Have they got the balance right?

[GVGjr]

Have they got the balance right? The burning questions for the Bulldogs in 2023 (https://www.sen.com.au/news/2022/10/20/have-they-got-the-balance-right-the-burning-questions-for-the-bulldogs-in/)

https://images.ctfassets.net/u8w3l566ay8a/3BFt7uVP75AphML0pcM7ym/549794d9909db3f5208b02c02fb474d4/01MeWB22DB1499.jpg?w=980&h=520&fit=fill&f=faces

With the 2022 AFL season complete, Kane Cornes and Garry Lyon have gone through all 18 clubs and come up with burning questions for each.

The Bulldogs finished 8th in 2022, with a season of ups and downs being fittingly capped off by blowing a 41-point lead to Fremantle in an Elimination Final.

Lyon asks have they got the balance right?

“When I look at their recruiting, so from a forward-line point of view, they have Aaron (Naughton), they have (Jamarra) Ugle-Hagan, they have (Sam) Darcy, they have (Josh) Bruce, and they’ve added (Rory) Lobb, is that balanced?” he questioned on SEN Breakfast.

“Sam Darcy, we’ve only seen him for four games but he looks like he’s going to be able to play, Ugle-Hagan has got to find the consistency but yes looked better as the season wore on.

“Liam Jones will hold down the spot in defence… would you be throwing Naughton, is he the potential one to go back or not?”

Cornes agrees that the Bulldogs do have an unbalanced team, however is excited by the “spine” of the list.

“It doesn’t seem (balanced) on paper does it, you questioned whether they have plans for Darcy to play back and whether he’s going to be there for 10 years and play that role because I’m not sure how they all fit in,” he said.

“They explained that pretty well I thought, Sam Power after the trade period, he said ‘look clearly we are excited about the future but those young players need some support now, and that’s where the Jones and the Lobb ones come in.’

“They have the best young spine and most exciting spine in the game, Naughton and Ugle-Hagan… key position players, one of the two playing centre half-forward, Darcy at centre half-back I would have thought.

“Lobb is going to be in there as well, you’ve got (Marcus) Bontempelli in the middle, it’s frightening… who has a better young and more exciting spine?”

Despite being excited about their future, Cornes asks are the Bulldogs professional enough?

“Are they a motivated, hungry group is my question... they want for nothing on their list, but there’s the intangibles,” he said.

“Are they professional enough, I don’t know, I hear things about the Western Bulldogs.

“They can win a premiership next year, provided those things sort themselves out.”

Lyon voiced similar worries, viewing the departure of star Josh Dunkley as cause for concern.

“Two words, Josh Dunkley… why was Josh Dunkley desperate to get out two years ago and desperate to get out (again)?” he asked.

“You can say, ‘I want to live in Brisbane,’ two years ago he didn’t, two years ago he wanted to live 20 minutes down the road at Essendon.

“I know (the Bulldogs would) deny it, but I’d love to put the lasso of truth around Josh Dunkley.

“Everyone hears the same sort of stuff, but it’s the challenge now for Luke is to get this group back and if there are any issues there, culturally or otherwise.”

[GVGjr]

Cornes lists the following observations

Despite being excited about their future, Cornes asks are the Bulldogs professional enough?

“Are they a motivated, hungry group is my question... they want for nothing on their list, but there’s the intangibles,” he said.

“Are they professional enough, I don’t know, I hear things about the Western Bulldogs.


I think we have opened the door for these type of observations.

[Grantysghost]

Cornes lists the following observations

Despite being excited about their future, Cornes asks are the Bulldogs professional enough?

“Are they a motivated, hungry group is my question... they want for nothing on their list, but there’s the intangibles,” he said.

“Are they professional enough, I don’t know, I hear things about the Western Bulldogs.


I think we have opened the door for these type of observations.

I think some of the best coaches walk that line between mate and mentor well.
Lethal, Thompson, Clarkson, Scott...
I do wonder if Bevo is too close with the players at times and so they'll take liberties others wouldn't.
I mean we are trash talking Dunks but it probably should set off alarm bells.
Maybe by getting rid of the players we did during trade period we've gone some way to addressing this.

[GVGjr]

I think some of the best coaches walk that line between mate and mentor well.
Lethal, Thompson, Clarkson, Scott...
I do wonder if Bevo is too close with the players at times and so they'll take liberties others wouldn't.
I mean we are trash talking Dunks but it probably should set off alarm bells.
Maybe by getting rid of the players we did during trade period we've gone some way to addressing this.

I've often felt that Bevo needs to have an assistant coach who's a bit of a hard arse to help balance things.

