Changes for Round 5

[Dry Rot]

I really hope the Willi guys went well today, because half our side deserve a boot up the arse.

But I suppose we have few options aside from Roughead.

[LostDog]

disgusted !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[AndrewP6]

Out - Minson, Moles, Hill
In - Roughead, Johnson (if he's right), Aker

[Scorlibo]

Out: Minson, Moles, Everitt, Hill
In: Johnson, Roughead, Grant, Stack.

[LostDoggy]

Not sure who will be dropped, but some names need to be looked at.

Possible outs: Hill, Moles, Minson & maybe Hahn.

Possible ins: Roughead, Johnson, Grant.

[Dry Rot]

Need to sort this out. On form we have the following games and likely results:

Crows W

Saints L

Melbourne dunno

Swans L

[lemmon]

Out- Minson, Moles, Hill
In- Roughead, Johnson, Grant

[comrade]

Hahn just did not look fit.

[The Coon Dog]

After a loss like that, there are about 8 of them that you feel should be dropped. After a couple of hours maybe I'll only want to drop 5 & by tomorrow I'll have 3 in the gun.

Just seemed to stop as if shot.

I reckon that was a real tough game last week against Hawthorn & both sides showed it with their displays this week.

[Doc26]

Hahn just did not look fit.

Either way Mitch is ineffective and just too damn slow.

Have also been supporting retaining Josh until now.

[G-Mo77]

I think it's time to shake it up a little. There are a lot of players running on cruise control and are getting a free ride.

Who were the better Willi players today? Anyone knocking at the door?

[Hotdog60]

If we don't pull our socks up, we will be luckily to make the top 4 let alone a grand final.

[mighty_west]

After a loss like that, there are about 8 of them that you feel should be dropped. After a couple of hours maybe I'll only want to drop 5 & by tomorrow I'll have 3 in the gun.

Just seemed to stop as if shot.

I reckon that was a real tough game last week against Hawthorn & both sides showed it with their displays this week.

Exactly right, which is one of the reasons i try not to post straight after a terrible performance such as tonight, and you just sense a massive over reaction with certain comments, one bad game doesn't make a bad team, we were clearly fatiqued something cronic, lake couldn't even walk.

That said, for looking at players to be dropped, is to look at players consistancy under performing, and not a one off, such as Murphy or Gilbee, Shaggy had a shocker, Everitt as well, yet has taken a steps forward this season until tonight.

Hill would have to be under pressure, Moles has struggled since the NAB Cup, and Minson continues to have terrible brain fades, i wonder if he had his papers stamped for next week after that kick out of bounds?

I would like to see Roughead given a game next week.

[LostDoggy]

After a loss like that, there are about 8 of them that you feel should be dropped. After a couple of hours maybe I'll only want to drop 5 & by tomorrow I'll have 3 in the gun.

Just seemed to stop as if shot.

I reckon that was a real tough game last week against Hawthorn & both sides showed it with their displays this week.

I don't think so. As Eade says, execution of skill and decision making is a mindset. I think that's what let us down. We haven't played good footy all year so far. We are lucky to lose by such a small margin.

Out: Minson, Moles, Hill
In: Roughead, Johnson, Grant

[LostDoggy]

Will is gone, moles and Hill will struggle, one out for Johnson. Roughy in obviously.

[LostDoggy]

I don't think so. As Eade says, execution of skill and decision making is a mindset. I think that's what let us down. We haven't played good footy all year so far. We are lucky to lose by such a small margin.

Out: Minson, Moles, Hill
In: Roughead, Johnson, Grant

Maybe a good game to bring Grant in against cows.

[Dry Rot]

Looking at everyone's in and outs, you'd have Aker playing at Willi next week?

[Desipura]

Very disappointed, we are lucky we did not lose by a greater margin. Our midfield run was non existent in the last 1.5 quarters.
A tall centre Half forward would be handy tonight.
I am confident Jones will be that player in the long term future.
In: Johnson, Aker & Roughead
Out: Hahn, Hill & Minson.
The game is getting quicker which makes Minson look even slower I reckon.

[AndrewP6]

Looking at everyone's in and outs, you'd have Aker playing at Willi next week?

Good point... my anger (and the Scotch) clouded my vision.

[GVGjr]

Did Addison do enough to stay in the side? He's been good at Williamstown and I think it gave him the best chance to perform well.

[The Coon Dog]

Did Addison do enough to stay in the side? He's been good at Williamstown and I think it gave him the best chance to perform well.

In a word, yes.

[LostDoggy]

Looking at everyone's in and outs, you'd have Aker playing at Willi next week?

Aker is down as a two week injury, so didn't think he was available for next week.

[LostDoggy]

I don't normally like making more than two changes, but I wouldn't be surprised with Johnson and Aker hopefully being fit and maybe a couple more pushing for spots. I don't mind seeing senior players dropped to pull their heads in, but I don't think it should come to that really, players like Murphy and Hargrave don't usually have two shocking performances in a row.
I do think Moles needs to go back to Williamstown, his decision making and disposal were really off tonight (and haven't been that great for the season)- Addison has more of a case to stay in than Moles does really, on tonight's performance. Hill will have to fight for his spot too, it's disappointing after only scraping in last week, but I guess it's hard to get a lot of touches when the ball doesn't go inside 50.

[GVGjr]

In a word, yes.

He's normally the whipping boy after a loss so I'm glad to see others in the firing line ;)

[Hotdog60]

Did Addison do enough to stay in the side? He's been good at Williamstown and I think it gave him the best chance to perform well.

Compared to the rest of the team I think he should stay, but he maybe unlucky because of Aker and Johnno coming back.

[AndrewP6]

Did Addison do enough to stay in the side? He's been good at Williamstown and I think it gave him the best chance to perform well.

I thought his hardness was good, and he wasn't the worst for disposal.

[Ozza]

I thought his hardness was good, and he wasn't the worst for disposal.

I'm not an Addison fan by any stretch - but he did a good job on Sherman tonight and was ok with the footy.

Only knock on him was when he gibbed in running back late in the game.

[Go_Dogs]

He's normally the whipping boy after a loss so I'm glad to see others in the firing line ;)

Agreed. It clicked for him tonight (as a wise man predicted wasn't far off), so let's hope that continues.

I didn't know he had that goal kicking ability in him, it was very impressive.




Ins: Roughead, Akermanis.

Out: Minson, Moles.

Hill for Johnson if Johnson gets up, otherwise potentially Hill for Grant. Hill did kick a nice goal tonight, and whilst it wasn't his greatest night, the delivery he received was generally very poor. I wouldn't mind seeing him get another game next week.

[aker39]

I don't care who comes in, just get rid of Josh Hill, he is a waste of space.

[Remi Moses]

Poor Poor Result . Once again lack of getting our hands on the ball!FFS come on Dogs pull the finger out FFS!!

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

[QUOTE=Griffen#16;146920]Agreed. It clicked for him tonight (as a wise man predicted wasn't far off), so let's hope that continues.

I didn't know he had that goal kicking ability in him, it was very impressive.

QUOTE]

I remarked in my match preview that I didn't think he had the ability to hurt the opposition on the scoreboard. Gald he proved me wrong.
I thought Dylan was good tonight.

Ins: Roughead, Johnno

Outs: Minson, Hill

If Aker is fit, then I think Moles goes out too.

[Remi Moses]

Compared to the rest of the team I think he should stay, but he maybe unlucky because of Aker and Johnno coming back.

Sick to death of the Ducks and Drakes with Johnson:mad:

[LostDoggy]

Ins: Roughead, Akermanis.

Out: Minson, Moles.

Hill for Johnson if Johnson gets up

Agree. Im sure Rocket is fed up with Will this past month to the point of letting him go get some sort of form at Williamstown, and having a chance to debut Roughie. Moles wasn't great but if you look at tonight's problems you dont go for the 3rd gamer, if Aker is ready its upto Moles to earn his spot again at Willy.

[Rocco Jones]

Do we really need both Williams and Everitt next week? Alongside two one dimensional ruckmen, we look very top heavy. It's just a personal opinion but I think we have been at least one runner short in all our games this year.

You guys all know my opinion on going in with two very limited ruckmen. Sure it looks good against the worst team and the worst ruck divison in the comp but coming up against quality has exposed us.

[Remi Moses]

Will Minson has to go that kick was deplorable
Addison was good,I just cannot get my head around that Gilbee hanball in the last quarter!Mitch Hahn is running in cement shoes surely J.Grant has to be looked at.Rocket said Johnson and Aker will be right for next week.Looks like Johnson's recovered from his flu related Achilles

[lemmon]

Did Addison do enough to stay in the side? He's been good at Williamstown and I think it gave him the best chance to perform well.

No Picken and Moles' bad form definitely helps him out, he had a relatively good game tonight and deserves another next week.

[becmatty]

Players who will be looked at: Minson (certainly OUT), Hill, Everitt, Moles, Williams, Hahn, Eagleton, Addison (though he was reasonable tonight)

Ins: Roughead, Akermanis, Johnson (Eade has said the latter two are atomatic inclusions next week), Grant (outside chance)

[Greystache]

I think it's time to shake it up a little. There are a lot of players running on cruise control and are getting a free ride.

Who were the better Willi players today? Anyone knocking at the door?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Willi won by 36 points, strong last quarter performance.

Williamstown
Goal Kickers: M. Little 5, L. Jones 4, A. Hooper 3, B. Davies, L. Cartelli, J. Grant, B. Stack
Best Players: B. Johnson, E. Carr, P. Faulks, C. Lockwood, L. Markovic, M. Little

[Mantis]

Do we really need both Williams and Everitt next week? Alongside two one dimensional ruckmen, we look very top heavy. It's just a personal opinion but I think we have been at least one runner short in all our games this year.



Who is this imaginary 'runner' you mention?

- Ward - injured.
- Aker - injured.
- Picken - injured.
- Johnson - injured.
- Reid - injured.
- Wood - injured.

- Stack - struggling.

Who else is there?

[GVGjr]

Do we really need both Williams and Everitt next week? Alongside two one dimensional ruckmen, we look very top heavy. It's just a personal opinion but I think we have been at least one runner short in all our games this year.



