The Monday Soapbox - R21

[GVGjr]

Sorry for the delay.

What do you want to get on your soapbox for round 21?


To me, there is talk of changing the finals set-up next year to include 2 extra teams in a playoff type scenario.
Teams 7 vs 10 and Team 8 vs 9 with the winners making the final 8.

I think the AFL are using the close race at the moment as another revenue spinner.

[jeemak]

Players taking a shot for goal seeking umpire intervention to set the mark and then immediately playing on to kick at goal, effectively using the umpire as a distraction or obstruction.

Bobby Hill did it on the weekend, Nick Daicos did it against us. It's crap and should be stopped.

[Bulldog Joe]

Sorry for the delay.

What do you want to get on your soapbox for round 21?


To me, there is talk of changing the finals set-up next year to include 2 extra teams in a playoff type scenario.
Teams 7 vs 10 and Team 8 vs 9 with the winners making the final 8.

I think the AFL are using the close race at the moment as another revenue spinner.

The AFL are always looking at how they can increase revenue.

They have been trialling the 7 to 10 play offs in the VFL and it is only a matter of time before they introduce it.

It is already scheduled in via the pre-season bye and they are also desperate for Gold Coast to make a final and also give Essendon more opportunity to hopefully lose one.

[hujsh]

If Essendon win a Playoff it's not the same as winning a Final we all agree right?

[Happy Days]

Playoffs/wildcards won’t ever work in the AFL, the game is too taxing and it will create too big an advantage.

Finals are awesome can they just leave them alone.

[bornadog]

Sorry to bang on about the same thing, but 33,000 to our game Friday is still poor. I know Demons supporters don't come out but surely if we have 60,000 members we can get more to a game. Especially since we are flying at the moment.

[jeemak]

Sorry to bang on about the same thing, but 33,000 to our game Friday is still poor. I know Demons supporters don't come out but surely if we have 60,000 members we can get more to a game. Especially since we are flying at the moment.

Reckon the 1915 start time had something to do with it.

[GVGjr]

Sorry to bang on about the same thing, but 33,000 to our game Friday is still poor. I know Demons supporters don't come out but surely if we have 60,000 members we can get more to a game. Especially since we are flying at the moment.

I wasn't too disappointed in the crowd on Friday night but I agree with the sentiment we should be able to draw a bigger crowd against other Vic based sides given it was a prime time slot. I don't think the AFL and the club did a great job at letting people now of the earlier starting time due to the double header because 15 minutes before the game it looked like being a crowd closer to 23K
People were flooding in 15 minutes into the first quarter.

I guess the real issue is that despite the membership numbers we are reporting are growing impressively we actually don't have anything like that that in real terms. We are still a small club in terms of memberships.

[Bulldog Joe]

Players taking a shot for goal seeking umpire intervention to set the mark and then immediately playing on to kick at goal, effectively using the umpire as a distraction or obstruction.

Bobby Hill did it on the weekend, Nick Daicos did it against us. It's crap and should be stopped.

Absolutely agree on this.

Once the umpire comes in to set the mark play should not re-commence until the umpire has moved back to his position.

[Hotdog60]

Sorry to bang on about the same thing, but 33,000 to our game Friday is still poor. I know Demons supporters don't come out but surely if we have 60,000 members we can get more to a game. Especially since we are flying at the moment.

Do we actually have 60,000 members with fudging stats with baby and pet memberships and multiples by businesses. It would be nice to get a true head count on members across all teams to see what the actual numbers are.

[Bulldog Joe]

Do we actually have 60,000 members with fudging stats with baby and pet memberships and multiples by businesses. It would be nice to get a true head count on members across all teams to see what the actual numbers are.

We would have a lot of members who NEVER get to games.

I pay for 5 grandchildren who really can't get to the footy.

[bornadog]

Reckon the 1915 start time had something to do with it.

There is always an excuse

[jeemak]

There is always an excuse

Or reasons.

[bornadog]

Absolutely agree on this.

