The 2010 prediction's thread

[mighty_west]

Not sure if one of thse has been written up yet for this season, so here goes, just copy & past [you know the drill]....

AFL GENERAL
Premiers:
Runners Up:
Wooden Spoon:
Brownlow Medallist:
Coleman Medallist:
Coaches sacked:
In the headlines for the wrong reasons:

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow:
Bulldogs Best & Fairest:
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010:
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker:
Bulldog All Australians:
Most kicks for a Bulldog:
Most handballs for a Bulldog:
Most Tackes for a Bulldog:
Rodney Eade Headline:

[The Coon Dog]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: Collingwood
Wooden Spoon: North Melbourne
Brownlow Medallist: Adam Goodes
Coleman Medallist: Brendan Fevola
Coaches sacked: Mark Williams & Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Lance Franklin

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Shaun Higgins
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Jordan Roughead, Brodie Moles & Liam Jones
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Shaun Higgins, Brian Lake, Ryan Hargrave, Lindsay Gilbee & Matthew Boyd
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Adam Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackles for a Bulldog: Jason Akermanis
Rodney Eade Headline: GC17 & GWS18 concessions are too great!

[comrade]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Bulldogs
Runners Up: Saints
Wooden Spoon: Tigers
Brownlow Medallist: Brendan Godard
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: A couple of Stokesy's mates at Geelong

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Shaun Higgins
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Shaun Higgins
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Brodie Moles, Jordan Roughead, Liam Jones and Jarrad Boumann
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall (48)
Bulldog All Australians: Shaun Higgins, Adam Cooney, Dale Morris and Brian Lake
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Matthew Boyd
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross (who else)
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Rodney Eade Headline: I ALWAYS KNEW BOUMANN WAS A STAR!

[Scorlibo]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Bulldogs
Runners Up: Adelaide
Wooden Spoon: North Melbourne
Brownlow Medallist: Buddy Franklin
Coleman Medallist: Buddy Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey, Mark Williams
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Daniel Kerr

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Shaun Higgins
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Brad Johnson
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Jordan Roughead, Brodie Moles, Pat Rose, Liam Jones
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Brad Johnson - 71
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Shaun Higgins, Ryan Griffen, Brian Lake, Daniel Giansiracusa, Brad Johnson and Lindsay Gilbee
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Ryan Griffen
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Rodney Eade Headline: That was pretty good how we didn't lose a game wasn't it?

[KT31]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Bulldogs
Runners Up: St-Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Adam Coney
Coleman Medallist: Buddy Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey, Mark Williams and Matthew Knights.
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Gary Ablett

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Adam Coney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Jordan Roughead, Brodie Moles, Pat Rose, Liam Jones, Ace Cordy
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Shaun Higgins, Ryan Griffen, Brian Lake, Lindsay Gilbee, Dale Morris and Matthew Boyd.
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Matthew Boyd
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Liam Picken
Rodney Eade Headline: Longest Drought Finally over by Beating Saint's flood.

[mjp]

I think we need to add a 'Where will the bulldogs finish' category.

[LostDoggy]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Bulldogs
Runners Up: Adelaide
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Joel Selwood
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Brendan Fevola

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Robert Muprhy
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Barry Hall, Liam Jones, Jordan Roughead, Jason Tutt.
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Jarrod Harbrow, Brian Lake, Adam Cooney, Robert Murphy.
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Lindsay Gilbee
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Callan Ward
Rodney Eade Headline: 'We stuck it right up'em'

[Happy Days]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Bulldogs
Runners Up: Crows
Wooden Spoon: Tigers
Brownlow Medallist: Nick Riewoldt
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Various Carlton players

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Matthew Boyd
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Brodie Moles, Jordan Roughead, Liam Jones, Jarrad Boumann
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall (51)
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Brian Lake, Ryan Hargrave
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Adam Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Rodney Eade Headline: "I appreciate the sentiment, but greatest coach ever?"

[LostDoggy]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: St. Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Lenny Hayes
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Kevin Sheedy

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Ryan Griffen
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Ryan Griffen
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: J. Roughead
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Lake, Griffen, Higgins
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Matthew Boyd
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Rodney Eade Headline: THE NEADE FOR SPEADE TO WIN PREMIERSHIP!

[KT31]

I think we need to add a 'Where will the bulldogs finish' category.

At the Barkley, celebrating a flag.

[mjp]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers:Hawthorn
Runners Up:Collingwood
Wooden Spoon:Richmond
Brownlow Medallist:McVeigh (Sydney version)
Coleman Medallist: Buddmeister
Coaches sacked: None
In the headlines for the wrong reasons:Brisbane - Salary cap

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted finish: 7th - 13 wins
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney - 15 votes
Bulldogs Best & Fairest:Dale Morris
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010:Roughead, Moles
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Aker - 37
Bulldog All Australians:Morris
Most kicks for a Bulldog:Gilbee
Most handballs for a Bulldog:Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog:Cross
Rodney Eade Headline:

[mjp]

AFL GENERAL
Wooden Spoon: St. Kilda
Brownlow Medallist: Lenny Hayes
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey


I dont think Hayes can win the Brownlow if the Saints finish last...and you might need to add Lyon to the sacked coaches list in that scenario!

[jazzadogs]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Bulldogs
Runners Up: St Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Luke Hodge most votes but ineligible. Adam Cooney
Coleman Medallist: Buddy
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Pains me, but I fear for Barry Hall

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Brian Lake
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Barry Hall, Brodie Moles, Jordan Roughead, Liam Jones
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Akermanis - 49
Bulldog All Australians: Jarrod Harbrow, Brian Lake, Adam Cooney, Robert Murphy
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Matthew Boyd
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackles for a Bulldog: Callan Ward
Rodney Eade Headline: "We stand by Barry"

[The Bulldogs Bite]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: St. Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Gary Ablett
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Alan Didak

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted finish: 2nd - 17 wins
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Shaun Higgins (19 votes)
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Jordan Roughead, Brodie Moles, Liam Jones
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall (49)
Bulldog All Australians: Shaun Higgins, Adam Cooney, Brian Lake, Ryan Hargrave
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Adam Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Matthew Boyd/Callan Ward
Rodney Eade Headline: "It wasn't Barry's intentions to split the Premiership cup in half."