I suppose this begs the question of which extra runner gets included outside of Akermanis?
With Johnson, Ward and Picken out with injuries and possibly Hill on form I'm not sure we have the depth especially players in tip top form to add an extra runner.

Edit, I just read the Mantis response

[ReLoad]

Ok, im going to overreact.

We are one loss away from a crisis, and im deadly serious when i say that, looking at our draw, and what is needed to finish top 2 or 4. we are in trouble.

Why are we in trouble? i guess thats for rocket to sort out, but our intensity and skills are deplorable, in every game we have played this year we have seriously lacked it. Even the tigers game, the errors we made, crikey! we were just lucky the tigers are crap.

Ok so here is the changes this week:

Out: Minson, Hahn, Moles.
In: Roughead, Johnson, Akermanis.

What about those othersive forgotten, here is why they should stay:
Williams: He needs consistent game time in him, butchering him is not an option until a long term view can be formed.
Hill: We lost the game last night when brennan went in the middle for the lions, and the ball never went forward of the centre AT ALL, hardly his fault.

Other notes:
Grant, he has done NOTHING for williamstown I dont know why people bandy his name around. Fails to present and lacks intensity.
We missed the class of Callan Ward last night, that extra quality midfeilder would have made a difference.

Coaching issue: The flood, Why? We were getting smashed in the middle and our defenders were hugely under the pump, when we did get the ball the middle was so crowded we could not get out, we needed to take a risk not shut the game down, WE HAVE NEVER FLOODED WELL, why start now?

Rankings:
Players 5/10
Coaches 4/10
Supporters 7/10 - a few of us made the journey
Highlight: Getting frequent flyer miles.
Lowlight: spending money to watch that get served up and only ending up with FF miles as a consolation.

[BulldogBelle]

Wil is almost a certainty to allow Roughead to debut. That's great for the club as Roughy has all the markings of a 200 game/premiership player. Acker and Johnno are not debatable - so out goes Hill and Moles (sorry Brodie, but you will get more opportunities).
Where would Grant play if he come in for Hahn? He's no CHF. It would mean to much structural change, and good teams don't make four changes in a week.
So-
Roughead for Minson
Acker for Hill
Johnno for Moles
Moles to get another chance is either Acker or Johnno don't come up.

Well done to Addison. No pressure this week.

[BulldogBelle]

ReLoad - Great post. When your behind, you need to play attacking football. Going defensive means you've conceded and are just trying to limit the damage.

Again - Great post. I bet you cring when the crowd cry "Just kick it long" and "Pick him up".:-)

[ReLoad]

ReLoad - Great post. When your behind, you need to play attacking football. Going defensive means you've conceded and are just trying to limit the damage.

Again - Great post. I bet you cring when the crowd cry "Just kick it long" and "Pick him up".:-)

I'll be honest im just a supporter, i really dont understand the complete tactical picture of AFL football an all the variables the coaches are dealing with, i can only imagine what they have to think of, and i guess its why they have 10 people in the coaches box?

But to me it was crystal clear, why go all out defense when you need to win the game, not save the game.

Anyways as rule we have a great coach and coaching staff, thier performances in the finals series last year were outstanding, they could not have done anything more with what they had at thier disposal, i just think they got it wrong last night.

and yes for the record, i always cringe at the fans "kick it long" and "someone get on him!"

Im thinking we need to form a "Woof forum" coaches box on the Doug Hawkins wing, and call our own game one day :)

I wonder what the Adelaide game will bring us, because ive heard Neil Craig is one game away from getting the boot.

[Jasper]

Who is this imaginary 'runner' you mention?

- Ward - injured.
- Aker - injured.
- Picken - injured.
- Johnson - injured.
- Reid - injured.
- Wood - injured.

- Stack - struggling.

Who else is there?

The decision to go with one less runner has been made when many of the players were fit, it is a structural decision by the match committee to go with two unmobile rucks.

Those calling for Grant and Roughead to be included need to watch them play - they aren't ready for AFL. Yet Liam Jones continues to impress with his numbers and comments from those who have seen him, I haven't seen him and would be interested on people's thoughts on him as an option.

My concern with our list is that we appear a little slow, with Griffen, Cooney and Harbrow giving us speed. Picken is also quick and his absence hurts us. Aker, Johnson and Eagleton have lost pace. While Moles is not quick enough. Boyd, Cross, Addison Gilbee, Gia, Ward etc aren't quick.

The speed of the game is such now I tend to think carrying two non athletic ruckmen with no other strings to their bow is obsolete. I think we need to risk Everitt in the ruck and lose Minson thereby freeing up space for another runner. To allow Hudson to rest and to protect Everitt, you could have Hudson to take high impact centre bounces and then run to the bench while Everitt runs off half back/wing as a follower around the ground.

Interested on who could replace Hahn.

Changes as follows:

If Johnno and Aker fit, bring both in.
Minson and Moles out

Hahn for Jones, give both players a taste (Hahn of twos; Jones of what it takes to play AFL)

[GVGjr]

Hahn for Jones, give both players a taste (Hahn of twos; Jones of what it takes to play AFL)

I can't talk about how Jones performed yesterday but from the games I have seen this year and those from last year he's a fair way off the mark.
I question the benefit of playing a youngster before they are ready as it certainly didn't work for Grant last year.

[G-Mo77]

Those calling for Grant and Roughead to be included need to watch them play - they aren't ready for AFL. Yet Liam Jones continues to impress with his numbers and comments from those who have seen him, I haven't seen him and would be interested on people's thoughts on him as an option.

Just wondering if you have seen them play this year? From all the reports I read Grant was very good last week which is why he was named as an Emergency. To my knowledge Roughhead has also been very consistent for Willy. I've only ever seen Jones once and that was in the slop in Canberra. I would have loved to see him get another gig in the NAB cup.


I question the benefit of playing a youngster before they are ready as it certainly didn't work for Grant last year.

I don't think it would hurt. It gives a young player an idea of what they need to do to get to the top level. Some players can make that step quickly others don't. You'll never find out unless you try. It also sends a message to players who are on cruise control. If you don't work hard enough then go back to the VFL. IMO there are quite a few players out there who are on shaky ground, it is time to send this message IMO. Unfortunately our hands are a little tied with injuries.

[GVGjr]

I don't think it would hurt. It gives a young player an idea of what they need to do to get to the top level. Some players can make that step quickly others don't. You'll never find out unless you try. It also sends a message to players who are on cruise control. If you don't work hard enough then go back to the VFL. IMO there are quite a few players out there who are on shaky ground, it is time to send this message IMO. Unfortunately our hands are a little tied with injuries.


I'm not sure about that. Promoting a young player before they have earned it and then seeing them get minimal possessions can't be good for their confidence. Getting 20 plus possessions for Williamstown would have been better for him.

Bringing them after some solid performances would give most young players the best chance of succeeding.

[G-Mo77]

I'm not sure about that. Promoting a young player before they have earned it and then seeing them get minimal possessions can't be good for their confidence. Getting 20 plus possessions for Williamstown would have been better for him.

Bringing them after some solid performances would give most young players the best chance of succeeding.

True I was never suggesting to promote someone who didn't deserve it. I think Roughhead, Grant and even Jones have put together some good games to warrant a selection in the next few weeks. A lot of people think they're not ready but if their form is good at VFL level then give them a go at AFL level.

[Rocco Jones]

Who is this imaginary 'runner' you mention?

- Ward - injured.
- Aker - injured.
- Picken - injured.
- Johnson - injured.
- Reid - injured.
- Wood - injured.

- Stack - struggling.

Who else is there?

I didn't know about Wood being injured and I agree that we were very limited this week. We had options in the first three rounds and still went in with unbalanced teams IMHO.

I think we are horribly unbalanced for a highly rated side. Aker is back next week, I really hope Eade and co don't go down their usual path of just dropping kids like Moles after a poor performance.

[GVGjr]

True I was never suggesting to promote someone who didn't deserve it. I think Roughhead, Grant and even Jones have put together some good games to warrant a selection in the next few weeks. A lot of people think they're not ready but if their form is good at VFL level then give them a go at AFL level.

My original response was specifically about Jones. I didn't see yesterdays game but I have seen a fair bit of him and whilst I think he is a ripper I don't think we could promote him and for it to work. It would smack as desperation.

Even Grant is only just hitting his straps and I'd like to see him do a bit more.
I've frequently made my concerns about promoting Roughy so I won't go over them again but I do think Minson's form might necessitate Roughead's promotion.

[OLD SCRAGGer]

if we don't pull our socks up, we will be luckily to make the top 4 let alone a grand final.


guys, guys, guys. It's only round 4, i know we were beaten, and i was angry as well, but some of the people here are beginning to sound like richmond supporters. Lets not panic just yet eh?????

[Go_Dogs]

I really hope Eade and co don't go down their usual path of just dropping kids like Moles after a poor performance.

He isn't a kid, and he has offered us very little for 2 weeks in a row. I know I've been a pretty hard marker on his performances over the pre-season and season thus far, but really, what is he offering us at the moment?

He struggles to get to enough contests, his ball use and decision making (both offensively and defensively) isn't fantastic, and due to his inability to get to enough contests his defensive work struggles.

His likely saving grace will be the fact that Ward, Picken, Wood and Reid are out injured. Can someone please tell Howard to hurry up and finish his rehab, because we need his type, right now!

[Rocco Jones]

Fwiw here's what I'd do:
In: Aker, Johnno
Out: Minson, Hill

I think either a ruck spot or Williams needs to be sacrificed for another runner. Ironically, I don't think Minson has been THAT bad, just that we are very balanced.

What I think will happen:
In: Aker, Johnson
Out: Moles, Hill

[westbulldog]

IMO Moles didn't look quite up to it, Eagleton is past his used by date and Josh Hill occasionally makes a guest appearance. We were worked over in centre clearances and did not handle the slippery ball well. Given the number of inside 50's Brisbane had, the performance of Brian Lake was outstanding. He clearly beat Brown on the night. One might knock Will Minson's deplorable kick but Crossy doesn't have any penetration in his kicks at all. Not a time to panic though it is early days.

[LostDoggy]

Seems to be a bit of fowards bashing happening at the moment. If you can't get the ball past half way how are the forwards supposed to have an impact?

