AFL level before getting cut by Gold Coast serving a coke suspension. Potential base salary DFA signing that provides us with depth. Still only 22.

I still watch West Coast every year pluck a smart, skillful small forward from a small town in WA each year and wonder why the hell we don't look at these types too (no, Arty Jones is not a small forward - he's a wingman). We only have to nail one of those picks and small forwards are the type that can play very early in their career.

Beside that, our list now is the list we're taking forward. I don't think we have the cap space for any decent FAs and we'll largely stay a draft and develop type of club.

[Grantysghost]

Are you judging him on reputation, or on what he actually does?
He's kicked 164.116 over his career. 58 percent without OOF.

Naughton

104.82 about 55 percent.

Taking the gold standard Dickson he was at 75 percent (181.61).

So Naughton or Casboult you're going to be losing your hair.

[Sedat]

Do you really want Dunkley kicking the ball? He is either in the middle doing the grunt work or he doesn't have a role.
Dunks spending more time forward as a short term option is not the worst suggestion I've heard.

Liam Picken was effecively our pseudo CHF in the 2016 finals series and he had the worst kicking efficiency in the entire competition when he was playing primarily as a mid under BMac a couple of years prior. Very strong hands aerially and ultra-competitive, not dissilimar to Dunkley's skillset.

Agree it is heart in mouth stuff whenever Dunks is having a shot at goal, but gee he would help out Naughts enormously as another aerial threat up forward. JUH is not there yet consistently and the cupboard is otherwise bare until Bruce gets back. Dunks spending time forward will also give Libba more opportunity to roll the sleeves up in the middle and get to work doing what he does best.

By the time Bruce comes back and we are (hopefully) still in contention in 2022, Dunks reverting back to more mid will be a potent weapon late in the season.

[MrMahatma]

That Adams guy who plays for the Lions seems a goer. He can take a good intercept grab, big body, takes on the gorillas a lot of the time.

[Mofra]

He's kicked 164.116 over his career. 58 percent without OOF.

Naughton

104.82 about 55 percent.

Taking the gold standard Dickson he was at 75 percent (181.61).

So Naughton or Casboult you're going to be losing your hair.
Early career Casboult, or later years Casboult?

8.4 this year
Since 2018 he's gone at 47 goals 28 behinds - again, his reputation as a poor kick for goal isn't borne out by his most recent years.
That's not accounting for the fact he demands a defender and can chop out in the ruck which helps the team and also means Naughton may get higher % shots on goal as he's not being double-teamed in the goal square.

Players do sometimes improve aspects of their play. It's a big reason why I'm such a fan of getting Anthony Rocca to the Bulldogs, as he turned Casboult from a god-awful kick for goal to one who is now better than average.
If he can help Levi he can help anyone.

[bornadog]

That Adams guy who plays for the Lions seems a goer. He can take a good intercept grab, big body, takes on the gorillas a lot of the time.

His biggest issue is he is not tall enough and hasn't got the leap to compensate. Struggles against the Hawkins, Lynches, Mackays and King types

[GVGjr]

His biggest issue is he is not tall enough and hasn't got the leap to compensate. Struggles against the Hawkins, Lynches, Mackays and King types

Tall enough for our back-up ruck man role though.

[Grantysghost]

Early career Casboult, or later years Casboult?

8.4 this year
Since 2018 he's gone at 47 goals 28 behinds - again, his reputation as a poor kick for goal isn't borne out by his most recent years.
That's not accounting for the fact he demands a defender and can chop out in the ruck which helps the team and also means Naughton may get higher % shots on goal as he's not being double-teamed in the goal square.

Players do sometimes improve aspects of their play. It's a big reason why I'm such a fan of getting Anthony Rocca to the Bulldogs, as he turned Casboult from a god-awful kick for goal to one who is now better than average.
If he can help Levi he can help anyone.

62 percent so definitely better as you say. Still around 6 out of 10. I just don't rate him, but you do make some worthwhile arguments that are hard to dismiss.

You've got me from no way I'd rather Barry Round, now; to no way I'd rather have Darren Jarman now :cool:

[Mofra]

62 percent so definitely better as you say. Still around 6 out of 10. I just don't rate him, but you do make some worthwhile arguments that are hard to dismiss.

You've got me from no way I'd rather Barry Round, now; to no way I'd rather have Darren Jarman now :cool:
It's all moot, as hopefully we get Josh Bruce back for next year - but will he play much after that?
Darcy & Marra won't be ready in 2023 to play as genuine KPFs (or KPD in Darcy's case) so I still think we look at options that are available.

In an ideal world we'd be able to grab a Darcy Cameron type (who can ruck and play forward) but the market is real thin for those types.

[azabob]

It's all moot, as hopefully we get Josh Bruce back for next year - but will he play much after that?
Darcy & Marra won't be ready in 2023 to play as genuine KPFs (or KPD in Darcy's case) so I still think we look at options that are available.

In an ideal world we'd be able to grab a Darcy Cameron type (who can ruck and play forward) but the market is real thin for those types.

The market is thin, but it appears we are not interested in those types.

[Mofra]

The market is thin, but it appears we are not interested in those types.
Yeah, as I say it's weird.
Some formerly "terrible" rucks that cost almost nothing are now performing well - Xerri and Hickey among them.
We've turned two DFAs into competent KPDs, and two more are playing AFL (Skinner & Sam Collins) and another recently taken by Geelong.

[DOG GOD]

Do you really want Dunkley kicking the ball? He is either in the middle doing the grunt work or he doesn't have a role.
He’s going to be kicking it wherever he is, and in all honesty, he’s got as much chance of kicking a goal from 30 out directly in front as Naughton has. What Dunkley offers is a good marking ability, and a great tackling ability in our fwd 50, which we are screaming out for. Libba has the best hands in the team and needs to be dead centre majority of his on ground time.
There is probably not a win/win scenario, but I’m just posing what would help the team better imo.

[macca]

That Adams guy who plays for the Lions seems a goer. He can take a good intercept grab, big body, takes on the gorillas a lot of the time.

He took 7 intercept marks against the Lions. His a big loss as he can play big and small. Has the strength, agility to play against the big bodies and can kick. The Lions have a depth of big markers there : Harris, Gardner, McStay,Adams , Fort and Big O. Don't you hate it.

[Mofra]

He took 7 intercept marks against the Lions. His a big loss as he can play big and small. Has the strength, agility to play against the big bodies and can kick. The Lions have a depth of big markers there : Harris, Gardner, McStay,Adams , Fort and Big O. Don't you hate it.
... and add Payne in the twos who apparently we rate (chasing him in previous trade periods), and Fullerton who has to work out whether he's a forward or ruck.

They'll get Hipwood back later this year too who is taller than expected (203cm!)

[Mofra]

I know he's under contract (not that means much anymore) but I wouldn't mind putting a watch out on Charlie Comben. Still a bit skinny and developing but plays forward/ruck and may be ready to go from 2024 in the post-Bruce era. Has shown glimpses.

Between Larkey, Xerri, Edwards and CCJ he might find opportunity hard to come by as he develops.

[soupman]

I know he's under contract (not that means much anymore) but I wouldn't mind putting a watch out on Charlie Comben. Still a bit skinny and developing but plays forward/ruck and may be ready to go from 2024 in the post-Bruce era. Has shown glimpses.

Between Larkey, Xerri, Edwards and CCJ he might find opportunity hard to come by as he develops.
Good suggestion.

Another to watch (along with Strachan and Meek) will be the West Coast version of Bailey Williams. Naitanui is injured and as far as I can tell Williams is next up, could be worth keeping tabs on in the event English does nominate a move west.

Was also thinking that if we do go down a pathway that see's Dunkley move elsewhere and Libba drop off would we be lookng at getting in a good second tier mid to shore up our midfield and if so would Liam Shiels be any interest? Had an amazing career for a non star, doesn't seem to be in the frame at Hawthorn and will be 31 at the start of next season. More as a 2-3 year thing as we try and uncover a younger version who can play that sacrificing role well (I don't really think the candidates on the list atm really fit what I'm after).

[macca]

... and add Payne in the twos who apparently we rate (chasing him in previous trade periods), and Fullerton who has to work out whether he's a forward or ruck.

They'll get Hipwood back later this year too who is taller than expected (203cm!)

I hate it even more they have sOOO many talls

What a good problem to have

[Mofra]

I hate it even more they have sOOO many talls

What a good problem to have
Not only have they scored well with academy kids, they also draft talls and have signed at least one non-traditional pathway tall (basketball) as well.

It's by design, not luck. Then Neale fell into their laps and they took a punt on Mitch Robinson, not to mention a free hit in Jarrod Lyons.

They have shaped their list remarkably well while we've pinned all our hopes on English, Sweet and a bunch of blokes who can still technically hang out with Snow White.

[Testekill]

English has to be our number 1 extension, he gives us a point of difference. Next is to aggressively chase a key defender and a forward that can pinch hit in the ruck.

[comrade]

English has to be our number 1 extension, he gives us a point of difference. Next is to aggressively chase a key defender and a forward that can pinch hit in the ruck.

I agree. He’s quickly becoming irreplaceable given the make up of our list and what else is available on the market.

I’d sooner lose Bazlenka.

[josie]

I agree. He’s quickly becoming irreplaceable given the make up of our list and what else is available on the market.

I’d sooner lose Bazlenka.

Oooo-that’s like Sophie’s Choice. Please let’s keep both. If Tim keeps up this form and asks for a trade he is going to be worth a lot..

[Axe Man]

Jay Clark: The "Fascinating" Salary Cap & Free Agency Situation At The Western Bulldogs (https://www.triplem.com.au/story/jay-clark-the-fascinating-salary-cap-free-agency-situation-at-the-western-bulldogs-199380?fbclid=IwAR1IkdxSuQlI07u2PQUJwOeRXX3Dacrg4ZlcuqAYWf-44tGMmuHNR3v0aXg)


Jay Clark says he expects the Western Bulldogs to be major free agency players this upcoming off-season, telling Triple M's Rush Hour the state of their list and contracts is "fascinating".

The Bulldogs are 3-5 after their loss to Port Adelaide last weekend, and with a host of their stars still out of contract, Jay-Z says there's a "juggling act" ahead for the Dogs.

"They've got a salary cap squeeze on," he explained.

"They've got a stacked midfield, they've got some talent up forward and in the backline they're ranked last for losing defensive one-on-one contests..."

Audio in the link but to summarise he throws up some ideas that have been brought up here many times - do we sacrifice a midfielder (names Dunkley) to bring in a tall defender? Throws up some fringe talls: Logue (Freo), McAsey (Adel), Marchbank (Carl), Joel Smith (Melb), Weideman (Melb) (turn him into a defender).

[Axe Man]

Western Bulldogs will scour the league for a prime key defender to bolster its back line for next year’s premiership tilt.

The Bulldogs are in the market for a strong-bodied key backman such as Fremantle’s Griffin Logue to address the defensive vulnerabilities which have been exposed this season.

Out-of-contract Brisbane big man Dan McStay could also be an option to help boost the Dogs key position stocks.

Luke Beveridge’s men have lost 37 per cent of their defensive contests – ranked 18th in the league.

They have also conceded 39 goals to key forwards this year – ranked 13th.

Former coach Rodney Eade said it was the obvious missing link for the Dogs after slipping to 10th spot with three wins from eight games ahead of Friday night’s crunch clash against Collingwood.

“When they play against good teams, that is going to catch them out,” Eade said on RSN.

“I know Luke has probably bristled at that in the past about tall defenders but going forward they need to really sit down and plan about how we are going to get some tall defenders in.”

Complicating matters is the salary cap squeeze on at the kennel as the Dogs attempt to re-sign a host of stars including Bailey Smith, Caleb Daniel, Tim English, Bailey Dale and Josh Dunkley.

Hard nut midfielder Dunkley, 25, would help free up salary cap space if he sought another trade request after failing to get to Essendon, but the club has held positive talks with him on a new deal.

Bulldogs’ list manager Sam Power also faces a tricky challenge finding the right man to beef-up the back end from the players potentially available this year.

In particular, the new stand rule has left backmen exposed and the Dogs’ reliance on their midfield to support the back line has fallen down this year after making last year’s Grand Final.

Logue looms as an attractive option but the Dogs would face a fight to land him as the 24-year-old has recently re-established himself as a key pillar in one of the best defences in the competition.

Likewise his Dockers’ teammate Alex Pearce, 26, remains out of contract at season’s end and has the ability to push for All-Australian selection throughout his prime according to former coach Ross Lyon.