[The Underdog]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers:Hawthorn
Runners Up:Collingwood
Wooden Spoon:Richmond
Brownlow Medallist:McVeigh (Sydney version)
Coleman Medallist: Buddmeister
Coaches sacked: None
In the headlines for the wrong reasons:Brisbane - Salary cap

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted finish: 7th - 13 wins


Not drinking the kool-aid then?

[chef]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: Adelaide
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Adam Cooney
Coleman Medallist: Brendan Fevola
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Brendan Fevola

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted finish: 3rd 16 wins
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Cooney 27 votes
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Moles, Rose, Jones, Boumann and Roughead
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall (54)
Bulldog All Australians: Shaun Higgins, Adam Cooney, Brian Lake, Dale Morris and Jarrod Harbrow
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Adam Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Matthew Boyd
Rodney Eade Headline: "Piss off Clayton"

[becmatty]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: St Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Ryan Griffen
Coleman Medallist: Buddy Franklin
Coaches sacked: None
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Ben Cousins

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Ryan Griffen
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Brian Lake
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Moles, Roughead
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Joint leaders: Johnson, Akermanis, Hall, all with 42 goals.
Bulldog All Australians: Griffen, Lake, Cooney, Higgins, Gilbee, Harbrow, Murphy, Giansiracusa
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Boyd
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Morris
Rodney Eade Headline: Now lets go back to back...

[Big Will]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: St. Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Nick Riewoldt
Coleman Medallist: Jarryd Roughead
Coaches sacked: Mark Williams
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Fevola

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Matthew Boyd
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Brodie Moles, Jordan Roughead, Liam Jones
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Matthew Boyd, Jarrod Harbrow, Brian Lake, Adam Cooney, Lindsay Gilbee, Dale Morris, Robert Murphy
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Adam Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Liam Picken
Rodney Eade Headline: We knew we could do it!

[mighty_west]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: St Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Carlton
Brownlow Medallist: tie between Adam Cooney & Gary Ablett [this time Ablett gives Cooney the head peck]
Coleman Medallist: Buddy Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Ben Cousins

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Adam Cooney & Dale Morris
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughead, Moles, Jones.
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall [76]
Bulldog All Australians: Cooney, Higgins, Morris, Lake, Harbrow
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Boyd
Rodney Eade Headline: "This is my proudest moment in AFL Football"

[LostDoggy]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: Collingwood
Wooden Spoon: Fremantle
Brownlow Medallist: Shaun Higgins
Coleman Medallist: Buddy Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Luke Ball

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted Finish: 2nd, 17-5
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Shaun Higgins
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Shaun Higgins
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughie, Jones, Moles, Thorne
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Higgins, Lake, Boyd
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Lake
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross <- I dont suggest anyone predict otherwise haha
Most Tackles for a Bulldog: Boyd
Rodney Eade Headline: Rocket launches a Rocket at Hall after a wild punch to Sydney's Captain Kirk.

[BulldogBelle]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: St Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Adam Cooney + L.Montagna
Coleman Medallist: Buddy
Coaches sacked: None
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Richmond. All season. Poor bastards.

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Daniel Cross
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughhead, Moles, Jones, Thorne, Rose (to be taken off the rookie list at round 11)
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Dale Morris, Robert Murphy, Ryan Hargrave
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Murphy
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackles for a Bulldog: Liam Picken
Rodney Eade Headline: Rocket admits telling Barry Hall to break Joel Selwood's face in two.

[Swoop]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: St Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Scott Pendlebury
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Williams
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Gary Ablett Jnr

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted finish: 2nd
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Daniel Giansiracusa
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Jordan Roughead, Brodie Moles, Barry Hall
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Ryan Hargrave, Robert Murphy
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Ryan Hargrave
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Liam Picken
Rodney Eade Headline: We couldn't have done it without WOOF

[LostDoggy]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: St Kilda
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist:
Coleman Medallist: Jonathon Brown
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Our adored Johnno with the headline 'Time's Up'

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Boyd
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Higgins
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughead, Moles, Jones
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Higgins, Boyd, Lake, Morris, Giansiracusa, Cross
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Hargrave
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackles for a Bulldog: Griffen
Rodney Eade Headline: ''I told you we could win a Prelim''

[Go_Dogs]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: Geelong
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Lenny Hayes
Coleman Medallist: Brendan Fevola
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Marc Murphy - The New Fevola

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted Finish: 1st
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Ryan Griffen
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Daniel Cross
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Brodie Moles, Jordan Roughead, Lucas Markovic, Liam Jones, Jarrad Boumann.
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Brad Johnson
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Matthew Boyd, Brian Lake, Jarrod Harbrow.
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Ryan Griffen
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Rodney Eade Headline: It was win the Grand Final or nothing

[LostDoggy]

Rodney Eade Headline: We couldn't have done it without WOOF

Love it :D

[boydogs]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: Adelaide
Wooden Spoon: Melbourne
Brownlow Medallist: Adam Cooney
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey, Dean Bailey, Mark Williams
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Melbourne for finishing last again

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Brodie Moles, Jordan Roughead, Liam Jones, Barry Hall, Lukas Markovic, Jarrad Boumann, Shane Thorne
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall (47)
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Shaun Higgins, Matthew Boyd, Brian Lake, Jarrod Harbrow
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Adam Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most tackles for a Bulldog: Liam Picken
Rodney Eade Headline: "To break the 56 year drought I thought was quite pleasing"

[Throughandthrough]

Am concerned that no one is picking Hall as a Bulldogs Debutant in 2010.

Have I missed some bad news?

[boydogs]

Am concerned that no one is picking Hall as a Bulldogs Debutant in 2010.

Have I missed some bad news?

I would say most are just not counting him as he has already debuted elsewhere

[Go_Dogs]

I would say most are just not counting him as he has already debuted elsewhere

Yeah, that's why he didn't make my list.

[The Coon Dog]

Am concerned that no one is picking Hall as a Bulldogs Debutant in 2010.

Have I missed some bad news?

I went down the 'AFL debut' path.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: St Kilda
Runners Up: Hawthorn
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Brendan Goddard
Coleman Medallist: Buddy Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons:

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted Finish 4th - 14 wins
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughead
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Johnno - 39
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Dale Morris
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Adam Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Cross
Rodney Eade Headline:

[AndrewP6]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: Geelong
Wooden Spoon: Melbourne
Brownlow Medallist: hate to say it, but Gablett. Before he buggers off to the Goldie.
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey, Dean Bailey.
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Tigers, so bad they ought to be relegated.

