Brownlow 2022

[bornadog]

No chance for a Bulldog player to win, but who will be our top vote getter?

Libba has had a great year, but umpires don't reward the in and under players and look for the flashy type.

AFL.com.au predict for WBulldogs:

Brownlow Predictor

13 Josh Dunkley
12 Bailey Smith*
11 Marcus Bontempelli

What is your prediction for the overall winner?

I think Neale is a big chance and I will spew up if Oliver gets it

[chef]

I hope Clarry wins it. My girls know him through school in Shep and he seemed a great kid.

Always admired how he went about it to get drafted, wasn't one of those that everything fell in his lap and he worked his arse off and got rewarded.

[Grantysghost]

Do we seriously need to get to the point where they give votes across the lines eg best forward, best defender, best mid per game and then tally those votes?

It's only a midfield award.

[bornadog]

Do we seriously need to get to the point where they give votes across the lines eg best forward, best defender, best mid per game and then tally those votes?

It's only a midfield award.

It never use to be and 3 votes were given to the Best and fairest no matter if their team won or lost

[Grantysghost]

It never use to be and 3 votes were given to the Best and fairest no matter if their team won or lost

What chance would Scott Wynd have nowadays?

[bornadog]

What chance would Scott Wynd have nowadays?

Gary Dempsey, Templeton, or back pocket Hardie. The great John Schultz?

[bornadog]

The real goal of the year


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O44bgGvfIQU

[Grantysghost]

For eg at this point

Naughts has 6.
Jai Newcombe has 7.

[bornadog]

Neale, Cripps or Miller from here.

I am hoping Miller

[Happy Days]

That was fixed. Give this Brownlow to Chris Grant.

[The Underdog]

A real reverse Chris Grant this year.

[GVGjr]

A deserved winner but I hate the way Gil calls the votes. Those pauses are just wrong.

[Topdog]

A deserved winner but I hate the way Gil calls the votes. Those pauses are just wrong.

One of the worst appeal debacles ends with him picking up the most coveted individual prize in the afl

[Testekill]

It was rigged from the start.

[Grantysghost]

A deserved winner but I hate the way Gil calls the votes. Those pauses are just wrong.

Callum Ah Chee has entered the chat.

Grant must be shaking his head.

[GVGjr]

I was surprised that Rory Laird didn't poll more votes. He played some very dominate games but clearly the short chip kicks to his team mates don't appeal to the umpires.

[Grantysghost]

I guess there's a very real chance the guy who wins our B and F won't be here next season.

https://i.postimg.cc/j2wSyYCL/Screenshot-20220919-080657.jpg (https://postimg.cc/H8mmCKwg)

[Grantysghost]

I was surprised that Rory Laird didn't poll more votes. He played some very dominate games but clearly the short chip kicks to his team mates don't appeal to the umpires.

How they can give votes and concentrate on what they're doing is beyond me.

Time for an overhaul the system is broken.

[bornadog]

I guess there's a very real chance the guy who wins our B and F won't be here next season.

https://i.postimg.cc/j2wSyYCL/Screenshot-20220919-080657.jpg (https://postimg.cc/H8mmCKwg)

Tim with two best on grounds

[angelopetraglia]

Chris Grant loses a Brownlow medal to suspension. It was a stray arm that accidently hit Holland high. The umpire paid a free kick and had a perfect view. Umpire refuses to report him. Holland gets straight back up and takes the free kick. Holland plays the next week. No long term injury to Holland. Ian Collins (former Carlton player) intervenes, reports Grant and rubs him out.

Cripps wins a Brownlow. Chooses to bump, leaves the ground with viscous intent, collects Ah Chee high and knocks him unconscious. Ah Chee can't take the free kick. Is subbed out of the game. He then misses the next two weeks due to concussion symptoms. He is reported and given two weeks. Blues take it to the Tribunal. Tribunal agrees with the MRP and gives him two weeks. They then appeal the Tribunal decision and win. The overrule goes against everything that the AFL has said about choosing to bump and then being responsible for your actions.

I still can't believe Grant was robbed. I still can't believe Cripps got off.

[comrade]

Bont really had a stinker by his standards.