The Dogs will also consider other injury-hit players and key forward options who could make the switch into the back line such as former Carlton stopper Liam Jones or Demon Sam Weideman.

Adelaide 197cm defender Fischer McAsey, a former pick six, has been on the outer at the Crows, Carlton’s Caleb Marchbank has returned from injury through the VFL, Melbourne’s Joel Smith is out again with injury, while Essendon’s Aaron Francis is a left-field candidate.

Demon Harrison Petty (2025), West Coast’s Tom Barrass (2026), Cat Jack Henry (2024) and Richmond’s Noah Balta (2023) have all recently recommitted.

The Dogs will prefer a taller key defender instead of a third option or smaller marking intercept player to fill the void on their list.

It is the clear priority for the club which has lost former Hawk Tim O’Brien to another soft tissue setback after securing him from Waverley last year.

Alex Keath, 30, will replace him in the team after overcoming a hamstring problem.

Link (https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/afl-trade-news-2022-keep-up-to-date-with-all-the-latest-contract-signings/news-story/472120de9ef5abef7a3d7b9643e09c7c)

[bornadog]

Ruck backup, cough, cough

[GVGjr]

I know it's just an article but 8 games into the season the club will look for a KP defender at the end of the season during trade period. We seem to be a year later in identifying that gap.

It's a bit of a strange article that identifies that we are in a salary cap squeeze but we will also be in the market for an established key defender.

[azabob]

I know it's just an article but 8 games into the season the club will look for a KP defender at the end of the season during trade period. We seem to be a year later in identifying that gap.

It's a bit of a strange article that identifies that we are in a salary cap squeeze but we will also be in the market for an established key defender.

I think the jurno is suggesting we will trade out Dunkley or someone else to free up cap space. But yeah… odd.

[Vred]

I think the jurno is suggesting we will trade out Dunkley or someone else to free up cap space. But yeah… odd.

I've come to terms with losing one of our vaunted midfielders to make way for a KPD. Although I actually think we retain Dunkley and lose someone like Dale / CD instead, I know Dale would fetch us something pretty good on the open market, sucks to lose him tho, but face it, we're 18th now for losing 1v1's in the backline, that needs to be fixed asap.

[Grantysghost]

I've come to terms with losing one of our vaunted midfielders to make way for a KPD. Although I actually think we retain Dunkley and lose someone like Dale / CD instead, I know Dale would fetch us something pretty good on the open market, sucks to lose him tho, but face it, we're 18th now for losing 1v1's in the backline, that needs to be fixed asap.

Bevo will never part with an established player imo.

[whythelongface]

I've come to terms with losing one of our vaunted midfielders to make way for a KPD. Although I actually think we retain Dunkley and lose someone like Dale / CD instead, I know Dale would fetch us something pretty good on the open market, sucks to lose him tho, but face it, we're 18th now for losing 1v1's in the backline, that needs to be fixed asap.

No way we lose Dale. He is close to our most consistent player. Not only is he an offensive weapon but his defence is getting better and better. He is effective at spoiling and being at the contest. A game high 11 marks last night also shows he gets himself in the right position whether that be defensively taking some intercepts or busting his gut to find position to provide an attacking option. Players running off the HBF are gold and with a developing forward line are critical for us to be challenging over the next few years.

[comrade]

No way we lose Dale. He is close to our most consistent player. Not only is he an offensive weapon but his defence is getting better and better. He is effective at spoiling and being at the contest. A game high 11 marks last night also shows he gets himself in the right position whether that be defensively taking some intercepts or busting his gut to find position to provide an attacking option. Players running off the HBF are gold and with a developing forward line are critical for us to be challenging over the next few years.

Yeah, after waiting years for the penny to drop with Dale, I’d hate to see him go now he’s finally approaching elite status. He’s a must sign.

[josie]

I’ve had him in best 4 almost all of not every week this year. Dale is a must keep. If I had to choose between him and Dunks it would be Dale. If I had to choose between him and Daniel I’d cry first and then possibly still choose Dale. I think he in our top 10 most important players and IMO very high up the list, my rough order (Bont, Naughts, Dale, English, Keath, Bruce, Smith, Treloar, Daniel, Libba).

[comrade]

I’ve had him in best 4 almost all of not every week this year. Dale is a must keep. If I had to choose between him and Dunks it would be Dale. If I had to choose between him and Daniel I’d cry first and then possibly still choose Dale. I think he in our top 10 most important players and IMO very high up the list, my rough order (Bont, Naughts, Dale, English, Keath, Bruce, Smith, Treloar, Daniel, Libba).

At 25, he’s likely got another 5 or so years of elite football in him. Every other club would kill to have his foot skills.

[azabob]

We need to be ruthless with our delistings.
I’m on the record over the past two years being concerned that we were not able to hit the draft due to Darcy and JUH and how much it will impact our next tier of talent coming through. The other part to this is previously we have been very conservative in delisting fringe players.

Simply put we need to hit the draft with 5-6 picks and make the picks count

[comrade]

We need to be ruthless with our delistings.
I’m on the record over the past two years being concerned that we were not able to hit the draft due to Darcy and JUH and how much it will impact our next tier of talent coming through. The other part to this is previously we have been very conservative in delisting fringe players.

Simply put we need to hit the draft with 5-6 picks and make the picks count

Yeah, we’ve held on to a few we shouldn’t have, in positions we already have ample cover (West and Wallis for example). We also need to spread our picks over different types, especially later. Speculate on ruck and key position talent, rather than mids and flankers.

[Swoop]

I'm of the opposite view, we have had Pick 1 and 2 in the draft over the past two years. That's provided us with top end talent despite our ladder position and we've still been able to use later speculative picks in covid affected years where there has been less exposed form which gives us a chance to steal players later in the draft. I don't see how our draft concessions have worked against us.

[bornadog]

I'm of the opposite view, we have had Pick 1 and 2 in the draft over the past two years. That's provided us with top end talent despite our ladder position and we've still been able to use later speculative picks in covid affected years where there has been less exposed form which gives us a chance to steal players later in the draft. I don't see how our draft concessions have worked against us.

Agree Swoop, we can't complain getting those two top end draft picks and at the same time turning over 5 to 6 players each year.

I would have liked to see us Rookie some more talls, including a rookie Ruck and tall Backman.

[The Doctor]

This year we will enter the trade period with most likely 3 picks in the top 40. It's looking like a good draft. I hope we use them at the draft.

[The Doctor]

Ralph reporting Lobb and Logue from Freo are among our targets.

[DOG GOD]

Ralph reporting Lobb and Logue from Freo are among our targets.
Logue had 29 disposals and 11 marks against GC today in average conditions.

[kruder]

Yeah Lobb is such an inconsistent player I would hesitate paying him big coin.

Logue is developing nicely isn’t he a WA boy? I wouldn’t be leaving Fremantle now.

[bornadog]

Yeah Lobb is such an inconsistent player I would hesitate paying him big coin.

Logue is developing nicely isn’t he a WA boy? I wouldn’t be leaving Fremantle now.

Yes he is from WA. Only 193cm, same height as Tim O'Brien. Is he really the backman we are looking for?

[GVGjr]

Yes he is from WA. Only 193cm, same height as Tim O'Brien. Is he really the backman we are looking for?

We made a play for the 190cm Steven May a few years back didn't we and Jake Lever is 194cm and we would happily take both/either of them if they were interested. In most cases if you are good enough you are tall enough. We also let the 197cm Lewis Young go so I don't think height for heights sake is a strong consideration for us.

I'm not sure Logue is exactly what we need but a couple of cm's of height isn't the issue from my perspective. He can play on all sizes of forwards so he's versatile but my question on him is more around if he is durable enough. I think he is also more of a 1 v 1 type defender which might appeal to us.

Gardner, Keath, O'Brien and in a few years time maybe Darcy is a decent starting point for key defenders but we do need to find someone else as well. At 24yo he could be a solid addition but we are probably at long odds to land him.

[Vred]

Ralph reporting Lobb and Logue from Freo are among our targets.

Hard no to Lobb, big pass from me. I'd take Hammer back from Freo specially if he comes for next to nothing, and Pearce is the one I'd really be chasing.

[FrediKanoute]

I'm of the opposite view, we have had Pick 1 and 2 in the draft over the past two years. That's provided us with top end talent despite our ladder position and we've still been able to use later speculative picks in covid affected years where there has been less exposed form which gives us a chance to steal players later in the draft. I don't see how our draft concessions have worked against us.

I am worried about JUH. I watched via stream a quarter and a half of the VFL game and he was politely underwhelming. Add to the body of work presented whilst in the senior side, along with he senior and reserves form of last year and I have a feeling he will be a bust. He lacks urgency/intensity and I am not sure that we can coach that out of him. I would be inclined to do a deal with North/the Hawks/Essendon and prise some draft picks out of them that we can use on "our type of players".

[jeemak]

We made a play for the 190cm Steven May a few years back didn't we and Jake Lever is 194cm and we would happily take both/either of them if they were interested. In most cases if you are good enough you are tall enough. We also let the 197cm Lewis Young go so I don't think height for heights sake is a strong consideration for us.

I'm not sure Logue is exactly what we need but a couple of cm's of height isn't the issue from my perspective. He can play on all sizes of forwards so he's versatile but my question on him is more around if he is durable enough. I think he is also more of a 1 v 1 type defender which might appeal to us.

Gardner, Keath, O'Brien and in a few years time maybe Darcy is a decent starting point for key defenders but we do need to find someone else as well. At 24yo he could be a solid addition but we are probably at long odds to land him.

Steven May is 193cm tall. And that's plenty tall enough to nullify most contests, and win plenty of others in a team oriented defence.

[GVGjr]

Steven May is 193cm tall. And that's plenty tall enough to nullify most contests, and win plenty of others in a team oriented defence.

Logue is the same height and he is deemed too small. At 193cm that is tall enough if you have some athletic traits..

[jeemak]

Logue is the same height and he is deemed too small. At 193cm that is tall enough if you have some athletic traits.

By whom is he deemed too small? BAD?

BAD is an extremely body conscious poster........you know that! :p

[MrMahatma]

I am worried about JUH. I watched via stream a quarter and a half of the VFL game and he was politely underwhelming. Add to the body of work presented whilst in the senior side, along with he senior and reserves form of last year and I have a feeling he will be a bust. He lacks urgency/intensity and I am not sure that we can coach that out of him. I would be inclined to do a deal with North/the Hawks/Essendon and prise some draft picks out of them that we can use on "our type of players".

Nah, he’ll come good. Very young. Tough role to play. Has the skills.

[bornadog]

By whom is he deemed too small? BAD?

BAD is an extremely body conscious poster........you know that! :p

Let's see Logue up against Lynch, or the King Brothers and then you will agree with me.

[hujsh]

Let's see Logue up against Lynch, or the King Brothers and then you will agree with me.

How does May go against them?

[bornadog]

How does May go against them?

Lynch has kicked a couple, but the whole team didn't play well, this year or last against Melbourne.

King also kicked a couple last year.

Hard to tell from stats, but surely you get my drift when you are up against 200cm plus forwards with talent.

[hujsh]

Lynch has kicked a couple, but the whole team didn't play well, this year or last against Melbourne.

King also kicked a couple last year.

Hard to tell from stats, but surely you get my drift when you are up against 200cm plus forwards with talent.

Maybe the opposite is also true and you could see why dismissing Logue based just on a couple of centimetres might be a bit misguided without other factors to inform your judgement?

[Happy Days]

You know who did beat May? Aaron Naughton. That was pretty sweet.

[GVGjr]

Just had a look at some commentary around Logues draft year

Logue tested superbly at the AFL National Combine in October, recording a big vertical leap of 71cm, running right foot jump 91cm, 3.03 second 20 metre speed, 15.1 beep test, 9.58 minute 3km run and 25.09 second repeat speed.

He seems to have the right mix of athletic traits but I wonder if he is durable enough for us.

Logue went at pick 8 in his draft year and the other players Fremantle drafted were tall defenders and a ruckman and this was after trading for Hamling. No messing around at addressing a small back line or a lack of taller players.

Draft pick 38 - Sean Darcy
Draft pick 41 - Brennan Cox
Draft pick 66 - Luke Ryan

[azabob]

He seems to have the right mix of athletic traits but I wonder if he is durable enough for us.

Logue went at pick 8 in his draft year and the other players Fremantle drafted were tall defenders and a ruckman and this was after trading for Hamling. No messing around at addressing a small back line or a lack of taller players.

Draft pick 38 - Sean Darcy
Draft pick 41 - Brennan Cox
Draft pick 66 - Luke Ryan

Or on the flip side he could fit right in!

