Scoring against the Swans

[bornadog]

We have kicked some big scores so far this season and in fact averaging over 20 goals a game compared to Sydney's 15. Sydney's defence is the best in the AFL only conceeding 11 goals a game.

Sydney will do their usual trick and bottle the game up, block the corridor and try and stop our runners delivering into the forward 50m? We need to kick a big score at the SCG and really put away Sydney early.

What should we do differently? How can we break away from the way Sydney stifle a game?

[Bulldog Revolution]

Without wanting to revisit last years Manuka Massacre - are we going to be able to score against them. Its incredible the way they hold teams to such low scores at the Dome where you just dont think its possible to do that.

Can we generate enough out of the centre square and stoppages?

[Desipura]

Without wanting to revisit last years Manuka Massacre - are we going to be able to score against them. Its incredible the way they hold teams to such low scores at the Dome where you just dont think its possible to do that.

Can we generate enough out of the centre square and stoppages?
With Cooney winning the most contested possesions (10) and Griffen fully fit, we should be able to compete with them in this area.
Hahns bullocking work will also be very handy.
I think playing at the SCG against a physical side like Sydney will see Hill be dropped for Ray. The smaller ground will help Ray's chances of getting a recall along with Williamstown having the bye. Playing for Willi 2nds will not be of much benefit to Ray fitness wise.

[1eyedog]

With Cooney winning the most contested possesions (10) and Griffen fully fit, we should be able to compete with them in this area.
Hahns bullocking work will also be very handy.
I think playing at the SCG against a physical side like Sydney will see Hill be dropped for Ray. The smaller ground will help Ray's chances of getting a recall along with Williamstown having the bye. Playing for Willi 2nds will not be of much benefit to Ray fitness wise.

I think the smaller ground will hinder Ray's space, I reckon he's more comfortable on big grounds like the G and I don't think Ray is all that physical, but neither is Hill so that's a tough one. Personally, I'd go up there with no changes. Being out with a serious leg injury for 9-10 weeks I reckon all the match fitness Ray can get in the magoos will make a world of difference.

[firstdogonthemoon]

We have scored the most of any team - and Sydney have had the least of any team scored against them - however they have also scored the fourth lowest of any team.

At the end of the day, we just need to score more than they do. You know what I mean, we score a lot and they dont. We wont beat them at their game, but we have to stop them from stopping us.

Geez, I should be on telly.

Maybe we just need to run around a lot! Keep away from them.

Run away! Run away!

[Bulldog Revolution]

I think the smaller ground will hinder Ray's space, I reckon he's more comfortable on big grounds like the G and I don't think Ray is all that physical, but neither is Hill so that's a tough one. Personally, I'd go up there with no changes. Being out with a serious leg injury for 9-10 weeks I reckon all the match fitness Ray can get in the magoos will make a world of difference.

And if he misses this week he's got a week off to build his fitness before we play Freo at Subi - and he will be ideally suited to that ground

[Desipura]

And if he misses this week he's got a week off to build his fitness before we play Freo at Subi - and he will be ideally suited to that ground
Building fitness is not his problem at this stage, building his match fitness is more the issue.
He does not need the weekend off at this stage. He should play this week all be it off the bench

[bornadog]

And if he misses this week he's got a week off to build his fitness before we play Freo at Subi - and he will be ideally suited to that ground

He can play for Willy that week as well. BTW, how many are allowed to go to Willy during that week off? There must be some sort of limit in the VFL.

[Bulldog Revolution]

He can play for Willy that week as well. BTW, how many are allowed to go to Willy during that week off? There must be some sort of limit in the VFL.

I think it will be whatever the rules of our alliance with Willy are on how many AFL listed players we can have

[LostDoggy]

We have scored the most of any team - and Sydney have had the least of any team scored against them - however they have also scored the fourth lowest of any team.

At the end of the day, we just need to score more than they do. You know what I mean, we score a lot and they dont. We wont beat them at their game, but we have to stop them from stopping us.

Geez, I should be on telly.

Maybe we just need to run around a lot! Keep away from them.

Run away! Run away!


Maybe we just need the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch.

Run away!

[Go_Dogs]

I wonder if we'll go for a more open forward line this week, with more numbers put behind the ball to help prevent Sydney from scoring and to also help enable us to run the ball down field with greater numbers. Having a less cramped forward line will also gives us (theoretically) more space in front of the ball carrier to run into, and space for the forwards to lead into.

