In's and Out's - Preliminary Final

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Selection will be interesting this week. At most, there will probably only be the one change for that final position in the squad. Callan, Everitt, Hill and Williams all in the mix.

Callan - Played OK tonight albeit making a few little errors. A lot may depend on whether we decide to err on the side of attack or defence against St. Kilda. He certainly could be handy to play a role on Milne or Schneider. Not going to give us much in the way of rebound, but perhaps gives us a harder defensive edge and releases Hargrave/Gilbee.

Everitt - The Saints have a pretty tall squad across the ground with Riewoldt, Kosi and Gardiner spending time up forward. In their back half, Goddard, Gilbert and Dawson all have plenty of size about them too. Everitt gives us a little more versatility and is perhaps a bit of a wild card. He would be an interesting selection and could trouble them IMO.

Hill - Looks out of favour but if he performs well tomorrow then there's always the chance he'll get a recall. I'd like to see Hill play a lot more on the wing than he has so far this season if selected. His ability to run all day, find space and conetst in the air would be handy. I'd prefer him as a winger floating forward, rather than the other way around. If he's played primarily as a forward - he'll struggle against the bigger bodied defenders that the St. Kilda team has.

Williams - From all reports is tracking along OK and if needed will be able to play next week. Is he worth the risk? Not sure he's shown the form required this season, despite playing pretty good v The Lions in Round 20. If ever there's a time to bring him in, it would be for this one though. Might even be an option up forward? We may have to try something a little different to our previous two encounters and I would not be against trying Williams as a FF at all.

[Mantis]

Much will depend on how Williams goes today and Riewoldt match up.

Very easy to speculate at the moment, but I might wait til after the Willi game before delving too deeply into it.

[G-Mo77]

I really think everyone earnt their spot last night. It will be all to do with matcups at the selection table. Williams is a big chance next Friday. I wouldn't know who would be the unlucky one if he came back.

Good chance there is no change at all.

[GVGjr]

I really think everyone earnt their spot last night. It will be all to do with matcups at the selection table. Williams is a big chance next Friday. I wouldn't know who would be the unlucky one if he came back.

Good chance there is no change at all.

Players like Hahn, Giansiracusa and Griffen all answered the challenge however, Welsh and Callan could be under the hammer depending on who performs with Williamstown today.

[G-Mo77]

I thought Welsh did a pretty good but thankless job last night.

[Topdog]

Too many TO's for Welsh, his kicking was terrible last night. Don't think Bob covered himself in glory.

[G-Mo77]

Too many TO's for Welsh, his kicking was terrible last night. Don't think Bob covered himself in glory.

Bob couldn't land get a decent kick all night. I'm thinking it has more to do with the Jab he got. He started getting onto a few decent kicks in the 4th. He almost kicked one from outside 50 and I don't think anyone at the ground would have even given him a chance to make the distance.

Welsh did have a few TO's but thought he played his role quite well.

[Bumper Bulldogs]

Good spot to be in and as always some ones going to feel unlucky, for me Hill wont get in as we need as much defensive pressure as possible. No change for mine if everybody's fit.

The concern is Griff, if he's not right that stuff's things a little.

[G-Mo77]

The concern is Griff, if he's not right that stuff's things a little.

Corky, should be fine according to Eade.

[Bumper Bulldogs]

Corky, should be fine according to Eade.

Well do we believe everything that Rocket lets go to print?

He did look proppy after the game.

[bulldogtragic]

Too many TO's for Welsh, his kicking was terrible last night. Don't think Bob covered himself in glory.
That kick where Welsh looked up and still bombed it into the chest of an unmanned Brisbane player was on of the worsty kicks i have ever seen, ever.

[The Coon Dog]

That kick where Welsh looked up and still bombed it into the chest of an unmanned Brisbane player was on of the worsty kicks i have ever seen, ever.

My first thought was that he must have seen the blue on the jumper & assumed it was one of our players. He was about the only bloke within a 100 metres & Welshy spotted him up beautifully.

[Desipura]

If Williams comes in, it would most likely be at the expense of Welsh or Callan. I like the idea of having 2 smalls on Schneider & Milne so Callan stays in. Therefore Welsh makes way for Williams as I think we have the coverage for Welsh up forward but do not have enough height down back for Kosi and Riewoldt. Will allow us to use Morris and Hargreave as 3rd men up in a marking contest which is important.