Eade has stated that Johnson and Aker are automatic inclusions this week so:

In's - Johnson, Aker, Roughead
Out's - Hill, Minson, ????

Not blaming Hill for last night's debacle but if a forward needs to make way you'd think it would be Hill.

Big Will is living at number 1, Struggle Street at the moment. I'm at the point where I can't look when he gets the ball. Also, has discipline problems on the field this year. Just gives away too many clummsy free kicks.

Not sure who the third out will be? Moles hasn't set the world on fire however do we or the Club expect him to be getting 40 touches and killing it? No, this is reserved for blokes like Boyd, Coons and Cross. Moles is new to this level and will take time.

Hahn wasn't good last night and I haven't seen a lot of him this year but if he was as slow and ordinary last night as people are saying he might be unlucky.

Eagleton was coming back from injury so you'd expect he'd get the benifit of the doubt.

DFA seemed to go ok last night.

Eade has never been one to make too many changes so I'm not sure what to expect.

[Rocco Jones]

He isn't a kid, and he has offered us very little for 2 weeks in a row. I know I've been a pretty hard marker on his performances over the pre-season and season thus far, but really, what is he offering us at the moment?

He struggles to get to enough contests, his ball use and decision making (both offensively and defensively) isn't fantastic, and due to his inability to get to enough contests his defensive work struggles.

His likely saving grace will be the fact that Ward, Picken, Wood and Reid are out injured. Can someone please tell Howard to hurry up and finish his rehab, because we need his type, right now!

I agree with that, I know he isn't a kid but he is only a first year player.

I have no issues with Moles being dropped in isolation but I hope we go beyond just dropping the younger/inexperienced guys. I really think we need to make some tough calls on the likes of Minson,Williams and Hahn.

[Go_Dogs]

I really think we need to make some tough calls on the likes of Minson,Williams and Hahn.

Yep, can't disagree with most of that.

For mine, Minson is gone this week. Needs to go back and spend some time at Willy, kick a few goals, take a few grabs and sort himself out.

Hahn we need more from, and he has had a couple of quiet weeks. He still lacks consistency and struggles to work himself into a game when it's not happening for him.

Williams I wasn't too disappointed with, and we just need to keep getting games into him.

Shaggy and Murph obviously have more credits in the bank, but they'll want to turn it around quickly as both put in absolute shockers.

[LostDoggy]

Wil is almost a certainty to allow Roughead to debut. That's great for the club as Roughy has all the markings of a 200 game/premiership player. Acker and Johnno are not debatable - so out goes Hill and Moles (sorry Brodie, but you will get more opportunities).
Where would Grant play if he come in for Hahn? He's no CHF. It would mean to much structural change, and good teams don't make four changes in a week.
So-
Roughead for Minson
Acker for Hill
Johnno for Moles
Moles to get another chance is either Acker or Johnno don't come up.

Well done to Addison. No pressure this week.

What he said.

[mjp]

Can someone please tell Howard to hurry up and finish his rehab, because we need his type, right now!

Howard?

Wow. He hasn't even played senior VFL footy yet...and hasn't even been running! If you had said Ward then I would understand, but looking to a rookie for salvation? C'mon.

Let's not be dreamers when it comes to the kids. Our team is good enough (though I agree with Rocco that we are at least one mid short - injuries are making this difficult to fix) but we ran into a good side a week after an incredibly tough game and a plane trip. The only miracle was we were in position to WIN half-way through the last quarter.

In short? Don't worry too much about it. As an aside, looking at Moles and Hill and Minson etc is not going to fix it...we win last night if our BEST players - Murphy and Cooney and to a lesser extent Higgins - are able to perform to their capabilities. Getting some more out of Gilbee and Shaggy would have helped, but those three mids/forwards who make us go struggled to get into it - Murphy esp. - and the result was the result.

[Doc26]

For mine, Minson is gone this week. Needs to go back and spend some time at Willy, kick a few goals, take a few grabs and sort himself out.

Hahn we need more from, and he has had a couple of quiet weeks. He still lacks consistency and struggles to work himself into a game when it's not happening for him.

Williams I wasn't too disappointed with, and we just need to keep getting games into him.

Shaggy and Murph obviously have more credits in the bank, but they'll want to turn it around quickly as both put in absolute shockers.

Agree.

Not surprisingly our deficiencies are being exposed by the better sides and somewhat masked by the poorer ones. Although last night's game wasn't lost in our forward fifty unless the hard call on Will and Mitch is finally made, round 5 against a struggling Crows outfit will be another opportunity for them to build up more false credit. What appears a constant after a terrible loss is the same old deficiencies in these players being exposed.

I'm not yet convinced about using the likes of an Everitt as 2nd ruck on an ongoing basis but happy to give it a go this week as the current option is not working for us.


we win last night if our BEST players are able to perform to their capabilities. and the result was the result.

Spot on. We need for them to become more consistent and to rise to occasions that call for it rather than go missing.


IN: Johnson, Akermanis

OUT: Hahn, Minson

[Go_Dogs]

Howard?

Wow. He hasn't even played senior VFL footy yet...and hasn't even been running! If you had said Ward then I would understand, but looking to a rookie for salvation? C'mon.

It was a bit of tongue in cheek, because obviously he is miles off it at the moment due to his surgery and rehab. We need runners though, and looking down our list, there aren't many options at all...



In response to the rest of your post, Cooney went alright last night, and Higgins wasn't that bad. We also had Griffen playing well, Lake playing well, Hall kicking a few, Harbrow was good. When these guys play well, we should win.

Murphy is a massive key, and we were non-existent across half forward with him not playing well. If we are relying on Murph to play CHF and do an outstanding job every week for us to win, then we are in for a long season, we simply need to be able to find another avenue into our forward half.

Shaggy was terrible, and whilst Gilbee made a few errors, he was far from our worst.

[Hotdog60]

guys, guys, guys. It's only round 4, i know we were beaten, and i was angry as well, but some of the people here are beginning to sound like richmond supporters. Lets not panic just yet eh?????

It's not so much sounding like Richmond supporters, and yes it's still early days.
But if the performances keep on going the way they have in the last 4 rounds we are going to be behind the eightball.
The team needs to lift.

[LostDoggy]

There were heaps of players down last night - the second quarter was our best quarter but other than that we were outplayed. Dumb handballs to blokes standing still - Brisbane zoned off really well which stopped our run. When we did move the ball into half forward we coughed it up too easy.

Changes I would make - Outs: Minson 4 shockers in a row dumb mistakes and really poor skills, Hahn has been ordinary since the NAB cup as well - forward pressure is his job and that was no existent last night and this season.

Rockets to Murph - he dropped way too many marks! Gia - disappeared in the second half. Hill, Cooney and Eagleton need to produce more..

Ins: Roughie, Johnson & Aker if right (Eagle or Moles out)

Sidenote: IF our players push back ie zone / flood etc - the fwds / half fwds have to run, Run, RUn, RUN forward - too many times we had no one to kick too when we had the ball at half back!

[DOG GOD]

Against the crows, they only have maric and an injured Tippett for ruck duties, so could be a time to give Everitt a go in the ruck when Hudson rests. He did well against the Pies rd 22 last year. This would give us another runner who we dearly lacked last night, so my changes would be...

In: Johnno, Aker,
Out: Minson, Hahn

[Go_Dogs]

Against the crows, they only have maric and an injured Tippett for ruck duties, so could be a time to give Everitt a go in the ruck when Hudson rests. He did well against the Pies rd 22 last year. This would give us another runner who we dearly lacked last night, so my changes would be...

I think it's certainly a worthy consideration this week DG, and could help us be a bit fresher for the big game against St Kilda. At the same time, it's probably a good opportunity for Roughead to debut.

[boydogs]

Who is this imaginary 'runner' you mention?

- Ward - injured.
- Aker - injured.
- Picken - injured.
- Johnson - injured.
- Reid - injured.
- Wood - injured.

- Stack - struggling.

Who else is there?

This is why Moles must stay in the side. If Johnno and Aker are ready, Hahn and Hill make way

[mjp]

Cooney went alright last night, and Higgins wasn't that bad. We also had Griffen playing well, Lake playing well, Hall kicking a few, Harbrow was good. When these guys play well, we should win.

Murphy is a massive key, and we were non-existent across half forward with him not playing well. If we are relying on Murph to play CHF and do an outstanding job every week for us to win, then we are in for a long season, we simply need to be able to find another avenue into our forward half.

Shaggy was terrible, and whilst Gilbee made a few errors, he was far from our worst.

Yep - Cooney and Higgins were OK. But that was sort of my point. In games like that we need to see their names at the top of the best player list...not in that group of 'contributors' between 'good' and 'poor'. It is pretty harsh I know but that is what we require from our elite performers when the side as a whole is having a bit of a 'down' night.

If only Griffen would run from contest to contest like that every week? He is the most frustrating player I can remember - he is a potentially elite performer but his level of on-ground impact varies wildly from week to week...was that elimination final really back in 2006?

Just on Lake for a moment - he did play OK. But was anyone else wishing they had Chris Grant available to play on Brown in the last quarter? Lake is an elite player, Brown is an elite player...Brown never gave Granty a moment of trouble (in my memory anyway) and yet he really was sticking it to Lake in the last term.

[LostDoggy]

I was very lucky to see three games last night on TV. I watched the first half of Brisbane Lions Vs the Western Bulldogs, then HT caught up on a bit of the Collingwood Magpies Vs Hawthorn Hawks, after that it was an interesting move by the AFL to call off the original match at the GABBA and play 2 quarters of the Brisbane Lions Vs Western Bipolars.


If Minson isn't out next round then i'll make alternate plans.

Someone above said that Roughead and Grant weren't ready for AFL. Well my friend, If those two aren't ready for a crack then we have major problems because i couldnt think of another youngster(s) at Willy who is.

[Hotdog60]

Williamstown
Goal Kickers: M. Little 5, L. Jones 4, A. Hooper 3, B. Davies, L. Cartelli, J. Grant, B. Stack
Best Players: B. Johnson, E. Carr, P. Faulks, C. Lockwood, L. Markovic, M. Little

Interesting that out of the best players only one Bulldog got mentioned.

