Liam Jones - Where is he at?

[LostDoggy]

Of all the recruits we have taken this year. Liam Jones has probably flown under the radar the most as he was playing for his school for most of the year. Could you see him playing in Willy seniors for the majority of next season? How is his fitness? From the little I've seen of him he looks a pretty good prospect. Seems to know where to lead and just looks (to me) the most natural KPP player we took in last years draft in body size and ability. Do you think there is a slight chance he could get a senior game next year or is he way off?

[GVGjr]

Obviously school commitments were the main focus for him this year however, he has impressed all and sundry with the games he has played for the reserves.
He will need a bit of time because his fitness won't be anything like it would need to be but he will come along quick enough. Great mark, decent field kick but his set shots need a lot of work.

[bulldogtragic]

Obviously school commitments were the main focus for him this year however, he has impressed all and sundry with the games he has played for the reserves.
He will need a bit of time because his fitness won't be anything like it would need to be but he will come along quick enough. Great mark, decent field kick but his set shots need a lot of work.
Ditto.

He is my man. The first 5 minutes i watched him in his first game for the Willi 2's i got a sense of some excitable movement.

Would hope to see him in the Willi 1's for a large chunk of next year. Whilst i would hope he could snag a late game for us, I would hope Hall in the the main team and Grant, Roughy and/or Cordy are trying to demand a spot. Liam has some way to go, but by jingo, there is a lot to like.

[mel]

Ditto.

He is my man. The first 5 minutes i watched him in his first game for the Willi 2's i got a sense of some excitable movement.

Would hope to see him in the Willi 1's for a large chunk of next year. Whilst i would hope he could snag a late game for us, I would hope Hall in the the main team and Grant, Roughy and/or Cordy are trying to demand a spot. Liam has some way to go, but by jingo, there is a lot to like.

As in the Seinfeld "mango" episode? I hold high hopes for the boy, but don't think they go that far!! :D

[LostDoggy]

Is Jones a chance to get a run in the firsts during the first half of this season. I saw him for the first time live in a Willi practice match at the Whitten Oval a month or so ago and he really impressed me with his work ethic and speed when he hits the ground. He also has beautiful hands and can take pack marks. I havent seen Grant in the last few weeks - but i would have thought that Jones could sneak in front of Grant?

What do you think his chances are of a breakthrough soon?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Is Jones a chance to get a run in the firsts during the first half of this season. I saw him for the first time live in a Willi practice match at the Whitten Oval a month or so ago and he really impressed me with his work ethic and speed when he hits the ground. He also has beautiful hands and can take pack marks. I havent seen Grant in the last few weeks - but i would have thought that Jones could sneak in front of Grant?

What do you think his chances are of a breakthrough soon?

Pretty doubtful I would have thought. What's the rush?

Liam needs to concentrate on playing good footy in the VFL seniors first. I don't think he should be promoted on the back of a couple good games. Let him build a good base, learn the game and improve his fitness. If he's playing well in the second half of the year, perhaps give him a shot then.

Grant is in front of him at this stage (as he should be) so I would expect we'll be giving opportunities to him first. This is only Liam's first year full time with the club, so there's absolutely no rush or concern with him playing a full year at Williamstown IMO.

[LostDoggy]

There is certainly no rush with Jones, but i guess i look back at how / when Grant got his first game - he didnt really deserve it. Watching Jones on a few occasions and seeing that he is taking pack marks and kicking goals at Willi firsts - then i would have thought that he would get a chance sooner rather than later. He just really impressed with his defensive pressure / speed once the ball hit the ground and ofcourse his ability to take a contested mark. For me - he seems to offer more than Grant does, and he seems more physically advanced as well.

I will be keeping a close eye on Jones in the next few weeks as i have a feeling that he will debut sooner rather than later.

[bornadog]

There is certainly no rush with Jones, but i guess i look back at how / when Grant got his first game - he didnt really deserve it. Watching Jones on a few occasions and seeing that he is taking pack marks and kicking goals at Willi firsts - then i would have thought that he would get a chance sooner rather than later. He just really impressed with his defensive pressure / speed once the ball hit the ground and ofcourse his ability to take a contested mark. For me - he seems to offer more than Grant does, and he seems more physically advanced as well.

I will be keeping a close eye on Jones in the next few weeks as i have a feeling that he will debut sooner rather than later.

If he keeps going the way he is , he will debut some time this year.

[Greystache]

I really like the look of Jones, he showed in the second half of the intra-club match the ability he has, Lake had his hands full with him.