Once the umpire comes in to set the mark play should not re-commence until the umpire has moved back to his position.

It's not only for goal kicking, it also happens in field play and the player on the mark has no hope of catching the player with the ball.

The whole stand rule is another BS rule and has done nothing to enhance the game.

[Grantysghost]

Sorry to bang on about the same thing, but 33,000 to our game Friday is still poor. I know Demons supporters don't come out but surely if we have 60,000 members we can get more to a game. Especially since we are flying at the moment.
That's a good crowd for mine.

We only have about 20k that go to games.

[bornadog]

That's a good crowd for mine.

We only have about 20k that go to games.

And therein lies the problem

[EasternWest]

There is always an excuse

Actually it's a reason. Like, until the quality of the product improves I'm not going.

That's not an excuse, I don't have anything to excuse. That's a reason.

[bornadog]

Actually it's a reason. Like, until the quality of the product improves I'm not going.

That's not an excuse, I don't have anything to excuse. That's a reason.

7:15 pm was an excuse - not a reason, but your concern is a reason.

If people really want to go, they will.

[Grantysghost]

And therein lies the problem
30k at dons yesterday

[bornadog]

30k at dons yesterday

When you are losing, people don't show up, only the hard core. Watch them fill Marvel next week.

[Axe Man]

How the AFL still haven't announced the final round fixture is ridiculous, it's less than 3 weeks away and the pre finals bye means it really doesn't matter about breaks for finals teams.

[Pleather Sole]

Reckon the 1915 start time had something to do with it.

Agreed, I was in the middle of booking tickets when I realised the starting time was earlier and we just wouldn't make it. Due to our age and mobility we just can't rush. If we'd twigged a few weeks earlier we would've been prepared but there was no notification. Shame as we were looking forward to the first game back at Docklands in a few weeks and Adam's big milestone against our GF nemesis.

I don't see how a game in Perth should bring a game forward here. If you're watching on telly or online it doesn't matter much where you are. You can't watch two at once. I assume some people or an entity benefit, not sure how. Fans on seats is always better for the game, in my book anyway.

[Pleather Sole]

How the AFL still haven't announced the final round fixture is ridiculous, it's less than 3 weeks away and the pre finals bye means it really doesn't matter about breaks for finals teams.

Booking checkins for hotels in Ballarat, trying to plan the whole day/night/weekend for everyone coming from all over without a match start time is a nightmare.

[bornadog]

How the AFL still haven't announced the final round fixture is ridiculous, it's less than 3 weeks away and the pre finals bye means it really doesn't matter about breaks for finals teams.
I heard it will be announced Wednesday

[GVGjr]

7:15 pm was an excuse - not a reason, but your concern is a reason.

If people really want to go, they will.

The start time isn't the reason for the crowd being a bit smaller than ideal but the lack of communication meant that a high portion of people weren't in the ground or near their seats at the first bounce.

[angelopetraglia]

Crowd history versus Melbourne at Docklands.

Take out the post Premiership year and it was our biggest Crowd versus Melbourne in 21 games at the venue. Take out the zero COVID game. Average crowd is 26,168. So the crowd was +27% higher than the average between the teams with Melbourne on a very ordinary run of games.

Crowd Date
33,000 Fri 02-Aug-2024 7:15 PM
26,501 Sat 23-Jul-2022 7:25 PM
Zero Fri 28-May-2021 7:50 PM
26,781 Sun 14-Jul-2019 3:20 PM
28,485 Sat 02-Jun-2018 1:45 PM
33,667 Sun 18-Jun-2017 3:20 PM
27,805 Sun 16-Aug-2015 3:20 PM
24,953 Sun 29-Jun-2014 1:10 PM
22,176 Sun 01-Sep-2013 4:40 PM
29,516 Fri 01-Jul-2011 7:40 PM
27,446 Sun 13-Jul-2008 2:10 PM
18,946 Sat 11-Aug-2007 7:10 PM
24,584 Sun 13-May-2007 2:10 PM
28,478 Sat 08-Apr-2006 2:10 PM
26,307 Sat 02-Apr-2005 2:10 PM
25,107 Sun 18-Jul-2004 2:10 PM
20,714 Fri 01-Aug-2003 7:40 PM
20,790 Sun 13-Apr-2003 2:10 PM
30,789 Fri 26-Apr-2002 7:45 PM
21,146 Sun 02-Sep-2001 2:10 PM
26,180 Sun 28-May-2000 2:10 PM

