Hill and Hall

[Twodogs]

Watching them tonight got me thinking that if they could work together they could be a really dangerous double act in the forward line. Hall's strength is leading down the ground and if opposition defenders follow him that leaves the goal square open for Josh to float in to take marks and do some damage on the lesser defenders.


I had to laugh when Hall went to mark the ball at the top of the square in the second quarter only to see Josh float in and take the mark before he could get his hands on the ball. Hall walked past Josh and gave him a look that said "that's my area-dont do that again!"

I didnt realise Hall was so agile. A couple of those goals he kicked in the first half where he gathered the bouncing ball and snapped truly were Ablettesquesnr. Except Senior would have been 40 metres further out from goal on the boundary line with 15 defenders hanging off various parts of him.

[Remi Moses]

The big benefactors of obtaining barry is the other forwards will go under the radar. BTW an all points for Hawthorn's 50,000 members were in blazes were they tonight???
:rolleyes:

[stefoid]

true enough, barry will suck more than one defender to a contest, giving hill a good look at it.
hill seemed nervous last night though. Should have had 4 goals.

[Bulldog Revolution]

hill seemed nervous last night though. Should have had 4 goals.

Hills two shanks from close range surprised me, he's normally a pretty balanced and fluent set shot for goal

[chef]

Hills two shanks from close range surprised me, he's normally a pretty balanced and fluent set shot for goal

He dropped a couple of marks that he usually gobbles up too.

[The Coon Dog]

Hills two shanks from close range surprised me, he's normally a pretty balanced and fluent set shot for goal

I reckon Hill's the only indigenous player that can't kick around corners, all the other brothers just go back & banana them!

[Sockeye Salmon]

He dropped a couple of marks that he usually gobbles up too.

He dropped a pud 20m out right in front.

If it was a bag of shit it would have splattered all over him.

[Hotdog60]

Hills two shanks from close range surprised me, he's normally a pretty balanced and fluent set shot for goal

Doesn't Hill have a left foot?

I thought that a bad left foot kick would have had a better result than those right foot ones from that angle. Kicking left foot may make him think it through better.

Just a thought.

[BornInDroopSt'54]

He dropped a pud 20m out right in front.

If it was a bag of shit it would have splattered all over him.

Pure poetry!
Hopefully it was just a bad night for nerves for him and he doesn't lose belief in himself because of an assumed lack of the club's belief in him.

[Sedat]

For a bloke that came back from the off-season looking like Shallow Hal's girlfriend, Hill looked in very good nick physically last night. He must have done a power of work since Xmas.

[Rocco Jones]

For a bloke that came back from the off-season looking like Shallow Hal's girlfriend, Hill looked in very good nick physically last night. He must have done a power of work since Xmas.

Yep.

Josh Hill gets more combined love and hate from me during games than any other player I have ever seen.

[LongWait]

I had to laugh when Hall went to mark the ball at the top of the square in the second quarter only to see Josh float in and take the mark before he could get his hands on the ball. Hall walked past Josh and gave him a look that said "that's my area-dont do that again!"

I didnt realise Hall was so agile. A couple of those goals he kicked in the first half where he gathered the bouncing ball and snapped truly were Ablettesquesnr. Except Senior would have been 40 metres further out from goal on the boundary line with 15 defenders hanging off various parts of him.

Unlike Ablett Senior, Barry Hall has been and will continue to be unselfish and a great team player. I'd hope Hall's message to Hill was more like...If I'm going stand under the ball with 2 or 3 blokes trying to pole-axe me, you'd better hang on to those marks Josh...and kick the goals.

I'm pretty sure Hall knows he will be judged by the club and the football public by how much he improves the bulldogs team and forward-line in particular. Fevola has shown during his career what we don't want. Hall will be stoked if Hill kicks 40+ goals for the season, even if 20 are stolen from Barry.

[Mofra]

Hall actually released Hahn to do blocking/bullocking work too. One of Josh's F50 marks was due entirely to the other defenders getting caught behind Hahn.

Given his forays back too, I guess Welsh's swingman abilities are well covered this year.

[Scorlibo]

I reckon Hill's the only indigenous player that can't kick around corners, all the other brothers just go back & banana them!

I agree he's not your typical indigenous player with good crumbing skills, snaps and good agility, his best qualities are his sticky hands and his endurance.

[GVGjr]

I agree he's not your typical indigenous player with good crumbing skills, snaps and good agility, his best qualities are his sticky hands and his endurance.

