James Harmes

[jazzadogs]

Simple premise for this thread - somebody convince me that this is a good idea.

His best football was in 2021 as a centre bounce mid. If we're serious about including more players in that rotation, I want it to be youth with upside.

2023 stats/averages
9 games
1 goal 5 behinds
12 disposals
1.8 clearances
0.1 goal assists
3.4 tackles
17.8 pressure acts

Edit: he is also reported to be on 500k per year

[bulldogtragic]

It’s poo. And smacks of someone out of ideas, or trading for the sake of it.

[hujsh]

If I was to try and sell it I'd say he adresses gaps in our list. Defensive midset in the middle/tagging. Added pace. Premiership experience. Pressure as a forward. A bit of 'hardness'

Maybe attributes to convert to a lockdown defender though I have no idea if that's possible with him.

Not sure I'm sold either TBH.

[GVGjr]

It's hard to get excited about him at the moment and while his 2021 season was quite good his best football in terms of possession numbers go back to 2018 and 2019.

When you throw in some question marks about his off field conduct it would need for a bit to go right to make it a success.

I'm not against bringing him in and I'm not concerned about his age which is often a distraction when we discuss bringing in experienced players from other teams but I just wonder if he is a depth player or if we have a genuine spot in mind that he will fill.

[soupman]

I don't mind the idea of bringing in a change of mentality to our mid group and having someone involved who can set the tone in terms of "defensive accountability".

There's gotta be a better version than Harmes though.

[jazzadogs]

When googling I did see that he had time off at the start of the year for "personal reasons" so maybe he does just need a change of scenery like Lachie Hunter.

[Sedat]

If I was to try and sell it I'd say he adresses gaps in our list. Defensive midset in the middle/tagging. Added pace. Premiership experience. Pressure as a forward. A bit of 'hardness'

Maybe attributes to convert to a lockdown defender though I have no idea if that's possible with him.

Not sure I'm sold either TBH.
All decent arguments. We aren't going to live or die in 2024 whether or not we take Harmes. Is he an upgrade on our 19-23 players selected each week? Does he fit an area of need? Has he come from a winning environment? If the answer is yes to these 3 questions, it's a reasonable call to make if the cost is minimal.

The problem isn't really getting Harmes, it is giving the likes of Baker and VDM generous contract extensions (in terms of length). These types should be on a short leash (if any at all) - I would argue giving VDM 3 years is more irresponsible (in terms of list management) than 8 years for Naughton.

[Grantysghost]

I can't. Cooked.

[Happy Days]

Harmes sucks and this is a shocking move that will not work.

We haven?t made one move I?ve liked at the trade table in 3 years. In fact we haven?t made one move at the trade table in 3 years that I haven?t hated and between Coffield, Harmes, and O?Brien it seems like we?re going out of our way to target guys that I in particular think are terrible.

We need to make it stop before someone puts a call in to lure Cale Hooker out of retirement.

[jazzadogs]

Harmes sucks and this is a shocking move that will not work.

We haven?t made one move I?ve liked at the trade table in 3 years. In fact we haven?t made one move at the trade table in 3 years that I haven?t hated and between Coffield, Harmes, and O?Brien it seems like we?re going out of our way to target guys that I in particular think are terrible.

We need to make it stop before someone puts a call in to lure Cale Hooker out of retirement.

I'm okay with Coffield as he is the "good player with injury issues" that is worth a risk.

"Average player who is getting old and has no scope for improvement" is not worth the risk.

[bulldogtragic]

OFFICIAL:

Harmes requests trade to dogs.

[Happy Days]

I'm okay with Coffield as he is the "good player with injury issues" that is worth a risk.

"Average player who is getting old and has no scope for improvement" is not worth the risk.

Is he though? He was decent in 2020 but out of the side on form in 2021 and wasn’t able to get a game at all this year despite being fit for most of it.

Unless we think that TOB has left a massive hole on the list I don’t really see the point in replacing him.

[hujsh]

Is he though? He was decent in 2020 but out of the side on form in 2021 and wasn’t able to get a game at all this year despite being fit for most of it.

Unless we think that TOB has left a massive hole on the list I don’t really see the point in replacing him.

Was he? Must not have lasted long as he played 18 games and then 21 the year after.

I think our offer is 3 years+1, partly to flatten out his salary but all I can say is I hope he surprises us because that'll be a long time to have a list spot tied up on him. Maybe he's the next Dureya? Please?

[bulldogtragic]

Was he? Must not have lasted long as he played 18 games and then 21 the year after.

I think our offer is 3 years+1, partly to flatten out his salary but all I can say is I hope he surprises us because that'll be a long time to have a list spot tied up on him. Maybe he's the next Dureya? Please?

3+1?

You shitting me. Serious? Melbourne handing back Hunter’s salary contribution as well for this year and next? FMD.

[Grantysghost]

OFFICIAL:

Harmes requests trade to dogs.

Ha. This is the worst.

[bulldogtragic]

Ha. This is the worst.

We’ve lost the plot. Got rid of three firsts, Sweet and bringing in Harmes for 3+1 and Coffield who hasn’t played in two years.

[choconmientay]

They discussed this on AFL trade radio just now that he was to come to the dogs in 2020 trade period but because we jumped at Ads hence it didn't eventuate.

Maybe they refreshed the conversation based on the past link/discussion. For me it's 2 years too late. Depth player or tagger but I felt like myself many times going after a bargain and bought it but in the end never or would get used once and throw away.

[hujsh]

3+1?

You shitting me. Serious? Melbourne handing back Hunter’s salary contribution as well for this year and next? FMD.

Thats the rumour. He's on 500k a year which is too much so he signs a contract when he gets here that spreads it out over a longer period of time, If he's no good that +1 shouldn't matter so a 3 year commitment

And since the list manager of the Dees spoke about letting him explore other options I think he comes over for free since we take that salary off their list.

[bulldogtragic]

Thats the rumour. He's on 500k a year which is too much so he signs a contract when he gets here that spreads it out over a longer period of time, If he's no good that +1 shouldn't matter so a 3 year commitment

Madness. This is madness.

[jazzadogs]

Is the Footscray captaincy included in our offer?

[Rocket Science]

So we're courting a bloke who knocked back overtures from Essington a year ago and wasn't good enough to snatch a spot in a side that got turfed out in straight sets, again, not even as the freakin sub.

And perhaps most unforgivably, he grew up actually barracking for Melbourne.

PloughSpewUp.gif

[chef]

The day keeps getting better.

[The Underdog]

Most punchable Bulldog is nailed down for the next 3-4 years.

[choconmientay]

I propose this trade to have at least Libba sign-off or is this a result of Libba's request for a punching bag at training?

[azabob]

Look, at least now we have a genuine contest of clubs best rig.

Smith, Harmes or Buku...

Calenderer for all seasons has basically printed itself.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Here's our new whipping boy.

[G-Mo77]

I'm not against this as much as others but 3+1. We're the club that just keeps on giving!

[Happy Days]

Was he? Must not have lasted long as he played 18 games and then 21 the year after.

I think our offer is 3 years+1, partly to flatten out his salary but all I can say is I hope he surprises us because that'll be a long time to have a list spot tied up on him. Maybe he's the next Dureya? Please?

I was talking Coffield.

I don?t think there?s anyone on the site who wants us to pick up Harmes.

[hujsh]

I was talking Coffield.

I don?t think there?s anyone on the site who wants us to pick up Harmes.

Oh my bad.

Then I'd dispute that he was available all year. He played 4 VFL games at the very end of the season. Which itself is a mark against his body/durability. You're right he was dropped in 21 though.

[westbulldog]

Hannan mark2 imo

[Mofra]

Hannan mark2 imo
Hannan could kick though.
He could play a variety of rolls.

If any midfield minutes open up next year I'd want them going to Baz, not a semi-cooked Casey VFL player.

[DOG GOD]

Wow. Not suprised at all. This club is quickly becoming the Titanic.

[azabob]

Future 3rd likely to be traded for Harmes.

[bulldogtragic]

Future 3rd likely to be traded for Harmes.

