NAB CHALLANGE MATCH v ST KILDA

[OLD SCRAGGer]

Anyone have a time that the match starts on Saturday at Princes Park?:confused:

[bornadog]

Anyone have a time that the match starts on Saturday at Princes Park?:confused:

There is an intra club match this Friday. Would they have another match this Saturday?

[soupman]

I thought it was on a friday (next week) at 4:30pm.

[The Coon Dog]

I thought it was on a friday (next week) at 4:30pm.

That's how I remember it, Fri 27th.

[aker39]

There are no NAB Challenge matches this weekend.

We are playing on Friday 27th at 4.30pm at Princess Park.

[Dancin' Douggy]

There are no NAB Challenge matches this weekend.

We are playing on Friday 27th at 4.30pm at Princess Park.

Is it free entry?

[alwaysadog]

Is it free entry?

Can't believe anything at bluebagger cemetery could be free. It's against their religion; free is for millionaires.

[bornadog]

Can't believe anything at bluebagger cemetery could be free. It's against their religion; free is for millionaires.

In the past you could show your membership ticket and get in free, otherwise it was something like $10. Pity we don't have our membership tickets sent out yet.

[The Coon Dog]

Received an email tonight. This was on it:

NAB Challenge
Western Bulldogs vs St Kilda
Date: Friday, 27th February 2009
Location: Visy Park
Time: 4.30pm
General Admission tickets will be avaiable at the gate.
Adult - $10
Concession - $5
Junior - $2
Family - $20

[Sockeye Salmon]

Received an email tonight. This was on it:

NAB Challenge
Western Bulldogs vs St Kilda
Date: Friday, 27th February 2009
Location: Visy Park
Time: 4.30pm
General Admission tickets will be avaiable at the gate.
Adult - $10
Concession - $5
Junior - $2
Family - $20

Does anyone else think $10 is obscene for a practice match?

[GVGjr]

Does anyone else think $10 is obscene for a practice match?

When compared to what you will have to pay for any food there $10 will be fairly cheap. Given it's an AFL sanctioned game, $10 is OK.

[azabob]

When compared to what you will have to pay for any food there $10 will be fairly cheap. Given it's an AFL sanctioned game, $10 is OK.

Sorry GVGjr don't agree. Where does the $10 go to?

[GVGjr]

Sorry GVGjr don't agree. Where does the $10 go to?

To host the game, if the game was played in Shepparton it would still be $7 to $10.

I'm fairly sure it was $10 or just a bit cheaper when we played the Blues there last year.

[azabob]

To host the game, if the game was played in Shepparton it would still be $7 to $10.

I'm fairly sure it was $10 or just a bit cheaper when we played the Blues there last year.

IMO I still don't think it is justified.

[GVGjr]

IMO I still don't think it is justified.

It may not be but lets face it AFL footy isn't that cheap and I can't see them giving access to adults for $5. The point I was trying to make was that the price of a pie, bucket of chips and one can of drink once you get in there will be more expensive than the actual entry into the game. To me $10 for 2 hours of footy isn't bad value.

Would it be that much more enjoyable if it was $7? They have a fair bit of security on plus they have to man the gates etc so I suppose that's what they charge for.

[azabob]

It may not be but lets face it AFL footy isn't that cheap and I can't see them giving access to adults for $5. The point I was trying to make was that the price of a pie, bucket of chips and one can of drink once you get in there will be more expensive than the actual entry into the game. To me $10 for 2 hours of footy isn't bad value.

Would it be that much more enjoyable if it was $7? They have a fair bit of security on plus they have to man the gates etc so I suppose that's what they charge for.

To be honest I may be being unrealistic but I think it should be free especially to memembers of the competiting clubs. Chances are neither team will be serious about the match, you don't know who is playing or what position etc etc.
But you are right things these days cost money.

[LostDoggy]

I wont be able to make this one. I was really looking forward to seeing some more young players.

[GVGjr]

To be honest I may be being unrealistic but I think it should be free especially to memembers of the competiting clubs. Chances are neither team will be serious about the match, you don't know who is playing or what position etc etc.
But you are right things these days cost money.

If all the challenge games were free then the costs incurred would just be added back into the cost of the memberships. At least this way you can make the decision if you want to go and pay the money rather than have it forced on you.

And yes, there is a fair chance that one side will take it more seriously than the other or it could be predominately be a game between bunch of lesser lights but we ran the same risk last week and paid $25.

[aker39]

Yes, $10 may not sound much, but this is a practice match. Whether people turn up or not, the clubs still need to have practices matches. And there is no way that members should have to pay to get in.

If clubs want members to sign up early, they should make sure that they get the members tickets out so that they get in to games like this.

The AFL have become very money hungry. The biggest joke of all was when they decided that your membership didn't get you in to the NAB Cup. All this did was take money away from the clubs. It was the one incentive for members to sign up early.

[Sockeye Salmon]

It may not be but lets face it AFL footy isn't that cheap and I can't see them giving access to adults for $5. The point I was trying to make was that the price of a pie, bucket of chips and one can of drink once you get in there will be more expensive than the actual entry into the game. To me $10 for 2 hours of footy isn't bad value.

Would it be that much more enjoyable if it was $7? They have a fair bit of security on plus they have to man the gates etc so I suppose that's what they charge for.

Only because they're charging people to get in.