[Grantysghost]

Chris Grant loses a Brownlow medal to suspension. It was a stray arm that accidently hit Holland high. The umpire paid a free kick and had a perfect view. Umpire refuses to report him. Holland gets straight back up and takes the free kick. Holland plays the next week. No long term injury to Holland. Ian Collins (former Carlton player) intervenes, reports Grant and rubs him out.

Cripps wins a Brownlow. Chooses to bump, leaves the ground with viscous intent, collects Ah Chee high and knocks him unconscious. Ah Chee can't take the free kick. Is subbed out of the game. He then misses the next two weeks due to concussion symptoms. He is reported and given two weeks. Blues take it to the Tribunal. Tribunal agrees with the MRP and gives him two weeks. They then appeal the Tribunal decision and win. The overrule goes against everything that the AFL has said about choosing to bump and then being responsible for your actions.

I still can't believe Grant was robbed. I still can't believe Cripps got off.

I agree. Berry too, goes the eye and gets to play in a Prelim. Another broken system at the AFL.

Grant's one was so long ago, it's probably hard to compare the two systems but he really must be wondering how many ladders he walked under in 97.

[GVGjr]

Bont really had a stinker by his standards.

There was a 3 or 4 week patch where he just wasn't himself.

[Testekill]

Bont really had a stinker by his standards.

His body was just not right this season, hopefully we got him straight into surgery and rehab so that he can be right for the preseason.

[bornadog]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fc705qgaAAI30P3?format=jpg&name=medium

[bornadog]

Jack Macrae has become the 10th Western bulldogs player to record 100 career Brownlow votes…


176 - G.Dempsey
175 - S.West
134 - M.Bontempelli
130 - N.Ware
112 - C.Grant
112 - T.Whitten Snr
112 - T.Liberatore Snr
111 - M.Boyd
111 - J.Schultz
101 - JACK MACRAE

[Axe Man]

Jack Macrae has become the 10th Western bulldogs player to record 100 career Brownlow votes…


176 - G.Dempsey
175 - S.West
134 - M.Bontempelli
130 - N.Ware
112 - C.Grant
112 - T.Whitten Snr
112 - T.Liberatore Snr
111 - M.Boyd
111 - J.Schultz
101 - JACK MACRAE

Bont will almost certainly end his career as our all time leading vote getter yet may never actually win.

[MrMahatma]

Bont will almost certainly end his career as our all time leading vote getter yet may never actually win.

He'll win next year.

[bornadog]

He'll win next year.

When Bont is injury free, he is a match winner

[Ozza]

Jack Macrae has become the 10th Western bulldogs player to record 100 career Brownlow votes…


176 - G.Dempsey
175 - S.West
134 - M.Bontempelli
130 - N.Ware
112 - C.Grant
112 - T.Whitten Snr
112 - T.Liberatore Snr
111 - M.Boyd
111 - J.Schultz
101 - JACK MACRAE

A question for you - if the Dempsey figure including any years where there was double voting? (I think I recall there was a year or two where both umpires voted so a player could get 6 votes....I may be wrong).

[GVGjr]

A question for you - if the Dempsey figure including any years where there was double voting? (I think I recall there was a year or two where both umpires voted so a player could get 6 votes....I may be wrong).

Good question but I think they were averaged out.
Dempsey won with just 20 votes.
Did Graham Moss win a Brownlow with 50 votes around the same time because of the double votes? Teasdale with nearly 60.

Dempsey got a swag of Brownlow votes at North as well.

[Topdog]

A question for you - if the Dempsey figure including any years where there was double voting? (I think I recall there was a year or two where both umpires voted so a player could get 6 votes....I may be wrong).

They have counted them as the doubles.

https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/G/Gary_Dempsey.html

If you count the Footscray years individually you get 176 but then look on this page

https://afltables.com/afl/brownlow/totals0.html

and it tells you in 76 and 77 they have an Adjusted column were those years votes are cut in half.

So Dempsey at the Bulldogs would have had 149.5 votes

[bornadog]

A question for you - if the Dempsey figure including any years where there was double voting? (I think I recall there was a year or two where both umpires voted so a player could get 6 votes....I may be wrong).