[hujsh]

With Picken seemingly out for 8 or so weeks could Patrick Rose be the runner we're looking for? Even if it is only until Ward Wood or Reid is fit enough to take his spot. Or would we not want to rule out Picked for 8 or so weeks?

[Go_Dogs]

Yep - Cooney and Higgins were OK. But that was sort of my point. In games like that we need to see their names at the top of the best player list...not in that group of 'contributors' between 'good' and 'poor'.

If only Griffen would run from contest to contest like that every week? He is the most frustrating player I can remember - he is a potentially elite performer but his level of on-ground impact varies wildly from week to week

Just on Lake for a moment - he did play OK. But was anyone else wishing they had Chris Grant available to play on Brown in the last quarter?

I probably had Cooney as slightly better than OK, but yes, I see your point and can't disagree with it at all.

Griffen has had 3 very good weeks in a row, so I think he is starting to get to that level. His work rate has been very good thus far.

To be fair, I'm not sure Brown has ever been as fit and in such dominating form as he currently is. Lakey just ran out of petrol tickets at the end of the night.

[BulldogBelle]

Williamstown
Goal Kickers: M. Little 5, L. Jones 4, A. Hooper 3, B. Davies, L. Cartelli, J. Grant, B. Stack
Best Players: B. Johnson, E. Carr, P. Faulks, C. Lockwood, L. Markovic, M. Little

Interesting that out of the best players only one Bulldog got mentioned.

Good to see Markovic in the best players - maybe a chance to get a game soon?

[The Pie Man]

Griffen has had 3 very good weeks in a row, so I think he is starting to get to that level. His work rate has been very good thus far.


I was critical of Griffen last year as I didn't think he was fulfilling his potential - I do now.

Anyone else curious to see how Grant would go in the forward line in place of Hahn?

If Johnson & Aker are passed fit, then Moles & Hill seem the obvious outs, like for like. Not convinced Minson is in real trouble yet (inched closer to it, but not sure he got there) and don't believe they'll be even thinking of Grant for Hahn like I am.

[Hot_Doggies]

Good to see Markovic in the best players - maybe a chance to get a game soon?


With respect, if Lucas Markovic gets a game this year we are in a LOT of trouble.

Would prefer to see Jones get a game before Grant for what it's worth.

[GVGjr]

With respect, if Lucas Markovic gets a game this year we are in a LOT of trouble.

Would prefer to see Jones get a game before Grant for what it's worth.

Any particular reason for that?

[chef]

Grant, he has done NOTHING for williamstown I dont know why people bandy his name around. Fails to present and lacks intensity.


He went alright against Collingwood(not sure about how he went against GC) and apparently is doing everything that is asked of him on the training track. Has been in the emergencies the last few games and IMO isn't far off getting some game time.

[Hot_Doggies]

Any particular reason for that?

He works harder when the ball is in the area. Would provide another tall target in the forward fifty.

[chef]

I was critical of Griffen last year as I didn't think he was fulfilling his potential - I do now.

Anyone else curious to see how Grant would go in the forward line in place of Hahn?
If Johnson & Aker are passed fit, then Moles & Hill seem the obvious outs, like for like. Not convinced Minson is in real trouble yet (inched closer to it, but not sure he got there) and don't believe they'll be even thinking of Grant for Hahn like I am.

I am.

[LostDoggy]

Anyone else curious to see how Grant would go in the forward line in place of Hahn?

If Johnson & Aker are passed fit, then Moles & Hill seem the obvious outs, like for like. .

What about Johnson & Aker in for Moles & Hahn?

Or -

Out - Minson,Hahn

In - Johnson, Aker

with moles keeping his spot as an extra midfielder, and everitt pinch hitting in the ruck?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Moles was shocking last night. If we didn't have so many injuries, there would be no way to justify him retaining a spot.

Two of Minson, Hahn and Hill need to be dropped. I'd say Minson and Hahn purely because Mitch never gets dropped when he should.

Roughy, Grant, Aker and Johnson all possible inclusions.

[GVGjr]

He works harder when the ball is in the area. Would provide another tall target in the forward fifty.

My concerns are about promoting Jones is that he's erratic in front of goal and finds 30mtrs a challenge plus he isn't anywhere near fit enough at the moment. He's got a lot of talent but he isn't ready.

I don't think he works any harder than Grant but yes he is tall.

[Hot_Doggies]

My concerns are about promoting Jones is that he's erratic in front of goal and finds 30mtrs a challenge plus he isn't anywhere near fit enough at the moment. He's got a lot of talent but he isn't ready.

I don't think he works any harder than Grant but yes he is tall.

Surprised by that, i think Liam's defensive pressure is a real highlight.

[Rocco Jones]

It seems to me that the Jones and Grant in calls come from an 'anything is better than this' base. While they might look the goods every other week in the VFL (and that's being nice) they don't have the fitness/physical conditioning needed for the top level. I think it's an area that is overlooked by many.

I want Eade to finally drop some 'regulars' but not purely for the sake of making changes. Remember Grant's game last year? He looked like a chain smoking fat bloke.

[The Pie Man]

It seems to me that the Jones and Grant in calls come from an 'anything is better than this' base. While they might look the goods every other week in the VFL (and that's being nice) they don't have the fitness/physical conditioning needed for the top level. I think it's an area that is overlooked by many.

I want Eade to finally drop some 'regulars' but not purely for the sake of making changes. Remember Grant's game last year? He looked like a chain smoking fat bloke.

But after a solid pre-season and VFL form, he does look a different prospect to the VFL sectonds player he finished last season as.

I wouldn't promote Jones yet (though 4 goals yesterday is very good news) though Grant is in a make or break time in his career, and in my view there may just be an opportunity around the corner

[LostDoggy]

Might be an idea to try Addison in the fwd line to give some defensive pressure.

Hill and Hahn gave nothing and I can't believe Gia scored 3 goals. He was unsighted most of the night. Expect more from the captain.

[GVGjr]

Surprised by that, i think Liam's defensive pressure is a real highlight.

In what games has he displayed that attribute?

[LostDoggy]

But after a solid pre-season and VFL form, he does look a different prospect to the VFL sectonds player he finished last season as.

I wouldn't promote Jones yet (though 4 goals yesterday is very good news) though Grant is in a make or break time in his career, and in my view there may just be an opportunity around the corner

If you also read the interview he had last year, after his first game he finally knew what it took play in the AFL. He has improved over this pre season & may well be ready for another crack at AFL level, time will tell.

[Hot_Doggies]

In what games has he displayed that attribute?

Every time i have seen him play.

Stands out like dogs balls.

[GVGjr]

Every time i have seen him play.

Stands out like dogs balls.

He played about 7 games in the reserves last year and I can think of two that he might have done this. It might be a strength of his but why promote someone who is underdone physically and fitness wise and has just two senior games of VFL experince just because he applies some pressure?

[Hot_Doggies]

He played about 7 games last year and I can think of two that he might have done this. It might be a strength of his but why promote someone who is underdone physically and fitness wise and has just two senior games of VFL experince just because he applies some pressure?


I was looking at another forward option. I was comparing Grant v Jones and believe Jones has more to offer.

If we are going to be slow, we may aswell be a bit taller.

[mjp]

All the Grant / Jones stuff is great. Tell me again how we win without getting the ball inside the forward 50m arc? We could have had Templeton, Whitten and Grant up there against Brisbane and it wouldn't have made a single bit of difference.

[LostDoggy]

OUT - Minson (should have atleast a week at Willy so he realises he has to actually play well to stay in the side), Hahn, Hill (I think dropping him for a couple of games will do him well)

IN - Roughhead (deserves a game in the seniors and I think this week is a good week for him to come in) and 2 of Grant/Johnno/Aker.

[BulldogBelle]

All the Grant / Jones stuff is great. Tell me again how we win without getting the ball inside the forward 50m arc? We could have had Templeton, Whitten and Grant up there against Brisbane and it wouldn't have made a single bit of difference.


Totally agree!

And with that we could have had Kennedy, Whitten, Grant, Henderson etc all in our back 50m, and the Lions forwards would have still tore us a new one in 3rd and final quarters

Our mid fielders were flat footed, didn't chase, weren't hungry, coughed the ball up, made numerous skill errors etc


Whats the problem then?
Lack of conditioning
Over conditioning
Illness
Poor discipline
Lack of leadership / inspiration


Ins and Outs
In
Aker and Johno

Two guys that need to stand up and show the team how games are won. They do that with their mouths and by putting their bodies over the ball especially

Out
Hill and Minson

Both need a spell at Williamstown to get some confidence up

[LostDoggy]

Are people content with Hudson doing the all the ruck work, or bulk of?

[azabob]

Are people content with Hudson doing the all the ruck work, or bulk of?

No not at all.

I also wonder who they think will do the ruck work.

To win the Grand Final or finals you need 2 ruckman.

[Rocco Jones]

Are people content with Hudson doing the all the ruck work, or bulk of?


No not at all.

I also wonder who they think will do the ruck work.

To win the Grand Final or finals you need 2 ruckman.

I tell you what boys, I watched a side last night who did pretty well with one ruckman.

Two specialist rucks are ideal, but at least one of them needs to add some value elsewhere. I have read posters saying we should just play Will and Hudson in the ruck, the pair averaging 50% would place an enormous burden on our already ordinary looking running depth.

[LostDoggy]

I tell you what boys, I watched a side last night who did pretty well with one ruckman.

Two specialist rucks are ideal, but at least one of them needs to add some value elsewhere. I have read posters saying we should just play Will and Hudson in the ruck, the pair averaging 50% would place an enormous burden on our already ordinary looking running depth.

Will doesn't, he isn't mobile enough for today's modern game. I would love to see Roughy given a go some time, just to see if he can handle the AFL & i think he is a hell of a lot more versatile than Minson.

Only other option if we were to go with Hudson as our only ruck, is Everitt doing some chop out work. Who knows, he could turn into a Ryder/Brennan type footballer there.

[Hotdog60]

Tiller played in the 2nds, does anyone know how he went?

Do you think he maybe an option if he's get some form after injury?

[Rocco Jones]

Will doesn't, he isn't mobile enough for today's modern game. I would love to see Roughy given a go some time, just to see if he can handle the AFL & i think he is a hell of a lot more versatile than Minson.