[bornadog]

If Williams comes in, it would most likely be at the expense of Welsh or Callan. I like the idea of having 2 smalls on Schneider & Milne so Callan stays in. Therefore Welsh makes way for Williams as I think we have the coverage for Welsh up forward but do not have enough height down back for Kosi and Riewoldt. Will allow us to use Morris and Hargreave as 3rd men up in a marking contest which is important.

I agree, Desi, I thought Callan started off very slowly but started to get into the rhythm of things as the game went on. Lets face it was only his second game for the year. We need Callan to pick up Schneider.

Paul Williams just on SEN and said Griff is fine, kicked himself in the shin, and will be ok. He said ill is a chance to come in next week, but I guess we have to see how players perform today at Willi.

What does every one think about Everitt picking up Goddard?

[bulldogtragic]

I agree, Desi, I thought Callan started off very slowly but started to get into the rhythm of things as the game went on. Lets face it was only his second game for the year. We need Callan to pick up Schneider.

Paul Williams just on SEN and said Griff is fine, kicked himself in the shin, and will be ok. He said ill is a chance to come in next week, but I guess we have to see how players perform today at Willi.

What does every one think about Everitt picking up Goddard?
I would like to see Harbrow and Gilbee rotate on Goddard. Assuming the back 5 is Lake, Morris, Hargy, Callan, Williams/Welsh, we have have Gilbee and Harbrow to play of HB and the other on HF or rotating. Harbrow looked very dangerous up forward last night when he went up there and if he gets space Goddard might have to play him tighter. Same with Gilbee, although he has a bigger body and when he gets space at 50, we can usually mark down a goal. Others have suggested Higgins for Goddard, but i'd prefer these guys with very good foot skills getting some free time from Goddard for either shots at goal or hitting up our forwards. The key to winning is not bombing the all into the forwardline and these two kicking clinicians will assist in that strategy if they are forward and getting latitude from Goddard and are quick enough to stay with him to keep him honest too.

As for Dre, i'm not sure he can demand a spot back in the side. If Williams plays OK, i would like him in for Welsh, with Callan staying for Schneider. Therefore i'm not too sure who else we can drop?

[anfo27]

If Williams does alright today then he has to come in for Welsh, his kicking last night was woeful.
Seeing Harbrow go forward was interesting, we do need his pace to put on pressure up there but we need his run out of defence also. Any chance we can clone Harbrow by next Friday?

[mjp]

Why all the love for Williams?

It is not like he was actually contributing in a positive way when he was last in the side...

Our continued fascination with this player amazes me. Gia struggles coming back from injury and is crucified - Williams permanently struggles and is nominated for coronation.

[bornadog]

Why all the love for Williams?

It is not like he was actually contributing in a positive way when he was last in the side...

Our continued fascination with this player amazes me. Gia struggles coming back from injury and is crucified - Williams permanently struggles and is nominated for coronation.

So you think we should be ok to cover the Saints talls, and go in with more midfield types?

[mjp]

So you think we should be ok to cover the Saints talls, and go in with more midfield types?

To me, Williams isn't up to it - especially coming off yet another injury.

I would rather back Morris and Lake to do the job and throw in an extra runner than chuck Williams in there just because they are tall. If St Kilda throw Gardiner or King forward and we are that worried about height, here's a radical idea - stick OUR resting ruckman on them.

[bornadog]

To me, Williams isn't up to it - especially coming off yet another injury.

I would rather back Morris and Lake to do the job and throw in an extra runner than chuck Williams in there just because they are tall. If St Kilda throw Gardiner or King forward and we are that worried about height, here's a radical idea - stick OUR resting ruckman on them.

You know MJP, I agree with that, Williams has had a poor year and I doubt he would be ready for next Friday.

What do you think of Everitt coming in for Welsh?

[mjp]

You know MJP, I agree with that, Williams has had a poor year and I doubt he would be ready for next Friday.

What do you think of Everitt coming in for Welsh?

Don't really mind that idea. Given the Callan in, Hill out selection and Everitt's occasional reluctance to stick his head over the ball, I think it is unlikely though.

I would guess we will be unchanged if there are no injuries.