They gave us a F3 for Hunter…

[angelopetraglia]

Deal lodged:
James Harmes has been traded to the Western Bulldogs in exchange for a future third-round pick

(Mitch Cleary)

[bulldogtragic]

Bailey Smith: More midfield minutes or I leave.

Dogs: We just signed Harmes. Over to you Bailey.

[Dancin' Douggy]

It's a tie with Lobb for me.
Most punchable Bulldog is nailed down for the next 3-4 years.

[The Pie Man]

My guess is they see him playing a high half forward pushing into the midfield role that Smith & MacRae kinda sucked at this year. SP has mentioned the need to add more speed to the group.

If Baz is still there next season and Harmes takes his midfield minutes, we’d want to be winning most of our games to justify it.

Future 3rd at least an appropriate exchange.

Who knows, could work out

[hujsh]

Club twitter says Our future third pick so presumably we keep the GC pick.

That's 2 of our future picks out, good thing we're winning the premiership next year

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I'd rather it was a token 4th round pick. Especially if we are taking on his salary. I mean, we traded Hunter for less didn't we?

As a player, I'm not mad about it.

For those angry about it, don't forget we've been giving games to McNeil, VDM, Scott, Arty, R Smith, Baker, Poulter, McComb and others in recent times. A couple of these are OK and some are young (Arty) but Harmes is better than all of them.

Our bottom 6-8 has been putrid. Harmes/Coffield help a little bit in this area.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Club twitter says Our future third pick so presumably we keep the GC pick.

That's 2 of our future picks out, good thing we're winning the premiership next year

At this rate I feel our 3rd will be a better pick than the suns' 3rd.

It's such a bad trade. We're taking on his salary and the dees don't even want or need him......

[angelopetraglia]

Are only comitting ourselves to one year? What is the length of the contract?

[bulldogtragic]

Are only comitting ourselves to one year? What is the length of the contract?

3+1.

[Sedat]

I'd rather it was a token 4th round pick. Especially if we are taking on his salary. I mean, we traded Hunter for less didn't we?

As a player, I'm not mad about it.

For those angry about it, don't forget we've been giving games to McNeil, VDM, Scott, Arty, R Smith, Baker, Poulter, McComb and others in recent times. A couple of these are OK and some are young (Arty) but Harmes is better than all of them.

Our bottom 6-8 has been putrid. Harmes/Coffield help a little bit in this area.
This. And a future 3rd with all the academy/NGA/father-sons in next year's crop will end up being a very speculative pick at best.

I'm more annoyed at a 3 year deal for someone with as many clear deficiencies as VDM.

Poor Harmes - doesn't even have a dedicated 'Welcome to the Bulldogs' thread :D

[choconmientay]

James H Career stat is an upgrade compared to Garcia, McNeil, West (unfair comparison TBH with the others are much younger and less games, especially West has never got a decent run at it) but he is similar to Toby McLean. Where does this leave Toby Mclean?


Toby McLean Name James Harmes
Western Bulldogs Team Melbourne Demons
Midfield, Forward Position Midfield, Forward
102 Career Games 152
January 31, 1996 Date of Birth October 5, 1995
27yr 8mth Age 28yr 0mth
181cm Height 186cm
83kg Weight 85kg
2014 National Draft Last Drafted In 2013 Rookie Draft
Round 2, Pick #26 Draft Position Round 1, Pick #2
Career Stats Career
102 Games 152
8 Kicks 8.8
10.1 Handballs 9.7
18.1 Disposals 18.5
3.2 Marks 3
0.6 Goals 0.5
0.5 Behinds 0.5
3.9 Tackles 4.1
0 Hitouts 0
2.6 Inside 50s 3.1
0.4 Goal Assists 0.3
1.4 Frees For 0.9
0.8 Frees Against 1.1
7.1 Contested Possessions 7.7
11.4 Uncontested Possessions 11.2
13.4 Effective Disposals 12.9
74% Disposal Efficiency % 69.70%
2.1 Clangers 2.9
0.2 Contested Marks 0.3
0.5 Marks Inside 50 0.4
2.2 Clearances 2.3
0.6 Rebound 50s 1
1 One Percenters 1.3
0.3 Bounces 0.3
73.6 Time On Ground % 74.9
0.6 Centre Clearances 0.8
1.6 Stoppage Clearances 1.5
5 Score Involvements 4.5
197.2 Metres Gained 260
2.8 Turnovers 3.2
2.3 Intercepts 2.7
0.9 Tackles Inside 50 0.8

[The bulldog tragician]

He seems like such a tosser. Has always seemed like one of the smug and entitled. I can’t dislike this enough, and then talentwise is not what we need in any sense. I can’t imagine ways in which he makes us better.

I’m really concerned that these decisions are being made without those fresh eyes and new ideas on how we play and what we need, that we all wanted to be in place. If we’d snared one of that ever growing list of assistants who’ve turned us down, I’d feel more faith in our direction.

[G-Mo77]

We happy with giving an F3 for him. We got an F3 for Lachie didn't we?

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Well....at least someone wanted to come here. Good on him for that. Maybe he'll get a trend going.

[Hotdog60]

It's not good he has more tattoo than Libba.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Another positive is he brings some intangibles we need. Like defending and flying the flag. We need this. If he can set some standards here for the rest of the group it might actually pay off. We no longer have to rely on Libba and only Libba.

[Rocket Science]

It's been remarked 'round these parts we're a hard team to like lately so bravo to Sam Power I suppose for doubling down on that shit.

[jazzadogs]

He seems like such a tosser. Has always seemed like one of the smug and entitled. I can’t dislike this enough, and then talentwise is not what we need in any sense. I can’t imagine ways in which he makes us better.

I’m really concerned that these decisions are being made without those fresh eyes and new ideas on how we play and what we need, that we all wanted to be in place. If we’d snared one of that ever growing list of assistants who’ve turned us down, I’d feel more faith in our direction.

+++++

[DOG GOD]

He seems like such a tosser. Has always seemed like one of the smug and entitled. I can’t dislike this enough, and then talentwise is not what we need in any sense. I can’t imagine ways in which he makes us better.

I’m really concerned that these decisions are being made without those fresh eyes and new ideas on how we play and what we need, that we all wanted to be in place. If we’d snared one of that ever growing list of assistants who’ve turned us down, I’d feel more faith in our direction.

Yep, I don’t want to be negative, but I just can’t help it. Since our season finished, nothing we have done since has given me any hope for 2024. I literally can’t wait to see the first spud get announced for the coaches box.

[1eyedog]

He seems like such a tosser. Has always seemed like one of the smug and entitled. I can’t dislike this enough, and then talentwise is not what we need in any sense. I can’t imagine ways in which he makes us better.

I’m really concerned that these decisions are being made without those fresh eyes and new ideas on how we play and what we need, that we all wanted to be in place. If we’d snared one of that ever growing list of assistants who’ve turned us down, I’d feel more faith in our direction.

And then he kicks a goal in RWB or does a goal saving tackle and all is forgiven

[1eyedog]

The sooking on this site is out of control you'd think Bont left the club the way some people are carrying on.

Harmes is what he is. I don't give a shit if he is a good bloke or not to be honest I'm not inviting him over for drinks. If he brings some hardness to our very soft underbelly all well and good.

Assistants sure we've missed out but who other than Leppa have we had a genuine crack at and who has given us an outright no?

[Grantysghost]

The sooking on this site is out of control you'd think Bont left the club the way some people are carrying on.

Harmes is what he is. I don't give a shit if he is a good bloke or not to be honest I'm not inviting him over for drinks. If he brings some hardness to our very soft underbelly all well and good.

Assistants sure we've missed out but who other than Leppa have we had a genuine crack at and who has given us an outright no?

You feel better after a good sook :)

Harmes might be ok - but I haven't finished hating him yet; give me a few more days.

[Bulldog4life]

The sooking on this site is out of control you'd think Bont left the club the way some people are carrying on.

Harmes is what he is. I don't give a shit if he is a good bloke or not to be honest I'm not inviting him over for drinks. If he brings some hardness to our very soft underbelly all well and good.

Assistants sure we've missed out but who other than Leppa have we had a genuine crack at and who has given us an outright no?

Agree let's all harden up woofers till we know the end result. Personally I like that we are bringing some hardness into the ranks.

