Hodge, Judd or Bartel?

[GVGjr]

Great players from the 2001 draft but if we had the money right now and could get one of these guys which one would it be and why?

[The Coon Dog]

Hodge for me.

Has that bit of mongrel in him that makes his team mates know he's around. Gets his own ball, uses it well & is prepared to make it difficult for opponents to get it.

He can play down back or in the midfield. A tough hard bastard!

[KT31]

Interested to KnoW why you picked a early draft for this post.
For me we are already have to many players of this age group and think we would pass on all of them.
Although at a pinch I would select Hodge.

[GVGjr]

Interested to KnoW why you picked a early draft for this post.
For me we are already have to many players of this age group and think we would pass on all of them.
Although at a pinch I would select Hodge.

For years Judd was regarded as the standout but a few years on and all three are premiership players and they are very different midfield types (Hodge spending more time in the midfield now) but by my assessment there isn't too much between them.

[bornadog]

Hodge for me.

Has that bit of mongrel in him that makes his team mates know he's around. Gets his own ball, uses it well & is prepared to make it difficult for opponents to get it.

He can play down back or in the midfield. A tough hard bastard!

Totally agree, the very reasons I voted for Hodge.

2001 was probably one of the best draft years ever.

[chef]

Hodge for me.

Has that bit of mongrel in him that makes his team mates know he's around. Gets his own ball, uses it well & is prepared to make it difficult for opponents to get it.

He can play down back or in the midfield. A tough hard bastard!

What he said, Hodge would fit into our team the best.

If Judd hadn't wrecked his body he would still be the best out of this group IMO, but he is a shadow of himself nowadays.

[The Doctor]

The question is who would you want right now.

the answer for me is Jimmy Bartel.

He has been the best of the 3 at least for the past 18 months. Ablett takes a lot of the kudos but Bartel is a champ and in a quiet unassuming way a matchwinner, especially in big games.

[GVGjr]

The question is who would you want right now.

the answer for me is Jimmy Bartel.

He has been the best of the 3 at least for the past 18 months. Ablett takes a lot of the kudos but Bartel is a champ and in a quiet unassuming way a matchwinner, especially in big games.


I agree. Bartel slips under the radar a bit but he shouldn't be regarded as the 3rd wheel in this group. He goes about his job a bit quieter than Hodge and Judd but he is very effective.

[Go_Dogs]

All very good players, and let's be honest, we'd take any of them in a heart beat.

I think I'm going to side with TCD and say Hodge, he's simply the player who I rate as the most damaging, and also most enjoy watching. He's got a fantastic all round game (better than Judd's IMO), and is more damaging offensively and has a little more speed (than Bartel).

It's very interesting how players age, because I'm sure 2-3 years ago, it would have been Judd, hands down.

[Topdog]

Personally I think Bartel is the best of the lot at the moment but I would want Hodge in our team. Skilled and with plenty of mongrel which I believe we lack, esp. in the HB line.

[LostDoggy]

Picked Judd, just a sensational footballer. I have gotten sick of watching him carve us up every year, gets his own ball & uses it well. Runs all day & is pretty good on both sides of his body, basically carries Carlton on occasions.

I didn't pick Hodge because i don't like the way he plays, being a loose man in the back line all day isn't exactly what i like.

[angelopetraglia]

Judd. He does what he does with a bloke hanging off him for 120 min.

Hodge is a gem, but much easier coming off half back. Hodge would not have the engine to shake a tagger in guts like Judd.

[KT31]

For years Judd was regarded as the standout but a few years on and all three are premiership players and they are very different midfield types (Hodge spending more time in the midfield now) but by my assessment there isn't too much between them.

Thanks GVGjr

[AndrewP6]

Judd. He does what he does with a bloke hanging off him for 120 min.

Hodge is a gem, but much easier coming off half back. Hodge would not have the engine to shake a tagger in guts like Judd.

And he gets every minute of that to get a handball away too... ;)

[angelopetraglia]

Judd today. Delayed season start. 3 weeks off.

Helps himself to a lazy 30 touches, 15 contested possessions, 9 tackles, takes it inside 50 seven times and a goal. Not a bad afternoons work. IMHO he is the best midfielder going around.