[bulldogtragic]

Peter Larkins says a full list to pick from with Griffen, Reid and Williams both available if needed/selected.

[Max469]

You know MJP, I agree with that, Williams has had a poor year and I doubt he would be ready for next Friday.

What do you think of Everitt coming in for Welsh?

Make no change or Everitt can run and play on the wing.

Because we don't have the big bodies they do, we need to out run them. Back each up - tackle hard, have someone to crumb and don't leave the goal square empty. Too many missed opportunities have come from having no one there.

No love for Williams at the moment either - sorry. There are others who are fit and would not be focusing on whether they are going to get injured again or not. Williams never goes well on his first game back and rarely gets criticized for his poor efforts first game back - unlike those who let Bobby and Gia have it.

Get over the love for Williams - we have a Grandfinal just waiting for us to be in.

Most of all - Play to win, get off to a good start, run, run, run and BELIEVE.

If all else fails - Take out Roo and Kosi ;)

[LostDoggy]

Make no change or Everitt can run and play on the wing.



Most of all - Play to win, get off to a good start, run, run, run and BELIEVE.

If all else fails - Take out Roo and Kosi ;)

Well Max469, I have to VooDoo dolls out now, and I plan to use them :D

[Jasper]

Assuming all fit, no changes. But I'd like to see Everitt come in a FF/Ruck forward half to rotate with Minson, and have someone well over 6t with overhead marking (as well as speed and good long kicking skills) A key to breaking St Kilda I think is having players with speed to run through their zone, long kicks to kick over the zone or be able to take overhead contested marks. Everitt has all these abilities, Welsh doesn't, so I'd like to see Everitt in and Welsh out.

Agree with earlier posts on Williams, no point playing the guy when he's not ready. He really worries when the ball comes in fast and he is one on one. Also gives away frees close to goal and is not great overhead. Don't think he offers a lot. And if Eade follows his own advice when referring to tall forwards (don't pick them just because they are tall), then Williams should not play.

[BulldogBelle]

No changes - unless a forced one if Griffen doesn't come up, then Everitt would be my choice to come in.

[LostDoggy]

No changes - unless a forced one if Griffen doesn't come up, then Everitt would be my choice to come in.

Yep 100% agree.

More than any other game for the year winning the clearances is going to be crucial.
Making the most of our opportunities up forward - and locking the ball in. Forward line pressure like we showed against Geelong (rd 21) and the Pies (rd 22).

Bring it on!!!

[ledge]

No changes after the Willy game, it was horrid and none of the player stood up to say i want in!

[boydogs]

No changes - unless a forced one if Griffen doesn't come up, then Everitt would be my choice to come in.

+1 :)

[Templeton31]

What about 'king' Tom in to go on kosi. To me that allow Morris to drop down onto Milne. Hargy, harbrow, gilbee remain free then and also we have 3 bigs to rotate on riewoldt, kosi and when Gardner comes down. Welsh the man to make way.

[bulldogtragic]

What about 'king' Tom in to go on kosi. To me that allow Morris to drop down onto Milne. Hargy, harbrow, gilbee remain free then and also we have 3 bigs to rotate on riewoldt, kosi and when Gardner comes down. Welsh the man to make way.
I'm with you T31. Better match-ups for mine.

[LostDoggy]

Williams to come in for mine, he is needed.

We have to take a risk and play him, if we don't we are throwing Morris to the wolves. Morris has chipped away during his career by playing on taller opponents, but we can all see he can't keep doing it all the time. Williams coming in will relieve a lot of pressure from him & also Lake, it's a risk i think we should take.

We all seen what happened to Morris against Hawthorn last season, when Buddy tore him apart. Riewoldt will do exactly the same thing, if Morris is given the job, with no support.

Not sure who is exactly the one to be dropped, but someone needs to make way in my opinion.

[Templeton31]

the only other possibility is that I seem to remember Hargy has done a good job on riewoldt in the past? Is that right?

[Mantis]

the only other possibility is that I seem to remember Hargy has done a good job on riewoldt in the past? Is that right?

I can't remember such a thing happening and would not like to see this match-up eventuate.

[BulldogBelle]

We are the highest scoring team in the AFL

We are much more dangerous when Gilbee and Hargrave can attack, and arent playing pure negating roles

Think Williams if 100% fit can provide a decent option on Reiwolt, and possibly play on a rest Gardiner or King. Its a gamble we have to take.