[anfo27]

I don't dislike the trade. We need as many tough hobres as we can get. Are the dees paying some of his wage?

[Grantysghost]

Agree let's all harden up woofers till we know the end result. Personally I like that we are bringing some hardness into the ranks.

Why are people correlating Harmes with hardness?

Beach muscles.

[SonofScray]

He’s going to have to bring plenty of stuff to the table for me to get around him.

Get a kick.
Hit the scoreboard.
Make life hard for the opposition, frequently.
Start a fight every now and then.

Good luck to him, but it’s a worry.

[Grantysghost]

He’s going to have to bring plenty of stuff to the table for me to get around him.

Get a kick.
Hit the scoreboard.
Make life hard for the opposition, frequently.
Start a fight every now and then.

Good luck to him, but it’s a worry.

Especially when Demons fans say he's cooked. I mean he was playing at Casey right....(9 games this year for AFL side and Oliver was out for a while)

Give that man 4 years ! (please that can't be true).

[Bulldog4life]

Especially when Demons fans say he's cooked. I mean he was playing at Casey right....(9 games this year for AFL side and Oliver was out for a while)

Give that man 4 years ! (please that can't be true).

Link?

[angelopetraglia]

"James Harmes has signed a three-year deal with the Western Bulldogs through to the end of 2026. Had one year remaining with Melbourne."


Callum Twomey

[jazzadogs]

He's in my top 5 (bottom 5?) least liked players in the comp. Fritsch #1 obvs. And I'm not sure he's played a good AFL game in a few years?

Would have preferred to take a ping at Sullivan.

It's gonna take me some time to warm to this.

[soupman]

3 years is crazy. Again I see the merit in recruiting a mid who is a bit more defensive minded, and also means we aren't fully reliant on Libba to provide a harder edge, but man is Harmes really the best version of that we could get?

[Grantysghost]

Link?

3 years, still 2 too many.

[Dancin' Douggy]

It's hard when your club signs players you've always had a deep dislike of. Lobb and now Harmes. but meh what are you gonna do.

As far as Harmes' toughness goes, it's a bit of 'K Mart tough' in my opinion.

[Bulldog Revolution]

"James Harmes has signed a three-year deal with the Western Bulldogs through to the end of 2026. Had one year remaining with Melbourne."


Callum Twomey

Id suspect/hope its a renegotiated 3 year deal - not a 1+3

[whythelongface]

Yep, I don?t want to be negative, but I just can?t help it. Since our season finished, nothing we have done since has given me any hope for 2024. I literally can?t wait to see the first spud get announced for the coaches box.

I get that it is hard to be positive about a lot of decisions but surely the Naughton long term deal put at least a smile on your face. Even if it was only for a moment.

[The Underdog]

The sooking on this site is out of control you'd think Bont left the club the way some people are carrying on.

Harmes is what he is. I don't give a shit if he is a good bloke or not to be honest I'm not inviting him over for drinks. If he brings some hardness to our very soft underbelly all well and good.

Assistants sure we've missed out but who other than Leppa have we had a genuine crack at and who has given us an outright no?

It?s funny, the general discourse in the wider AFL world seems to be that this is a decent deal for the Dogs. I don?t necessarily feel that way, but it gives a bit of perspective.

[Dancin' Douggy]

This just reeks of us getting distracted on the way to the shops. Were we chasing Harmes? Does he fill a specific need? Or did we just take him because he happened to be there in the clearance bin, and we were the first customer. It’s utterly underwhelming and doesn’t fill me with any other feeling than ‘yeah whatever’.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

It?s funny, the general discourse in the wider AFL world seems to be that this is a decent deal for the Dogs. I don?t necessarily feel that way, but it gives a bit of perspective.

Yeah I'm hearing a lot of positivity from non dogs fans......

[GVGjr]

This just reeks of us getting distracted on the way to the shops. Were we chasing Harmes? Does he fill a specific need? Or did we just take him because he happened to be there on the way to the shops. It’s utterly underwhelming and doesn’t fill me with any other feeling than ‘yeah whatever’.

I'm warming to this trade just a bit and it's just the 3 year deal that I need to work out why we would head in that direction.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

I'm warming to this trade just a bit and it's just the 3 year deal that I need to work out why we would head in that direction.

I've seen the club website mention defensive minded a bit. It's good that we've identified that as a need but also not a great sign we have confidence in our existing players to knuckle down in that area.

[The Underdog]

Yeah I'm hearing a lot of positivity from non dogs fans......

Mentioned it to an Essendon supporter at work who was disappointed they didn’t get him last year and was pretty positive about it.

[The Underdog]

I've seen the club website mention defensive minded a bit. It's good that we've identified that as a need but also not a great sign we have confidence in our existing players to knuckle down in that area.

Maybe they’re going to weld him to Bailey Smith and make a 2 way runner.

[Grantysghost]

Mentioned it to an Essendon supporter at work who was disappointed they didn’t get him last year and was pretty positive about it.

That's all you need to know that it's a bad idea!

[Happy Days]

So to recap:

- player who sucks
- horrible tattoos
- unreal rig
- seems like a dickhead

I figured out why I hate this so much. This is Justin Sherman all over again.

[G-Mo77]

So to recap:

- player who sucks
- horrible tattoos
- unreal rig
- seems like a dickhead

I figured out why I hate this so much. This is Justin Sherman all over again.

Haha. I didn't hate him until he arrived and then I realised.

Melbourne have got rid of one of their 2 most punchable faces. Melksham holds that 1st place trophy by a fair margin.

[Doc26]

Haha. I didn't hate him until he arrived and then I realised.

Melbourne have got rid of one of their 2 most punchable faces. Melksham holds that 1st place trophy by a fair margin.

and to think Fritsch didn?t make your list.

I don’t mind Harmes based on insurance and some level of need but should fit more in the Territory of as a delisted free agent.

[G-Mo77]

and to think Fritsch didn?t make your list.

I don’t mind Harmes based on insurance and some level of need but should fit more in the Territory of as a delisted free agent.

Oh dear. How could I forget him.

[jeemak]

I'm not thinking he's going to be magnificent for us, but I'd be interested to know how posters think we're supposed to get depth on our list that has proved capable of playing at the highest level without trading for it.

We desperately need players who can put selection pressure on the players we think haven't contributed consistently. Harmes does that.

[Grantysghost]

I'm not thinking he's going to be magnificent for us, but I'd be interested to know how posters think we're supposed to get depth on our list that has proved capable of playing at the highest level without trading for it.

We desperately need players who can put selection pressure on the players we think haven't contributed consistently. Harmes does that.

For me Jee I'd rather see proven VFL talent get a crack over washed up guys on the retirement plan.

Sullivan for eg would be my preference in this instance. Probably similar skill sets, about the same effectiveness in the VFL (actually Lachie played better when we smashed Casey).

I'm not sure if everyone is seeing the 21 version of Harmes in their minds eye, he's not been that for a while.

I hope he gets it back, however I'm not that confident.

We need depth agree.

[jeemak]

For me Jee I'd rather see proven VFL talent get a crack over washed up guys on the retirement plan.

Sullivan for eg would be my preference in this instance. Probably similar skill sets, about the same effectiveness in the VFL (actually Lachie played better when we smashed Casey).

I'm not sure if everyone is seeing the 21 version of Harmes in their minds eye, he's not been that for a while.

I hope he gets it back, however I'm not that confident.

We need depth agree.

He's a bigger body and taller, we'll find out if he's able to get form back I guess. Sullivan to me is a great VFL player who I don't want to see lining up on the half forward line for us as we try and squeeze him into a role.

[jazzadogs]

He's a bigger body and taller, we'll find out if he's able to get form back I guess. Sullivan to me is a great VFL player who I don't want to see lining up on the half forward line for us as we try and squeeze him into a role.

But isn't that what we'll do with Harmes? His best football was in the midfield and this year wasn't getting picked in that role with Oliver out, and also wasn't getting picked for the half forward role (because I don't think he's very effective at it) behind Neal-Bullen and Chandler.

[Rocket Science]

We desperately need players who can put selection pressure on the players we think haven't contributed consistently. Harmes does that.