Only other option if we were to go with Hudson as our only ruck, is Everitt doing some chop out work. Who knows, he could turn into a Ryder/Brennan type footballer there.

Yep. When you're first ruckman offers nothing elsewhere, the role of your 2nd ruck changes. Will spends most of his TOG out of the ruck. I actually don't think Dre is really suited to the role but neither is Will. I really am not trying to straight out criticise Minson, more that I think that you play two out and out ruckmen at your own peril in the modern game.

[LostDoggy]

We just really need to start producing some good football for 4 qtrs. None of this small spurts of brilliance. Minson will proabably get droped for Roughead. Roughy will have an average game, minson will proabably start for Willi and get his spot back for the big game against the Saints.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Yep. When you're first ruckman offers nothing elsewhere, the role of your 2nd ruck changes. Will spends most of his TOG out of the ruck. I actually don't think Dre is really suited to the role but neither is Will. I really am not trying to straight out criticise Minson, more that I think that you play two out and out ruckmen at your own peril in the modern game.

It's beginning to become that way with the likes of Clark, Ryder, Kreuzer and Naitanui coming through in recent years.

If both our rucks are in form it's OK. When one struggles, our balance doesn't look great. However, as you said we don't have another player suited to the role. Everitt can pinch hit at the very least - but we'd need more than that.

Perhaps the biggest question is whether or not Roughy can offer anything up forward? If he can, then structurally it might be a better option for us.

[Bulldog4life]

I tell you what boys, I watched a side last night who did pretty well with one ruckman.
Two specialist rucks are ideal, but at least one of them needs to add some value elsewhere. I have read posters saying we should just play Will and Hudson in the ruck, the pair averaging 50% would place an enormous burden on our already ordinary looking running depth.

Melbourne also had one ruckman and won well. I have always been against one ruckman but now I'm having second thoughts. Maybe not with every game. The commentator at the Melbourne game even mentioned that with Jamar being the only ruckman they have an extra runner in which was a good move.

[LostDoggy]

I don't think you can go in with just Hudson, so if Minson goes Roughead has to come in..

Which leaves who gets dropped for Acker and Johnson? I think Hill is in trouble primarily because he really struggles in physical games, this is something he will need to work through. Not sure who else gets dropped, it would be a big call to drop Hahn, but maybe its time for a big call.

Just on Minson, I have to feel a bit sorry for the fella, gives his absolute all every week, just lets himself down with poor skill and over eagerness to exert a physical presence.

[chef]

I tell you what boys, I watched a side last night who did pretty well with one ruckman.

Two specialist rucks are ideal, but at least one of them needs to add some value elsewhere. I have read posters saying we should just play Will and Hudson in the ruck, the pair averaging 50% would place an enormous burden on our already ordinary looking running depth.

Sandilands looked pretty stuffed in the last quarter and the Saints benefited from it.

As we saw against Hawthorn last week, you can't let a mid field get a free ride which is what happens in the forth quarter if you only have one ruck.

[Hotdog60]

Sandilands looked pretty stuffed in the last quarter and the Saints benefited from it.

As we saw against Hawthorn last week, you can't let a mid field get a free ride which is what happens in the forth quarter if you only have one ruck.

I think you do need two ruckmen, the problem we have at the moment is that both our ruckmen are just that, only ruckmen.

This won't be an issue once Hudson retires in a couple of years and then Will will be the dedicated ruck with Cordy and Roughead sharing the backup and playing forward.

I suppose we need Will to add another string to his bow in the interim.

[EasternWest]

I thought his hardness was good, and he wasn't the worst for disposal.

Good to see the DFA love after a good performance. Though it's grudging for some (above). Disposal efficiency of 94% "wasn't the worst"... You're a hard taskmaster AP6!!!:D:D

[Topdog]

Our run from the backline was disgraceful on the weekend and Murphy's shocker didn't help what has already looked like a dysfunctional forward line.

Moles had a very poor game, as did Hill.

Besides 2 poor mistakes I don't think Minson was that bad. Half of his problems are coming from no runners being around him. Why is it that Hudson always has someone running behind him to give off a handball but Will is always being forced to kick?

[stefoid]

We dont want to run huddo into the ground during the regular season. Remember he is 30+ with a history of back problems.

[LostDoggy]

Did Addison do enough to stay in the side? He's been good at Williamstown and I think it gave him the best chance to perform well.

Addison played well and will stay in the side

Out Minson Moles and maybe Hill
In Roughy Aker Johnno

[bornadog]

Our run from the backline was disgraceful on the weekend and Murphy's shocker didn't help what has already looked like a dysfunctional forward line.

Moles had a very poor game, as did Hill.

Besides 2 poor mistakes I don't think Minson was that bad. Half of his problems are coming from no runners being around him. Why is it that Hudson always has someone running behind him to give off a handball but Will is always being forced to kick?

Your post basically sums up the game.

The only thing I would add is that the midfield turned over the ball far too many times. How many times did Boyd's handballs miss their target, how many times did Crossies kicks go to the opposition and Griffen must have been caught with the ball at least 5 times and his kicking didn't hit targets enough times.

[Desipura]

Your post basically sums up the game.

The only thing I would add is that the midfield turned over the ball far too many times. How many times did Boyd's handballs miss their target, how many times did Crossies kicks go to the opposition and Griffen must have been caught with the ball at least 5 times and his kicking didn't hit targets enough times.
and how many times did the ball spill out of Everitts hands?
and how many times did Hill not take a mark and not provide defensive pressure?
and how many times..........

[Mantis]

The only thing I would add is that the midfield turned over the ball far too many times. How many times did Boyd's handballs miss their target, how many times did Crossies kicks go to the opposition and Griffen must have been caught with the ball at least 5 times and his kicking didn't hit targets enough times.

The question needs to be raised:

How can we take the next step when we have the same experienced players making the same mistakes week in/ week out?

[DOG GOD]

The question needs to be raised:

How can we take the next step when we have the same experienced players making the same mistakes week in/ week out?

That is the burning question Mantis. Is it confidence? Mental? who knows....what i do know is that it needs to be fixed ASAP. Leadership is lacking on the field and we desperately need a FIT Johnno out there guiding the troops. Players like Hahn and Hill need to get their mojo back.

The problem is that we don't have consistant performers at Willi who are severly knocking on the door. If Grant had had 4 stellar performances in the 2's then Hahn and Hill would be feeling the pressure...but its not to be atm.

Players like Coon, Griff and Higgo really need to take it to another consistant level of 4 qtrs, and bring the others into the game.

Picken could be a big loss for us.

[LostDoggy]

First half against Hawks, Second half against Brizzy, getting slaughted at the stoppages!!

[Mantis]

It was plain to see on Saturday night that we ran out of legs in the 2nd half against Brisbane so that leads me to this proposal.

We play Adelaide this Friday night coming off another 6 day break after having played in warm & humid conditions. Adelaide have been shitful over the past month and barring a minor miracle we will beat them comfortably this week.

So come Wednesday or Thursday this week we have the same players struggling with general soreness do we think about resting them so that they are fighting fit come the St.Kilda game the following week? This will give a reprieve to the players who are under-performing, but perhaps if we rest up the likes of Higgins, Cross, Boyd or Hargrave (if they require it or the others that do) we will see the benefits down the track.

I know you don't want to take any team lightly, but we really have to think about keeping our key players fresh for what is a bloody long season.

[LostDoggy]

This begs the question did we put too much effort into the NAB cup?

Here we are 4 matches in and we are looking to rest players because they are weary. This time last year they were jumping out of their skin.

Did we go too hard too early?

Otherwise, something is seriously wrong.

[The Underdog]

It was plain to see on Saturday night that we ran out of legs in the 2nd half against Brisbane so that leads me to this proposal.

We play Adelaide this Friday night coming off another 6 day break after having played in warm & humid conditions. Adelaide have been shitful over the past month and barring a minor miracle we will beat them comfortably this week.

So come Wednesday or Thursday this week we have the same players struggling with general soreness do we think about resting them so that they are fighting fit come the St.Kilda game the following week? This will give a reprieve to the players who are under-performing, but perhaps if we rest up the likes of Higgins, Cross, Boyd or Hargrave (if they require it or the others that do) we will see the benefits down the track.

I know you don't want to take any team lightly, but we really have to think about keeping our key players fresh for what is a bloody long season.

But do we have anyone who can come in for Higgins, Cross or Boyd. We are struggling for mids at the moment. I'm not sure we even have one guy who can come in for one of those guys. At least if we're going like for like. Aker and Johnno won't be running around in the midfield too much. Fine in theory but I'm not sure we have the cattle to do it at this point.

[LostDoggy]

The question needs to be raised:

How can we take the next step when we have the same experienced players making the same mistakes week in/ week out?

Begs the question - maybe we don't have the depth we thought we did. Players not banging on the door to get into the side (ala Geelong last few seasons)

[Happy Days]

Begs the question - maybe we don't have the depth we thought we did. Players not banging on the door to get into the side (ala Geelong last few seasons)

That's because they're all injured...

[Bulldog4life]

That's because they're all injured...

You've hit the nail on the head unfortunately.

[LostDoggy]

Hudson will need someone to give him a chop out if he goes in alone so maybe we could just have Everitt in the ruck with him if the M.C doesnt feel Roughhy is ready, Everitt played pretty good in the ruck in rnd 22 vs Collingwood. Maybe give Minson a shot at being the number 1 ruck, hes played well being number 1 in the past.

[Sockeye Salmon]

It was plain to see on Saturday night that we ran out of legs in the 2nd half against Brisbane so that leads me to this proposal.

We play Adelaide this Friday night coming off another 6 day break after having played in warm & humid conditions. Adelaide have been shitful over the past month and barring a minor miracle we will beat them comfortably this week.

So come Wednesday or Thursday this week we have the same players struggling with general soreness do we think about resting them so that they are fighting fit come the St.Kilda game the following week? This will give a reprieve to the players who are under-performing, but perhaps if we rest up the likes of Higgins, Cross, Boyd or Hargrave (if they require it or the others that do) we will see the benefits down the track.

I know you don't want to take any team lightly, but we really have to think about keeping our key players fresh for what is a bloody long season.