[mjp]

Cornes is a peanut at times but, at the same time, he does talk about 'stuff' that most other commentators tend to avoid.

When you watch pretty average groups like the one Collingwood rolled out this year - as well as (cough) the team that won the premiership - get rolling it is generally because:

1/. They are predictable to each other which allows them to defend well and retain possession when the pressure is on.
2/. Players are able to roll into different positions relatively seamlessly - if only for small periods of time - without impacting on the overall team structure.

I mean, yes, Jeremy Cameron covers up for a lot of problems but - player for player - we match up OK with the Cats. But when we play them...well, we aren't good enough for long enough. Their relentless approach wins out. They know their roles, they sacrifice for one another (they each know their turn will come) and just do the basics right. We are dependent on Bont being brilliant and Naughton clunking marks vs 4.

We all know this stuff is true. Getting the group together - it starts off the field - is the first step. If the Dunks show plus Hunter (whatever has been going on there) assist in this, well, great.

[Happy Days]

Stopped reading at Naughton goes back. It's the new "if they could just get a key forward". Lazy boring nothingness.

[GVGjr]

What did everyone think of Garry's comments about putting the lasso of truth on Dunks?
The media has some strong speculation of what our challenges might have been over the last two years but the club is keeping it in house as you would expect and the media just keeps throwing out the questions around that something isn't quite right.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Everything discussed in this thread is spot on. For the most part, even though I've been critical of list management, our list is good enough to win it all based on talent. But we're not getting a performance that is the sum of its part and most of that is down to discipline and not doing the little things. The 1 percenters. The selfless things that go unnoticed but help your team-mate and team.

Why we're poor at doing these things as well as being poor setting up around the ground , staying focused for 4 qrtrs etc is unknown - is it lack of on field leadership? Poor coaching? Divide in the playing group? Selfish players or culture? Who knows. But Dunkley wanting out so bad is a worrying sign and I do suspect something isn't right.

[Mitcha]

What did everyone think of Garry's comments about putting the lasso of truth on Dunks?
It's a very fair question to ask, I mean how long does a hot pocket need to be in the microwave for it to reach optimum eating temperature?

[Happy Days]

Personally I like projecting onto Dunkley rather than actually finding out if he had legitimate grievances.

[Mofra]

What did everyone think of Garry's comments about putting the lasso of truth on Dunks?
The media has some strong speculation of what our challenges might have been over the last two years but the club is keeping it in house as you would expect and the media just keeps throwing out the questions around that something isn't quite right.
The 'professionalism' smoke has been blowing pretty darn hot since the 2020 hub shenanigans. I think some of us have heard a lot of troubling things.

That Dunkley walked and Hunter was shoved out, under contract, for peanuts (and with us kicking in some of his contract apparently) speaks volumes.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

The 'professionalism' smoke has been blowing pretty darn hot since the 2020 hub shenanigans. I think some of us have heard a lot of troubling things.

That Dunkley walked and Hunter was shoved out, under contract, for peanuts (and with us kicking in some of his contract apparently) speaks volumes.

You have to wonder whether it's JUST Hunter or more than that. Hunters issues sound pretty confined to himself (although I don't know the details). I suspect the latter is true as we had intentions to get rid of Hunter early on and would this not have addressed Dunkleys concerns if it was only about Hunter? Or perhaps Josh had already committed himself to leaving and the clubs decision to get rid of Lachie wasn't going to change that. Who knows. Well....the club does.

[jeemak]

Dunkley's leaving doesn't have to be just one thing.

It's entirely feasible that he wanted to be super close to his girlfriend's parents, his best mates partner and kid, away from his controlling father, part of a mega deal and at a new club that doesn't have some cultural issues as far as he can tell all at once.

What I find interesting is that he didn't feel he could help lead the club to a better place.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Dunkley's leaving doesn't have to be just one thing.

It's entirely feasible that he wanted to be super close to his girlfriend's parents, his best mates partner and kid, away from his controlling father, part of a mega deal and at a new club that doesn't have some cultural issues as far as he can tell all at once.

What I find interesting is that he didn't feel he could help lead the club to a better place.

He doesn't strike me as leadership material. He might be a professional and set good standards but players who predominantly think about themselves don't usually make good leaders. Josh has made a decision for himself and only for himself. That's fine. But those players won't make great leaders so he wasn't going to change any of the issues we might be facing.

Unfortunately for us, I can't think of a strong leader who could change any potential issues....

[Grantysghost]

He doesn't strike me as leadership material. He might be a professional and set good standards but players who predominantly think about themselves don't usually make good leaders. Josh has made a decision for himself and only for himself. That's fine. But those players won't make great leaders so he wasn't going to change any of the issues we might be facing.

