Always Right Match Committee Round 13 v Port Adelaide

[Scraggers]

Welcome to the Always Right Match Committee Thread. The Match Committee threads has been named after long time WOOF member Always Right who tragically passed away in March 2018.

If you were on the Western Bulldogs match committee, what changes would you make after our Round Twelve match against Geelong for our Round Thirteen match against Port at Marvel on Friday night.

For those new to these threads, please give a brief explanation for your changes ... this would add a lot of value to the discussion

[GVGjr]

Bump

[bulldogtragic]

Delist McNeil now.

[bulldogtragic]

Delist McNeil now.

Richards injured.

Then what? Buku, West & Hannan.

The way we played. The way Port played. It’s deckchairs on the titanic stuff. May as well keep playing JOD.

[macca]

Richards injured.

Then what? Buku, West & Hannan.

The way we played. The way Port played. It’s deckchairs on the titanic stuff. May as well keep playing JOD.

why not Poulter, Raak and Clearly ? See where they are at on our list.

Half way through the season, either we splutter into the 8, or go through our list and see who can play?

We need to put the last half of this season to cut deep and set up for next year.

[bulldogtragic]

why not Poulter, Raak and Clearly ? See where they are at on our list.

Half way through the season, either we splutter into the 8, or go through our list and see who can play?

We need to put the last half of this season to cut deep and set up for next year.

Sure why not? Doesn’t really matter. It’s a slow motion car crash, the passengers week to week are incidental. But there’s much merit to what you say.

[GVGjr]

In Poulter and VDM
Out JOD and Richards

A rangy winger/defender and a speedy defender will allow us to move Daniel back into the midfield.

JOD just not ready for the seniors. Richards will be missed.
McNeil doesn't grab his chances like he should.

[westbulldog]

In Cleary Crozier
Out Richards McNeill

[JanLorMill]

Gardner and OBrien should in the gun

[Bullies]

Out: Arty needs a spell, McNeill (stamped), Baker, Richards, JOD

In: Cleary, West, Poulter, Buku, Crozier

Maybe Keath for Gardner (not the same player as last year and has no touch on his opponent)

[JanLorMill]

Gardner is the same player as last year just we have midfield firing that covered him. Never been very good

[GVGjr]

Gardner and OBrien should in the gun

I didn't think they were in anyway our problem against Geelong.

[GVGjr]

Out: Arty needs a spell, McNeill (stamped), Baker, Richards, JOD

In: Cleary, West, Poulter, Buku, Crozier

Maybe Keath for Gardner (not the same player as last year and has no touch on his opponent)

There is some merit there but I suspect we will stick with Baker. Not sure about where Buku would play in our side.

Could we consider dropping Lobb and playing Bruce up forward because we know that Naughton, Bruce and Marra can gel together?

[JanLorMill]

I didn't think they were in anyway our problem against Geelong.
Yes they are a Problem every week. Pick them every week knowing they aren’t Afl standard.

[G-Mo77]

Richards injured.

Then what? Buku, West & Hannan.

The way we played. The way Port played. It’s deckchairs on the titanic stuff. May as well keep playing JOD.

I said the same last week mate, just shuffling deck chairs. I'm wanting to see an outside the square selection regardless of form for one VFL game and work with it. If Poulter is ready then why not? Would we be any worse off if we played Buku instead of TOB? Cleary should be in the mix as well. We'll go the "safe" selections though, Hannan, McComb, Crozier will all be top of the list at the selection meeting.

[Mantis]

I said the same last week mate, just shuffling deck chairs. I'm wanting to see an outside the square selection regardless of form for one VFL game and work with it. If Poulter is ready then why not? Would we be any worse off if we played Buku instead of TOB? Cleary should be in the mix as well. We'll go the "safe" selections though, Hannan, McComb, Crozier will all be top of the list at the selection meeting.

Like O’Donnell was?

Not sure that’s working out for us/him.

[bulldogtragic]

B: Dale Naughton TOB
HB: Poulter Jones Duryea
C: Williams Macrae Baker
HF: Jones Marra Scott
F: Bruce Lobb Weightman
R: English Bont Libba
I: Treloar Smith Daniel Cleary
S: Darcy

Realistically, we will do the same and get the same result. But we need to address a bloke who spoils teammates and focus him on opponents, getting a talk accuracste goal kicker back up front, hope the mids show up, not really be able to cover JJ & Richards out, and as bad as Baker was I don’t see a replacement this week. We’ll just bring in a Hannan or Crozier and get the usual very little from them. Naughton is a net negative on the forward line and unless he and the others learn to play for and with each other, we need to do something like bring the Bruce back, use a wildcard like Darcy or something. Surely the plan isn’t long bombs into the forward line to a pack of 10 players.

[Hotdog60]

Out:
JOD and Richards
In:
Bruce and Cleary
Sub:
Out McNeil in Smith

[G-Mo77]

Like O’Donnell was?

Not sure that’s working out for us/him.

Bingo, I'm comfortable with the JOD selection now, wasn't at the time. Hes got some tools to work with and think it's time for him to go back and work on them. We need to be bold, we can go safe and select someone who won't develop any further or we can keep an eye on down the road and give some of these players a taste of the big time. Who knows they may inject some enthusiasm into this team and cement a spot like Jones did.

[Dogs 24/7]

Do we have selection integrity (heard this mentioned on the radio) with our VFL players being rewarded with senior games when they display some form or are we more prone to playing someone based on their training appeal?

[Scorlibo]

Do we have selection integrity (heard this mentioned on the radio) with our VFL players being rewarded with senior games when they display some form or are we more prone to playing someone based on their training appeal?

If there are good reasons for playing JOD over (at least at the time) better performing players in Khamis and Cleary, then we haven't heard them publicly.

I really like the look of JOD, and it was great to see him kick his first, but he's not ready and the move to play him forward and send Lobb to a wing is pissing in the wind kind of stuff. The kind of experiment you could tolerate for a half of footy but simply can't be a month-long pursuit.

I don't think moves at the selection table are why we've lost the last couple of weeks, but to your point - no we certainly don't have integrity based on exposed VFL form.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Do we have selection integrity (heard this mentioned on the radio) with our VFL players being rewarded with senior games when they display some form or are we more prone to playing someone based on their training appeal?

We haven't had selection integrity the entire time Bevo has been at the club. To be fair we aren't the only club.

But can you imagine a young player like Khamis watching us draft another young player from backyard cricket, play 2 VFL games, and come straight into the VFL side and perform poorly for 4 weeks? How can the MC even begin to justify it?

I thought they must be planning for JOD to sit on Stewart. Nope. So you can add Bruce (forward version) to this same story, because BOTH Khamis and Bruce would offer a hell of a lot more than JOD as both a forward or defender.

Bevo speaks about JOD being a great athlete, but I haven't seen it, and at the top level you need to either be able to offer something on attack or defense and through no fault of his own JOD has done neither.

It's an absolutely ridiculous selection. But Bevo is obsessed with a yearly project.

[bulldogtragic]

We haven't had selection integrity the entire time Bevo has been at the club. To be fair we aren't the only club.