It's true, we do, the main wrinkle here though is he wasn't actually doing a whole lot of this at the club he's coming from and managed fewer games this year than all of McNeil, West & Scott respectively, and was completely ghosted come finals.

This bloke's going to light a fire under our comfortable regulars?

He's a modest upgrade on McComb I suppose.

[jeemak]

But isn't that what we'll do with Harmes? His best football was in the midfield and this year wasn't getting picked in that role with Oliver out, and also wasn't getting picked for the half forward role (because I don't think he's very effective at it) behind Neal-Bullen and Chandler.

Likely, and on a wing. Roles he's proved capable of playing in a premiership team.

He's admitted he didn't play well this year, and I'm sure there's reasons for that. He should technically be in his prime so we'll see how it goes.

I reckon Melbourne would have been a shit place to be the last couple of years, let's see how he goes.

[whythelongface]

For me Jee I'd rather see proven VFL talent get a crack over washed up guys on the retirement plan.

Sullivan for eg would be my preference in this instance. Probably similar skill sets, about the same effectiveness in the VFL (actually Lachie played better when we smashed Casey).

I'm not sure if everyone is seeing the 21 version of Harmes in their minds eye, he's not been that for a while.

I hope he gets it back, however I'm not that confident.

We need depth agree.

We tried that with McComb and he is quite dominant at VFL level. Sullivan would probably be similar. At least Harmes has shown ability. Nothing to stop him regaining his ‘21 form. Then bang we have a player who is bottom of our top 22.

[jeemak]

It's true, we do, the main wrinkle here though is he wasn't actually doing a whole lot of this at the club he's coming from and managed fewer games this year than all of McNeil, West & Scott respectively, and was completely ghosted come finals.

This bloke's going to light a fire under our comfortable regulars?

He's a modest upgrade on McComb I suppose.

I get it's all the rage to put shit on everything at the moment, but those keeping him out of Melbourne's side are a bit better than those who played for us. Bringing McComb into the conversation doesn't give any cred, we've let him go and Harmes is well better than he is and it's silly to suggest otherwise.

[soupman]

For me Jee I'd rather see proven VFL talent get a crack over washed up guys on the retirement plan.


Haven't we tried that already?

McComb, Hayes, Gowers, Scott, Poulter and Gardner all came from the VFL system, and aside from the last two solely the VFL system.

"Strong bodied ball winning mid who can play a role forward" describes both Harmes and McComb when we recruited them. Except one has proven he can play at AFL level while the other only had to be named on an extended bench before people started threatening not to go.

We have been "moneyballing" our late picks in the last few years, trying to get low ceiling but sturdy floor types to add depth, except we keep finding out the floor is stuffed. I don't mind the change of mindset to get actual proven AFL role players, even if they are a bit cooked, especially if it means we swing for the fences a bit more with our draft selections and try and find players that could have a point of difference instead of a reliable foot soldier that isn't actually good enough for our best 22.

I do not like Harmes, but I do think when called upon he is going to be serviceable.

[Grantysghost]

Yes and think that's a reasonable hit rate.

Poulter tick.
McComb cross.
Gardner tick. (come at me woof)
Gowers huge tick! (ok cross apart from one season)
Scott tick.

I'm not sure the argument that he was good before so he will be good again in the future holds any weight.

[The Underdog]

For me Jee I'd rather see proven VFL talent get a crack over washed up guys on the retirement plan.

Sullivan for eg would be my preference in this instance. Probably similar skill sets, about the same effectiveness in the VFL (actually Lachie played better when we smashed Casey).

I'm not sure if everyone is seeing the 21 version of Harmes in their minds eye, he's not been that for a while.

I hope he gets it back, however I'm not that confident.

We need depth agree.

A lot easier to sell a 28yo premiership winning 150 gamer as depth than a 26 yo rookie out of the VFL.

[Rocket Science]

I get it's all the rage to put shit on everything at the moment, but those keeping him out of Melbourne's side are a bit better than those who played for us. Bringing McComb into the conversation doesn't give any cred, we've let him go and Harmes is well better than he is and it's silly to suggest otherwise.

All the rage and largely deserved y'think?

We agree he's an upgrade on McComb and amusingly enough, Beach Rig's VFL averages this year are marginally better than McComb's, so that settles that and there's 20 seconds I'll never get back.

Let's look forward to him getting a nice long leash and the measured discourse to come!

[jazzadogs]

All the rage and largely deserved y'think?

We agree he's an upgrade on McComb and amusingly enough, Beach Rig's VFL averages this year are marginally better than McComb's, so that settles that and there's 20 seconds I'll never get back.

Let's look forward to him getting a nice long leash and the measured discourse to come!

I plan to be utterly ruthless in my appraisal of his game.

[bornadog]

I plan to be utterly ruthless in my appraisal of his game.

Why? He is a cheap pick up - who else could you get at that price? an unknown kid that is 100 to one to make it.

[Bulldog Joe]

I am seeing a lot of angst about this but I am not sure why.
I am currently overseas and have had a message from a Melbourne supporting mate telling me I should be happy and he is disappointed.
What I have see across the trade threads is that we basically should decide that we are no longer in contention and should be trying to rebuild for maybe 3 to 5 years time.
Personally I want to see us improve with a view that we can win in 2024.
If we look at Collingwood 2021, we are better than they were.
Maybe I wanted a new coach, but since that is not happening I simply want a better team.
Harmes is an improvement on Hannan from 2023.
Let's just set ourselves up to win the thing

[Grantysghost]

I plan to be utterly ruthless in my appraisal of his game.

Ditto. My pressure acts segment is making a woof come back just for Bali Jim.

[Grantysghost]

Why? He us a cheap pick up - who else could you get at that price? an unknown kid that is 100 to one to make it.

Cause he sucks?

[G-Mo77]

Why? He us a cheap pick up - who else could you get at that price? an unknown kid that is 100 to one to make it.

You can look at it that way the other way is that we could get a player to make us even better beyond those 2 - 3 years Harmes will give us. I'm not against getting him in but would have preferred our recruitment team actually got out and did their job and find us some hidden talent.

Lots of people even those within are using the lack of mid range picks as an excuse for our poor depth and that argument stacks up. We get a heap of picks in the 3rd and we trade them away for a short term player and the rest get eaten on F/S selection.

It just seems no one internally is on the same page? Are we contending? Are we rebuilding? Until we work things out internally we'll continue to be a directionless ship sailing aimlessly around the ocean.

[GVGjr]

You can look at it that way the other way is that we could get a player to make us even better beyond those 2 - 3 years Harmes will give us. I'm not against getting him in but would have preferred our recruitment team actually got out and did their job and find us some hidden talent.

Lots of people even those within are using the lack of mid range picks as an excuse for our poor depth and that argument stacks up. We get a heap of picks in the 3rd and we trade them away for a short term player and the rest get eaten on F/S selection.

It just seems no one internally is on the same page? Are we contending? Are we rebuilding? Until we work things out internally we'll continue to be a directionless ship sailing aimlessly around the ocean.

It's such an important part of entering the trade and draft periods to really know what direction the club is capable of heading in and I do wonder if we are in a bit of denial with that aspect at times. We picked up a couple of experienced players last year and we've already added a player with 150 games of experience this year and the message that sends is we are chips in on contending.
What we haven't been good at is delivering on that vision.

[bulldogtragic]

It's such an important part of entering the trade and draft periods to really know what direction the club is capable of heading in and I do wonder if we are in a bit of denial with that aspect at times. We picked up a couple of experienced players last year and we've already added a player with 150 games of experience this year and the message that sends is we are chips in on contending.
What we haven't been good at is delivering on that vision.

I hope they’re right. If there’s a decision to rebuild next year with no F1 then it’s going to a long painful rebuild and not the short sharp one I had hoped for. We will see.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Cause he sucks?

How do you rate McNeil? ;)

[Grantysghost]

How do you rate McNeil? ;)

Great biceps for a statue.

[hujsh]

Didn't listen but Harmes on Trade Radio saying his role will be as a defensive midfield and high half forward. Knocked back other interested clubs because of the pitch from Bevo and Power

[jeemak]

All the rage and largely deserved y'think?