Also, has anyone noticed he has a disproportionately long body and short legs? I would’ve thought so long as he still has pace and agility (which he certainly seems to) that would be a major advantage to him, having a low centre of gravity at 195cm should make him extremely difficult to move off the ball.

[stefoid]

Ultimately we want Grant playing out of the square and Jones at CHF.

[LostDoggy]

Thought he looked ok yesterday, presented pretty well all game & was willing to get involved in a contest.

Probably should have had two goals as well, the experience will do him good.

[comrade]

Not the worst debut, that's for sure.

He now knows the pace that top line footy is played at. Too many times he was in prime position but waited for the ball and got closed down by an opposition defender. The fact that he got to these positions is a real positive, but he has to learn to attack the ball in the air.

AFL defenders (even numpty Norf ones) are much, much quicker than their VFL counterparts. I'm sure Jones will come prepared next time.

[Ozza]

Was a reasonably good first hit out for a young man playing as a Tall Forward. Certainly did him no harm to have him get a game under his belt and would expect him to play 10-12 games next season if not more.

[AndrewP6]

Also, has anyone noticed he has a disproportionately long body and short legs? I would’ve thought so long as he still has pace and agility (which he certainly seems to) that would be a major advantage to him, having a low centre of gravity at 195cm should make him extremely difficult to move off the ball.

:D Yeah I did notice that.

[LostDoggy]

Not the worst debut, that's for sure.

He now knows the pace that top line footy is played at. Too many times he was in prime position but waited for the ball and got closed down by an opposition defender. The fact that he got to these positions is a real positive, but he has to learn to attack the ball in the air.

AFL defenders (even numpty Norf ones) are much, much quicker than their VFL counterparts. I'm sure Jones will come prepared next time.

Spot on.. probably back to Willy this week but good to give him a taste

[BornInDroopSt'54]

I really like the look of Jones, he showed in the second half of the intra-club match the ability he has, Lake had his hands full with him.

Also, has anyone noticed he has a disproportionately long body and short legs? I would’ve thought so long as he still has pace and agility (which he certainly seems to) that would be a major advantage to him, having a low centre of gravity at 195cm should make him extremely difficult to move off the ball.

So many great footballers are/were like this: Didak, Swan, Leigh Matthews, Daicos, Liberatore snr (shortest thickest legs in human history), Wallis snr etc (Milne has this advantage but is a suspected maggot, and then there's Wallace). They pump their little legs and are quick off the mark and can twist and turn quicker because they have shorter steps and a lower centre of gravity. They still look weird and disproportionate. But all these guys are short and Jones is tall, yeah, should make him harder to move off the ball and also more manouverable. He has aboriginal heritage doesn't he? Red hair and Tasmanian?? He doesn't look like his old man.....Is he a throw back to the Tasmanian aborigines who were red haired, like Truganini?

[soupman]

On your last couple of sentences there droop I think Jones has quite an odd complexion. He is almost orangish, and with his reddish fuzzy hair it's an odd colour.

On his game there were encouraging signs, however he often seemed toe a metro or two off being in the right spot to gather the ball or take the mark, indicating that the comments about him needing to adjust to e pace of the game may be right. He was also the victim of poor delivery frequently, with passes to him especially in the first half not being to his advantage.

[Desipura]

On your last couple of sentences there droop I think Jones has quite an odd complexion. He is almost orangish, and with his reddish fuzzy hair it's an odd colour.
You do realise his Dad is Aboriginal? Not sure of his mums background.

[Topdog]

I didn't know that Desi.

[Greystache]

His Dad is of strong aboriginal background, he was a key forward for St Kilda who played 20 games before moving back to the bush.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/pg-st-kilda-saints--bob-jones

[Desipura]

His Dad is of strong aboriginal background, he was a key forward for St Kilda who played 20 games before moving back to the bush.

http://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/pg-st-kilda-saints--bob-jones
Furthermore when he left St Kilda, he came to train with us one preseason but was overlooked.

[Twodogs]

I can vaguely remember his dad playing for St Kilda.

[soupman]

You do realise his Dad is Aboriginal? Not sure of his mums background.

Yes, I am aware of that. He is still quite an unusual colour though.

[Twodogs]

Yes, I am aware of that. He is still quite an unusual colour though.


He looks the same colour as Hulk Hogan I reckon. Sort of an orangybecauseI'vebeeninthesunlamptoolong shade.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

You do realise his Dad is Aboriginal? Not sure of his mums background.

So Bob is aboriginal, I wonder if he's Tasmainian aboriginal, and Liam's redness is from that? That's an exciting possibility. Bob used to be called Wow Jones didn't he and played in the ruck or did he have a namesake at Carlton?

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Sorry got confused with Warren Jones of Carlton.