But can you imagine a young player like Khamis watching us draft another young player from backyard cricket, play 2 VFL games, and come straight into the VFL side and perform poorly for 4 weeks? How can the MC even begin to justify it?

I thought they must be planning for JOD to sit on Stewart. Nope. So you can add Bruce (forward version) to this same story, because BOTH Khamis and Bruce would offer a hell of a lot more than JOD as both a forward or defender.

Bevo speaks about JOD being a great athlete, but I haven't seen it, and at the top level you need to either be able to offer something on attack or defense and through no fault of his own JOD has done neither.

It's an absolutely ridiculous selection. But Bevo is obsessed with a yearly project.

I can understand giving him a taste. But clutch matches again GCS & Geelong to cement top four is hubris if the highest order.

[DOG GOD]

JOD offers nothing more than Khamis, and having him playing ahead of Khamis is nothing but laughable. At least Khamis has shown positive traits. And by what I’ve seen, seems as much the athlete as they say JOD is.

Not sure who’s out or who’s in, but 1 thing is almost a given….crozier, Hannan and McComb will be in the mix, while Khamis, West and Cleary freeze their asses off in the VFL.

[hujsh]

Why is everyone dropping Richards?

[bulldogtragic]

Why is everyone dropping Richards?

Injury.

[The Underdog]

Delist McNeil now.

#blamethesub

[Grantysghost]

Why is everyone dropping Richards?

Did his hammy.

[Grantysghost]

#blamethesub

Guy is on a hiding to nothing.

[bulldogtragic]

#blamethesub

He’s not an AFEL footballer. He missed a gimme goal to get us back in it, and late at CHF let Rohan take an uncontested mark without any pressure and gave nothing to the side. I’m not blaming him for anything. He does not deserve to be on the list in my opinion based on his performances over three years including last night.

Edit:

Career Averages

7.8 touches
1.6 mark
1 I50
0.5 goals
0.2 goal assist


Not to standard. Not worthy of promotion when the forced choice is delist or promote. He needs to be delisted and he shouldn’t play again if I was picking the team. That’s not blame, that’s my opinion on his career to date and performance last night sealed it.

[bulldogtragic]

Guy is on a hiding to nothing.

The guy (after serving three seasons) must be promoted or delisted according to AFEL rookie list rules. Those are the options.

I choose to delist him and would not promote him. I wouldn’t play him again in addition. I’d rather get a look at Clarke or others.

[bulldogtragic]

He?s not an AFEL footballer. He missed a gimme goal to get us back in it, and late at CHF let Rohan take an uncontested mark without any pressure and gave nothing to the side. I?m not blaming him for anything. He does not deserve to be on the list in my opinion based on his performances over three years including last night.

Edit:

Career Averages

7.8 touches
1.6 mark
1 I50
0.5 goals
0.2 goal assist


Not to standard. Not worthy of promotion when the forced choice is delist or promote. He needs to be delisted and he shouldn?t play again if I was picking the team. That?s not blame, that?s my opinion on his career to date and performance last night sealed it.

Happy to be corrected then. What am I missing about McNeil?

[Grantysghost]

Happy to be corrected then. What am I missing about McNeil?

He's young and has played 5 games of late 4 as sub.

That was his first kick I think after being on the bench.

I get it, he's no gun however he's not the problem for mine BT.

He'd be getting paid sfa too so I'm ok with him on the list.

Our depth is a concern.

[bulldogtragic]

He's young and has played 5 games of late 4 as sub.

That was his first kick I think after being on the bench.

I get it, he's no gun however he's not the problem for mine BT.

He'd be getting paid sfa too so I'm ok with him on the list.

Our depth is a concern.

But he must be delisted or promoted according to AFEL rules. MUST. So which is it. Has he shown enough to be promoted to the main list or otherwise be demoted. There’s no other option.

[G-Mo77]

I can understand giving him a taste. But clutch matches again GCS & Geelong to cement top four is hubris if the highest order.

I'm comfortable trying him out. He has now had a taste and needs to go back and work on it more before being selected again. The dangers of it now and as TBB said it may turn into a Bevo yearly project if we keep selecting him.over and over like he has done in the past.

[Bulldog4life]

But he must be delisted or promoted according to AFEL rules. MUST. So which is it. Has he shown enough to be promoted to the main list or otherwise be demoted. There’s no other option.

Agree. He actually was better in his first year and hasn't improved but gone backwards.

[bulldogtragic]

Agree. He actually was better in his first year and hasn't improved but gone backwards.

This is elite footy. Some make the grade, most don’t. I think he will be a good state league footballer which is a great achievement in its own right. But he is not an AFEL footballer, I know that to be true.

[GVGjr]

The guy (after serving three seasons) must be promoted or delisted according to AFEL rookie list rules. Those are the options.

I choose to delist him and would not promote him. I wouldn’t play him again in addition. I’d rather get a look at Clarke or others.

I like so many aspects about what he could potentially bring us in terms of pace and pressure but as a low possession winner he needs to convert his chances and he has consistently fallen well short of that mark.
Missing a shot when you're 5 goals up doesn't hurt like the one that he was basically gifted last night.

I'm probably inclined to say he should be cut. Could he be tried as a back man at Footscray for the balance of the season to see if he has some scope there?

[bulldogtragic]

I like so many aspects about what he could potentially bring us in terms of pace and pressure but as a low possession winner he needs to convert his chances and he has consistently fallen well short of that mark.
Missing a shot when you're 5 goals up doesn't hurt like the one that he was basically gifted last night.

I'm probably inclined to say he should be cut. Could he be tried as a back man at Footscray for the balance of the season to see if he has some scope there?

So we are trialling Gallagher, Cleary, Crozier, maybe Poulter, Raak & Khamis, plus VDM at half back. Now McNeil too to HBF. I think there’s too many players trying their last chance saloon there.

I’d say either McNeil or VDM gets trialled. VDM has the shot right now.

[azabob]

Is Treloar injured?

[G-Mo77]

Is Treloar injured?

Played out the game so don't think so.

[GVGjr]

Is Treloar injured?

Copped a corkie from reports.

[Grantysghost]

Bont had the knee heavily strapped looked proppy late.

[Hotdog60]

Bont had the knee heavily strapped looked proppy late.

I wouldn't be surprised if he's carry some major niggle from the that tackle and is getting jabbed just to get through the game.
If it's a problem would it be better to get it fixed now so he'll be right for the end of the season or it requires surgery and it will have to wait until the end of the season. Current Bont is not firing as he was 3 weeks ago.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

I've loved Arty Jones coming into the team and providing some spark. But I've hardly even seen him the last 2 weeks and think it's probably time for a spell. Maybe VDM comes in for him. Our depth isn't looking good which is sad considering there looks like a fee players who are either carrying injuries or need a spell.

[Grantysghost]

But he must be delisted or promoted according to AFEL rules. MUST. So which is it. Has he shown enough to be promoted to the main list or otherwise be demoted. There’s no other option.

I'd promote as this stage.

[meenies]

Not sure if we have the guts for four or five changes but ...
Out: O'Brien, O'Donnell, Arty Jones, Richards, McNeil
In: Keath or Bruce, VDM, Gallagher, Crozier
West, Poulter or Cleary as sub

[SonofScray]

I'd promote as this stage.