Great observation in list management by Fremantle in addressing key position stocks.

[Happy Days]

My recollection of it is Logue was a bit of a reach based on his testing results and him being from WA, but to me he definitely looks the part. We’d have to give up something pretty significant though.

[Danjul]

This conversation seems to be suggesting the dogs need a tall player.

Recent history shows they don’t recognise them. And I suspect that history is well known by potential players. They won’t come unless as a last resort.

From the AFL website, not written by a Bulldog supporter.


Schache selection reaps rewards
There was some surprise when Josh Schache was included in the side to tackle the Demons given the Dogs' set of tall forwards. Schache started against Demons big man Luke Jackson but also spent time matched up against Ben Brown and Tom McDonald and played well across the night, finishing with 17 disposals and six marks. His inclusion was more valuable than the Dogs would have expected, though, given Keath's hamstring injury early in the first term left them a key defender down.

This about a tall who has also been our best goal kicker at times, as recently as two weeks ago when he also played a half on the back line.

And now they are not seen as being in our top 30 players ???

That game was against the top of the ladder and now we are worried about defeating the Suns?

A squad can go from grand final to worried about the Suns? Is it some form of joke?

[bornadog]

Maybe the opposite is also true and you could see why dismissing Logue based just on a couple of centimetres might be a bit misguided without other factors to inform your judgement?

more like 10 plus centimetres.

The human race is getting bigger and bigger.

The King brothers are 202,
McKay is 204
Tom Lynch 199
Hawkins 198
Himmelberg (Crows) 200
Peter Wright 203
Hipwood 203
Ben Brown 200

and then you look at Darcy at 207 which will be the new norm.

Bont is 193cm.

I know height isn't everything, but for me we have to start looking at a fullback around the 200cm mark who obviously can play.

I am sick of these big forwards kicking lots of goals because our guys are pip squeaks.

[Bulldog Joe]

This conversation seems to be suggesting the dogs need a tall player.

Recent history shows they don’t recognise them. And I suspect that history is well known by potential players. They won’t come unless as a last resort.

From the AFL website, not written by a Bulldog supporter.


Schache selection reaps rewards
There was some surprise when Josh Schache was included in the side to tackle the Demons given the Dogs' set of tall forwards. Schache started against Demons big man Luke Jackson but also spent time matched up against Ben Brown and Tom McDonald and played well across the night, finishing with 17 disposals and six marks. His inclusion was more valuable than the Dogs would have expected, though, given Keath's hamstring injury early in the first term left them a key defender down.

This about a tall who has also been our best goal kicker at times, as recently as two weeks ago when he also played a half on the back line.

And now they are not seen as being in our top 30 players ???

That game was against the top of the ladder and now we are worried about defeating the Suns?

A squad can go from grand final to worried about the Suns? Is it some form of joke?




I am certainly with you on this.

We consistently refuse to pick tall players based on what they can't do and all our talls are expected to mobile and good at ground level.

Under Beveridge we have quickly closed off the career of an All Australian Ruckman and actively removed Premiership Talls in Roughead and Roberts. Plus a reasonable back-up ruck in Campbell.

We also recruited and then dismissed Trengove based on the same criteria

We have also seen Hamling and Adams choose to go elsewhere, while Boyd has retired with different issues.

Throughout all this we have consistently played undersized in defence.

Why would any tall choose to play under Beveridge.

[GVGjr]

Or on the flip side he could fit right in!

Great observation in list management by Fremantle in addressing key position stocks.

The following year they went after Brayshaw and Cerra so it looks like when they identify a gap they go hard to cover their needs.

[GVGjr]

My recollection of it is Logue was a bit of a reach based on his testing results and him being from WA, but to me he definitely looks the part. We’d have to give up something pretty significant though.

It probably comes down to if Fremantle see themselves as genuine contenders or not.
A draft pick might interest them if there is a local boy they are very interested in.

[bornadog]

I am certainly with you on this.

We consistently refuse to pick tall players based on what they can't do and all our talls are expected to mobile and good at ground level.

Under Beveridge we have quickly closed off the career of an All Australian Ruckman and actively removed Premiership Talls in Roughead and Roberts. Plus a reasonable back-up ruck in Campbell.

We also recruited and then dismissed Trengove based on the same criteria

We have also seen Hamling and Adams choose to go elsewhere, while Boyd has retired with different issues.

Throughout all this we have consistently played undersized in defence.

Why would any tall choose to play under Beveridge.


I don't agree with your assessment of Bevo. Bevo is looking for a particular type of tall.

Of all the players you listed, Hamling is the one I would not have let go.

Under Bevo the talls we have recruited are English, Naughton, Schache, Bruce, Gardner, Keath, Sweet, Martin, JUH and Darcy

[GVGjr]

By whom is he deemed too small? BAD?

BAD is an extremely body conscious poster........you know that! :p

Posts have confirmed he is very invested in his WAH principles in assessing players. (Weight, Age and Height) :)
Form and ability is more of a tie breaker consideration.

[GVGjr]

I am certainly with you on this.

We consistently refuse to pick tall players based on what they can't do and all our talls are expected to mobile and good at ground level.

Under Beveridge we have quickly closed off the career of an All Australian Ruckman and actively removed Premiership Talls in Roughead and Roberts. Plus a reasonable back-up ruck in Campbell.

We also recruited and then dismissed Trengove based on the same criteria

We have also seen Hamling and Adams choose to go elsewhere, while Boyd has retired with different issues.

Throughout all this we have consistently played undersized in defence.

Why would any tall choose to play under Beveridge.

Lewis Young was also played out of position and he seems to be going better now as a defender with Carlton.
I don't think we had many options with Hamling but at 194cm he's just a cm taller than Logue.

[hujsh]

more like 10 plus centimetres.

The human race is getting bigger and bigger.

The King brothers are 202,
McKay is 204
Tom Lynch 199
Hawkins 198
Himmelberg (Crows) 200
Peter Wright 203
Hipwood 203
Ben Brown 200

and then you look at Darcy at 207 which will be the new norm.

Bont is 193cm.

I know height isn't everything, but for me we have to start looking at a fullback around the 200cm mark who obviously can play.

I am sick of these big forwards kicking lots of goals because our guys are pip squeaks.

Now now, I'm pretty sure you're aware I'm referring to the criteria you'd accept there. Are you saying if we were recruiting someone 195/96 cm tall you'd say "Nah he's too short to play on Max King"?

Obviously a 200 cm backman with the agility and speed of a Naughton would be great, but there are plenty of backmen in the league (like Steven May) who manage to compete and win despite the huge 7cm difference. All I care about is if they can do the job. 193/94 cm is close to bottom end of how tall you'd want a key defender to be but if he has a good leap, good positioning etc that prevents him from being beaten consistently then I don't think it matters.

Based on how he is rated (I've honestly not seen him play or looked for him enough to judge for myself) I suspect he does have the qualities needed to compete and win. Especially in a team defence when a midfield is doing it's part

[Happy Days]

I am certainly with you on this.

We consistently refuse to pick tall players based on what they can't do and all our talls are expected to mobile and good at ground level.

Under Beveridge we have quickly closed off the career of an All Australian Ruckman and actively removed Premiership Talls in Roughead and Roberts. Plus a reasonable back-up ruck in Campbell.

We also recruited and then dismissed Trengove based on the same criteria

We have also seen Hamling and Adams choose to go elsewhere, while Boyd has retired with different issues.

Throughout all this we have consistently played undersized in defence.

Why would any tall choose to play under Beveridge.

I don’t really think this is fair and there are reasons beyond selection for anyone of quality that you’ve listed for moving on. Hamling’s dad, Adams’ frustration with the medical staff, and Boyd isn’t reasonable to even bring up.

Roughead being the possible exception (if you ignore how full on bad he was in 2017), the other guys were not AFL quality when they were delisted, which is evident from the lack of teams picking them up when they were moved on.

Meanwhile we’ve seen Beveridge develop Naughton and English into genuine match winning key position players, and the brightest tall talent the club has probably ever seen. We’ve also invested heavily and repeatedly in free agency and at the very top of the draft during Bevo’s time in key position stock, and consistent opportunity has been given to guys like Gardner and Cordy, for better or worse, to establish themselves.

Are we a key defender and a ruck short? Probably, if only by one guy. But I’m not gonna lose sleep over any of those names and doubt we’re really any better off with any of them in our side right now. I’m more frustrated with our inability to turn Lipinski into a consistent contributor than Marcus Adams.

[MrMahatma]

more like 10 plus centimetres.

The human race is getting bigger and bigger.

The King brothers are 202,
McKay is 204
Tom Lynch 199
Hawkins 198
Himmelberg (Crows) 200
Peter Wright 203
Hipwood 203
Ben Brown 200

and then you look at Darcy at 207 which will be the new norm.

Bont is 193cm.

I know height isn't everything, but for me we have to start looking at a fullback around the 200cm mark who obviously can play.

I am sick of these big forwards kicking lots of goals because our guys are pip squeaks.

Keath = 200cm
Gardiner = 197
Pip-squeaks?

Sure, they're not 210cm but they should be able to compete with the guys you've listed.

[Happy Days]

Zach Reid still isn’t signed up at Essendon and has looked pretty good in the last few weeks. Surely he’d rather play somewhere else?

[comrade]

Zach Reid still isn’t signed up at Essendon and has looked pretty good in the last few weeks. Surely he’d rather play somewhere else?

They’d ask for Marra. Would you do it?

[Happy Days]

They’d ask for Marra. Would you do it?

No, but I feel dirty for thinking about it.

They can’t be feeling too great that none of their haul from the Best Draft Hand Ever have re-signed.

[Grantysghost]

They’d ask for Marra. Would you do it?

A 200 cm top ten defender.... God. No defintely not. I mean...no... Well.. Maybe.. Ah.. nope.

I would consider another though.

[Grantysghost]

No, but I feel dirty for thinking about it.

They can’t be feeling too great that none of their haul from the Best Draft Hand Ever have re-signed.

From what I've seen Perkins looks the pick of the bunch

[Bulldog Joe]

I don't agree with your assessment of Bevo. Bevo is looking for a particular type of tall.

Of all the players you listed, Hamling is the one I would not have let go.

Under Bevo the talls we have recruited are English, Naughton, Schache, Bruce, Gardner, Keath, Sweet, Martin, JUH and Darcy

Of those
English, Naughton, Gardner and Keath fit the mobility mantra.

Martin was a (reluctant) concession that we needed to do something about the ruck and also a player who was more mobile (but unfortunately before we got him)

Schache has not established himself (or been allowed to settle) due to his perceived weaknesses (lack of aggression etc, ability below his knees perhaps) - displays a lack of confidence
Sweet has absolutely been underplayed with resulting clear issues in confidence.
JUH is in danger of going the same way as Schache.
Darcy is still a mystery with 1 game on managed minutes.

You need to add Trengove, who was specifically targeted and effectively spat out due to the lack of mobility issues that also saw the demise of Roughead and Roberts.

I agree that Bevo is looking for a particular type of tall, but it appears he wants Max Gawn with the mobility and ground skills of Marcus Bontempelli.

He has consistently refused to play those who can't do what he wants, rather than develop a plan that makes the most of what players can do.

EDIT
As pointed out from my earlier post we have Lewis Young as someone recruited, who showed something but was never allowed to settle (Schache treatment) and his lack of confidence /development has seen him move on to Carlton, who despite having plenty of talls have been able to get him to play a role consistently.

[comrade]

A 200 cm top ten defender.... God. No defintely not. I mean...no... Well.. Maybe.. Ah.. nope.

I would consider another though.

I would hate to see Marra explode at Essendon. Another club, I could handle if the deal was right.

[Axe Man]

Logue set a Freo club record with 17 intercepts on the weekend to go with a career high 29 disposals, 6 intercept marks and 3 coaches votes. He would be fantastic regardless of his height (officially 194cm and 98kgs) but surely they aren't letting him go.

[bornadog]

Keath = 200cm
Gardiner = 197
Pip-squeaks?

Sure, they're not 210cm but they should be able to compete with the guys you've listed.

Keath is also 197

[comrade]

Logue set a Freo club record with 17 intercepts on the weekend to go with a career high 29 disposals, 6 intercept marks and 3 coaches votes. He would be fantastic regardless of his height (officially 194cm and 98kgs) but surely they aren't letting him go.

Yeah, unlikely they give him up even if we offer to pay through the nose. I hope we try as hard as we can though, the exact type of player we should be bringing into the club.