You almost have to start thinking about rotating players like the European soccer teams do when they have Champions League commitments.

[Doc26]

So come Wednesday or Thursday this week we have the same players struggling with general soreness do we think about resting them so that they are fighting fit come the St.Kilda game the following week? This will give a reprieve to the players who are under-performing, but perhaps if we rest up the likes of Higgins, Cross, Boyd or Hargrave (if they require it or the others that do) we will see the benefits down the track.

I know you don't want to take any team lightly, but we really have to think about keeping our key players fresh for what is a bloody long season.

Hey ease up Mantis this would be dire to my SuperCoach chances ;)

[GVGjr]

I don't think you can go in with just Hudson, so if Minson goes Roughead has to come in..


Neither do I. Given Minson's form and Roughead's inexperience even at the state level it shows just how light on our playing list is for ruck man.

[Rocco Jones]

It will be interesting to see whether we make structural changes. The Blues seemed to have no problems holding Adelaide despite going in with a small backline. As much as I have pushed the extra runner cart, we are really struggling for running depth.

[choconmientay]

Matthew Boyd may not be in the start line up for round 5 ... here in the news ... http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/bulldog-matthew-boyd-has-surgery-to-repair-broken-hand/story-e6frf9jf-1225855659399

[AndrewP6]

Matthew Boyd may not be in the start line up for round 5 ... here in the news ... http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/bulldog-matthew-boyd-has-surgery-to-repair-broken-hand/story-e6frf9jf-1225855659399

Bloody hell :( Anything else, God?

[Hotdog60]

If Matthew Boyd doesn't get up for Friday who do we see taking his role?

Could Moles do it?

What about Andrejs Everitt?

Or do you try Dylan Addison?

With most of or in and under players injured it becomes an interesting problem.

[LostDoggy]

Wow. When you look at it now our injury list is actually starting to add up!!

Thank goodness we're playing Adelaide this week.

[choconmientay]

Actually, now we are getting tested if our team have some depth or not. For a PS contender, we surely must overcome these obstacles?! For me it is not all that bad because the season is still early. Now there are a lot of chances for young guys to stand up and proclaim their places in the team. It is better to start slow but finish strong :)

[Sedat]

As much as I have pushed the extra runner cart, we are really struggling for running depth.
Expect to see Johnno and Aker spend more time in the middle this week to assist with the rotations. With Boyd likely to miss, I'd keep Moles in the team this week despite his poor performance up in Brisbane - there is literally no running midfield cover available for selection at the moment.

[choconmientay]

Expect to see Johnno and Aker spend more time in the middle this week to assist with the rotations. With Boyd likely to miss, I'd keep Moles in the team this week despite his poor performance up in Brisbane - there is literally no running midfield cover available for selection at the moment.


Moles had one bad game out of 3. For a rookie ( which mistakes are still acceptable) I would just keep him in the team. That is part of the learn process he has to go through to become a better player

[bornadog]

Expect to see Johnno and Aker spend more time in the middle this week to assist with the rotations. With Boyd likely to miss, I'd keep Moles in the team this week despite his poor performance up in Brisbane - there is literally no running midfield cover available for selection at the moment.

Eagleton needs to stand up this week.

[LostDoggy]

THey all need to stand up this week!

[chef]

Out Boyd, Hill and Moles
In Johnson, Akermanis and Grant

[The Underdog]

Wow. When you look at it now our injury list is actually starting to add up!!

Thank goodness we're playing Adelaide this week.

They're playing badly but I'd never underestimate them, especially considering where we are at with form and injuries.

[Mofra]

Out Boyd, Hill and Moles
In Johnson, Akermanis and Grant
Not sure we can drop Moles given we will already be struggling for running power.
Johnson wont be able to spend too much time in the midfield and Aker has lost a yard of pace.
Will be interesting to see how the match committee handles this week.

[KT31]

Wow. When you look at it now our injury list is actually starting to add up!!

Thank goodness we're playing Adelaide this week.

Boy have those words haunted me since the mid 90's.

[LostDoggy]

God I hope Boyd gets up, does anybody have any more news to suggest he will or wont?

[LostDoggy]

He won't suggested by him being put as an Out.

[Mantis]

He won't suggested by him being put as an Out.

Do you want to have another go with what this comment should read and relate to?

[LostDoggy]

Boydy :( Hard as nails, he'll play.

I was concerned about this last year when we delisted O'Keefe. Whether rightly so or not, we didn't seem to have many young midfielders coming through to cover for the likes of Cooney, Boyd, Cross and Griff. Ward was, and when not injured, is part of the setup. Reid is currently injured but he fits the bill somewhat. The recruitment of Moles has helped in this area but when you look at the Willy first and seconds you don't see midfields containing Bulldogs listed players. Hopefully wecan keep the injuries to midfielders to a minimum this season.

[The Coon Dog]

I was concerned about this last year when we delisted O'Keefe.

Forget O'Keefe, if he was worth persevering with in some way, shape or form one of the other 15 clubs would have drafted or rookied him. They didn't.

[LostDoggy]

Forget O'Keefe, if he was worth persevering with in some way, shape or form one of the other 15 clubs would have drafted or rookied him. They didn't.

He is, don't worry about that.

My point was more about the body type needed to play the type of midfield role to cover the players mentioned. ward is developing it, so is Reid but they're injured at the moment and would seem 3 to 4 rounds away after they're recovered.

[Desipura]

Forget O'Keefe, if he was worth persevering with in some way, shape or form one of the other 15 clubs would have drafted or rookied him. They didn't.
Much like Barlow and to a lesser extent Podsiadly. There are always a few who slip through the cracks.

[comrade]

Much like Barlow and to a lesser extent Podsiadly. There are always a few who slip through the cracks.

I’m not sure how those two names are relevant; they’ve achieved their success due to being overlooked and THEN working their backsides off to improve themselves.

O’Keefe didn’t fall through the cracks. He was given a golden opportunity and wasn’t good enough to take it.

[chef]

Forget O'Keefe, if he was worth persevering with in some way, shape or form one of the other 15 clubs would have drafted or rookied him. They didn't.

GC didn't want him either.

[The Coon Dog]

Much like Barlow and to a lesser extent Podsiadly. There are always a few who slip through the cracks.

No not all like those two!

[Desipura]

I’m not sure how those two names are relevant; they’ve achieved their success due to being overlooked and THEN working their backsides off to improve themselves.

O’Keefe didn’t fall through the cracks. He was given a golden opportunity and wasn’t good enough to take it.
They are relevant in that if he works hard, he can still be picked up. Podsiadly was rookied by Collingwood back in 1999 but did not make the most of his opportunity.

Peter Bell initially played 2 games for Freo, they thought he was too small and too slow. No other club showed any real interest. He went on to become a best and fairest and premiership player who went on to captain an AFL side
I have learnt you cannot totally discard any player anymore.

[chef]

They are relevant in that if he works hard, he can still be picked up. Podsiadly was rookied by Collingwood back in 1999 but did not make the most of his opportunity.

Peter Bell initially played 2 games for Freo, they thought he was too small and too slow. No other club showed any real interest. He went on to become a best and fairest and premiership player who went on to captain an AFL side
I have learnt you cannot totally discard any player anymore.

That is correct, but you can't hang on to them for too long either nowadays.

[Sedat]

They are relevant in that if he works hard, he can still be picked up. Podsiadly was rookied by Collingwood back in 1999 but did not make the most of his opportunity.

Peter Bell initially played 2 games for Freo, they thought he was too small and too slow. No other club showed any real interest. He went on to become a best and fairest and premiership player who went on to captain an AFL side
I have learnt you cannot totally discard any player anymore.
If you have a glaring deficiency (such as foot speed) you can still make the grade if you work extremely hard in other areas, and if you are elite in others. Barlow can find the footy and can run all day, Pods can take a strong grab - that's why these guys have been given another chance. O'Keefe was in the bottom 2-3 players on our list from an aerobic fitness perspective, and that coupled with his lack of foot speed was the reason that he was overlooked by all other clubs in the off season. If he works his butt off and makes himself extremely fit over the next 2-3 seasons, he might be a show to become a mature age rookie down the track. But he would not add anything in the way of what we currently lack at the moment - and frankly we are not in short supply of mid sized half-forwards who lack a yard of pace and are not overly defensive.

[Desipura]

If you have a glaring deficiency (such as foot speed) you can still make the grade if you work extremely hard in other areas, and if you are elite in others. Barlow can find the footy and can run all day, Pods can take a strong grab - that's why these guys have been given another chance. O'Keefe was in the bottom 2-3 players on our list from an aerobic fitness perspective, and that coupled with his lack of foot speed was the reason that he was overlooked by all other clubs in the off season. If he works his butt off and makes himself extremely fit over the next 2-3 seasons, he might be a show to become a mature age rookie down the track. But he would not add anything in the way of what we currently lack at the moment - and frankly we are not in short supply of mid sized half-forwards who lack a yard of pace and are not overly defensive.

I dont disagree with what you have written about O'Keefe. He may never make it due to your points made above. Pods has always been able to take a grab, the introduction of 2 new teams along with the mature age rookie has assisted him in getting on Geelong's senior list.
Never say never.

[Mofra]

O'Keefe was in the bottom 2-3 players on our list from an aerobic fitness perspective, and that coupled with his lack of foot speed was the reason that he was overlooked by all other clubs in the off season.
Yes - and bearing this in mind, even if he was on our list now he's no chance to replace Boyd who works his arse off for the entire game. O'Keefe was a classic case of a guy who can coast though on guile and natural talent in all grades bar the bigtime.

[LostDoggy]

A good test this, and a revealing one for our depth and the thinking of Eade and the MC I think.

I think there are a couple of aspects to the problem, midfield depth, team structure and team/selection culture.

I have tried analysing our midfield rotation by splitting the group up into pure mids and mid/forwards. I have then listed each in terms of suggested importance to the team with those in bold thought to be unavailable this week.