We agree he's an upgrade on McComb and amusingly enough, Beach Rig's VFL averages this year are marginally better than McComb's, so that settles that and there's 20 seconds I'll never get back.

Let's look forward to him getting a nice long leash and the measured discourse to come!

I think people respond to asymmetric information differently. I'm not going to tell people their emotional responses to the current situation are wrong, they are what they are.

I'll expect the same type of discourse experienced with the likes of Lobb and O'Brien, noting it will take a long while for Harmes to be accepted as one of our own for a number of reasons.

[1eyedog]

I am seeing a lot of angst about this but I am not sure why.
I am currently overseas and have had a message from a Melbourne supporting mate telling me I should be happy and he is disappointed.
What I have see across the trade threads is that we basically should decide that we are no longer in contention and should be trying to rebuild for maybe 3 to 5 years time.
Personally I want to see us improve with a view that we can win in 2024.
If we look at Collingwood 2021, we are better than they were.
Maybe I wanted a new coach, but since that is not happening I simply want a better team.
Harmes is an improvement on Hannan from 2023.
Let's just set ourselves up to win the thing

Same I have Melbourne mates messaging me he is a great pick up for us. He's tough and has a crack but can also play. They seem to think he needs to freshen up and some really good players are keeping him out of a specific position in the team. My mates think the team plays better when he is playing.

Harmes is probably better than about 8 players we played last year.

[Twodogs]

I am seeing a lot of angst about this but I am not sure why.
I am currently overseas and have had a message from a Melbourne supporting mate telling me I should be happy and he is disappointed.
What I have see across the trade threads is that we basically should decide that we are no longer in contention and should be trying to rebuild for maybe 3 to 5 years time.
Personally I want to see us improve with a view that we can win in 2024.
If we look at Collingwood 2021, we are better than they were.
Maybe I wanted a new coach, but since that is not happening I simply want a better team.
Harmes is an improvement on Hannan from 2023.
Let's just set ourselves up to win the thing

Funnily enough when I messaged my son in England to let him know he said "Harmes? That's a good pick up for us"

Maybe some of us are a bit close to it and can't see the forest for the trees?

[choconmientay]

Maybe some of us are a bit close to it and can't see the forest for the trees?

Maybe .. since he chooses us over others

SEN
WHY HARMES SHUNNED INTEREST FROM OTHER CLUBS TO REQUEST A TRADE TO THE BULLDOGS (https://www.sen.com.au/news/2023/10/11/why-harmes-shunned-interest-from-other-clubs-to-request-a-trade-to-the/)

The 28-year-old was reportedly being chased by the likes of Richmond, Sydney, Carlton and Essendon but Harmes says he knew the Bulldogs were his preferred home after a meeting with coach Luke Beveridge and list manager Sam Power.

?I had a few clubs inquire about me,? Harmes told AFL Trade Radio.

?The reason I chose Bulldogs is when I caught up with Bevo (Luke Beveridge) and Sammy (Power) it felt right.

?I felt like I could really belong to this club and feel like they really believed in me.

?They do believe in me that I can be a really good AFL footballer and obviously last year was pretty challenging for me.

?I didn't have the greatest year, so I probably lost a bit of confidence.

?After the meeting, I felt like I walked out of there and they had a lot of confidence in me to become a really good footballer again.?

Harmes says the initial meeting with Beveridge and Power re-energised him and gave him the confidence that he could get back to his best at his new home.


would that make us a destination club now? :)

[bornadog]

Maybe .. since he chooses us over others

SEN
WHY HARMES SHUNNED INTEREST FROM OTHER CLUBS TO REQUEST A TRADE TO THE BULLDOGS (https://www.sen.com.au/news/2023/10/11/why-harmes-shunned-interest-from-other-clubs-to-request-a-trade-to-the/)


would that make us a destination club now? :)

Must be a mistake, players don't like us

[jeemak]

Must be a mistake, players don't like us

Plus Bevo is flat and poison for anyone we're targeting, don't forget that. Did you see how flat he was at the Charlie Sutton night?

Before anyone jumps on me I'm just expressing a bit of frustration about what I think is partially a self-fulfilling narrative we have about ourselves.

It's mainly in jest, in the bits that don't count as mainly it's not. A chin up here and there wouldn't go astray.

[macca]

Harmes is behind a few players now at Dees either in midfield or at half-fwd.
melkshem , mcVee, Van roeyee and with Pickett floating forward , it be a fwd half hard to crack

I hope he comes good , and provides the hard tackling fwd with good forward pressure

Let’s see how he fares .
150 odd games , I guess half of them would have been in a Sh$&t Demons team until 2020

Interesting he nominated us ahead of other clubs below us .

[kruder]

Wow I can't believe Harmes has 8 pages already! Family members are Melbourne supporters and I've watched a bit of him over the years and I've always thought he would be handy at the Dogs just with his grunt and the ability to play a role.

I'd love to see a world where the Bont doesn't finish 4th on tackles which would give him the ability to add a little more sheen in his game(stole sheen from Bevo) I thought this year he was forced a little too inside.

Like Acres, Harmes might be a little meh during the season but come finals time can be a different beast and I reckon supporters will be glad to have him on our side.

Like him or not he is a Bulldogs player now lets give him a go and support him.

[FrediKanoute]

It's such an important part of entering the trade and draft periods to really know what direction the club is capable of heading in and I do wonder if we are in a bit of denial with that aspect at times. We picked up a couple of experienced players last year and we've already added a player with 150 games of experience this year and the message that sends is we are chips in on contending.
What we haven't been good at is delivering on that vision.

We wouldn't trade for Harmes if we felt as though we were not contending. It doesn't make sense to bring a ready now role player if you are doing a rebuild/refresh.

[Grantysghost]

We wouldn't trade for Harmes if we felt as though we were not contending. It doesn't make sense to bring a ready now role player if you are doing a rebuild/refresh.

What metric points to us contending?

The not making finals?

Or making it and being destroyed by Freo.

This is a land of make believe

[Grantysghost]

Plus Bevo is flat and poison for anyone we're targeting, don't forget that. Did you see how flat he was at the Charlie Sutton night?

Before anyone jumps on me I'm just expressing a bit of frustration about what I think is partially a self-fulfilling narrative we have about ourselves.

It's mainly in jest, in the bits that don't count as mainly it's not. A chin up here and there wouldn't go astray.

So contrived your contrarianism.

Maybe go to a game or talk to a player?

[Bulldog Joe]

What metric points to us contending?

The not making finals?

Or making it and being destroyed by Freo.

This is a land of make believe

What about the metric of adding one goal a game in 2023 would have had us top 4.

[anfo27]

What metric points to us contending?

The not making finals?

Or making it and being destroyed by Freo.

This is a land of make believe

No doubt we've been terrible the last 2 years & defensively we've been embarrassing. Its more on the coaching group than the playing group for mine. Harmes gives us some toughness & thats under rated & much needed.

The real question is the coaching group going to get the best out of the playing group? I have my doubts especially since the perception is nobody seems keen to come.

[anfo27]

What about the metric of adding one goal a game in 2023 would have had us top 4.

Not with the shizen type of style we played.

[Rocket Science]

Like Acres, Harmes might be a little meh during the season but come finals time can be a different beast and I reckon supporters will be glad to have him on our side.

Is this code for relaxing in the stands while your teammates get chucked out in straight sets?

Because we could definitely use some of that. The whole actually playing finals bit I mean.

[bornadog]

Like him or not he is a Bulldogs player now lets give him a go and support him.

My initial thoughts were we don't need him, but looking at the trade ie a F3 (from GC), cheap.

Now that he is in RWB, I back him all the way

[hujsh]

Is this code for relaxing in the stands while your teammates get chucked out in straight sets?

Because we could definitely use some of that. The whole actually playing finals bit I mean.

And straight sets means top 4. Cheap for a future third

[jeemak]

So contrived your contrarianism.

Maybe go to a game or talk to a player?

Or maybe take it in the spirit with the caveats provided.

Not all of us are privo enough to get access to players, some of us don't like going to games all the time because the experience is shit.

Maybe take on board a view from which the source or reasoning isn't telegraphed.