I’m cutting him. Said in another thread, he’s the slowest quick bloke I’ve seen.

[bulldogtragic]

I'd promote as this stage.

I’m curious. With list spots at an absolute premium, and depth a major problem, what does he have going for him for a fourth and probably fifth year with his first three very poor from a statistical perspective?

[Grantysghost]

I’m curious. With list spots at an absolute premium, and depth a major problem, what does he have going for him for a fourth and probably fifth year with his first three very poor from a statistical perspective?

Pace, good kick, pressure, good link play.


And my love.

[Mantis]

Pace, good kick, pressure, good link play.

And my love.

He’s a good kick? Really?

He simply refuses to kick and often handballs to players in worse positions than him.

And I don’t feel he has good pace… or if he does he doesn’t know how to use it effectively.

[bulldogtragic]

Pace, good kick, pressure, good link play.


And my love.

I’ve loved Jarrad Grant and many others. So I know the feeling. But as Mantis says, I don’t see what you see at all.

[The Underdog]

Not sure if we have the guts for four or five changes but ...
Out: O'Brien, O'Donnell, Arty Jones, Richards, McNeil
In: Keath or Bruce, VDM, Gallagher, Crozier
West, Poulter or Cleary as sub

Gallagher has played 2 VFL games off an interrupted pre-season. Put him in now and you’re setting him up to fail, surely Cleary and even Poulter are ahead of him.

[Grantysghost]

He’s a good kick? Really?

He simply refuses to kick and often handballs to players in worse positions than him.

And I don’t feel he has good pace… or if he does he doesn’t know how to use it effectively.

Good, not great.

Yes I think he has pace.

I get he's fringe too. However we need young mids / wing forwards so I don't think we'd find much better at his level of investment.

[Grantysghost]

I’ve loved Jarrad Grant and many others. So I know the feeling. But as Mantis says, I don’t see what you see at all.

Fair enough.
Old microphone head!

[bulldogtragic]

Fair enough.
Old microphone head!

I still think he could’ve made it. Cut down by Bevo in his prime.

[Rocco Jones]

In: Keath, Bruce, Poulter, Cleary
Out: TOB, Gardner, JOD, Ed (inj)
Sub: Vanders

I don't like TOB, Gardy, Bruce and Keath but I'd go with the latter two as being more dependable/safer. Gardy really struggling.

[Grantysghost]

I still think he could’ve made it. Cut down by Bevo in his prime.

If we cut McNeil which we may well, what type are you looking for to replace BT?

[bulldogtragic]

If we cut McNeil which we may well, what type are you looking for to replace BT?

I’m hoping that Clarke takes his spot next year. I’m hoping we land Lohmann too.

That gives us Weightman, Clarke, Arty, Lohmann with Scott as back up as the smaller forward brigade. With three talls.

[Rocco Jones]

It's a list management post but I'd retain McNeil. He is 21 and he can create pressure. Small forwards don't have to do much to be effective. Killer that he combines a pretty poor kick with (seemingly) massive nerves in front of goal. Like if he can get some improvement with his goal kicking, maybe there is something. I am fine with him being cut though.

[Grantysghost]

It's a list management post but I'd retain McNeil. He is 21 and he can create pressure. Small forwards don't have to do much to be effective. Killer that he combines a pretty poor kick with (seemingly) massive nerves in front of goal. Like if he can get some improvement with his goal kicking, maybe there is something. I am fine with him being cut though.

This is why you're one of my favorite posters Borat.

[Grantysghost]

Thing with Lachie is, he's just a Mc off being a Brownlow medallist with a sketchy bird tattoo

[Danjul]

Thing with Lachie is, he's just a Mc off being a Brownlow medallist with a sketchy bird tattoo
He was not very good and stuffed up badly with a shot at goal. There, that?s the facts.

Ive seen Naughton, Bont, Bruce and others miss from the same spot. Did he score anything with the kick? Last week Lobb hit the behind post and scored nothing. Yes he was further around but it was an easy shot for a superstar who is paid thousands of dollars per disposal. That seems a bit negative now I look at it again.

Is there anything I can say that is positive about his game? How about he had 6 possessions in 20% game time. I know Naughton had 7 but he was on the ground 80% game time.

McNeil was not the problem. We kicked 2.8 in the second half so others kicked poorly. And that is not counting players missing everything.

Should he go back to the seconds to freshen up? Yes.

[westbulldog]

We are rotating the deckchairs on the Titanic, how about Naughton back, English forward and Sweet in.

[The Underdog]

We are rotating the deckchairs on the Titanic, how about Naughton back, English forward and Sweet in.

Yep, because the way to fix our problems is to take the guy who was our best player by a mile on Saturday and put him where he can have less of an influence on the game.

[Danjul]

We are rotating the deckchairs on the Titanic, how about Naughton back, English forward and Sweet in.
I always get into trouble when I mention the S words, but here goes.

Last year when we played Gold Coast Sweet was absolutely murdered by Witts. Witts got 55 hitouts and 6 kicks while Sweet had 27 and 3. Miraculously we won the clearances 49-36. And Also the game, we had 31 shots at goal and Naughton got 3 goals.

Digging a little deeper, Witts had 90% game time but Sweet only had 75%. Allowing for that Sweets figures improve a little. Who rucked when he was off the ground? Cordy and Khamis. We were happy for them to ruck against Witts.

The week before Sweet was our ruckman against Collingwood. Sweet had 26 hitouts (13 disposals) against 33 (11) . But the clearances were 43-27 in our favour. 29 shots at goal gave An 8 goal win and Naughton got 3. Who was his assistant that time? Cordy.

Treloar, Smith, Macrae and Libba had 144 disposals and the slackers were Bont and Dunkley who could only manage 50 disposals between them. That is close to 200 disposals by players running through the midfielder.

So the conclusion is Sweet can only play when the midfielders are in sensational form, and at the moment they are not. And we do not have Cordy to help him anymore.

[The Underdog]

https://youtu.be/BvWefB4NGGI

[westbulldog]

Yep, because the way to fix our problems is to take the guy who was our best player by a mile on Saturday and put him where he can have less of an influence on the game.

I don't recall posting that English would be 100% forward

[The Underdog]

I don't recall posting that English would be 100% forward

True

[azabob]

It's a list management post but I'd retain McNeil. He is 21 and he can create pressure. Small forwards don't have to do much to be effective. Killer that he combines a pretty poor kick with (seemingly) massive nerves in front of goal. Like if he can get some improvement with his goal kicking, maybe there is something. I am fine with him being cut though.

Isn?t that the rub with McNeil? You justify why you want to retain him then on the other hand your ok delisting him.

I really do long for a time where are delisting decisions are hard because they are afl quality and not just vfl quality.

[Grantysghost]

Isn?t that the rub with McNeil? You justify why you want to retain him then on the other hand your ok delisting him.

I really do long for a time where are delisting decisions are hard because they are afl quality and not just vfl quality.
Baker is a good example. Demons recruiting has been superb.

[Bullies]

I always get into trouble when I mention the S words, but here goes.