[hujsh]

Yeah, unlikely they give him up even if we offer to pay through the nose. I hope we try as hard as we can though, the exact type of player we should be bringing into the club.

They seem to have 4 Key Defenders who would all want to be playing senior football. I guess the question is can we get one of Logue, Pearce or Cox (is he good? He's been playing for them and is 195cm at 24ish years of age) or even Hamling?

[Axe Man]

They seem to have 4 Key Defenders who would all want to be playing senior football. I guess the question is can we get one of Logue, Pearce or Cox (is he good? He's been playing for them and is 195cm at 24ish years of age) or even Hamling?

Hamling is the one I feel the Dockers would be willing to lose. He is 29 and has struggled to get on the park for the past 2 seasons and seems to be behind the other 3 now. He's contracted until the end of 2023 and reportedly on a decent amount so they may be willing to give him up for very little to ensure they can keep players like Logue.

[Danjul]

Hamling is the one I feel the Dockers would be willing to lose. He is 29 and has struggled to get on the park for the past 2 seasons and seems to be behind the other 3 now. He's contracted until the end of 2023 and reportedly on a decent amount so they may be willing to give him up for very little to ensure they can keep players like Logue.
Just the characteristics we need???

We should be developing the players we have to the best of their ability and giving them experience in their natural role.

We have a good list. But only some players are seen to fit the ‘requirements’ and the rest are wasted.

[hujsh]

Hamling is the one I feel the Dockers would be willing to lose. He is 29 and has struggled to get on the park for the past 2 seasons and seems to be behind the other 3 now. He's contracted until the end of 2023 and reportedly on a decent amount so they may be willing to give him up for very little to ensure they can keep players like Logue.

Worth trying for one of the others first though. We don't exactly have a developing young Key Defender on the list (aside from maybe Darcy but who knows where he'll end up) so someone with more than 2-3 years left would be nice. If we pry out Hamling as a consolation prize it's not the worst outcome ever either

[comrade]

Just the characteristics we need???

We should be developing the players we have to the best of their ability and giving them experience in their natural role.

We have a good list. But only some players are seen to fit the ‘requirements’ and the rest are wasted.

We don’t have enough genuine key defensive talent on the list, especially now that Keath’s body is starting to become more fragile.

[hujsh]

We don’t have enough genuine key defensive talent on the list, especially now that Keath’s body is starting to become more fragile.

It felt a lot more secure with the idea Schache would be playing back this year but that seems to be a bust as of round 1 and I have no clue what the plan is for him anymore.

[Bulldog Joe]

It felt a lot more secure with the idea Schache would be playing back this year but that seems to be a bust as of round 1 and I have no clue what the plan is for him anymore.

The plan for Schache now seems to play him at Footscray whenever he is not required as the Medical Sub.

His position at Footscray also seems to have evolved to play wherever we are lacking other tall players this week.

[Grantysghost]

The plan for Schache now seems to play him at Footscray whenever he is not required as the Medical Sub.

His position at Footscray also seems to have evolved to play wherever we are lacking other tall players this week.

We need to play him at the end of the season to pump up his trade value!

[hujsh]

We need to play him at the end of the season to pump up his trade value!

From a burger to a burger and fries?

[jeemak]

Who's Lewis Young keeping out of the side at Carlton presently?

[Grantysghost]

From a burger to a burger and fries?

Maybe we could get 2 games, shoe hire, hot dog, fries and a coke. (ads work).

[azabob]

Who's Lewis Young keeping out of the side at Carlton presently?

No one. Carlton have a few injuries in the backend.
He wasn’t in their best 22 for the first few weeks.

[Danjul]

It felt a lot more secure with the idea Schache would be playing back this year but that seems to be a bust as of round 1 and I have no clue what the plan is for him anymore.
Round one was a bust for much of the team. 44 hitouts to 20 and 10 more scoring shots gave Melbourne a lot of drive.

Schache played well at both ends against Adelaide and got dropped (after the usual 1 game sequence ) and others who were worse stayed in. Schache got 2 goals in the second half when he went to the forward line because it was breaking down. It had only kicked 3 goals in the first half. But In the second half Walker became dominant and the backline couldn’t hold up.

That one point loss was a disgrace and some supporters are still angry.

[Danjul]

No one. Carlton have a few injuries in the backend.
He wasn’t in their best 22 for the first few weeks.

Young had 28 marks in his last 3 games. I think Carlton is probably happy with that.

Especially combined with his 45 disposals.

A superstar compared to what we are seeing.

[jeemak]

Young had 28 marks in his last 3 games. I think Carlton is probably happy with that.

Especially combined with his 45 disposals.

A superstar compared to what we are seeing.

Fairly comparable with Gardner, though is getting more of the footy and has really picked up his disposal efficiency. Not sure how much of it is sharing the footy around in defence prior to launch, as I don't watch enough of Carlton, but it's not something we use Gardner for.

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?playerStatus1=A&tid1=4&playerStatus2=A&tid2=8&type=A&pid1=6374&pid2=4215&fid1=S&fid2=S

[Happy Days]

Fairly comparable with Gardner, though is getting more of the footy and has really picked up his disposal efficiency. Not sure how much of it is sharing the footy around in defence prior to launch, as I don't watch enough of Carlton, but it's not something we use Gardner for.

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?playerStatus1=A&tid1=4&playerStatus2=A&tid2=8&type=A&pid1=6374&pid2=4215&fid1=S&fid2=S

Young also has a considerably worse one on one defensive winning percentage than Gardner (more losses from less contests), despite playing with Jacob Weitering and therefore on by and large far worse players than Gards has had to without Keath.

He sure can get on the end of that switch kick though.

[jeemak]

Young also has a considerably worse one on one defensive winning percentage than Gardner (more losses from less contests), despite playing with Jacob Weitering and therefore on by and large far worse players than Gards has had to without Keath.

He sure can get on the end of that switch kick though.

I'd be interested in seeing those stats if they're available.

[Happy Days]

I'd be interested in seeing those stats if they're available.

https://www.afl.com.au/stats/leaders?category=Defence&seasonId=43&roundId=-1&roundNumber=0&sortColumn=tackles&sortDirection=descending&positions=All&teams=All&benchmarking=false&dataType=totals

[GVGjr]

Who's Lewis Young keeping out of the side at Carlton presently?

It will be interesting to see if he holds his spot but losing Jones and Marchbank and McGovern being injured he's been a handy player for them.
With Pittonet out maybe Carlton does a Bevo and let him slide into the relief ruck spot for a period of time.

[GVGjr]

Young had 28 marks in his last 3 games. I think Carlton is probably happy with that.

Especially combined with his 45 disposals.

A superstar compared to what we are seeing.

The Carlton supporters I know are very happy with him. Lets see if he can hold his spot.

[G-Mo77]

Had we actually played Young he may have stayed and we'd have some depth in defence.

With Keath's continuing issues with soft tissue it's a real concern going forward and I'm certainly not comfortable with O'Brien being the one and only back up.

[Danjul]

Young also has a considerably worse one on one defensive winning percentage than Gardner (more losses from less contests), despite playing with Jacob Weitering and therefore on by and large far worse players than Gards has had to without Keath.

He sure can get on the end of that switch kick though.

False. Your stats averages are

contested defence one-on-1 Young 3.2 Gardner 2.4. O’Brien 2.6. Cordy 0.4
loss. Young 1.2 Gardner 0.7. O’Brien 1.2. Cordy 0.3
win. Young 2. Gardner 1.7 O’Brien 1.4 Cordy 0.1

so Young had more of these contests and won more.

So At worst Young seems to be comparable to (Gardner who is impressing everyone with his improvement this year) and O’Brien (who has impressed everyone as a great pick up this year).

Actually, the one who surprised me in those stats was Sweet. He scored very highly in some categories. Thanks for sharing the link.

[Bulldog Joe]

False. Your stats averages are

contested defence one-on-1 Young 3.2 Gardner 2.4. O’Brien 2.6. Cordy 0.4
loss. Young 1.2 Gardner 0.7. O’Brien 1.2. Cordy 0.3
win. Young 2. Gardner 1.7 O’Brien 1.4 Cordy 0.1

so Young had more of these contests and won more.

So At worst Young seems to be comparable to (Gardner who is impressing everyone with his improvement this year) and O’Brien (who has impressed everyone as a great pick up this year).

Actually, the one who surprised me in those stats was Sweet. He scored very highly in some categories. Thanks for sharing the link.

Keep in mind that the Sweet stats can only be for 1 game.

Lets see how he backs it up for as long as the MC decide he can get a game.

[Danjul]

Keep in mind that the Sweet stats can only be for 1 game.

Lets see how he backs it up for as long as the MC decide he can get a game.
Agree.

But from what I have read I thought it was beyond him. That’s why I was surprised.

[jeemak]

False. Your stats averages are

contested defence one-on-1 Young 3.2 Gardner 2.4. O’Brien 2.6. Cordy 0.4
loss. Young 1.2 Gardner 0.7. O’Brien 1.2. Cordy 0.3
win. Young 2. Gardner 1.7 O’Brien 1.4 Cordy 0.1

so Young had more of these contests and won more.

So At worst Young seems to be comparable to (Gardner who is impressing everyone with his improvement this year) and O’Brien (who has impressed everyone as a great pick up this year).

Actually, the one who surprised me in those stats was Sweet. He scored very highly in some categories. Thanks for sharing the link.

Lewis Young has lost 36.8% of defencive contests, Gardner 27.3%. I'm not sure how many each neutralises versus wins. Anyway, that's ~30% more losses for Young.

On average Young loses 1.2 per game, Gardner 0.7 per game. That's ~53% more.

[Grantysghost]

Lewis Young has lost 36.8% of defencive contests, Gardner 27.3%. I'm not sure how many each neutralises versus wins. Anyway, that's ~30% more losses for Young.

On average Young loses 1.2 per game, Gardner 0.7 per game. That's ~53% more.

Now you've gone done it.

[hujsh]

Lewis Young has lost 36.8% of defencive contests, Gardner 27.3%. I'm not sure how many each neutralises versus wins. Anyway, that's ~30% more losses for Young.

On average Young loses 1.2 per game, Gardner 0.7 per game. That's ~53% more.

Keath is 18% for comparison

May and Logue comfortably the best 2 in the league despite bring woefully undersized (sorry BAD nothing nasty meant by it)

[azabob]

I preferred it when we argued over players height.
These other stats are making my head hurt.

[Grantysghost]

I preferred it when we argued over players height.
These other stats are making my head hurt.

All you need to know is Lewis Young and Casboult are crap.

Gardner is good.

Sweet jury is out.

[azabob]

All you need to know is Lewis Young and Casboult are crap.

Gardner is good.

Sweet jury is out.
Granty! I thought there was an embargo on calling Casbault anything until this time next week?!?

[Grantysghost]

Granty! I thought there was an embargo on calling Casbault anything until this time next week?!?

Haha.

https://media.giphy.com/media/DhfjlI8nXxnGUkdfvt/giphy.gif

[Happy Days]

False. Your stats averages are

contested defence one-on-1 Young 3.2 Gardner 2.4. O’Brien 2.6. Cordy 0.4
loss. Young 1.2 Gardner 0.7. O’Brien 1.2. Cordy 0.3
win. Young 2. Gardner 1.7 O’Brien 1.4 Cordy 0.1

so Young had more of these contests and won more.

So At worst Young seems to be comparable to (Gardner who is impressing everyone with his improvement this year) and O’Brien (who has impressed everyone as a great pick up this year).

Actually, the one who surprised me in those stats was Sweet. He scored very highly in some categories. Thanks for sharing the link.


Lewis Young has lost 36.8% of defencive contests, Gardner 27.3%. I'm not sure how many each neutralises versus wins. Anyway, that's ~30% more losses for Young.

On average Young loses 1.2 per game, Gardner 0.7 per game. That's ~53% more.

Damn you hate to see it.

[Danjul]

Lewis Young has lost 36.8% of defencive contests, Gardner 27.3%. I'm not sure how many each neutralises versus wins. Anyway, that's ~30% more losses for Young.

On average Young loses 1.2 per game, Gardner 0.7 per game. That's ~53% more.

the original comment said more losses from LESS contests. Young had more contests. He won more contests and he lost more contests.

because percentage is a relative concept it is meaningless without its context. 80% of 30 is the same as 30% of 80.

when you look at the absolute values both Young and Gardner are having good seasons,.

The quality of their opponents I can’t comment on so I will have to accept other assessment there.

The most meaningful stats for the evening are the ones you presented. Where one is slightly ahead in some components of the game the other makes up for it elsewhere.