Pure mids
Cooney, Boyd, Griffen, Cross, Picken, Ward, Eagleton, Reid, Moles

Cooney #1 due to demonstrated game breaking ability
Boyd #2 for sheer consistency
Grifen # 3 for potential (increasingly realised)
Cross # 4 for contested ball winning and stoppage lockdown
Picken # 5 Perhaps the biggest reason for our harder edge last year, #1 tagging option for fast/mobile skillful mids
Ward # 6 steady improving hard inside ball winner with improving spread and good disposal

The next group could be described as players on the fringe of selection
Eagleton: could be harsh on him, as at his best he is in the main group due to run and offensive potential, can be a liability defensively.
Reid: Still ahead of Moles based on AFL performance, tackling and hardness around the contest in the Hawthorn and Geelong games last year was a real feature
Moles: Showed a lot in the preseason, clean by hand, strong and mobile, has failed however to really ignite in the season proper.

Mid/Forwards (I left Johnno out as he is really a permanent forward)
Acker, Higgins, Gia, Hill, Addison, Rose(?)

Acker #1: still works up the ground and through the middle. Proven ability to break matches open.
Higgins #2: class to burn and can be extremely damaging but can also fade in and out of contests.
Gia #3: Can be effective on the lead or passing into the 50, needs space to work in though.


On the fringe
Hill #4: Can be effective as a link player/runner on the flank or a marking target in the 50, questions on defensive game.
Addison#5 A suprise but has now been used a few times as a defensive forward and shows a surprsingly good snap, can run in the middle although he tends to run into contests with his head down and does not evade well.
Rose: Unknown quantity for us or at this level, smart lead and tough for Willy, good hands on the mark.

Of the pure mid group based on my ranking we are missing 3 of our best 6 and one fringe player leaving only 5 of 9. At our best last year we would have had 6 pure mids in our team, Friday will probably see us play with 5. We should have all mid forward options available this week probably looking to play four of them. This may mean that Acker, Higgins and Gia must play a larger midfield role than normal and may argue for Addison's inclusion for his defensive qualities.


So far we have also played Everitt who seems to be a wildcard, by which I mean that I am not yet sure if or where he fits in.I think Eade and MC are trying to develop him in a utility role but I am unsure if he has yet cemented his place or the place of this role in the team.

Out from last week would be Boyd (inj.) replaced with Acker, if Boyd plays then Moles might be in the gun. Who goes out for Johnno is harder...I am not sure who to drop out of Addison Hill or Everitt but I think Andrejs this year has more runs on the board than Josh and Dylan should be rewarded for a good game.

In terms of some key position players I would echo the questions raised on Hahn, Minson and Williams, all of whom have had some poor perfromances over rounds 1-4. Structurally a well performed Hahn at CHF, Minson in the Ruck, Williams at CHB and Everitt as a utility option are things we might want in our best team. The question is how long do we spend trying to get the theoretical best team playing well before we go develop plan B? We would not want to be dropping too many more games trying to figure this all out.


Factors driving selection for the key position players in particualr vary depending on whether we view dropping players as a) finding/ developing alterntives eg. Hahn-Grant/Jones, Williams - Everitt/Boumann, Minson -Roughead, b) sending them a message or c) believing they will improve by working on their game at Willliamstown.

In terms of reason a) I do not think that any of the idenitified alternative players are thought to be ready to make a contribution come september therefore game time may only be considered due to injury, rest requirements or form problems for other players.

Resons b) probably comes down to the players in question and the culture and approach the club wants to set. St Kilda were widely prasied in 08 for dropping Dal Santo and Milne sparking a better effort from them in playing to team rules, however one could say that on the other hand tough selection stances with Maguire, Hudghton and Ball failed to get the best from those players. Ultimately in the StKilda example they have gone with a team/structure first culture and mentaility with great success.

For our own club, selection decisions for Ray in 08 and Hill in 09 could be viewed as creating serious issues with those players, Ray went to the Saints and Josh Hill blew the start to his pre-season, coming back out of condition and unmotivated. I think the balance between player development, team develpment and culture development is extremely difficult to manage well. I also think that the Bulldogs culture is less team/structure based and is more dependant on the individual player compared to say St Kilda.

As regards question c) the question is will the player improve more for the Bulldogs playing in the AFL or in the VFL?? The argument for dropping the player is to allow them to rebuild confidence playing on weaker opponents in a less intensive environment, the down side is the readjustment required once back at AFL level. This has to be balanced with our ability to cover their absence.

Therefore my suggested ins are

In: Johnno and Acker

Out: Boyd and Hill

Don't want to panic at this stage however the call on Minson, Williams and Hahn (Minno in particular) must be made soon or we will run out of time.

PS sorry for the long post, don't get a chance to post often so I am overcompensating :)

[EasternWest]

PS sorry for the long post, don't get a chance to post often so I am overcompensating :)

Hard work, but a good read. Obviously considered. Dunno who this Acker bloke is though. Is he related to Aka? Or a distant cousin of our Aker?

[EasternWest]

They are relevant in that if he works hard, he can still be picked up. Podsiadly was rookied by Collingwood back in 1999 but did not make the most of his opportunity.

Peter Bell initially played 2 games for Freo, they thought he was too small and too slow. No other club showed any real interest. He went on to become a best and fairest and premiership player who went on to captain an AFL side
I have learnt you cannot totally discard any player anymore.

Aaron Fiora? He was like the Bulldogs 23rd player when we played him. Horrible.

[soupman]

I'm not sure we can afford to drop Hill. With all our midfielders missing I think we might have to restructure the side a bit.

I think with our midfield likely missing Boyd now on top of the others we are going to struggle to fill out the spots from reserves players, as the only fit one who is not a rookie and vaguely resembles a midfielder is Easton Wood, and I don't think he has played both the past two weeks.

So my solution is to put Josh Hill into the midfield off a wing. Sure he's been average these last few weeks, but this works on a number of levels:
-Hill was very damaging in his first few games for the Doggies playing off a wing, arguably having a major influence on both the St.Kilda and Adelaide matches in early 2007.
-Hill tends to use the ball well by foot, both in field kicking and kicking for goal on the run. Set shots he struggles with.
-Yes, he has been given numerous chances. But this benefits the side, potentially turns him into a more versatile (and damaging) player, and hopefully we can exploit the fact that he is a dangerous runner who can take a contested mark around the ground.

I can also see Everitt and Gilbee spending time through the midfield, but I feel Hill into the middle will be beneficial, specially as I am unsure of Aka's capability in there now.

[LostDoggy]

Hard work, but a good read. Obviously considered. Dunno who this Acker bloke is though. Is he related to Aka? Or a distant cousin of our Aker?

Thanks for the feedback and for making it though I sem to be stuck in report writing mode. Regarding 'Acker' I am tempted to say he is the gamebreaking, freak goal kicking version not Aka, the guy who fumbled all though the Prelim last year...but I might just change the way I write his name..now how do I do a sheepish smiley...

[The Coon Dog]

but I might just change the way I write his name..now how do I do a sheepish smiley...

http://yahoofreak.com/emoticons/Animal%20Emoticons/smiley%20sheep.gif

[EasternWest]

Thanks for the feedback and for making it though I sem to be stuck in report writing mode. Regarding 'Acker' I am tempted to say he is the gamebreaking, freak goal kicking version not Aka, the guy who fumbled all though the Prelim last year...but I might just change the way I write his name..now how do I do a sheepish smiley...

Ha ha. Nice work.:D

[LostDoggy]

O'Keefe was a classic case of a guy who can coast though on guile and natural talent in all grades bar the bigtime.

How do we know this? Never played in the big time. Not saying you're wrong but until two weeks ago everyone was still saying Pods didn't have what it took to cut it in the big time too. Sometimes players are just overanalysed/overlooked -- can't tell me that Pods or O'Keefe would be worse than some of the players at Richmond.

[LostDoggy]

You almost have to start thinking about rotating players like the European soccer teams do when they have Champions League commitments.

I don't know why we don't already do this. Our seasons are interminably long, our games go forever, and we play the most physical code of football on the planet.

We have lists of 40+ players, we should be utilising this to the max. It is currently used primarily (or exclusively, in some cases) as an incubator for youth, but I think a savvy club can extend the senior playing ranks a lot more than is currently done with recycled players to keep your list fresh for the pointy end, and would probably be more competitive than a tired but more talented 22 in any case.

We just have to get over the myth of youth always being preferred to a recycled player with known strengths and weaknesses.. maybe Brisbane, and to a lesser extent Sydney and Freo may help finally dispel that philosophy as a default 'best choice'.

[Mofra]

How do we know this? Never played in the big time. Not saying you're wrong but until two weeks ago everyone was still saying Pods didn't have what it took to cut it in the big time too. Sometimes players are just overanalysed/overlooked -- can't tell me that Pods or O'Keefe would be worse than some of the players at Richmond.
O'Keefe was in the bottom 4 at the club for aerobic capacity, and every game I saw him in he managed to get the ball via superior positioning rather than running ability. It would agree that 17 teams agree with this assessment, including Richmond.

I remember in his last game, K-Mac took himself off the ground 7 minutes into the last quarter even though he knew he was playing for his career because he was stuffed - he couldn't run. His running abilities were better than Guy's. A midfielder who can't run these days wont cut it - AFL is a running game.

[Desipura]

How do we know this? Never played in the big time. Not saying you're wrong but until two weeks ago everyone was still saying Pods didn't have what it took to cut it in the big time too. Sometimes players are just overanalysed/overlooked -- can't tell me that Pods or O'Keefe would be worse than some of the players at Richmond.
I agree, Pods is a classic case. Its not as if he is any better as a player today as he was 2 years ago.
Its also the reason Buddy Franklin got picked later than he did. In his interview, they thought he was a little strange and had a very casual approach.
In fairness, you want to take the safe approach with your first pick and pick a player you are confident will play alot of games for your club.
O'Keefe on the other hand will only make it if he increased his fitness levels to the eilte level, otherwise he will be playing in the SANFL and getting pissed on weekends. Sorry to get off the topic.

[LostDoggy]

Why do we play open shoot-out football as often as we do? A game where your opposition team is getting 36 shots on goal tell you that it's pretty open. We can't even beat crap teams like Carlton when going cowboy, so why keep doing it?

We've looked our best in finals when we play a lockdown, low-scoring, arm-wrestle of a game, because we have the insides to match it with anyone, with a bit of class on the edges to finish things off when any space does open up.