[Desipura]

from Mangarook footy show website:

Congratulations go to Liam Jones after a fine AFL debut for the Western Bulldogs.
The 19-year-old, 195cm forward kicked a goal (and was probably ripped off another one) as the Bulldogs thrashed North Melbourne by 71 points at Etihad Stadium on Sunday.

Not surprisingly, Jones was all smiles as he celebrated the unforgettable moment with his father Bob (who played 20 games for St Kilda in the late 1980s) and younger brothers Jhdara and Leiwyn in the dressingrooms after the game.

"I couldn't believe it," he said.
"I found out on Tuesday. I was just wandering around (at the Whitten Oval) and 'Rocket' said when you're finished what you are doing, come and see me."
"(They said) You're playing with us this weekend. They congratulated me. They said you deserve it."
"It didn't sink in at all," he said.

Jones said it was a thrill to play alongside the likes of Barry Hall and Brad Johnson.
"I called dad first.
"He was very strange. I think he was just shocked."

[AndrewP6]

Was talking to someone from work on Friday (principal and her husband) who are friends of the family. Dad is Aboriginal/Indigenous, Mum is of European background/caucasian/white (insert correct term here!)

And Liam is a ranga!!! :) GO THE RANGAS!

[LostDoggy]

Love this bloke, played well tonight.

[Mofra]

He just chases & chases. A few teammates could learn something from him.

[Mantis]

He just chases & chases. A few teammates could learn something from him.

Yep.

He is clearly in our best 22 just on his ability & willingness to chase.

[bornadog]

He showed tremendous potential last night, needs to be a little more aware of teams mates when he is going for the ball. He ended up spoiling his own team mates a few times, but hey 3 game, aged 19, and still learning.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

did some nice things and finished well. Did anyone see him get a nice spray from Rocket at 3 Qtr time though for not looking for Bazza on the lead.
It looked like Eade asked him why he didn't go to him on one particular occasion when Hall caught a nice break from Scarlett about 20 out in front.

Jones must've said, that he did look at it, and Eade responded very sharply "No you didn't!"

Congrats Liam on receiving your first public Rocket from Rocket!! :D

[Desipura]

I noticed 3 things about Jones last night:
He lead to the right spots a number of occasions (through the corridor) and was 5 metres free. Gilbee on at least 2 occasions ignored him.

Secondly, Hall kicked to Jones on at least 3 occasions, the grubber kick to him the 1st, a one on one kick and the short pass in the last quarter.

Once his teammates have more faith in Jones (like Hall does) he will get more of the ball and we will get to see one of his real strengths, contested marking.

Thirdly, he does chase and would not be at all surprised if he stays in the side. Its not like we have another tall marking target up forward.

[LostDoggy]

I noticed 3 things about Jones last night:
He lead to the right spots a number of occasions (through the corridor) and was 5 metres free. Gilbee on at least 2 occasions ignored him.

Annoyed me all night, they instead kicked to an outnumbered Hall.

[Rocco Jones]

Another fan of Jones.

Funny that a lot of us (definitely me included) had doubts over playing an extra tall as our forward line was already lack defensive pressure but our two young talls in Jones and Grant have just about been our forward defensive pressure leaders.

[Mantis]

Someone asked me last night who you would prefer in your team to play our first final: Brad Johnson or Liam Jones.

I went for Jones.

[Rocco Jones]

Someone asked me last night who you would prefer in your team to play our first final: Brad Johnson or Liam Jones.

I went for Jones.

I definitely agree.

[LostDoggy]

I think he's been great, he chases hard and doesn't give up - a couple of times he didn't actually touch the player running, but put enough pressure on them to affect their kicks. That's all you can ask from a chase, I think a lot of his teammates can learn a bit from him.

He seems to know where the goals are, which is a good sign as well.

[LostDog]

He looks the same colour as Hulk Hogan I reckon. Sort of an orangybecauseI'vebeeninthesunlamptoolong shade.

Beware the politics of Tasmanian Aboriginal Heritage,
I know Bobby Jones well, he was the manager for the Palawa Aboriginal Basketball team for a while.
White Blonde or Ginger with blue eyes in Tasmania are generally aboriginal funny enough

[Greystache]

He just chases & chases. A few teammates could learn something from him.


Someone asked me last night who you would prefer in your team to play our first final: Brad Johnson or Liam Jones.

I went for Jones.

Beat me to it, we should make him captain, at least we'd finally have a captain that would play for the team. As a bonus he may even stand up for us on the big stage.

[mighty_west]

The LJ Express keeps rolling along, he would have been earmarked to play one game in the Doggies line up, he earn't his 4th game in a row after last night imo, love his attack, pressure skills, INTENSITY which what makes this kid so exciting.