Unfortunately for us, I can't think of a strong leader who could change any potential issues....

Actually you raise a very good point, do we lack leaders?

Personally I'd be pushing Alex Keath. He worked the room like a master at a function I went to recently (won't mention what it was for in case I upset Jee).
Josh Bruce might have some natural leadership in him too.

Macrae, I get he's a solid citizen and Bevo was trying to reward him but I think it's not his bag.

[bornadog]

The 'professionalism' smoke has been blowing pretty darn hot since the 2020 hub shenanigans. I think some of us have heard a lot of troubling things.

That Dunkley walked and Hunter was shoved out, under contract, for peanuts (and with us kicking in some of his contract apparently) speaks volumes.

As I mentioned in the Dunkley thread, his Uncle tweeted to me that Hunter was the issue and it was about time he was gone. He has since deleted. :D

[Bulldog4life]

As I mentioned in the Dunkley thread, his Uncle tweeted to me that Hunter was the issue and it was about time he was gone. He has since deleted. :D

Uncle Dave. Most likely reading the Dunkley thread.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

I suspect the voice of the playing group is being listened to and it is this voice that has pointed the bone at McCartney, Stringer, Hunter and Dunks.

[GVGjr]

Dunkley's leaving doesn't have to be just one thing.

It's entirely feasible that he wanted to be super close to his girlfriend's parents, his best mates partner and kid, away from his controlling father, part of a mega deal and at a new club that doesn't have some cultural issues as far as he can tell all at once.

What I find interesting is that he didn't feel he could help lead the club to a better place.

He might have also been under the impression that the footy department weren't as serious about addressing some of the challenges.
I don't think we should dismiss that either.

[GVGjr]

The 'professionalism' smoke has been blowing pretty darn hot since the 2020 hub shenanigans. I think some of us have heard a lot of troubling things.

That Dunkley walked and Hunter was shoved out, under contract, for peanuts (and with us kicking in some of his contract apparently) speaks volumes.

You have to ask the question why we can't or didn't address some of the behavioral challenges earlier?

[Mofra]

You have to ask the question why we can't or didn't address some of the behavioral challenges earlier?
Maybe we tried and this year they got worse?
Or maybe Dunkley did try to voice those concerns and didn't feel his concerns were given the gravitas they should have?

Nobody knows for sure, but there is far too much smoke generated for there to be no fire at all.

[lemmon]

Some huge runs in the Shield - Handscomb 281*, Renshaw 200*, Harper 132*, Harris 111 and Neser 136.

[Grantysghost]

Maybe we tried and this year they got worse?
Or maybe Dunkley did try to voice those concerns and didn't feel his concerns were given the gravitas they should have?

Nobody knows for sure, but there is far too much smoke generated for there to be no fire at all.

There's fire, however if Hunter has been through what I think he has I don't blame him for one second.

Maybe it got big on him the stress, but you would hope Dunks understands things aren't black and white.

I'm leaning towards it being an excuse for wanting to push #brandhotpocket

[Axe Man]

Some huge runs in the Shield - Handscomb 281*, Renshaw 200*, Harper 132*, Harris 111 and Neser 136.

I know you love cricket Lemmon but there is a time and place. ;)

[bornadog]

There's fire, however if Hunter has been through what I think he has I don't blame him for one second.

Maybe it got big on him the stress, but you would hope Dunks understands things aren't black and white.

I'm leaning towards it being an excuse for wanting to push #brandhotpocket

Zorko will look after him

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Actually you raise a very good point, do we lack leaders?

Personally I'd be pushing Alex Keath. He worked the room like a master at a function I went to recently (won't mention what it was for in case I upset Jee).
Josh Bruce might have some natural leadership in him too.

Macrae, I get he's a solid citizen and Bevo was trying to reward him but I think it's not his bag.

The big question for me is - The Bont. I love him and think he's one of the greatest to pull on the jumper but he is our captain and on field leadership needs to go through him. He's far and away our best player but does that make him a good and strong leader?

I'm not for one second questioning his leadership. I'd have no idea. He obviously commands respect but he does seem a quiet type out on the field. Does he have it in him to command the troops? I think he's certainly capable of it but has he up to this point?

[Bulldog Revolution]

I tend to think that there is likely some truth and or issues that needed to be resolved internally, but at the same time Dunkley leaving is 98% about money, and contract terms ($). Now you could argue that if we'd fixed stuff internally then he would have been staying, but Im not sure I buy that. The other thing I'd say is that its a fine line for a lot of clubs/teams in holding the internal stuff together.