I'd like to see him played on a wing more than being slotted into a forward pocket but I enjoy watching him play. If he can develop a bit more consistency, Hill will be a great player for us.

[stefoid]

I liked the look of the hawk's Peterson - seemed to be the bizzaro-world clone of hill - you know, the evil twin.

[LostDoggy]

Hill should have crumbed for Hall in that instance. Two players on the same team competing for the same ball often end badly with an easy clearance for the opposition. Hill wants senior time so wants to be noticed but the team comes first.

[The Adelaide Connection]

I know a lot of you were at the game, but i found it quite amusing that a few of the commentators started to bang on about the possibility that perhaps we have started going to Hall too much and that last year we were a team that spread the love and rarely had anyone kick bags.

Excuse me what? So first we are told that we will not win a flag without a key forward and now that our key forward may upset our winning formula? :confused:

For the record I do believe that there is a very real possibility that from time to time we will go for Hall when better options are on, but such is his prescence. I really don't think it will get to Carlton-Fevola levels.

[boydogs]

I know a lot of you were at the game, but i found it quite amusing that a few of the commentators started to bang on about the possibility that perhaps we have started going to Hall too much and that last year we were a team that spread the love and rarely had anyone kick bags.

Excuse me what? So first we are told that we will not win a flag without a key forward and now that our key forward may upset our winning formula? :confused:

For the record I do believe that there is a very real possibility that from time to time we will go for Hall when better options are on, but such is his prescence. I really don't think it will get to Carlton-Fevola levels.

I think the Fevola example distorts the situation a bit. At Carlton, they really struggled for goalkickers after Fev and Betts, the man at his feet. Hall is coming into the top scoring side, with plenty of goalkicking options. The main problem Carlton had with having Fev as the main target is that you can get good Fev and bad Fev - he can kick 8 goals in a half to win you a game, or do nothing but give away free kicks. Hall you would expect to be more consistent, but when he is not on song we do have other good scoring options.

[LongWait]

Hill should have crumbed for Hall in that instance. Two players on the same team competing for the same ball often end badly with an easy clearance for the opposition. Hill wants senior time so wants to be noticed but the team comes first.

If no-one else is able to compete overhead when Hall goes for a mark then we will become predictable and Hall will be a liability. Hill is a marking forward not a crumbing forward - the mark was there for Josh to take and he did so - exactly what the coach would want imo.

[always right]

If no-one else is able to compete overhead when Hall goes for a mark then we will become predictable and Hall will be a liability. Hill is a marking forward not a crumbing forward - the mark was there for Josh to take and he did so - exactly what the coach would want imo.

^^^^Spot on. If the mark is there to be taken...go for it.

[stefoid]

Hill should have crumbed for Hall in that instance. Two players on the same team competing for the same ball often end badly with an easy clearance for the opposition. Hill wants senior time so wants to be noticed but the team comes first.

Hill was in front and had a clear look at the ball. Do you want him to let it go past in case there is a team mate behind him? Hall had an opponent at his side, and good on him for out-positioning him, but I reckon you let the free guy in front fly for the mark, while the guy with the opponent blocks for him.

[LostDoggy]

I know a lot of you were at the game, but i found it quite amusing that a few of the commentators started to bang on about the possibility that perhaps we have started going to Hall too much and that last year we were a team that spread the love and rarely had anyone kick bags.
Excuse me what? So first we are told that we will not win a flag without a key forward and now that our key forward may upset our winning formula? :confused:

For the record I do believe that there is a very real possibility that from time to time we will go for Hall when better options are on, but such is his prescence. I really don't think it will get to Carlton-Fevola levels.

Umm, was watching the game on TV as well, and like you, was amazed to hear some of the comments. What the..* .. *...!!! Yeah, last year we get "can't go the next step without a power forward", and now, during our 2nd game of the year (and not even the real stuff), we are hearing that crap! Go figure :rolleyes: For the record, I don't care if at times we get "Hall" conscious - if he is on his game like Friday night, then I'm more than happy for the guys to look for him. As has been said on other threads, opposition teams get "Hall" conscious, and so hopefully leave the door for some of our other forwards. I, for one, will be interested to see how Baz and Johnno play together. It seemed to me that it took Johnno some time to understand (and perhaps even accept) Aker - I sure hope he adjusts to the big fella somewhat quicker :D

[The Adelaide Connection]

I think the Fevola example distorts the situation a bit. At Carlton, they really struggled for goalkickers after Fev and Betts, the man at his feet. Hall is coming into the top scoring side, with plenty of goalkicking options. The main problem Carlton had with having Fev as the main target is that you can get good Fev and bad Fev - he can kick 8 goals in a half to win you a game, or do nothing but give away free kicks. Hall you would expect to be more consistent, but when he is not on song we do have other good scoring options.