When he truly believes he is a perminent 22 player, and eventually finds his mark, players get used to him etc etc, watch him explode.

[cnmin2]

Yes I noticed quite a few times his leads being ignored.Geelong players seem to try and bring their young players into the game,perhaps some of our leaders need to have a look at themselves.It was a long trip home last night.

[Desipura]

And most on this forum were stirring me for jumping on so early....;)
I dont talk up a player so early in their career, in fact I have not done so on this forum...ever!

[Mantis]

And most on this forum were stirring me for jumping on so early....;)
I dont talk up a player so early in their career, in fact I have not done so on this forum...ever!

In the end it always comes down to a pissing contest with you.

[Stevo]

And most on this forum were stirring me for jumping on so early....;)
I dont talk up a player so early in their career, in fact I have not done so on this forum...ever!

Mantis beat me to it but you're not bad at talking yourself up. :)

[LostDoggy]

Beat me to it, we should make him captain, at least we'd finally have a captain that would play for the team. As a bonus he may even stand up for us on the big stage.

You must have only become a bulldog recently or you are suffering memory loss. Johnson has played 300 plus games of which many have been match winners.So you would rather a kid of 3 games in a final over an experienced champion. Jones would be maulled in a final. What other leader do we have?

[Greystache]

You must have only become a bulldog recently or you are suffering memory loss. Johnson has played 300 plus games of which many have been match winners.So you would rather a kid of 3 games in a final over an experienced champion. Jones would be maulled in a final. What other leader do we have?

Brad Johnson- 11 career finals against top 4 teams, 13 goals, 1 game out of 11 he collected more than 20 possessions. That was at his peak, yet somehow you think he's going to reverse that trend after 360 games and carrying a crippling injury. Seriously do you watch the game with your hands over your eyes?

[LostDoggy]

Brad Johnson- 11 career finals against top 4 teams, 13 goals, 1 game out of 11 he collected more than 20 possessions. That was at his peak, yet somehow you think he's going to reverse that trend after 360 games and carrying a crippling injury. Seriously do you watch the game with your hands over your eyes?

Did Johnson play well the previous 2 weeks?
Does you think he might need more games to get back to his high level
Did Johnson have the flu?
Was he feeling the effects of the wet/hard game last week?(6 day break)
Was he a victim of poor delivery to the forward line when it finally got down there?

[Desipura]

In the end it always comes down to a pissing contest with you.
Lighten up Mantis, your posts seem a little angry of recent times.:)
Its only one game..... You will move on, you have to for your own sake.
How about responding to how I saw his game, you tend to pick and choose something that irks you before you respond.

[Desipura]

Mantis beat me to it but you're not bad at talking yourself up. :)
You have misunderstood me Stevo. People were stirring say I am infactuated with the guy, I am just stating there was a reason why I rated him. I dont generally jump on Brendan Stack appreciation threads, I just jump on players I rate.
Sorry if you see that as talking myself up. I did not recruit him, the recruiters did all the work.

[Mofra]

He showed tremendous potential last night, needs to be a little more aware of teams mates when he is going for the ball. He ended up spoiling his own team mates a few times, but hey 3 game, aged 19, and still learning.
There was one contest whene Hall & Jones spoled each other, and I didn't mind it TBH. Two tall forwards who were both leading to the best spot - shows the kid knows where to run to.

If Hahn's role was to be the no 2 tall this year, Jones has now taken that role and is mobile neough to play on the HF line when a ruckman is resting down there.

He chases, and he spreads from Hall to split the tall opposition defenders. I don't think we can ask any more of him at this stage.

[SlimPickens]

I like Jones and see him in our 22 come finals. What has really impressed me is his speed off the mark, the ability to apply pressure and his field kicking. He certainly didn't look out of his depth against the cats, and playing on the G with plenty of space to run around will suit him.

[Curly5]

There was one contest when Hall & Jones spoiled each other, and I didn't mind it TBH. Two tall forwards who were both leading to the best spot - shows the kid knows where to run to.

If Hahn's role was to be the no 2 tall this year, Jones has now taken that role and is mobile neough to play on the HF line when a ruckman is resting down there.

He chases, and he spreads from Hall to split the tall opposition defenders. I don't think we can ask any more of him at this stage.

I did mind that, it's not Jones' business to get in Hall's way. Age before beauty. ;) And with what transpired subsequently, a goal at that stage might have helped... might... Otherwise Jones seems to be progressing nicely.