[Topdog]

Maybe go to a game or talk to a player?

So players are saying Bevo is poison?

[whythelongface]

So contrived your contrarianism.

Maybe go to a game or talk to a player?

Which players exactly and what concerns have been expressed?

[chef]

Naughton sounded pretty in love with Bevo, Harmes too.

[G-Mo77]

Naughton sounded pretty in love with Bevo, Harmes too.

This is something we just don't know. Players and coaches will try and say the right things and you will very rarely hear a bad word said about anyone. There would be players that like Bevo and players who do not, we'll never really find out the full story.

[chef]

This is something we just don't know. Players and coaches will try and say the right things and you will very rarely hear a bad word said about anyone. There would be players that like Bevo and players who do not, we'll never really find out the full story.

No doubt some wont 'love' him, but those two were pretty genuine with the way they talk about Bevo.

But then again im not in the Bevo is cancer camp.

[G-Mo77]

No doubt some wont 'love' him, but those two were pretty genuine with the way they talk about Bevo.

But then again im not in the Bevo is cancer camp.

Well Naughton signed on for 8. I doubt he has issues with him. Dunks tried to leave twice so I doubt he has much time for our coach.

[1eyedog]

What metric points to us contending?

The not making finals?

Or making it and being destroyed by Freo.

This is a land of make believe

That was 2022-2023 next season is 2024. We can't always be looking behind us.

[chef]

Well Naughton signed on for 8. I doubt he has issues with him. Dunks tried to leave twice so I doubt he has much time for our coach.

I think Dunks had more of a problem with the party boy element of our team rather than Beverage, from the mouth of an ex forward of ours.

[hujsh]

Which players exactly and what concerns have been expressed?

I had the impression Buku didn't like Bevo (normal for someone on the edge of the team not getting a game) but then he signed on again when there were offers elsewhere so maybe that's just the person who knows Buku and not the man himself?

An inherent problem with getting 3rd/4th hand info

[ledge]

If Bevo was having problems with personality . The club would hand picked up on it with players going to the board about it .. eg the McCartney syndrome.
Remember the rubbish rumour about Naughton not wanting to go back and being upset about it all ? Well that proved to be some way out there rumour of no substance and he signed another 7 years .
I think the supporters are all pissed off about not reaching our potential this year and vent up rubbish like the media.
Sure we need a review on what went wrong and to fix it but it doesn’t mean the worlds falling apart.
I’m good with this review and it should happen every year anyway.
I think Power is doing a great job the players we have picked up in the draft are 2-3 years away from being at their best but they are top of the tree players .
Jamarra is about a year away now Naughton and Smith are about to explode and Darcy a year away but we will start to see him move up now . Croft will be maybe two years away .
So if you look at the future in two years time we will be extremely good.
Just need to shore up some decent midfielders to take over from libba, Treloar and Macrae .
We have two years to do it either draft or trade .
Harmes looks like he will be the elder statesmen by then , I hope he is a good teacher and leader.

[Grantysghost]

What about the metric of adding one goal a game in 2023 would have had us top 4.

Ha. Classic. So if we were better we'd be better.

I get your point but not sure that's something you can build a framework or process around.

[Grantysghost]

Or maybe take it in the spirit with the caveats provided.

Not all of us are privo enough to get access to players, some of us don't like going to games all the time because the experience is shit.

Maybe take on board a view from which the source or reasoning isn't telegraphed.

You come across as very anti player Jee, I'm not sure if you think it's all down to a player issue?

I get you want to assess when the dust has settled and that's cool I just think it's fine if others want to go a bit sky is falling at times.
That's why we have this awesome community.

Love your work :)

[kruder]

Is this code for relaxing in the stands while your teammates get chucked out in straight sets?

Because we could definitely use some of that. The whole actually playing finals bit I mean.

He has the ability to impact come finals time make no mistake, we need to get the best out of him.

[1eyedog]

He has the ability to impact come finals time make no mistake, we need to get the best out of him.

100%. I look at Harmes and I see a player with obvious limitations but I also see a personality type that will not drop their head when we turn to shit. He's actually one player that will give a shit when we are 4 goals down and we need as many players like that as we can get.

[Bulldog Joe]

I think Dunks had more of a problem with the party boy element of our team rather than Beverage, from the mouth of an ex forward of ours.

I heard from someone who was really connected to the playing group that Dunkley had a genuine dislike for Bevo.

[Bulldog Joe]

Ha. Classic. So if we were better we'd be better.

I get your point but not sure that's something you can build a framework or process around.

It does indicate we weren't far off despite all the disappointment of the year.
If you had managed to convince Marra to kick straighter it might have been the difference :)

[EasternWest]

100%. I look at Harmes and I see a player with obvious limitations but I also see a personality type that will not drop their head when we turn to shit. He's actually one player that will give a shit when we are 4 goals down and we need as many players like that as we can get.

I like this take.

I don't hate the trade, but I'm not inspired by it. But he at least has a bit of grit about him.

Anyway it's a moot point. He's one of us now and I'll get behind him.

[chef]

I heard from someone who was really connected to the playing group that Dunkley had a genuine dislike for Bevo.

Fair enough mate, goes against what i heard.

[GVGjr]

I like this take.

I don't hate the trade, but I'm not inspired by it. But he at least has a bit of grit about him.

Anyway it's a moot point. He's one of us now and I'll get behind him.

I've warmed to the trade, he has some traits we don't have a lot of and if he can stay fit he should be a regular senior player for us.

[ReLoad]

I heard from someone who was really connected to the playing group that Dunkley had a genuine dislike for Bevo.

Thats ok, i have a genuine dislike for Dunkley and his bland burrito videos.

[Grantysghost]

So contrived your contrarianism.

Maybe go to a game or talk to a player?

Jee - apologies this was a bit OTT. Sometimes I just click send without re-reading.

My point was to say it's ok to have the opinion that things aren't great at times :)

[chef]

Sometimes I just click send without re-reading.



Please never change.

[Bulldog4life]

Jee - apologies this was a bit OTT. Sometimes I just click send without re-reading.

My point was to say it's ok to have the opinion that things aren't great at times :)

Nets.

[Grantysghost]

Nets.

Ha - look i wasn't joking about my speed off the mark for the first 2 metres. I can't be caught.

[EasternWest]

Ha - look i wasn't joking about my speed off the mark for the first 2 metres. I can't be caught.

Challenge accepted.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Ha - look i wasn't joking about my speed off the mark for the first 2 metres. I can't be caught.

Oh you took off before the starting gun.

[bulldogsthru&thru]

Challenge accepted.

Race him EW! Race him!

[EasternWest]

Race him EW! Race him!

I choose not to run.

[Grantysghost]

Challenge accepted.

Let the training begin!

[Grantysghost]

I choose not to run.

Ha... That is a classic episode. When George pretends not to know Jerry in the diner and it descends into a slanging match.

You really went bald there didn't you.

[bulldogtragic]

I choose not to run.

WOOF says: kawk a kaw - kawk a kaw - kawk a kaw

1207

[EasternWest]

WOOF says: kawk a kaw - kawk a kaw - kawk a kaw

1207

I don't think any of you people have ever seen a chicken.

[Twodogs]

I don't think any of you people have ever seen a chicken.

I had two chickens namsd Bazza and Huddo after the great men.

[Axe Man]

I had two chickens namsd Bazza and Huddo after the great men.

Barry Manilow and Anthony Hudson?

[Scraggers]

Barry Manilow and Anthony Hudson?

Rock Hudson

[Twodogs]

Barry Manilow and Anthony Hudson?

Well Anthony is a Bendigo boy like my dear old dad and Barry writes the songs. Although ironically Barry didn't actually write that song.

[Twodogs]

Rock Hudson

Interesting that out of three names so far two of them have been gay men.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[The Adelaide Connection]

Whoa, 11 pages? Harmes thread on world record post pace!

[Rocket Science]

Whoa, 11 pages? Harmes thread on world record post pace!

I have every faith we can propel this thing to triple figures before we kick a ball in anger next season.

https://i.ibb.co/PzMTvVK/Screen-Shot-2023-10-11-at-2-43-36-pm.png (https://ibb.co/jZzVPjm)

[hujsh]

Whoa, 11 pages? Harmes thread on world record post pace!