[LostDoggy]

Have Hodgey in my Supercoach, and love the way he goes about his footy. Would have put him in my top 10 if he had a better 2009. Has started 2010 well.

Judd in his prime was the best player of the three, but his prime was always going to be short and sweet; his explosiveness was never going to last forever, although he has been cruelled by injury somewhat.

The one I voted for, and who will age the best of the lot will be Bartel -- he has never relied on explosive speed anyway, so will hardly miss it when he is on the wrong side of 30. He's as tough as the other two any day of the week, and would easily be a no.1 midfielder in any team except one with Gablett in it. A much more complete player than Selwood too, who seems to get more kudos (probably for being younger and faster). I think he (and Ling) is actually what makes Geelong tick as he just goes about his job where it's needed and does everything brilliantly and without much fuss. Kicks crucial goals too, and goalkicking mids are worth their weight in gold in the modern game.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Hodge.

His leadership is amazing. One of the best I've honestly seen in this area. He's a very smart player and is one of the toughest going around too. Beautiful skills, can play on smalls/talls and dominates in both the midfield and half backline. He's an unbelievable player and stands up when it so often counts.

Judd's best was better than all three, but it was very brief. Still a very good player but he's confined to the midfield and isn't as explosive as he once was. Bartel would be on par with Judd but can rest forward. For mine, Hodge is clearly the most damaging player.

[GVGjr]

When I started the thread I though Hodge will get the most votes mainly because of our needs and Judd will be next followed a fair way back by Bartel.
I wonder why Judd has been overlooked so much though? He's still brilliant but I wouldn't have thought he's far behind Hodge at all.

[Go_Dogs]

I wonder why Judd has been overlooked so much though? He's still brilliant but I wouldn't have thought he's far behind Hodge at all.

Judd has probably suffered a bit due to his form over the past couple of seasons not being as outstanding as his form with West Coast earlier on. Although, he showed on the weekend just how damaging he can be.

At the end of the day, it's such a line ball call that after any given weekend, any of them could justifiably be selected as the better/more suitable player.

[mighty_west]

I voted Hodge for many of the reasons above.

But was tempted to take Judd, imo has struggled to find his best form at Carlton due to their midfield, and team in general, as they say, good teams get the best of out players, including the superstars, having Judd alongside Cooney & Griff, Higgins, Boyd etc etc would be VERY tempting.

[wimberga]

On the above note MW,

Does anyone remember if we made contact with judd when he was leaving WCE? Im fairly certain we wouldn't have been able to get him but if we had.....

[LostDoggy]

I voted Hodge for many of the reasons above.

But was tempted to take Judd, imo has struggled to find his best form at Carlton due to their midfield, and team in general, as they say, good teams get the best of out players, including the superstars, having Judd alongside Cooney & Griff, Higgins, Boyd etc etc would be VERY tempting.

Coons would play second fiddle to Juddy the way he plays, don't know how that would work.

Bartel makes everyone around him better (Gablett and Selwood wouldn't be half as effective without Jimmy), so Coons and Griff would both suddenly become top 10/all-Australian types. And he will be going strong at 33-35, long after Hodgey and Juddy slow down into pale imitations of thier former selves, so we would get a lot more value out of a trade if done at the end of this season.

[Doc26]

Well I'm after a premiership this year so it's Juddy for me, then Hodgey.

All 3 sublime players. Just love Juddy's leadership and workrate in the midfield. Is tagged hard every week yet can break them, racks up midfield clearances and inside 50s. Is no coincidence that the Eagles midfield especially Kerr have struggled since his departure.

A midfield in 2010 of Judd, Cooney, Boyd, Hudson would do just nicely not to mention freeing up Cooney from the number 1 tag every week. Now what to do with Griff ? :)

[Doc26]

On the above note MW,

Does anyone remember if we made contact with judd when he was leaving WCE? Im fairly certain we wouldn't have been able to get him but if we had.....

If we did try I'm sure his number was diverted through to Dick Pratt. We wouldn't have stood a chance with Visy's 3rd party arrangement tied into the deal. Nice to dream though.