Years ago I did my apprenticeship at Albion Explosives Factory in Deer Park. When they closed the factory down the last people to finish up were the pay staff and the only pays left for them to make up were their own.

[LostDoggy]

If all the challenge games were free then the costs incurred would just be added back into the cost of the memberships.

This is exactly how it is. Membership prices would be far more expensive for the average Joe Blow if all the extras are included for example NAB Cup and these challenge games. It is a tricky situation for the clubs and the AFL holds all the cards.

[Dogs 24/7]

$10 is a bit high but not worth complaining about. Ideally it should be $10 but with a discount say $3 if you have already signed on as a member.

[LostDoggy]

So is anyone actually going? It's 5-10 dollars to go watch most suburban hack teams, so 10 dollars isn't that much for a full game. 37 degrees so the story goes, hope there's a late change :)

[The Coon Dog]

Given the expectation is for a 38 degree day, both sides will have extended interchange benches.

The Bulldogs will field 30 players & the Saints 29.

Obviously rotations will occur thick & fast & some players will get minimal game time, particularly those returning from injury.

Ryan Hargrave won't play, just precautionary & Callan Ward will be rested as will Tom Williams who's ankle is responding slowly, erring on the side of caution thre.

Those who will play are: Robert Murphy, Jason Akermanis, Mitch Hahn, Scott Welsh, Ayce Cordy, Malcolm Lynch, Stephen Tiller & Andrejs Everitt.

[bulldogsman]

Squad

Western Bulldogs (from)
1. Jarrad Grant
2. Robert Murphy
3. Andrejs Everitt
4. Daniel Cross
5. Matthew Boyd
6. Brad Johnson
7. Shaun Higgins
8. Mitch Hahn
9. Lindsay Gilbee
10. Nathan Eagleton
13. Daniel Giansiracusa
15. Ben Hudson
16. Ryan Griffen
18. Brennan Stack
20. Josh Hill
21. Jason Akermanis
22. Dylan Addison
27. Will Minson
28. Scott Welsh
29. Easton Wood
33. Tim Callan
34. Wayde Skipper
35. Stephen Tiller
36. Brian Lake
38. Dale Morris
39. Malcolm Lynch
40. Jarrod Harbrow
41. Henry White
42. Liam Picken
49. Ayce Cordy

Good to see a fair few back in

I notice Cam Wight isn't in there. I wonder why

[Desipura]

Squad

Western Bulldogs (from)
1. Jarrad Grant
2. Robert Murphy
3. Andrejs Everitt
4. Daniel Cross
5. Matthew Boyd
6. Brad Johnson
7. Shaun Higgins
8. Mitch Hahn
9. Lindsay Gilbee
10. Nathan Eagleton
13. Daniel Giansiracusa
15. Ben Hudson
16. Ryan Griffen
18. Brennan Stack
20. Josh Hill
21. Jason Akermanis
22. Dylan Addison
27. Will Minson
28. Scott Welsh
29. Easton Wood
33. Tim Callan
34. Wayde Skipper
35. Stephen Tiller
36. Brian Lake
38. Dale Morris
39. Malcolm Lynch
40. Jarrod Harbrow
41. Henry White
42. Liam Picken
49. Ayce Cordy

Good to see a fair few back in

I notice Cam Wight isn't in there. I wonder why
or Roughead

[Sockeye Salmon]

it's easier to name who isn't there

Reid
Williams
Ward
Cooney
Jones
Roughead
Hargrave
Daniels
O'Keefe
Mulligan
Boumann
Wight
Shaw
O'Shea

[alwaysadog]

Very good to see Easton Wood and Henry White in the squad along with the younger son of Cotten Picken

[alwaysadog]

Just got the latest enewsletter from the club, it contains the following

NAB Challenge
Western Bulldogs vs St Kilda
Date: Friday, 27th February 2009
Location: VISY Park
Time: 4.30pm
2009 Membership cards will enable entry or general admission tickets will be available at the gate.
Adult - $10
Concession - $5
Junior - $2
Family - $20

Now what do those of us have been paying up but haven't yet got our memberships do?

[GVGjr]

Now what do those of us have been paying up but haven't yet got our memberships do?

Did we stop off at a tent and get a pass last year?

[bornadog]

Just got the latest enewsletter from the club, it contains the following

NAB Challenge
Western Bulldogs vs St Kilda
Date: Friday, 27th February 2009
Location: VISY Park
Time: 4.30pm
2009 Membership cards will enable entry or general admission tickets will be available at the gate.
Adult - $10
Concession - $5
Junior - $2
Family - $20

Now what do those of us have been paying up but haven't yet got our memberships do?

Members who have received their 2009 membership card should present it to receive free entry. Those who are yet to receive their membership card should visit the Western Bulldogs membership marquee located at Gate 5 at the ground, to obtain a paper ticket (paper tickets subject to availability). Alternatively, general admission tickets are available at the gate.

[alwaysadog]

Did we stop off at a tent and get a pass last year?

Yes, as usual your memory is spot on GVG.

[Mantis]

Members who have received their 2009 membership card should present it to receive free entry. Those who are yet to receive their membership card should visit the Western Bulldogs membership marquee located at Gate 5 at the ground, to obtain a paper ticket (paper tickets subject to availability). Alternatively, general admission tickets are available at the gate.

So how many will they have, 100 or 3,000?

[aker39]

So how many will they have, 100 or 3,000?

If they are fair dinkum they'll make sure they have enough to make sure that every paid up member that wants to get in, can get in for free.

