Beau Dowler

[bulldogtragic]

Hawks signed up 8 last week, not to mention many others along the course of the year. I don't recall Beau being signed up for an extension.

With his knees i'd suggest a second rounder, they are after a defender and i can only see Wight as someone we could dispense with.

Would we have any interest, or more to the point (With Boyle being a 1st rounder...) would they have any interest?

[Desipura]

Good choice re Beau. I think the hawks would be after a Higgins/Ray type of player. Big men don't grow on trees so they would want a bit for him.

[bulldogtragic]

Good choice re Beau. I think the hawks would be after a Higgins/Ray type of player. Big men don't grow on trees so they would want a bit for him.
Interesting...

Dogs lose Ray
Hawks lose Dowler
Freo/WCE lose Defender or pick 18/19

Dogs get Dowler
Hawks get Defender or pick 18/19
Freo/WCE get Ray


Does that work?

[LostDoggy]

Shame they signed up Thorpe. He looks to have filled out quite nicely. Maybe now that Clayton is gone we might start to draft a few of those types.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Interesting...

Dogs lose Ray
Hawks lose Dowler
Freo/WCE lose Defender or pick 18/19

Dogs get Dowler
Hawks get Defender or pick 18/19
Freo/WCE get Ray


Does that work?

I know it's fashionable to slag off Farren, but if they were to trade him for a guy who has been on a list for 3 years and not managed a senior game (?) we deserve to be sent back to the bottom of the ladder.

Dowler is their 5th choice forward. If you want him, get in his ear about opportunity and when he asks to be traded you pick him up for pick 48.

[Sedat]

Good choice re Beau. I think the hawks would be after a Higgins/Ray type of player. Big men don't grow on trees so they would want a bit for him.
Screw Pelchan and the Hawks. Dowler can either continue to rot at Box Hill (he's behind Boyle and Thorp, neither of whom can even get a game for Hawthorn) or he can threaten to go to Melbourne for nothing in the PSD and get some regular AFL action. Then another club can look at offering the Hawks something in the late 2nd/3rd round for Dowler and see if they blink. Just because he was a top 6 pick doesn't mean he will turn out to be a gun. He has every chance of going the way of Bradley or Walsh the rate he's develped so far in his career.

Having said all that, I haven't seen him play so I can't comment on his suitability for us. I like the idea of picking up under-performing players at minimal draft cost who have significant upside in them and, more importantly, fill a void on our list. Dowler might fit this description - I just haven't seen enough of him to make an accurate assessment.

[Scraggers]

I know it's fashionable to slag off Farren, but if they were to trade him for a guy who has been on a list for 3 years and not managed a senior game (?) we deserve to be sent back to the bottom of the ladder.

Dowler is their 5th choice forward. If you want him, get in his ear about opportunity and when he asks to be traded you pick him up for pick 48.

Agreed ... as much as we (woofers that is) slag off Farren Ray, he is worth a hell of a lot more than Dowler.

I think we all agree that a couple of key position players are required, and quickly, but it should definitely not be at any cost.

[ledge]

I have a lot of time for Ray, he gets a game whenever he is fit so obviously coaching staff put him in our top 22.
Wouldnt like to see him traded as we have done all the development work and i think next year is going to be his come of age year.
Wont be much tinkering done with our list, just the retirements and a couple of delistings, thats if no big forward crops up of course.
I can see Ray doing his usual dash and Jarryd Grant being the man up forward within the next season.
I think whats happened to Grant has set us back a bit but no one could see his injury problems coming,
Actually would rather he got all these injuries now, got them out the way and spent his time in the gym building up his body.
Remember we do have kids like Mulligan and Bourmann coming through.
Think our selections in the last draft were excellent, picked up 2 players with experience and certainly good enough.
The others are pretty tall kids and remember Ayce this draft will be another.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Agreed ... as much as we (woofers that is) slag off Farren Ray, he is worth a hell of a lot more than Dowler.

I think we all agree that a couple of key position players are required, and quickly, but it should definitely not be at any cost.

Ray deserves most of his criticism - there's no two ways about it. However, he's still worth a lot more than Dowler.

I've seen Beau briefly at Box Hill a couple of times, and he doesn't appear to play the role of a KPF. He seems to be more of a HFF in the mould of a Hahn/Tiller, though perhaps with a little more pace and a little less aggression.

If he's cheap, maybe, but he's probably not worth bothering.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I can see Ray doing his usual dash and Jarryd Grant being the man up forward within the next season.
I think whats happened to Grant has set us back a bit but no one could see his injury problems coming,
Actually would rather he got all these injuries now, got them out the way and spent his time in the gym building up his body.
Remember we do have kids like Mulligan and Bourmann coming through.
Think our selections in the last draft were excellent, picked up 2 players with experience and certainly good enough.
The others are pretty tall kids and remember Ayce this draft will be another.

Have you seen Grant?

He's incredibly skinny - he won't be ready for 3-4 years.

Mulligan hasn't done too much in the reserves, but Boumann seems to be talented & improving.

Even if we draft Ayce (who would be 3+ years) we're still in need of a genuine FF/CHF.

[ledge]

He's incredibly skinny - he won't be ready for 3-4 years.


Did you read anymore of the post? I did say spend all his time in the gym and if he has been since OP set in he has had time to have 2 pre seasons in the gym.

I am amazed how some players can come out of nowhere in one pre season too, being involved in cricket for many years i have seen kids struggle to hit a ball past a close in fieldsman one year but the next year, smashing them over the boundary.