Last year when we played Gold Coast Sweet was absolutely murdered by Witts. Witts got 55 hitouts and 6 kicks while Sweet had 27 and 3. Miraculously we won the clearances 49-36. And Also the game, we had 31 shots at goal and Naughton got 3 goals.

Digging a little deeper, Witts had 90% game time but Sweet only had 75%. Allowing for that Sweets figures improve a little. Who rucked when he was off the ground? Cordy and Khamis. We were happy for them to ruck against Witts.

The week before Sweet was our ruckman against Collingwood. Sweet had 26 hitouts (13 disposals) against 33 (11) . But the clearances were 43-27 in our favour. 29 shots at goal gave An 8 goal win and Naughton got 3. Who was his assistant that time? Cordy.

Treloar, Smith, Macrae and Libba had 144 disposals and the slackers were Bont and Dunkley who could only manage 50 disposals between them. That is close to 200 disposals by players running through the midfielder.

So the conclusion is Sweet can only play when the midfielders are in sensational form, and at the moment they are not. And we do not have Cordy to help him anymore.You could look it the other way and and Sweet can put the midfielders in form by giving them the armchair ride. It is well known amongst other clubs that Sweet is one of the best tap ruckman going around. He was targeting by a few clubs and will be again next year. Sweet should do all the ruck work and English be the utility around the ground and play forward at the bounce. English plays like a ruck rover anyway.

Getting clean use of the ball out of the middle and moving it forward quickly to Naughton, English and Marra could make such a difference.

[lemmon]

Out: Richards, JOD, McNeil
In: Crozier, Cleary, West

I'd like to see us regain the balance we had before JJ went down and bring in the extra small back, in place of JOD. I think Crozier is the best 'interceptor' we have in the twos, so comes in for Ed and Cleary has been unlucky not to play so far. Poulter close, but I'd rather play the natural half backs.

Arty falls out of the 22 and takes McNeil's role as sub. Think his pace and ability to play wing or half forward will be handy coming on late. West in as he feels like the only small forward running around at Footscray, it's starting to get a bit last chance saloon for Ryhlee

[Danjul]

I don't recall posting that English would be 100% forward
In those games games we were sensational. Like in early 2021. And that was without English who is usually our best player now.

We would be unbeatable if we could put our balanced, experienced and cohesive group on the field with everyone in their natural position.

As supporting evidence, it is probably on tape somewhere, I watched some of the vfl games at the end of last season and saw Sweet kick as many goals as Arty. Two were from outside 50.

[Danjul]

Baker is a good example. Demons recruiting has been superb.
I might be misinterpreting this but Baker has been one of the improvements this year. He has good football sense, covers a lot of ground and plays a quick game. No standing still, looking backwards and slow lobs to the forwards. I would like to see the forwards help by making better targets.

[Rocco Jones]

In those games games we were sensational. Like in early 2021. And that was without English who is usually our best player now.

We would be unbeatable if we could put our balanced, experienced and cohesive group on the field with everyone in their natural position.

As supporting evidence, it is probably on tape somewhere, I watched some of the vfl games at the end of last season and saw Sweet kick as many goals as Arty. Two were from outside 50.

Have you tried contacting the club? If I was as certain I had the ideas that would make us unbeatable, I say this without jest, if I was as certain as you that I had the formula, I'd send all this to the club rather than post it here.

I don't agree with you but you seem to believe you are being ignored and have the answers to make us not lose a game.

[Danjul]

Have you tried contacting the club? If I was as certain I had the ideas that would make us unbeatable, I say this without jest, if I was as certain as you that I had the formula, I'd send all this to the club rather than post it here.

I don't agree with you but you seem to believe you are being ignored and have the answers to make us not lose a game.

When we played 2 genuine ruckmen in 2021 we were top of the ladder, above the eventual premiers, with 3 rounds left. Everyone in Melbourne saw and enjoyed our success. I was surprised at the time by the wide interest. So, in reality I got these ideas from the club. And it was using them less than two seasons ago.

Then, Playing the anyone can ruck game plan got us down to fifth, in just 3 games. That?s clearly still the go to strategy.

So in my humble opinion the 2 ruck approach was a very successful strategy adopted by the club, and it should work better now that English, Bont and a few others are in their prime. I?m sure everyone at the club saw and enjoyed the success then and would prefer it to Saturday?s 2 goal second half.. It is ok to experiment with some new ideas, like we are doing, but we are nowhere near top of the ladder.. Comparing the playing groups Then and now we should be seeing greater success.

[Rocco Jones]

When we played 2 genuine ruckmen in 2021 we were top of the ladder, above the eventual premiers, with 3 rounds left. Everyone in Melbourne saw and enjoyed our success. I was surprised at the time by the wide interest. So, in reality I got these ideas from the club. And it was using them less than two seasons ago.

Then, Playing the anyone can ruck game plan got us down to fifth, in just 3 games. That?s clearly still the go to strategy.

So in my humble opinion the 2 ruck approach was a very successful strategy adopted by the club, and it should work better now that English, Bont and a few others are in their prime. I?m sure everyone at the club saw and enjoyed the success then and would prefer it to Saturday?s 2 goal second half.. It is ok to experiment with some new ideas, like we are doing, but we are nowhere near top of the ladder.. Comparing the playing groups Then and now we should be seeing greater success.

Yep, I hear you. I don't agree with you but I am certain of little in life. You seem certain that the changes you want would result in us being unbeatable. I sincerely do not intend to be facetious, if I were as certain as you about this resulting in us basically never losing, I'd contact the club instead of/as well as posting on here.

[Grantysghost]

When we played 2 genuine ruckmen in 2021 we were top of the ladder, above the eventual premiers, with 3 rounds left. Everyone in Melbourne saw and enjoyed our success. I was surprised at the time by the wide interest. So, in reality I got these ideas from the club. And it was using them less than two seasons ago.

Then, Playing the anyone can ruck game plan got us down to fifth, in just 3 games. That?s clearly still the go to strategy.

So in my humble opinion the 2 ruck approach was a very successful strategy adopted by the club, and it should work better now that English, Bont and a few others are in their prime. I?m sure everyone at the club saw and enjoyed the success then and would prefer it to Saturday?s 2 goal second half.. It is ok to experiment with some new ideas, like we are doing, but we are nowhere near top of the ladder.. Comparing the playing groups Then and now we should be seeing greater success.

Bevo always talks about the "turnover game".

I recall when speaking about Martin leading up to the GF or Prelim in 2021 he said something along the lines of he won't be able to contribute to the turnover game.

So 1.) Retaining shape when we turn it over 2.) Spreading when they do

I would assume the same applies with Sweet. That's my guess if that helps from a coaching perspective.

[Danjul]

Yep, I hear you. I don't agree with you but I am certain of little in life. You seem certain that the changes you want would result in us being unbeatable. I sincerely do not intend to be facetious, if I were as certain as you about this resulting in us basically never losing, I'd contact the club instead of/as well as posting on here.
Let?s change never to rarely.

[Critter]

Bevo always talks about the "turnover game".

I recall when speaking about Martin leading up to the GF or Prelim in 2021 he said something along the lines of he won't be able to contribute to the turnover game.