[Mantis]

If they are fair dinkum they'll make sure they have enough to make sure that every paid up member that wants to get in, can get in for free.

I got my membership card today so I don't have to worry.

[LostDoggy]

My card came today also the fridge magnet will arrive with the first edition of the magazine though

[bornadog]

I got my membership card today so I don't have to worry.

same, but junior tickets still till to come.

[Mantis]

Umm, umm, umm..... Where do I start?

Firstly if what I have just sat through is the way modern football is to be played, well it's time to find another sport to watch. That was utterly horrible.

I really can't find one positive to come out of that 2 hours of football (if you can still call it football)

The game style was disgusting, our skill level was worse.

[Dancin' Douggy]

well if that's an accurate report I'm glad I didn't brave the heat and the traffic to get there.
Was it worse than last night? When Collingwood repeatedly kicked or ran into a forward line with no forwards?

[Mantis]

Was it worse than last night? When Collingwood repeatedly kicked or ran into a forward line with no forwards?

Almost the same except the skills, especially our's, was worse.

[Bulldog4life]

Umm, umm, umm..... Where do I start?

Firstly if what I have just sat through is the way modern football is to be played, well it's time to find another sport to watch. That was utterly horrible.

I really can't find one positive to come out of that 2 hours of football (if you can still call it football)

The game style was disgusting, our skill level was worse.


I agree 100%. There were some very worrying signs. No cohesion in the backline with the ball being passed back and forward then back again. With Gilbee off the ground we have no designated kicker of note. Our forward line was non existant and to only kick 5 goals was very poor. I thought that we were lucky to only lose by 26 points and in my opinion St.Kilda's form was average at best.

Our handballing all around the ground was atrocious. If you didn't know better you swear it was something completely new to team.

And I'm an optimistic supporter.:eek:

Overall a poor team effort. I would say 2 to 2.5 out of 10.

[wb_age]

I just got back from the game and boy, was it an ordinary game.

Scoreline was 61 to 35, so we only booted 5 majors.

Higgins kicked two goals, one from the boundary and other from straight in front.

Picken dobbed one from 50 after taking his man on.

Hill kicked his from 45 out after taking advantage of the play on rule.

Lynch kicked his from 45out on the half forward flank, linked up well with Stack and played on in between two opponents then slotting it in on the left.

There really wasn't much to elaborate on from today's hit out, skills are well down and the forward line wasnt working anywhere near hard enough. On countless occasions the ball was bombed long or just kicked ahead of the play straight into the hands of St Kilda players.

Higgins started off great but was quite average from then on, got caught holding the ball in the backline when an easy handball out of traffic was all that was required.

Grant was very quiet today, kicking is becoming a real concern as he missed a short pass backwards by a good 15 meters.

Most of our ball getters were well done, Cross/Boyd/Griffen etc.

Morris was Morris.

Tiller looks set for a career in the backline, at times he was defined like Morris.

Lynch showed some really good signs once he worked his way into the game, has a beautiful left foot (unsure if that's his natural, it was that good).

Murphy only played the last quarter and you can tell he hasn't played in a while, shanked every one of his kicks (albeit there were only about 3).

Cordy would of been lucky to get 15mins out there, and when he was out there he was in the forward line whilst we were getting dominated, so he didn't touch it.


Looks like we're still a fair way off the pace, but hey we're still a month out from the real stuff.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

That is the worst thing I've ever seen.

No, really.

Mantis summed it up about right. Absolutely no positives to come out of the game of football - if you can call it that. The disposal by foot and hand was the worst I have ever seen it, too.

Eh, it can't get any worse.

[LostDoggy]

Dogs bottom four for 2009?

[wb_age]

Dogs bottom four for 2009?
Get your hand off it.

[lemmon]

Fairly glad i didnt go down then. Sounds like a fairly atrocious game we are probably able to sweep this one under the carpet though being only a NAB cup game.

[Stevo]

Get your hand off it.

You might want to take some of your own advice as it was clearly posed as a question not a statement.

[Stevo]

Dogs bottom four for 2009?
A month to go before the real season and while we might not be hitting the high notes at the moment there is still plenty of scope for some fine tuning.

[ledge]

A month to go before the real season and while we might not be hitting the high notes at the moment there is still plenty of scope for some fine tuning.

From the posts it sounds like we need a lot more than fine tuning, more like back to basics.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

From the posts it sounds like we need a lot more than fine tuning, more like back to basics.

Anything half decent would be a start.

The decision making and disposal was atrocious - I can't believe how bad they were. I understand it's a NAB Cup match, it means nothing - etc. But if you saw today, you'd be wondering why they bothered turning up because it was beyond my comprehension of ... well, 'crap'. Far too much handball, which constantly put us under pressure, not a lot of leading/running and no game plan whatsoever.

I have no doubt we'll get better as the weeks wear on, but it was an odd game. Such an ugly "spectacle" - the ugliest I have ever seen. No structure in the game at all really. Forward lines non existant, plenty of flooding, handballs going everywhere. If somebody hit a target - it became a surprise.

St. Kilda looked better in the second half and showed some better signs, but they weren't great either. We were lucky to have one piece of play worth mentioning TBH. Stack to Lynch who played on and kicked a goal was good, but aside from that, it really was awful.

I just hope footy isn't going to be played like this because like Mantis said, if it is, then it's time to follow another code.