[LostDoggy]

I like Jones and see him in our 22 come finals. What has really impressed me is his speed off the mark, the ability to apply pressure and his field kicking. He certainly didn't look out of his depth against the cats, and playing on the G with plenty of space to run around will suit him.

He was playing on a last minute replacement who has played about as many games as he.

To play CHF in a Final is a big ask for a raw 19 year old. It is fine to say he chases hard (and he does) but their is lot more expected of him in that position.

[Mantis]

He was playing on a last minute replacement who has played about as many games as he.

To play CHF in a Final is a big ask for a raw 19 year old. It is fine to say he chases hard (and he does) but their is lot more expected of him in that position.

On what we have seen this year would who prefer him (Jones) or Hahn playing a forward role in a final on the MCG?

[bornadog]

You have misunderstood me Stevo. People were stirring say I am infactuated with the guy, I am just stating there was a reason why I rated him. I dont generally jump on Brendan Stack appreciation threads, I just jump on players I rate.
Sorry if you see that as talking myself up. I did not recruit him, the recruiters did all the work.

maybe it was that tattoo of Jones on your arm:D

[stefoid]

Jones has shown enough to be in Eades plans from game#1 next year. Same with Grant.

Next year our forward planning will revolve around having Hall, Grant and Jones all in the same forward line on a permanent basis!!

:D

From what Roughead has shown, we should be looking to get as many games into him as possible as well. 2011 will be Hudson backed my whichever of Roughead and Minson are playing the best, and I think that will probably be Roughhead. 2012 will probably see a Minson/Roughhead combo in action.

[SlimPickens]

He was playing on a last minute replacement who has played about as many games as he.

To play CHF in a Final is a big ask for a raw 19 year old. It is fine to say he chases hard (and he does) but their is lot more expected of him in that position.


That's true, He did also spend time on Mackie and Milburn. Regardless of who played on him IMO i think he should start CHF round 1 of the finals. I know its a big ask but i've seen nothing to suggest that he isn't upto it. Collingwood has palced a lot of faith in their kids this year for great reward, J. Brown was only a kid during Brisbanes successful years.

Let's "expose" this kid and see what he can come up with. I'll be backing him.

[LostDoggy]

On what we have seen this year would who prefer him (Jones) or Hahn playing a forward role in a final on the MCG?

Not Hahn

I would prefer to have Hall play further up or return Murphy who provides issues for the opposition in matching like for like.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against Jones. I simply believe at this stage of his career he is too raw. Comparisons with Jonathon Brown at that age are unfair. Brown was light years ahead in maturity and ability.

[SlimPickens]

Comparisons with Jonathon Brown at that age are unfair. Brown was light years ahead in maturity and ability.

Not trying to compare him to Brown, more the situation. At one point or another you need to back your kids and they were simple examples which have paid dividends

[Sockeye Salmon]

I'm with EJ Smith on this one. Jones is a talent but finals is for now, not the future and as good as Jones is going to be, right now he's a 3 game rookie.

Having said that, Jones is ahead of Hahn, I'm not sure there's a finals place for either of them. Our depth is almost non-existant, though, so if we are missing one or two Jones might end up playing by default.

[Greystache]

Not trying to compare him to Brown, more the situation. At one point or another you need to back your kids and they were simple examples which have paid dividends

That's a good point. J. Brown was a 19 year old mobile and somewhat light CHF who would push up the ground and also be a foil inside 50m for the powerhouse Lynch, which either made it harder for the opposition key defenders to double and triple team him, or left Brown unmarked and he could punish them on the scoreboard. Sounds pretty familiar?

Also while Grant might be tall and will perhaps one day develop into a key forward at the moment he plays as a half forward/crumbing forward who applies defensive pressure in our forward line. So in effect he's basically playing the small forward role for us.

[mighty_west]

I'm with EJ Smith on this one. Jones is a talent but finals is for now, not the future and as good as Jones is going to be, right now he's a 3 game rookie.

Having said that, Jones is ahead of Hahn, I'm not sure there's a finals place for either of them. Our depth is almost non-existant, though, so if we are missing one or two Jones might end up playing by default.

The problem is though, we need to play key forwards especially against the Pies, to make their running off defenders accountable, otherwise they will just cut us up.

I also like Jones ahead of Hahn, but if neither play, who then?

Could we go with Lake up forward along with Hall for the majority of the game and just back our mids in? Do we use Roughead up forward whilst Huddo is taking the ruck?

[Mofra]

Roughy forward against the Pies worries me - we need an injection of pace against Collingwood, and given they play 1 ruck we may not play 2 against them anyway (we went Hudson alone vs Jamar earlier on in the year with Everitt & Williams as pinch hitters, and Williams got another go late against North for experience).