With a competing Welcome thread too

[jazzadogs]

Whoa, 11 pages? Harmes thread on world record post pace!

This is my 'Trade Dunkley'.

Still yet to be convinced that it's a good idea.

[jeemak]

Jee - apologies this was a bit OTT. Sometimes I just click send without re-reading.

My point was to say it's ok to have the opinion that things aren't great at times :)

All good bud and no need to apologise.

I've been taking a bit of a hard line on things recently and it's just mainly due to the season being pretty dour (not the ex-Carlton guy) and being worn out by the negativity. Pluralism is what makes this site great.

:)

[jeemak]

Ha - look i wasn't joking about my speed off the mark for the first 2 metres. I can't be caught.


Nets.

It's actually my first three metres that's impressive. With your reach vs. my speed we're at a stalemate. Let's just be friends.

[Twodogs]

All good bud and no need to apologise.

I've been taking a bit of a hard line on things recently and it's just mainly due to the season being pretty dour (not the ex-Carlton guy) and being worn out by the negativity. Pluralism is what makes this site great.

:)

That'd be Doull. He was a dour type of player though

[jeemak]

That'd be Doull. He was a dour type of player though

Not Paddy Dour......

I mean if I meant Bruce Doull I'd look foolish because the Flying Doormat was as hard as they come. He probably invented using sugar soap for the body, beard and balding combo he's that hard.

[Twodogs]

Not Paddy Dour......

I mean if I meant Bruce Doull I'd look foolish because the Flying Doormat was as hard as they come. He probably invented using sugar soap for the body, beard and balding combo he's that hard.

He was as hard as a cat's head the Flying Doormat. Right up until Simon Beasley kicked 9 on him in his 300th game in R1 1985

[Bulldog4life]

Rock Hudson

He was married to Gomer Pyle. Not that there is anything wrong with that.

[jeemak]

He was as hard as a cat's head the Flying Doormat. Right up until Simon Beasley kicked 9 on him in his 300th game in R1 1985

Not sure your memory is on point with this one TD.

[Twodogs]

Not sure your memory is on point with this one TD.

Yeah/no you're right. It was his 329th game.

It was a milestone for Doull though he overtook John Nicholls game record at Carlton that day.

[ledge]

Just saw a lad (Jon) who must be a huge James Harmes fan on Twitter, he must have been a Melbourne supporter, he saw James has moved to the dogs and now calls him the hot dog and I think James sent him a bulldog jumper.
From what I can gather Jon is well loved by the Melbourne faithful and they all have wished him well in following James .
Lovely little story how sport brings joy to everyone .
Excuse my ignorance if everyone knows of him. Warms the heart.

[jazzadogs]

Just saw a lad (Jon) who must be a huge James Harmes fan on Twitter, he must have been a Melbourne supporter, he saw James has moved to the dogs and now calls him the hot dog and I think James sent him a bulldog jumper.
From what I can gather Jon is well loved by the Melbourne faithful and they all have wished him well in following James .
Lovely little story how sport brings joy to everyone .
Excuse my ignorance if everyone knows of him. Warms the heart.

I'd forgotten about that relationship. This is the first piece of evidence that has swayed me to "maybe he's not as much of a w**ker as I thought".

[Twodogs]

Just saw a lad (Jon) who must be a huge James Harmes fan on Twitter, he must have been a Melbourne supporter, he saw James has moved to the dogs and now calls him the hot dog and I think James sent him a bulldog jumper.
From what I can gather Jon is well loved by the Melbourne faithful and they all have wished him well in following James .
Lovely little story how sport brings joy to everyone .
Excuse my ignorance if everyone knows of him. Warms the heart.

According to the tweet with Jon in the jumper it was the local policeman who got him the jumper

[The Pie Man]

Just read an SEN article where Cooney reckons Harmes is a solid replacement for Dunkley as that two way / defensive minded mid that we lacked this year. Not suggesting they’re at the same level, but it’s not a bad shout

Amazed I agree with Cooney on something, but here we are.

We ended up missing Junkley a lot more than we anticipated eh?

[Twodogs]

Just read an SEN article where Cooney reckons Harmes is a solid replacement for Dunkley as that two way / defensive minded mid that we lacked this year. Not suggesting they’re at the same level, but it’s not a bad shout

Amazed I agree with Cooney on something, but here we are.

We ended up missing Junkley a lot more than we anticipated eh?

We sure did. I reckon he would have been the difference on 2 or 3 games we lost this year.

[Go_Dogs]

Just read an SEN article where Cooney reckons Harmes is a solid replacement for Dunkley as that two way / defensive minded mid that we lacked this year. Not suggesting they’re at the same level, but it’s not a bad shout

Amazed I agree with Cooney on something, but here we are.

We ended up missing Junkley a lot more than we anticipated eh?

Saw that and thought the same.

Cooney coming around to the Dogs a bit? Hope so.

[bulldogtragic]

Saw that and thought the same.

Cooney coming around to the Dogs a bit? Hope so.

His son will be in the RW&B in two years time, I hope so too.

[bornadog]

Saw that and thought the same.

Cooney coming around to the Dogs a bit? Hope so.

The Essendon legend?:D

[Curly5]

Did he have some sort of falling out with some other members of the Melbourne team, at one stage? If so that makes him a good guy ;)

[bulldogtragic]

Did he have some sort of falling out with some other members of the Melbourne team, at one stage? If so that makes him a good guy ;)

Not sure. But I thought he was the guy trying to get him himself subbed off in the GF to give their sub a run before the final siren, but couldn’t do it in time because no one else at Melbourne cared about sharing the moment. If true, that’s a tick in his column.

[bulldogtragic]

Not sure. But I thought he was the guy trying to get him himself subbed off in the GF to give their sub a run before the final siren, but couldn’t do it in time because no one else at Melbourne cared about sharing the moment. If true, that’s a tick in his column.

https://www.afl.com.au/news/682145/harmes-sacrifice

Tick.

[EasternWest]

Not sure. But I thought he was the guy trying to get him himself subbed off in the GF to give their sub a run before the final siren, but couldn’t do it in time because no one else at Melbourne cared about sharing the moment. If true, that’s a tick in his column.


https://www.afl.com.au/news/682145/harmes-sacrifice

Tick.

Woah. Big points for that.

[bulldogtragic]

Woah. Big points for that.

Yep. That’s very anti-Melbourne 2020-2023.

[Rocket Science]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/682145/harmes-sacrifice

Tick.

I am once again asking you not to make me tap the sign.

https://i.ibb.co/YTSbSFF/Screen-Shot-2023-10-22-at-6-41-13-pm.png (https://ibb.co/gF868LL)

[Twodogs]

I am once again asking you not to make me tap the sign.

https://i.ibb.co/YTSbSFF/Screen-Shot-2023-10-22-at-6-41-13-pm.png (https://ibb.co/gF868LL)

Tap it. You know that you want to do it.

[Grantysghost]

I am once again asking you not to make me tap the sign.

https://i.ibb.co/YTSbSFF/Screen-Shot-2023-10-22-at-6-41-13-pm.png (https://ibb.co/gF868LL)

Ewwww

[Rocket Science]

Tap it. You know that you want to do it.

It's quite something that Harmes' scone isn't even the most punchable head in this image.

[Grantysghost]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/682145/harmes-sacrifice

Tick.

Sounds like a story you tell after the fact.

Fake a proper injury man!

Although I guess - fake flag - fake injury - fake story.

[Grantysghost]

It's quite something that Harmes' scone isn't even the most punchable head in this image.

You could get a two for one they're that close together.

[Rocket Science]

You could get a two for one they're that close together.

Yeah, the boys are, as they say, 'tight'.

Just be grateful I'm hate-scrolling his 'gram so that you don't have to.

[Twodogs]

It's quite something that Harmes' scone isn't even the most punchable head in this image.

It's a fair effort isn't it?

[Sedat]

https://www.afl.com.au/news/682145/harmes-sacrifice

Tick.
Even our strongest dissenters will warm to Harmes eventually. He is team first and sacrificial to a fault, which is exactly what our midfield needs.