So 1.) Retaining shape when we turn it over 2.) Spreading when they do

I would assume the same applies with Sweet. That's my guess if that helps from a coaching perspective.

Sweet is far more fit and mobile than Martin was in 2021 so can't see why he be won't be able to contribute to turnover game.

Here's a thought. Beveridge likes to push an extra player up, which means most times we play with 5 forwards. Why not ruck Sweet and have English play the extra role, so that we get the benefit of English's mobility and all-round game skills in general play and Sweet's tap work in ruck contests?

In the Footscray V Geelong VFL game, Sweet was BOG (the service he gave midfielders was outstanding), Crozier & Cleary marked everything and Bruce played well deep in defence. So let's do something crazy, such as rewarding form, and bring in those 4 for Gardner/TOB, Richards (inj), JOD and Lobb.

[Rocco Jones]

Those wanting Sweet in. Do we drop Lobb? Or do you want Lobb as a pure KPF, English R2/fwd and Sweet in ruck?

[Bullies]

Those wanting Sweet in. Do we drop Lobb? Or do you want Lobb as a pure KPF, English R2/fwd and Sweet in ruck? Lobb stays in. English plays as utility/ruck rover type role. Sweet starts in the middle for all bounces and around the ground for throw ins. English starts up forward allowing Sweet to give us first use of the ball out of the middle and move it quickly to the forward line.

[Rocco Jones]

Lobb stays in. English plays as utility/ruck rover type role. Sweet starts in the middle for all bounces and around the ground for throw ins. English starts up forward allowing Sweet to give us first use of the ball out of the middle and move it quickly to the forward line.

How is a ruck rover different to the other inside mids we have? IMO centres, ruck rovers and rovers are ceremonial positions now and have been so for a while. You just play three inside mids.

[bulldogtragic]

Those wanting Sweet in. Do we drop Lobb? Or do you want Lobb as a pure KPF, English R2/fwd and Sweet in ruck?

Where would Darcy aim to play when ready?

[Bullies]

How is a ruck rover different to the other inside mids we have? IMO centres, ruck rovers and rovers are ceremonial positions now and have been so for a while. You just play three inside mids. Correct they are all utility type roles so can go anywhere as do half forwards/wings etc. English can drop back and go forward during play without worrying about the ruck work.

[Bullies]

Where would Darcy aim to play when ready? Darcy can play the intercept defender role quite easily. It is easier for him to learn the game down back and develop his confidence.

[Critter]

Lobb stays in. English plays as utility/ruck rover type role. Sweet starts in the middle for all bounces and around the ground for throw ins. English starts up forward allowing Sweet to give us first use of the ball out of the middle and move it quickly to the forward line.

Yeah, what he said.

[Grantysghost]

Lobb stays in. English plays as utility/ruck rover type role. Sweet starts in the middle for all bounces and around the ground for throw ins. English starts up forward allowing Sweet to give us first use of the ball out of the middle and move it quickly to the forward line.

You're suggesting we take the anointed AA ruckman..... Out of the ruck?

[Bullies]

You're suggesting we take the anointed AA ruckman..... Out of the ruck? Correct as Tim is not a good tap ruckman. English becomes a utility and Sweet does the ruck work as his tap work in the ruck is first rate. Gives us first use of the ball like Witts does with the Suns. Against us Witts destroyed English in the ruck and gave their mid field an armchair ride. Due to this they were able to go forward a lot less but converted more.

[Danjul]

Those wanting Sweet in. Do we drop Lobb? Or do you want Lobb as a pure KPF, English R2/fwd and Sweet in ruck?
When Lobb played as a match winner against us late last season he played purely as a full forward if I remember correctly.

He took 7 marks for 7 kicks for 4 excellent goals.

He is wasted at the moment.

So is English. Time for some creative thinking. English should play wherever he feels like it, just not in all ruck contests. Sweets main instruction should be just stay out of English?s way, and do some ruck work.

give it six weeks and evaluate.

[westbulldog]

Correct as Tim is not a good tap ruckman. English becomes a utility and Sweet does the ruck work as his tap work in the ruck is first rate. Gives us first use of the ball like Witts does with the Suns. Against us Witts destroyed English in the ruck and gave their mid field an armchair ride. Due to this they were able to go forward a lot less but converted more.

Pittonet also destroyed English in ruck contests.

[Danjul]

Bevo always talks about the "turnover game".

I recall when speaking about Martin leading up to the GF or Prelim in 2021 he said something along the lines of he won't be able to contribute to the turnover game.

So 1.) Retaining shape when we turn it over 2.) Spreading when they do

I would assume the same applies with Sweet. That's my guess if that helps from a coaching perspective.

I have carefully studied the Bulldog shape/spread game. Got a seat at Dockland and concentrated on the display.

It lead to 2 goals in the second half and Geelong getting the last 6?

It was disastrous. Reminded me of my intense observations during the St Kilda game when Zane Cordy tore us apart. In that one we scored 1 goal in the second half.

With this team there is no spread/shape. When they play their natural game they are good, and like all experienced athletes appreciate a bit of guidance to keep them winning.

[Grantysghost]

I have carefully studied the Bulldog shape/spread game. Got a seat at Dockland and concentrated on the display.

It lead to 2 goals in the second half and Geelong getting the last 6?

It was disastrous. Reminded me of my intense observations during the St Kilda game when Zane Cordy tore us apart. In that one we scored 1 goal in the second half.

With this team there is no spread/shape. When they play their natural game they are good, and like all experienced athletes appreciate a bit of guidance to keep them winning.

Aha interesting.

It's a tough one.

We are generating inside 50s and scores.

But also turning it over.

Must be infuriating for the coaches.

[Rocco Jones]

WOOF needs a thread purely dedicated to where Sweet should be in the side.

[hujsh]

WOOF needs a thread purely dedicated to where Sweet should be in the side.
All players should be Sweet

https://i.imgflip.com/7o9ijj.jpg

[bornadog]

Lobb stays in. English plays as utility/ruck rover type role. Sweet starts in the middle for all bounces and around the ground for throw ins. English starts up forward allowing Sweet to give us first use of the ball out of the middle and move it quickly to the forward line.
Land of the giants

[EasternWest]

WOOF needs a thread purely dedicated to where Sweet should be in the side.

We need a contract thread before we branch out into the metaverse.

[Grantysghost]

We need a contract thread before we branch out into the metaverse.

Droll

[FrediKanoute]

Gallagher has played 2 VFL games off an interrupted pre-season. Put him in now and you?re setting him up to fail, surely Cleary and even Poulter are ahead of him.

Pick players on form not potential. We have a 2 spots in the back half and Cleary is the best placed to fill one of them - pick him. With Richards its a little more difficult as he is a great intercept mark - maybe Crosier.

I would give McNeil a rest - let him develop some form in the magoos. West/Khamis should come in. If McComb or Hannan get near that team I will spew.

[bornadog]

Out: Richards, JOD

In: Cleary, VDM

McNeil to VFL, West as sub

[Mantis]

In - Cleary, Keath, VDM,

Out - Richards, Gardner, JOD, McNeil

[hujsh]

In - Cleary, Keath, VDM,

Out - Richards, Gardner, JOD, McNeil

I'm happy enough with your suggestions but if Gardner is out (didn't see the Geelong game but he was poor against GC so makes sense) why is it Keath over Bruce in your mind? Is it because he can offer a bit more pace and attacking run? Or just that he's less of a liability with ball in hand?