Regardless, we haven't created a consistent culture or team since the premiership and thats been disappointing.

As mjp points out - we match up ok with teams like Geelong, and play some great footy in patches, but we just dont/cant do it for long enough, and rely too much on a star players being brilliant, than getting the collective effort of a team who are in synch and prepared to do all the team 1 & 2%ers

[bulldogsthru&thru]

There's fire, however if Hunter has been through what I think he has I don't blame him for one second.

Maybe it got big on him the stress, but you would hope Dunks understands things aren't black and white.

I'm leaning towards it being an excuse for wanting to push #brandhotpocket

I think this is just another clue into how brand Dunkley thinks. tEaM

[Mantis]

Actually you raise a very good point, do we lack leaders?

Personally I'd be pushing Alex Keath. He worked the room like a master at a function I went to recently (won't mention what it was for in case I upset Jee).
Josh Bruce might have some natural leadership in him too.

Macrae, I get he's a solid citizen and Bevo was trying to reward him but I think it's not his bag.

Given both players form in 2022 we need to ensure they are going to be in our best 22 before looking to place them as official leaders.

We made the mistake with Wallis and it would be silly to go down that path again.

[MrMahatma]

What about an alternate take?

- Talented list
- Made GF last year
- We care for our players so gave Hunter so much support
- Strong leadership was shown when he didn’t live up to his side, and when Dunkley also had to go.
- Strong leadership was shown 2 years ago when Dunks was (reportedly) offered $800k per year by Essington (IE: maybe he just wanted to get big bucks… not “wanted out”?)
- We had a down year but have addressed, at least to some degree, our structural issues
- Who could’ve predicted Keath would play like a 60yr old this season?
- Bont was inured since Rd 1

I think the questions need to be asked but last I heard this group aren’t punching each other at the restaurant. Or are they? I don’t hear rumours apart from mainstream media and to be honest, most of the “rumours” sound a bit “meh”.

Do we have enough “mongrel” and “never say die” in the squad? Dunno. I reckon you put Morris and M Boyd into our squad and you don’t catch us for a few years. We aren’t far off.

[bornadog]

What about an alternate take?

- Talented list
- Made GF last year
- We care for our players so gave Hunter so much support
- Strong leadership was shown when he didn’t live up to his side, and when Dunkley also had to go.
- Strong leadership was shown 2 years ago when Dunks was (reportedly) offered $800k per year by Essington (IE: maybe he just wanted to get big bucks… not “wanted out”?)
- We had a down year but have addressed, at least to some degree, our structural issues
- Who could’ve predicted Keath would play like a 60yr old this season?
- Bont was inured since Rd 1

I think the questions need to be asked but last I heard this group aren’t punching each other at the restaurant. Or are they? I don’t hear rumours apart from mainstream media and to be honest, most of the “rumours” sound a bit “meh”.

Do we have enough “mongrel” and “never say die” in the squad? Dunno. I reckon you put Morris and M Boyd into our squad and you don’t catch us for a few years. We aren’t far off.

Some positivity, I like it

[Mofra]

Do we have enough “mongrel” and “never say die” in the squad? Dunno. I reckon you put Morris and M Boyd into our squad and you don’t catch us for a few years. We aren’t far off.
Rhylee West - there's one.
Surely he knows we need a defensive mid in our centre square rotation roster now, and he's the most likely to take those minutes?
He attacks the body & the ball with intent.
It's innate, you either have it or you don't. To me he projects as a Jack Viney type player and you take the flaws with the good with those types.

[Grantysghost]

Given both players form in 2022 we need to ensure they are going to be in our best 22 before looking to place them as official leaders.

We made the mistake with Wallis and it would be silly to go down that path again.

Yes good point Mantis.

[WBFC4FFC]

Some positivity, I like it

Given the changes in the off-season, the issue now is mental toughness. Too many times the side went missing in games, with the defensive side lacking. This is a matter work-rate and has to be resolved.

[Grantysghost]

The big question for me is - The Bont. I love him and think he's one of the greatest to pull on the jumper but he is our captain and on field leadership needs to go through him. He's far and away our best player but does that make him a good and strong leader?

I'm not for one second questioning his leadership. I'd have no idea. He obviously commands respect but he does seem a quiet type out on the field. Does he have it in him to command the troops? I think he's certainly capable of it but has he up to this point?

I think he is very good. He's not the most overt on the field but off it seems to be quite a commanding presence (and on it with his actions).

Personally I don't doubt Marcus, but I get where the question comes from.

[Scraggers]

Given both players form in 2022 we need to ensure they are going to be in our best 22 before looking to place them as official leaders.