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Brodie Moles, Jordan Roughead
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall (45)
Bulldog All Australians: Adam Cooney, Matthew Boyd, Brian Lake, Jarrod Harbrow
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross. Nah, just kidding! Cooney.
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Daniel Cross
Most tackles for a Bulldog: Ryan Griffen.
Rodney Eade Headline: "I don't care how popular it has become, I'm not growing A BEARD!!!!"

[LostDoggy]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: St Kilda
Runners Up: Western Bulldogs
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Dal Santo
Coleman Medallist: Fevola
Coaches sacked: Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Carlton & Essendon's lack of forward line:rolleyes:

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Finish in the H&A: 2nd
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Boyd
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Higgins
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Hall, Roughead & Moles
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Johno 55
Bulldog All Australians: Lake, Morris, Higgins & Boyd
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Boyd
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Akermanis
Rodney Eade Headline: Recruiting Barry Hall was a Gamble that paid off.

[mjp]

Not drinking the kool-aid then?

Not really feeling it, no.

I just don't know where the improvement is going to come from. Our 'x'-factor still comes from Aker and Johnno - they are not getting any better. Of our best three players, Lake wont have a better year than 2009 (and I expect the opposition coaches to try and make him accountable every week), Murphy is fragile and we don't know what he will deliver and Cooney could become completely distracted by the wheel-barrow loads of money GC17 keep leaving for him.

Our ins (in real terms) is an aging full forward who has been making headlines for the wrong reasons for 3 seasons now...which kind of covered up the fact that he isn't Barry Hall anymore...or at least he wasn't last year.

I guess in Rod we trust and Griffen/Higgins/Ward all take large steps forward and everything is OK.

[LostDoggy]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Western Bulldogs
Runners Up: Hawthorn
Wooden Spoon: Melbourne
Brownlow Medallist: Ryan Griffen
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Dean Bailey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Eddie McGuire

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Ryan Griffen
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Adam Cooney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Jordan Roughead, Brodie Moles, Liam Jones
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Barry Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Lake, Gilbee, Griffen, Cooney, Johnson, Akermanis, Boyd, Cross, Harbrow
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Gilbee
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Picken
Rodney Eade Headline: Now we must concentrate on back to back flags!

[The Pie Man]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: St Kilda
Runners Up: WB
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Hayes
Coleman Medallist: Franklin
Coaches sacked: Dean Bailey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Buckley/Malthouse relationship going sour

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Cooney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Jones, Roughead, Moles if elevated
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Higgins, Cooney, Murphy, Morris
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Boyd
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Cross
Rodney Eade Headline: Rocket salutes prelim win

[LostDoggy]

Not really feeling it, no.

I just don't know where the improvement is going to come from. Our 'x'-factor still comes from Aker and Johnno - they are not getting any better. Of our best three players, Lake wont have a better year than 2009 (and I expect the opposition coaches to try and make him accountable every week), Murphy is fragile and we don't know what he will deliver and Cooney could become completely distracted by the wheel-barrow loads of money GC17 keep leaving for him.

Our ins (in real terms) is an aging full forward who has been making headlines for the wrong reasons for 3 seasons now...which kind of covered up the fact that he isn't Barry Hall anymore...or at least he wasn't last year.

I guess in Rod we trust and Griffen/Higgins/Ward all take large steps forward and everything is OK.

You don't value having a fit Cooney, Murphy, Higgins, Giansiracusa and Williams in the side or the benefit to Gilbee and Griffen being free of the trauma of losing their fathers mid-season or the value Hall will bring to the side as another option for the forward line or the possibility of some improvement in the likes of Ward, Harbrow, Wood and Roughead and finally no benefit from another pre-season managed by the triathlon guru?

MJP, you're either a hard man or you're having a bad day

[Mantis]

Not really feeling it, no.

I just don't know where the improvement is going to come from. Our 'x'-factor still comes from Aker and Johnno - they are not getting any better. Of our best three players, Lake wont have a better year than 2009 (and I expect the opposition coaches to try and make him accountable every week), Murphy is fragile and we don't know what he will deliver and Cooney could become completely distracted by the wheel-barrow loads of money GC17 keep leaving for him.

Our ins (in real terms) is an aging full forward who has been making headlines for the wrong reasons for 3 seasons now...which kind of covered up the fact that he isn't Barry Hall anymore...or at least he wasn't last year.

I guess in Rod we trust and Griffen/Higgins/Ward all take large steps forward and everything is OK.

As a countering arguement do we need to improve that much to at least maintain our current position (top 4 team)?

One would think that Collingwood would improve with addition of Jolly and Hawthorn similiarily with a couple of new additions (Burgoyne & Gibson) and also a much fitter list, but where does the other challenging teams improvement come from? Surely Geelong & St.Kilda are going to struggle to improve on their efforts from the 2009 season.

Looking only at our team one would think that Hall will give us more than Welsh, that Gilbee & Griffen can improve their output after the hardships they encountered last season and that Gia, Cooney, Murphy and Higgins can all put their injury concerns behind them and play at or near their best for larger chunks of the season. I guess I haven't even factored in the improvement of the younger players (Ward, Hill, Everitt, Williams, etc..) and already I see us in a stronger position than last season.

Agree that Aker & Johnson will probably drop off and whilst the level of decrease is an unknown it would be expected that others could help pick up the slack. I understand that their unique skills are irreplacacble, but I wouldn't have thought that both of these 2 will be burdens on our performance and improvement this year.

I also would also be interested in knowing which teams you have finishing above our predicted 7th position?

[mjp]

I also would also be interested in knowing which teams you have finishing above our predicted 7th position?

Geelong
Saints
Hawthorn
Adelaide
Collingwood
Port
==> US <==
Sydney

West Coast just miss out.

[chef]

Geelong
Saints
Hawthorn
Adelaide
Collingwood
Port
==> US <==
Sydney

West Coast just miss out.

What has Port done over the preseason to give you this opinion?

[Bulldog Revolution]

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Predicted finish: 7th - 13 wins


In the optimistic climate of 2010 thats basically the equivalent of tipping us for the wooden spoon

Have we been drinking our own bath water out at the Kennel all summer?

Will a fit Murphy, Cooney, Morris not be able to outweigh the ageing forward line of Aker, Johnson and Hall?

What are the areas you see us struggling in 2010?

[Bulldog Revolution]

I've just seen you've answered some of these issues

[mjp]

13 wins is a good season.