Did you check out a well known C. Grant in his first year, look at his photos then, he was tiny.
Westoff at Port Adelaide is another who is tiny but certainly has great football skill.
J Grant I have heard has brilliant hands if thats the case sometimes build isnt a problem.
If Ayce is as good as they say, why 3-4 years?

Examples of first year footballers, Kruezer, Palmer,Gibbs, Murphy, Judd, the list goes on.
Correct me if i am wrong but i do believe Eade had thoughts of Ward and Grant playing in the seniors at sometime this year.

[westdog54]

He's incredibly skinny - he won't be ready for 3-4 years.


Did you read anymore of the post? I did say spend all his time in the gym and if he has been since OP set in he has had time to have 2 pre seasons in the gym.

I am amazed how some players can come out of nowhere in one pre season too, being involved in cricket for many years i have seen kids struggle to hit a ball past a close in fieldsman one year but the next year, smashing them over the boundary.

Did you check out a well known C. Grant in his first year, look at his photos then, he was tiny.
Westoff at Port Adelaide is another who is tiny but certainly has great football skill.
J Grant I have heard has brilliant hands if thats the case sometimes build isnt a problem.
If Ayce is as good as they say, why 3-4 years?

Examples of first year footballers, Kruezer, Palmer,Gibbs, Murphy, Judd, the list goes on.
Correct me if i am wrong but i do believe Eade had thoughts of Ward and Grant playing in the seniors at sometime this year.


Well said Ledge.

Jarrad Grant has fantastic hands and a desire to be a key forward, the number 1 target. I think the Westhoff comparison is a very good one, and Grant would have a preseason on him in terms of time between being drafted and breaking into the side.

[Cyberdoggie]

I know it's fashionable to slag off Farren, but if they were to trade him for a guy who has been on a list for 3 years and not managed a senior game (?) we deserve to be sent back to the bottom of the ladder.

Dowler is their 5th choice forward. If you want him, get in his ear about opportunity and when he asks to be traded you pick him up for pick 48.


There certainly is a some disparity there.

Dowler hasn't done much for Box Hill and generally looks a bit slow.

Farren Ray has proven himself a decent even if much maligned footballer at afl level.

How could you even compare the two?

[LostDoggy]

Dowler has played 17 games in the VFL for 20 goals. He's not up to scratch.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Did you read anymore of the post? I did say spend all his time in the gym and if he has been since OP set in he has had time to have 2 pre seasons in the gym.

I am amazed how some players can come out of nowhere in one pre season too, being involved in cricket for many years i have seen kids struggle to hit a ball past a close in fieldsman one year but the next year, smashing them over the boundary.

I'll ask again; have you seen Grant?

He might gain a bit of strength over summer, but he's not going to simply transform into a KPF over night. He's barely even played football this year either. He might well be a focal point in a few years time, but I don't care how many weights he lifts, he's not going to be 'the man'.

There's a big difference between him and Westhoff at the moment. Grant hasn't played a whole lot at VFL level whilst Westhoff has done pretty well at SANFL level. Granted, Grant may be able to emulate something similar once he gets on the park, but it's a bit of a stretch atm IMO.



If Ayce is as good as they say, why 3-4 years?

Ayce is as skinny as Grant, the difference being he's earmarked to be a ruckman too. How many ruckmen at 18-21 do you see running around at the moment? Kruezer is an exceptional talent and has done well in his first year, but he's physically developed more than Cordy. Ayce might be a good player but I'd be very surprised if he didn't take at least 3 years.


Examples of first year footballers, Kruezer, Palmer,Gibbs, Murphy, Judd, the list goes on.
Correct me if i am wrong but i do believe Eade had thoughts of Ward and Grant playing in the seniors at sometime this year.

The list does go on, but only one of them is a tall. The rest are midfielders, of whom always develop far quicker than the big guys. Not too many talls are able to make any impact within the first couple of seasons, and understandably. Eade said Ward was a good chance of playing senior football this year, and he was right, but I don't recall him mentioning Grant.

I know what you're saying in the bigger picture in regards to Grant etc. but I don't think anyone can put any serious expectations on them to perform in the seniors for at least 3 years. They need time to develop into their bodies as well as adapting to the pace and physicality of the game. For the KPP's, it's always a gradual process. Players like Chris Grant are mere exceptions, not too many are able to do what he did at his young age with his body.

Our biggest problem is that we don't have any tall timber from 20-25 years old. Williams I'm guessing is the only one. Wight, Skipper, Bowden, Wells, Wiggins etc. all didn't work out. Hopefully Everitt, Grant & Boumann can change that soon though.

[Mofra]

Well said Ledge.

Jarrad Grant has fantastic hands and a desire to be a key forward, the number 1 target. I think the Westhoff comparison is a very good one, and Grant would have a preseason on him in terms of time between being drafted and breaking into the side.
The problem with doing only weights and not running is that the build up isn't gradual, so Grant would lose pace if he isn't hitting the gym as part of a complete program.
Over the last summer the players had programs that were so specialised the time they wait between sets was measured to the second. Part of that program is determining how much weight they could put on without losing pace (a la Aker's main worry over pre-season, losing pace due to his gain of 8 kg).

I'd be wrapt if Grant played senior footy next year, but from what I saw at VFL level he wasn't just a few kgs away from being AFL ready. He is a work in progress that looks like he will take time.