Out
Welsh

In
Williams

Welsh hasen't realy done anything wrong, although we need Williams height against a taller opposition in St Kilda

Callan stays to provide an opponent for Schnieder or Milne, and also to throw himself in front on the St Kilda big guys in Rielwolt and Kosi, and provide a 3rd man up in these contests

[Mantis]

At this point in time I would say no change.

Morris to follow Riewoldt around and Lake to Kosi.

If Tom was an established and reliable player he would be a certainty, but he is probably just as likely to stink it up coming off a months break.

[Rocco Jones]

At this point in time I would say no change.

Morris to follow Riewoldt around and Lake to Kosi.

If Tom was an established and reliable player he would be a certainty, but he is probably just as likely to stink it up coming off a months break.

I keep on changing my mind but I agree with that right now. :)

I trust Callan against a small forward more than I do Williams against a tall one. Playing Williams means Morris takes a smaller opponent, which doesn't leave much room for Timmy. I really hope we try to expose Milne going the other way by putting Shaggy or Harbrow on him.

[Before I Die]

I think Williams will come in. The line from Eade was always that he would come back through the VFL. I suspect the the coaches were just happy to see him get through the game and were not overly fussed about his form (which wasn't too bad). Not too sure who will go out, probably Callan, maybe Welsh. Eade has been pretty consistent with regard to who his best 22 has been all year and it has Williams at CHB.

[LostDoggy]

I'd like to see Williams play this week, but I don't think they'd drop Callan. I think they played him last week to get some game time in him at this level so he is ready for the prelim. Why else would they bringt him in the side if they haven't gone with him all year. Even Addison has been picked ahead of him throughout the season.

[LostDoggy]

Based on Williams game on Saturday the St Kilda forwards would murder him. He is not ready yet. Why not try something different like Skipper in for Welsh and play him in the goal square, he is capable of kicking a few goals and taking a pack mark, especially if the pressure is intense and some kicks are bombed in the forward 50, we do need to lift our scoring ability against the Saints, we really struggle to score enough against them. We could rest Huddo and Will on the bench.

I am confident our current backline will perform adequately and contain the Saints to a reasonable total, but we have to find a way to score more than we have in our recent history against the Saints to win.

No one in the Willy team tries harder than big Skip and his form has him as a contender for the Liston, whilst this suggestion is left field, do you think there is any merit in it, considering that we must find a way to kick a higher score than we have, and also it gives the Saints defence a true tall to have to worry about.

[LostDoggy]

Skipper in to play FF, is one of the most bizarre calls I've heard so far.

[Before I Die]

There is more chance of the match committee picking me to play at FF than there is of them selecting Skipper. If Williams is considered fit he will come in.

[Mantis]

There is more chance of the match committee picking me to play at FF than there is of them selecting Skipper. If Williams is considered fit he will come in.

Not necessarily.

At best Tom could probably only get through 60% game time coming off his injury which I don't think is enough for a player who is limited to playing in just one area of the ground. Lake & Morris will both be playing upwards of 85% of game time (Lake will probably play >95%) which is what is needed from your key defenders.

[Dry Rot]

Based on Williams game on Saturday the St Kilda forwards would murder him. He is not ready yet.

Agreed. Whoever he is, he's underdone. He's have to be someone Chris Grant or Johnson etc to be brought straight back in and expected to play on one of the opposition's best.


we have to find a way to score more than we have in our recent history against the Saints to win.



IMO this should be our focus. The Saints usually don't kick a high score and IMO our biggest hurdle will be finding ways to kick enough goals, not stopping them.

[Mofra]

The problem with Riewoldt isn't just his height or ability to mark the ball at the highest point of his leap - he covers more ground than most midfielders.

If Williams comes in he will have limited time on him, more liekly spending time on the resting ruckman & Kosi to allow Lake to zone off at times.

This would leave us with Morris, Lake, Williams, Callan, The Brow and Shaggy in the backline, with Gilbee to work up the field as he has done previously. Given the Saints zone & pressure on the ball carrier, is this enough rebounding power to get us enough F50 entries to win the game?

[Sockeye Salmon]

Riewoldt works so hard no single defender can run with him all game.