I just don't see how by making our forward line predictable (adding Hall) makes us a better side. The whole 'now we have someone to mark it at the top of the square' argument doesn't wash with me - he is a leading forward. Now Hall and Hahn will try and play the same role as far as I can tell.

Maybe there has been a gameplan change/shift that will make this work - you couldn't get an idea from the Canberra game - but I just don't buy it.

The improvement needs to come from the bottom of the list...I dont see that. I am still concerned about our midfield depth (beyond Ward we get 'iffy' though Reid might be OK and Moles will help if he can get on the list) and that group of players from 16 ==> on the the list...Guys like Hill, Callan, Addison, Everitt, Stack etc etc - we don't know if they are good enough (but suspect most aren't), we don't know if they are ready (but suspect most never will be) and they are going to have to play key, key roles at different times throughout the year. And unless Markovic turns into something, we got zero help from this years draft.

I don't know. It is probably just me...but I wouldn't mind everyone going back and re-reading their own posts after either of the West Coast games last year and then telling me we are certainties for the flag. I guess to me there is no disappointment without expectation and as a supporter group we are basically piling it all on. Things are never as good as you think or as bad as you fear - we have a good, solid side that to me could finish top 4 and again challenge for the flag if everything goes well. Our forward line is a complete unknown, we are putting our faith in the very unreliable Williams to hold down a key defensive post and the bottom end of our midfield is either ageing (Eagleton) or completely untried (Reid, Moles) - on those days when two of Cooney, Griffen and Higgins are either having a quiet one, injured or tagged out of it...those blokes will have to step up.

[chef]

Not really feeling it, no.

I just don't know where the improvement is going to come from. Our 'x'-factor still comes from Aker and Johnno - they are not getting any better. Of our best three players, Lake wont have a better year than 2009 (and I expect the opposition coaches to try and make him accountable every week), Murphy is fragile and we don't know what he will deliver and Cooney could become completely distracted by the wheel-barrow loads of money GC17 keep leaving for him.

Our ins (in real terms) is an aging full forward who has been making headlines for the wrong reasons for 3 seasons now...which kind of covered up the fact that he isn't Barry Hall anymore...or at least he wasn't last year.

I guess in Rod we trust and Griffen/Higgins/Ward all take large steps forward and everything is OK.

-Hahn, Hudson, Lake, Hargrave, Boyd and Minson doing what they do
-Higgins, Murphy, Cooney, Gia, Morris and Cross having better luck injury wise
-Griffen and Gilbee being able to concentrate on footy
-Hall in the forward line
-Harbrow, Hill, Ward, Picken and Williams improving with another preseason under their belts
-Everitt, Tiller, Reid, Wood, Callan, Addison, Jones, Grant, Roughead, Moles, Rose and Stack giving us the best depth in the competition as well as putting pressure on the players preform.
-Belief that we are as good as any team in the comp

I think I have mentioned everyone:p

It all comes down to injuries and keeping our best players on the park. Even if Johnson, Akermanis and Eagleton struggle this year I would still expect us to finish near the top of the ladder.

[bornadog]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Bulldogs
Runners Up: Saints
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Marc Murphy
Coleman Medallist: Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Harvey
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Fev - he will stuff up again

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Cooney
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Cooney
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughhead, Boumann
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Hall
Bulldog All Australians: Cooney, Murphy, Lake
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Boyd
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Cross
Rodney Eade Headline: Rockets Rocket fires Dogs into Grand Final

[comrade]

I disagree that introducing Hall into our forward line will automatically make us ‘predictable’, in fact, it could be argued that when it came to the crunch in high intensity games, we’ve been too predicatable for years, i.e. getting pushed back through the midfield and resorting to deep balls into our undersized forward line.

We must have done it 10 times within the first 15 minutes in the last quarter against St Kilda.

IMO, adding Hall makes us more flexible. We’ll still have a spread of goalkickers, but we’ve also got a decent bail out option for the times where the pressure is so great that we are forced to go deep. He’s not going to mark everything that comes his way but he’s a much better option than Minson.

[LostDoggy]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Bulldogs
Runners Up: Collingwood
Wooden Spoon: Richmond
Brownlow Medallist: Ryan Griffen
Coleman Medallist: Fevola
Coaches sacked: None
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Nick Riewoldt for faking and being rubbed out for 4 weeks.

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Griffen
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Dale Morris
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughhead, Cordy, Moles, Thorne
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Aker
Bulldog All Australians: Cooney, Lake, Boyd, Griffen
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Brad Johnson
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Picken
Rodney Eade Headline: Goes to Laser Hair with KB and gets new nickname of Whispy

In regard to some of the other posts regarding our weakness I really believe that Hall is going to be able to bring the ball to ground for our little blokes... but where are our little blokes? We have Aker who is superb but when he isn't at the fall of the ball we haven't got anyone as creative Rioli. Although Hill has a great leap and some sticky hands he doesn't have the ground level game... but heres hoping the penny has dropped and he does become that great small forward that we do need.

[LostDoggy]

I dont think Hayes can win the Brownlow if the Saints finish last...and you might need to add Lyon to the sacked coaches list in that scenario!

I missed a line...And its more likely to happen then your prediction of Collingwood to win the Flag :P

[mighty_west]

13 wins is a good season.

I just don't see how by making our forward line predictable (adding Hall) makes us a better side. The whole 'now we have someone to mark it at the top of the square' argument doesn't wash with me - he is a leading forward. Now Hall and Hahn will try and play the same role as far as I can tell.



With all due respect, i don't quite understand this, how can adding a quality forward into a forward line not help things out, not only would Hall take the best defender, he may also be double teamed at times, he is a leading forward, but he is also a very good overhead mark, smashes the packs as well an any forward, presents & presents, as forwards need to do.

Also with this making our forward line a bit more predictable, again, why should that be a concern if that was the case?, Brisbane were as predictable as any side in their heyday, to me, that's almost a cop out for a side that is a quality side and pressing for Premiership glory, you can only do so much with being unpredictable imo.

[mjp]

I missed a line...And its more likely to happen then your prediction of Collingwood to win the Flag :P

You don't think I realised you missed a line? :rolleyes:

[LostDoggy]

You don't think I realised you missed a line? :rolleyes:

Yeah I did, but then again, as I said previously. You did predict Collingwood to win the flag so who knows what you do and don't realise ;)

[mjp]

With all due respect, i don't quite understand this, how can adding a quality forward into a forward line not help things out, not only would Hall take the best defender, he may also be double teamed at times, he is a leading forward, but he is also a very good overhead mark, smashes the packs as well an any forward, presents & presents, as forwards need to do.