That also renders moot (or at least reduces) the need for more running depth, as winning stoppages becomes more important than making it an athletics carnival. I don't think any other team has more dangerous forwards from stoppages as we do, but this is being wasted.

Is it because we've had to adapt our game plan around keeping the forwardline open for Barry?

[Mofra]

I agree, Pods is a classic case. Its not as if he is any better as a player today as he was 2 years ago.
Its also the reason Buddy Franklin got picked later than he did. In his interview, they thought he was a little strange and had a very casual approach.
His championship games were not great either which pushed him down the pecking order a little. Tambling was touted as a possible pick 2 before the draft!

[Desipura]

His championship games were not great either which pushed him down the pecking order a little. Tambling was touted as a possible pick 2 before the draft!

Yes I know. I watched the championships with Buddy. Although he was not great, he showed enough for me to get excited about, his agility for someone so big was unbelievable.
In fact, I bumped into David Smorgon during that years finals (prior to the draft) and jokingly pleaded with him that we get Buddy.

[LostDoggy]

It would agree that 17 teams agree with this assessment, including Richmond.

I agree with your assessment of Guy, no worries there. However, the rationale above (of 17 other clubs passing a player over being case closed) shouldn't be over-used in discussing discards.

Recruiting is hardly a science, and plenty of good players are glossed over that would probably have made it in the league, while more than half of the recruits that ARE picked up end up delisted with little to no impact anyway. We only have to look at some of the recruiting records of some clubs to be wary of using their judgment as a yardstick for what is 'AFL quality', and if you've met some of these so-called 'expert recruiters' you would know as well as I do that not all of them are the sharpest tools in the shed. Our recruiting methodology has a LONG way to go before we can match it with best-practice in other sports, and even then it's not a science -- I can think of ten examples off the top of my head of players in world soccer that were passed over by club after club for whatever reason (some top clubs' recruiting budgets make our entire AFL TV rights sum pale in comparison) only to later make it with a smaller club, or picked up by a savvy recruiter, and be bought back by a top club at an exorbitant rate, or flourish in the right conditions while previously having flopped in others. Players are people, and people can surprise, change, be motivated by different things, etc. and formulas and 'checkboxes' (that we rely on far too much) can never capture the complexity of that.

[Desipura]

I agree with your assessment of Guy, no worries there. However, the rationale above (of 17 other clubs passing a player over being case closed) shouldn't be over-used in discussing discards.

Recruiting is hardly a science, and plenty of good players are glossed over that would probably have made it in the league, while more than half of the recruits that ARE picked up end up delisted with little to no impact anyway. We only have to look at some of the recruiting records of some clubs to be wary of using their judgment as a yardstick for what is 'AFL quality', and if you've met some of these so-called 'expert recruiters' you would know as well as I do that not all of them are the sharpest tools in the shed. Our recruiting methodology has a LONG way to go before we can match it with best-practice in other sports, and even then it's not a science -- I can think of ten examples off the top of my head of players in world soccer that were passed over by club after club for whatever reason (some top clubs' recruiting budgets make our entire AFL TV rights sum pale in comparison) only to later make it with a smaller club, or picked up by a savvy recruiter, and be bought back by a top club at an exorbitant rate, or flourish in the right conditions while previously having flopped in others. Players are people, and people can surprise, change, be motivated by different things, etc. and formulas and 'checkboxes' (that we rely on far too much) can never capture the complexity of that.

Agree totally, especially the bolded bit, which was the point I was trying to make in my first post.

[Mofra]

Players are people, and people can surprise, change, be motivated by different things, etc. and formulas and 'checkboxes' (that we rely on far too much) can never capture the complexity of that.
Agree here - in terms of a "how long is a piece of string" question, how many of the guys who are passed over, and then make it, would credit their initial rejection with their eventual success?

Some guys mature later, endure personal events that change their attitude to life or simply don't work hard enough at the time to justify selection.
Guy O'Keefe is an example - what's to say he doesn't go away, work his arse off, and get another shot?
If he does, good luck to him. That rejection would have been the making of him as a player in some ways.

[The Coon Dog]

How did we get stuck on Guy O'Keefe (again) when it's about the changes for round 5. One thing I do know, Guy O'Keefe won't be playing! ;)

There's a rough chance we may play a debutant too!

[Desipura]

How did we get stuck on Guy O'Keefe (again) when it's about the changes for round 5. One thing I do know, Guy O'Keefe won't be playing! ;)

There's a rough chance we may play a debutant too!

Nice work, how Rough a chance?

[Doc26]

Nothing Rough about it.

In: Roughead
Out: Minson

[Desipura]

Nothing Rough about it.

In: Roughead
Out: Minson
Surely more than one change.

[comrade]

Surely more than one change.

I reckon the MC might grant you your wish.

[Desipura]

I reckon the MC might grant you your wish.
hmm surely not? If they Grant my wish and go with a roughy, we might be light on for experience.
Those 2 surely Will not be over the Hill.
Im Boyd by the fact that Johhno will come in and add some experience. Is this how you read it?

[aker39]

hmm surely not? If they Grant my wish and go with a roughy, we might be light on for experience.
Those 2 surely Will not be over the Hill.
Im Boyd by the fact that Johhno will come in and add some experience. Is this how you read it?

If they make that many changes, I may get a game too.

[Desipura]

If they make that many changes, I may get a game too.
How many are you reading?

[Doc26]

Surely more than one change.

I would certainly suspect so with Johnno and Aker to come but is the only given for now.

[bornadog]

hmm surely not? If they Grant my wish and go with a roughy, we might be light on for experience.
Those 2 surely Will not be over the Hill.
Im Boyd by the fact that Johhno will come in and add some experience. Is this how you read it?

A can man is that all:D

[Doc26]

Has anyone got the latest on Boydy's chances of playing this week or next ?

[chef]

hmm surely not? If they Grant my wish and go with a roughy, we might be light on for experience.
Those 2 surely Will not be over the Hill.
Im Boyd by the fact that Johhno will come in and add some experience. Is this how you read it?

:DI like.

[The Coon Dog]

Has anyone got the latest on Boydy's chances of playing this week or next ?

No chance.

[LostDoggy]

OUT - Minson, Hill
IN- Roughead, Grant

[chef]

OUT - Minson, Hill
IN- Roughead, Grant

No Johnno?

[The Coon Dog]

OUT - Minson, Hill
IN- Roughead, Grant

Did you miss Boyd?

[becmatty]

Boydy is playing.

The three changes at this stage are: Minson, Hill and Moles to be replaced by Roughead, Johnno and Acker.

[The Coon Dog]

Boydy is playing.

The three changes at this stage are: Minson, Hill and Moles to be replaced by Roughead, Johnno and Acker.

I hope he plays, somehow I doubt it.

[bornadog]

OUT - Minson, Hill
IN- Roughead, Grant

Eade stated early in the week that Johhno and Aker were playing, however, I guess things can change.

[boydogs]

My turn -

Granted, not every Boy'd know who Will play and who won't. There is a Rough chance Johnno will come back, he is not over the Hill yet. We are no Minnow club ;)

Out: Boyd, Hill, Minson
In: Johnson, Grant, Roughead

[The Adelaide Connection]

The question needs to be raised:

How can we take the next step when we have the same experienced players making the same mistakes week in/ week out?

I think we need to do skill sessions with buttered up balls. Watching them on the weekend reminded me of seeing a cartoon character grab a banana only to see the banana fly right out of the skin into the air.

[comrade]

Boydy is playing.

The three changes at this stage are: Minson, Hill and Moles to be replaced by Roughead, Johnno and Acker.

I hope you're on the money and this doesn't turn out like your 'Johnson late change' call last week ;)

[LostDoggy]

Originally Posted by Doc26
Has anyone got the latest on Boydy's chances of playing this week or next ?



No chance.

No chance next week either ?:(

[The Coon Dog]

No chance next week either ?:(

Sorry, didn't see the next week bit, only saw this week & responded accordingly. I don't know about next week.

[Mantis]

Reported on SEN that Grant, Roughead, Aker & Johnson will play tomorrow night.

Only outs mentioned were Minson & Boyd.

[Mofra]

Reported on SEN that Grant, Roughead, Aker & Johnson will play tomorrow night.

Only outs mentioned were Minson & Boyd.
Well, we get another few hours of speculation to keep the talk going at least :)

[Desipura]

Reported on SEN that Grant, Roughead, Aker & Johnson will play tomorrow night.

Only outs mentioned were Minson & Boyd.
You can pretty much add Hill as a certainty to that list of outs.
Last out will be one of Moles or Hahn you would think.

[G-Mo77]

You can pretty much add Hill as a certainty to that list of outs.
Last out will be one of Moles or Hahn you would think.

I don't know about Moles, we are down a mid with Boyd out so Moles may stay.

Everitt maybe?

[angelopetraglia]

Confirmed. Minson definitely out.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/bulldogs-dump-will-minson/story-e6frf9jf-1225856814936

[soupman]

This from facebook:


Rocket has just announced at today's press conference that Jordan Roughead will debut this week, while Johnno and Aker are certain starters. Looks like Will Minson may line up for Williamstown and Boydy will unfortunately miss with his broken hand. Jarrad Grant is also a chance to get his first game for the year

[G-Mo77]

This from facebook:

Are these official posts or just from fans?

[bornadog]

Are these official posts or just from fans?

Also on the Bulldogs website, but we don't know who is out.

So ins are:

Roughead
Grant
Aker
Johnno

Outs:

Minson
Boyd
?
?

I am going to Guess its Hill and Moles.

[LostDoggy]

Also on the Bulldogs website, but we don't know who is out.

So ins are:

Roughead
Grant
Aker
Johnno

Outs:

Minson
Boyd
?
?

I am going to Guess its Hill and Moles.

Outs:
Minson
Boyd
Hill
Moles

[Mantis]

Are these official posts or just from fans?

Official posts.

[Greystache]

Are these official posts or just from fans?

It's also on the Bulldogs Twitter page.

[jazzadogs]

I must say I'm enjoying the facebook updates. Although I come on here to check Dogs news fairly often, it is nice to have a bit of Bulldog pop up when you least expect it.

Good luck to Roughie, and Grant if he gets a go.

[The Coon Dog]

Boydy is playing.


Hmmm, maybe not.