It'll be interesting to see exactly how we handle this one, as Sydney will not allow us easy ball movement and will really try to shut down the space we have both to run forwards into, and have our forwards move out into.

[Sockeye Salmon]

I wonder if we'll go for a more open forward line this week, with more numbers put behind the ball to help prevent Sydney from scoring and to also help enable us to run the ball down field with greater numbers. Having a less cramped forward line will also gives us (theoretically) more space in front of the ball carrier to run into, and space for the forwards to lead into.

It'll be interesting to see exactly how we handle this one, as Sydney will not allow us easy ball movement and will really try to shut down the space we have both to run forwards into, and have our forwards move out into.

The problem is that Roos will have about 13 players in our forward line anyway.

I've heard people try to defend Roos' game plan by saying they like contested footy. Sure I like contested footy, I just don't like forwards being outnumbered 2 to 1 at both ends.

[Raw Toast]

The problem is that Roos will have about 13 players in our forward line anyway.

I've heard people try to defend Roos' game plan by saying they like contested footy. Sure I like contested footy, I just don't like forwards being outnumbered 2 to 1 at both ends.

Agree with this as well SS.

It didn't happen however, in recent Collingwood V Swans matches because the Pies play on like crazy and kick it quickly and fairly long. They are the team which has gone against the trend by increasing their speed of play via a kicking rather than hand-ball and run game. If you look at their last three games v the Swans they move from 13 point win in R12 06 with 223 kicks and 111 handballs (about 2 to 1), a 16 point R12 07 with 204 kicks to 92 (about 2.2 to one), to a 25 point win in R21 07 with 223 kicks to 73 handpasses (about 3 to 1). They should've won the R12 07 by more but Cloke kicked 1.4 and Rocca 3.4 and the Pies ended with 10.16.

In other words Collingwood play a more extreme version of their usual game-plan against Sydney, and it works really well. They have the tall forwards that can at least bring the ball to ground, and the crumbers, and move the ball quickly enough to get enough one-on-one contests in the forward fifty to win and score decently (95, 76 and 101).

Can we play this style? I think we can with Minson up forward and our improvement in clearances but it would be a fairly big departure from our normal game. The problem is our normal game of creating run through hand-balls is a game the Swans love, as we know. The only team to beat the Swans with this game has been the Eagles who struggled to do it with any authority, despite what looked like a much better list.

The other style that has a chance against the Swans is to try and beat them at their own game. Adelaide and the Saints have had some success at this, but it can create a pretty awful spectacle as well. We might try this, and are better placed than before to make a go of it, but I'd much prefer we try and beat them with fast ball-movement by foot rather than our usual run and carry game which is likely to get struggle again.

[LostDoggy]

^^^

Long goals (on the run or from outside 50) will be a factor against such clogging tactics. Gilbee and Aker (and Griff) become even more important to our scoring ability this weekend. One hopes the kids don't stop running just because Sydney zone. They just have to run harder and make better decisions and compete harder at the breakdowns.

Has anyone else had the sense that Rocket has 'designed' several goalscoring avenues that we use a consistent number of times every week, to get a consistent return? It's like a breakdown of how we will get to twenty goals a game: 3 for Welsh on the lead to the top of the 50, 2/3 from Aker on the lead into the right forward pocket, 3 - 5 from kicks to the top of the goalsquare and crumbing off Will, 1 long goal from Lindsay (preferably late in the second or third quarter when the opposition are tiring and less likely to pick him up), one attack from Brian on the overlap down the left, 2 from Gia late in the quarter when he pushes him deep into the 50, and 1-2 off Griff/Eagle running forward off a centre-bounce and found by handball over the top. Johnno he's been using all over the ground, and I don't think Rocket is expecting a huge bag from Johnno this year.

[dog town]

The problem is that Roos will have about 13 players in our forward line anyway.

I've heard people try to defend Roos' game plan by saying they like contested footy. Sure I like contested footy, I just don't like forwards being outnumbered 2 to 1 at both ends.
I like watching them play against attacking sides. Love the contrast and how hard they work to shut sides down. Absolutely hate watching them against other very tactical sides like North/Saints/Hawthorn/Adelaide. If both sides are doing it to each other its horrible.

The last time we played Sydney we simply forgot to run. Sure we need to be ferocious in close against them but they are also a good running side who rarely give you the ball cheaply. If you dont run you cant win. Last time we didn't run to defend, we didn't run to make space and we certainly didn't run to attack.

Very interesting analysis RT regarding the magpies.