[LostDoggy]

If we did try I'm sure his number was diverted through to Dick Pratt. We wouldn't have stood a chance with Visy's 3rd party arrangement tied into the deal. Nice to dream though.

Could have promised him a lifetime of free suits from Peter Jackson.

ps. While we're on the topic of Visy and Pratt and what has happened to the Storm, surely if the AFL are fair dinkum about their cap and investigating Waldron's time at the Saints, they would also have a second look at Carlton's third-party agreements: after all, Pratt and Visy actually ARE convicted white collar criminals, so if anyone knows how to cook the books...

[Sockeye Salmon]

Edit: Bugger. Wrong thread.

[mighty_west]

Coons would play second fiddle to Juddy the way he plays, don't know how that would work.



Rotations these days, we would always have that burst player in the middle, and whilst both starting in the middle, who does Ling/Jones pick up, Judd or Cooney?

Re: Bartel, Geelong have many great mids, Corey, Bartel, Ablett, Selwood etc, similar in many ways to Brissy in their hay day, and West Coast mid 00's, great midfields allow great players to play at their peak.

That said, my first choice was Hodge. ;)

[LostDoggy]

Rotations these days, we would always have that burst player in the middle, and whilst both starting in the middle, who does Ling/Jones pick up, Judd or Cooney?

Re: Bartel, Geelong have many great mids, Corey, Bartel, Ablett, Selwood etc, similar in many ways to Brissy in their hay day, and West Coast mid 00's, great midfields allow great players to play at their peak.

That said, my first choice was Hodge. ;)

I thought of this very retort when I wrote my point! Haha.. it wasn't a throroughly researched position, of course. But I think my point stands -- Geelong works because Bartel is Bartel, and MAKES others great (Corey is similar). I don't think Juddy and Selwood would work in the same midfield, for example (unless they grew up in the same team and learnt to work together). They play far too similarly. Juddy and Gablett is a different case, Gabs would be on the end of all Juddy's hard work.

Actually, I just realised that I made a case for Juddy in our midfield. He would be the ultimate inside/outside that would complement our ball-winners, and free up Coons and Griff to be explosive runners on the end of his handballs.

Any of the three would improve our team no end.

And get us thrown out of the comp for salary cap rorting.

[Sockeye Salmon]

We couldn't get any of them without hiring Brian Waldron to manage it.

[mighty_west]

I thought of this very retort when I wrote my point! Haha.. it wasn't a throroughly researched position, of course. But I think my point stands -- Geelong works because Bartel is Bartel, and MAKES others great (Corey is similar). I don't think Juddy and Selwood would work in the same midfield, for example (unless they grew up in the same team and learnt to work together). They play far too similarly. Juddy and Gablett is a different case, Gabs would be on the end of all Juddy's hard work.

Actually, I just realised that I made a case for Juddy in our midfield. He would be the ultimate inside/outside that would complement our ball-winners, and free up Coons and Griff to be explosive runners on the end of his handballs.

Any of the three would improve our team no end.

And get us thrown out of the comp for salary cap rorting.

I was going to say, can we have all 3? :D

I'm sure we could make it our MISSION to find room in the cap!

[lemmon]

Hodge- Beautiful skills, great leader, versatile, stands up in the big games, tough mongrel. Yes please

[Twodogs]

When I started the thread I though Hodge will get the most votes mainly because of our needs and Judd will be next followed a fair way back by Bartel.
I wonder why Judd has been overlooked so much though? He's still brilliant but I wouldn't have thought he's far behind Hodge at all.



That's an easy answer IMO. Hodge understands every minute of every game he plays that football is a team game and sacrifices his game accordingly for the team's sake. Judd mostly plays for himself.

I'd have Hodge in a heartbeat.

[Ozza]

That's an easy answer IMO. Hodge understands every minute of every game he plays that football is a team game and sacrifices his game accordingly for the team's sake. Judd mostly plays for himself.
I'd have Hodge in a heartbeat.

You have to be kidding.

Judd does so much grunt work, has someone hanging off him every week and has the ability to bring others into the game all the time.

Judd is simply one of the best players I've ever seen - I'm completely stunned by the poll.

Hodge is a great player - but not at the level Judd is.