I remember Sydney adding an aging Tony Lockett to their side a few years back. He was a quality forward. He didn't help them.

He wont always take the best defender - and I guess that is my point. What playing an extra tall forward will do is allow opposition sides to play their 'normal' defensive unit against us - no longer will you see teams restructuring their defensive group, Collingwood stuck with Prestigiacomo sat on the bench for example - because we are the same as everyone else.

That said, I dont really have any idea how we will use him - and it will be interesting to see if we try and use Hall and Murphy as some kind of two headed leading centre-half-forward...if we do this and figure a way to make it successful, then this will be incredibly hard to counter (no-one else really does it this way) and with our ball movement this could actually change the game. If we try and stick Hall in the goal-square playing the Hahn/Minson role from last year, I dont think we improve and I further think that Hahn will struggle to find a role.

Basically, we have no idea what Hall is going to do to our forward line...we aren't going to know for several months whether it is good or bad.

[mjp]

Yeah I did, but then again, as I said previously. You did predict Collingwood to win the flag so who knows what you do and don't realise ;)

Hmmm. OK. You said it twice so I went to check - and no, I didn't pick the Pies to win the flag. Check again.

[LostDoggy]

Touche. I guess I missed a line :D

[mjp]

Touche. I guess I missed a line :D

Yeah...touche.

First you miss a line.:)
Now you miss another line?:rolleyes:

You remind me of that fighter...you know, the one who got knocked out in the first round?

[chef]

Basically, we have no idea what Hall is going to do to our forward line...we aren't going to know for several months whether it is good or bad.

And it's going to be one hell of a ride:)

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I remember Sydney adding an aging Tony Lockett to their side a few years back. He was a quality forward. He didn't help them.

He wont always take the best defender - and I guess that is my point. What playing an extra tall forward will do is allow opposition sides to play their 'normal' defensive unit against us - no longer will you see teams restructuring their defensive group, Collingwood stuck with Prestigiacomo sat on the bench for example - because we are the same as everyone else.

That said, I dont really have any idea how we will use him - and it will be interesting to see if we try and use Hall and Murphy as some kind of two headed leading centre-half-forward...if we do this and figure a way to make it successful, then this will be incredibly hard to counter (no-one else really does it this way) and with our ball movement this could actually change the game. If we try and stick Hall in the goal-square playing the Hahn/Minson role from last year, I dont think we improve and I further think that Hahn will struggle to find a role.

Basically, we have no idea what Hall is going to do to our forward line...we aren't going to know for several months whether it is good or bad.

There's merit in your analysis, but effectively we're trading in Hall for Welsh. Big upgrade. Welsh still attracted the likes of Scarlett but the difference was that he got swamped every single time. Not only did Scarlett and co keep him quiet, they rebounded off him too. Hall is a superior player to Walsh and this is what it should be seen as IMO.

The key to our forward half is Murphy though. Not many players can keep up with him and I think he'll benefit from having Hall around him. As you said - they both play that CHF role well.

Agree that Hall shouldn't play a Minson/Hahn role, he needs to be on the move but this means Scarlett and co. HAVE to follow him. They aren't going to out mark him or cut him to shreads on the rebound. He's too dangerous for that. This means we shouldn't see Johnson having to contest against both Scarlett and Mackie/Taylor for example.

[Rocco Jones]

I remember Sydney adding an aging Tony Lockett to their side a few years back. He was a quality forward. He didn't help them.


Do you mean the 2002 recruitment of Lockett? I know you're not a big fan of us recruiting Hall but that is a harsh comparison. Lockett was retired for 2 seasons and turned 36 at the start of the season. The 2002 version was never going to be a 'quality forward'. I don't think Rocket wanted him, seemed like a marketing move.

Hall is 3 years younger than Lockett was in 2002 and when he has actually managed to avoid hitting people, he has been a quality forward.

By saying we can finish top four and push for the flag you have covered a few bases (fair enough too, unpredictable) but I very much disagree with your base call of 7th. If we finish outside the top 6 and Port make it, I will literally eat my hat (one of my old man hats, lack of hard brim makes it easier).

[Happy Days]

I remember Sydney adding an aging Tony Lockett to their side a few years back. He was a quality forward. He didn't help them.


Got them to a grand final; whens the last time we did that?

[Rocco Jones]

Got them to a grand final; whens the last time we did that?

I think he is talking about the 2002, 36 year old, 2 years out of footy edition.

[Swoop]

Barry Hall kicked multiple goals in 10 of his 11 appearances last year and was fifth in the AFL for goals per game. No, he is not the answer to all our forward line worries he is simply a replacement/upgrade for Welsh.

We still boast Johnson, Akermanis, Hahn, Higgins, Murphy, Hill, Giansiracusa, Minson & Cooney who are capable of kicking at least 20 goals a season. This is our greatest asset and I think Eade knows our strengths and will continue to play to them accordingly.

Hall was recruited to compliment our existing structures not to re-shape the wheel.

[LostDoggy]

I have to say that I don't feel as optimistic as some of the other supporters on here. We should have could have won it last year, and I think that we blew another opportunity. The game that makes me so angry is the final against Geelong, we went in over confident and got smashed. The same as what we did the year before against Hawthorn.

Other teams will step up this year, so we will end up fighting it out in a weight division with quite a few others including Geelong.

[GVGjr]

I have to say that I don't feel as optimistic as some of the other supporters on here. We should have could have won it last year, and I think that we blew another opportunity. The game that makes me so angry is the final against Geelong, we went in over confident and got smashed. The same as what we did the year before against Hawthorn.

Other teams will step up this year, so we will end up fighting it out in a weight division with quite a few others including Geelong.

I was thinking about his over the weekend. I'm not sure why but I think we will either finish in the top 2 or somewhere around 5th and 7th by the end of the home and away season.

A month or so ago I would have thought we were a top 4 side with little doubt. I just think it's going to be one of those seasons where dropping a winnable game will be so costly.