[Stevo]

From the posts it sounds like we need a lot more than fine tuning, more like back to basics.

Obviously I'd prefer us to be playing a better brand of football but there is still a lot of time to get things right. 12 months ago were weren't playing that much better and it didn't hold us back.

[alwaysadog]

I went and sat behind our bench and the players were on and off like clockwork, forwards, defenders, on ballers today it didn't matter. I'm surprised that Rocket didn't have two teams and do a complete swap every 4 minutes.
No chance of developing any cohesion, or to work on your game or an opponent off of his.
They were determined that no one was going to get heat effected.

It wasn't a game we tried to win. I suspect we would have called it off if we could.

[LostDoggy]

No good hearing it was that bad...

I didnt expect a win or anything though, team we fielded is nowhere near our best 22, so i think theres nothing to get worried about, the real season is the real season this is just rubbish in the leadup..Look at last year, Essendon belted us in the nab comp, big woop that did for them.

Only concern is un-wanted travelling, I assume we have to goto Alice Springs or something like that next week?

[ledge]

This interchanging all the time is the biggest load of rot ever, how do you get cohesion or anything if you spend your time concentrating on getting on and off a bench?
I posted once before how i can never understand how players kick team lifting goals, their adrenalin is running , they are on a high but then run off to the bench?
Players get paid squillions to only be on a ground for maybe 1 hr a game.
Go back to the old days i say and then you really see who the fit players and good side is by players running out a whole game.
How do players get to settle and show skills if they are only on for 5 minutes at a time?

[Mantis]

I went and sat behind our bench and the players were on and off like clockwork, forwards, defenders, on ballers today it didn't matter. I'm surprised that Rocket didn't have two teams and do a complete swap every 4 minutes.
No chance of developing any cohesion, or to work on your game or an opponent off of his.
They were determined that no one was going to get heat effected.

It wasn't a game we tried to win. I suspect we would have called it off if we could.

So why didn't we get the game changed then? Perhaps we tried.

I understand what you are saying, but the lack of polish our player's showed, even early, was very disappointing.

[Mantis]

Obviously I'd prefer us to be playing a better brand of football but there is still a lot of time to get things right. 12 months ago were weren't playing that much better and it didn't hold us back.

The most disappointing thing from my viewpoint was the poor decision making & the terrible skill level by our 'senior' players.

Players like Johnson, Gia, Cross, Lake, Boyd the list goes on should be master's at hitting targets. I counted Johnson make atleast 6 errors by foot and most of these were under little or no pressure. These are the same error's he makes during the regular season so I guess to think things might improve is asking a bit too much.

[Mantis]

from the AFL website:

The Bulldogs started the better on Friday, but their trademark skill was noticeably absent, and coach Rodney Eade was at a loss to explain why.

"Normally a coach in this position, you've got all the psychological reasons and we can wheel them out to make excuses," he said.

"I know it was a little bit swirly today, the wind, but it (the lack of skill) was lamentable and most of the skills were not under a lot of pressure."

Eade said getting some experienced players back was the only positive to draw from the game.

Bulldog half-back Lindsay Gilbee fainted at half-time because of the heat but was fine after the match.
The Bulldogs play the Swans in western Sydney next weekend.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/72650/default.aspx

[Sockeye Salmon]

I was there today with Mantis.

We refused to use the word 'football' because whatever game it is they're playing, it bears no resemblance to the game I've played and watched for more than 35 years.

We started calling it 'Andersonball".

And it's shit.

[aker39]

Murphy only played the last quarter and you can tell he hasn't played in a while, shanked every one of his kicks (albeit there were only about 3).



Sounds like he picked up where he finished off last year.

[The Pie Man]

I was there today with Mantis.

We refused to use the word 'football' because whatever game it is they're playing, it bears no resemblance to the game I've played and watched for more than 35 years.

We started calling it 'Andersonball".

And it's shit.

I didn't go today, and nor am I familiar with the reference, but I found this post hilarious nonetheless

We don't normally play ugly - bad sometimes, but rarely ugly. opin

[The Pie Man]

I was there today with Mantis.

We refused to use the word 'football' because whatever game it is they're playing, it bears no resemblance to the game I've played and watched for more than 35 years.

We started calling it 'Andersonball".

And it's shit.

I didn't go today, and nor am I familiar with the reference, but I found this post hilarious nonetheless

We don't normally play ugly - bad sometimes, but rarely ugly. Hoping what the reports reflect is an aberration

[Sockeye Salmon]

I didn't go today, and nor am I familiar with the reference, but I found this post hilarious nonetheless

We don't normally play ugly - bad sometimes, but rarely ugly. opin

I don't mean our performance, which, granted was dreadful, I was referring to what the game has become.

[Remi Moses]

I know it's only a praccy game but I pray that our mob isn't content in finishing third last season. :mad:

[Bulldog Revolution]

Hard not to agree with almost everything said

The worrying trend is the way the game is being played - it's got very ugly

We started well and for the first 15 minutes looked far the better side without converting the most of our opportunities. Griffen and Higgins were getting the ball, Hahn looked promising up forward.

Then for the next 15 minutes we presumed to make stupid mistakes that allowed St Kilda to goal e.g Higgins getting caught holding the ball 25 metres out from goal after playing on stupidly. For the next 3 quarters the saints were the better side. They had more run through the midfield and made far less mistakes. They should have won by more.