[Curly5]

Sadly, Arty out, West in
Ed out, Crozier in
O'Donnell out, Buku or Keath in
Cleary sub.

[Mantis]

I'm happy enough with your suggestions but if Gardner is out (didn't see the Geelong game but he was poor against GC so makes sense) why is it Keath over Bruce in your mind? Is it because he can offer a bit more pace and attacking run? Or just that he's less of a liability with ball in hand?

I think Keath is a better option in defence compared to Bruce… defends and intercepts better.

Not opposed to Bruce replacing O’Brien if Dixon comes back in…. Would also be happy enough with JOD playing as the 3rd tall defender too, but not as the 4th defender or 3rd tall forward.

[Jeanette54]

Sadly, Arty out, West in


Agree, Arty needs to show more, mere enthusiasm is not enough. Westy might bring a harder edge to forward line pressure, Arty just doesn't stick tackles.

[macca]

In - Cleary, Keath, VDM,

Out - Richards, Gardner, JOD, McNeil

Arty could be rested . I would not read too much into that .

I am glad West is in, his tough and will take on the bigger body Port players. I want to see him play for the rest of the season.
VDM to replace McNeil ?

[Mantis]

Arty could be rested . I would not read too much into that .

I am glad West is in, his tough and will take on the bigger body Port players. I want to see him play for the rest of the season.
VDM to replace McNeil ?

I didn’t have West in, but happy for him to be the sub.

[Grantysghost]

IN: J. Bruce, A. Keath, L. Vandermeer, R. West
OUT: O.Baker (omitted), R. Gardner (omitted), E. Richards (hamstring), T. O’Brien (omitted)

[Hotdog60]

ROUND 13 TEAM

Western Bulldogs v Port Adelaide
Friday 9 June, 7.50pm AEST
Marvel Stadium

B: Taylor Duryea, Liam Jones, Alex Keath
HB: Bailey Dale, Josh Bruce, Laith Vandermeer
C: Anthony Scott, Marcus Bontempelli, Bailey Williams
HF: Rhylee West, Aaron Naughton, Adam Treloar
F: Cody Weightman, Jamarra Ugle-Hagan, Rory Lobb
R: Tim English, Caleb Daniel Tom Liberatore
Int: James O’Donnell, Arthur Jones, Jack Macrae, Bailey Smith
Emerg: Mitch Hannan, Oskar Baker, Jordon Sweet, Caleb Poulter

IN: J. Bruce, A. Keath, L. Vandermeer, R. West
OUT: O.Baker (omitted), R. Gardner (omitted), E. Richards (hamstring), T. O’Brien (omitted)

[Grantysghost]

Baker stiff.

Who plays wing?

[bulldogtragic]

I can live with this.

[bulldogtragic]

Baker stiff.

Who plays wing?

Baker couldn’t hit a target last week. Isn’t Lobb our winger?

[Hotdog60]

I think LVM for Richards, Bruce for Gardner, Keith for O'Brian and West for Baker

[Grantysghost]

Baker couldn’t hit a target last week. Isn’t Lobb our winger?

Ha - that's right of course!

[Grantysghost]

I think LVM for Richards, Bruce for Gardner, Keith for O'Brian and West for Baker

So you're saying.....

The West Wing!?

(I'm here all week, please try the "fish")

I think Macrae or Smith and West will go to the high half forward -> +1 at the contest role alternating.

[bornadog]

JOD still in

[Hotdog60]

JOD has been everywhere may be this week he's on the wing.

And don't give up your day job.

[The bulldog tragician]

Wow!! This is surprisingly ruthless.

[Grantysghost]

JOD still in

I thought it his best game so far. So not really surprised.

[bulldogtragic]

JOD still in

Surprised? Bevo loves his project player each season.

[G-Mo77]

It seems like a long time since we've seen that many changes. Happy to see West given another shot, hopefully it's more than 1 week. Gardener and TOB were awful in defence last week and have been pretty ordinary anyway. Let's hope Keath can wind back the cloxk and Bruce destroys Dixon.

[JanLorMill]

Baker stiff.

Who plays wing?
Stiff? How many mistakes do you want him to make?

[GVGjr]

It seems like a long time since we've seen that many changes. Happy to see West given another shot, hopefully it's more than 1 week. Gardener and TOB were awful in defence last week and have been pretty ordinary anyway. Let's hope Keath can wind back the cloxk and Bruce destroys Dixon.

I thought both had good games against Adelaide but average in Darwin and down against Geelong.
Happy to see Bruce back into the team though.

[josie]

Glad they kept Arty in. Let’s hope Westy grabs this chance.

Big statement dropping Gardner and O’Brien. I thought Bruce looked really good in vfl, less so Keath - my heart is in my mouth when he disposes of ball but then again it is when Gardner does too. Keath a much better mark.

Presume VDM to replace Richards in back half. Who will replace Baker on the wing?

[Danjul]

Baker stiff.

Who plays wing?

If you add

Lobb and A Jones and Scott and JOD and McNeil together,

how many more kicks do you need in order to get the number Baker had last week?

Yes, it is a positive number.

Not sure whether to submit this for a maths or psychology course design.

[JanLorMill]

Probably a little tall still

[MrMahatma]

Reckon Baker is stiff as he’s been decent all year so far. Baz didnt Get dropped for poor efficiency (I know I know… diff roles etc…)

Cool to see West back in. Wonder if he’ll get some midfield mins. Has he been playing mid in the VFL?

Bruce and Keath give us some size/muscle back there. Not sure too much changes though.

[JanLorMill]

No Poulter is a surprise

[jeemak]

I don't think Baker gets dropped for poor disposal as much as he gets dropped for his first touches.

He probably doesn't get dropped for either in truth, and likely has specific things in his game outside of basic skills he needs to work on.

[SquirrelGrip]

These are good changes. Baker almost certainly the sub.

Ultimately I think Arty will become a wing - he has a big tank. I didn’t think it would be just yet. Cleary must be asking what more he has to do to get a game, especially with us losing two HBF in two weeks.

Bruce going to the big forward frees up Liam Jones. I like it.

[Grantysghost]

Stiff? How many mistakes do you want him to make?

At the game I didn't think he was making too many? I am half blind though :)

Edit: He had 22 at 50 percent and 6 turnovers so probably not great. 400 metres gained.

[josie]

These are good changes. Baker almost certainly the sub.

Ultimately I think Arty will become a wing - he has a big tank. I didn’t think it would be just yet. Cleary must be asking what more he has to do to get a game, especially with us losing two HBF in two weeks.

Bruce going to the big forward frees up Liam Jones. I like it.

Agree regarding Cleary and he has been good in vfl the whole year. Probably the most consistent. Hope he is given a chance this year and that he grabs it.

[HOSE B ROMERO]

Reckon Baker is stiff as he’s been decent all year so far. Baz didnt Get dropped for poor efficiency (I know I know… diff roles etc…)

Cool to see West back in. Wonder if he’ll get some midfield mins. Has he been playing mid in the VFL?