Jones adds pace & real defensive pressure in the F50, and splits the tall defenders to give Hall more chance of a 1 on 1 contest - what he offers the side currently outweighs his ability as a raw 19 year old KPP and I'd like to see him stay in for that reason.

[Greystache]

Do we use Roughead up forward whilst Huddo is taking the ruck?

I've really liked the look of Roughead up forward, it's just his goal kicking that's really let him down. Another preseaon working on it and I think he'll be a viable option.

[Sockeye Salmon]

The problem is though, we need to play key forwards especially against the Pies, to make their running off defenders accountable, otherwise they will just cut us up.



The forwards don't need to be big, they just need to spread.

[bornadog]

That's a good point. J. Brown was a 19 year old mobile and somewhat light CHF who would push up the ground and also be a foil inside 50m for the powerhouse Lynch, which either made it harder for the opposition key defenders to double and triple team him, or left Brown unmarked and he could punish them on the scoreboard. Sounds pretty familiar?

Also while Grant might be tall and will perhaps one day develop into a key forward at the moment he plays as a half forward/crumbing forward who applies defensive pressure in our forward line. So in effect he's basically playing the small forward role for us.

I donot see him playing (currently) as a small forward at all. I think he has been playing tall, leading but getting ignored. He does chase hard. Grant who is around 193cm, does play small.

[Greystache]

while Grant might be tall and will perhaps one day develop into a key forward at the moment he plays as a half forward/crumbing forward who applies defensive pressure in our forward line. So in effect he's basically playing the small forward role for us.


I donot see him playing (currently) as a small forward at all. I think he has been playing tall, leading but getting ignored. He does chase hard. Grant who is around 193cm, does play small.

So... Does that mean you agree with my comment that Grant has been playing more like a small forward or not?? :confused::confused:

[Bulldog4life]

Roughy forward against the Pies worries me - we need an injection of pace against Collingwood, and given they play 1 ruck we may not play 2 against them anyway (we went Hudson alone vs Jamar earlier on in the year with Everitt & Williams as pinch hitters, and Williams got another go late against North for experience).

Jones adds pace & real defensive pressure in the F50, and splits the tall defenders to give Hall more chance of a 1 on 1 contest - what he offers the side currently outweighs his ability as a raw 19 year old KPP and I'd like to see him stay in for that reason.

Strangely too I've noticed lately that regularly Eade has been playing 2 Ruckmen on the ground at the same time!

[bornadog]

So... Does that mean you agree with my comment that Grant has been playing more like a small forward or not?? :confused::confused:

Yes I agree.

Sorry, I was talking about Liam not playing small. I should learn to read properly:p

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Roughy forward against the Pies worries me - we need an injection of pace against Collingwood, and given they play 1 ruck we may not play 2 against them anyway (we went Hudson alone vs Jamar earlier on in the year with Everitt & Williams as pinch hitters, and Williams got another go late against North for experience).

Jones adds pace & real defensive pressure in the F50, and splits the tall defenders to give Hall more chance of a 1 on 1 contest - what he offers the side currently outweighs his ability as a raw 19 year old KPP and I'd like to see him stay in for that reason.

Let's face it the poor form this year of Hahn, Johnson, Akermanis and Higgins has dramatically changed the composition of our forward line. Thank God for Hall who has been our one shining light with good support from Grant most of the time. Gia's form has picked up in recent games. Liam Jones is a work in progress and needs to be retained.
The suggested move of Lake is futile given the strength of opposition attacks in the finals.
The only possible X factor is to move Murphy to half forward as he has the class to worry defences. We would unfortunately take some form of penalty given his good form down back but sadly we have few other worthy options.

[Mofra]

Let's face it the poor form this year of Hahn, Johnson, Akermanis and Higgins has dramatically changed the composition of our forward line. Thank God for Hall who has been our one shining light with good support from Grant most of the time. Gia's form has picked up in recent games. Liam Jones is a work in progress and needs to be retained.
The suggested move of Lake is futile given the strength of opposition attacks in the finals.
The only possible X factor is to move Murphy to half forward as he has the class to worry defences. We would unfortunately take some form of penalty given his good form down back but sadly we have few other worthy options.
To a degree Grant has been playing in the Murphy style at HF, except he runs forward and crumbs quite well too (probably doesn't have Murph's tank at this stage which is understandable). Murph's HF form was poor before the switch to an attacking backline role which has rejuvinated his season. I have been very imporessed with Gia over the last two months as well.