The only arguement for playing Williams, IMO, is to take Riewoldt for 5-10 minutes in the middle of each quarter when Dale is running around with his tongue hanging out.

The only way to do it would be to use Lake on him for 5 minutes a quarter while Dale 'rests' on Kossie.

[Mantis]

If Williams comes in he will have limited time on him, more likely spending time on the resting ruckman & Kosi to allow Lake to zone off at times.



In watching a bit of St.Kilda over the past month or so they haven't been resting their ruckman in the forwardline that often and even more so since McEvoy was demoted.

[LostDoggy]

I don't think there will be a change but i want Williams back in at the expense of Welsh

[Before I Die]

I actually believe the match committee see Williams as an automatic in if fit. He wasn't dropped, he was injured and the club stated from the outset that the hope was to get him back for the third week of the finals. The fact he didn't have a sensational game on Saturday is neither here or there. He wasn't trying to win a place on form, he was trying to prove his fitness, which he did. If he hasn't pulled up sore he will be in. Whoever goes out will be stiff and it will probably be Callan. Riewoldt won't be the only factor on Friday, but anyone who doesn't acknowledge him as a major factor is kidding themselves. We need Williams in and we need the entire side to play with the desperation of a Tim Callan.

[LostDoggy]

I think Williams is almost a certainty to come in. He just allows us so much more flexibility with our structure down back and if it allows a Hargrave or Lake to play further up field in bursts then it will be a positive for us.
Yes there are concerns on how Williams will adapt to coming straight in for the biggest game of the season against one of the best attacks in the league - but when it comes down to it, I think Eade will roll the dice and bring him in.
Callan will be the unlucky one forced to make way.

[chef]

After watching the replay today on Fox, Welsh out Williams in for me. Welsh struggled to keep up with Brown and Bradshaw when played down back to give Morris/ Lake a rest so he will be needed IMO for Roo and Kosi. Callan is going to be needed for Schneider.

[LostDoggy]

Riewoldt works so hard no single defender can run with him all game.

The only arguement for playing Williams, IMO, is to take Riewoldt for 5-10 minutes in the middle of each quarter when Dale is running around with his tongue hanging out.

The only way to do it would be to use Lake on him for 5 minutes a quarter while Dale 'rests' on Kossie.

Dale cannot take Kosi rfor any lengthy period, resting or not. Simply too short.

We need to be rotating players on these blokes but for most of the time, Lake and Williams because of their height, will be the main ones to tackle the task

Williams does not have the smarts to contest with Riewoldt but he does have the pace.

Providing we can shut Milne out completely, this really means that Riewoldt and Kosi need to kick 5 each for them to be even in the game. With Williams in the side, I'm willing to bet they can't kick that many.

[Axe Man]

the only other possibility is that I seem to remember Hargy has done a good job on riewoldt in the past? Is that right?

The only good thing I remember Shaggy doing on Riewoldt was breaking his collarbone.

[LostDoggy]

The only good thing I remember Shaggy doing on Riewoldt was breaking his collarbone.

That will do

[neodog]

And Gia flooring Kosi will definitely blunt the saints scoring power!

[bornadog]

No Change

[LostDoggy]

The other option of course is, we could see what Ben Harrison is doing these days - I recall he towelled up Riewoldt on one occasion, even running off him and kicking goals

Perhaps Twodogs knows of his whereabouts?:D

[bornadog]

The other option of course is, we could see what Ben Harrison is doing these days - I recall he towelled up Riewoldt on one occasion, even running off him and kicking goals

Perhaps Twodogs knows of his whereabouts?:D

Actually Ben had his measure:D

[Sockeye Salmon]

The other option of course is, we could see what Ben Harrison is doing these days - I recall he towelled up Riewoldt on one occasion, even running off him and kicking goals

Perhaps Twodogs knows of his whereabouts?:D

Riewoldt got dizzy watching Harro go round in circles.

[LostDoggy]

I think Williams is almost a certainty to come in.
Callan will be the unlucky one forced to make way.

I think he might come in too teddy..
But why bring Callan back for the Brisbane game if not to get him ready for the Saints game, and a job on their small forwards?
Some have suggested Welsh will be the unlucky one but he has a lot of finals experience and is pretty versatile.
Could Pickens spot be up for grabs? He seems to be running out of steam a little in the last few weeks.
Its a tough one.