We made so many mistakes our midfield was baffling/appalling/ineffectual. We got very little run or drive, and very little handball receive overlap play. Our forward line was not a factor at all but I think a fair bit of it was to do with the way the midfield overcooked it frequently. Any forward would have had a hard time knowing when to lead today, that said our forward line did not function at all.

The herald sun lists these as our best players:
Western Bulldogs: D Cross N Eagleton J Hill S Higgins D Addison L Picken.

On those I would say that Josh Hill tried hard all day and was reasonably effective for as close to four quarters as any players. I think Addison has improved and apart from a late error or two was very good, as was Picken who also made a mistake or two, but that was 5 less than most players. I wouldn't comment on the others because I'm not convinced they were that good.

[LostDoggy]

I don't mean our performance, which, granted was dreadful, I was referring to what the game has become.

Eade warned us it was going to be like this.

I've said my piece of the lack foresight and vision from the AFL about the game.

[mighty_west]

All i can hear is LA LA LA LA LA LA.....It's Feb, right?

Seriously though, the conditions along with the importance of the game doesn't really factor into my thoughts & hopes going into the season, apparently some of the players were feeling pretty dodgy out there as well, Higgo throwing up, Gilbs fainting, just as long as no one got injured, thats all i care about.

[mighty_west]

The herald sun lists these as our best players:
Western Bulldogs: D Cross N Eagleton J Hill S Higgins D Addison L Picken.

On those I would say that Josh Hill tried hard all day and was reasonably effective for as close to four quarters as any players. I think Addison has improved and apart from a late error or two was very good, as was Picken who also made a mistake or two, but that was 5 less than most players. I wouldn't comment on the others because I'm not convinced they were that good.

I guess when you kick 5 goals, each goal kicker HAS to get in the best...:D

Great to see him amongst the best all the same, hoping for good things from Picken.

[mighty_west]

Dogs bottom four for 2009?

In the NAB Cup / Challenge yes. ;)

[bornadog]

I was there today with Mantis.

We refused to use the word 'football' because whatever game it is they're playing, it bears no resemblance to the game I've played and watched for more than 35 years.

We started calling it 'Andersonball".

And it's shit.

Thats what happens when you keep fiddling with the rules to try and change the game to the way you think it should be played. All this does is force the coaches to find new ways to win and get around the dumb rule changes. Take the 50 metre penalty, it has become a farce beyond belief the way it is now used.

Anderson, Demtriou have destroyed our game and I don't think it can now be reversed.

[Throughandthrough]

I was there today with Mantis.

We refused to use the word 'football' because whatever game it is they're playing, it bears no resemblance to the game I've played and watched for more than 35 years.

We started calling it 'Andersonball".

And it's shit.


And the AFL is wondering why the SANFL is getting a massive flow of support....

[Go_Dogs]

I didn't go today, and nor am I familiar with the reference, but I found this post hilarious nonetheless

Agreed. Andersonball...haha, great.

[bornadog]

The AFL are not flexible enough, that game should have been postponed to today when the weather was going to be cooler. What idiots playing in the heat. I note that Gilbee fainted from heat exhaustion, what the hell is the AFL doing, everyone knew a week ago it was going to be a hot day.

[comrade]

I felt the same way last year.

I'm trying to not to worry about yesterday's result - average conditions, NAB Challenge rules - kicking backwards is play on, 20 metre kicks - 4 weeks from the season proper and not even close to a cohesive best 22 out on the park.

Rocket will no doubt blast them over their overuse and will fine tune us over the next month. Murhpy will be better for the run, as will Everitt, Griff, Hahn, Aker and Welsh.

We also have the reigning Brownlow medalist to return.

Good signs from Hill, Lynch and Addison - 3 guys who can really help lift our team to next level.

I thought Grant's work ethic when chasing was good but he really needs to run to better spots and demand the ball (although the midfield zone makes it hard for leading forwards).

Eagleton was named in the bests and I have no idea how - he got a bit of the ball but his disposal is just third rate.

Perfect example - Griff had a paddock on the wing and Eagle (under no pressure) just bombed it to space, with the ball bouncing 10 metres from Griff and then trickling towards the boundary so he had to stop, run back and get it and try and then make the play under pressure from 2 Saints. If Eagleton had some composure and hit Griff up like a professional footballer should, he would've been off like a shot and attacking our 50.

Also - sledge to the Saints fan for giggling like a schoolgirl whenever Kosi took a mark. For God sakes man, act your age.

[bornadog]

This sums it up:

http://westernbulldogs.com.au/season2007/news/newsarticle/tabid/4112/newsid/72666/default.aspx

Eade sees lighter side of loss

IT WAS so bad, you had to laugh.

That was the view of Western Bulldogs coach Rodney Eade after his side lost an incredibly scrappy NAB Challenge game to St Kilda by 26 points on Friday afternoon.

It was so hot at Visy Park that defender Lindsay Gilbee fainted in the race at half time on the way back to the rooms and each side used 12 players on its bench.

But there were still an awful lot of skill errors.

In the rooms after the match, a relaxed Eade was joking with journalists as he shook his head about the performance.

"They were lamentable," he said. "I’ve got no idea. I honestly don’t know [why].

"Normally as a coach in this situation, you’ve got all the psychological theories and we can wheel them out to make excuses. I know it was a little bit swirly, the wind, but it was lamentable, the skill level today.

"It was shocking and most of the skills were not under a lot of pressure."