On Jones, what he offers to us is exactly what we need in terms of our F50 weakness this year - pressure on the opposition, and an ability to drag a tall defender away from Hall, giving him space or a one on one contest. You have said (rightly) that poor form of others has given him and Grant opportunity, but both guys have grabbed that opportunity with both hands in a way Hill hasn't this year.

Ditto Roughy - his kicking for goal is terrible, but if someone had of said that a 19 year old coming off an interrupted pre-season, who played half a season of VFL last year would be able to stamp himself as the no 2 ruckman I would have laughed. Some kids just take the opportunities that come to them and run with it.

[Raw Toast]

To a degree Grant has been playing in the Murphy style at HF, except he runs forward and crumbs quite well too (probably doesn't have Murph's tank at this stage which is understandable). Murph's HF form was poor before the switch to an attacking backline role which has rejuvinated his season. I have been very imporessed with Gia over the last two months as well.

On Jones, what he offers to us is exactly what we need in terms of our F50 weakness this year - pressure on the opposition, and an ability to drag a tall defender away from Hall, giving him space or a one on one contest. You have said (rightly) that poor form of others has given him and Grant opportunity, but both guys have grabbed that opportunity with both hands in a way Hill hasn't this year.

Ditto Roughy - his kicking for goal is terrible, but if someone had of said that a 19 year old coming off an interrupted pre-season, who played half a season of VFL last year would be able to stamp himself as the no 2 ruckman I would have laughed. Some kids just take the opportunities that come to them and run with it.

Great post Mofra.

Grant's been vital as a Murphy-CHF-link player, and has also been able to contribute with super-fast hands around packs and with crumbing the ball as well. His speed and pressure has been up amongst our best as well, though his tackles are still shrugged off too often. His inaccuracy with set shots is also becoming a concern (opposition teams might zone off and give him difficult shots - he just needs to play on or get Higgins to come in and kick them :)).

Jones has been a bit of a revelation to me. His willingness to run and pressure defenders has been great, and while I would have laughed off his chances of seeing September action, if he can keep doing that I'd keep him in the team.

I'm not convinced about Roughy in the finals. He's done well but I don't think he's ready for the added speed and intensity, and I think Minson's stronger body will be useful (though there is a good case to be made for playing neither against certain teams as well).

[stefoid]

Jones and roughead are the third and 4th youngest on our list, respectively, just behind Tutt and Howard, and they are likely to play finals this year.

[LostDoggy]

Jones and roughead are the third and 4th youngest on our list, respectively, just behind Tutt and Howard, and they are likely to play finals this year.

That just goes to show how much of a future we have to look forward too.

[OLD SCRAGGer]

That just goes to show how much of a future we have to look forward too.

Couldn't agree more, but you watch some on here find some negative out of it!!:mad: so bloody annoying:mad:

[Hotdog60]

I addition to Jones could we see a Rose or Hooper taking over from Johnson as that lead up forward. If Johnno doesn't go on next year, the forward line will look very different to last year.

It will start to look very youthful.

[Murphy'sLore]

It will start to look very youthful.

Let's hope it also looks very useful...:)

[LostDoggy]

Couldn't agree more, but you watch some on here find some negative out of it!!:mad: so bloody annoying:mad:
Couldn't agree more, I got on here because Big Footy was so bad. I'm like you always got my rose coloured glasses on. Some of the criticism deep down I know is probably warranted, but a lot is way over the top. I can not bag anybody who plays for us, like Aker I grew to love him, but now I don't have the time of day for him. It would be nice to have a separate forum for no bagging. Like you the bulldogs never lose on my tv.

[Murphy'sLore]

Couldn't agree more, I got on here because Big Footy was so bad. I'm like you always got my rose coloured glasses on. Some of the criticism deep down I know is probably warranted, but a lot is way over the top. I can not bag anybody who plays for us, like Aker I grew to love him, but now I don't have the time of day for him. It would be nice to have a separate forum for no bagging. Like you the bulldogs never lose on my tv.

Can you tell me where to get myself one of those?

[LostDoggy]

Can you tell me where to get myself one of those?
They are free when you have followed the Bulldogs for 59 years and never left a game early, boy is that a gluton for punishment.

[Murphy'sLore]

I hope the boys can bring it home, for the faithful like you OB. God knows you've earned it.

[LostDoggy]

I hope the boys can bring it home, for the faithful like you OB. God knows you've earned it.
I'll drink to that (and I don't even drink !)

[azabob]

Liam Jones had a very promising debut season playing 5 games and if not some poor disposal in round 22 against Essendon he may have got the nod ahead of Hahn for the finals.

2011 shapes as an exciting year for Jones, or does it?

Jones will be competing for spots in the forward line with Hall, Hahn, Minson / Roughead, Murphy, Grant, also Everitt and Hill depending on the trade period.