[LostDoggy]

I think he might come in too teddy..
But why bring Callan back for the Brisbane game if not to get him ready for the Saints game, and a job on their small forwards?
Some have suggested Welsh will be the unlucky one but he has a lot of finals experience and is pretty versatile.
Could Pickens spot be up for grabs? He seems to be running out of steam a little in the last few weeks.
Its a tough one.

Agree it is a tough one and whoever misses out is going to feel hard done by.
I really dont think Eade will leave out the experience of Welsh, so then it will come down to Callan / Picken / ??? - Pickers has done some great jobs for us and seems to be quicker than Callan.

I guess we can only wait to see how the match committee sees the match ups and then who is the unlucky one to be left out, but as soon as Williams played last week and got through it unscathed, i didnt think that there was anyway that he would be left out this week.

[jazzadogs]

I agree with those who say that Williams will play because Eade has a "best 22" and he plays that best 22 when fit. Josh Hill was in that team, but let himself down consistently and obviously did not show signs of trying to improve that.

Picken has been in the side all year, so based on the above logic I can't see him being dropped. Callan is possible, although it would be strange to only bring him in for one week.

I'd say Welsh is in most danger, because there was a period where he was out of the team earlier this year (if that was purely because of injury, I apologise). His role seems to be too flexible, with no set position anymore, and he is not what you would label a necessity against St Kilda.
Can't really label Welsh's finals experience as a reason to keep him in, certainly lacked composure on Friday night (that kick to Merrett, the only player inside the 50, after staring at him for 10seconds. Gah.) and hasnt offered much in the forward line for ages.

So. Williams for Welsh, or no change.

But really, I don't think anyone would have correctly guessed the Match Committee's decisions over the course of this year. And guessing is all we are doing.

[GVGjr]

I agree with those who say that Williams will play because Eade has a "best 22" and he plays that best 22 when fit. Josh Hill was in that team, but let himself down consistently and obviously did not show signs of trying to improve that.

Picken has been in the side all year, so based on the above logic I can't see him being dropped. Callan is possible, although it would be strange to only bring him in for one week.

I'd say Welsh is in most danger, because there was a period where he was out of the team earlier this year (if that was purely because of injury, I apologise). His role seems to be too flexible, with no set position anymore, and he is not what you would label a necessity against St Kilda.
Can't really label Welsh's finals experience as a reason to keep him in, certainly lacked composure on Friday night (that kick to Merrett, the only player inside the 50, after staring at him for 10seconds. Gah.) and hasnt offered much in the forward line for ages.

So. Williams for Welsh, or no change.

But really, I don't think anyone would have correctly guessed the Match Committee's decisions over the course of this year. And guessing is all we are doing.

I like your logic and I tend to agree. It will be interesting to see if Eade has the same thoughts. I think it will be hard for him to drop anyone and given Welsh's age it might be a bit harder again.

[Ozza]

Could Pickens spot be up for grabs? He seems to be running out of steam a little in the last few weeks.
Its a tough one.

I would hope not. Picko has had a huge year - and will almost certainly get Montagna on Friday night.

What about the Saints changes? They could well drop Luke Ball this week for his lack of pace - with us being a pacey side. I wouldn't be surprised if he missed. I also wouldn't be surprised Hudgton came in to play on Johnson, or others.

[Sedat]

Williams is notoriously rusty first game back from a spell - this is in the H&A season, let alone the white-hot intensity of the knock-out final. I've seen smaller defenders have massive games against better credentialed and much bigger forwards - Dean Solomon's comprehensive blanket job on Matty Richardson in the 2001 QF springs to mind.

I was hoping that Williams would actually be rushed back last week, as he has proven to be very good at adapting to the pace of the game at his 2nd start, but for mine, he is too risky a proposition coming in cold from the VFL this week.

[boydogs]

What about the Saints changes? They could well drop Luke Ball this week for his lack of pace - with us being a pacey side. I wouldn't be surprised if he missed.

They would have to look at this but who comes in?

[Ozza]

Dempster perhaps.

[Sedat]

Dempster perhaps.
Dempster is fighting for a spot with Eddy. Probably Geary would be the one to come in if they feel their midfield needs an extra rotation.