[Happy Days]

I was gonna make fun of the 28 May 2021 crowd but then I remembered that’s actually accurate.

[angelopetraglia]

I was gonna make fun of the 28 May 2021 crowd but then I remembered that’s actually accurate.

It was a great win. Pity no one was there to witness it. "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

[The Underdog]

Sorry to bang on about the same thing, but 33,000 to our game Friday is still poor. I know Demons supporters don't come out but surely if we have 60,000 members we can get more to a game. Especially since we are flying at the moment.

Don?t equate 60,000 members with 60,000 people. Getting 33,000 people out on a winter night in Melbourne isn?t that disastrous. I?ve attended 4 games this year (including Friday night) and honestly I?ve missed a lot of those for the simple reason that I couldn?t be arsed. A lot of people have better reasons than that.

[GVGjr]

Don?t equate 60,000 members with 60,000 people. Getting 33,000 people out on a winter night in Melbourne isn?t that disastrous. I?ve attended 4 games this year (including Friday night) and honestly I?ve missed a lot of those for the simple reason that I couldn?t be arsed. A lot of people have better reasons than that.

I'd prefer us to be playing in front of good crowds most weeks and this would help us both keep and attract players to the club but I totally get where you are coming from. I've also come to the realization in recent weeks that the 60K membership number we have achieved isn't genuinely reflective of having 60K members and especially trying to attract fans to games. It's the reason why we play 2 home games at Mars stadium this year. All that will change if we knock over a couple of teams in the next 3 weeks and we will have a huge number of people by our standards looking to secure finals tickets.

[Hotdog60]

Get the next two and Ballarat will be a sell out. :)

[jeemak]

7:15 pm was an excuse - not a reason, but your concern is a reason.

If people really want to go, they will.

OK so it's a good excuse then. Not all excuses are bad, BAD.

[Happy Days]

It was a great win. Pity no one was there to witness it. "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

Nah that was at the G, we lost the one at Marvel (James Harmes legacy game).

[The Doctor]

Watching Hawthorn v GWS in their regular jumpers. What an eyesore.

[DOG GOD]

Watching Hawthorn v GWS in their regular jumpers. What an eyesore.

100% agree Doc…horrendous viewing.

And a personal one for the Monday soapbox….today tested positive for Covid….my 5th time. Sick as a dog.

[comrade]

Watching Hawthorn v GWS in their regular jumpers. What an eyesore.

The Pies & Blues was also a hard watch.

[Grantysghost]

100% agree Doc…horrendous viewing.

And a personal one for the Monday soapbox….today tested positive for Covid….my 5th time. Sick as a dog.
Get well soon DG. It's really a horrible virus.

[chef]

Sorry to bang on about the same thing, but 33,000 to our game Friday is still poor. I know Demons supporters don't come out but surely if we have 60,000 members we can get more to a game. Especially since we are flying at the moment.

We only have around 20k who actually go to games, that 60k figure isn't real people.

[bornadog]

Crowd history versus Melbourne at Docklands.

Take out the post Premiership year and it was our biggest Crowd versus Melbourne in 21 games at the venue. Take out the zero COVID game. Average crowd is 26,168. So the crowd was +27% higher than the average between the teams with Melbourne on a very ordinary run of games.