We need to get games into him for when Hall retires but with each new season run through the midfield becomes more vital.

Murphy is by far our best lead up forward but Murphy also adds great run and dare from defence. Can Jones and Grant provide the same lead up options that Murphy does allowing Murphy to play down back?

With also the possible changes with restricted rotations this adds another variable to the scenario – Minson missing out completely and Roughead spending more time up forward.

For what its worth if he can play 12-15 games and a final or 2 it will be a great outcome for him.

[LostDoggy]

Liam Jones had a very promising debut season playing 5 games and if not some poor disposal in round 22 against Essendon he may have got the nod ahead of Hahn for the finals.

2011 shapes as an exciting year for Jones, or does it?

Jones will be competing for spots in the forward line with Hall, Hahn, Minson / Roughead, Murphy, Grant, also Everitt and Hill depending on the trade period.

We need to get games into him for when Hall retires but with each new season run through the midfield becomes more vital.

Murphy is by far our best lead up forward but Murphy also adds great run and dare from defence. Can Jones and Grant provide the same lead up options that Murphy does allowing Murphy to play down back?

With also the possible changes with restricted rotations this adds another variable to the scenario – Minson missing out completely and Roughead spending more time up forward.

For what its worth if he can play 12-15 games and a final or 2 it will be a great outcome for him.

Definitely think Jones can add the same leading up forward, we seen it in glimpses this season. He is a very smart footballer & knows where to lead, he already has the big frame, which means it's harder for defenders to get around him to spoil.

What gives Jones a massive up side, is that he is quick & is very handy at ground level. He isn't the type of forward that gives nothing once it hits the deck, he basically turns into another swooping half forward player (much like Murph).

I think Jones, Grant, Roughy & Hall can all work together in the same forward line, i think we tested that this season& it worked ok. Grant is still very light frame, so is basically a quick roving flanker at the moment, even though he is tall.

[stefoid]

Fast track him, aim to play 22+ games next year.

[bornadog]

Fast track him, aim to play 22+ games next year.

Jones and Hooper in from round 1

[hujsh]

Jones and Hooper in from round 1

I'm not so sure about Hooper. He showed a bit of passion with that goal but didn't look like doing much that game before or after. Maybe if he shows good form pre-season but personally I'm not buying the hype around him yet.

The defensive pressure looked good though

[gohardorgohome]

Fast track him, aim to play 22+ games next year.

Agreed. I'm very impressed by him so far.'needs as much games times as possible.

[Mantis]

Showed some very good signs this year and probably proved to be further advanced than previously thought.

He needs to improve his aerobic capabilities, which given his age will improve. He also needs to improve his kicking which was at best average this year, but overall there is a fair bit to work with.

[LostDoggy]

He's still a kid and so we can't be relying on him to hold down a key position next year. Need to be careful with his development.

[Greystache]

Hopefully this preseason he can put a bit of muscle on his upper body and increase his aerobic capacity and I think he can have a bit of an impact, he's already quite strong through the legs, is genuinely quick, and is a very strong contested mark.

Certainly the best KPF prospect we've had in a long time.

[Mofra]

I'm still a fan of his, and did not expect him to debut this year given he was a 19 year old who played school football for most of last year.
He adds height, defensive pressure and demands a tall backman. What he offers us as a side exceeds his playing ability at this point in time, which will imporve with more senior gametime. He'd have to fancy his chances of stamping himself a best 22 player next year after a big pre-season.

[Dazza]

I have no doubt in my mind the kid will make it. Him Roughead and Grant seem certainties. On that note does anyone think we paid overs for Cordy?

[The Coon Dog]

I have no doubt in my mind the kid will make it. Him Roughead and Grant seem certainties. On that note does anyone think we paid overs for Cordy?

Bit early to tell. I guess time will tell, but right now I'm reasonably comfortable with what we did.

[Bumper Bulldogs]

He's still a kid and so we can't be relying on him to hold down a key position next year. Need to be careful with his development.

Why note Richmond did it this year and he won the coleman medal.

I hope that he could play with Barry next year and learn from the master.

[ReLoad]

I have no doubt in my mind the kid will make it. Him Roughead and Grant seem certainties. On that note does anyone think we paid overs for Cordy?

Can see why you would think that, but the flip side wasn't worth it, Saints bid early first round for him, so realistically was a good deal for us to nab him.

With his frame, id expect him to get his shoulders sorted (aka Andrew Walker) then come out and show us his promise.

Talls take a while to deliver, Kreuzer is a good example of that, even Nic Nat was a huge disappointment this year.