Bruce and Keath give us some size/muscle back there. Not sure too much changes though.

West has been played mostly forward for Footscray. Hasn't exactly had the impact i'd hoped for this season. Fingers crossed he takes his chances.

[HOSE B ROMERO]

Look forward to Keefy resuming his wrestling match with Dixon.

Hope Adz gets through the match ok. Bevo mentioned post game that he'd had some issues with his calf last week. Can't afford to lose any more pace from the team. Surely Oscar as sub.

[hujsh]

I thought it his best game so far. So not really surprised.

What did he do? Stats only say 6 touches so assume there's a tale not told there.

Overall I'm surprised at how quickly VDM is back into defence, that Cleary is seemingly just no chance of a game at the moment, that Baker is dropped (guessing Scott on the wing with a forward rotating through) but not super surprised Gardner and O'Brien could be dropped.

[jeemak]

Just something further on Baker, perhaps there's something associated with how we failed to hold our defencive structure that relates to the role he had been playing the past couple of weeks.

It's seemed to the eye these past couple of weeks we've struggled to negate passage between the arcs which has put our defenders under more pressure than we'd like, exacerbating both Gardner and O'Brien's defencive struggles.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

There is no justification for JOD. It isn't as though he's playing a specific role i.e nullifying an opposition rebounder or intercepter. He has given us ZERO in all facets of the game and it's clear he's in because, well, Bevo loves a shiny new toy.

If I am Khamis and Cleary (and yes, Cleary plays a different role) I'd be at a loss as to how I can't crack a game while JOD is gifted 5 after coming from backyard cricket.

The rest of the selections are fine, whatever, and no JOD won't be the reason we win or lose ... But that's kind of the point. He's also not the reason we score, get scored against, win the ball, lose the ball, etc

I don't mean it as an attack on the player, it's not his fault he isn't ready, but it's a ridiculous call (again).

[soupman]

There is no justification for JOD. It isn't as though he's playing a specific role i.e nullifying an opposition rebounder or intercepter. He has given us ZERO in all facets of the game and it's clear he's in because, well, Bevo loves a shiny new toy.

If I am Khamis and Cleary (and yes, Cleary plays a different role) I'd be at a loss as to how I can't crack a game while JOD is gifted 5 after coming from backyard cricket.

The rest of the selections are fine, whatever, and no JOD won't be the reason we win or lose ... But that's kind of the point. He's also not the reason we score, get scored against, win the ball, lose the ball, etc

I don't mean it as an attack on the player, it's not his fault he isn't ready, but it's a ridiculous call (again).

Thanks for writing out the exact post I was about to make for me.

I am optimistic about his future, but he isn't even having moments in games where he is showing stuff, and we are not playing him in any meaningful manner. If we played him as the third defensive tall then maybe I could see some merit, but it feels like when everyone splits up for their line meetings he'd kind of be left by himself in the middle of the room because there is no role to discuss with him.

[kruder]

JOD selection is bizarre, just can't work it out.

I still think we need to find a way to get Daniel back to the centre forward role even though he was good last week.

Fingers crossed Vanders and Westy( do the basics Westy!!!) take their chance they have been given enough opportunity for mine.

[whythelongface]

Same here regarding JOD. What does he bring that others don’t have? I am just not seeing it. Rather have Buku, TOB or Cleary in the team. This will be his 5th start and in his previous games has done little.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

JOD must train well.

[D Mitchell]

Same here regarding JOD. What does he bring that others don’t have? I am just not seeing it. Rather have Buku, TOB or Cleary in the team. This will be his 5th start and in his previous games has done little.
He scored 1 goal 1 behind last week, on a par with the 3 other tall forwards. I've only seen him play the once, last week. From very limited opportunities, he played an adjunct role to the other 3, more experienced and touted forward talls, I liked what I saw. I don't think the 3 tall set up works, let alone a 4 tall. I share your puzzlement at what O'Donnell brings to the team that others don't.

[Grantysghost]

What did he do? Stats only say 6 touches so assume there's a tale not told there.

Overall I'm surprised at how quickly VDM is back into defence, that Cleary is seemingly just no chance of a game at the moment, that Baker is dropped (guessing Scott on the wing with a forward rotating through) but not super surprised Gardner and O'Brien could be dropped.

Ok -- so for starters he's just a kid so I don't expect too much.

For me it's his movement and contest.

He competes really well in the air and on the ground. He spreads well and gets himself into good positions on transition both ways.

Stats wise I get it, however I think that will come with experience.

He also kicked a goal yay.

If I compare him to Buku, who we all love no doubt, he just has his covered for smarts.

Of course he is fringe and certainly don't expect him to have a secure spot.

[hujsh]

Ok -- so for starters he's just a kid so I don't expect too much.

For me it's his movement and contest.

He competes really well in the air and on the ground. He spreads well and gets himself into good positions on transition both ways.

Stats wise I get it, however I think that will come with experience.

He also kicked a goal yay.

If I compare him to Buku, who we all love no doubt, he just has his covered for smarts.

Of course he is fringe and certainly don't expect him to have a secure spot.

Thanks, since I didn't see the game and didn't care to subject myself to a Geelong win I'm kind of relying on WOOFers to get the story (silly I know)

[D Mitchell]

T...
If I am Khamis and Cleary (and yes, Cleary plays a different role) I'd be at a loss as to how I can't crack a game while JOD is gifted 5 after coming from backyard cricket.

T....

Bolded bit. That's a bit harsh, isn't it ?. Essendon CC in the Premier League, the old District Cricket Competition ?

[DOG GOD]

JOD obviously does the 1%’s well

[Grantysghost]

JOD obviously does the 1%’s well

Not a fan DG?

[westbulldog]

Can someone post what Vandermeer has done to get a game over Cleary ? Sweet is the perpetual emergency even after a good vfl game, whilst Lobb deserved to be dropped. Imo Cleary, Khamis and Sweet should leave for other clubs, their treatment at the dogs is appalling. Baker has had just one midly off game, he was good before then and we need his speed.

[lemmon]

Can someone post what Vandermeer has done to get a game over Cleary ? Sweet is the perpetual emergency even after a good vfl game, whilst Lobb deserved to be dropped. Imo Cleary, Khamis and Sweet should leave for other clubs, their treatment at the dogs is appalling. Baker has had just one midly off game, he was good before then and we need his speed.

I would've played Cleary and Crozier this week, but my guess is we're looking at him to bring pace off a half-bank flank. We're pretty slow down there without JJ and Richards, and that's made a bit worse without Baker in the side as well. My guess is he's come in to play behind the ball and try to break some lines.

[lemmon]

Ok -- so for starters he's just a kid so I don't expect too much.

For me it's his movement and contest.

He competes really well in the air and on the ground. He spreads well and gets himself into good positions on transition both ways.

Stats wise I get it, however I think that will come with experience.

He also kicked a goal yay.

If I compare him to Buku, who we all love no doubt, he just has his covered for smarts.

Of course he is fringe and certainly don't expect him to have a secure spot.

I don't see what you're seeing, but that implies we're choosing not to use him when he's touched the ball 20 times in four games of footy (and half of those disposals came in one game against the Sun).