Yeah I agree the circumstances with Carlton and Fevola are very different, but I guess I was just using him as an example where he is the main avenue to goal and they did, on a lot of occasions, have eyes only for him.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Hill was in front and had a clear look at the ball. Do you want him to let it go past in case there is a team mate behind him? Hall had an opponent at his side, and good on him for out-positioning him, but I reckon you let the free guy in front fly for the mark, while the guy with the opponent blocks for him.

There was an instance early last year where Johnno was body on body with his opponent and Harbrow waited down for the crumb. After the ball when out of bounds Johnno gave Harbrow a spray because Johnno was deliberately stopping his opponent from getting a jump at the ball so Harbrow could mark it 3rd man up.

[LostDoggy]

If no-one else is able to compete overhead when Hall goes for a mark then we will become predictable and Hall will be a liability. Hill is a marking forward not a crumbing forward - the mark was there for Josh to take and he did so - exactly what the coach would want imo.

Two sets of hands on the ball of the same color jumper, one leading straight at it and one sideways take reminicent of Royce Hart. Little talk fellas. Can only see the coaches being happy with the resulting goal, not the play.

[chef]

Two sets of hands on the ball of the same color jumper, one leading straight at it and one sideways take reminicent of Royce Hart. Little talk fellas. Can only see the coaches being happy with the resulting goal, not the play.

Don't agree. If they both stayed down yes, but not if they both are going for the mark.

[Mantis]

Two sets of hands on the ball of the same color jumper, one leading straight at it and one sideways take reminicent of Royce Hart. Little talk fellas. Can only see the coaches being happy with the resulting goal, not the play.

From the stands it looked like Hall was very happy with Hill and gave him a complimentary pat on the back and some encouraging words after he had kicked the goal.

[chef]

From the stands it looked like Hall was very happy with Hill and gave him a complimentary pat on the back and some encouraging words after he had kicked the goal.

Hall is a great team player:)(apart from a couple of stupid brain explosions)

[LongWait]

Two sets of hands on the ball of the same color jumper, one leading straight at it and one sideways take reminicent of Royce Hart. Little talk fellas. Can only see the coaches being happy with the resulting goal, not the play.

I wasn't at the game but from the broadcast it looked like Hill had taken the mark cleanly without Hall touching the ball - Hill flew from the side but got in front and just plucked it cleanly.

[w3design]

Leigh Matthews was particularly lukewarm wasn't he...just couldn't sound excited about Hall, and carped endlessly about how it would have an effect on our midsize players. Maybe he just didn't enjoy seeing the Hawks lose. Time is the only way it will really tell, but it seems to me it can only add to our great variety in the forward line - if they become Hall-conscious, well and good..far better than the days Jono would attract the opposition's best backman because we had no one even resembling a forward..won't he love being a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th option.

[mjp]

After the ball when out of bounds Johnno gave Harbrow a spray because Johnno was deliberately stopping his opponent from getting a jump at the ball so Harbrow could mark it 3rd man up.

It's footy 101 - call him back, don't call him out.

Man in front takes the ball, man behind protects his back. BUT: You shouldn't be leading backwards in the forward line, so the lines can get blurry on occasion.

[The Adelaide Connection]

Leigh Matthews was particularly lukewarm wasn't he...just couldn't sound excited about Hall, and carped endlessly about how it would have an effect on our midsize players. Maybe he just didn't enjoy seeing the Hawks lose. Time is the only way it will really tell, but it seems to me it can only add to our great variety in the forward line - if they become Hall-conscious, well and good..far better than the days Jono would attract the opposition's best backman because we had no one even resembling a forward..won't he love being a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th option.

The reality is that Hall being Hall he has already done his job even if he never features in the bests. Firstly he has created such a buzz that bees have forgotten what they sound like and that can only be good for $$$ flowing into the club.

Most importantly, like you alluded to, he will demand the best defender and everyone gets to take a guy generally one peg down to what they are used to. I don't believe he will be dead weight, and the signs are obviously good, but even if he is everyone around him is now having an easier time.

He has already proved a good pickup. Now we wait to see if he has been an Amazing pickup. Can't wait.