[Danjul]

All you need to know is Lewis Young and Casboult are crap.

Gardner is good.

Sweet jury is out.

jeemak’s figures




$454,000
AFL Fantasy Price
$381,000


58.2
AFL Fantasy Score
46.0


$394,700
Supercoach Price
$312,400


76.7
Supercoach Score
59.7



all 4 say Young is 25% better than Gardner.

What did we get in return from Carlton?

[Grantysghost]

jeemak’s figures




$454,000
AFL Fantasy Price
$381,000


58.2
AFL Fantasy Score
46.0


$394,700
Supercoach Price
$312,400


76.7
Supercoach Score
59.7



all 4 say Young is 25% better than Gardner.

What did we get in return from Carlton?

Bag of chips id say :) (pick 52)

We used 52 in a pick swap with North to get points for Darcy.

We got Cleary with 61 which is a different pick im trying to track down. Job for another time.

[jeemak]

the original comment said more losses from LESS contests. Young had more contests. He won more contests and he lost more contests.

because percentage is a relative concept it is meaningless without its context. 80% of 30 is the same as 30% of 80.

when you look at the absolute values both Young and Gardner are having good seasons,.

The quality of their opponents I can’t comment on so I will have to accept other assessment there.

The most meaningful stats for the evening are the ones you presented. Where one is slightly ahead in some components of the game the other makes up for it elsewhere.

Mate this doesn't cut it and the percentages are what they are.

[jeemak]

jeemak’s figures




$454,000
AFL Fantasy Price
$381,000


58.2
AFL Fantasy Score
46.0


$394,700
Supercoach Price
$312,400


76.7
Supercoach Score
59.7



all 4 say Young is 25% better than Gardner.

What did we get in return from Carlton?

But the stats that matter (depending on what you think a defender should be doing) suggest he's 30-50% give or take worse than Gardner.

[Axe Man]

False.

I knew it, Danjul is Dwight Schrute.


jeemak’s figures




$454,000
AFL Fantasy Price
$381,000


58.2
AFL Fantasy Score
46.0


$394,700
Supercoach Price
$312,400


76.7
Supercoach Score
59.7



all 4 say Young is 25% better than Gardner.

What did we get in return from Carlton?

Are you seriously using supercoach and AFL fantasy scores to argue player A is better than player B?

[hujsh]

jeemak’s figures




$454,000
AFL Fantasy Price
$381,000


58.2
AFL Fantasy Score
46.0


$394,700
Supercoach Price
$312,400


76.7
Supercoach Score
59.7



all 4 say Young is 25% better than Gardner.

What did we get in return from Carlton?

So we're now meant to ignore wing-loss percent but use supercoach points instead? You always throw up stats like number of disposals as though it's the only way to judge a players contribution but when there's an actually meaningful statistic relevant to the position the player plays like how often they lose a one-on-one contest it needs "relevant context"? Surely you can just recognize that in this particular area Gardner is out-performing Young?

[bornadog]

Surely you can just recognize that in this particular area Gardner is out-performing Young?

For me stats that matter with Gardner are Spoils and 1%ers. Gardner is top three for Spoils in AFL and top 5 for Spoils

[Danjul]

Mate this doesn't cut it and the percentages are what they are.
My criticism of the original comment was it contained a factual error.

It said more losses from less contests. That’s false.

The original comment used the error to suggest Young is not getting into the game, whereas (if my memory of the table is accurate) his involvement number of 3.2 was almost the highest in the league.

Moving to percentages doesn’t fix it.

The reality is Young had more losses from more contests.

I don’t understand how fixing that simple error before others act on it can generate so much hatred and venom. But if people must then they are free to spit it.

I also clearly said that Gardner is doing better than Young in a number of areas (not just one) so I wasn’t demeaning him as a player . But if you and others insist, I am happy to accept Gardner is much,much,much better than Young.

[Grantysghost]

Melbourne clubs informed as Fremantle defender shuts down contract negotiations

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2022/05/17/melbourne-clubs-informed-as-fremantle-defender-shuts-down-contract/

Griffin Logue has put contract talks on hold at Fremantle as the in-demand defender edges closer to a move away from the club.

Sources at multiple Melbourne-based clubs said they have been informed that Logue has shut down negotiations with the Dockers until the end of the season.

It comes as the key position stopper last night expressed his frustration at a lack of game time under Justin Longmuir this year.

Logue has been dropped twice in the first nine rounds, including the week after receiving coaches votes in a Round 4 win over GWS.

“For myself it is a bit frustrating. I haven’t felt like I’ve wavered too much in terms of my own form and obviously we’re in a really good spot at the moment where we’ve got a lot of depth to build off,” Logue told Channel 9 Perth.

“Unfortunately, people are going to miss out and that’s been me a few times.”

The Dockers stand out in a marketplace crowded with clubs searching for key defenders. Alex Pearce, Heath Chapman, Brennan Cox, Joel Hamling and Logue are all fighting over key position spots.

West Australian Logue said he wanted to stay at Fremantle, but the 24-year-old is also prepared to hear what other clubs have to offer ahead of the trade period.

“I’ll let that sort itself out. For now, it’s a pretty simple focus on playing the best footy I can personally, but more so as a team to see where we can take it,” Logue said last night.

A No.8 pick in the 2016 national draft, Logue played his 50th game in the loss to Gold Coast last weekend

[1eyedog]

I can't align stats with actual game to game feel. What I do know is the Gardner is progressing well and getting better every week. He's athletic, tall enough and good enough one on one to play on the King's and dextrous enough to follow Buddy around up the field. He has versatility.

He's also making less errors now and is actually building enough confidence to start taking marks when he can. He kicks the ball fine and has an old skool defenders mentality meaning he always plays percentages first and also seeks to reduce as much risk as possible on everything he does.

He's not a superstar but he is disciplined and has that Dale Morris-like will to be better. Still working on maintaining shape but he's an inexperienced player still who is playing on very good players week to week. I think he will be a very good defender in a year or two.

[Danjul]

So we're now meant to ignore wing-loss percent but use supercoach points instead? You always throw up stats like number of disposals as though it's the only way to judge a players contribution but when there's an actually meaningful statistic relevant to the position the player plays like how often they lose a one-on-one contest it needs "relevant context"? Surely you can just recognize that in this particular area Gardner is out-performing Young?

my comment wasn’t about how often they lose a contest.

it was about how often they are in a contest.

Surely you can see they are different things.

[Happy Days]

My criticism of the original comment was it contained a factual error.

It said more losses from less contests. That’s false.

The original comment used the error to suggest Young is not getting into the game, whereas (if my memory of the table is accurate) his involvement number of 3.2 was almost the highest in the league.

Moving to percentages doesn’t fix it.

The reality is Young had more losses from more contests.

I don’t understand how fixing that simple error before others act on it can generate so much hatred and venom. But if people must then they are free to spit it.

I also clearly said that Gardner is doing better than Young in a number of areas (not just one) so I wasn’t demeaning him as a player . But if you and others insist, I am happy to accept Gardner is much,much,much better than Young.

But it’s not false?

Young - 19 one on one contests, 7 losses
Gardner - 22 one on one contests, 6 losses

What am I missing here.

[1eyedog]

Gardner and Young are actually quite different players.

[Grantysghost]

Gardner and Young are actually quite different players.

Agree.

One good, one plays at Carlton.

[hujsh]

my comment wasn’t about how often they lose a contest.

it was about how often they are in a contest.

Surely you can see they are different things.

First of all, Happy Days stated that "Young also has a considerably worse one on one defensive winning percentage than Gardner". It was your choice to nitpick his explanation of what that means.

Your explanation of the average stats, "so Young had more of these contests and won more." also seems to be implying that Young was performing better in one-on-ones (contradicting the statistics). If your intention was different then so be it but that's not clear on it's own.

To be fair to you, you did later say "Where one is slightly ahead in some components of the game the other makes up for it elsewhere." which I missed so my previous criticism that you couldn't accept Gardner is performing better in one-one-ones was misguided.

But if your overall point is about "how often they are in a contest," then I don't think you've really articulated that particularly clearly. Nor do I really see what it proves. Young is one-on-one more often and loses them more often so Carlton's structure isn't quite working or Young is playing the wrong role in it would be my takeaway.

[Grantysghost]

Dunkley: ‘There’s no real rush’

https://www.rsn.net.au/breakfast-club/18/05/2022/dunkley-theres-no-real-rush/

Western Bulldogs star Josh Dunkley is comfortable for contract talks to remain on the backburner as the season progresses.

“To be honest there hasn’t really been much update in terms of contract stuff of late and I’m comfortable with that … obviously playing footy and play my role for the team,” Dunkley told RSN’s The Breakfast Club.

“There’s no real rush on it.”

At end of the 2010 season, Dunkley requested a trade to Essendon, but the Dogs refused to budge mid-contract. That contract expires at the end of this season.

Dunkley said he was leaving it to his manager Liam Pickering and focusing on footy.

“I’ll back him in to get everything done,’’ Dunkley said.

“It’s a hard time to go through, everyone goes through contract negotiations and that’s for me just where I’m at at the moment. I’m being completely honest when I say I haven’t really had much discussion so we’ll see how it unfolds.”

[Danjul]

But it’s not false?

Young - 19 one on one contests, 7 losses
Gardner - 22 one on one contests, 6 losses

What am I missing here.

They have played a different number of games. Young started the season late and missed last week (not sure what but I did hear health protocol). I think Gardner has played all games (check my memory on that).

Your percentages were not on totals ( not false) but on game averages (false).

Young had more contests per game (true) Gardner had more contests per season (also true).

That’s why we use long term averages like in jeemak’s source. It compensates for things like games lost for things like injuries. But,as was pointed out about Sweet, it has to be long term, or one performance can distort the conclusion.

But as you clearly show here, I think they are both good players. I fully agree with you, Gardner is having a very good season. I wasn’t expecting such progress.

[EasternWest]

Dunkley: ‘There’s no real rush’

https://www.rsn.net.au/breakfast-club/18/05/2022/dunkley-theres-no-real-rush/

Western Bulldogs star Josh Dunkley is comfortable for contract talks to remain on the backburner as the season progresses.

“To be honest there hasn’t really been much update in terms of contract stuff of late and I’m comfortable with that … obviously playing footy and play my role for the team,” Dunkley told RSN’s The Breakfast Club.

“There’s no real rush on it.”

At end of the 2010 season, Dunkley requested a trade to Essendon, but the Dogs refused to budge mid-contract. That contract expires at the end of this season.

Dunkley said he was leaving it to his manager Liam Pickering and focusing on footy.

“I’ll back him in to get everything done,’’ Dunkley said.

“It’s a hard time to go through, everyone goes through contract negotiations and that’s for me just where I’m at at the moment. I’m being completely honest when I say I haven’t really had much discussion so we’ll see how it unfolds.”

Jeemak likes this.

[Happy Days]

They have played a different number of games. Young started the season late and missed last week (not sure what but I did hear health protocol). I think Gardner has played all games (check my memory on that).

Your percentages were not on totals ( not false) but on game averages (false).

Young had more contests per game (true) Gardner had more contests per season (also true).

That’s why we use long term averages like in jeemak’s source. It compensates for things like games lost for things like injuries. But,as was pointed out about Sweet, it has to be long term, or one performance can distort the conclusion.

But as you clearly show here, I think they are both good players. I fully agree with you, Gardner is having a very good season. I wasn’t expecting such progress.

My percentages were on 6/22 and 7/19, more than enough for a decent sample size. Why does it matter how many games they’ve played, unless you want to look at it holistically and say that the only reason Young started late is because he couldn’t get a game ahead of Oscar McDonald.

Anyway this is getting to pissing contesty which is so unlike me.

[jeemak]

My criticism of the original comment was it contained a factual error.

It said more losses from less contests. That’s false.

The original comment used the error to suggest Young is not getting into the game, whereas (if my memory of the table is accurate) his involvement number of 3.2 was almost the highest in the league.

Moving to percentages doesn’t fix it.

The reality is Young had more losses from more contests.

I don’t understand how fixing that simple error before others act on it can generate so much hatred and venom. But if people must then they are free to spit it.

I also clearly said that Gardner is doing better than Young in a number of areas (not just one) so I wasn’t demeaning him as a player . But if you and others insist, I am happy to accept Gardner is much,much,much better than Young.

Come on mate, what you did was selectively use a few stats that don't paint the full picture in response to a post that wasn't as well articulated as it might have been but actually got the message across just fine.