We made the mistake with Wallis and it would be silly to go down that path again.

Whilst I agree with your first point, I'm not sure how we made the mistake with Wally. Yes he was not on-field, but his off-field leadership was spoken about quite frequently by the playing group.

[mjp]

Whilst I agree with your first point, I'm not sure how we made the mistake with Wally. Yes he was not on-field, but his off-field leadership was spoken about quite frequently by the playing group.

Yeah...but how does that help you half way through a grand final when Melbourne turn a 3-goal deficit into a 2 goal lead and the season is on the line? Leaders need to PLAY!

[Swoop]

What about an alternate take?

- Talented list
- Made GF last year
- We care for our players so gave Hunter so much support
- Strong leadership was shown when he didn’t live up to his side, and when Dunkley also had to go.
- Strong leadership was shown 2 years ago when Dunks was (reportedly) offered $800k per year by Essington (IE: maybe he just wanted to get big bucks… not “wanted out”?)
- We had a down year but have addressed, at least to some degree, our structural issues
- Who could’ve predicted Keath would play like a 60yr old this season?
- Bont was inured since Rd 1

I think the questions need to be asked but last I heard this group aren’t punching each other at the restaurant. Or are they? I don’t hear rumours apart from mainstream media and to be honest, most of the “rumours” sound a bit “meh”.

Do we have enough “mongrel” and “never say die” in the squad? Dunno. I reckon you put Morris and M Boyd into our squad and you don’t catch us for a few years. We aren’t far off.

Love this!

[Bullies]

The 'professionalism' smoke has been blowing pretty darn hot since the 2020 hub shenanigans. I think some of us have heard a lot of troubling things.

That Dunkley walked and Hunter was shoved out, under contract, for peanuts (and with us kicking in some of his contract apparently) speaks volumes. I was hoping Dunks would have captained the club but not to be.

You are spot on Mofra about the issues about professionalism. Hopefully the move they made with Hunter is a wake up call for others but then again you would have thought the same when Stringer/Dahl were moved on.

It is a problem when one person has so much say within the club.

[Bullies]

There's fire, however if Hunter has been through what I think he has I don't blame him for one second.

Maybe it got big on him the stress, but you would hope Dunks understands things aren't black and white.

I'm leaning towards it being an excuse for wanting to push #brandhotpocket Maybe it got to the stage where the player didn't learn from his first and second and third mistake and it kept happening. Dunks decided enough is enough.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

What about an alternate take?

- Talented list
- Made GF last year
- We care for our players so gave Hunter so much support
- Strong leadership was shown when he didn’t live up to his side, and when Dunkley also had to go.
- Strong leadership was shown 2 years ago when Dunks was (reportedly) offered $800k per year by Essington (IE: maybe he just wanted to get big bucks… not “wanted out”?)
- We had a down year but have addressed, at least to some degree, our structural issues
- Who could’ve predicted Keath would play like a 60yr old this season?
- Bont was inured since Rd 1

I think the questions need to be asked but last I heard this group aren’t punching each other at the restaurant. Or are they? I don’t hear rumours apart from mainstream media and to be honest, most of the “rumours” sound a bit “meh”.

Do we have enough “mongrel” and “never say die” in the squad? Dunno. I reckon you put Morris and M Boyd into our squad and you don’t catch us for a few years. We aren’t far off.

I would add Liam Picken to Morris and M Boyd, all fine on field leaders including also Easton Wood, which is now lacking.

[bornadog]

Maybe it got to the stage where the player didn't learn from his first and second and third mistake and it kept happening. Dunks decided enough is enough.

Dunks decided he wanted to be number one and is jealous of Bont on $1 million and Adz on $900k - make no mistake. The non-professional stuff happens at every club. Hunter had issues for sure.

[MrMahatma]

I would add Liam Picken to Morris and M Boyd, all fine on field leaders including also Easton Wood, which is now lacking.

Bumped into Morris in a pet shop in Nth Brisbane (Stafford) yesterday. Had a brief chat. Did the fanboy thing and got a selfie. Great guy. Looks to have relocated permanently up here.

[WBFC4FFC]

Dunks decided he wanted to be number one and is jealous of Bont on $1 million and Adz on $900k - make no mistake. The non-professional stuff happens at every club. Hunter had issues for sure.

Agree.

Dunks is saying everything other than Cash as a reason for leaving. The fact the club removed Hunter was not enough for Dunks to change his mind tells you it is BS.

The fact Dunks is happy to move to a Club where he does not know who the coach is and/or does not care enough says a fair bit too.

Who knows, maybe he'll get a personal endorsement deal from Hancock Prospecting, given the recent days events?!?!