Crowd Date
33,000 Fri 02-Aug-2024 7:15 PM
26,501 Sat 23-Jul-2022 7:25 PM
Zero Fri 28-May-2021 7:50 PM
26,781 Sun 14-Jul-2019 3:20 PM
28,485 Sat 02-Jun-2018 1:45 PM
33,667 Sun 18-Jun-2017 3:20 PM
27,805 Sun 16-Aug-2015 3:20 PM
24,953 Sun 29-Jun-2014 1:10 PM
22,176 Sun 01-Sep-2013 4:40 PM
29,516 Fri 01-Jul-2011 7:40 PM
27,446 Sun 13-Jul-2008 2:10 PM
18,946 Sat 11-Aug-2007 7:10 PM
24,584 Sun 13-May-2007 2:10 PM
28,478 Sat 08-Apr-2006 2:10 PM
26,307 Sat 02-Apr-2005 2:10 PM
25,107 Sun 18-Jul-2004 2:10 PM
20,714 Fri 01-Aug-2003 7:40 PM
20,790 Sun 13-Apr-2003 2:10 PM
30,789 Fri 26-Apr-2002 7:45 PM
21,146 Sun 02-Sep-2001 2:10 PM
26,180 Sun 28-May-2000 2:10 PM

Membership in same period



2000
18,056


2001
19,085


2002
20,838


2003
21,260


2004
19,295


2005
21,975


2006
26,042


2007
28,725


2008
28,306


2009
28,590


2010
34,842


2011
32,125


2012
30,007


2013
30,204


2014
31,725


2015
35,991


2016
39,459


2017
47,653


2018
43,246


2019
44,373


2020
38,876


2021
46,541


2022
50,941


2023
56,302


2024
59,751


GG and Chef are correct - we have a core group that go each week and that is my beef, because it doesn't happen with other clubs

[bornadog]

100% agree Doc…horrendous viewing.

And a personal one for the Monday soapbox….today tested positive for Covid….my 5th time. Sick as a dog.

FMD not again - hope you are ok.

[EasternWest]

Delete I can't even be bothered.

[Dry Rot]

Has anyone else noticed that the late-season rise of Brisbane and probable premiership favouritism has coincided with the Federal Government raising the national terrorist threat level from possible to probable?

[angelopetraglia]

Crowds have not grown at the same pace as club memberships for any clubs over the last couple of decades. You could draw the same conclusions looking at any club. In the year 2000 for instance, Collingwood only had 28,000 members. They now have well north of 100,000. Collingwood crowds are not four times larger than 2000.

Clubs have got more creative in selling memberships. It highlights more that membership numbers are really not that meaningful anymore.

Richmond and Collingwood both have more than 100,000 members. Have you ever heard of people complaining they can?t get a ticket to a H&A game when they play each other?

How many of Richmond?s 100,000 ?members? turned up when we played them at the MCG this year? Or when they only drew 19K against GWS?

[bornadog]

Delete I can't even be bothered.

It's ok, EW, this is just a whinge thread and a bit of fun, because we know the AFL will never listen to us.

[jeemak]

Crowds have not grown at the same pace as club memberships for any clubs over the last couple of decades. You could draw the same conclusions looking at any club. In the year 2000 for instance, Collingwood only had 28,000 members. They now have well north of 100,000. Collingwood crowds are not four times larger than 2000.

Clubs have got more creative in selling memberships. It highlights more that membership numbers are really not that meaningful anymore.

Richmond and Collingwood both have more than 100,000 members. Have you ever heard of people complaining they can?t get a ticket to a H&A game when they play each other?

How many of Richmond?s 100,000 ?members? turned up when we played them at the MCG this year? Or when they only drew 19K against GWS?

So the clubs have converted casual supporters who are regular attendees to members, and non-attending supporters to members rather than attracting new supporters and making them members and having them attend games. Kinda makes sense.

[ledge]

I will say at least the AFL realised having games at Ballarat in the middle of the year is stupid.
At the beginning or the end, yes it’s still cold but having it in the middle of the year risks games getting called off due to snow or ice or the ground being slippery.
Night games should never be played there either.