There's no venom in my posts, or other posters posts and what the stats show is that Young is more prone to losing defencive contests than Gardner is by some margin. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Happy Days]

Dunkley: ‘There’s no real rush’

https://www.rsn.net.au/breakfast-club/18/05/2022/dunkley-theres-no-real-rush/

Western Bulldogs star Josh Dunkley is comfortable for contract talks to remain on the backburner as the season progresses.

“To be honest there hasn’t really been much update in terms of contract stuff of late and I’m comfortable with that … obviously playing footy and play my role for the team,” Dunkley told RSN’s The Breakfast Club.

“There’s no real rush on it.”

At end of the 2010 season, Dunkley requested a trade to Essendon, but the Dogs refused to budge mid-contract. That contract expires at the end of this season.

Dunkley said he was leaving it to his manager Liam Pickering and focusing on footy.

“I’ll back him in to get everything done,’’ Dunkley said.

“It’s a hard time to go through, everyone goes through contract negotiations and that’s for me just where I’m at at the moment. I’m being completely honest when I say I haven’t really had much discussion so we’ll see how it unfolds.”

Weirdest contract negotiations ever. It’s like both parties are going way over the top to prove how chill with each other they are.

It’s definitely got me reading all the tea leaves though. He’s playing more forward, which is bad, but less relief ruck, which is good. He also celebrated a goal by high fiving the cheer squad a few weeks back, which is good, but then he didn’t do any crowd work this week. WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN???

[Danjul]

My percentages were on 6/22 and 7/19, more than enough for a decent sample size. Why does it matter how many games they’ve played, unless you want to look at it holistically and say that the only reason Young started late is because he couldn’t get a game ahead of Oscar McDonald.

Anyway this is getting to pissing contesty which is so unlike me.

In that case I was wrong.

[comrade]

Melbourne clubs informed as Fremantle defender shuts down contract negotiations

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2022/05/17/melbourne-clubs-informed-as-fremantle-defender-shuts-down-contract/

Griffin Logue has put contract talks on hold at Fremantle as the in-demand defender edges closer to a move away from the club.

Sources at multiple Melbourne-based clubs said they have been informed that Logue has shut down negotiations with the Dockers until the end of the season.

It comes as the key position stopper last night expressed his frustration at a lack of game time under Justin Longmuir this year.

Logue has been dropped twice in the first nine rounds, including the week after receiving coaches votes in a Round 4 win over GWS.

“For myself it is a bit frustrating. I haven’t felt like I’ve wavered too much in terms of my own form and obviously we’re in a really good spot at the moment where we’ve got a lot of depth to build off,” Logue told Channel 9 Perth.

“Unfortunately, people are going to miss out and that’s been me a few times.”

The Dockers stand out in a marketplace crowded with clubs searching for key defenders. Alex Pearce, Heath Chapman, Brennan Cox, Joel Hamling and Logue are all fighting over key position spots.

West Australian Logue said he wanted to stay at Fremantle, but the 24-year-old is also prepared to hear what other clubs have to offer ahead of the trade period.

“I’ll let that sort itself out. For now, it’s a pretty simple focus on playing the best footy I can personally, but more so as a team to see where we can take it,” Logue said last night.

A No.8 pick in the 2016 national draft, Logue played his 50th game in the loss to Gold Coast last weekend

I likey.

[GVGjr]

I can't align stats with actual game to game feel. What I do know is the Gardner is progressing well and getting better every week. He's athletic, tall enough and good enough one on one to play on the King's and dextrous enough to follow Buddy around up the field. He has versatility.

He's also making less errors now and is actually building enough confidence to start taking marks when he can. He kicks the ball fine and has an old skool defenders mentality meaning he always plays percentages first and also seeks to reduce as much risk as possible on everything he does.

He's not a superstar but he is disciplined and has that Dale Morris-like will to be better. Still working on maintaining shape but he's an inexperienced player still who is playing on very good players week to week. I think he will be a very good defender in a year or two.

He seems to get better each year. Really happy with the way he is progressing.

[Vred]

I likey.

Yeah, big yes for me. Solves a big issue for us, need to find another one tho can't go into next season with our current defender issue.

[Grantysghost]

I likey.

What would it take to satisfy Freo?

Couple of second rounders?

Future first?

Player? (not sure what they need)

[Grantysghost]

In that case I was wrong.

No Danjul never admit defeat! xD

[EasternWest]

What would it take to satisfy Freo?

Couple of second rounders?

Future first?

Player? (not sure what they need)

In the great tradition of WOOF trade discussion it's time to revert to our usual formula when it comes to trading in a decent player: offer them quantity.

Ergo I suggest for Logue we offer them McNeil, Butler, R Smith, Lukas Webb, Cam Faulkner, Tim Callan, Nathan Saunders, Jayden Schofield and Ayce Cordy.

Then we must argue most vehemently that they're fools for not immediately accepting it.

If we need to sweeten the pot we could chuck in Brad Murphy too.

[Grantysghost]

Weirdest contract negotiations ever. It’s like both parties are going way over the top to prove how chill with each other they are.

It’s definitely got me reading all the tea leaves though. He’s playing more forward, which is bad, but less relief ruck, which is good. He also celebrated a goal by high fiving the cheer squad a few weeks back, which is good, but then he didn’t do any crowd work this week. WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN???

He didn't mention Treloar in that grab either.

Jeemak mightve got his man.

[Grantysghost]

In the great tradition of WOOF trade discussion it's time to revert to our usual formula when it comes to trading in a decent player: offer them quantity.

Ergo I suggest for Logue we offer them McNeil, Butler, R Smith, Lukas Webb, Cam Faulkner, Tim Callan, Nathan Saunders, Jayden Schofield and Ayce Cordy.

Then we must argue most vehemently that they're fools for not immediately accepting it.

If we need to sweeten the pot we could chuck in Brad Murphy too.

If we sweeten it with a free performance by "Darce and the Dogettes" we may just have something EW.

https://media.giphy.com/media/35Rd1bMokH2AsVOkvi/giphy.gif

[bornadog]

Melbourne clubs informed as Fremantle defender shuts down contract negotiations

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2022/05/17/melbourne-clubs-informed-as-fremantle-defender-shuts-down-contract/ (https://www.sen.com.au/news/2022/05/17/melbourne-clubs-informed-as-fremantle-defender-shuts-down-contract/)

Griffin Logue has put contract talks on hold at Fremantle as the in-demand defender edges closer to a move away from the club.

Sources at multiple Melbourne-based clubs said they have been informed that Logue has shut down negotiations with the Dockers until the end of the season.

It comes as the key position stopper last night expressed his frustration at a lack of game time under Justin Longmuir this year.

Logue has been dropped twice in the first nine rounds, including the week after receiving coaches votes in a Round 4 win over GWS.

“For myself it is a bit frustrating. I haven’t felt like I’ve wavered too much in terms of my own form and obviously we’re in a really good spot at the moment where we’ve got a lot of depth to build off,” Logue told Channel 9 Perth.

“Unfortunately, people are going to miss out and that’s been me a few times.”

The Dockers stand out in a marketplace crowded with clubs searching for key defenders. Alex Pearce, Heath Chapman, Brennan Cox, Joel Hamling and Logue are all fighting over key position spots.

West Australian Logue said he wanted to stay at Fremantle, but the 24-year-old is also prepared to hear what other clubs have to offer ahead of the trade period.

“I’ll let that sort itself out. For now, it’s a pretty simple focus on playing the best footy I can personally, but more so as a team to see where we can take it,” Logue said last night.

A No.8 pick in the 2016 national draft, Logue played his 50th game in the loss to Gold Coast last weekend

He just wants to see what people will offer him and then go back to Freo for a pay rise

[bornadog]

He seems to get better each year. Really happy with the way he is progressing.

He is starting to mature and is almost 25 years old but only played 30 games. What I do like is he is growing in confidence. He has even gone for a mini run, baulking a couple of players then kicking to a target.

1eyedog mentions Dale Morris like stats. He is the first player I thought of when I looked up his spoils and 1%ers stats

[EasternWest]

If we sweeten it with a free performance by "Darce and the Dogettes" we may just have something EW.

https://media.giphy.com/media/35Rd1bMokH2AsVOkvi/giphy.gif

I live my life actively avoiding seeing Darcy and his shit takes. Please never make me experience that again.

[Grantysghost]

I live my life actively avoiding seeing Darcy and his shit takes. Please never make me experience that again.

https://i.postimg.cc/nc5tYP0d/20220518-125801.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[MrMahatma]

Weirdest contract negotiations ever. It’s like both parties are going way over the top to prove how chill with each other they are.

It’s definitely got me reading all the tea leaves though. He’s playing more forward, which is bad, but less relief ruck, which is good. He also celebrated a goal by high fiving the cheer squad a few weeks back, which is good, but then he didn’t do any crowd work this week. WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN???

Feels a bit like "Dunks, you didn't want to hang around so we've got you at the bottom of our people to recontract list. I mean, we want you to stay, but not at the expense of the other dudes - so we'll let you know how many $ are left later in the year and if that's enough, sweet, and if not, we'll get our trade on".

Which, he's probably fine with. If the $ Essendon were going to offer him (was it $800k?) were true, he won't be getting that at the Dogs. Not sure Ess would still offer it either but anyway, Dunks may have an eye on a big pay day.

I'd like to keep him, and English, and Baz, and Dale, and Daniel... we may not though.

[MrMahatma]

He just wants to see what people will offer him and then go back to Freo for a pay rise

Is he though? There's some interesting language in that and a bit of an undercurrent of "I'm playing as well as I can, and doing it consistently, and still not getting a game all the time - so b*gger it... I'm up for going somewhere I'll get a regular game..."

And hopefully .. "I also want to go somewhere with a good core group that will be in the mix for flags immediately, given Freo are heading in that direction..."

And hopefully.. "Like the dogs. I feel like I'd almost be the missing piece over there. Me and Lobb. Maybe we do a double deal?"

[Grantysghost]

Is he though? There's some interesting language in that and a bit of an undercurrent of "I'm playing as well as I can, and doing it consistently, and still not getting a game all the time - so b*gger it... I'm up for going somewhere I'll get a regular game..."

And hopefully .. "I also want to go somewhere with a good core group that will be in the mix for flags immediately, given Freo are heading in that direction..."

And hopefully.. "Like the dogs. I feel like I'd almost be the missing piece over there. Me and Lobb. Maybe we do a double deal?"

I thought the same it was an interesting interview. Seems legit wants out.

[bornadog]

I thought the same it was an interesting interview. Seems legit wants out.

anyway, too short for us :D

[hujsh]

In the great tradition of WOOF trade discussion it's time to revert to our usual formula when it comes to trading in a decent player: offer them quantity.

Ergo I suggest for Logue we offer them McNeil, Butler, R Smith, Lukas Webb, Cam Faulkner, Tim Callan, Nathan Saunders, Jayden Schofield and Ayce Cordy.

Then we must argue most vehemently that they're fools for not immediately accepting it.

If we need to sweeten the pot we could chuck in Brad Murphy too.

For all that we should probably get Lobb as well. Maybe Freo to provide some cap relief if we add in McComb

[Bulldog Revolution]

I thought the same it was an interesting interview. Seems legit wants out.

I read it as: Prioritise me, or be prepared to lose me

[Grantysghost]

I knew it, Danjul is Dwight Schrute.

https://i.postimg.cc/pV0RZkdh/RDT-20220518-1851478447199429846787528.png (https://postimg.cc/0rJT5YDP)

[Danjul]

https://i.postimg.cc/pV0RZkdh/RDT-20220518-1851478447199429846787528.png (https://postimg.cc/0rJT5YDP)
He has better spectacles. Otherwise very close.

[1eyedog]

Rory Lobb = Daniel Bandy v2

[Grantysghost]

He has better spectacles. Otherwise very close.

Haha. Very good.

[comrade]

Rory Lobb = Daniel Bandy v2

Which is still a big upgrade on whatever we’re rolling with now.

[Mantis]

Rory Lobb = Daniel Bandy v2

So I guess you prefer Zaine Cordy?

[GVGjr]

Rory Lobb = Daniel Bandy v2

Decent comparison and I didn't mind Daniel Bandy with us.

I'm not as keen on Lobb mainly from an effort point of view but he would compliment our side OK.

[1eyedog]

So I guess you prefer Zaine Cordy?

Their respective outputs forward and in the ruck is close enough to make spending the extra money a meaningless proposition. If it happens I don't think we'll end up liking it. I would coax Roughead back or if we're interested (and I'm not) look at Mason Cox as he is essentially the same player but way cheaper.
Casboult again even.