Dempsey won the Brownlow in 1975. The dual umpire voting was brought in 1976, but abandoned in 1978

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Chris Grant loses a Brownlow medal to suspension. It was a stray arm that accidently hit Holland high. The umpire paid a free kick and had a perfect view. Umpire refuses to report him. Holland gets straight back up and takes the free kick. Holland plays the next week. No long term injury to Holland. Ian Collins (former Carlton player) intervenes, reports Grant and rubs him out.

Cripps wins a Brownlow. Chooses to bump, leaves the ground with viscous intent, collects Ah Chee high and knocks him unconscious. Ah Chee can't take the free kick. Is subbed out of the game. He then misses the next two weeks due to concussion symptoms. He is reported and given two weeks. Blues take it to the Tribunal. Tribunal agrees with the MRP and gives him two weeks. They then appeal the Tribunal decision and win. The overrule goes against everything that the AFL has said about choosing to bump and then being responsible for your actions.

I still can't believe Grant was robbed. I still can't believe Cripps got off.

I thought the same. A sick feeling.
Nature has taken care of arrogant Collins at 79 yo but is ready to reclaim him.

[Bulldog4life]

https://www.police.vic.gov.au/police-arrest-four-people-re-investigation-illegal-betting-brownlow-medal

Monday 14 November 2022 9:43am
Detectives from the Sporting Integrity Intelligence Unit have arrested 4 people in relation to an investigation into suspicious betting activity linked to the Australian Football League (AFL) Brownlow Medal.

The investigation relates to the release of the Brownlow Medal voting tallies from matches in the AFL 2022 season.

It’s alleged that a person with knowledge of the voting tally of these matches distributed the information to a group of people known to them.

Police are investigating how many matches may have had votes released, and exactly how much money was awarded from the bets.

At this stage, police have no information to suggest that the outcome of the votes were impacted as the allegations relate solely to the distribution of information.

The investigation is being conducted in conjunction with the AFL and Sport Integrity Australia.

Detectives executed warrants at multiple residential properties today in Glenroy, Kilsyth, Oak Park, Drouin, Craigieburn and Doreen, seizing several mobile phones and electronic items and arresting four people, including:

This includes:

• Two 32-year-old men from Glenroy

• 29-year-old man from Oak Park

• 27-year-old man from Drouin

All four men are currently in custody assisting police with their enquiries and the investigation is ongoing.

The criminal offences police are investigating are engaging in conduct that corrupts or would corrupt a betting outcome of event or event contingency, and using corrupt conduct information for betting purposes. These offences carry up to 10 years imprisonment.

Anyone with information about crime or suspicious activity is urged to make a report with Crime Stoppers on 1800 333 000 or by submitting a confidential report online at www.crimestoppersvic.com.au

Quotes attributable to Intelligence & Covert Support Command, Commander Deb Robertson:

“We have a dedicated team of detectives at the Sporting Integrity Intelligence Unit who are committed to investigating any and all allegations of corruption in sport.

“Victorians are well known for their love of AFL and in particular, the prestigious Brownlow Medal award, but equally they want to know that there is integrity, fairness and honesty behind this award.

“We have been working with the AFL and Sport Integrity Australia in relation to these matters, and we will continue to work together to target, disrupt and apprehend people who commit these offences.

“The public assistance is a really key part – we know there are people out there involved in sport who see or hear things they know are not right and we need them to speak up. This can also be done confidentially via Crime Stoppers.”

Alanna Jarry

Victoria Police Media Unit

110413

[EasternWest]

How old is Ray Chamberlain and where does he live?

[bornadog]

Should there be a recount of the Brownlow where the umpires who is involved, votes are taken away?

[angelopetraglia]

How old is Ray Chamberlain and where does he live?

Ha. Razor is 46.

[Scraggers]

Apparently one of the four arrested is an umpire

[GVGjr]

Should there be a recount of the Brownlow where the umpires who is involved, votes are taken away?

Can I ask why? The suggestion is that the voting information were leaked not that the votes were rigged.
I don't think there needs to be a recount or votes cancelled unless there is a suggestion that votes were compromised.