[Dry Rot]

-Hahn, Hudson, Lake, Hargrave, Boyd and Minson doing what they do
-Higgins, Murphy, Cooney, Gia, Morris and Cross having better luck injury wise
-Griffen and Gilbee being able to concentrate on footy
-Hall in the forward line
-Harbrow, Hill, Ward, Picken and Williams improving with another preseason under their belts
-Everitt, Tiller, Reid, Wood, Callan, Addison, Jones, Grant, Roughead, Moles, Rose and Stack giving us the best depth in the competition as well as putting pressure on the players preform.
-Belief that we are as good as any team in the comp

I think I have mentioned everyone:p

It all comes down to injuries and keeping our best players on the park. Even if Johnson, Akermanis and Eagleton struggle this year I would still expect us to finish near the top of the ladder.

Couldn't you put broadly similar arguments about say the Pies, Crows and Lions?

Probably Saints fans would also look to improvement in their younger players too.

[Dry Rot]

That said, I dont really have any idea how we will use him - and it will be interesting to see if we try and use Hall and Murphy as some kind of two headed leading centre-half-forward...if we do this and figure a way to make it successful, then this will be incredibly hard to counter (no-one else really does it this way) and with our ball movement this could actually change the game. If we try and stick Hall in the goal-square playing the Hahn/Minson role from last year, I dont think we improve and I further think that Hahn will struggle to find a role.

Basically, we have no idea what Hall is going to do to our forward line...we aren't going to know for several months whether it is good or bad.




The key to our forward half is Murphy though. Not many players can keep up with him and I think he'll benefit from having Hall around him. As you said - they both play that CHF role well.

Agree that Hall shouldn't play a Minson/Hahn role, he needs to be on the move but this means Scarlett and co. HAVE to follow him. They aren't going to out mark him or cut him to shreads on the rebound. He's too dangerous for that. This means we shouldn't see Johnson having to contest against both Scarlett and Mackie/Taylor for example.

Agree that Hall is at his best when he is a roaming CHF. Begs a question about we do in the goal square.

[LostDoggy]

Geelong
Saints
Hawthorn
Adelaide
Collingwood
Port
==> US <==
Sydney

West Coast just miss out.

Sure you haven't been drinking this MJP

[mjp]

Sure you haven't been drinking this MJP

What is the point of that? At least post a counter view.

[mjp]

What has Port done over the preseason to give you this opinion?

I over-rate Port every single year. But:

- Addition by subtraction ==> Burgoyne #1 and #2.
- Further maturation of my favorite young midfielder Travis Boak. (Apologies to S. Higgins).
- Real leg speed on every line and a roaming half-back in Krakouer ready to take the competition apart.
- A team that has completely fallen off the horse since the 2007 grand-final. They will sneak under the radar for 8-10 rounds, and by the time anyone realises that they have improved it will be too late to drag them back.

Plus, 12 games in Adelaide - they will win 8 of those - and a relatively helpful draw will see 11-12 wins...I think they will squeak an extra couple as well. I just see them in the 12-14 win mark and slightly shading us.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I over-rate Port every single year. But:

- Addition by subtraction ==> Burgoyne #1 and #2.
- Further maturation of my favorite young midfielder Travis Boak. (Apologies to S. Higgins).
- Real leg speed on every line and a roaming half-back in Krakouer ready to take the competition apart.
- A team that has completely fallen off the horse since the 2007 grand-final. They will sneak under the radar for 8-10 rounds, and by the time anyone realises that they have improved it will be too late to drag them back.

Plus, 12 games in Adelaide - they will win 8 of those - and a relatively helpful draw will see 11-12 wins...I think they will squeak an extra couple as well. I just see them in the 12-14 win mark and slightly shading us.

Port Adelaide have some talent but I am very surprised you have them finishing above us. Their forward line consists of Tredrea (Finished), Ebert (Plays maybe a handful of games a year), Mottlop (See Ebert) and Westhoff (Done nothing since year one). I struggle to see how their forward half worries many sides. Gray is a very good player and there's a couple of other likely types but it's slim.

Their midfield is full of potential with Boak, Hartlett and Pearce. Fact is though, Pearce's work rate is poor and he cannot shake a tag. For all his skills, he really is an underperformer. Cassissi, Salopek and Cornes are good players but it's drawing a low bow to compare them to the top 5 or so midfields in the competition.

I like their back half and agree about Krakouer. I think he's going to be a star this season off the half back and it's a shame we couldn't find another pick to draft him. By all reports Clayton was very keen on him.

I actually think you're underrating us mjp. The defense and midfield is only going to improve. We've got older cattle up forward but there's still plenty of options to rotate through there. I can understand a slide to 5th as I think 1-5 will be very close, but I think the group has shown over the last two years we're better than 7th.

In any case, nice to see some differing views. Makes for good discussion.

[boydogs]

13 wins is a good season.

I just don't see how by making our forward line predictable (adding Hall) makes us a better side. The whole 'now we have someone to mark it at the top of the square' argument doesn't wash with me - he is a leading forward. Now Hall and Hahn will try and play the same role as far as I can tell.

Maybe there has been a gameplan change/shift that will make this work - you couldn't get an idea from the Canberra game - but I just don't buy it.

The improvement needs to come from the bottom of the list...I dont see that. I am still concerned about our midfield depth (beyond Ward we get 'iffy' though Reid might be OK and Moles will help if he can get on the list) and that group of players from 16 ==> on the the list...Guys like Hill, Callan, Addison, Everitt, Stack etc etc - we don't know if they are good enough (but suspect most aren't), we don't know if they are ready (but suspect most never will be) and they are going to have to play key, key roles at different times throughout the year. And unless Markovic turns into something, we got zero help from this years draft.

I don't know. It is probably just me...but I wouldn't mind everyone going back and re-reading their own posts after either of the West Coast games last year and then telling me we are certainties for the flag. I guess to me there is no disappointment without expectation and as a supporter group we are basically piling it all on. Things are never as good as you think or as bad as you fear - we have a good, solid side that to me could finish top 4 and again challenge for the flag if everything goes well. Our forward line is a complete unknown, we are putting our faith in the very unreliable Williams to hold down a key defensive post and the bottom end of our midfield is either ageing (Eagleton) or completely untried (Reid, Moles) - on those days when two of Cooney, Griffen and Higgins are either having a quiet one, injured or tagged out of it...those blokes will have to step up.

mjp, I appreciate having a devil's advocate in the thread, but I do think you are off the mark.