[Grantysghost]

Their respective outputs forward and in the ruck is close enough to make spending the extra money a meaningless proposition. If it happens I don't think we'll end up liking it. I would coax Roughead back or if we're interested (and I'm not) look at Mason Cox as he is essentially the same player but way cheaper.
Casboult again even.
https://media.giphy.com/media/O5NyCibf93upy/giphy.gif

[Mantis]

Their respective outputs forward and in the ruck is close enough to make spending the extra money a meaningless proposition. If it happens I don't think we'll end up liking it. I would coax Roughead back or if we're interested (and I'm not) look at Mason Cox as he is essentially the same player but way cheaper.
Casboult again even.

Really? Have you compared their seasons thus far?

The terms of contract would need to be suitable from our end, but to say that their outputs is similar is just incorrect.

[macca]

Rory Lobb = Daniel Bandy v2

Daniel Bandy first season with us was pretty good I thought. To me he was a bit of a cult figure. Could Run all day, ruck and take a few marks forward. Plus the name, meant you could put him anywhere to be the "Band-aid".

Not sure what happened afterwards, in the second year.

Some interesting stats , in 2002 kicked 30 goals and played 22 games for us !

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/D/Daniel_Bandy.html

[1eyedog]

Daniel Bandy first season with us was pretty good I thought. To me he was a bit of a cult figure. Could Run all day, ruck and take a few marks forward. Plus the name, meant you could put him anywhere to be the "Band-aid".

Not sure what happened afterwards, in the second year.

Some interesting stats , in 2002 kicked 30 goals and played 22 games for us !

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/D/Daniel_Bandy.html

I should have said Cam Wight I suppose.

[1eyedog]

Really? Have you compared their seasons thus far?

The terms of contract would need to be suitable from our end, but to say that their outputs is similar is just incorrect.

I haven't compared them no and I realise Cordy is bad but Lobb is really not very good either. I don't think I'm incorrect saying that Lobb in and Cordy out will make a any kind of meaningful difference, which is essentially what the point is.

I've had a bit of a look at Lobb's stats this year what do you like about them? Got 15 touches once, has taken 6 marks once and has kicked 3 goals once. I mean, aside from pure numbers Lobb has also been on the ground 30% more than Zaine so he's going to see more of it isn't he? Also playing different roles one defensive and one more attacking Rory gets it more, but he burns it more as well.

Freo actually being good is helping Lobb as far as I'm concerned but I'm not convinced he's making a big contribution to that. Zaine gets shovelled around everywhere. Anyway, I'm not nitpicking stats you're right he's probably better than Cordy but that's irrelevant because I wouldn't play either of them.

[1eyedog]

https://media.giphy.com/media/O5NyCibf93upy/giphy.gif

Legit if we're after a forward who can relieve Engish of ruck duties for 5-8 minutes a quarter I'd prefer Casboult / Cox over Lobb. At least Levi is hitting the scoreboard this year, is a better mark than Lobb in any type of situation and is a free agent (not sure if he has signed on another year yet?), so would be cheap. Lobb wants good coin. And the whole point of getting in this type of player would be that they'd need to play long minutes as a forward, with English in the ruck, or play in the VFL. Sweet can't play this role effectively (at least we don't think he can). If we're more ruck backup focused cause we really don't want to play Sweet if English gets injured go Cox then. Would cost nothing. Casboult / Cox / Roughhead would essentially cost a list spot.

It's not ideal but neither is meeting Rory's likely outrageous demands for what you get. Did everyone see Casboult man handle Lobb in the ruck contest that led to Casboult's snap goal in their game last week? Ultimately If we're not developing Darcy as a ruckman now then we really need to draft the best available ruckman later this year so we can put the 'let's look at all the sub-par players over 200cm we can get in' to rest.

[GVGjr]

Daniel Bandy first season with us was pretty good I thought. To me he was a bit of a cult figure. Could Run all day, ruck and take a few marks forward. Plus the name, meant you could put him anywhere to be the "Band-aid".

Not sure what happened afterwards, in the second year.

Some interesting stats , in 2002 kicked 30 goals and played 22 games for us !

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/D/Daniel_Bandy.html

He did struggle in games where Plough flooded extra players in the back line leaving our 4 forwards competing against 6 defenders but I thought he was a decent player for us.

[Grantysghost]

Legit if we're after a forward who can relieve Engish of ruck duties for 5-8 minutes a quarter I'd prefer Casboult / Cox over Lobb. At least Levi is hitting the scoreboard this year, is a better mark than Lobb in any type of situation and is a free agent (not sure if he has signed on another year yet?), so would be cheap. Lobb wants good coin. And the whole point of getting in this type of player would be that they'd need to play long minutes as a forward, with English in the ruck, or play in the VFL. Sweet can't play this role effectively (at least we don't think he can). If we're more ruck backup focused cause we really don't want to play Sweet if English gets injured go Cox then. Would cost nothing. Casboult / Cox / Roughhead would essentially cost a list spot.

It's not ideal but neither is meeting Rory's likely outrageous demands for what you get. Did everyone see Casboult man handle Lobb in the ruck contest that led to Casboult's snap goal in their game last week? Ultimately If we're not developing Darcy as a ruckman now then we really need to draft the best available ruckman later this year so we can put the 'let's look at all the sub-par players over 200cm we can get in' to rest.

You make a solid argument. I just don't like Levi.

If Levi kicks a goal on Saturday I'll not post for a month That's a win for everyone!

[jeemak]

You make a solid argument. I just don't like Levi.

If Levi kicks a goal on Saturday I'll not post for a month That's a win for everyone!

So what you're actually saying is that you feel Levi is at least good for one goal a game, which isn't bad.

[Grantysghost]

So what you're actually saying is that you feel Levi is at least good for one goal a game, which isn't bad.

Am I?

I'm saying he sucks.

Also that I have a terrible sense of humour xD

Talent levels across the league have dropped substantiallyin my opinion there are too many teams.

I'm backing Levi to kick 0.

[MrMahatma]

Am I?

I'm saying he sucks.

Also that I have a terrible sense of humour xD

Talent levels across the league have dropped substantiallyin my opinion there are too many teams.

I'm backing Levi to kick 0.

I’d take Lobb, Levi or Cox… any of them. Zaine needs to retire.

[josie]

You make a solid argument. I just don't like Levi.

If Levi kicks a goal on Saturday I'll not post for a month That's a win for everyone!

Please don’t do that GG. I’m conflicted. I’ve always had a soft spot for Levi and if he was not set for Qld I’d love to have grabbed him, meanwhile I enjoy reading your posts.

[bornadog]

Please don’t do that GG. I’m conflicted. I’ve always had a soft spot for Levi and if he was not set for Qld I’d love to have grabbed him, meanwhile I enjoy reading your posts.

Levi got his chance when King went down with an injury. He was pick 3 in the rookie draft and he is 32 years old. He would have been good for a year to replace Bruce.

Hopefully he won't kick any tomorrow.

[josie]

I’d take Lobb, Levi or Cox… any of them. Zaine needs to retire.

100% agree. I’m kinda off the Zaine Train too. I will never forget his 2016 finals efforts, especially that first goal in the GF and the knee of god in the PF. Every year I think he has to prove me wrong. It’s not for want of effort, he just isn’t up to it. Even with the hesitant play of Schache I’d much prefer Josh to be given games ahead of Zaine. One of the Bevo conundrums that we mere mortals do not understand.

[Grantysghost]

Please don’t do that GG. I’m conflicted. I’ve always had a soft spot for Levi and if he was not set for Qld I’d love to have grabbed him, meanwhile I enjoy reading your posts.

Ha you're the one!

I've got a problem with running jokes that aren't funny.

I'm sure Levi is a decent human, I'm just not a fan of his football abilities. He certainly has made the most of what he has though.

I'm more annoyed we didn't grab Chol he's the one I'm more concerned about.

[Bulldog Joe]

You make a solid argument. I just don't like Levi.

If Levi kicks a goal on Saturday I'll not post for a month That's a win for everyone!

No GG
Don't hang yourself on the Gallows of Levi

You are daring him to score heavily and I would much prefer you to be posting.

[1eyedog]

You make a solid argument. I just don't like Levi.

If Levi kicks a goal on Saturday I'll not post for a month That's a win for everyone!

Don't you dare do that! I don't like Levi either I just don't like Lobb more.

[Grantysghost]

No GG
Don't hang yourself on the Gallows of Levi

You are daring him to score heavily and I would much prefer you to be posting.

The gallows of Levi.

That sounds like a dystopian story set in America's deep south.

1984 meets to kill a mocking bird.

Love it.

[Grantysghost]

Don't you dare do that! I don't like Levi either I just don't like Lobb more.

Haha. Gold. Ok I'll wind back the Levi jokes. (maybe one more?).

[Happy Days]

Levi’s having a career year and keeping him goalless would go a long way to winning the game. He isn’t exactly a dynamic player but he creates 2-3 chances a game out of nowhere through his marking, whether for himself of their guys at ground level which apparently includes the world’s biggest small forward Mabior Chol.

I see what you’re doing GG. You won’t post if Levi kicks a goal but you didn’t say anything about him kicking 2 or more.

[Grantysghost]

Levi’s having a career year and keeping him goalless would go a long way to winning the game. He isn’t exactly a dynamic player but he creates 2-3 chances a game out of nowhere through his marking, whether for himself of their guys at ground level which apparently includes the world’s biggest small forward Mabior Chol.

I see what you’re doing GG. You won’t post if Levi kicks a goal but you didn’t say anything about him kicking 2 or more.

Damn! Hoist with my own petard!

I did read an article on the afl website explaining how well he's been playing. Good for him.

[azabob]

Damn! Hoist with my own petard!

I did read an article on the afl website explaining how well he's been playing. Good for him.

I find it interesting you chose to believe the afl website over posters on woof!

[azabob]

Levi’s having a career year and keeping him goalless would go a long way to winning the game. He isn’t exactly a dynamic player but he creates 2-3 chances a game out of nowhere through his marking, whether for himself of their guys at ground level which apparently includes the world’s biggest small forward Mabior Chol.

I see what you’re doing GG. You won’t post if Levi kicks a goal but you didn’t say anything about him kicking 2 or more.

And this is our biggest weakness.

[Happy Days]

And this is our biggest weakness.

Maybe, but this is the first game we’ve seen all year with our preferred KPD set up, which I personally am a bit bullish on. I have somehow watched a ton of GC this year and have been really impressed by their forward mix, but am not gonna go so far as to be full on concerned until I see how Keath, Gardner and O’Brien work together.

[bornadog]

And this is our biggest weakness.

Why do you say that? We are 4th for most inside 50s, just short of top, so we are creating lots of opportunities.

[Grantysghost]

I find it interesting you chose to believe the afl website over posters on woof!

I thought it was all part of some adolescent hijinx.

[1eyedog]

Why do you say that? We are 4th for most inside 50s, just short of top, so we are creating lots of opportunities.

Getting it in there is one thing but maximising the entry is entirely different. Buku was the first player outside Weightman that constantly looked to provide multiple options deep in the forward line. Our forward line is a bit of a shambles really and I haven't looked but our i50 / goal ratio would be dropped lasagne. I'm probably wrong but it sorta feels that way.

[Happy Days]

Getting it in there is one thing but maximising the entry is entirely different. Buku was the first player outside Weightman that constantly looked to provide multiple options deep in the forward line. Our forward line is a bit of a shambles really and I haven't looked but our i50 / goal ratio would be dropped lasagne. I'm probably wrong but it sorta feels that way.

I’m pretty sure this stat is right. Between our reliance on Naughton to create every opportunity, inaccuracy and lack of goals from the mids (when they’re playing as mids) our efficiency is way down. We need Bruce and Cody back badly.

[1eyedog]

I’m pretty sure this stat is right. Between our reliance on Naughton to create every opportunity, inaccuracy and lack of goals from the mids (when they’re playing as mids) our efficiency is way down. We need Bruce and Cody back badly.

It's interesting that we haven't played Bedendo yet. I wonder what the delay is. We've played almost everyone else on the list and seem to have a pressing need for a natural medium Dickson-type forward who marks and kicks the ball well. Maybe not a natural forward but he's a good size and mark in the hybrid-high forward Georgiades mould. Not only that his bio states he can play pretty much anywhere and I guess that's why we were into him. I know he hasn't been setting the world on fire at Footscray but I'd be keen take a look.

Anyone know why he's been overlooked?