[Grantysghost]

Can I ask why? The suggestion is that the voting information were leaked not that the votes were rigged.
I don't think there needs to be a recount or votes cancelled unless there is a suggestion that votes were compromised.

I'm with BAD it throws the entire system into debate.
If the votes aren't secured, which clearly they are not, how can you be expected to trust they have acted with integrity in all facets of the process?

[EasternWest]

Ha. Razor is 46.

Damn.

[soupman]

I'm with BAD it throws the entire system into debate.
If the votes aren't secured, which clearly they are not, how can you be expected to trust they have acted with integrity in all facets of the process?

Depends what you count as secured.

My impression is that no undue access to the votes as a whole would've happened, more that with the umpire involved they have probably just been privy to enough games (probably 2 a weekend) to be able to give their mates a good heads up that "so and so is polling well", except more specific.

[Grantysghost]

Depends what you count as secured.

My impression is that no undue access to the votes as a whole would've happened, more that with the umpire involved they have probably just been privy to enough games (probably 2 a weekend) to be able to give their mates a good heads up that "so and so is polling well", except more specific.

Who would know, that's my issue.

Maybe you give Cripps 3 instead of 1 this week because you've got 500 on him.

[Stevo]

I'm with BAD it throws the entire system into debate.
If the votes aren't secured, which clearly they are not, how can you be expected to trust they have acted with integrity in all facets of the process?

Trump logic at it's finest. :) Based on what has been reported we just have to wait to see if the voting has been impacted.

[Grantysghost]

Trump logic at it's finest. :) Based on what has been reported we just have to wait to see if the voting has been impacted.

Ha ye gods I retract it then.

[EasternWest]

Trump logic at it's finest. :) Based on what has been reported we just have to wait to see if the voting has been impacted.

Stop the steal.

[soupman]

Who would know, that's my issue.

Maybe you give Cripps 3 instead of 1 this week because you've got 500 on him.

Dont disagree but unsure how you make it more secure when no matter what there will be a human issuing the votes who could be tempted.

[Grantysghost]

Dont disagree but unsure how you make it more secure when no matter what there will be a human issuing the votes who could be tempted.

Yes true

[jeemak]

I reckon there'd be a lot of people in the umpiring fraternity sweating on whether the umpire in question is going to deal his way out of his current predicament.

[GVGjr]

Former AFL umpire Dean Margetts says he’s been unsettled by the allegations of suspicious betting activity on the 2022 Brownlow Medal.

Victoria Police arrested four people on Monday as part of an investigation on Monday after an investigation relating to the release of Brownlow Votes by a person with inside knowledge before the count.

An AFL umpire – who is yet to be named – was one of the four arrested. Speaking on Monday afternoon, Margetts – who made his umpiring debut in 2002 and officiated 377 games – says he never saw a scandal such as this in his time involved at the elite level.

“It was unsettling, that was probably the word that came to mind,” he said on SEN WA’s The Run Home.

“It was something in my 20 years as an AFL umpire we’d never experienced. It’s a little bit like fight club. What’s the one rule of fight club? We never talk about fight club, that’s Brownlow Medal for us.

“We do our job and treat it very seriously, but it’s one thing we never discuss. So for this to come out, it’s a bit of a shock and its probably unsettled 34 field umpires today as well.”

Margetts added: “From an umpiring point of view, I can’t stress enough that it’s just something we treat so seriously because we know how important the award is and we know umpires are an integral part of the game.”

“The Brownlow Medal voting is something we take extremely seriously and professionally.”

Margetts also stated the league’s rules for umpires are crystal clear and that he never once discussed Brownlow votes outside of the process after each game he officiated.

“An AFL umpire can earn north of 100k per year, so for this person to potentially lose their contract, it’s a pretty significant penalty to face if they’re proven to be guilty,” he stated.

“I don’t think the umpire involved can be putting his hand up and say, ‘no one told me’, because in my 20 years I’ve been signing contracts that quite clearly stated it in all the agreements I put my name to.

Patrick Cripps won this year’s award with 29 votes in a thrilling count that came down to the final game.