[Sedat]

I will say at least the AFL realised having games at Ballarat in the middle of the year is stupid.
At the beginning or the end, yes it?s still cold but having it in the middle of the year risks games getting called off due to snow or ice or the ground being slippery.
Night games should never be played there either.
That Port game in July 2018 was the coldest place on earth at the time. And AFEL scheduling that game for a 3.20pm start so it finished in near darkness at 6pm was peak "AFEL not giving a shit about the fundamental basics because they cash the bonuses from TV rights money and other lobby groups". A bit like Jarryd Roughead getting scraped with metal bolts protruding from the ground near the boundary at ANZ Stadium, but all good because Mike Fitzpatrick was an investor in the stadium.

[angelopetraglia]

So the clubs have converted casual supporters who are regular attendees to members, and non-attending supporters to members rather than attracting new supporters and making them members and having them attend games. Kinda makes sense.

100%. Well said.

Also. Due to things like 3 games Memberships. The barrier to entry for Membership has been lowered. The clubs with their active social media and email marketing that results in a much more intimate direction connection to the club supporter base, can give more reasons to be a member rather than just attending games. They can tug on that human emotion, that deep down all humans want to belong to something bigger than themselves. e.g. Bevo's brief

So Membership used to be just for those hardcore supporters who would go every week and saw it as value for money. It now is much deeper and more meaningful that that. There was the whole emotional push from all AFL clubs, to be a real supporter you had to be a financial member. Also, the ability for clubs to connect directly with their supporter base I think has widened the net to those casual footy supporters who may only go to a couple of games a year but want that feeling of belonging to the club.

Also, we are all wealthier and the ability to roll memberships over via direct direct debit from credit cards has made the renewing process easier.

[Axe Man]

I will say at least the AFL realised having games at Ballarat in the middle of the year is stupid.
At the beginning or the end, yes it?s still cold but having it in the middle of the year risks games getting called off due to snow or ice or the ground being slippery.
Night games should never be played there either.

I mean there is also a risk a swarm of killer bees attacks the players or a meteorite crashes into the ground. I know it gets bloody cold in Ballarat but I'm not sure there's much risk of a game being called off during the afternoon because of it. And every ground has a risk of being slippery, other than Marvel, at absolutely any time of the year.

I do agree that scheduling the Mars games early and late in the season is the sensible thing to do. What isn't sensible is that we still don't know what day and time the game is going to be in just over 2 weeks.

[ledge]

I mean there is also a risk a swarm of killer bees attacks the players or a meteorite crashes into the ground. I know it gets bloody cold in Ballarat but I'm not sure there's much risk of a game being called off during the afternoon because of it. And every ground has a risk of being slippery, other than Marvel, at absolutely any time of the year.

I do agree that scheduling the Mars games early and late in the season is the sensible thing to do. What isn't sensible is that we still don't know what day and time the game is going to be in just over 2 weeks.

Funny you mention the bees , every few years they get a cricket swarm and I can tell you now you can’t see the road for crickets when it happens. Imagine if that happened during a game, it would definitely be called off.

[jeemak]

What about the dogs with bees in their mouths and when they bark they shoot bees at you?

[Axe Man]

What about the dogs with bees in their mouths and when they bark they shoot bees at you?

They are a significant risk along with sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their heads.

[EasternWest]

It's ok, EW, this is just a whinge thread and a bit of fun, because we know the AFL will never listen to us.

Now whingeing is something I can manage.

[josie]

They are a significant risk along with sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their heads.

And the ill-tempered, mutated sea bass.

[Rocket Science]

https://i.ibb.co/DrnSY6W/i-hate-it.png (https://ibb.co/kmFWJrB)

[hujsh]

To do what they've done in some of these arenas around the world, it's going to cost billions of dollars in some instances, and that will be an issue in Australia because the majority of funding is public funds.



Priority should be to get this technology in Sedat Park ASAP of course.

I don't care how many children are stuck in 'temporary' classrooms or how underfunded our hospitals are. The people of Geelong NEED this