[bornadog]

Getting it in there is one thing but maximising the entry is entirely different. Buku was the first player outside Weightman that constantly looked to provide multiple options deep in the forward line. Our forward line is a bit of a shambles really and I haven't looked but our i50 / goal ratio would be dropped lasagne. I'm probably wrong but it sorta feels that way.

We are ranked 8th for scoring, but agree we should be higher. We have kicked 110 goals and 105 behinds :eek:

[bornadog]

It's interesting that we haven't played Bedendo yet. I wonder what the delay is. We've played almost everyone else on the list and seem to have a pressing need for a natural medium Dickson-type forward who marks and kicks the ball well. Maybe not a natural forward but he's a good size and mark in the hybrid-high forward Georgiades mould. Not only that his bio states he can play pretty much anywhere and I guess that's why we were into him. I know he hasn't been setting the world on fire at Footscray but I'd be keen take a look.

Anyone know why he's been overlooked?

Since he broke his hand at the start of the first quarter v Richmond and had a few weeks off, he has come back playing on a wing for some reason. VFL team is not exactly flushed with goal kickers either. He has only played 3 games this year.

[GVGjr]

Please don’t do that GG. I’m conflicted. I’ve always had a soft spot for Levi and if he was not set for Qld I’d love to have grabbed him, meanwhile I enjoy reading your posts.

Secretly GG was trying to get both Casboult and Greenwood to the club so he could have his best pair of Levi's. :)

[Happy Days]

It's interesting that we haven't played Bedendo yet. I wonder what the delay is. We've played almost everyone else on the list and seem to have a pressing need for a natural medium Dickson-type forward who marks and kicks the ball well. Maybe not a natural forward but he's a good size and mark in the hybrid-high forward Georgiades mould. Not only that his bio states he can play pretty much anywhere and I guess that's why we were into him. I know he hasn't been setting the world on fire at Footscray but I'd be keen take a look.

Anyone know why he's been overlooked?

He was injured for a little bit and hasn’t been super awesome since he got back in. He’s still really slight and I don’t see what he offers that Buku doesn’t offer more of.

[Grantysghost]

Secretly GG was trying to get both Casboult and Greenwood to the club so he could have his best pair of Levi's. :)

Haha you can retire on that.

Greenwood is actually playing at Deer Park not far from me.

[hujsh]

If Bruce gets back to decent shape, Weightman comes in and Buku stays good we have something of a working forwardline. At minimum one slot will always be set aside for a midfielder so maybe there's room for a Wallis or a McNeil or Bedendo or whoever puts their hand up.

[Grantysghost]

If Bruce gets back to decent shape, Weightman comes in and Buku stays good we have something of a working forwardline. At minimum one slot will always be set aside for a midfielder so maybe there's room for a Wallis or a McNeil or Bedendo or whoever puts their hand up.

Be interesting to see how Bruce goes. He looks fit still.

Probably a couple of games in the VFL and then straight in.

[azabob]

Why do you say that? We are 4th for most inside 50s, just short of top, so we are creating lots of opportunities.

I am talking about our defenders defending marking forwards.

[azabob]

Maybe, but this is the first game we’ve seen all year with our preferred KPD set up, which I personally am a bit bullish on. I have somehow watched a ton of GC this year and have been really impressed by their forward mix, but am not gonna go so far as to be full on concerned until I see how Keath, Gardner and O’Brien work together.

Same, in the match committee thread I said and I quote

"Fairly happy to see the big three boys down back"

[Grantysghost]

Same, in the match committee thread I said and I quote

"Fairly happy to see the big three boys down back"

I think there are two teams in it.

Us and Melbourne.

We need to hit our straps soon because you need to be up there to win it.

Look at the Eagles 2018.

Tigers would've smashed them.

Same as GWS the next year.

If you're in the top 4 no matter how you get there (the prelims) you have a good chance.

[jeemak]

I am talking about our defenders defending marking forwards.

Mate that's exactly how I read it but you seemed to create a couple of pages of content through the confusion so good work!

[The Doctor]

Jon Ralph says

And yet for all of those priorities the Dogs’ clear intent is to bring in another key back and key forward.

The Rory Lobb ruck-forward type would be perfect to compliment the Dogs given Josh Bruce is returning but is 30 next week and coming off an ACL tear.

A Griffin Logue-Darcy Gardiner type stopper would be perfect for the back six.

The Dogs have some key position backs across the league they believe they could turn into key forwards if they could acquire them but it’s not apparent exactly who those players are.

---------------

Note that he is using Lobb and Logue as examples of the player types we might be looking for, not actually linking us with them.

[MrMahatma]

We need more key fwds?

[GVGjr]

We need more key fwds?

I think Ralph's assumption is Bruce's age and coming off a knee injury.

[Mantis]

I think Ralph's assumption is Bruce's age and coming off a knee injury.

You would hope with another pre season JUH will be a staple in the forward line next year so would think a forward/ruck is the position we need to fill rather than a pure KF.

A key back is another requirement…. But happy for this one to be a developing type.

[bornadog]

Jon Ralph says

And yet for all of those priorities the Dogs’ clear intent is to bring in another key back and key forward.

The Rory Lobb ruck-forward type would be perfect to compliment the Dogs given Josh Bruce is returning but is 30 next week and coming off an ACL tear.

A Griffin Logue-Darcy Gardiner type stopper would be perfect for the back six.

The Dogs have some key position backs across the league they believe they could turn into key forwards if they could acquire them but it’s not apparent exactly who those players are.

---------------

Note that he is using Lobb and Logue as examples of the player types we might be looking for, not actually linking us with them.

The Age with something similar, but also say we have been talking to Dawson at Williamstown. However Carlton now looking at Dawson in mid season draft

[Axe Man]

The Age with something similar, but also say we have been talking to Dawson at Williamstown. However Carlton now looking at Dawson in mid season draft

HUN saying North will take Dawson at pick 2, Carlton may take Sam Durdin (former North) at their pick to bolster their KPDs. Either way he's not going to end up at the kennel.

[SquirrelGrip]

The Age with something similar, but also say we have been talking to Dawson at Williamstown. However Carlton now looking at Dawson in mid season draft

Is Dawson the one who Jamarra kicked 6 on this week?

[bornadog]

Is Dawson the one who Jamarra kicked 6 on this week?

Kicked 4 on him and Schache 2

[comrade]

If we picked up Lobb and Logue this off season, we would be a lock for top 4 next year.

Pretty much cleans up our major structural deficiencies, and we still have Marra and Darcy developing. I’d also pick up the best available key defender with our first pick in the draft and go hard on genuine forward talent of all sizes.

[jeemak]

I'd be really eager to bring in a 188-192cm mid sized and genuine forward if possible. A too big for smalls and too quick/ crafty for talls type.

[bornadog]

I'd be really eager to bring in a 188-192cm mid sized and genuine forward if possible. A too big for smalls and too quick/ crafty for talls type.

Bendendo

[azabob]

Bedendo

Bendendo has played wing the last few weeks. His skill set seems to suit the wing as well as mid forward.

[bornadog]

Bendendo has played wing the last few weeks. His skill set seems to suit the wing as well as mid forward.

All part of his learning. Has a great leap too.

[Axe Man]

Bendendo has played wing the last few weeks. His skill set seems to suit the wing as well as mid forward.

I'm not sure there are any AFL listed players that haven't spent time on the wing this year when playing for Footscray. Seems like everyone is getting a go in an attempt to uncover some more options with our only established winger in Hunter obviously missing at the moment.

[Bulldog4life]

All part of his learning. Has a great leap too.

Played well against Willy too.

[The Doctor]

Bedendo is starting to look every bit an AFL player. His improvement this season has been quite noticeable. Looks classy at times and if you ask me has gone past Roarke for a call up to the seniors.

Hope he gets a 2 year deal.

[Mantis]

Played well against Willy too.

They all did… but Willi are a really poor team this year so it was sort of expected.

More interested to see how we go this week as the Geelong VFL team are pretty strong.

[1eyedog]

Bedendo is starting to look every bit an AFL player. His improvement this season has been quite noticeable. Looks classy at times and if you ask me has gone past Roarke for a call up to the seniors.

Hope he gets a 2 year deal.

We really need a decent medium forward.

[Vred]

Media reporting we're chasing Dan McStay.

Yay or nay?

[GVGjr]

Media reporting we're chasing Dan McStay.

Yay or nay?

As a player, no doubt he would be a good addition. Can we afford him and does he really fix a problem for us are the main questions I have.

[Mantis]

As a player, no doubt he would be a good addition. Can we afford him and does he really fix a problem for us are the main questions I have.

Not interested at asking price unless we are going to play him at CHB which isn't his best or preferred spot.

We need a forward who can take a turn in the ruck... assuming of course we think JUH is going to make it.

[GVGjr]

Not interested at asking price unless we are going to play him at CHB which isn't his best or preferred spot.

We need a forward who can take a turn in the ruck... assuming of course we think JUH is going to make it.

That's how I see it. He's a good enough player but he is similar to a few others we already have.
I get why we are being linked to McStay but he isn't a huge priority for me at the moment.
Could we play McStay alongside of Naughton and Bruce and still find room for Marra next year?

[G-Mo77]

Media reporting we're chasing Dan McStay.

Yay or nay?

At over 600k over 5. No thanks

[Mofra]

At over 600k over 5. No thanks
What do you think AFL-standard talls cost?
Keath at $750k, Bruce similar, etc.

[boydogs]

What do you think AFL-standard talls cost?
Keath at $750k, Bruce similar, etc.

Too much for Bevo’s liking

[MrMahatma]

Too much for Bevo’s liking

Bevo? Or the guy whose actual job it is to put the list together?

[Bullies]

At over 600k over 5. No thanks But we are happy to pay fringe players who dont get a game $400k a year. More than happy to pay the extra $200k for someone who will make a contest and can take a legit pack mark. Also has good skill for a big fella.

[G-Mo77]

But we happy to pay fringe players who dont get a game $400k a year. Happy to pay $200k extra for someone who will make a contest and can take a legit pack mark.Also has good skill for a big fella.

My expertise on salaries now may have diminished over the years. Seems a lot to me but I'm not sure on what the TPP is or Min, avg, max a player can go now days. Maybe it's not excessive?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I like McStay but i'm not sure he fits a position of need. Would he make us better? Yes, but what happens to JUH? Assuming Bruce plays, I think we can spend the money on a KPD or second ruck.

For mine, McStay is more a forward.

[comrade]

Timmy staying til end of 2024, Caleb until 2026.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2022/06/14/dogs-stars-ink-new-deals-at-the-kennel/

Time to get the big Chilli a proper ruck partner and make the next two years count.

[comrade]

I like McStay but i'm not sure he fits a position of need. Would he make us better? Yes, but what happens to JUH? Assuming Bruce plays, I think we can spend the money on a KPD or second ruck.

For mine, McStay is more a forward.

Agree. Key defender and ruck/forward are absolute necessities (have been for the last 2 years). Draft the best pure forwards, these types tend to come in and make an impact earlier anyway.

[Sedat]

Time to get the big Chilli a proper ruck partner and make the next two years count.
Goldy is old but very durable and hasn't lost any athleticism. Some will say once bitten twice shy after getting Martin but Goldy is a different type and is a proven aerial threat up forward - his skill set would compliment English nicely in the short term.

[GVGjr]

I like McStay but i'm not sure he fits a position of need. Would he make us better? Yes, but what happens to JUH? Assuming Bruce plays, I think we can spend the money on a KPD or second ruck.

For mine, McStay is more a forward.

Summed up perfectly. Good player but unless he is a good enough defender he doesn't quite fit our needs.

[GVGjr]

Agree. Key defender and ruck/forward are absolute necessities (have been for the last 2 years). Draft the best pure forwards, these types tend to come in and make an impact earlier anyway.

If we don't address it at the end of the season it will be another missed opportunity. With Marra and Darcy just needing some time to develop a shorter term fix could work.

[G-Mo77]

Timmy staying til end of 2024, Caleb until 2026.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2022/06/14/dogs-stars-ink-new-deals-at-the-kennel/

Time to get the big Chilli a proper ruck partner and make the next two years count.

I haven't been comfortable until it comes out officially. This is close enough, great result. I honestly thought Tim was gone.

[Mantis]

Timmy staying til end of 2024, Caleb until 2026.

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2022/06/14/dogs-stars-ink-new-deals-at-the-kennel/

Time to get the big Chilli a proper ruck partner and make the next two years count.

Good news, but not really comfortable with the comment that Caleb becomes one of our highest earners… be interesting to see where he fits in, but would hope that he isn’t in our top 5-8 highest paid players.