Hall replaces Welsh, so life won't be much different for Hahn. Opposition sides will still have difficulty matching up on us. We won't lose unpredictability unless Hall's output demands more of the ball, this reminds me of the reverse of the Carlton argument that their forward line will be better this year without Fevola

Improvement does not have to come solely from the younger brigade - there were a raft of top line senior players for us last year that struggled for one reason or another - Gia, Gilbee, Griffen, Cross, Cooney, Murphy, Higgins - that's a fair list. You are going to get injuries every year, but last year whilst we went Ok in terms of number of games missed, we seemed to have a lot of players underdone with ongoing niggles and did not have them at their best when it counted, Gilbee and Griffen excluded

Our midfield contains Boyd, Cross, Cooney, Griffen, Gia, Higgins, Ward, Picken, Eagle, Gilbee.
Reid, Moles, Wood, Everitt may get a game through there
I am not seeing a depth issue.

Younger players we should expect to improve would be Hill, Everitt, Stack, Higgins, Picken, Wood, Ward. I think you are lumping these guys with Callan, Tiller and Addison who are in and out of the side but have been around long enough to have locked in a spot if they were good enough.

From the draft, Moles has already suprised and may play a role. Markovic may help as you suggested. I haven't heard much about Thorne's progress but he is also mature age. But even just one player from the draft helping in the first year is positive, the draft is not really about the next season. You also have to remember Hall was traded in for our third round pick, so his contribution is essentially from the draft.

I have to point out you called our forwardline predictable in paragraph two and unknown in your last, I think you are clutching at straws a little looking for something to point at to express your doubts which gives me great confidence

Williams has been an issue, but has had a great pre-season and we drafted Markovic as a better backup than Tiller or Wight

The bottom end of everyone's midfield is the kids and older players - you worry when the best players are those types, as in our forward line, not when the worst are. In the most important position on the ground, our best players are in their prime.

My biggest fears for our side are the ruck which you didn't mention, not having match winning superstars (see Hayes and Riewoldt in the 2009 PF) which you didn't mention and the Williams factor which you touched on. Things will need to go well for us, with minimal injuries and to the least critical players at the least critical times, but I hold high hopes for 2010 which I believe have a strong basis when looking at our recent results, the changes to our lineup for the year ahead and the reports of a successful preseason

[mjp]

mjp, I appreciate having a devil's advocate in the thread, but I do think you are off the mark.
Not meaning to be devils advocate...I am just not feeling it.



Hall replaces Welsh, so life won't be much different for Hahn. Opposition sides will still have difficulty matching up on us. We won't lose unpredictability unless Hall's output demands more of the ball, this reminds me of the reverse of the Carlton argument that their forward line will be better this year without Fevola
Welsh finished the season down back as a loose man...pretty sure Hall wont play that role. The whole Welsh + Hahn + Johnson thing never really worked. I accept Hall is better than Welsh (though a less reliable shot for goal) but remain curious how this will work. To me, something has got to give. We need mobility and pace down there to pressure the opposition and create goals...I don't see where that will come from.



Improvement does not have to come solely from the younger brigade - there were a raft of top line senior players for us last year that struggled for one reason or another - Gia, Gilbee, Griffen, Cross, Cooney, Murphy, Higgins - that's a fair list. You are going to get injuries every year, but last year whilst we went Ok in terms of number of games missed, we seemed to have a lot of players underdone with ongoing niggles and did not have them at their best when it counted, Gilbee and Griffen excluded

Fair call. We will cop our fair share of injuries, illness and miscellaneous 'other' stuff in 2010 though. This really needs to be considered 'a wash' when looking at the season ahead...remember, Cooney was flying come finals compared with the year before when he was stuffed.



Our midfield contains Boyd, Cross, Cooney, Griffen, Gia, Higgins, Ward, Picken, Eagle, Gilbee.
Reid, Moles, Wood, Everitt may get a game through there
I am not seeing a depth issue.

Reid, Moles, Wood and Everitt are completely unproven.
Gilbee is a small - defender (yes, I remember he played on Rocca in the 06 elimination final).
Eagle is not getting better, coming off a poor season and knee surgery.
Picken played as a tagger - let's hope he is more than that.
Ward and Higgins - agree, should improve.
Gia - Should be better.
Griffen - Who knows? Promises the world...
Cooney, Boyd and Cross should be right.



Younger players we should expect to improve would be Hill, Everitt, Stack, Higgins, Picken, Wood, Ward. I think you are lumping these guys with Callan, Tiller and Addison who are in and out of the side but have been around long enough to have locked in a spot if they were good enough.
I dont have faith in Stack or Hill improving this year. I dont have faith that Callan, Addison and Tiller can be any more than bit parters.



From the draft, Moles has already suprised and may play a role. Markovic may help as you suggested. I haven't heard much about Thorne's progress but he is also mature age. But even just one player from the draft helping in the first year is positive, the draft is not really about the next season. You also have to remember Hall was traded in for our third round pick, so his contribution is essentially from the draft.
Grasping. We wont see Howard or Tutt, Markovic hasn't been selected in the NAB cup and Thorne barely sighted. Agree that Moles looked good vs Brisbane.



I have to point out you called our forwardline predictable in paragraph two and unknown in your last, I think you are clutching at straws a little looking for something to point at to express your doubts which gives me great confidence
Well it is unknown, but to me the addition of a traditional tall forward in Hall makes us more predictable. It gives the big gorillas like Merrett at Brisbane someone to play on...in years past, he was either dropped or on the bench. I do admit to not being able to see the future though...therefore the outcome of all this is unknown though I have mentioned the twin chf role filled by Murphy and Hall - yet I dont know if this is the structure or if we will try it or if they can work together or....what can I say?



Williams has been an issue, but has had a great pre-season and we drafted Markovic as a better backup than Tiller or Wight
Markovic = conjecture. I still dont have faith in Williams but hope to be proven wrong.



The bottom end of everyone's midfield is the kids and older players - you worry when the best players are those types, as in our forward line, not when the worst are. In the most important position on the ground, our best players are in their prime.
I am more worried about our forward line than the midfield...that has been the main thrust of my argument.



My biggest fears for our side are the ruck which you didn't mention, not having match winning superstars (see Hayes and Riewoldt in the 2009 PF) which you didn't mention and the Williams factor which you touched on. Things will need to go well for us, with minimal injuries and to the least critical players at the least critical times, but I hold high hopes for 2010 which I believe have a strong basis when looking at our recent results, the changes to our lineup for the year ahead and the reports of a successful preseason
I have faith in Hudson. Agree with the rest.

We have a good team...I just dont see a march to the flag.