I think his selection is Bevo not wanting to admit he's got this wrong.

He was brought in for a small, made us far too top heavy and we still haven't addressed that imbalance - we're way too big in the front half, lacking run off a half-back flank and playing a guy who has played one decent half of footy in four games against the Suns.

I like his raw talent and think he could be a real player, but this weird utility role he's playing at the moment is not good for him and it's hurting the side as a whole. He either needs to be selected as one of our 2 or 3 key defenders, or he needs to be developing at Footscray till we think he is in our best 2 or 3 key defenders.

[macca]

I would've played Cleary and Crozier this week, but my guess is we're looking at him to bring pace off a half-bank flank. We're pretty slow down there without JJ and Richards, and that's made a bit worse without Baker in the side as well. My guess is he's come in to play behind the ball and try to break some lines.

Has VDM been doing that in VFL games ? I am not convinced he can kick accurately

Lets see how he does it in afl games

[G-Mo77]

Can someone post what Vandermeer has done to get a game over Cleary ? Sweet is the perpetual emergency even after a good vfl game, whilst Lobb deserved to be dropped. Imo Cleary, Khamis and Sweet should leave for other clubs, their treatment at the dogs is appalling. Baker has had just one midly off game, he was good before then and we need his speed.

I think once you're in the doghouse it's hard to get out under this regime. You see players who do not perform get games week after week when others are given once chance to cement their spot and then sent back to the VFL to rot. I'm happy enough to let JOD get games but it's pretty clear he needs to move back to the VFL to work on his craft. He's still getting picked?

Vandermeer seems to have a special place in the MC hearts as well, average at best at VFL level, walks into the team on the back of a questionable 2 year contract extension.

It's nothing new, every week there seems to be questionable Ins and Outs and while this week, to me, seems to make a bit of sense I can see why supporters are putting their arms out and questioning why on some of them.

[G-Mo77]

Has VDM been doing that in VFL games ? I am not convinced he can kick accurately

Lets see how he does it in afl games

Played as a forward lately and no he can't kick accurately. Can run well but is not great by foot at all.

[bulldogtragic]

Has VDM been doing that in VFL games ? I am not convinced he can kick accurately

Lets see how he does it in afl games

We’ve got 2.5 more years to see…

[macca]

We’ve got 2.5 more years to see…

BT, I only can HOPE and look optimistically for his talent to emerge in those 2.5 years :)

I am starting to question some of our young player's development vs the need to constant shift for versatility.

[bulldogtragic]

BT, I only can HOPE and look optimistically for his talent to emerge in those 2.5 years :)

I am starting to question some of our young player's development vs the need to constant shift for versatility.

Well he was drafted as a HBF. Let’s see if that’s his best position. Because he’s not a good forward. So let’s see if players going back to their natural positions get results like JJ?

[Axe Man]

Played as a forward lately and no he can't kick accurately. Can run well but is not great by foot at all.

Latest VFL report:

Laith Vandermeer
18 disposals, three marks, two inside 50s

“Laith was good off half-back - he gave us plenty of drive. It was one of those ones where with more exposure to that half-back role, he seems to be transferring that knowledge from Jamie (Maddocks) onto the field. It looks pretty dangerous with him coming off half-back.”

[hujsh]

Played as a forward lately and no he can't kick accurately. Can run well but is not great by foot at all.

Well, neither could Boyd until he was in defence, and even at his Norm Smith best JJ often couldn't either. We'll have to see if the position change helps with that aspect of his game.

[GVGjr]

Can someone post what Vandermeer has done to get a game over Cleary ? Sweet is the perpetual emergency even after a good vfl game, whilst Lobb deserved to be dropped. Imo Cleary, Khamis and Sweet should leave for other clubs, their treatment at the dogs is appalling. Baker has had just one midly off game, he was good before then and we need his speed.

Who knows for sure but with our best runners from the back line out in Richards and JJ plus Baker being dropped I guess Vandermeer should be able to provide us some dash from the back line.
He trained there a few times in the summer and was going okay.

[Scorlibo]

I don't mind the omission of Baker as he has been missing easy targets by foot for over a month, and I think Scott can offer us better value up the field.

Gardner has been my whipping boy for a while but I do feel like he's unlucky on this occasion. Made some dreadful errors against the Cats but also did some good things. Overall I just don't see that he offers less than Bruce, who we know is likely to turn it over by foot in bad spots.

Keath for O'Brien - meh - reward the VFL form, sure.

O'Donnell's selection is purely stubbornness on Bevo's part at this point.

Vandermeer's selection must be based on him bringing pace to the side. I get that, but also there's more than one way to create space, and Cleary does this so well in the VFL with his composure, agility and decision making. There must be something more at play with Cleary, off field indiscretions or the like. He's in the bad books for some reason.

Good luck to Rhylee, hope he can bring a good contest at the drop of the ball.

[Bullies]

Played as a forward lately and no he can't kick accurately. Can run well but is not great by foot at all. Probably the bonus with VDM not getting it much is the fact that his skills are no good.

[Rocco Jones]

Who knows for sure but with our best runners from the back line out in Richards and JJ plus Baker being dropped I guess Vandermeer should be able to provide us some dash from the back line.
He trained there a few times in the summer and was going okay.

Yep. There's a spot there for someone who offers linebreaking speed. VDM is that type, Cleary isn't. I'd still like to see Cleary in but get why VDM is in.

[JanLorMill]

Can't say Gardner was unlucky because he made a few mistakes against Geelong, he did the same against Gold Coast. Nothing special vs Carlton

[GVGjr]

Can't say Gardner was unlucky because he made a few mistakes against Geelong, he did the same against Gold Coast. Nothing special vs Carlton

I thought he played very well against Adelaide as well.

[Mantis]

I thought he played very well against Adelaide as well.

Adelaide only had 41 Inside 50's and were without their 2 most recognized tall forwards in Thilthorpe & Walker so it was a good day to be a tall defender.

[Grantysghost]

Adelaide only had 41 Inside 50's and were without their 2 most recognized tall forwards in Thilthorpe & Walker so it was a good day to be a tall defender.

They were bottom 6 that day. Really played terribly.

[G-Mo77]

Well, neither could Boyd until he was in defence, and even at his Norm Smith best JJ often couldn't either. We'll have to see if the position change helps with that aspect of his game.

FWIW. I'd rather him in Defence than on a HF line which is how we've played him in the past. What both those players lacked in certain areas they made up for them in others. I've seen nothing from Vandemeer that is even close to the toolkit of a Boyd or JJ, he can run fast, I don't see much else really. He's one of our last options to fill the void so we've got to go with it, we've also got to justify putting 2 more years onto his contract.

[G-Mo77]

Latest VFL report:

Laith Vandermeer
18 disposals, three marks, two inside 50s

?Laith was good off half-back - he gave us plenty of drive. It was one of those ones where with more exposure to that half-back role, he seems to be transferring that knowledge from Jamie (Maddocks) onto the field. It looks pretty dangerous with him coming off half-back.?

OK, I'll take my quote as an L. I could have sworn I saw him line up on the HFF. He certainly didn't stand out from what I saw of it.