The obvious truth is that players don’t lose their ability but just take time to rediscover that touch ahead of the season proper. That was a major reason for Eade's stress-free outlook.

"You don’t lose your skill over the pre-season and I think if you look at most games in the NAB Cup – they’re higher intensity than this – but there has been a lot of errors," he said.

"To me it just hit home today seeing Robert Murphy, who’s as skilled as any in the competition, who hasn’t done a lot of footy work. He couldn’t co-ordinate his leg to kick the ball, it was like he’d had to re-train the muscle.

"I think we’ve done less footy than most teams – we started about three weeks later and we concentrated a lot on our fitness early.

"So we’ve got four weeks where we can throw plenty of balls at them, so we’ll be OK."

[Mantis]

"I think we’ve done less footy than most teams – we started about three weeks later and we concentrated a lot on our fitness early.

"So we’ve got four weeks where we can throw plenty of balls at them, so we’ll be OK."

How do you teach guys who can't kick to kick in 4 weeks?

[Before I Die]

How do you teach guys who can't kick to kick in 4 weeks?

Over the last few years we have been seen as a team highly skilled by foot. These skills don't disappear over the summer, but they do get rusty. Elite golfers and tennis players need to practise hitting balls almost every day ot they lose their touch. Footballers are the same.

[Mantis]

Over the last few years we have been seen as a team highly skilled by foot. These skills don't disappear over the summer, but they do get rusty. Elite golfers and tennis players need to practise hitting balls almost every day ot they lose their touch. Footballers are the same.

We are also supposed to be a quick team. I don't see too many quick players, do you?

On your second point these players have been training for the best part of 3 months to ready themselves for the upcoming season, and yes we read that they have concentrated more on fitness than football thus far, but at a guess I would have thought they would be training with balls for 2 to 4 hours a week. Some of the kicks and handballs I have viewed in the past few weeks are like those of a beginner.

I am a fairly handy golfer and recently I had a 5 week lay off. After this lay off I was hitting the ball all over the place, but within a week I was back to playing some pretty good golf. My golf is no where near being at a professional state and thus the amount of practice I put in would be limited to 1 perhaps 2 hours a week, but our football team are professionals and I would hope to see professional performances from them when they play be it a NAB Cup game or an official H&A game.

[soupman]

We are also supposed to be a quick team. I don't see too many quick players, do you?

We haven't been an overly quick team for at least 1 year.

We move the ball quickly, and play a quick style, but we have no Davey type players, and most of our quick guys are in the pacy group, without being anything outstanding.

The only really quick players on our list to have played a game are Lynch and Harbrow.

[Desipura]

We are also supposed to be a quick team. I don't see too many quick players, do you?

On your second point these players have been training for the best part of 3 months to ready themselves for the upcoming season, and yes we read that they have concentrated more on fitness than football thus far, but at a guess I would have thought they would be training with balls for 2 to 4 hours a week. Some of the kicks and handballs I have viewed in the past few weeks are like those of a beginner.

I am a fairly handy golfer and recently I had a 5 week lay off. After this lay off I was hitting the ball all over the place, but within a week I was back to playing some pretty good golf. My golf is no where near being at a professional state and thus the amount of practice I put in would be limited to 1 perhaps 2 hours a week, but our football team are professionals and I would hope to see professional performances from them when they play be it a NAB Cup game or an official H&A game.
I agree we are not as quick as some say. Gee I hope Lynch comes good as his genuine pace in the forward line is badly needed. My bro was talking with one of the conditioning guys at the praccy game and he said that Lynch is one of the quickest in the league! My bro asked how about Alwyn Davey, he said Lynch is quicker. I found this most surprising.
Cooney will help the pace in the midfield when he comes back then you have Griffen (both have great acceleration), other than that, I am unaware with other players on our list with genuine pace.

[Desipura]

We haven't been an overly quick team for at least 1 year.

We move the ball quickly, and play a quick style, but we have no Davey type players, and most of our quick guys are in the pacy group, without being anything outstanding.

The only really quick players on our list to have played a game are Lynch and Harbrow.
I disagree about Harbrow having pace. Dont get me wrong, he is not slow however I would not say he has pace. In fact I wish/hope he has gained a yard with the new conditioning guy.

[Before I Die]

I don't think we have ever (well, not in a long time) been a team with a lot of genuine pace. What we have had is a generous number of players who like to run and carry and a few players with good acceleration. The departures of McMahon and Ray (though for the best) reduce our run and carry, as does the ageing of Eagleton. However, I think the heat was the main factor on Friday. There was no gut running from the backline or through the midfield and given the conditions and the risk to players, I think that was probably a good thing. Unfortunately the foot skills were also down (on the day) so short passes regularly missed targets and long kicks were rarely to our players' advantage.
However, there was no shortage of endeavour and plenty of tackling pressure, areas that have been a concern in the not too distant past.

[The Coon Dog]

I think the heat was the main factor on Friday.

How will this affect our players who play in Perth in rounds 1 & 4?

Freo game starts at 4.10pm & West Coast game at 2.40pm local time.

Those living in WA may be best placed to answer this one.

[Go_Dogs]

We are also supposed to be a quick team. I don't see too many quick players, do you?


Is it leg speed, or speed of ball movement that needs to improve though? If we had super quick players but moved the ball slowly, it wouldn't make any difference at all. Sure, it would be nice to have some extra leg speed, but I don't think its the be all end all.