[Mantis]

That's an easy answer IMO. Hodge understands every minute of every game he plays that football is a team game and sacrifices his game accordingly for the team's sake. Judd mostly plays for himself.

I'd have Hodge in a heartbeat.

That's a silly statement TD.

Judd works as hard, if not harder than any player in the competition and is very selfless in his actions.

[Ozza]

Another thing on Hodge - is he has become a player that nobody is allowed to criticise.
Watching the weekend's game - he put teammates under the pump often with his trademark 'sweeping handballs', got caught plenty of times and really did nothing to settle a team that was disposing of the ball poorly and rushing everything.

Yet, by the end of the game - all the comments were 'Hodge has been brave', 'Hodge is trying to make the play'.

As I said earlier - he is a very good footballer - but he is given a fair bit of freedom to roam and chase the ball without an opponent most of the time.

[Doc26]

That's an easy answer IMO. Hodge understands every minute of every game he plays that football is a team game and sacrifices his game accordingly for the team's sake. Judd mostly plays for himself.

I'd have Hodge in a heartbeat.

:eek::eek::eek:


You have to be kidding.
Judd does so much grunt work, has someone hanging off him every week and has the ability to bring others into the game all the time.

Judd is simply one of the best players I've ever seen - I'm completely stunned by the poll.

Hodge is a great player - but not at the level Judd is.


Another thing on Hodge - is he has become a player that nobody is allowed to criticise.

Yet, by the end of the game - all the comments were 'Hodge has been brave', 'Hodge is trying to make the play'.


Concur with you Ozza.

Even looking at this poll based on our current needs we only need look back two weeks at the Brisbane game to highlight our midfield deficiencies. Although Hodgey is a class act and would be great to have him running the ball out of defense he generally isn't AS damaging nor demands the close checking attention that Juddy gets every week yet Judd still is so often THE point of difference.

Chris leaves the Eagles, they struggle, he returns from his Seagal punishment and straight up the Blues fortunes turnaround. The guy is a freak, gets his own ball, brings others into the game, is a clearance specialist and never stops running. Critically, he has the ability to make others around him rise up to another level.

And what is it with the media's sycophantic infatuation with Hodge ? Yes he's brave and hard at it but it's reached the point of being bloody ridiculous. He only needs to be in the vicinity of a contest to be showered with courage and bravery accolades as if he's the lone soldier out there.

[Twodogs]

You have to be kidding.

Judd does so much grunt work, has someone hanging off him every week and has the ability to bring others into the game all the time.

Judd is simply one of the best players I've ever seen - I'm completely stunned by the poll.

Hodge is a great player - but not at the level Judd is.


I'm not talking about bringing other guys into the play with handball and hitting them up with passes. I'm talking about sacrificing your own game for the overall benefit of the team. Things like covering your teammates direct opponent while he's doing something else or keeping an opponent out of the play.

For me the reason Hodge is in front of Judd is his selflessness and singleminded pursuit of team success. The fact he is a crazybrave bastard is a bonus.



That's a silly statement TD.

Judd works as hard, if not harder than any player in the competition and is very selfless in his actions.

OK maybe "Judd mostly plays for himself" is a bit OTT but are you saying that he is an ideal team man? That he always puts the team before himself?

[Mantis]

OK maybe "Judd mostly plays for himself" is a bit OTT but are you saying that he is an ideal team man? That he always puts the team before himself?


No player does, but he runs his guts out trying.

And I know you will say that he his defensive work is poor, but he is paid big $$'s due to his offensive strengths which as we have seen time and time again is as good as anyone elses in the competition.

[Ozza]

No player does, but he runs his guts out trying.

And I know you will say that he his defensive work is poor, but he is paid big $$'s due to his offensive strengths which as we have seen time and time again is as good as anyone elses in the competition.

I agree,

When someone is hanging off you the whole day - its pretty easy to be accountable the other way also!!

In any case, Judd had 9 tackles against Adelaide, another 5 on the weekend - and averaged just under 5 tackles per game last season. Hodge averaged under 4 tackles a game last year.

I'm not saying this is the only relevant stat - and I know Hodge spoils and pressures too - but my point is - Judd isn't ALL one way either.