[chef]

Couldn't you put broadly similar arguments about say the Pies, Crows and Lions?

Probably Saints fans would also look to improvement in their younger players too.

Crows, yes(I think we will be challenging them for the flag). The Pies and Lions lists aren't as good as ours and we have a better crop of younger players coming through than the Saints.

[Mantis]

Plus, 12 games in Adelaide - they will win 8 of those - and a relatively helpful draw will see 11-12 wins...I think they will squeak an extra couple as well. I just see them in the 12-14 win mark and slightly shading us.

Why?

Because they are a good team or just because they have an advantage playing at home? (abit often in front of a half full stadium)

In 2009 they were 8-4 at home.
In 2008 they were 3-9 at home.

Which will it be this year?

[LostDoggy]

Geelong won't be in the top 2 this year. They even have it in their mindset that they won't do as well as they have over the past 3 years. Don't get me wrong, they will do well, but they won't be as feared as previous years.

[Go_Dogs]

I must say, I'm not convinced about the Power either.

They are going to have a pretty weak ruck combination. There most exciting young midfielders show a lot of promise, but will Boak handle the extra attention? Can Hartlett over come his injury concerns and if so, will he have the fitness base to play out the season? Will Gray finally arrive as a consistent performer? Ditto Pearce? Cassisi, Salopek and Kane Cornes, you know what you'll get, but they'll be hoping Salopek can improve again.

Their forward line will revolve around Tredrea, Motlop, Ebert and possibly one of Shultz, M Westhoff, Thompson or Salter. It could go ok, but all are either aging, inconsistent or unprovens.

Their back 6 looks alright, Chad Cornes, Carlile, Chaplin, Pettigrew are all capable. Surjan is ok off a back flank, and yes, Krakouer will hopefully improve on a reasonable 2009. Moore, Trengove and a few others may also find a role. Back line is their strength imo.

They have a host of 2nd tier players, in Logan, Matt Thomas, Nash, Harding, Davenport, Meyer, some aging guys such as Carr who may struggle for a game, then a host of kids including Broadbent, Banner, M Motlop, Stewart and even Pittard who they'll hope can develop into AFL quality players, but that won't happen overnight.

I agree they are on the turn around, but I think they'll need another year or 2 of development to really see the benefits of their strong recruiting over the past few years, although they do still have too many depth and top-up players for mine.

[Ozza]

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: St.Kilda
Runners Up: Bulldogs
Wooden Spoon: Richmond (moral!)
Brownlow Medallist: Nick Riewoldt to change the theme of it being a midfielders award.
Coleman Medallist: Lance Franklin
Coaches sacked: Mark Williams as Port sits in the bottom 3
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Rhan Hooper

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Shaun Higgins
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Brian Lake
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughead, Liam Jones.
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Brad Johnson
Bulldog All Australians: Lake, Higgins, Cooney
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Cooney
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Cross
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Liam Picken
Rodney Eade Headline: - something about Eade and Bazza enjoying the first win over Collingwood round 1. -

[Mofra]

MJP has raised some excellent points, but there is one in particular I don't agree with - Hall will make our forwardline predictable and therefore less potent.

We were reasonably predictable last year, expecially when our HF line was being held (something that happened far too regularly last year for my liking) - teams made a habit of chopping off the "long bomb" to Hill (undersized) or Will (not a KPP in marking ability).

Hall will provide us with etiher a big target on the HF line or the chop out long bomb - he's more of a smart footballer than a brawler, despite his reputation and will run to the right spots once he gels with the rest of the forwards. The straight swap with Welsh doesn't mark a radical change to our structure either.

In any case, St Kilda & Geelong in 2009 were predictable IMO; everyone knew their gameplan, they just did it so well it was difficult to counter. Hawks in 2008 weren't exactly the most difficult side to read either, yet they won the big one.

To be honest, I'm not sure predictability is all it's cracked up to be, especially if the opposition has a competant match-day coach. Our F50 has been unpredictable at times and that was entirely through necessity, not desire.

[mjp]

I reckon I have had a fair go on this thread and completely derailed it from the 'list of predictions' it is supposed to be. Have enjoyed the debate but wont post anything else in this one...sorry for stuffing it up.

[The Coon Dog]

I reckon I have had a fair go on this thread and completely derailed it from the 'list of predictions' it is supposed to be. Have enjoyed the debate but wont post anything else in this one...sorry for stuffing it up.

I've enjoyed reading your posts mjp, as usual, well reasoned & thought out.

From my view point you certainly didn't stuff up anything. You contributed to a debate which is afterall what this forum is all about.

Even if I don't understand everything you post I try to learn from them.

[The Pie Man]

I've enjoyed reading your posts mjp, as usual, well reasoned & thought out.

From my view point you certainly didn't stuff up anything. You contributed to a debate which is afterall what this forum is all about.

Even if I don't understand everything you post I try to learn from them.

What CD said

[chef]

I reckon I have had a fair go on this thread and completely derailed it from the 'list of predictions' it is supposed to be. Have enjoyed the debate but wont post anything else in this one...sorry for stuffing it up.

You didn't stuff it up, you made it more interesting:)

[LostDoggy]

So, getting it back on track somewhat... (have enjoyed the read too mjp)

AFL GENERAL
Premiers: Dogs (come on.. no real choice here -- it's a heart vs. head thing)
Runners Up: Adelaide. Now wouldn't that bury some nightmares!
Wooden Spoon: Melbourne, will fight it out with Richmond.
Brownlow Medallist: Gablett/Hayes tie
Coleman Medallist: Fev
Coaches sacked: Bailey, Ratten
In the headlines for the wrong reasons: Hawthorn falls apart as drug scandal breaks. Buddy at the centre of the storm.

WESTERN BULLDOGS
Highest ranked Bulldog in Brownlow: Boydy
Bulldogs Best & Fairest: Boydy
Bulldogs debutant's in 2010: Roughead, Moles, Markovic
Leading Bulldogs Goal Kicker: Hall comfortably
Bulldog All Australians: Lake, Morris, Hargrave, Gilbee, Murphy, Cooney, Griffen, Boyd, Ward, Higgins, Gia, Harbrow, Picken (how many did Geelong have in 2008?)
Most kicks for a Bulldog: Coons
Most handballs for a Bulldog: Crossy
Most Tackes for a Bulldog: Griff
Rodney Eade Headline: Rocket Speaks of Dynasty as Bulldogs End 56-year Premiership Drought.