At the end of the day, I feel leg speed is most important out of the clearance, where explosive speed can make space and time to create. Cooney and Griffen can provide enough in this regards. I don't know many other centre square combos that have 2 pretty good players with such explosive leg speed.

[Before I Die]

How will this affect our players who play in Perth in rounds 1 & 4?

Freo game starts at 4.10pm & West Coast game at 2.40pm local time.

Those living in WA may be best placed to answer this one.

Pre-season and home and away are very different. You run yourself into the ground to get the win in a home and away game. In the pre-season you experiment with other things and look after the players.

[The Coon Dog]

Pre-season and home and away are very different. You run yourself into the ground to get the win in a home and away game. In the pre-season you experiment with other things and look after the players.

Hang on, in your previous post you said the heat was a factor on Friday night but then say in your next post that in a proper match you 'run yourself into the ground'. Given that the heat was a factor on Friday night & we're playing rounds 1 & 4 in Perth during the day where we'll be running ourselves into the ground, surely the heat will again be a factor, will it not?

[Before I Die]

Hang on, in your previous post you said the heat was a factor on Friday night but then say in your next post that in a proper match you 'run yourself into the ground'. Given that the heat was a factor on Friday night & we're playing rounds 1 & 4 in Perth during the day where we'll be running ourselves into the ground, surely the heat will again be a factor, will it not?

I am being consistent in my intent, but I apologise if I am not communicating it too well. I am suggesting that the heat impacted on the style of play adopted on Friday night. If the team adopted a gut running style it would have had a detrimental effect on their ability to train over the next week. Being that the result of the game did not matter, but the ability to train at this time of the year is paramount, I am suggesting that they chose (not necessarily a conscious decision) to play a more sedentary game style. In the home and away season, winning is everything and with the fitness base and ball skills in place, a game in hot conditions would be followed by a very light week on the track. Of course this is all just surmising on my behalf, but I hope I have now made my thoughts clear.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

To shy away from the concern for a moment, Lynch has had a good pre-season and was probably our best against St. Kilda - or close to it. He's using his pace to good effect and in one instance, took on about 3 or 4 St. Kilda players when running forward because we simply had no other options. He did this very well and then delivered the footy nicely to the right spot. On top of that, in an earlier piece of play he used his pace to get on the end of a pass from Stack to kick a very good goal from a difficult angle about 45m out.

Obviously there hasn't been a whole lot to write home about, but the signs from Lynch are promissing. He looks as though he's definitely got over last year's troubles, and whilst he needs to find more of the ball, he could play a role this season. Having Minson up forward to bring the ball to ground could help his game too, but unfortunately we haven't really been able to trial this yet, as we haven't had a structure up forward TBH.

I hope Lynch makes it though - we really need some genuine pace/x factor, and he could be pretty dangerous as a FP. Kind of like Alwyn Davey.

[LostDoggy]

If heat was a factor for our team, how come it did not effect St Kilda as much?

[Before I Die]

If heat was a factor for our team, how come it did not effect St Kilda as much?

I think it did. The game was crap from both teams. I just think the style played was closer to that typically played by St Kilda and they were better at it than us. I am not trying to read good things into how we played, it was terrible. I just don't think it means very much in terms of how we will go when the real stuff starts in a month.

[NoParkingOnMatchDays]

Could someone who watched the game let me know how Farren played if he did.

I know he used to divide opinion amongst us but I thought he had really healthy hair and would like to know how he played. I would also be interested to know if the heat caused him any frizz problems.

[Mantis]

If heat was a factor for our team, how come it did not effect St Kilda as much?

Funny story with that one.

At half time I had to go and put some more money in the parking meter. As I was exiting the ground I passed up to 10 or 12 St.Kilda player's who were all pissed off big time. They all looked hot and bothered and were constantly cursing. They were all walking away from a regfrigerated truck which I learnt very quickly had been turned off.

The plan was that the player's would cool off during the break in the truck so to bring there core temperature's down. The bloke in charge had a reddier face than the players.

[ledge]

Couldnt doing that cause muscle problems as muscles cool down and then you go back out and do a hammy or whatever?

[hujsh]

Is it leg speed, or speed of ball movement that needs to improve though? If we had super quick players but moved the ball slowly, it wouldn't make any difference at all. Sure, it would be nice to have some extra leg speed, but I don't think its the be all end all.

Like Geelong. Not the quickest team in term of leg speed but they can move the ball quickly.

[azabob]

Like Geelong. Not the quickest team in term of leg speed but they can move the ball quickly.

Hawthorn wouldn't be classed as quick either

[bornadog]

Like Geelong. Not the quickest team in term of leg speed but they can move the ball quickly.

McMahon and Griffen off the backline made us look quick.

[alwaysadog]

How do you teach guys who can't kick to kick in 4 weeks?

Obviously you can't but my very dim memory suggests that there were two things that took a long time to really click into place with what passed for a preseason in my very lower grade days were judging the ball through the air so you could be in the right place for the marking contest and getting kicking touch, the capacity to not just hit the ball with your foot but to fine tune direction, length and velocity. The difference between being a good kick and a hack.

[ledge]

Foot speed is overated i think, its more brain speed and quick ball delivery that matters.

If you have a football brain thats good enough to get you into AFL footy foot speed is irrelevant.
Williams was a perfect example, its the brain speed and awareness.

The ball travels a lot faster in the air than some one running with it.