[GVGjr]

Michael Pell is the umpire arrested as part of Victoria Police's investigation into the Brownlow betting scandal, reports the Herald Sun.

It’s understood Pell, 32, was interviewed by detectives in relation to allegations he engaged in conduct that corrupts or would corrupt a betting outcome.

Reports have stated there are numerous rounds in question for the suspicious betting activity.

Pell was promoted to the AFL's field umpires list earlier this year.

The maximum sentence for the alleged offending is 10 years imprisonment.

https://images.ctfassets.net/u8w3l566ay8a/4hfKROmwnbd7SokwJKGKvj/50e81818a1d6bc2c992f327f73e7235a/Pell.jfif?w=980&h=520&fit=fill&f=faces

[GVGjr]

I've gone through the games he umpired and nothing looks suspicious in terms of the Brownlow medal candidates.
Some of the lesser games have mixed results.
Any review would need to look at other games as well so I'll leave that to the experts.

[MrMahatma]

It’s spot betting on particular matches. So if he told his buddies who he gave votes to, they could’ve got on it I guess?

[divvydan]

Based on the games he umpired, Powell-Pepper's 3 votes in Rd 11 is the one that jumps off the page as being such an outlier that a huge amount could be made on it.

[Stevo]

It’s spot betting on particular matches. So if he told his buddies who he gave votes to, they could’ve got on it I guess?

All sports are scrutinized when betting is involved. Horse racing is full of handlers, owners and trainers leaking information to friends and Cricket and Tennis is reviewed ball by ball and point by point to check for what they call exotic bets.
We have seen what the AFL do to players who bet $10 and if there is any suggestion that umpires are fixing games or votes they will get the max penalties.

[Stevo]

According to Blobo umpire Pell told mates who got the votes in games and they placed bets. No need for a recount at the moment Trumpy.

[GVGjr]

Based on the games he umpired, Powell-Pepper's 3 votes in Rd 11 is the one that jumps off the page as being such an outlier that a huge amount could be made on it.

3 umpires give the votes so it's unlikely that votes can be controlled to that extent. I do wonder if that was one of the games bet on though.

The positives are that the AFL and the betting agencies really do go looking for these types of betting trends and try and make sure there is some integrity in the midfielders B&F. Spot fixing is potentially a real blight on any sport and the Brownlow is the biggest betting in the AFL.

[divvydan]

3 umpires give the votes so it's unlikely that votes can be controlled to that extent. I do wonder if that was one of the games bet on though.

The positives are that the AFL and the betting agencies really do go looking for these types of betting trends and try and make sure there is some integrity in the midfielders B&F. Spot fixing is potentially a real blight on any sport and the Brownlow is the biggest betting in the AFL.

Yeah, wasn't implying the votes themselves are rigged, just that knowing SPP gets 3 votes in that game is huge in terms of betting potential.

[GVGjr]

Yeah, wasn't implying the votes themselves are rigged, just that knowing SPP gets 3 votes in that game is huge in terms of betting potential.

Agreed, if he's let his mates know that SPP got 3 votes in a game when someone else dominated possessions it would be easy for them to place a few bets and clean up. It will be interesting to finally know to what extent that he and his mates have benefited from the insider knowledge.
There has been rumours about game information being leaked for years and I think Malcolm Blight said he was told he won the brownlow years ago and prepared a speech accordingly.

[macca]

Yeah, wasn't implying the votes themselves are rigged, just that knowing SPP gets 3 votes in that game is huge in terms of betting potential.

It be interesting to see how this was caught out

Was it the betting agency complained there was anormally o SPP vote? From one is the umpires mates account?
I reallly wonder how much was the win in $$$ ?
One of the mates for caught out?

I am surprised it’s taken this long for such a thing to be have found out

[EasternWest]

It be interesting to see how this was caught out

Was it the betting agency complained there was anormally o SPP vote? From one is the umpires mates account?
I reallly wonder how much was the win in $$$ ?
One of the mates for caught out?

I am surprised it’s taken this long for such a thing to be have found out

Be pretty easy wouldn't it? Inordinately large bets on certain players in certain games, cross check for any commonality. Find same umpire in every game.