His mindset 5 mins before winning a premiership is telling - he is willing to sacrifice to make sure his mate gets to tangibly enjoy an historic moment. I love this stuff and you cannot have too much of it at your club.

[Grantysghost]

Even our strongest dissenters will warm to Harmes eventually. He is team first and sacrificial to a fault, which is exactly what our midfield needs.

His mindset 5 mins before winning a premiership is telling - he is willing to sacrifice to make sure his mate gets to tangibly enjoy an historic moment. I love this stuff and you cannot have too much of it at your club.

He was popular at Casey, he would be the first to leave so others could get their cars out of the car park.

In all seriousness, apart from the fact he's a massive flog - where do we think he will play?

Can't be midfield SHIRLEY. Otherwise say goodbye to Baz...

I'm guessing maybe half back/wing/defensive forward? (sometimes at Footscray).

[GVGjr]

Even our strongest dissenters will warm to Harmes eventually. He is team first and sacrificial to a fault, which is exactly what our midfield needs.

His mindset 5 mins before winning a premiership is telling - he is willing to sacrifice to make sure his mate gets to tangibly enjoy an historic moment. I love this stuff and you cannot have too much of it at your club.

Great summary. Power has mentioned a couple of times that he has a defensive mindset which fits into your point that he is a team first type player. I can't imagine him not wanting to play whatever roles he's asked to.

[hujsh]

He was popular at Casey, he would be the first to leave so others could get their cars out of the car park.

In all seriousness, apart from the fact he's a massive flog - where do we think he will play?

Can't be midfield SHIRLEY. Otherwise say goodbye to Baz...

I'm guessing maybe half back/wing/defensive forward? (sometimes at Footscray).

Yes god forbid we have a midfielder who has any concerns aside from getting the ball. Would be mean of us to stop the opposition from enjoying their consecutive goals.

He's the first guy I want in there when we're up by 3 goals but the opposition have just kicked 2 in quick succession. Bailey is probably the last guy on that list

[Grantysghost]

Yes god forbid we have a midfielder who has any concerns aside from getting the ball. Would be mean of us to stop the opposition from enjoying their consecutive goals

Do you think Harmes is going to do this....?

[hujsh]

Do you think Harmes is going to do this....?

Well we know it won't be anyone we have now don't we

[Grantysghost]

Well we know it won't be anyone we have now don't we

Haha. Zing.

It's going to be an interesting watch to see how we rotate the mids next season.

I'll warm to Harmes... It will just take me until he wins a flag with Footscray.

[Topdog]

Do you think Harmes is going to do this....?

Even if he breathes on the opposition that will be a significant uplift from our current standards. Heck maybe even just having the punchable face in there will make the opposition think about something other than easily picking up the ball and waltzing off with it. We completely fell apart without Libba, it needs to change.

[jazzadogs]

Bailey Smith also desperately needs to be coached as to what his role is in that situation. He clearly has the ability to lock down/negate as he showed on Cripps, but his default position is to disregard his opponent and go all out ball hunting attack.

Our preferred position should be Baz in the middle, knowingly focussed on developing his defensive skills. That version of Baz, if it can be achieved, is a weapon.

[Sedat]

Bailey Smith also desperately needs to be coached as to what his role is in that situation. He clearly has the ability to lock down/negate as he showed on Cripps, but his default position is to disregard his opponent and go all out ball hunting attack.

Our preferred position should be Baz in the middle, knowingly focussed on developing his defensive skills. That version of Baz, if it can be achieved, is a weapon.
In a perfect world, we would be able to deploy Bont deep forward more in game, like Petracca does to good effect for Melbourne and Martin in his prime did for Richmond. But that wasn't an option in 2022-2023 with our clearance/stoppage structure being so utterly dependant on Bont/Libba.

I'm hopeful that Harmes, a focused Smith and a fitter Macrae can ensure we don't have to continue putting our eggs in the "Bont/Libba or die" basket moving forward when it comes to our clearance/stoppage game.

[Curly5]

He was popular at Casey, he would be the first to leave so others could get their cars out of the car park.

In all seriousness, apart from the fact he's a massive flog - where do we think he will play?

Can't be midfield SHIRLEY. Otherwise say goodbye to Baz...

I'm guessing maybe half back/wing/defensive forward? (sometimes at Footscray).

He's not better than Baz. Shirley!

[Grantysghost]

Even if he breathes on the opposition that will be a significant uplift from our current standards. Heck maybe even just having the punchable face in there will make the opposition think about something other than easily picking up the ball and waltzing off with it. We completely fell apart without Libba, it needs to change.

Yes that Hawks game was a shocker. I'm not sure if it said more about our tactics than the players. Not rotating more players through left us exposed and Macrae was badly out of form by that point.

[Rocco Jones]

Baz, Macrae and Adz only offering us value as inside mids is absolute killer. I think footy is changing with inside mids. Your 4-5th inside mids are becoming a bit like a 2nd ruck I think where you need them to play elsewhere. I think it's why we are seeing a growing value on small forwards. You don't want inside mids plodding on a wing, up forward or having no defensive nous down back.

Harmes definitely has his faults and I am not trying to sell him, I don't know what his value will be but he is able/willing to play in his preferred positions.

[jeemak]

Even if he breathes on the opposition that will be a significant uplift from our current standards. Heck maybe even just having the punchable face in there will make the opposition think about something other than easily picking up the ball and waltzing off with it. We completely fell apart without Libba, it needs to change.

To be fair we've completely fallen apart with Libba in the side as well. He was the worst offender in the GF.

[Sedat]

To be fair we've completely fallen apart with Libba in the side as well. He was the worst offender in the GF.
I'm encouraged by other premiership teams who have been able to change and adapt failed elements of their structure/game plan, with basically existing personnel embracing the changed structure and roles. Think Cotchin for Richmond and also Melbourne's midfield, who were bees to the honeypot in 2020 and got absolutely torched on the outside. All our mids (even Bont and Libba) need to embrace whatever changes are necessary to become the most selfless and most effective group of stoppage/clearance mids in the competition. Our rucks also need to be more consistently robust in their efforts at stoppage.

[jeemak]

Hopefully the penny drops.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

The over reliance on Bont and Libba needs addressing with the arrival of Harmes and an improved season from both Macrae and Smith.
Given our poor forward line the quality of our six midfielders should also provide more use of them used forward to kick goals at the same time. This is possible by changing Bont and Harmes both goal kickers at half forward and Treloar changing with Libba on the other
forward flank . Treloar with his extra pace is also a goal kicker.
I could also envisage given his football smarts playing Caleb Daniel as our small forward pocket which we have lacked for some time.
Changing Macrae with Smith in the midfield would return them to their best positions.
Harmes a noted tagger becomes an ideal replacement for Dunkley which we have lacked.
I also would have English spend more time as a key forward given his class and high marking with Lobb who finished the season on a high note given more responsibility in the ruck.
We badly need a revamped attack to create more goalkicking options.

[ledge]

The over reliance on Bont and Libba needs addressing with the arrival of Harmes and an improved season from both Macrae and Smith.
Given our poor forward line the quality of our six midfielders should also provide more use of them used forward to kick goals at the same time. This is possible by changing Bont and Harmes both goal kickers at half forward and Treloar changing with Libba on the other
forward flank . Treloar with his extra pace is also a goal kicker.
I could also envisage given his football smarts playing Caleb Daniel as our small forward pocket which we have lacked for some time.
Changing Macrae with Smith in the midfield would return them to their best positions.
Harmes a noted tagger becomes an ideal replacement for Dunkley which we have lacked.
I also would have English spend more time as a key forward given his class and high marking with Lobb who finished the season on a high note given more responsibility in the ruck.
We badly need a revamped attack to create more goalkicking options.

I don’t believe our forward line players are the problem it’s more the delivery into it and better planning of them not going the same ball . Eg like Hawkins and Cameron at Geelong rarely go the same ball .
We are actually lucky as we have more than two who are leading marking forwards. Get the mids and forwards better connection and we will destroy teams.

[josie]

Our inability to keep ball inside F50 is I think also a challenge. Small, tough forwards who are good at ground level and can lock it in F50 is a need.