Im of the old school, you see someone ahead you give it to them ASAP not this run and put all your forwards out of position because they dont know when the hell they are going to pass it.
Also stops flooding.
To me thats when you try turning athletes into footballers, Mc Mahon being the classic example.
I have also noticed over the years players are scared to kick to one on one contests, have a bit of faith in your players abillty to win the ball one out please!!

[Mantis]

I have also noticed over the years players are scared to kick to one on one contests, have a bit of faith in your players abillty to win the ball one out please!!

There was hardly a one on one contest during the practice match on Friday.

[ledge]

There was hardly a one on one contest during the practice match on Friday.

Go back to players playing in positions i say.
EG..
If your playing on a HBF you cant go past the centre unless you have the ball etc.
No idea how to police it but hey i can dream.

[Go_Dogs]

Foot speed is overated i think, its more brain speed and quick ball delivery that matters.

If you have a football brain thats good enough to get you into AFL footy foot speed is irrelevant.
Williams was a perfect example, its the brain speed and awareness.

The ball travels a lot faster in the air than some one running with it.



Perhaps we'll see a lot more, low, spearing daisy cutter kicks this season because of it too, rather than well weighted balls that allow too much time for defenders to get back.

[hujsh]

Go back to players playing in positions i say.
EG..
If your playing on a HBF you cant go past the centre unless you have the ball etc.
No idea how to police it but hey i can dream.

Might end up with netball bibs.

[Before I Die]

Could someone who watched the game let me know how Farren played if he did.

I know he used to divide opinion amongst us but I thought he had really healthy hair and would like to know how he played. I would also be interested to know if the heat caused him any frizz problems.

I wasn't paying a lot of attention to him, but from memory. He played off the back flank. Didn't try to generate any real run and preferred to handball rather than kick, though he did butcher at least two attempted foot passes. Also roughed up Johnno (or at least gave him the shits) after one bit of play. Johnno did not look happy and Ray seemed to find it hilarious.
I am afraid I didn't pay any attention at all to his hair, though I am fairly confident there was no sign of frizzing.

[ledge]

Might end up with netball bibs.

I couldnt care less at least you see one players skill against another.

[Cyberdoggie]

Ugly game yes.

I'm not going to read too much into the state of AFL just yet, it is pre-season and it seems every club wants to play around with the clarko's cluster at the moment.

They few things i learned from the game were as follows:

*When we can't run and tackle hard (fatigue) then we are ordinary
*We still don't have anyone that resembles a key forward
*Higgins will be ok in the midfield
*Picken is improving as a footballer and so is his confidence
*Without Gilbee in defence we look shaky in kick-ins
*Koschitszke at some stage this year will be injured again and will probably knock himself out
*Farren Ray looks fat
*Princes 'Visy' Park has taken a few months to get their renovations going to what took us several years. I think they will be finished before we are at this rate.

[bulldogsman]

Ugly game yes.

I'm not going to read too much into the state of AFL just yet, it is pre-season and it seems every club wants to play around with the clarko's cluster at the moment.

They few things i learned from the game were as follows:

*When we can't run and tackle hard (fatigue) then we are ordinary
*We still don't have anyone that resembles a key forward
*Higgins will be ok in the midfield
*Picken is improving as a footballer and so is his confidence
*Without Gilbee in defence we look shaky in kick-ins
*Koschitszke at some stage this year will be injured again and will probably knock himself out
*Farren Ray looks fat
*Princes 'Visy' Park has taken a few months to get their renovations going to what took us several years. I think they will be finished before we are at this rate.

Add Hargrave to that as well

[Ozza]

I disagree about Harbrow having pace. Dont get me wrong, he is not slow however I would not say he has pace. In fact I wish/hope he has gained a yard with the new conditioning guy.

I would say that Harbrow IS genuinely quick. His closing speed to tackle defenders in our arc is probably his best weapon, as is his foot speed to get away from tacklers himself.

[Ozza]

I wasn't at the game so I can't comment on it directly.

But a good mate of mine works for St.Kilda and pretty much said there wasn't too much to be worried about or to take from the game as far as how the teams would go.

He said all our regular midfielders were on a rotation of 5 minutes on, 4 minutes off - regardless of what was happening in the game (eg. leaving opposition not manned up etc)- and the changes were being run so quickly that most players had no idea who they were on.

He said Eagleton and Ray played on each other - but typically didn't go near each other all day.
He thought Higgins was our best, but other than that nobody settled in long enough from either team to play well.

If we're terrible in rounds 1 & 2 - then maybe get worried guys...until then I wouldn't be too phased.

[The Coon Dog]

But a good mate of mine works for St.Kilda and pretty much said there wasn't too much to be worried about or to take from the game as far as how the teams would go.

He said all our regular midfielders were on a rotation of 5 minutes on, 4 minutes off - regardless of what was happening in the game (eg. leaving opposition not manned up etc)- and the changes were being run so quickly that most players had no idea who they were on.



Thanks for that info Ozza, much appreciated.

[Cyberdoggie]

As an interesting side note to this discussion,

At the start of the match the umpires didn't have a coin to toss to decide the ends.
So have a guess how they did it!........

yes that's right.


rock paper scissors! :D

[Ozza]

As an interesting side note to this discussion,

At the start of the match the umpires didn't have a coin to toss to decide the ends.
So have a guess how they did it!........

yes that's right.


rock paper scissors! :D

That's gold! They should do that every game - it would be hillarious!